The reality of the cap space - would Aldridge would cost too much

[024]

I've been looking for a good break down of the Spurs cap space and I found some interesting articles about it:

http://www.poundingtherock.com/2015/5/8/8574309/heres-how-the-spurs-can-sign-lamarcus-aldridge-while-also-bringing?_ga=1.187089451.248654822.1429195878

http://www.grizzlybearblues.com/2015/5/21/8628367/2015-nba-free-agency-marc-gasol-san-antonio-spurs-duncan-ginobili-parker

Both articles explore the feasibility of the Spurs signing a max player (Aldridge in the first one, Gasol in the second). I'll summarize it for you guys.


The Spurs may seem to have a lot of cap space but due to cap holds, the Spurs really only have $11 million in free space even AFTER giving Duncan and Ginobili minimum contracts and renouncing everyone else.
Grabbing a max contract player then requires pawning off Splitter or renouncing Green's rights. Keep in mind this is in addition to giving Duncan and Ginobili minimum contracts to get rid of their cap holds.
I doubt the Spurs offer Duncan and Ginobili the minimum so they'll pretty much either earn more or retire. If they retire, the Spurs will essentially be trading Duncan, Ginobili, Splitter/Green, and most of the bench for a max player like Aldridge. The Spurs will get the MLE though but they will most likely push over the luxury tax unless everyone else is on minimum contracts.
If the Spurs sign Green and Leonard to long term contracts and give out one year deals to Duncan and Ginobili, the Spurs can keep the team, maybe add a MLE player and have a projected $20-$25 million (depending on how much MLE they use) in cap space in 2016.


Best case scenario, the Spurs will get a lineup of: Duncan (re-signed with MLE?), Aldridge, Leonard, Green, Parker with a bench of Mills, Anderson, Diaw, + 1st round pick, min contract players (one of whom will probably be Bonner). Is that championship worthy? I don't think so, especially with such a hit to the bench. If Ginobili is willing to play for the minimum (he's only plays for 15 minutes a game anyways), it starts to look like a decent roster. Duncan and Ginobili would be taking severe paycuts though. I'm not sure how likely this is since I think the Spurs will offer Duncan $8-$9 million and Ginobili at least $4 million.

Second scenario, maybe Aldridge mimics the Heat big 3 and takes less. But I don't see how Aldridge's sacrifice of $2-3 million will do much to help the Spurs. It will still wipe out most of the bench.

Third Scenario, Spurs bring back Duncan, Ginobili, Green and most of the bench with the exception of the dead weights in one year contracts. The Spurs use the MLE to upgrade the back up PG/PF. They'll keep their lineup of: Duncan, Splitter, Leonard, Green, Parker with Ginobili, MLE PG/PF, Diaw, Mills, Beli?, Baynes?, Anderson, probably Bonner off the bench. They make one final run and wait until next year to sign a max player. I think this is the most likely scenario given the Spurs history of keeping everything the same and striking out on big FAs.

[BillMc]

Would a sign and trade with Portland giving them Diaw or Splitter + a pick and/or Mills, allow us to get LA without renouncing Tim/Manu/Danny? No way Tim and Manu sign for the minimum.

Nice break down by the way. Thanks! :toast

[ducks]

sign and trade green to Portland
green gets his 12 million a year and spurs keep splitter and get alridge

[024]

Would a sign and trade with Portland giving them Diaw or Splitter + a pick and/or Mills, allow us to get LA without renouncing Tim/Manu/Danny? No way Tim and Manu sign for the minimum.

Nice break down by the way. Thanks! :toast
I'm not too sure about any sign and trade scenarios. Can the Spurs take on extra salary (they do have some free cap space to work with) through a trade and then sign their players to over the limit? Splitter is only making $8.5 million whereas Aldridge will make $18-19 million. So Spurs either have to match or have the cap space to take on the extra $10 million salary right?

Also, I think the Spurs only need to get rid of either Splitter or Green, not both.

Edit: So I did some extra calculations. Let's say the Spurs keep Leonard and Green's cap hold where it is at $7 million each (low cap hold, no need to re-sign yet), re-sign Duncan and Ginobili at $9 million and $5 million each (to reduce their cap holds), and renounce everyone else. The Spurs will be at $63 million, leaving only about $4 million of free cap space. So won't the Spurs have to find more filler with Tiago to do a sign and trade? If the Spurs have to give up Splitter + Mills + possible picks, I think that's too high of a price to pay. Spurs are going to already lose Beli, CJ, and Baynes in this scenario. They will be essentially trading Splitter + the entire bench for Aldridge.

