Quick Thoughts - 2015 Summer League Game 6 (Spurs vs. Nets)

[timvp]

http://i.imgur.com/pLUqqr2.jpg

-The difference in Kyle Anderson's game from the start of summer league until now is night and day. At first, it seemed like everything was happening too fast for him on both ends of the court and he was constantly making questionable decisions. In the last three games or so, Anderson has become a maestro out there and is clearly the most polished player on the court at all times. Sure, he still moves slowly but it seems like each of his movements are calculated. On defense, he has improved greatly by getting back to the basics: staying in a defensive crouch, not reaching on the perimeter and using his length to bother shots. He's never going to be a great defensive player but he has gone from terrible to average in summer league. On offense, his combination of craftiness, patience and length has been deadly. And then when the other team shows him too much attention, he flashes his passing skills. Becky Hammon has been playing him a lot at power forward in the last two games and Anderson has flourished even more. There's simply not a summer league power forward who can even think about guarding him. On top of that, having one more shooter surrounding him allows him to operate freely. Bottomline: Anderson not only looks like a legit NBA player, it's now a no-brainer that he should be the team's backup small forward. His playmaking and basketball IQ will be a perfect match for the bench unit. If he can knock down three-pointers at even 34-35 percent, I expect him to have a successful sophomore season and should be a fixture in the rotation.

-I continue to really like Jonathon Simmons. Offensively, he incessantly looks to create via penetration. While the dunks get put on the highlight reel, he's not a slam-or-bust player at all. He has really good footwork going toward the hoop, he can finish with either hand and he appears to be an outstanding passer – whether it's a cross-court pass or a dump off in the lane. Defensively, he's very active when on the ball. He can maneuver quickly around screens. He draws offensive fouls. He knows his responsibilities team-defense wise. Simmons does have some weakness – namely being a bit too loose with the ball on offense and overplaying too much on defense – but he appears to be an exciting prospect. A hungry, active, energetic, athletic, creative swingman on the deep bench? Yes, please. It'll be fun to see how he grows from here.

-I thought Cady Lalanne played relatively well. He's raw but he exhibits glimpses of ability. When he takes his time on his jumper, he can knock it down. Lalanne isn't close enough to an NBA player right now to be worthy of a roster spot, but due to those aforementioned glimpses, I hope he signs in Europe and the Spurs take a look at him next year in summer league.

-Jarell Eddie remains interesting due to his tantalizing three-point stroke. His fast, accurate release could be deadly in San Antonio's offense. Unfortunately, he's just so inept everywhere else. Really bad on defense. Molassesly slow to loose balls. Can't dribble or pass. That said, I hope to see him in training camp simply due to his shooting ability.

-I'm a fan of Darion Atkins. He's basically a poor, poor man's version of PJ Brown. He plays stout post defense, can defend pick-and-rolls, plays physically in the paint and is unselfish. I doubt he'll ever make it in the NBA since he's short (6-foot-8 at best) and unathletic but he has my respect for how he plays the game. It's apparent that he really understands the ins and outs. If he doesn't make it anywhere as a player, he has a future as a coach.

-Brandon Davies actually has the skill-set to maybe make it as a stretch power forward in the NBA one day. What's holding him back right now is a bad body. He struggles to hold his position under the basket, which is compounded by his lack of upper body strength. Nice player but he needs to dedicate himself if he wants to make it in this line of work.

-The point guards on the team, Shannon Scott and Will Cherry, are pretty damn bad. They're not even reliable enough to bring the ball up the court, much less do anything else. Thankfully Simmons and Anderson are around to bail them out by taking some of the ball-handling duties.

-Treveon Graham would be a good get for Austin. He's a work in progress but if he can vastly improve his guard skills, he'd be a worthwhile prospect on the D-League level.

-Twenty years ago, Youssou Ndoye probably makes it as an NBA player. Unfortunately for him, these days there really isn't much of a use for a 7-foot brute without many refined skills.

-Livio Jean-Charles hasn't played in the last two games. I haven't heard anything official but I'd guess his knee is bothering him since he had been limping since about the third game of summer league.

-I've been really impressed with Becky Hammon. It's now clear that she wasn't simply a token hire. This Vegas team has been far better coached than the Salt Lake team was, for example. Her out-of-timeout plays have been successful. Her rotations show that she has a good feel for which players deserve extended court time. In this game against the Nets, a key to the win was getting Anderson and Simmons rest late in the third and early in the fourth in order to let the duo carry the team down the stretch. Hammon didn't panic when the Nets went out in front and instead kept her eye on the big picture. To top it off, she's made advanced adjustment – such as using Anderson at power forward to create mismatches, making sure Atkins is the bigman pick-and-roll defender in key situations and running the offense through Simmons when the point guards shriveled – that make it clear she knows exactly what she's doing. Could she be a future head coach in the NBA? I'm now a believer.

[Robz4000]

Thanks for the write up. Agree on all points.

[raybies]

thanks. nice write up. i'm so impressed by Kyle's turnaround. went from scrubbing it up, to being arguably the best player this summer. wonder how far simmons and kyle and becky can take us.

[Spur|n|Austin]

:tu

[palangi]

I'd like to see Ndoye get on the Austin roster

[Flawless]

Great write up :tu I've been really impressed with Kyle Anderson's recent play; he really look's like a legit NBA player out there.

[alfahdlan]

Great read.

