KD that good?

[ElNono]

Damn, just saw the 15pt loss to Boston at home... what's going on? This team was still battling with Scotty and just Westbrook...

College coach overrated? too early?

[UNT Eagles 2016]

Damn, just saw the 15pt loss to Boston at home... what's going on? This team was still battling with Scotty and just Westbrook...

College coach overrated? too early?
Too early & Donovan is too green this year.

[DMC]

STARTERS
MIN
FGM-A
3PM-A
FTM-A
OREB
DREB
REB
AST
STL
BLK
TO
PF
+/-
PTS


Noah Vonleh (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/3078284/noah-vonleh), PF
24
3-6
0-1
3-4
3
3
6
1
0
0
2
3
-6
9


Al-Farouq Aminu (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/4248/al-farouq-aminu), SF
22
2-5
1-2
2-2
0
3
3
2
1
0
0
5
0
7


Mason Plumlee (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/2488653/mason-plumlee), C
24
2-6
0-0
4-4
7
6
13
1
0
1
2
4
-10
8


Damian Lillard (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/6606/damian-lillard), PG
37
9-25
1-9
4-5
2
6
8
5
1
0
5
0
-12
23


C.J. McCollum (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/2490149/c.j.-mccollum), SG
37
5-18
2-6
4-4
0
2
2
4
1
0
0
2
-12
16







Oklahoma City Thunder


STARTERS
MIN
FGM-A
3PM-A
FTM-A
OREB
DREB
REB
AST
STL
BLK
TO
PF
+/-
PTS


Serge Ibaka (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/3439/serge-ibaka), PF
35
8-16
0-1
0-0
3
7
10
0
0
3
0
1
+1
16


Steven Adams (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/2991235/steven-adams), C
30
0-0
0-0
6-8
2
5
7
3
0
0
1
2
-1
6


Russell Westbrook (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/3468/russell-westbrook), PG
33
5-20
2-10
15-17
1
3
4
5
3
2
4
4
-7
27


Anthony Morrow (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/3474/anthony-morrow), SG
15
0-4
0-3
0-0
0
0
0
2
0
0
1
2
+7
0


Andre Roberson (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/2530596/andre-roberson), SG
25
3-5
1-2
0-0
0
2
2
1
2
0
0
0
0
7




See any similarities?

Shoot first PGs settling for the outside jumper. RW did attack the paint, but he took have his shots from outside. Lollard is a good 3pt shooter, RW is serviceable, but neither of them should be taking this many.

[HemisfairArena]

KD is the engine and substance,,,Westbrick is only style,,,,,its why the Thunder cant win without KD and get beat in the 1st round last year,,,,tbh

[Mikeanaro]

Westcrook had a bad night and Steven Adams went Infranova :lmao

[DMC]

Too early & Donovan is too green this year.

So Donovan doesn't have the understanding yet to know to let Russell shoot every trip down the floor like Brooks did? I don't get the "green" part or how it applies to this situation in OKC.

[DMC]

KD is the engine and substance,,,Westbrick is only style,,,,,its why the Thunder cant win without KD and get beat in the 1st round last year,,,,tbh

Thunder missed the playoffs, douchebag.

[HemisfairArena]

Thunder missed the playoffs, douchebag.


Even better, faggot,,,

[DAF86]

Yep, KD that good and Westbrook for all his talent, when given the liberty to do as he wants just doesn't play winning basketball.

[DMC]

Even better, faggot,,,
Jesus, and you come here to argue about a game you don't even watch.

[HemisfairArena]

Jesus, and you come here to argue about a game you don't even watch.

I hate basketball,,,,only faggots love it,,,what you gonna say about that?,,,,,

[DMC]

Yep, KD that good and Westbrook for all his talent, when given the liberty to do as he wants just doesn't play winning basketball.
Russ strikes me as a guy trying to push his brand. He hasn't gotten to the "anything to win a ring" stage in his career. He might be one of those guys who waits until he's crippled and old as fuck before trying to find a team that's bound for glory. Until then "winning" to Russ is a financial game, developed on the stat sheet and in the media when his triple doubles are the highlight of the night.

Maybe he thinks anyone can win a ring if they don't mind a lesser role, but they don't win in life. Meanwhile you have people like CP3 never won shit and gets tons of praise. Same for Carmelo and Blake Griffin. Russ wants that, fuck a ring.

[DMC]

I hate basketball,,,,only faggots love it,,,what you gonna say about that?,,,,,
Odd name for someone who hates basketball.

[HemisfairArena]

Odd name for someone who hates basketball.

