What Waco biker shootout suggests about race in America

[Winehole23]

witnesses gagged, security video not to be released:


A sweeping gag order was issued Tuesday in a lawsuit arising from a May brawl at a roadside restaurant in Waco, Texas, in which nine bikers were killed and 177 people arrested.

The ruling in the lawsuit filed by Matthew Clendennen, a biker who says he was wrongfully arrested, prevents attorneys, witnesses and law enforcement officers involved in the case from discussing it with the media.


McLennan County District Court Judge Matt Johnson also ruled that Clendennen’s attorney, Clint Broden, can view surveillance video from the Twin Peaks franchisee in Waco, but barred it from public release.

http://kxan.com/2015/06/30/judge-issues-gag-order-in-texas-biker-shooting-case/

[Winehole23]

witnesses still gagged, still no indictments:

http://www.kwtx.com/ourtown/home/headlines/Waco--Lawyer-Files-New-Motion-Seeking-Removal-Of-Biker-Shooting-Gag-Order-327497461.html

[Winehole23]

Kangaroo court in Waco: No reason needed to arrest packing pastor with CCL
Gun ownership is on trial in Waco, so why aren't the NRA and all the open-carry advocates going nuts over what's happening regarding prosecutions from the the Twin Peaks biker massacre?

In McLennan County, visiting Judge James Morgan ruled after an examining trial (http://www.wacotrib.com/news/twin-peaks-biker-shooting/judge-rules-probable-cause-to-arrest-bandidos-chaplain/article_70ba442b-0d99-562e-ab33-deca33f0b8f5.html) that there was sufficient cause to have arrested a 65-year old concealed carry permit holder who wasn't wearing a biker cut but a Christian t-shirt (he's chaplain to the Bandidos and two veterans groups) because he was carrying legal personal weapons. The judge declared there was probable cause to support an arrest even though no police "officer could offer evidence that Yager conspired to commit murder, assault or any crime that day" Like everyone else arrested in the episode, Yager's bail was initially set at $1 million.

An earlier examining trial (http://www.wacotrib.com/news/twin-peaks-biker-shooting/judge-rules-twin-peaks-biker-wife-jailed-with-sufficient-probable/article_7f6da5d8-b70f-55fc-9cd3-6f7dc9d56964.html) found probable cause to arrest a Brenham couple even though police agreed they were "merely present at a murder" that there was no evidence they committed.

Legality aside, how is it that a Texas judge can declare police don't need a reason to arrest legal Christian gun owners and there's not immediately an army of Second Amendment protesters beating down the DA's door? The silence from that wing of the political spectrum on this issue is deafening.

Regardless, the law doesn't seem to matter in Waco anymore. These are kangaroo courts and a flat-out embarrassment to the state.http://gritsforbreakfast.blogspot.com/2015/08/kangaroo-court-in-waco-no-reason-needed.html

[Winehole23]

Chief Justice Tom Gray of the 10th Court of Appeals, an intermediate appellate court, found that Judge Johnson had abused his discretion (http://www.search.txcourts.gov/SearchMedia.aspx?MediaVersionID=6d7e93dc-9df8-45cb-9cb3-07625ae3416f&coa=coa10&DT=Opinion&MediaID=726d9ecf-f053-42b6-9c03-20069cf7b0ee)by shutting out press coverage. Gray ordered Johnson to vacate (http://www.wacotrib.com/news/twin-peaks-biker-shooting/appeals-court-orders-gag-order-lifted-in-biker-s-twin/article_54d1351b-5d1a-5a3a-b084-e5012e2dd89f.html) the protective order.

Apparently, some judges just don’t know protectionwhen they see it.


This Thursday, the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals, the state’s highest criminal court, issued a stay (http://www.wacotrib.com/news/twin-peaks-biker-shooting/court-of-criminal-appeals-stays-lower-court-order-in-biker/article_038337fa-5652-510e-a64b-18f3d7d89746.html) on the intermediate court’s move to vacate the gag order. Unpack the negatives in that procedural history and you’ll find that the gag order remains in place during the pendency of the appeal.