[KaiRMD1]

KA has definitely opened my eyes during these summer league games. I'm very impressed by him and Simmons out there. Great read old sport

[SAGirl]

Agree with everything. I think part of the adjustment to play KA at the 4 has to be to have all of your best players in the court at the same time for some stretches: KA, Simmons and Eddie. Having KA at the 4 also allows them to run some sets designed w a stretch 4 in mind, and allowsis Simmons room to isolate and run PnR with space,and make it harder to defend, since you do have to account for KA in SL. Nice write-up!!!! :toast

[Nathan89]

I prefer Simmons playing next to Ginobili this year over KA. Better at defense, three point shooting, passing, generating offense for others,etc. He can help take the pressure to create off of Gino every so often while still maximizing Patty Mills shooting ability. He'll be able to take advantage of an open paint that will result from playing two bigs that can shoot. A better option overall imo.

[LongtimeSpursFan]

I've been saying all along that Anderson is a legit player. I've been around enough basketball to see who has it and who doesn't. Given the minutes (15-20) I think Anderson can be an 8 pt, 5 rb, 3 ast, 1 steal a game player.

[NASpurs]

-Livio Jean-Charles hasn't played in the last two games. I haven't heard anything official but I'd guess his knee is bothering him since he had been limping since about the third game of summer league.


http://projectspurs.com/2015-articles/spurs-advance-in-summer-league-tournament-with-win-over-nets.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=spurs-advance-in-summer-league-tournament-with-win-over-nets


Post-game notes

Livio Jean-Charles missed his second straight Summer League game. After the game, Jean-Charles told me he tweaked his ankle and his injury was more precautionary.

[Bruno]

Thanks a lot timvp .

RC said few days ago that their priority was now the wing. I wonder if these good games by Anderson and Simmons have and impact on what they are looking for. While I doubt Spurs will go as far as signing no one, RC might now value players who could potentially be fine with not playing in case Anderson and/or Simmons turns into good rotation players. It's typically the 35 years old vet who won't whine with not playing because his mindset isn't on showcasing his skills to get a bigger contract.

[Gordy58]

So I'm guessing both Kyle and Jonathon both will be sharing the minutes vacated be Belli? They both bring a different dimension to the second unit. Kyle's mismatch potential, passing skills, rebounding, and ability to control the offense combined with Simmons' energy, passing skills, 3pt. Shooting, athleticism, and defense will definitely upgrade the bench over what Belli did. Plus in those games when Manu is resting I see Simmons sliding right in to the second guard spot and Kyle in the other. I'm really starting to see how this might work out pretty well this season. I just hope they stay consistent and continue to play within themselves.

[letmk]

Thanks a lot timvp (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=8) .

RC said few days ago that their priority was now the wing. I wonder if these good games by Anderson and Simmons have and impact on what they are looking for. While I doubt Spurs will go as far as signing no one, RC might now value players who could potentially be fine with not playing in case Anderson and/or Simmons turns into good rotation players. It's typically the 35 years old vet who won't whine with not playing because his mindset isn't on showcasing his skills to get a bigger contract.

With the good play by Anderson and Simmons, I suspect they will turn to a veteran like Prince instead of another young & unproven wing player.

[ElNono]

Good to hear about Kyle picking up his game. I gotta remember to catch the next game. Thanks for the writeup

[timvp]

Post-game notes

Livio Jean-Charles missed his second straight Summer League game. After the game, Jean-Charles told me he tweaked his ankle and his injury was more precautionary.

Nice find, thanks. Let's hope ankle and not knee.

[timvp]

RC said few days ago that their priority was now the wing. I wonder if these good games by Anderson and Simmons have and impact on what they are looking for. While I doubt Spurs will go as far as signing no one, RC might now value players who could potentially be fine with not playing in case Anderson and/or Simmons turns into good rotation players. It's typically the 35 years old vet who won't whine with not playing because his mindset isn't on showcasing his skills to get a bigger contract.

1. If the Spurs are REALLY impressed, I could see them not adding anyone right now. They could do a sink/swim test early in the season with Anderson and Simmons. If they show signs of struggling, then they can always sign a player in the Rasual Butler mold. Those types of players grow on trees.

2. I really do think that the way Anderson and Simmons have played lately has changed RC's course of action. Last week, it appeared as if he was moving on from Bonner. It even got to the point Bonner was fielding offers from other teams. Then, all of a sudden, instead of signing the wing that RC said was the next move, he went back to Bonner.

3. The role the Spurs have to offer really couldn't be too appealing to free agents. Backing up Kawhi and competing against Kyle Anderson for minutes? Even an old retread like Tayshaun Prince would see that and assume he'd never get to play. With a minimum contract and a likelihood of limited minutes to offer, the Spurs would probably have to scrape the bottom of the barrel. Perhaps a Chris Copeland or Carlos Delfino is the best they could do at the moment.

[Austin_Toros]

I'm surprised that Blackshear has barely been getting any minutes. I'm guessing after signing Simmons the Spurs are no longer interested.

[benefactor]

:tu

Nice to have a couple of guys on the SL team to get excited about. Perhaps they can put together a couple of more good performances and gives a little bit more basketball before we head into the dead period.

[duncan2150]

I like the fact that simmons and ka leads spurs offense

the team looked lost on offense without one of them, i was skeptical about KA but last couple of games were good and it probably change the FO mind

[BillMc]

Nice write up as always OP!:toast

[Chinook]

Simmons saved the summer league for me. After LJC and Cady fell off, the team looked destined for a repeat of the Utah league. But now, this is the first time in years that the Spurs have had two roster guys playing at a high level at the same time (Cory and Kawhi did good jobs in 2012 but not the in the same games, and Cory wasn't as good as he'd be in 2013 anyway). Besides being awesome from a viewer's experiences, it bodes well for both of their prospects with the big roster that they can share ball-handling with each other and with a PG. They'll need to be able to do that to play next to Manu.