[cjw]

Splitter, Green or Diaw (or Parker but not opening that can of worms) must almost certainly be moved to get to max money. Could be done creatively with Mills / Anderson / getting rid of first round pick for two seconds or something to get you close and replacing those roster spots with $500k cap holds. Splitter is the obvious choice given there are literally no wings on the roster after Kawhi. Anderson isn't a wing, more like he ate too many wings and all the weight went to his head.

[Richie]

The analysis is wrong. If we bring back Duncan and Manu for the minimum (although one would get the Room Exception at $2.5m) and renounce everyone else, we'd have around $15m to spend. Dump Mills and we get just about to the $18m we need for Aldridge max.

The PtR article doesn't account for the fact that we'd be bringing them back with the Minimum Exception and not using cap space. I think they'll want more but if they'd accept the minimum then that's how we'd do it.

[itzsoweezee]

Scenario 3 is probably the best route. It provides the best overall roster and upgrade potential in subsequent years.

[ducks]

sign a 4 year deal with alridge with player option after 2 years cap up then sign him max to 5 year deal then

[Richie]

sign a 4 year deal with alridge with player option after 2 years cap up then sign him max to 5 year deal then

Pretty sure options can only be on the last year of the deal, so it'd have to be a 3 year deal with 3rd year option. Not implausible he goes that route with whatever team he signs with to maximise his money.

However we won't have his Bird Rights after 2 years so no 5 year max.

[BillMc]

I'm not too sure about any sign and trade scenarios. Can the Spurs take on extra salary (they do have some free cap space to work with) through a trade and then sign their players to over the limit? Splitter is only making $8.5 million whereas Aldridge will make $18-19 million. So Spurs either have to match or have the cap space to take on the extra $10 million salary right?

Also, I think the Spurs only need to get rid of either Splitter or Green, not both.

Edit: So I did some extra calculations. Let's say the Spurs keep Leonard and Green's cap hold where it is at $7 million each (low cap hold, no need to re-sign yet), re-sign Duncan and Ginobili at $9 million and $5 million each (to reduce their cap holds), and renounce everyone else. The Spurs will be at $63 million, leaving only about $4 million of free cap space. So won't the Spurs have to find more filler with Tiago to do a sign and trade? If the Spurs have to give up Splitter + Mills + possible picks, I think that's too high of a price to pay. Spurs are going to already lose Beli, CJ, and Baynes in this scenario. They will be essentially trading Splitter + the entire bench for Aldridge.

I agree. Way too expensive.

Again, nice job on the research. :bobo

[wildbill2u]

This is probably heresy, but the Spurs went over the cap and paid the luxury tax once in the past if I remember. In any event, couldn't the Spurs do that if they wanted to do what some of the big boys in big markets do.

Not likely, but possible?

[Mikeanaro]

This is probably heresy, but the Spurs went over the cap and paid the luxury tax once in the past if I remember. In any event, couldn't the Spurs do that if they wanted to do what some of the big boys in big markets do.

Not likely, but possible?
Thats a good question, if Spurs pass the cap by just 5 mil is that going to ruin Holt and associates financially speaking?

[DPG21920]

Thats a good question, if Spurs pass the cap by just 5 mil is that going to ruin Holt and associates financially speaking?

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q21

[Mikeanaro]

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q21
Its not gonna ruin them and we are not repeaters (no pun intended) so Holt could do it, thing is maybe he doesnt want to pay the NBA to help them with their Lebron and Harden ads.

[DPG21920]

Its not gonna ruin them and we are not repeaters (no pun intended) so Holt could do it, thing is maybe he doesnt want to pay the NBA to help them with their Lebron and Harden ads.

I agree, but good news is there are ways to both avoid tax and do all the things they may want to do.

[024]

I agree, but good news is there are ways to both avoid tax and do all the things they may want to do.
What way is that, can you do a break down?

[024]

The analysis is wrong. If we bring back Duncan and Manu for the minimum (although one would get the Room Exception at $2.5m) and renounce everyone else, we'd have around $15m to spend. Dump Mills and we get just about to the $18m we need for Aldridge max.

