ADVANCED STATS FROM PLAYOFFS MARCO VERSUS DANNY

[tholdren]

PER
Marco 20.7
Danny10.5

OWS
Marco .5
Danny .1

DWS
Marco 0
Danny .2

WS
Marco .5
Danny .2

WS/48
Marco .215
Danny .053

OBPM
Marco 6.3
Danny -.7

DBPM
Marco -1
Danny 2.9

BPM
Marco 5.4
Danny 2.2

VORP
Marco .2
Danny .2


Many stats show that Marco was superior to Danny during this year's playoffs, yet many Spurs fans think that Green deserves 5-6 times the pay that Marco receives.

Thoughts?

[dabom]

Dam Chinook lol

[benefactor]

http://photos.stoynev.net/misc_cars/NewThreadCatButton2.gif

[Mikeanaro]

Well, he is not a 12 million dollar guy.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Were you thinking to yourself that Neal deserved an exponential raise in comparison to Manu after the 2013 Finals?

[Chinook]

Lol using a microscopic sample size. Another tholdren special.

[tholdren]

Lol using a microscopic sample size. Another tholdren (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=29395) special.

so you're saying a 7 game slump wouldn't be enough for a coach to make a change? Look at this year, everyone saw that Tony was being outplayed by Mills. Small sample size, but I think if Mills got the minutes SA would have won. I think that if Joseph got Parker's minutes, we would have won. Small sample size, but it was big enough to know that Parker should have been benched.

LOL at deflection

[rudwick]

Both regular seasons and last year's playoffs, a much bigger sample, show exactly the opposite is true.

[Chinook]

so you're saying a 7 game slump wouldn't be enough for a coach to make a change?

Green didn't have a seven-game slump. He shot at least 50 percent from the field in three of those games. Danny had an abysmal Game One, which strongly directed his series numbers. And no, Pop wouldn't bench Green for seven poor games, seeing as Green is known to be incredibly streaky.


Look at this year, everyone saw that Tony was being outplayed by Mills.

Half a season is hardly the same thing as a seven-game series, especially given the fact that Green was significantly better than Marco defensively. Parker wasn't doing anything on either end.


Small sample size, but I think if Mills got the minutes SA would have won.

Mills got plenty of burn, but he couldn't stop Austin Freaking Rivers from going HAM on him.


I think that if Joseph got Parker's minutes, we would have won.

I pretty much agree with this.


Small sample size, but it was big enough to know that Parker should have been benched.

Parker had a whole season of awful play to help us come to that conclusion. If he were at his 2011 best for the RS and then hell off the playoffs, staying with him would have been totally justified.


LOL at deflection

Lol at picking a sample size that supports your point. Green had a superior Game Seven to Marco and a far superior season as a whole, but you pick seven games where Danny was slumping offensively to try to prove your point. It's just absurd. Anyone can get stats to support their view if they don't care about confidence intervals.

[cd98]

Bellineli was on fire in the playoffs.

[tholdren]

Green didn't have a seven-game slump. He shot at least 50 percent from the field in three of those games. Danny had an abysmal Game One, which strongly directed his series numbers. And no, Pop wouldn't bench Green for seven poor games, seeing as Green is known to be incredibly streaky.



Half a season is hardly the same thing as a seven-game series, especially given the fact that Green was significantly better than Marco defensively. Parker wasn't doing anything on either end.



Mills got plenty of burn, but he couldn't stop Austin Freaking Rivers from going HAM on him.



I pretty much agree with this.



Parker had a whole season of awful play to help us come to that conclusion. If he were at his 2011 best for the RS and then hell off the playoffs, staying with him would have been totally justified.



Lol at picking a sample size that supports your point. Green had a superior Game Seven to Marco and a far superior season as a whole, but you pick seven games where Danny was slumping offensively to try to prove your point. It's just absurd. Anyone can get stats to support their view if they don't care about confidence intervals.

1. If he's streaky, why does sample size matter anyway? Everyone's numbers will equal out the more you shoot.

2. Im not talking half a season, Im talking playoffs.

3. Rivers scored on anyone who defended him one game. Patty played more of a role taking the series to 7 than danny did, not sure how you can dispute that.

4. I disagree, and that's just a coaching difference, I would play the hot hand in the playoffs, rather than loyalty; sample size 1Q or 82 games.

5. You can be a regular season hero or playoff hero. Im with the latter.

- You can't equate regular season stats with playoff stats, its a different animal. Next, Im not sure you can think that with the exit of Tim and Manu, and the slowing down of Tony that our starting 2 won't have to pick up the scoring load and get more defensive pressure. Danny had his chance to show his worth as not a 4th or 5th option lingering on the three point line, but as the offensive player on the team. He was thoroughly outplayed on the offensive end the whole series by marco and patty. So, your theory is to pay him 2-3 times more than the two players who outperformed him combined? Again, I'm semi-down for giving Green 10 million, but not at the expense of letting 2 players who out-performed him go.

[Malik Hairston]

Should we play the 7 game sample size game? We could produce some extremely outrageous results all over NBA history, tbh:lol

[dabom]

Should we play the 7 game sample size game? We could produce some extremely outrageous results all over NBA history, tbh:lol

But he did do bad and the spurs live for the playoffs. You can't just ignore these stats.

[Malik Hairston]

But he did do bad and the spurs live for the playoffs. You can't just ignore these stats.

If we're judging Green strictly by his playoffs history, especially in isolated series' of choice, then he's probably one of the 5-7 best role players of the modern era, tbh:lol

It's a flawed argument on both ends..