[Chinook]

Thanks a lot timvp (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=8) .

RC said few days ago that their priority was now the wing. I wonder if these good games by Anderson and Simmons have and impact on what they are looking for. While I doubt Spurs will go as far as signing no one, RC might now value players who could potentially be fine with not playing in case Anderson and/or Simmons turns into good rotation players. It's typically the 35 years old vet who won't whine with not playing because his mindset isn't on showcasing his skills to get a bigger contract.

I wouldn't even consider adding a vet wing on a guaranteed deal unless it was too good to pass up. They simply don't need to fret about who's going to be the ninth perimeter player during the regular season. There will be time to grab a guy off the street later in the year. Williams' contract is probably better to keep on the books for now anyway.

[AFBlue]

Becky Hammon has been playing [Anderson] a lot at power forward in the last two games and Anderson has flourished even more. There's simply not a summer league power forward who can even think about guarding him. On top of that, having one more shooter surrounding him allows him to operate freely.

Noticed this about Anderson. He was extremely effective alongside Simmons and Eddie. I think him having the versatility to play either forward spot is extremely helpful to his long-term outlook with the Spurs. Still want to see him not come up short on so many jumpers, but hopefully he can improve over time.

[picnroll]

If McCallum is as good a player as Simmons appears to be this will be a helluva well rounded, deep team.

[AFBlue]

In spite of not having a highlight reel dunk (alley oop from KA wasn't bad though), I think this was Simmons' best all-around game. He brought the same effort and intensity as previous games, but he showed pretty much all his bag of tricks on offense. He continues to hit the spot-up 3, a must for Spurs role players, but his drive-and-finish ability went to another level. I saw a lefty drive, scoop and layup with English that was Manu-esque...only Simmons is a righty. I saw a euro-step in traffic with an easy finish at the rim. He had multiple straight-line drives to the right where he used his athleticism and strength to finish or draw contact. He bullied Hollins' kid, who actually played pretty well when Simmons was out, all night long on both ends. And that doesn't consider his crisp passing, which he flashed multiple times.

I know I already threw out Manu in this post as a comp, but his athleticism toggling between smooth and explosive while remaining in-control really reminds me of Kawhi. He's obviously not as skilled as either, but that's some exciting growth potential. If not for KA's emergence in the last few games, there's no doubt this place would be going bananas over Simmons.

[tatteredprince]

WE ARE GONNA ROCK AND ROLL

next season

yes!!!!

[tatteredprince]

we are the deepest team in the last 3 years, in my humble, humbler and humblest opinion

[Bruno]

Jean-Charles sprained in ankle with ASVEL in late May and didn't play the last couple of games of their season because of it. Provided it's the same ankle, this new injury might be related to the old one.

[TXstbobcat]

Thank you for the great writeup!

[Mr. Body]

Anderson/West pick and rolls will be interesting. ANderson locating the ball up to Marjanovich should be something we see often.

[exstatic]

I like the fact that simmons and ka leads spurs offense

the team looked lost on offense without one of them, i was skeptical about KA but last couple of games were good and it probably change the FO mind

The FO didn't need their mind changed on Kyle. They've been nothing BUT positive on him since before SL.

[SPURt]

The most positive aspect of having Anderson and Simmons on board is they've both played a lot in Austin and know the Spurs system.

[Spurtacular]

Something about Game 6 and Spurs vs. Nets that goes so well together....

[hater]

Anderson > ginobili

[100%duncan]

Excited with Simmons. But I always miss the gdamn game

[Biggems]

I like Davies a lot. He hustles his tail off. Unfortunately, like you said, he is weak. He needs to get into a strong weight program over the next two years, while also working on his low post and midrange game......If he could add strength and a bit more skill to his hustle and desire, I think it could turn him into a solid rotation guy in the NBA.

[TDomination]

Thanks for the write up Timvp

Its great to see that Anderson has been improving game to game. Whether its in summer league or NBA or wherever, if you're improving thats always a great sign that the individual is really focusing on getting better. Lets hope he keeps it up.

[Dex]

:tu Good stuff. Simmons and SlowMo have me excited for Saturday's game.

[tatteredprince]

with timvp saying kyle can be our back up three

then, we are set!

deepest team in the NBA: go Spurs go!!!

[tatteredprince]

i can smell

Ginobili-Mills-Simmons-Marjanovic-West!

Ginnnnnnnnnnnnoooooooooooooooobbbbbbbbiiiiiiiiiiil llllliiiiiiii!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ceperez]

In spite of not having a highlight reel dunk (alley oop from KA wasn't bad though), I think this was Simmons' best all-around game. He brought the same effort and intensity as previous games, but he showed pretty much all his bag of tricks on offense. He continues to hit the spot-up 3, a must for Spurs role players, but his drive-and-finish ability went to another level. I saw a lefty drive, scoop and layup with English that was Manu-esque...only Simmons is a righty. I saw a euro-step in traffic with an easy finish at the rim. He had multiple straight-line drives to the right where he used his athleticism and strength to finish or draw contact. He bullied Hollins' kid, who actually played pretty well when Simmons was out, all night long on both ends. And that doesn't consider his crisp passing, which he flashed multiple times.

I know I already threw out Manu in this post as a comp, but his athleticism toggling between smooth and explosive while remaining in-control really reminds me of Kawhi. He's obviously not as skilled as either, but that's some exciting growth potential. If not for KA's emergence in the last few games, there's no doubt this place would be going bananas over Simmons.

What is extremely encouraging is that he goes left a lot of times! Watch the D-league highlight videos of him.

