The NBA "Franchise Four'' -- Why Kobe Bryant, Shaquille O'Neal Make the Team

[Koolaid_Man]

Interesting link....top four players in History from each team named...here's the list for the Lakers....check the list for your teams...

L.A. Lakers

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar – The No. 1 scorer in history boasted the game’s greatest weapon, the Skyhook.

Magic Johnson – As soon as the effervescent 6-9 point guard arrived in Hollywood, he changed the NBA landscape, leading the Lakers to nine Finals appearances in 12 seasons and five titles.

Kobe Bryant – For old-timers, Jerry West probably makes this list, but even “The Logo’’ admits that Bryant is one of the top Lakers ever.

Shaquille O’Neal – Wilt Chamberlain won his one title in L.A. in his next-to-last season, but Shaq won three titles and was a three-time Finals MVP as a Laker.

Who Didn’t Make it – Four Top 50 Players: Wilt Chamberlain, Jerry West, Elgin Baylor and James Worthy.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/mitchlawrence/2015/07/19/lakers-franchise-four-why-kobe-bryant-shaquille-oneal-make-the-team-over-two-nba-icons/

[Pelicans78]

I agree with this list. I was a Lakers fans growing up in the 80s. I'm not a Kobe fan, but he's clearly above West.

[Koolaid_Man]

I agree with this list. I was a Lakers fans growing up in the 80s. I'm not a Kobe fan, but he's clearly above West.


Kobe should make the Pelicans list too..since yall originally drafted him :lol

[spurraider21]

good luck in the lottery kool :toast

[thiste]

Kareem Magic Wilt Shaq

[Thread]

I hate these fuckin' lists.

I ain't callin' pussy & asshole because Kool is my man in LA, but, if it were anybody else I'd call it.

[Splits]

I hate these fuckin' lists.

I ain't callin' pussy & asshole because Kool is my man in LA, but, if it were anybody else I'd call it.

Your religion consists of caveats, hence, non-religion.

[Thread]

Your religion consists of caveats, hence, non-religion.

Where's Shits lately?

[HemisfairArena]

I hate these fuckin' lists.

I ain't callin' pussy & asshole because Kool is my man in LA, but, if it were anybody else I'd call it.

You are an enigma my friend,,,a pussy wrapped in an asshole if you don't call him out. He hates the degenerate horse gambler and wants him out,,,you say without him you are light 2,,,but you keep your mouth shut. He makes lists like these that you despise,,,you exhale aggressively but,,,keep your mouth shut. I put you at the pinnacle of laker fan here,,,,was I wrong?

[Koolaid_Man]

You are an enigma my friend,,,a pussy wrapped in an asshole if you don't call him out. He hates the degenerate horse gambler and wants him out,,,you say without him you are light 2,,,but you keep your mouth shut. He makes lists like these that you despise,,,you exhale aggressively but,,,keep your mouth shut. I put you at the pinnacle of laker fan here,,,,was I wrong?


Hey inyourassarena....I didnt make the list...I reported on the list....big difference dip shit :lol

[TDMVPDPOY]

why not shift kareem to the 3?

sure no spacing on offense, but who needs spacing if u can play score automatic in the low post or work baseline/midrange to get closer for the sky hook?

on defense just play a zone....

[HemisfairArena]

Hey inyourassarena....I didnt make the list...I reported on the list....big difference dip shit :lol

So you're a follower,,,not a leader,,,,I get that. That's why Thread carries you on this site,,,

[Thread]

You are an enigma my friend,,,a pussy wrapped in an asshole if you don't call him out. He hates the degenerate horse gambler and wants him out,,,you say without him you are light 2,,,but you keep your mouth shut. He makes lists like these that you despise,,,you exhale aggressively but,,,keep your mouth shut. I put you at the pinnacle of laker fan here,,,,was I wrong?

I had him on the carpet less than month ago over a fake thread. I blistered his black ass until he about hit Dale.

If I chewed SF ass everytime you had it comin'---we'd never have peace. One must discriminate, Hemi.

[HemisfairArena]

I had him on the carpet less than month ago over a fake thread. I blistered his black ass until he about hit Dale.

If I chewed SF ass everytime you had it comin'---we'd never have peace. One must discriminate, Hemi.