[tholdren]

Should we play the 7 game sample size game? We could produce some extremely outrageous results all over NBA history, tbh:lol

It would almost be like you really smart people who:
Refer to plus minus as a reliable and valid piece of data after a game

[dabom]

If we're judging Green strictly by his playoffs history, then he's probably one of the 5-7 best role players of the modern era, tbh:lol

With a negative correlation between the 3 years. Like a decline.

[Malik Hairston]

It would almost be like you really smart people who:
Refer to plus minus as a reliable and valid piece of data after a game

None of us cite +/- data based on 1 game, though..

[cd021]

Well, he is not a 12 million dollar guy.

He is. Because teams are willing to pay him that much.

It would be the equivalent of him making $8.5 million this past season when compared to the percentage of cap.

He'd only be making 13.5% of the cap and considering he's an elite shooter and of the best 2 guards defensively, he's worth it. That percentage continues to drop as the cap rises. I could see a 4 year $44 million dollar offer from S.A though

[Malik Hairston]

With a negative correlation between the 3 years. Like a decline.

Green was better in 2014 than he was in 2013, people just remember the hot Finals series..

[tholdren]

If we're judging Green strictly by his playoffs history, especially in isolated series' of choice, then he's probably one of the 5-7 best role players of the modern era, tbh:lol

It's a flawed argument on both ends..

Its almost as amusing as watching people use advanced stats in the first place.

[Malik Hairston]

Its almost as amusing as watching people use advanced stats in the first place.

Tell that to the majority of current NBA organizations, including the defending champions:lol..

[tholdren]

None of us cite +/- data based on 1 game, though..
doesn't matter if you use plus minus a million times, its not reliable, or valid.

[Malik Hairston]

doesn't matter if you use plus minus a million times, its not reliable, or valid.

There are many forms of on/off numbers that are valuable and accurate if you use them correctly and with proper context, tbh..

[tholdren]

Tell that to the majority of current NBA organizations, including the defending champions:lol..
lol there are many things that you cannot use advanced stats for, but people are still trying to sell the cogs and widgets model to many human aspects.

[dabom]

Green was better in 2014 than he was in 2013, people just remember the hot Finals series..

I need some RPM. I'm to lazy to look right now. Even if it was a little bit better he did decline to tomato can status in the playoffs. He is a really really streaky shooter. One night 60% and the other 20%.
He can rarely ever just be solid.

[tholdren]

There are many forms of on/off numbers that are valuable and accurate if you use them correctly and with proper context, tbh..
SMH there are too many nuances and the basic human element make advanced stats silly. The second interesting part is that stats are an ESTIMATE of occurrence, so technically they can't be used to predict anything with utmost certainty. Interesting that people know this and still try to do the impossible.

[Spur|n|Austin]

http://images1.tickld.com/live/postimages/c92e989e4e0e745480288d06bf453960.gif

[cd021]

Green can have off series and he did offensively vs the Clippers but that Game 7 performance was stellar

16pts, 6-12 FG, 3-7 3PT, 8 Rebs, 5 Blks, 3 Asts, and 2 Stls

[Mikeanaro]

He is. Because teams are willing to pay him that much.

It would be the equivalent of him making $8.5 million this past season when compared to the percentage of cap.

He'd only be making 13.5% of the cap and considering he's an elite shooter and of the best 2 guards defensively, he's worth it. That percentage continues to drop as the cap rises. I could see a 4 year $44 million dollar offer from S.A though
If he is worth that much I hope he´s out ASAP.
Should take a paycut to stay in SA since he only played 1 good game in the playoffs, even his defense was awful also we need cap space for LMA.

[palangi]

PER
Marco 20.7
Danny10.5

OWS
Marco .5
Danny .1

DWS
Marco 0
Danny .2

WS
Marco .5
Danny .2

WS/48
Marco .215
Danny .053

OBPM
Marco 6.3
Danny -.7

DBPM
Marco -1
Danny 2.9

BPM
Marco 5.4
Danny 2.2

VORP
Marco .2
Danny .2


Many stats show that Marco was superior to Danny during this year's playoffs, yet many Spurs fans think that Green deserves 5-6 times the pay that Marco receives.

Thoughts?
This right here is why advance stats are a joke and shouldn't be used to determine a players worth. As much as I bag on green he is head and shoulders above Marco.

[cd021]

If he is worth that much I hope he´s out ASAP.
Should take a paycut to stay in SA since he only played 1 good game in the playoffs, even his defense was awful also we need cap space for LMA.

Good luck finding a replacement. Elite 3 & D players don"t grow on tree.

Guy holds the Finals record for 3pts made and was crucial to two finals runs. We can keep Green and get LMA, so long as they move Splitter without taking back alot of salary or better yet an S&T with Splitter and Mills for Aldridge.

[hater]

:lmao calling our entire 2015 playoff run a small sample size :lmao

What a bunch o grade A ret-ards


FERRARI outplayer one tick pony and it wasn't even close. :lmao saying if we sign Lamar and lose Green we are not contenders :lol


:lmao short bus

[hater]

:lol still holding on a o his 3pt finals record when in actuality Miami forgot about him until game 6 and the moment they started paying him attention Green chokes :lol

[hater]

"I don't want Lamar if it means losing Green" - Grade A retard short bus members

[vjcchs12]

Do we have any chance at keeping Belinelli. Offensively he is a beast. He and Mills helped us win a few of those clippers games in the playoffs.