Pop Defends Bud VS Ref's Union

[BillMc]

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14206924/atlanta-hawks-mike-budenholzer-fined-contact-official

Pop had this to say on the Ref's Union's push to suspend Bud:


"I think it's just a case of an anonymous suit trying to gain 15 minutes of stardom more than anything. It's comical."

My thoughts:

1) He's right. Bud's bumping of the ref was incidental. He was already thrown out of the game. Enough's enough.

2) It probably won't hurt us, but next time the refs miss some call that would have benefited the Spurs, or make some phantom foul against us, someone on ST is bound to say that Pop made a mistake by criticizing the ref's union. It'll happen. Ref Mafia. :lol

[Mel_13]

Notice that Pop criticized a labor lawyer, not the officials themselves. Have to wonder what percentage of the refs actually agree with Pop's take.

[UNT Eagles 2016]

yeah, FUCK unions in the US up the ass with no lube... all of them... they really don't belong.

[spurraider21]

yeah, FUCK unions in the US up the ass with no lube... all of them... they really don't belong.
maybe they're a blessing in disguise

[UNT Eagles 2016]

maybe they're a blessing in disguise

we'll find out on Thursday.... either the panthers will be 11-0 or my blessing in disguise thread will be closer to being validated. Win win tbh...

[Cry Havoc]

yeah, FUCK unions in the US up the ass with no lube... all of them... they really don't belong.

Yeah, fuck worker's rights! Let's go back to sweatshops!

[Cry Havoc]

And child labor! Who doesn't enjoy a good 12 hour day of hard labor for a 10 year old?

[UNT Eagles 2016]

And child labor! Who doesn't enjoy a good 12 hour day of hard labor for a 10 year old?
I spent a great deal of 2004 (age 9-10) working about that long every day on my uncle's ranch while my mom and grandma were fighting about how my mom might be able to afford to finish going back to college. It was kind of rough, especially since Nebraska winters are brutal, but a good experience nonetheless. Pampered liberals, on the other hand, will never understand the value and importance of work and the inherent problem with socialism.

[mingus]

I spent a great deal of 2004 (age 9-10) working about that long every day on my uncle's ranch while my mom and grandma were fighting about how my mom might be able to afford to finish going back to college. It was kind of rough, especially since Nebraska winters are brutal, but a good experience nonetheless. Pampered liberals, on the other hand, will never understand the value and importance of work and the inherent problem with socialism.

Eh, it's moronic to have the view that labor unions = lazy. There's absolutely no link between the two.

Out of High School I worked in manufacturing while going to college, and I came away with the view that, labor unions help mitigate or do away with completely a lot of the corrupt and/or greedy shit that corporations do to workers (i.e. not giving a shit about safety, nepotism, shit wages etc.).

And it has nothing to to with liberalism or socialism, either. Most of the guys I worked with voted Republican, including myself, and a lot of us were in a union.

If you don't like labor unions, I have no beef with that--if you can back it up. Personal stories are just that: personal, and are not necessarily reflective of everybody's experience. Working on a ranch owned by a family member ain't gonna count for much.

[Uriel]

Yeah, fuck worker's rights! Let's go back to sweatshops!

And child labor! Who doesn't enjoy a good 12 hour day of hard labor for a 10 year old?
:lol :tu

[SpurPadre]

Yeah, fuck worker's rights! Let's go back to sweatshops!
I know, right? Glad I have a union that stood up for me when I was getting the shaft at work.

[FromWayDowntown]

Pop's not alone in condemning the statement -- the entire Coaches Association (through Rick Carlisle, president of the Coaches Assoc.) took aim at the union lawyer's statement:

"For the record, our association would NEVER lobby for the suspension of an official for a situation like this one that has been thoroughly reviewed by the NBA and clearly determined to be incidental in nature. We view the unwarranted and reckless verbal attacks by Referee Union general counsel as grandstanding in nature, and beneath the dignity of the highly regarded group whose interests he claims to represent. The best interests of our great league lie far above what appears to be an obvious cheap and misguided attempt for a blast of short-term Twitter fame."


http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14212199/nba-coaches-association-rips-referees-union-comments-mike-budenholzer-discipline

[BillMc]

Pop's not alone in condemning the statement -- the entire Coaches Association (through Rick Carlisle, president of the Coaches Assoc.) took aim at the union lawyer's statement:

"For the record, our association would NEVER lobby for the suspension of an official for a situation like this one that has been thoroughly reviewed by the NBA and clearly determined to be incidental in nature. We view the unwarranted and reckless verbal attacks by Referee Union general counsel as grandstanding in nature, and beneath the dignity of the highly regarded group whose interests he claims to represent. The best interests of our great league lie far above what appears to be an obvious cheap and misguided attempt for a blast of short-term Twitter fame."


http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14212199/nba-coaches-association-rips-referees-union-comments-mike-budenholzer-discipline

Nice find. :toast

I agree with the Coaches Association.

[YGWHI]

Cool :bobo.

[Cry Havoc]

I spent a great deal of 2004 (age 9-10) working about that long every day on my uncle's ranch while my mom and grandma were fighting about how my mom might be able to afford to finish going back to college. It was kind of rough, especially since Nebraska winters are brutal, but a good experience nonetheless.

Let's review your statement. You just literally compared child slavery and sweatshop conditions to working on a ranch for your family.

I just have to ask: Have you... ever... picked up a history textbook? Read a little about the industrial revolution? Ever done any personal knowledge seeking at all? Or did you 1) take your personal, singular, anecdotal experience, 2) apply it to all types of industry and labor, 3) have the audacity to actually decide that ALL children who've ever had to do hard labor are better for it?