T,,,my takes are the worst,,,I would grab a ladder,,,climb up and hammer my own wrists to the cross and hang there for all to crucify if I could,,,I am that bad,,,no argument there.

[Silver&Black]

I got no problems with the list tbqh...

[Koolaid_Man]

So you're a follower,,,not a leader,,,,I get that. That's why Thread carries you on this site,,,


Not true..what happens when most Laker fans take a leave of absence? ...Kool becomes an even worser nightmare for Spur fan...a one man wrecking ball.....I'm a self starter Im gonna wreck asses with or without help....

[ambchang]

Magic, west, Kobe, Kareem.

Kareem got knocked down to four because he didn't even spend his prime with the lakers.

West gets a boost up for his GM work. That guy is a genius and we will never see another one like him in the front office.

Wilt spent most of his prime with the Warriors and 6ers, Baylor was great but not as great as Kobe, shaqs tenure was too short.

[Spurtacular]

Jerry West would have wiped the floor with Kobe, tbh.

[Spurtacular]

Mourning and Hardaway over Bosh for the Heat? I don't think so.

[Spurtacular]

KJ not making the Suns top four? Dude's a terrible mayor; but he is definitely a top four Sun.

[Koolaid_Man]

Jerry West would have wiped the floor with Kobe, tbh.

Ahhh..hahahahahahahaha

[Spurtacular]

Ginobili over the Iceman and Parker tbh.

[Koolaid_Man]

Jerry West would have wiped the floor with Kobe, tbh.


Kobe would have wiped the floor with this unatheletic, slow dude by comparison....hahahahahahaha....love Jerry though...but he couldnt do .25th of what Kobe could do....there goes that number 25 again :lol

n8oGUyREHcQ

[Killakobe81]

Kareem Magic Wilt Shaq

Wilt? he was past his prime by all accounts when he was in L.A ... if you have to pick 4 it's amongst Magic, West, Kobe, Baylor, Kobe, Kareem and Shaq. The first 4 spent their entire careers as Lakers. If forced to choose:

1. Magic
2. West (Player and GM if only player then he drops out of top 4)
3. Kobe
4. Kareem

Shaq and Baylor are #5 and #6 imho ...

[Killakobe81]

Magic, west, Kobe, Kareem.

Kareem got knocked down to four because he didn't even spend his prime with the lakers.

West gets a boost up for his GM work. That guy is a genius and we will never see another one like him in the front office.

Wilt spent most of his prime with the Warriors and 6ers, Baylor was great but not as great as Kobe, shaqs tenure was too short.

Great post solid reasoning.

[baseline bum]

The article was about players, so no way I'm taking West over Shaq there when West had to wait out Russell's career to win anything.

[Kidd K]

Ginobili over the Iceman and Parker tbh.

Over Parker. . .arguably yes. Over Gervin? No.

Duncan
Robinson
Bit of a dropoff
Gervin
Big dropoff
Parker/Manu.

tbh.
No Duncan = Manu/Parker never accomplish anything.

[Killakobe81]

The article was about players, so no way I'm taking West over Shaq there when West had to wait out Russell's career to win anything.

I get that but if you stuck to "franchise 4" for the spurs =

1. Timmy
2. Pop
3. David
4. Gervin

Pop is arguably the greatest Spur after Duncan can anyone argue otherwise? And after Russell and Bird it's Red for the Celts right above Pierce and Havlichek. for some teams Coaches/GM are bigger than some of the franchise stars. Same with Phil in Chicago after MJ and MAYBE Scottie Phil is the biggest/greatest Bull.

[TDMVPDPOY]

all the guys that have played for the spurs...i put them ahead of enrique

[ambchang]

Team

His List


My List


Reason




Boston


Russell
Bird
Havlicek
Cousy


Russell
Bird
Havlicek
Cousy


A little struggle between Cousy and Cowens, but ultimately went with
Cousy as he was really the first superstar PG in the league.




Chicago


Jordan
Pippen
Rose
Rodman


Jordan
Pippen
Walker
Love


Rose just hasn’t really accomplish much in his career.* Sure there
was the MVP, but the rest of his career is pretty ho-hum

Rodman, if anything, is a Piston.* Grant was the better fit next to
Jordan and Pippen anyways, and no one will have Grant on the Bulls teams

Walker and Love kept the Bulls going before they hit it big in the
80s with Jordan.