Regardless of whether Johnson’s order is a “gag” or “protection,” it is certainly a restraint on speech. As in “a prior restraint on speech.” The kind of state action that is presumptively unconstitutional.


Prior restraints on speech are likely to violate the First Amendment, but courts permit them in extraordinary circumstances. When the right of a criminal defendant to receive a fair trial would be compromised by pretrial publicity, courts can act. Sometimes when the Sixth Amendment squares off against the First Amendment, the First loses.


However, before issuing this type of order, judges must consider less restrictive means of preserving the integrity of the proceedings. Venue changes, careful voir dire, jury sequestration, and strong jury instructions can go a long way toward preventing a tainted trial. Only in the narrowest of circumstances is abridging free speech and a free press the only viable option.


Do the circumstances in Clendennen’s case rise to this level?


The reason the arrested bikers’ story isn’t in more headlines is not because what took place in Waco on May 17 doesn’t deserve public scrutiny. In fact, the reason the story isn’t in more headlines — a dubious gag order issued by self-interested officials — is itself something that deserves public scrutiny.

http://abovethelaw.com/2015/08/the-reason-you-havent-heard-more-about-the-177-bikers-arrested-in-waco/?show=comments#comments

[boutons_deux]

http://gritsforbreakfast.blogspot.com/2015/08/kangaroo-court-in-waco-no-reason-needed.html

"flat-out embarrassment to the state." :lol there's LOTS of embarrassing shit in TX, but Texians are too stupid to realize it, are actually PROUD TO BE STUPID TEXANS.

[Winehole23]

106 suspects indicted:

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/11/the-sprawling-elaborate-case-in-the-waco-biker-shootout/415626/

[Winehole23]

On Wednesday, McLennan County District Attorney Abel Reyna announced on Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=564012257087138&id=106012592887109) that a grand jury had handed down 106 indictments for “engaging in organized crime activity” related to the fight. Reyna promised to indict the remaining 71, too.

That’s an unusually large number of indictments, and the general consensus is that not all of the people who have been arrested and indicted were actually participants in the brawl. Prosecutors haven’t specifically indicated who they think did what in the fight, or who fired the shots that actually killed people. Instead, the dragnet seems intended to break the resistance of gang members, wielding the prospect of lengthy sentences—15 years to life—as a bludgeon to convince some of the individuals who have been indicted to flip and offer prosecutors what they need to convict others, in return for plea bargains.

[Winehole23]

What’s interesting about the case is the use of the organized-crime statute. Texas’s law (http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/Docs/PE/htm/PE.71.htm) is similar to the federal RICO (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeer_Influenced_and_Corrupt_Organizations_Act ) law. Using it affords Abel a whole range of new possibilities.

“It’s very clever on the part of the prosecutor,” Hamilton said.


First, it could make it easier to convict defendants, because the threshold for the crime is low. The corruption statute stipulates a great deal of crimes—the list begins with “murder, capital murder, arson, aggravated robbery, robbery, burglary, theft” and goes on for quite a while—but defendants in this case could likely be put behind bars if prosecutors can just prove that they were members of a criminal gang (in this case, the Cossacks or Bandidos) and that there was an agreement to commit a crime. It doesn’t have to have been an express agreement—it might be enough just to show, for example, that members of the gangs arrived en masse, knowing their rivals would be there and carrying illegal firearms.


“Most of these people, I don’t think they have evidence that they actually committed anything,” said Sandra Guerra Thompson (https://www.law.uh.edu/faculty/main.asp?PID=15), who directs the Criminal Justice Institute at the UH Law Center. “For most of them, they’ll have to prove an agreement to commit some sort of crime.”

[Winehole23]

If it turns out that some of the bikers in Waco died from police bullets, authorities will have shot people dead, arrested all the witnesses, and prohibited them from speaking out under penalty of contempt. It’s long past time for state overseers to step in.http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/09/in-the-waco-shootout-police-bullets-hit-bikers/406534/

[ChumpDumper]

There is no way they don't know which bullets killed which person by now. Really looks like they are hiding something.