The PtR article doesn't account for the fact that we'd be bringing them back with the Minimum Exception and not using cap space. I think they'll want more but if they'd accept the minimum then that's how we'd do it.
I think expecting both Duncan and Ginobili to take the minimum is pretty unrealistic. Ginobili I don't think is worth too much with his coin flip passes and the fact that he is only good for 15 minutes per game. But he's still worth around $5 million. Duncan just made all defensive 2nd team and all NBA 3rd team.... he's going to get $8-$9 million. I don't think the FO will insult him with anything less. Duncan will still be taking a pay cut too. To expect him to take a deeper cut would be greedy.

[DPG21920]

What way is that, can you do a break down?

It's kind of hard, but it's just about salaries for guys like Tim, any trades and what role players they sign. The LT is estimated to be at 81M.

So in an example like this: Spurs pursue cap space route. Spurs trade Boris & Patty away to get the cap space for LA.

TP: 13.5M
Tim: 5M (assumption - maybe not likely, but seems like a potential starter for speculation)
Tiago: 8.5M
LA: 18M (going to get max)
Kawhi: 17M (going to get max)
Green: 12M (assumption)
Kyle: 1.1M
1st Rd Pick: 1M

That is roughly 76M for 8 players. That gives the Spurs 5M before they hit the LT and that is with Max for LA (pretty much guaranteed), max for Kawhi (pretty much guaranteed) & what seems to be the high end for Green (pretty much a given he will be in that 10-12M range IMO).

Use min contracts to fill out the rest of the roster and you can avoid LT while keeping Tim/Tiago/Danny/Kawhi and adding LA.

Avoiding the LT will be close, but it can be done, even if everyone gets the high end. It all really hinges on Duncan though and that's the biggest question to answer (same with Manu).

Then you have the over the cap route. Currently, (assuming you aren't brining back Cory, Baynes, Ayres, etc..) with the cap holds for Danny/Kawhi counted, if you traded for LA instead of using cap space (like Chinook said, maybe Boris/Patty/1st) you would be sitting at roughly 55M in salaries before Green/Kawhi's actual salaries go up & before Tim resigns.

That 55M is including about 7M for DG & 7M for Kawhi. So let's assume they get the same salaries as in the cap space example above, that 55M goes to 70M. Let's say Tim get's the same 5M - that has the Spurs at 75M in total salary.

It would require Tim taking a contract like that amount and that would be the only person taking a discount (which in the real world it doesn't have to be Tim, the total pool of money discounted just has to be the same).

If the Spurs want to really build out the roster though, even if Tim takes a big discount like 5M, they would likely pay taxes.

[TD 21]

There's such a thing as partially guaranteed seasons (something the Spurs have utilized with McDyess, Bonner and Diaw), which is essentially a loophole or circumvention of the cap. In other words, say they can only technically afford to give Duncan $5M, they could give him the same for the following season, with say $2.5M guaranteed. They could also agree in principal to give him a minute ownership stake when he retires.

[SpurPadre]

Best (http://www.poundingtherock.com/2015/5/8/8574309/heres-how-the-spurs-can-sign-lamarcus-aldridge-while-also-bringing?_ga=1.187089451.248654822.1429195878) case scenario, the Spurs will get a lineup of: Duncan (re-signed with MLE?), Aldridge, Leonard, Green, Parker with a bench of Mills, Anderson, Diaw, + 1st round pick, min contract players (one of whom will probably be Bonner)

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[cd021]

The analysis is wrong. If we bring back Duncan and Manu for the minimum (although one would get the Room Exception at $2.5m) and renounce everyone else, we'd have around $15m to spend. Dump Mills and we get just about to the $18m we need for Aldridge max.

The PtR article doesn't account for the fact that we'd be bringing them back with the Minimum Exception and not using cap space. I think they'll want more but if they'd accept the minimum then that's how we'd do it.

18.2 Million to be exact, assuming the Spurs don't bring over their 1st rounder. In theory Aldridge could sign a 1 year deal for the remaining cap space and then we could max him out the following year. He'd make something like $106 million in that scenario.

I may be mistaken, but The Spurs would have to trade both Splitter and Diaw if Aldridge wants a sign and trade because of Splitter/Diaw + Mills contracts would be able to make the trade valid.

In that case the Spurs would still have the MLE,and Bi Annual Exception + Cap holds to Cojo, Duncan, Manu and Baynes. In theory they could bring all of them back plus Green and Leonard.