So do I watch basketball or do I not?,,,,,

[DMC]

So do I watch basketball or do I not?,,,,,

You must watch something different if you saw the Thunder lose in the playoffs.

[DAF86]

Russ strikes me as a guy trying to push his brand. He hasn't gotten to the "anything to win a ring" stage in his career. He might be one of those guys who waits until he's crippled and old as fuck before trying to find a team that's bound for glory. Until then "winning" to Russ is a financial game, developed on the stat sheet and in the media when his triple doubles are the highlight of the night.

Maybe he thinks anyone can win a ring if they don't mind a lesser role, but they don't win in life. Meanwhile you have people like CP3 never won shit and gets tons of praise. Same for Carmelo and Blake Griffin. Russ wants that, fuck a ring.

Imho, he does want to win but he thinks that to win he needs to do everything and it just doesn't work that way, you need to get folks involved, even if they fuck up.

[DMC]

Imho, he does want to win but he thinks that to win he needs to do everything and it just doesn't work that way, you need to get folks involved, even if they fuck up.

I don't believe that though. He knows what KD can do, yet he will chuck a brick before passing KD the ball. If he wanted to win, he would get KD involved. You and I don't even play yet we know that's what needs to happen. There's no way Russ knows less about that than we do. He's just too egotistical and greedy to share the ball or take a lesser role. Sure he has some shitty teammates but so what, you either win as a team or you lose as a team, but Russ has proven time and again to himself an others that no one wins a series by themselves. It's never happened, never will.

[baseline bum]

Imho, he does want to win but he thinks that to win he needs to do everything and it just doesn't work that way, you need to get folks involved, even if they fuck up.

Basically a better and more athletic Kobe.

[HemisfairArena]

You must watch something different if you saw the Thunder lose in the playoffs.

'm old,,,have mercy,,,not my 1st mistake today,,,wont be my last,,,,but what is funny is people always point out when you are wrong,,,never when you are right,,,,

[DAF86]

Basically a better and more athletic Kobe.

A better and more athletic Iverson I would say. Or a Kobe with less talent around.

[DMC]

'm old,,,have mercy,,,not my 1st mistake today,,,wont be my last,,,,but what is funny is people always point out when you are wrong,,,never when you are right,,,,

I'll be the first to let you know when you're right.

[HemisfairArena]

I'll be the first to let you know when you're right.

Lets see how good you are,,,,Okafor over Towns for rook of the year,,,am I right?

[DMC]

A better and more athletic Iverson I would say. Or a Kobe with less talent around.

They all have one thing in common: Brand. They push themselves as a brand. Their numbers matter to them, and to the companies they endorse. It's more lucrative for Russ to get a regular season MVP than for the Thunder to win a ring and Russ not get recognized.

[DMC]

Lets see how good you are,,,,Okafor over Towns for rook of the year,,,am I right?
I'm picking Russell for the Lakers.

[Mr Bones]

His talent is undeniable, but a career 30% 3pt shooter has no business taking 10 threes in a game. It's exactly what the opposing team is hoping he'll do. Russ driving to the basket is scary, but Russ launching threes is a below average player.

[HemisfairArena]

I'm picking Russell for the Lakers.

Arent we all?,,,,

[Mnky]

Russ is leading the nba in over 10 assits per game. Dude got 15 free throws? Yes obviously driving and creating. I don't get the horrible takes from people obviously not wacyhing the games.. don't get the hate on him.

Boston is a legit team. They have a great defense. Upsets happen when your star player misses everything he throws up, and your backups don't have it going.

Thunder are mentally weak tho. We all know this.

[DAF86]

Russ is leading the nba in over 10 assits per game. Dude got 15 free throws? Yes obviously driving and creating. I don't get the horrible takes from people obviously not wacyhing the games.. don't get the hate on him.

Boston is a legit team. They have a great defense. Upsets happen when your star player misses everything he throws up, and your backups don't have it going.

Thunder are mentally weak tho. We all know this.

10 assists, 15 FTs, 20 something FG, don't know how many TO's. Too much usage for just one player. That's not winning basketball, tbh.

[HarlemHeat37]

They were 5-3 with Durant, and weren't looking that great, tbh..

OKC is what it is..same philosophy as they had under Brooks, relying entirely on 2 guys to create everything, below average defensive team and 2 massive cancers/boom or bust players off the bench(Waiters/Kanter)..

Westbrook's style of play wouldn't fix their clear personnel limitations, although his terrible defense is part of the problem..