[SpursforSix]

There is no way they don't know which bullets killed which person by now. Really looks like they are hiding something.

cuz on Law and Order, they do it in an hour

[ChumpDumper]

cuz on Law and Order, they do it in an hourNo.

Your attempts at jokes get worse and worse.

Can you think of any reason the ballistic tests for the victims wold take longer than six months?

[SpursforSix]

No.

Your attempts at jokes get worse and worse.

Can you think of any reason the ballistic tests for the victims wold take longer than six months?

sure.
possible that the shooter(s) used reloads and marred the bullets before hand.
possible that the shooter(s) reloaded a smaller caliber bullet into larger brass than the gun that fired it.

[ChumpDumper]

sure.
possible that the shooter(s) used reloads and marred the bullets before hand.
possible that the shooter(s) reloaded a smaller caliber bullet into larger brass than the gun that fired it.so how long would tests for those take?

Give me a link that backs your claim.

[SpursforSix]

so how long would tests for those take?

Give me a link that backs your claim up.

I'm not sure that any test could conclusively match a bullet to gun in either of those scenarios.
If you don't believe the possibility of those 2 scenarios, you wouldn't understand any link I provided. But I'm not sure I could find one anyway.

[ChumpDumper]

I'm not sure that any test could conclusively match a bullet to gun in either of those scenarios.
If you don't believe the possibility of those 2 scenarios, you wouldn't understand any link I provided. But I'm not sure I could find one anyway.So no extra time would be needed at all since it wouldn't make any difference.

Way to undermine your claim unforced.

[SpursforSix]

So no extra time would be needed at all since it wouldn't make any difference.

Way to undermine your claim unforced.

all I did was provide you examples of situations where matching a bullet would not be as easy as you imagine
if you don't want to believe them, that's OK.

[ChumpDumper]

all I did was provide you examples of situations where matching a bullet would not be as easy as you imagine
if you don't want to believe them, that's OK.You provided no reason why test would take longer than six months.

And no one should ever believe you. You make shit up and always fold when called on it. That's OK.

[SpursforSix]

You provided no reason why test would take longer than six months.

And no one should ever believe you. You make shit up and always fold when called on it. That's OK.

the reason was that they could still be testing and not finding a match. but I don't know. and neither do you.

[ChumpDumper]

the reason was that they could still be testing and not finding a match.Still waiting for that link you'll never post.
but I don't know. and neither do you.Why do we not know? Why all the secrecy?

[SpursforSix]

Still waiting for that link you'll never post.Why do we not know? Why all the secrecy?

what secrecy?

[ChumpDumper]

what secrecy?You just said we don't know.

Why not?

[SpursforSix]

You just said we don't know.

Why not?

you're asking me if I know why we don't know?

[ChumpDumper]

you're asking me if I know why we don't know?Why all the secrecy?

[SpursforSix]

Why all the secrecy?

what secrecy?

[ChumpDumper]

what secrecy?If you don't even know about the gag order, you aren't worth wasting any more time.

[SpursforSix]

If you don't even know about the gag order, you aren't worth wasting any more time.

what gag order?

[boutons_deux]

Looks to me like the local law enforcement got in way over its amateur head. Mirrors the competence of West, TX ammonium nitrate safety officers.

[SpursforSix]

Looks to me like the local law enforcement got in way over its amateur head. Mirrors the competence of West, TX ammonium nitrate safety officers.

weak

[Winehole23]

Fyi, the judge gagged the lawyers, the witnesses, and sealed the videotape.

[Winehole23]

All we know about the case is from Waco PD press releases. If the lawyers or witnesses speak to the press, they go to jail for contempt. Bit of a one way street, don't you think?