What is weird also is that Project Spurs is saying that he's a lefty.

[ceperez]

The FO didn't need their mind changed on Kyle. They've been nothing BUT positive on him since before SL.

If the Spurs can be confident that KA can be in the court come playoff time, then that fills a glaring weakness. The 2nd team looks like this:

West
Diaw
Anderson/Simmons <--- These two aren't veterans. They seem to know what to do in SL, can this translate to playoff ball?
Ginobili
Mills

[TMTTRIO]

Anderson > ginobili
The way it should be. Manu should just enjoy his last ride to a ring this season and let the other guys carry the bench.

[spurs10]

Thanks for the Quick Thoughts! My faith is a bit restored with KA playing like a different person since hat game 1. Simmons has a lot of energy and seems like he will be a good athletic addition to our bench. On to the Quarter-finals!

[EVAY]

Thanks, Timvp! Always great to read your thoughts.

[DPG21920]

timvp - while I share your optimism on KA's progress, I don't share it with regards to impact minutes. My concern with him is role and fit. KA seems to be a guy who needs the ball to be effective and will he have that on the bench? With his shot not yet consistent, defense still a question mark (especially against SG/SF) & playmaking not quite as good as advertised (still, really solid there though) - how does he fit off the ball?

o He's not a hired gun with his shot (especially from 3) not being consistent, so that's not his role
o He won't be the best playmaker/ball handler on the bench unit, so that's not his role
o He's not some defensive ace you can sick on people, so that's not his role.

While he's shown all the things you've mentioned, will that translate to the role he's asked to play? I see him more as a guy who's out there helping units function effectively (advance stats will show the units he's in being effective) while not having big numbers with the exception of the occasional outburst because he's talented.

It's not a bad thing to have that, but I am not sure about fit.

Unlike with Simmons, you can see his role and how that might really, really make an impact if he turns out legit.

[ceperez]

timvp - while I share your optimism on KA's progress, I don't share it with regards to impact minutes. My concern with him is role and fit. KA seems to be a guy who needs the ball to be effective and will he have that on the bench? With his shot not yet consistent, defense still a question mark (especially against SG/SF) & playmaking not quite as good as advertised (still, really solid there though) - how does he fit off the ball?

o He's not a hired gun with his shot (especially from 3) not being consistent, so that's not his role
o He won't be the best playmaker/ball handler on the bench unit, so that's not his role
o He's not some defensive ace you can sick on people, so that's not his role.

While he's shown all the things you've mentioned, will that translate to the role he's asked to play? I see him more as a guy who's out there helping units function effectively (advance stats will show the units he's in being effective) while not having big numbers with the exception of the occasional outburst because he's talented.

It's not a bad thing to have that, but I am not sure about fit.

Unlike with Simmons, you can see his role and how that might really, really make an impact if he turns out legit.

What separates an NBA player from a D-Legue player is consistency. If both Anderson and Simmons can show consistency. If they can show consistency in this SL elimination playoffs, then they can definitely at least play in ther regular season. The bigger question though is whether they will be good enough to play minutes in the playoff rotation. They have a training camp and the regular season to develop their game.

Simmons progress in the last two years in outstanding.

Kyle Anderson is 21 years old and plays with a lot of maturity for his age. He understands his limitations and is working on moves to compensate for that. He can see the game that only a few can see and that is worth a lot in the NBA.

[DAF86]

-The difference in Kyle Anderson's game from the start of summer league until now is night and day. At first, it seemed like everything was happening too fast for him on both ends of the court and he was constantly making questionable decisions. In the last three games or so, Anderson has become a maestro out there and is clearly the most polished player on the court at all times. Sure, he still moves slowly but it seems like each of his movements are calculated. On defense, he has improved greatly by getting back to the basics: staying in a defensive crouch, not reaching on the perimeter and using his length to bother shots. He's never going to be a great defensive player but he has gone from terrible to average in summer league. On offense, his combination of craftiness, patience and length has been deadly. And then when the other team shows him too much attention, he flashes his passing skills. Becky Hammon has been playing him a lot at power forward in the last two games and Anderson has flourished even more. There's simply not a summer league power forward who can even think about guarding him. On top of that, having one more shooter surrounding him allows him to operate freely. Bottomline: Anderson not only looks like a legit NBA player, it's now a no-brainer that he should be the team's backup small forward. His playmaking and basketball IQ will be a perfect match for the bench unit. If he can knock down three-pointers at even 34-35 percent, I expect him to have a successful sophomore season and should be a fixture in the rotation.

Where does this phrase rank among the biggest hyperboles of all-time?

[Dingle Barry]

I like Simmons as Kawhi's primary backup more than Anderson. Just don't see Anderson effectively guarding NBA SFs, and the second unit has desperately needed a slasher like Simmons since Manu lost the ability. Anderson can steal some minutes from Simmons depending on the matchups.

[spurraider21]

Simmons saved the summer league for me. After LJC and Cady fell off, the team looked destined for a repeat of the Utah league. But now, this is the first time in years that the Spurs have had two roster guys playing at a high level at the same time (Cory and Kawhi did good jobs in 2012 but not the in the same games, and Cory wasn't as good as he'd be in 2013 anyway). Besides being awesome from a viewer's experiences, it bodes well for both of their prospects with the big roster that they can share ball-handling with each other and with a PG. They'll need to be able to do that to play next to Manu.
iirc kawhi only played like 2 games in the '12 summer league

[Chinook]

iirc kawhi only played like 2 games in the '12 summer league

Yeah, and Cory didn't really pick up steam until after that. He and Kawhi didn't have the same combined level of play that Anderson and Simmons do. Probably my favorite summer league since I've been able to watch them (started in 2009).