[spursistan]

Is there a more overrated GM in the history of the league than Sam Presti? whether its coaching or trade related move, after all these years, OKC is still going to live and die by its two-superstars going supernova-- that is assuming they are both on court..It is incredible how inept he has turned out to be surrounding two top 5 players in league with capable vets and role players on the watch of expert coaching that would at least mitigate the absence of one KD/Russ by playing the right way..Stay cute Sam :lol..

[LaMarcus Bryant]

A better and more athletic Iverson I would say. Or a Kobe with less talent around.

Revisionist history. Iverson devoted himself to winning on the court to a degree Westbrook has neve come close to displaying

[DAF86]

Revisionist history. Iverson devoted himself to winning on the court to a degree Westbrook has neve come close to displaying

Iverson wouldn't accept coming off the bench, getting a lesser role and going to practices. If that's devoting to winning, what would be what Duncan and Manu do, tbh.

[Cry Havoc]

I don't believe that though. He knows what KD can do, yet he will chuck a brick before passing KD the ball. If he wanted to win, he would get KD involved. You and I don't even play yet we know that's what needs to happen. There's no way Russ knows less about that than we do. He's just too egotistical and greedy to share the ball or take a lesser role. Sure he has some shitty teammates but so what, you either win as a team or you lose as a team, but Russ has proven time and again to himself an others that no one wins a series by themselves. It's never happened, never will.

Anyone who watches that interview after the Boston game and doesn't think, "Massive head-case" is beyond help. Westbrook is the definition of a cancer on a team. He holds his teammates with the same regard as Kobe did. Kobe was just fortunate enough to have a franchise that would throw $100,000,000 at problems to fix them and buy guys that could co-exist with Kobe for a few years at a time.

[LaMarcus Bryant]

Iverson wouldn't accept coming off the bench, getting a lesser role and going to practices. If that's devoting to winning, what would be what Duncan and Manu do, tbh.

Now you're comparing peak Westbrook to washed up Iverson, moving the goal posts
That's not the same discussion.

[KL2]

They were 5-3 with Durant, and weren't looking that great, tbh..

OKC is what it is..same philosophy as they had under Brooks, relying entirely on 2 guys to create everything, below average defensive team and 2 massive cancers/boom or bust players off the bench(Waiters/Kanter)..

Westbrook's style of play wouldn't fix their clear personnel limitations, although his terrible defense is part of the problem..

This. Their defense is fucked, Kanter has a target on his back and teams are killing him. Durant's defense has been bad this year, he went from average to below average, Westbrook's defense has fallen off too, having Kanter out there really amplifies their lack of defense. Even Adams is having trouble protecting the rim, players have been scoring on him at the rim with ease. It doesn't look fixable unless they make some sort of major move.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K47WmGTV0Zs


Kanter only played 22 mins in this game, however Rose took advantage of every minute he was out there, once he got by WB the basket was wide open.

[LaMarcus Bryant]

How does someone as elite an athlete as Westbrook suck that bad at defense?
Iverson was overrated as a defender but he did a decent enough job on opposing point guards (granted that was before the golden pg Era)

[~O~]

Offense sells tickets. Defense wins games.

[Mr Bones]

One theory is that Westbrook is such a high usage player-- the highest in the league-- that the other players just don't feel completely involved in the game. This translates from the offense to the defense. The whole team is infected with the idea that sharing isn't the main principle, and if their "leader" Russ wants to expend all of his energy on the offensive side while being a mediocre defender, why should they do any differently? I don't think they say this to themselves consciously, but that's the mood & environment that Russ's style promotes.

[HarlemHeat37]

Russy has the same usage % as he did 2 seasons ago, when the Thunder ranked 6th in the NBA, defensively..he also had a really high 33% usage rate in 2013, and they finished 4th..

Westbrook haters are silly, tbh..his teammates adore him, as do his coaches, I've never heard any of them say a single negative thing about him..Durant and Ibaka rave about him in interviews:lol..

[HarlemHeat37]

And :lol, Westbrook >>> Iverson, tbh..

[Mr Bones]

If his "terrible defense is part of the problem"-- your quote-- why do you <3 him so much?

Also, do you think him shooting 10 threes ia a good idea, or a bad habit that should be adjusted?

It's not "hating" to point out obvious shortcomings that a very talented player has...

[HarlemHeat37]

There's a huge difference between pointing out a player's flaws vs. blaming him for the struggles of a team with clear personnel/coaching/strategy issues..most of the anti-Westbrook sentiment on SpursTalk isn't just criticism and discussion about a player's flaws, it's blame and implication that the team would magically solve their problems if Westbrook shoots less or takes better shots, which is false IMO..