[boutons_deux]

Latest McLennan DA screwup par for Waco biker case

Even in a large-scale episode like the Waco biker shootout in May, one would think authorities ought to be able to count the number of dead. Regardless, it turned out the 10th victim (http://www.wacotrib.com/news/twin-peaks-biker-shooting/da-mistake-led-to-extra-name-listed-with-dead-twin/article_480b1717-5e1a-57b4-afef-343261d4735e.html) listed in the Twin Peaks biker shootout indictments didn't exist and was just a case of the same sort of sloppy lawyering which led the DA to charge dozens of people with the same, trumped up offenses. (Four others were shot by police with rifles (http://blog.chron.com/narcoconfidential/2015/12/biker-melee-shows-challenge-of-wielding-gun-at-gun-fight/) from a distance.) Reported the Houston Chronicle (http://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/houston/article/Another-Twin-Peaks-biker-controversy-as-6708631.php):


Everyone has been charged with the same crime - which carries a penalty of 15 years to life in prison - even though police surveillance videos clearly show most of the bikers running from the violence and ballistics tests on guns and bullet fragments have not yet been completed.

"It is a reflection of how sloppy this case has been handled from the beginning," Dallas lawyer Clint Broden said.

"He was really able to bamboozle the grand jury into indicting people for crimes that he acknowledges they didn't commit," said Broden, who added that it was an example of the adage that a prosecutor can indict a ham sandwich if he chooses to do so.

Amanda Peters, a former prosecutor who is now a professor at the South Texas College of Law in Houston, had little sympathy for Reyna.

"This office has already come under a lot of criticism," Peters said. "And you would think that they wouldn't want to do anything to fuel more criticism."

Peters said that from a legal standpoint, prosecutors can easily go back and amend the indictment, but that they have made yet another embarrassing public gaffe.

"This is one more indication this case isn't being handled as cleanly as it could," she said. "Most defense attorneys and prosecutors (in Texas) are scratching their heads," she said. "People I talk to are like, yeah, that is a mess."

The McLennan County District Attorney's Office has tried to do too much too quickly, she said.



"In every one of these mass-arrest situations, it always ends up a disaster," she said. "There are lawsuits filed; settlements; somebody gets kicked out of office or fired - not to mention the mockery it makes of the justice system."


Abel Reyna and the rest of the McLennan County justice system are in way over their heads and poised embarrass the entire state if they don't get a clue and begin to limit criminal prosecutions to people who actually engaged in criminal behavior.

http://gritsforbreakfast.blogspot.com/2015/12/latest-mclennan-da-screwup-par-for-waco.html

[Winehole23]

summary, one year on:

http://www.wacotrib.com/news/twin-peaks-biker-shooting/twin-peaks-shootout-one-year-later-many-questions-with-trials/article_cdd6666a-a70b-5510-999d-6fea657a1763.html

[Winehole23]

civil rights lawsuits: bikers arrested without evidence of wrongdoing

http://www.wacotrib.com/news/police/five-more-twin-peaks-bikers-file-civil-rights-lawsuits/article_ca2d8473-dadc-592b-a909-b0f4c76a7ec4.html

[Winehole23]

Dallas attorney Don Tittle represents 20 of the plaintiffs and said 13 of the 20 have not been indicted, including the five most recent plaintiffs.

[Winehole23]

The lawsuit alleges that authorities relied on “identical, fill-in-the-blank” arrest affidavits that did not allege specific facts against the plaintiffs “that would in any way establish probable cause” for their arrests.



“The district attorney (Reyna) recently claimed that his decision not to indict some of those arrested is proof that he’s trying to ‘do the right thing,’ ” Tittle said Wednesday. “I know that for these individuals, and many others, his words ring hollow. Almost 18 months after their arrests, my clients are still waiting for their names to be cleared, hardly what you’d expect from someone interested in ‘doing the right thing.’ ”

[boutons_deux]

civil rights lawsuits: bikers arrested without evidence of wrongdoing

http://www.wacotrib.com/news/police/five-more-twin-peaks-bikers-file-civil-rights-lawsuits/article_ca2d8473-dadc-592b-a909-b0f4c76a7ec4.html


yawn, happens to 100s of non-whites every day.

[Winehole23]

if I told you non-whites were arrested would you be more sympathetic?

[Winehole23]

boutons apparently finds it boring when the abuse of state power ruins the lives of white people

[boutons_deux]

if I told you non-whites were arrested would you be more sympathetic?

would you be so sympathetic if you knew that the Bandidos are huge criminal organization?

search "bandidos arrested"

do you really give a fuck about the fucking criminal gangs Bandidos and Cossacks? :lol

[Winehole23]

prior to conviction, the presumption of innocence obtains. prior to arrest, you need particularized probable cause.

doesn't matter who the target is.