[cd021]

There's such a thing as partially guaranteed seasons (something the Spurs have utilized with McDyess, Bonner and Diaw), which is essentially a loophole or circumvention of the cap. In other words, say they can only technically afford to give Duncan $5M, they could give him the same for the following season, with say $2.5M guaranteed. They could also agree in principal to give him a minute ownership stake when he retires.

Golden Parachute. Definitely and option with the cap jumping so much next season.

[Uriel]

Great thread, OP, and a much-needed one. :tu

A lot of posters in this forum have been bandying around impossible roster move scenarios without sufficient knowledge of the cap rules and implications, so hopefully this thread will clear up any lingering confusion.

[ElNono]

There's such a thing as partially guaranteed seasons (something the Spurs have utilized with McDyess, Bonner and Diaw), which is essentially a loophole or circumvention of the cap. In other words, say they can only technically afford to give Duncan $5M, they could give him the same for the following season, with say $2.5M guaranteed. They could also agree in principal to give him a minute ownership stake when he retires.

IIRC, partially guaranteed contracts count fully against the cap (as if they were guaranteed). The difference is that the team can simply opt to waive the player when the deadline comes to fully guarantee the contract, and then at that point the entire salary comes off the books. So there's really no loophole there.

[BillMc]

Great thread, OP, and a much-needed one. :tu

A lot of posters in this forum have been bandying around impossible roster move scenarios without sufficient knowledge of the cap rules and implications, so hopefully this thread will clear up any lingering confusion.

I second that. Best thread in weeks!:toast

[Mal]

LMA takes little paycut, Green takes paycut, Duncan takes little paycut, Leonard takes little paycut, Ginobili takes little paycut and it all could work.

[Sean Cagney]

The analysis is wrong. If we bring back Duncan and Manu for the minimum (although one would get the Room Exception at $2.5m) and renounce everyone else, we'd have around $15m to spend. Dump Mills and we get just about to the $18m we need for Aldridge max.

The PtR article doesn't account for the fact that we'd be bringing them back with the Minimum Exception and not using cap space. I think they'll want more but if they'd accept the minimum then that's how we'd do it.
Duncan is getting alot more than the minimum though to be honest.

[Malik Hairston]

Duncan's contract is the most interesting storyline of this off season for the Spurs IMO, despite how strange that statement sounds..

If he's actually willing to take another substantial paycut in an effort to win once again, despite making all-NBA and having a great playoff round, it would be quite the gesture..

You can attempt to use the illogical argument of past earnings affecting a person's mindset, but losing millions is still losing millions, regardless of who you are, tbh:lol..

[Agloco]

You can attempt to use the illogical argument of past earnings affecting a person's mindset, but losing millions is still losing millions, regardless of who you are, tbh:lol..

It only illogical to those who don't have a good sense of scale or orders of magnitude.

That said.....lol minimum.

[Russ]

Duncan's contract is the most interesting storyline of this off season for the Spurs IMO, despite how strange that statement sounds..

If he's actually willing to take another substantial paycut in an effort to win once again, despite making all-NBA and having a great playoff round, it would be quite the gesture..

You can attempt to use the illogical argument of past earnings affecting a person's mindset, but losing millions is still losing millions, regardless of who you are, tbh:lol..

10 million seems like a huge discount (already) for Duncan.

I don't see him taking less unless it's strictly his idea.

If I were the Spurs, I wouldn't mention any numbers less than 10.

[baseline bum]

I could Duncan taking $7 million, which would allow them to bring in Aldridge while keeping Green and Leonard if they can salary dump Splitter. But the bench will definitely be thin losing Ginobili, Joseph, and Bellinelli. I figure they could get Baynes back on a minimum deal though. Mills will have to play a ton of minutes and Kyle Anderson will get throw into the fire. I assume Manu's not coming back, he just doesn't sound like he is after Game 7. If he is coming back though I say fuck Aldridge and try to sign a replacement for Bellinielli who can hopefully play some SF too with the MLE.

Aldridge is a risky scenario since any time they're left waiting is time Danny Green can go find a contract somewhere else. They can't sign Green before Aldridge without losing significant capspace since his cap hold is only about $6 million. Basically if Aldridge doesn't commit on Day 1, maybe Day 2, I think the Spurs have to move on to keep from losing Green. Because they'll have to find a way to salary dump Splitter, and Green would be a shithead to wait a week for offers so that the free agent market dries up. If the Spurs really think they can land LMA they might need to salary dump Splitter at the draft.