Also, I actually wouldn't want Russy on my team, from a basketball perspective, I've said it many times:lol..I just love watching him play from an outsider's POV, because he's extremely entertaining on the court, is a genuine nigga off the court, a great teammate, a style icon, a great role model to the kids, and doesn't care about the opinions of the haters..

His defensive laziness is a problem, but he still plays with relentless intensity, too, which is admirable..we're only left to wonder how he would have developed in a more structured organization that didn't enable his bad habits, along with a co-superstar with a fear of being a leader..

[Mr Bones]

I think you cut him too much slack. He's been in the league 8 seasons... does he really need "more structure" to tell him playing defense is important, or that taking lots of threes is unwise for a career 30% 3pt shooter? If he's not mature enough to see that, that's clearly a huge hole in his personal approach to the game.

It makes sense to me that you'd love a player that you wouldn't want on your team.
Your whole schtick around here is that of contrarian provocateur, so naturally you'd spend time defending and <3ing a guy that you don't even want.

[LaMarcus Bryant]

And :lol, Westbrook >>> Iverson, tbh..

Again that wasn't the original quoted posters point but good effort for trying "... tbh :lol"

[Cry Havoc]

I think you cut him too much slack. He's been in the league 8 seasons... does he really need "more structure" to tell him playing defense is important, or that taking lots of threes is unwise for a career 30% 3pt shooter? If he's not mature enough to see that, that's clearly a huge hole in his personal approach to the game.

It makes sense to me that you'd love a player that you wouldn't want on your team.
Your whole schtick around here is that of contrarian provocateur, so naturally you'd spend time defending and <3ing a guy that you don't even want.

This x1000. Dude is a fucking adult. He has been playing basketball most of his life.

[DMC]

Offense sells tickets. Defense wins games.
In the grand scheme, winning games means not a fucking thing. It's about making money. It's a business. I doubt any NBA hopeful thinks "I can't wait to get drafted so I can compete for a championship". They think "I fitna get PAID BITCHES!" From the old wealthy white racist fuck to the youngest ebonic speaking Somali, it's all about getting paid. Wins and losses are fan things.

[daslicer]

Russ is in the mold of a Stephon Marbury, Baron Davis, Steve Francis. These type of players come around very often and they often don't win championships. Without Durant he would not be winning many games.

[~O~]

In the grand scheme, winning games means not a fucking thing. It's about making money. It's a business. I doubt any NBA hopeful thinks "I can't wait to get drafted so I can compete for a championship". They think "I fitna get PAID BITCHES!" From the old wealthy white racist fuck to the youngest ebonic speaking Somali, it's all about getting paid. Wins and losses are fan things.


I don't get your point...you think I don't know that. that the world is fairy tales. lol? Clarify


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gx2KZ_uwIlQ

[DAF86]

Now you're comparing peak Westbrook to washed up Iverson, moving the goal posts
That's not the same discussion.

The thing about practice wasn't when he was washed up, besides what does that have to do? If when he wasn't washed up he didn't accept a lesser role, imagine what he would have done during his prime. :lol

He wanted to win but getting his first. That's not devoting yourself to winning. Devoting yourself to winning is what Manu did his entire NBA career by accepting coming off the bench in benefit of the team.

[DAF86]

There's a huge difference between pointing out a player's flaws vs. blaming him for the struggles of a team with clear personnel/coaching/strategy issues..most of the anti-Westbrook sentiment on SpursTalk isn't just criticism and discussion about a player's flaws, it's blame and implication that the team would magically solve their problems if Westbrook shoots less or takes better shots, which is false IMO..

Also, I actually wouldn't want Russy on my team, from a basketball perspective, I've said it many times:lol..I just love watching him play from an outsider's POV, because he's extremely entertaining on the court, is a genuine nigga off the court, a great teammate, a style icon, a great role model to the kids, and doesn't care about the opinions of the haters..

His defensive laziness is a problem, but he still plays with relentless intensity, too, which is admirable..we're only left to wonder how he would have developed in a more structured organization that didn't enable his bad habits, along with a co-superstar with a fear of being a leader..

Those are mutually exclusive, tbh.

[Kawhitstorm]

Westbrook's motor is his gift/curse, sometimes he just plays too fast & makes decisions without surveying the floor. He's like a running back that takes off before the blockers have a chance to finish their job but can get away w/ it b/c of his elite speed.

[Cry Havoc]

Those are mutually exclusive, tbh.

40/4/14 tonight, meanwhile the offensive juggernaut that is the Grizzlies score 122. :lol