Detroit


Thomas
Bing
Lanier
Dumars


Thomas
Dumars
Lanier
Bing


I had Dumars higher.* Loved Lanier for his love of the game, and I
know a lot on here will be impressed by his big feet.

Bing is too much of a scorer’s image, even though he was a great
passer.* You can argue him being one of the prototype big point guards after
Maurice Stokes.




GSW


Wilt
Barry
Thurmond
Curry


Wilt
Barry
Mullin
Thurmond


Curry is way too young for this, and don’t use his MVP championships
winning season as a reason.* Winning an MVP and then having a sixth man win
the FMVP in the same year is an embarrassment.

Mullin did more to the Warriors than Curry did, and he never had the
type of team Curry did.




Houston


Hakeem
Moses
Murphy
Hayes


Hakeem
Moses
Hayes
Murphy


Hayes was ballhog extraordinaire, but Murphy just wasn’t as good a
player.




Lakers


Kareem
Magic
Kobe
Shaq


Magic
West
Kobe
Kareem


See reasoning above




Miami


Lebron
Wade
Mourning
Hardaway


Lebron
Wade
Mourning
Rice


Hardaway’s time with Miami wasn’t that impressive, his best was with
the Warriors.

And Rice carried that heat team for a bigger part of the franchise’s
beginning years along with Seikaly.




NYK


Reed
Frazier
Ewing
King


Ewing
Reed
King
Frazier


Frazier gets underrated everywhere, and I am doing it again here,
moving him from 2 to 4.* Great floor leader, scores well, phenomenal
defensively, rebounds, passes, comes up big in the clutch, but I just can’t
put him over Ewing.* Maybe King.




Philly


Wilt
Moses
Greer
Erving


Wilt
Moses
Barkley
Dr. J


Not having Barkley on this list is retarded.* Barkley’s prime was the
final few years with the 6ers, and one or two years after joining the Suns.*
His play with the 6er was crazy, he just had a terrible team next to him.

Dr. J just lost a lot of his prime with the Nets in the ABA, and
Greer just played too much dinoball,.




Suns


Nash
Barkley
Davis
Stoudemire


Barkley
Nash
Kevin Johnson
Davis


Having Stoudemire on any all-time teams just shows you how crap of a
franchise you have.* Stoudemire?* Are you serious?* I’d put Hornacek and Dan
Majerle above him.

Kevin Johnson was phenomenal when he was healthy.* Too bad he didn’t
listen to Eddie Johnson and started stretching before games.

Kidd vs. Davis was a tough one.* Even though Kidd’s prime was a
Sun/Net, his best work was still with the Nets, and he won the ring with the
Mavs




San Antonio


Duncan
Robinson
Gervin
Parker


Duncan
Robinson
Gervin
Ginobili


Ginobili just does more for the Spurs than Parker.

I’d also have Silas over Parker.

Moore, Gilmore, Elliott and Bowen were all great Spurs as well.




Washington


Unseld
Monroe
Hayes
Gus Johnson


Unseld
Monroe
Hayes
Gus Johnson


Same reasons.* Chris Webber could have been that guy alongside Juwan
Howard, it was just too bad.

Also, as much as people likes to crap on Pervis Ellison, he was
actually solid for a few injury free years there.

And who can forget Gheorge Muresan!

[Spurtacular]

Over Parker. . .arguably yes. Over Gervin? No.

Duncan
Robinson
Bit of a dropoff
Gervin
Big dropoff
Parker/Manu.

tbh.
No Duncan = Manu/Parker never accomplish anything.

Manu does so many things to win championships. Yes, Gervin scored, but that didn't translate to championships. If there's a "big dropoff" between the two, Gervin is down below.

[Spurtacular]

Kobe would have wiped the floor with this unatheletic, slow dude by comparison....hahahahahahaha....love Jerry though...but he couldnt do .25th of what Kobe could do....there goes that number 25 again :lol

n8oGUyREHcQ

Jerry West was a machine unto himself. The only reason he's not in the convo for GOAT is b/c the Celtics were a collectively more advanced machine. West is a more offensively skilled player than Kobe.

[Kidd K]

Manu does so many things to win championships. Yes, Gervin scored, but that didn't translate to championships. If there's a "big dropoff" between the two, Gervin is down below.