[DPG21920]

I think the Spurs know the market for DG and what they are willing to pay. I think the Spurs have such strong relationships, plus the fact they can pay DG more than anyone so I don't think that will be a huge issue. LA dragging things out is though.

[hater]

Green is gone imo. To Cle.

Marco might be gone too to better pastures. Nigga is a winner after all.

And all that is without even considering Manu or Lamar moves tbh :lol

If Lamar or Gasol don't come and Manu doesn't retire. Might as well tank for the lottery cause this team has no prayer next year.

[Raven]

Duncan's contract is the most interesting storyline of this off season for the Spurs IMO, despite how strange that statement sounds..

If he's actually willing to take another substantial paycut in an effort to win once again, despite making all-NBA and having a great playoff round, it would be quite the gesture..

You can attempt to use the illogical argument of past earnings affecting a person's mindset, but losing millions is still losing millions, regardless of who you are, tbh:lol..

he'd earn a minimum contract, not lose a contract he doesn't have.

[BillMc]

Green is gone imo. To Cle.

Marco might be gone too to better pastures. Nigga is a winner after all.

And all that is without even considering Manu or Lamar moves tbh :lol

If Lamar or Gasol don't come and Manu doesn't retire. Might as well tank for the lottery cause this team has no prayer next year.

I could be wrong, but I don't think Cleveland can afford Green unless Love bolts.

[baseline bum]

Green is gone imo. To Cle.


Not in a million years, he'd have to take MLE, and I'm not even sure if Cleveland could have the full MLE since they'd be luxury tax repeaters.

[monkeypunk]

So hypothetically, if Gino and TD come back on vet mins, we max Kawhi and we talk Aldridge into a lower priced short deal to reup the next year on a max, how many of last years team can we realistically bring back? Assuming no Bonner, Ayres, Baynes or Cojo? Can we then keep Tiago, Bobo, Mills and DG?

Is it doable if Holt agrees to pay luxury tax this year?

[SanAntonioSpurs23]

Lamarcus Aldridge is not coming to San Antonio.

[baseline bum]

So hypothetically, if Gino and TD come back on vet mins, we max Kawhi and we talk Aldridge into a lower priced short deal to reup the next year on a max, how many of last years team can we realistically bring back? Assuming no Bonner, Ayres, Baynes or Cojo? Can we then keep Tiago, Bobo, Mills and DG?

Is it doable if Holt agrees to pay luxury tax this year?

Might as well just hope LeBron opts out and comes here for minimum.

[Raven]

let's just give up and move on with cojo and green on board.

[monkeypunk]

let's just give up and move on with cojo and green on board.

I'm actually okay with bringing the whole team back minus Bonner and Ayres but it doesn't appear that PATFO is. IMO, we were a Splitter and TP injury away from playing GS right now and I'd like our chances if we were fully healthy.

[Maddog]

So hypothetically, if Gino and TD come back on vet mins, we max Kawhi and we talk Aldridge into a lower priced short deal to reup the next year on a max, how many of last years team can we realistically bring back? Assuming no Bonner, Ayres, Baynes or Cojo? Can we then keep Tiago, Bobo, Mills and DG?

Is it doable if Holt agrees to pay luxury tax this year?

Holt has paid it before and might be willing to do it short term



Lamarcus Aldridge is not coming to San Antonio.

When you look at the mechanistics to get it done salary wise it looks unlikely- much less does he wish to come here
It will be an interesting summer- however I'm not overly optimistic as I think the Spurs have less realistic flexibility than is thought

[baseline bum]

I'm actually okay with bringing the whole team back minus Bonner and Ayres but it doesn't appear that PATFO is. IMO, we were a Splitter and TP injury away from playing GS right now and I'd like our chances if we were fully healthy.

I think they can upgrade on Bellinelli but I'd bring everyone else back if Aldridge isn't happening. Well, except for Ayres. I really don't see Manu returning though, nothing about what he has said since elimination makes it sound like he's returning. At least nothing of what I have heard in the interviews on spurs.com and on the local tv stations. CoJo might end up being too expensive too since Green is going to command a nice contract, and of course Leonard is getting a max extension unless he signs a one year deal.