[spurraider21]

Yeah, and Cory didn't really pick up steam until after that. He and Kawhi didn't have the same combined level of play that Anderson and Simmons do. Probably my favorite summer league since I've been able to watch them (started in 2009).
kawhi was so dominant they pulled him after 2 games because he had nothing left to show. he was running as a point forward quite a bit too

[Mr. Body]

kawhi was so dominant they pulled him after 2 games because he had nothing left to show. he was running as a point forward quite a bit too

Anyone have stats?

[spurraider21]

Anyone have stats?
http://www.nba.com/summer-league/2012/teams/spurs/


kawhi's 2 games:

http://www.nba.com/summer-league/games/20120715/SASATL/gameinfo.html
http://www.nba.com/summer-league/games/20120717/SASLAL/gameinfo.html

[Chinook]

http://www.nba.com/summer-league/2012/teams/spurs/


kawhi's 2 games:

http://www.nba.com/summer-league/games/20120715/SASATL/gameinfo.html
http://www.nba.com/summer-league/games/20120717/SASLAL/gameinfo.html

That's not a dominant as I remember, but then again, Kawhi was already a starter. From a pure statistical standpoint, that doesn't seem any better than how Anderson has played in Vegas.

[SnakeBoy]

I can't wait to see SloMo send Ibaka to the bench with foul trouble. Ibaka is going to bite on those slow motion fakes every time.

[ceperez]

That's not a dominant as I remember, but then again, Kawhi was already a starter. From a pure statistical standpoint, that doesn't seem any better than how Anderson has played in Vegas.

I don't recall Leonard having a dominant game in SL. Those numbers just look like Anderson's numbers.

The guy who was dominant was Marco Belinelli ... 37 points:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXzpzqLf5wE

[Aztecfan03]

http://www.nba.com/summer-league/2012/teams/spurs/


kawhi's 2 games:

http://www.nba.com/summer-league/games/20120715/SASATL/gameinfo.html
http://www.nba.com/summer-league/games/20120717/SASLAL/gameinfo.html
that doesn't seem that dominant.

[Cry Havoc]

we are the deepest team in the last 3 years, in my humble, humbler and humblest opinion

Amazing what adding an all-star level bigman while only losing one starter and a couple of bench players will do for a team that was already considered a championship contender.

[Thunder1]

Thank you for the great writeup!
+1

[SAGirl]

I can't wait to see SloMo send Ibaka to the bench with foul trouble. Ibaka is going to bite on those slow motion fakes every time.
:boboRofl Thissssssss! You made me laugh so much! Thanksssss

[timvp]

Simmons saved the summer league for me. After LJC and Cady fell off, the team looked destined for a repeat of the Utah league. But now, this is the first time in years that the Spurs have had two roster guys playing at a high level at the same time (Cory and Kawhi did good jobs in 2012 but not the in the same games, and Cory wasn't as good as he'd be in 2013 anyway). Besides being awesome from a viewer's experiences, it bodes well for both of their prospects with the big roster that they can share ball-handling with each other and with a PG. They'll need to be able to do that to play next to Manu.

Yeah, watching this Anderson and Simmons combination is really fun. Simmons signing and then beasting from his first seconds on the summer league team has made this offseason even better. And even though he's not an NBA level prospect, I like watching Atkins play defense. Hopefully we get at least a couple more games to watch 'em.

This is one of the funnest summer league teams to watch since that 2001 Parker team. With Parker, he might have been the most shockingly good summer league player I've ever seen. A skinny prepubescent Frenchman stepped on the court and was got damn unstoppable. It's no wonder teams started offering up All-Stars for him after watching just one game. But, yeah, back then we had to wait like two weeks to watch the games on ESPN2 at 3 A.M.

[timvp]

timvp - while I share your optimism on KA's progress, I don't share it with regards to impact minutes. My concern with him is role and fit. KA seems to be a guy who needs the ball to be effective and will he have that on the bench?

I see this year's bench being different:

1) Ginobili can't be counted on as being a playmaker each and every play he's on the court with the bench ... which has basically always been his role. Ginobili needs someone to share playmaking duties with. And since it's not going to be Mills, Anderson will fit that role perfectly. Ginobili was still a good playmaker last year but his increase in turnovers point to the fact that it's not easy for him anymore. A year older and probably another step slower and Ginobili will welcome having Anderson at his side.

2) Usually, I advocate shooting above just about everything when it comes to bench players. But this year, the spacing is going to be so terrific that the Spurs actually need someone to take advantage of it more than they need yet another shooter. Imagine Mills and Ginobili on the court with two of Diaw, West and Aldridge. Defenses will need to be hugging out on the perimeter when Anderson has the ball. You could post him up, isolate him or put him in pick-and-rolls and then let him go to work.

3) With Aldridge in the fold, the Spurs will likely run more inside-out sets. Anderson has the tools to be one of the best post-up threats on the team, which would allow the Spurs to keep playing inside-out when Aldridge is on the bench.

I'm not 100 percent sold Anderson is going to make it -- his defense will be Danny Ferry-esque at best and he seemed to play nervous a lot of the time last year -- but I hope Pop gives him a chance. The bench needs to be more than simply Manu-go-do-your-thing and Anderson is the type of player who can help.

[Nathan89]

http://www.nba.com/summer-league/2012/teams/spurs/


kawhi's 2 games:

http://www.nba.com/summer-league/games/20120715/SASATL/gameinfo.html
http://www.nba.com/summer-league/games/20120717/SASLAL/gameinfo.html

The numbers don't seem that dominant but at the time everyone on spurstalk was very impressed. I distinctly remember him being compared to Lebron on this board because of his sl performances.