[boutons_deux]

prior to conviction, the presumption of innocence obtains. prior to arrest, you need particularized probable cause.

doesn't matter who the target is.

how naive, how theoretical.

try the thread "warrior cops are out of control", esp today' "Nevada $2 drug test" joke

[Winehole23]

we still have an adversarial system of justice to force the state recognize our rights. it occasionally works.

that's neither naive nor theoretical.

[Winehole23]

right to a speedy trial:


Frustrated by a lack of movement in the Twin Peaks cases, a judge set trial dates Friday for three bikers, while McLennan County prosecutors dismissed 13 more cases involving those indicted in the May 2015 shootout.

http://www.wacotrib.com/news/courts_and_trials/judge-sets-twin-peaks-trial-dates-da-dismisses-more-cases/article_6e3863ae-a132-5676-930c-5b3aab98c478.html

[Winehole23]

On Thursday, prosecutors dismissed 15 cases against bikers who had been summoned to court Friday, leaving a much smaller group at the hearing in Johnson’s court. Prosecutors also formally refused an unindicted case involving Donald Fowler on Thursday.

[Winehole23]

The dismissals this week bring the number of pending cases to 98, down from 155 bikers indicted

[Winehole23]

“The deal here is that we are now three years out on his thing,” Sutton said. “We have received no offer. As soon as we were told no to modify these bond conditions, we were told no, we can’t have a court date. Maybe we will get a court date sometime this year. So yeah, he is obviously frustrated. Imagine having your life put on hold for three years.”

[boutons_deux]

"Imagine having your life put on hold for three years"

Ah, the white man, free on bond, has it so bad

85 people held for 4 years in Louisiana jails without a trial, sheriffs say

http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2018/04/over_1300_louisiana_residents.html

[Winehole23]

yep. that sucks too.

deprivation of rights isn't a contest. it's allowed to pay attention to many things at the same time.

[boutons_deux]

yep. that sucks too.

deprivation of rights isn't a contest. it's allowed to pay attention to many things at the same time.

there's almost no good shit around. So much bad stuff happening, but none of it is accidental, natural, it's all oligarchy policy

The oligarchy, buttressed by the natsec/militarized police state, if fucking America hard and deep.

[SpursforSix]

there's almost no good shit around. So much bad stuff happening, but none of it is accidental, natural, it's all oligarchy policy

The oligarchy, buttressed by the natsec/militarized police state, if fucking America hard and deep.

You're too damn negative. There's good shit going on in the world.
But you'd rather spend your time working to make yourself angry.

[Winehole23]

judge postpones until a new DA is seated:


It was Strother, even more than Mendez’s attorney, Jaime Peña, who questioned prosecutors Thursday about the riot indictment and expressed concerns that they, in effect, had turned what normally is a Class B misdemeanor into a crime that possibly subjects the defendants to life in prison.

https://www.wacotrib.com/news/courts_and_trials/judge-no-twin-peaks-shootout-cases-to-be-held-in/article_f8b5154f-63fd-5f4e-a4fa-95771819aa08.html+2

[Winehole23]

Barry Johnson beat incumbent DA Abel Reyna by 20 percentage points in the March Republican primary and will run unopposed in November. Johnson, who takes office in January, said during the campaign that one of the first things he will do is assemble a team to review the remaining Twin Peaks cases.

Reyna has not attended any of the numerous hearings involving Twin Peaks defendants since he lost the primary.

[Winehole23]

The first Twin Peaks case was tried last year in Judge Matt Johnson’s 54th State District Court. That trial, involving Bandidos Dallas chapter president Jacob Carrizal, ended in a mistrial after the jury could not reach a verdict on three counts of engaging in organized criminal activity.

Since then, Reyna’s office has dismissed the majority of the 155 indicted cases and has re-indicted two dozen of the original defendants on first-degree felony riot charges.