[Dex]

Yeah, it really seems to me that the only way the Spurs can realistically afford Aldridge is to sacrifice some core pieces of the team. I personally think he'd fit in great here, but I don't think he's worth giving up three-out-of-four of Green, Splitter, Mills, and Diaw.

[BatManu20]

LMA to Dallas or stays in Portland imo. Danny won't go to CLE unless he signs for dirt cheap. They can't afford him, especially if they want to retain Tristan Thompson who's playing himself int o a big contract right now.

[baseline bum]

Yeah, it really seems to me that the only way the Spurs can realistically afford Aldridge is to sacrifice some core pieces of the team. I personally think he'd fit in great here, but I don't think he's worth giving up three-out-of-four of Green, Splitter, Mills, and Diaw.

It's doable if Tim takes a paycut to about $7 million or so and they salary dump Splitter, assuming Holt will pay a $1.50 per $1.00 luxury tax for a year and assuming Manu retires. They may need to salary dump their first round pick too though. But they'd still be able to keep Leonard + Green + Diaw + Mills. Joseph would be renounced, and so would Bellinelli, Baynes, Ayres, and Bonner.

[BatManu20]

When it's all said and done, Spurs will more than likely bring back most of the same guys, minus one or two like Ayers and Bonner, + the draft pick.

[DPG21920]

Holt has paid it before and might be willing to do it short term




When you look at the mechanistics to get it done salary wise it looks unlikely- much less does he wish to come here
It will be an interesting summer- however I'm not overly optimistic as I think the Spurs have less realistic flexibility than is thought

No one knows what flexibility the Spurs have at the moment. It could end up being much more than we thought if Tim takes a low contract. It's really up in the air right now. But with Pop's comments about changing things up, it definitely seems like things will be different.

[DPG21920]

The only people the Spurs may need replacement for are Patty/Manu/Beli/Ayres/Bonner/Cory/Baynes

I'm not counting Boris or Tiago since they would be gone for LA so they would be replaced (hopefully it's Boris gone - I love him, but I love Tiago more).

Ayres/Bonner are quite easily replaced because they play such limited roles anyways and there are a lot of good prospects. Spurs have Kyle Anderson to fill a role as well. Spurs will also have a first round pick (at least one) to replace a spot. So really the question is, is LA worth having to find replacements for Patty/Manu/Beli/Cory/Baynes assuming you have Kyle who might fill a role and 1st round pick to start with?

That's 5 bench spots to fill with Kyle Anderson, the 26th pick & either the MLE (if Spurs are willing to pay luxury tax) or min contracts.

[DPG21920]

And for the triple post for finale - if anyone is asking me my own answer to that question? I say absolutely.

If someone said you could essentially trade Manu/Patty/Cory/Beli/Baynes/Bonner/Ayres for LaMarcus/26th Pick/Kyle Anders (and possibly an MLE level player) no one would ever say no to that.

[cjw]

sign a 4 year deal with alridge with player option after 2 years cap up then sign him max to 5 year deal then

If that's how you need to get it done, then maybe...

But do you really want to sign him for $20.1 / $21.0mm over the next two years ($67.1mm cap / 4.5% raises) and then max him out for another five years at 35% of the cap? Over $30mm a year ascending at 7.5% per year for a guy who will be 37-38 when all is said and done?

[Andthentherewas21]

And for the triple post for finale - if anyone is asking me my own answer to that question? I say absolutely.

If someone said you could essentially trade Manu/Patty/Cory/Beli/Baynes/Bonner/Ayres for LaMarcus/26th Pick/Kyle Anders (and possibly an MLE level player) no one would ever say no to that.

I would say no. The Spurs lose all their backup guards (could care less about the frontcount players) for LaMarcus, a pick the Spurs have regardless, and are forced to play Kyle "Slow-Mo" Anderson who struggled to find court time during an injury riddled season for the Spurs. This immediately after a season when Parker struggled significantly.

I think the Spurs can probably find a decent role player at 26, but I doubt he'll be able to contribute immediately. Depending on Anderson's progress this off-season, he may or may not be ready to contribute next season. And while the MLE has traditionally been able to net a decent player, with the impending jump in the salary cap, I could see players demanding more money this off-season to offset the higher MLE that will be available next season.

[elbamba]

If a player retires with future years on his contract, does he still get the money?