[ElNono]

That's not a dominant as I remember, but then again, Kawhi was already a starter. From a pure statistical standpoint, that doesn't seem any better than how Anderson has played in Vegas.


I don't recall Leonard having a dominant game in SL. Those numbers just look like Anderson's numbers.

The guy who was dominant was Marco Belinelli ... 37 points:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXzpzqLf5wE


that doesn't seem that dominant.

He was dominant. He got fouled a lot, because they couldn't stop him. After those two games, nobody was surprised that the Spurs pulled him.

Then again, he already had an NBA season under his belt.

[Nathan89]

Anderson as the bench playmaker is an absolute joke. He won't create good looks for his teammates. It's better to have an athlete that can penetrate which will shift the defense. Passing the ball quickly will get the team more efficient shots.

[ElNono]

I see this year's bench being different:

1) Ginobili can't be counted on as being a playmaker each and every play he's on the court with the bench ... which has basically always been his role. Ginobili needs someone to share playmaking duties with. And since it's not going to be Mills, Anderson will fit that role perfectly. Ginobili was still a good playmaker last year but his increase in turnovers point to the fact that it's not easy for him anymore. A year older and probably another step slower and Ginobili will welcome having Anderson at his side.

2) Usually, I advocate shooting above just about everything when it comes to bench players. But this year, the spacing is going to be so terrific that the Spurs actually need someone to take advantage of it more than they need yet another shooter. Imagine Mills and Ginobili on the court with two of Diaw, West and Aldridge. Defenses will need to be hugging out on the perimeter when Anderson has the ball. You could post him up, isolate him or put him in pick-and-rolls and then let him go to work.

3) With Aldridge in the fold, the Spurs will likely run more inside-out sets. Anderson has the tools to be one of the best post-up threats on the team, which would allow the Spurs to keep playing inside-out when Aldridge is on the bench.

I'm not 100 percent sold Anderson is going to make it -- his defense will be Danny Ferry-esque at best and he seemed to play nervous a lot of the time last year -- but I hope Pop gives him a chance. The bench needs to be more than simply Manu-go-do-your-thing and Anderson is the type of player who can help.

I don't disagree with the Manu part, but you don't think Anderson needs to make giant strides in the next 6 months for this scenario to pan out? I mean, right now, I think Simmons has way more tools to make something like that work (and I'm not sold yet he'll make it either).

[Dex]

Yeah, watching this Anderson and Simmons combination is really fun. Simmons signing and then beasting from his first seconds on the summer league team has made this offseason even better. And even though he's not an NBA level prospect, I like watching Atkins play defense. Hopefully we get at least a couple more games to watch 'em.

This is one of the funnest summer league teams to watch since that 2001 Parker team. With Parker, he might have been the most shockingly good summer league player I've ever seen. A skinny prepubescent Frenchman stepped on the court and was got damn unstoppable. It's no wonder teams started offering up All-Stars for him after watching just one game. But, yeah, back then we had to wait like two weeks to watch the games on ESPN2 at 3 A.M.

Don't remember this...details?

[spurraider21]

rotoworld on kawhi's summer league in 2012

Kawhi Leonard (http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nba/1833/kawhi-leonard) - G/F - Spurs (http://www.rotoworld.com/teams/clubhouse/nba/sa/spurs)

Kawhi Leonard's Summer League run is over as of Wednesday night.

This apparently has nothing to do with his sore wrist, but rather that the Spurs saw what they needed to see from him. Leonard averaged 25 points, six boards and three dimes in his two games, and is primed for a full breakout season for the Spurs.


Source: Jeff McDonald on Twitter (https://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN/status/225767388673617920)
Wed, Jul 18, 2012 10:06:00 PM

[Chinook]

rotoworld on kawhi's summer league in 2012

Kawhi Leonard (http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nba/1833/kawhi-leonard) - G/F - Spurs (http://www.rotoworld.com/teams/clubhouse/nba/sa/spurs)

Kawhi Leonard's Summer League run is over as of Wednesday night.

This apparently has nothing to do with his sore wrist, but rather that the Spurs saw what they needed to see from him. Leonard averaged 25 points, six boards and three dimes in his two games, and is primed for a full breakout season for the Spurs.


Source: Jeff McDonald on Twitter (https://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN/status/225767388673617920)
Wed, Jul 18, 2012 10:06:00 PM




I don't think anyone disagrees with the fact that the Spurs pulled him because they had seen enough. It's just that it doesn't seem that great compared to Anderson. I think it was also because he was already an established starter whereas Anderson is fighting for a spot in the rotation still. I doubt the Spurs would have pulled Leonard after two games had he done that in a hypothetical 2011 summer league.

[Chinook]

He was dominant. He got fouled a lot, because they couldn't stop him. After those two games, nobody was surprised that the Spurs pulled him.

Then again, he already had an NBA season under his belt.

Seems to pretty much describe Anderson in Vegas. Difference is that Anderson is competing for a rotation spot, ironically with the other impressive SL Spur. There was really never a need to evaluate Leonard in 2012.

[timvp]

I don't disagree with the Manu part, but you don't think Anderson needs to make giant strides in the next 6 months for this scenario to pan out? I mean, right now, I think Simmons has way more tools to make something like that work (and I'm not sold yet he'll make it either).

Anderson still has a lot to prove but it's not that much of a stretch. He was a PG in college so being a bench facilitator would be right up his alley if he lives up to the potential he's shown in summer league.


Don't remember this...details?