I don't agree. Manu helped us win titles, yes. But so haven't role players too. It isn't like Manu is/was an annual all star player and helped us win titles. He was just a very good player who occasionally hit all star status some years (I don't just mean making the team, I mean being that caliber) and won titles with the team.

Gervin was great pretty much every year. He didn't win titles because our team wasn't very good and he didn't have Duncan or Robinson with him. Let's not credit Manu for being the anchor or centerpiece of the team to our titles because he certainly was not. That man is obviously Tim Duncan.

[Spurtacular]

I don't agree. Manu helped us win titles, yes. But so haven't role players too. It isn't like Manu is/was an annual all star player and helped us win titles. He was just a very good player who occasionally hit all star status some years (I don't just mean making the team, I mean being that caliber) and won titles with the team.

Gervin was great pretty much every year. He didn't win titles because our team wasn't very good and he didn't have Duncan or Robinson with him. Let's not credit Manu for being the anchor or centerpiece of the team to our titles because he certainly was not. That man is obviously Tim Duncan.

George Gervin was a one trick pony. He didn't rebound; he didn't get assists; he didn't play particularly great defense.

And Manu was arguably the co-anchor / centerpiece in 05. He was the real fmvp that year as far as I'm concerned.

And as far as I'm concerned, Manu was an annual all-star level player for all of his prime years (and he always played like one come playoff time). We know that the league wants their big market, big personality 18 and 8 guys. I've seen plenty of less impactful players get all-star nods that Ginobili was more deserving of.

Now, I don't really mind the argument that Gervin was better though if that's your opinion. I at least see a case for it. But I completely shoot down the idea that it's a "big drop off" when Gervin was a one trick pony. Granted, he was a a hella a one trick pony though.

[Thread]

I don't agree. Manu helped us win titles, yes. But so haven't role players too. It isn't like Manu is/was an annual all star player and helped us win titles. He was just a very good player who occasionally hit all star status some years (I don't just mean making the team, I mean being that caliber) and won titles with the team.

Gervin was great pretty much every year. He didn't win titles because our team wasn't very good and he didn't have Duncan or Robinson with him. Let's not credit Manu for being the anchor or centerpiece of the team to our titles because he certainly was not. That man is obviously Tim Duncan.

But without Manu you'd be light 3, a firm 3. They don't grow on trees, Kid. You coulda won your 2nd 5th switchin' out me & The Pile. Manu is a winner,,,and they don't grow there as well. Me? I'm a winner. I'm just in a loser's circle. My tree took sick & and my limb fell off.

[Kidd K]

But without Manu you'd be light 3, a firm 3. They don't grow on trees, Kid. You coulda won your 2nd 5th switchin' out me & The Pile. Manu is a winner,,,and they don't grow there as well. Me? I'm a winner. I'm just in a loser's circle. My tree took sick & and my limb fell off.

You need to stop looking at it like a child though. Its not Spurs - Manu. It's Spurs - Manu + competent replacement. Manu's injury issues have cost the Spurs their chances at titles during multiple years they didn't win too. Spurs may have not won 2 of their mid 2000s titles without him, but they may have won on other years instead; the years he was injured and not performing, or injured and costing us a high seed and/or being rusty in the postseason.

[Kidd K]

George Gervin was a one trick pony. He didn't rebound; he didn't get assists; he didn't play particularly great defense.

And Manu was arguably the co-anchor / centerpiece in 05. He was the real fmvp that year as far as I'm concerned.

And as far as I'm concerned, Manu was an annual all-star level player for all of his prime years (and he always played like one come playoff time). We know that the league wants their big market, big personality 18 and 8 guys. I've seen plenty of less impactful players get all-star nods that Ginobili was more deserving of.

Now, I don't really mind the argument that Gervin was better though if that's your opinion. I at least see a case for it. But I completely shoot down the idea that it's a "big drop off" when Gervin was a one trick pony. Granted, he was a a hella a one trick pony though.

Gervin didn't rebound? Other than his rookie year and when he was old as fuck, all of his seasons = more rebounds than Manu's best season. So. . .that's bullshit that he didn't rebound. 1.5 more RPG than Manu. Only 1.4 less APG than Manu as well.

Gervin also rarely missed a game and didn't come off the bench to play against 2nd stringers for more than half his career like Manu did. He also average playing more minutes than Manu played during his highest MPG season. Put Gervin next to DRob or Duncan and he probably plays even better. Especially with Duncan.