My thought would be to offer Duncan a 2 year contract for 15 million and a player option on the second year. He could then play this year for maybe 5-6 million and then retire if they win the championship.

[elbamba]

At this point, I would prefer to keep Marco over resigning Manu to a lot of money. And Manu has been my favorite player for the past 10 years.

[stxspurs]

its smoke screen....we will probably end up with Dalembert or the bad lopez

[baseline bum]

its smoke screen....we will probably end up with Dalembert or the bad lopez

Brooke? I'd rather have the good brother Robin.

[Seventyniner]

Lamarcus Aldridge is not coming to San Antonio.

He's already here!

[DPG21920]

If a player retires with future years on his contract, does he still get the money?

My thought would be to offer Duncan a 2 year contract for 15 million and a player option on the second year. He could then play this year for maybe 5-6 million and then retire if they win the championship.

The answer to your question is no - players do not get their money if they retire.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Spurs fans seem to be discounting the idea the team could be willing to pay the tax for one year, knowing after next summer the cap goes up substantially and they're in the clear. This is the twilight of the twilight of Tim's career. The front office owes him whatever it can do to try and get another ring before he's done.

[cd021]

Green is gone imo. To Cle.

Marco might be gone too to better pastures. Nigga is a winner after all.

And all that is without even considering Manu or Lamar moves tbh :lol

If Lamar or Gasol don't come and Manu doesn't retire. Might as well tank for the lottery cause this team has no prayer next year.

Sound like a Cleveland fan. They will have the highest payroll in the NBA. Smith is picking up his option Thompson is going to be resigned (probably at $14 million a year), Love has a handshake deal to pick up his option, Mosgov's team option is getting picked up. They will have at least $115 million in salary before they get to the MLE.

[cd021]

If a player retires with future years on his contract, does he still get the money?

My thought would be to offer Duncan a 2 year contract for 15 million and a player option on the second year. He could then play this year for maybe 5-6 million and then retire if they win the championship.

The Spurs could offer Duncan a 2 year deal (with the 2nd year partially guaranteed). He'd get payed a portion of his money irregardless of whether he retires or plays. They already did it with McDyess.

[cd021]

If that's how you need to get it done, then maybe...

But do you really want to sign him for $20.1 / $21.0mm over the next two years ($67.1mm cap / 4.5% raises) and then max him out for another five years at 35% of the cap? Over $30mm a year ascending at 7.5% per year for a guy who will be 37-38 when all is said and done?

They could sign him to a 1 year deal worth $18 then give him a max 4 year deal the following off season. He'd make something like $106 over 5 seasons

[maverick1948]

Anyone on here ever hear of a "one and one" contract"? That is where a player signs a 2 yr contract with the 2nd year a player option in order to sign a higher max. LA is at a point that if he signs a max contract this year, he would lose a lot of future money. If he signs a 5 yr max, he get the max deal at the level of the CBA now or a starting figure of 18.9 mil with annual raises. If he signs a one and one, LA would be at the break point for the higher max at 10yrs or more. Starting in 2016-17, that amount goes to 29mil +or-. If SA is the place LA wants to come then a one and one contract works in both his and the Spurs favor. LA can take a contract of 13 mill with a 2nd yr at play option at whatever. Then sign max deal after his 10th season and get the extra 10 mill a year for 5 yrs. This would give the Spurs a lot of leeway to work a contract with Danny Green to return for 6 mill and good raises. If another team offers more than 6 mill, we should let him go. A 3 and D can be found for less then 6 mill. Kawhi will be better off taking a 3 yr deal for max now and extend after that when he can get 7 yr max deal. "Reality of the cap space"? With a creative front office, we can get LA, DG, KL, TD, and still have money for a bench.

[look_at_g_shred]

3 and D guys are not easy to find lol why did it take so long for us to find a Bowen replacement? 6 mil for DG that's it? :lmao dude should get no less than 9! Pay whatever it takes to keep him. If we lose Danny, we may as well throw our championship aspirations out the window.

[TD 21]

IIRC, partially guaranteed contracts count fully against the cap (as if they were guaranteed). The difference is that the team can simply opt to waive the player when the deadline comes to fully guarantee the contract, and then at that point the entire salary comes off the books. So there's really no loophole there.

Right, which they can do, if Duncan only intends to play one more season

However they end up doing it, if Aldridge signs and Green re-signs, I'm confident that Duncan and Ginobili would work with the organization.