The most famous of those trade rumors was Gary Payton for Tony Parker. The Sonics GM at the time (Wally Walker, IIRC) watched TP's first summer league game and within hours made the trade offer. Considering that Payton was an All-Star the previous seven seasons, that was a pretty damn impressive offer for one game of summer league. :lol

[ElNono]

Seems to pretty much describe Anderson in Vegas. Difference is that Anderson is competing for a rotation spot, ironically with the other impressive SL Spur. There was really never a need to evaluate Leonard in 2012.

Anderson had a very slow start to the SL... dominant wouldn't be the word to use to describe him. Now, I admit I missed the last game, so I'll take another look tomorrow.

But, in a way, this is why I thought he was disappointing with his early showings: he already has a season within "the system", and he didn't really look that much different from a year ago.


Anderson still has a lot to prove but it's not that much of a stretch. He was a PG in college so being a bench facilitator would be right up his alley if he lives up to the potential he's shown in summer league.

He was (still is?) extremely ball dominant though, which I think it's the main reason it didn't work out with Manu last season (same thing happened with Cory). I actually still don't see a solution to this, as he's not been very good off the ball, and as far as posting him, it would be difficult to justify when you have West and Boris out there on the floor... tbh, trying to fit Kyle on our bench still gives me a headache... Simmons it's easier, he can penetrate and finish, play the pick and pop with Boris/West, or kick out... I envision his role closer to Gino's role as a two guard earlier in his Spurs career.

[Chinook]

Anderson had a very slow start to the SL... dominant wouldn't be the word to use to describe him. Now, I admit I missed the last game, so I'll take another look tomorrow.

But, in a way, this is why I thought he was disappointing with his early showings: he already has a season within "the system", and he didn't really look that much different from a year ago.

He actually has another NBA player next to him, and he isn't being weighed down by Bertans' sinking ship like he was in Utah. In Vegas, he got paired with two guys he had chemistry with in Eddie and Simmons. That really improved his game, since he didn't have to try to figure out what they were doing when he was on the court. Actually, the talent around him was just better all-around.


He was (still is?) extremely ball dominant though, which I think it's the main reason it didn't work out with Manu last season (same thing happened with Cory). I actually still don't see a solution to this, as he's not been very good off the ball, and as far as posting him, it would be difficult to justify when you have West and Boris out there on the floor... tbh, trying to fit Kyle on our bench still gives me a headache... Simmons it's easier, he can penetrate and finish, play the pick and pop with Boris/West, or kick out... I envision his role closer to Gino's role as a two guard earlier in his Spurs career.

I feel like Anderson has shown that he can share the ball and still be effective. He's not a great shooter, and Manu, while a good shooter, isn't really a lethal spot-up guy. But if Anderson and Manu can operate like Anderson and Simmons have so far, I don't see why it wouldn't work. I actually agree with you that Simmons' skill-set seems like a better fit if it translates. Jonathan can do a lot of the things Beli did (off-ball cuts and making open shots) while also being more athletic and a better slasher. Then obviously, his defense would be welcome. But I have no reservations about Anderson being the backup three on his own merit. I think by the end of the year that second unit could be deadly.

[ElNono]

He actually has another NBA player next to him, and he isn't being weighed down by Bertans' sinking ship like he was in Utah. In Vegas, he got paired with two guys he had chemistry with in Eddie and Simmons. That really improved his game, since he didn't have to try to figure out what they were doing when he was on the court. Actually, the talent around him was just better all-around.

I'm gonna try to watch tomorrow's game... I basically tuned in to the Utah games to watch Kyle, and was thoroughly disappointed. Simmons was a complete surprise out of the left field. Overall, I stopped watching because the basketball played was pretty shitty, and the weather is too nice here right now to stay in for such shitshows :D

But I'll take your word that it's been better.


I feel like Anderson has shown that he can share the ball and still be effective. He's not a great shooter, and Manu, while a good shooter, isn't really a lethal spot-up guy. But if Anderson and Manu can operate like Anderson and Simmons have so far, I don't see why it wouldn't work. I actually agree with you that Simmons' skill-set seems like a better fit if it translates. Jonathan can do a lot of the things Beli did (off-ball cuts and making open shots) while also being more athletic and a better slasher. Then obviously, his defense would be welcome. But I have no reservations about Anderson being the backup three on his own merit. I think by the end of the year that second unit could be deadly.

I look at this from the perspective of what the Spurs did when Manu basically lost his athleticism and stopped being effective penetrating. We basically moved to a crisp motion, quick passes, good shooters, off the ball cuts and movement, etc. No sticky ball and "everyone is a threat". Losing Beli hurts that a bit, but gaining West means we can actually go more to the pick and roll and pick and pop, a variant that was limited to P&R with Tiago. With Simmons I feel we go back to breaking down defenses with penetration.
With Kyle I just don't see how he fits on those scenarios, other than "spot up shooter". I think there's a lot of overlap with current Gino if you want to play both together in the back court (both slow, both not great shooters right now, both need the ball to create and be effective). I just get the feeling this is going to be Cory-Manu part deux. Kyle will probably play better when Gino is off the floor, but Gino is still the craftier vet and better defender to put him below Kyle in the pecking order.

I'm sure glad it's not me having to try to figure this out.

[Russ]

I'm sure glad it's not me having to try to figure this out.

Pop will definitely earn his money this year.

[GSH]

Thanks for that. Great write-up, as always. You said a couple of things I really like hearing from one of your reports

Anderson -The difference in Kyle Anderson's game from the start of summer league until now is night and day. Anderson not only looks like a legit NBA player, it's now a no-brainer that he should be the team's backup small forward. His playmaking and basketball IQ will be a perfect match for the bench unit.