My only concerns this off season are: 1) Signing Aldridge, 2) Re-signing Green, 3) Ginobili returning. If those three things come to fruition, the top eight would be: Duncan, Aldridge, Leonard, Green, Parker, Ginobili, one of Splitter/Diaw and one of Mills/Joseph. The depth would take a hit, but the tradeoff on the top end would be more than worth it.

[spurs10]

Right, which they can do, if Duncan only intends to play one more season

However they end up doing it, if Aldridge signs and Green re-signs, I'm confident that Duncan and Ginobili would work with the organization.

My only concerns this off season are: 1) Signing Aldridge, 2) Re-signing Green, 3) Ginobili returning. If those three things come to fruition, the top eight would be: Duncan, Aldridge, Leonard, Green, Parker, Ginobili, one of Splitter/Diaw and one of Mills/Joseph. The depth would take a hit, but the tradeoff on the top end would be more than worth it. This is where our draft pick, Anderson, or Baynes might come into play....that's 11.

[T Park]

if Green goes anywhere its to the Knicks. Can see them giving him a contract to come home and shore up their shooting, plus playe the new age small ball with a slower Anthony at the 4.

[cjw]

if Green goes anywhere its to the Knicks. Can see them giving him a contract to come home and shore up their shooting, plus playe the new age small ball with a slower Anthony at the 4.

You must not follow Phil Jackson on Twitter!

[ElNono]

Right, which they can do, if Duncan only intends to play one more season

However they end up doing it, if Aldridge signs and Green re-signs, I'm confident that Duncan and Ginobili would work with the organization.

My only concerns this off season are: 1) Signing Aldridge, 2) Re-signing Green, 3) Ginobili returning. If those three things come to fruition, the top eight would be: Duncan, Aldridge, Leonard, Green, Parker, Ginobili, one of Splitter/Diaw and one of Mills/Joseph. The depth would take a hit, but the tradeoff on the top end would be more than worth it.

It'll be interesting to see how much TD gets paid if he wants back. I can completely imagine an scenario where Pop does not want guys like Green or Tiago to make more than TD, strictly from a respect standpoint. If that's the case, it will likely cost $10m again.

[baseline bum]

Spurs fans seem to be discounting the idea the team could be willing to pay the tax for one year, knowing after next summer the cap goes up substantially and they're in the clear. This is the twilight of the twilight of Tim's career. The front office owes him whatever it can do to try and get another ring before he's done.

I think Holt will do it for a year, but it's not the dollar for dollar tax of the old days. Even for a first time offender the tax is $1.50 per dollar over now.

[baseline bum]

It'll be interesting to see how much TD gets paid if he wants back. I can completely imagine an scenario where Pop does not want guys like Green or Tiago to make more than TD, strictly from a respect standpoint. If that's the case, it will likely cost $10m again.

I could honestly see Tim take the same paycut Manu did this year, maybe a $7 million contract. I can definitely see Pop telling him he won't pay him less than $10 million and I can see Tim telling him to go fuck himself, he'll make what he makes. Not that I'd hold it against him since he's probably worth about $18 million.

[DPG21920]

I think Holt will do it for a year, but it's not the dollar for dollar tax of the old days. Even for a first time offender the tax is $1.50 per dollar over now.

Yup - it's a hefty bill. For a team that is just 5M over the tax line, the bill is 7.5M in tax for that. Also, a side note that no one seems to be discussing: It's not just about luxury tax. It's about total dollars spent. Even if the Spurs weren't in the "luxury tax" the roster could still cost 80M dollars.

Even in the past, when LT was lower, have you ever seen that from the Spurs? Luxury tax or not, 80M is 80M. Spurs didn't avoid luxury tax because of the tax. To them its total dollars spent whether it's in the form of a tax or not.

[spurs10]

Yup - it's a hefty bill. For a team that is just 5M over the tax line, the bill is 7.5M in tax for that. Also, a side note that no one seems to be discussing: It's not just about luxury tax. It's about total dollars spent. Even if the Spurs weren't in the "luxury tax" the roster could still cost 80M dollars.

Even in the past, when LT was lower, have you ever seen that from the Spurs? Luxury tax or not, 80M is 80M. Spurs didn't avoid luxury tax because of the tax. To them its total dollars spent whether it's in the form of a tax or not.:dizzyNo wonder it cost more to see the Spurs than a night at the Four Seasons.