Simmons - He can maneuver quickly around screens. He draws offensive fouls. He knows his responsibilities team-defense wise.

I'm always a fan of a guy who can draw whistles. For one thing, it says that they are paying enough attention to him to foul him. It's always a big asset to have a guy who drives aggressively, and draws defensive attention. If he's quick enough to get around screens, he might have enough value to score a roster spot. As much as I like having crafty old vets, it would be nice to have a young energy guy to throw in as a change-up.

[Darkwaters]

For as absolutely terrible as Anderson looked in Utah, he has really turned it around with consistently solid play in Sin City. I really didn't expect it - but it's obviously a welcome sight! I thought he was a year away but he deserves a long look during preseason and the early season. It's nice to see him finally making some shots. Hes not going to fool anyone into thinking hes a great shooter, and he was simply atrocious shooting the ball last year in the NBA. So the improvement we've seen lately is tremendous. Of course, the NBA is still a totally different level from SL, and hes already underwhelmed at that level. But I really do hope they give him some long burn to see if he can push through any early struggles he might have like he did with the early struggles he had in Utah. I'm rooting for you Kyle!

Jonathon Simmons continues to be just remarkable. Whats great about him is that he literally got off the midnight plane to Vegas and has just been electric from the first. Hes definitely got a more traditional skillset relative to Anderson as the more typical athletic slasher prospect. But his game is actually much more broadly defined and seasoned than I could have ever hoped for a D-League call-up. His play in Vegas has been so good that had the Spurs not pounced on him so quickly I'm certain somebody else would have. So even if he totally fails in the NBA this is still an amazingly quality gamble. Hopeful it works out for the best.

Cady Lalanne looked really intriguing through his first game or two but has definitely fallen off. Still - he shows enough that I haven't lost interest at all. But a year in Europe is in the best interest of both parties at this point. I'm really hoping he doesn't become this year's Jack McClinton.

[ceperez]

I'm wondering if anyone else noticed Jonathon Simmons prior to Spurs signing.

Nobody seemed to have commented that he wasn't on the Spurs roster even though he was a Austin Spurs player for the past two years.

Did he all of a sudden just jump the shark and become really good?

Last year we were all talking about Jamychal Green who showed a lot of promise even in SL, but we never heard of this guy.

Are the Austin Spurs become a real factory of NBA ready players? Jamychal Green was signed by the Grizzlies (hope this signing doesn't come to haunt the Spurs)

[ElNono]

I'm wondering if anyone else noticed Jonathon Simmons prior to Spurs signing.

Nobody seemed to have commented that he wasn't on the Spurs roster even though he was a Austin Spurs player for the past two years.

Did he all of a sudden just jump the shark and become really good?

Last year we were all talking about Jamychal Green who showed a lot of promise even in SL, but we never heard of this guy.

Are the Austin Spurs become a real factory of NBA ready players? Jamychal Green was signed by the Grizzlies (hope this signing doesn't come to haunt the Spurs)

It's a long and complicated topic, tbh... The Spurs approach the NBDL and their picks very differently than other ballclubs...

Simmons could be another case of somebody that took a while to figure what kind of work he needed to do to make it into the league (like Danny Green before him), and eventually they get it.

I say "could" because I don't think even right now he's a lock to stick. But he's gotten a chance, and I think so far he's made the most out of it.

[SnakeBoy]

Cady Lalanne looked really intriguing through his first game or two but has definitely fallen off. Still - he shows enough that I haven't lost interest at all. But a year in Europe is in the best interest of both parties at this point. I'm really hoping he doesn't become this year's Jack McClinton.

Cady is a project for sure but I think he could be another 2nd round gem in a couple of years. I hope he makes it, it would be a great rags to riches story...

http://www.expressnews.com/sports/spurs/article/Path-to-NBA-a-treacherous-one-for-Spurs-draft-6390758.php?t=cdf32bc8bf927fc3fb&cmpid=twitter-premium

[SAGirl]

I'm wondering if anyone else noticed Jonathon Simmons prior to Spurs signing.

Nobody seemed to have commented that he wasn't on the Spurs roster even though he was a Austin Spurs player for the past two years.

Did he all of a sudden just jump the shark and become really good?

Last year we were all talking about Jamychal Green who showed a lot of promise even in SL, but we never heard of this guy.

Are the Austin Spurs become a real factory of NBA ready players? Jamychal Green was signed by the Grizzlies (hope this signing doesn't come to haunt the Spurs) I think he just didn't stand out enough. He didn't have a niche. Athletic guys his size are a dime a dozen in the d'league. He can shoot the 3, but he is not a prolific shooter like Eddie. He doesn't have a quick release and needs to be wide open, much like KA in that respect. He was also horribly TO prone, check his assist to TO ratio. He was not a prolific scorer. While athletic, he is not a super quick guy. Even in the d'league there were more athletic and quicker guys, better shooters or better passers/ballhandlers. His strength, as I see it now, is that while he was not the best in the d'league at any of these things individually, he brings a little bit of everything, which makes him a lot more of a complete player even if he is never going to be elite at any one thing. Teams that have lottery type talent who are younger and can already do what he does would not even consider him as his ceiling bc of his age and growth path seems lower.

[Dex]

The most famous of those trade rumors was Gary Payton for Tony Parker. The Sonics GM at the time (Wally Walker, IIRC) watched TP's first summer league game and within hours made the trade offer. Considering that Payton was an All-Star the previous seven seasons, that was a pretty damn impressive offer for one game of summer league. :lol

Considering TP would torch GP just a few years later in the playoffs....I think the Spurs were right to stick to their guns. :tu