Because any child who's actually experienced such conditions would consider your "hard labor" a summer/winter camp vacation. They would have quite literally laughed at you and considered your "work" recreation. Because you clearly have no concept of what you're talking about, which frankly isn't all that surprising.


Pampered liberals, on the other hand, will never understand the value and importance of work and the inherent problem with socialism.

Way to tie it up with a nice ad-hominem. :lol

[DMC]

Yeah, fuck worker's rights! Let's go back to sweatshops!
You do realize this is bifurcation and moving the goalposts, right?

Unions and workers' rights aren't synonymous. A union is there to ensure workers' rights, but I have never, not once, been part of a union so I suppose then by your statement that my rights have been violated. in fact, less than 12% of the total workforce in the US is union labor. Lots and lots of violated rights.

You also realize that the Fair Labor Standards Act pretty much made unions obsolete, because now all unions do besides collect money is strong arm corporations into paying unreasonable amounts of money for unskilled labor. That's why the companies move to other countries and places like Detroit are barren wastelands that even the Fallout 4 guy wouldn't walk through.

I'm pretty sure Upton Sinclair didn't envision the concept of the union being what it is today. Just look at the UAW. How in the hell is a guy with no real skill set making 40 dollars an hour in a union position but only 15 an hour in a non-union position? It's not supply and demand. It's "pay this if you want to operate in this part of the country else we'll shut you down".

[dabom]

DMC is right here.

[UNT Eagles 2016]

Let's review your statement. You just literally compared child slavery and sweatshop conditions to working on a ranch for your family.

I just have to ask: Have you... ever... picked up a history textbook? Read a little about the industrial revolution? Ever done any personal knowledge seeking at all? Or did you 1) take your personal, singular, anecdotal experience, 2) apply it to all types of industry and labor, 3) have the audacity to actually decide that ALL children who've ever had to do hard labor are better for it?

Because any child who's actually experienced such conditions would consider your "hard labor" a summer/winter camp vacation. They would have quite literally laughed at you and considered your "work" recreation. Because you clearly have no concept of what you're talking about, which frankly isn't all that surprising.



Way to tie it up with a nice ad-hominem. :lol
I aced AP/DC US history in HS, awesome professor, wrote long essay supporting Andrew Carnegie/Original Pittsburgh Steelers and the US Industrial Revolution... etc. Without the Industrial Revolution, we'd be just another country living on subsistence agriculture and other countries would outsource their cheap labor HERE instead of the other way around. The bottom line is supply and demand makes the economy go, if people don't like their job or pay they can always quit (it's not slavery, after all). Big government has absolutely NO right to set unrealistic floors and ceilings that interfere with supply/demand equilibrium. This is undeniably socialistic.

[Cry Havoc]

I aced AP/DC US history in HS, awesome professor, wrote long essay supporting Andrew Carnegie/Original Pittsburgh Steelers and the US Industrial Revolution... etc. Without the Industrial Revolution, we'd be just another country living on subsistence agriculture and other countries would outsource their cheap labor HERE instead of the other way around. The bottom line is supply and demand makes the economy go, if people don't like their job or pay they can always quit (it's not slavery, after all). Big government has absolutely NO right to set unrealistic floors and ceilings that interfere with supply/demand equilibrium. This is undeniably socialistic.

So you researched the industrial revolution but still don't understand the massive impact it had on the health of working class families?

And guess what countries have the healthiest economies in the world? Social democracies! It's almost like we DO need government to regulate insanely greedy corporations.

Anyway. That's for the political forum. I just take issue with anyone who tries to trumpet the free market as the deus ex machina of the economy, when anyone with a degree in economics (who isn't getting paid by a right-wing investor) would laugh at that notion.

[Cry Havoc]

You do realize this is bifurcation and moving the goalposts, right?

Unions and workers' rights aren't synonymous. A union is there to ensure workers' rights, but I have never, not once, been part of a union so I suppose then by your statement that my rights have been violated. in fact, less than 12% of the total workforce in the US is union labor. Lots and lots of violated rights.

You also realize that the Fair Labor Standards Act pretty much made unions obsolete, because now all unions do besides collect money is strong arm corporations into paying unreasonable amounts of money for unskilled labor. That's why the companies move to other countries and places like Detroit are barren wastelands that even the Fallout 4 guy wouldn't walk through.

I'm pretty sure Upton Sinclair didn't envision the concept of the union being what it is today. Just look at the UAW. How in the hell is a guy with no real skill set making 40 dollars an hour in a union position but only 15 an hour in a non-union position? It's not supply and demand. It's "pay this if you want to operate in this part of the country else we'll shut you down".

It's humorous how you accuse me of one thing, and then do the exact same thing in your rebuttal.

I didn't say that present day unions are ideal or somehow free of any guilt. I think they need to be regulated just like the companies that they work under. As of now there is much that is wrong with unions, but it's a fallacy that the FLSA eliminates all potential wrongdoings from corporations in regard to working conditions and pay. That just establishes the absolute most incredibly basic level of treatment a worker can have, and completely ends there. It's like saying, "Well we have the Constitution, we don't need any other rights or protections as citizens!"

Come on. If the FSLA was such a self-contained success, we would be in much better shape in this country, especially with regard to the working poor. As it is, we have some of the worst work life balances in the "developed" world: http://mic.com/articles/104712/the-best-and-worst-countries-for-work-life-balance-the-u-s-doesn-t-rank-well#.ouPBXdrfA We are also one of the only developed nations that has no mandated leave or coverage for parents. It's completely bogus to say that we have no need for unions because we have a baseline level of subsistence rights for workers.

[DMC]

It's humorous how you accuse me of one thing, and then do the exact same thing in your rebuttal.

I didn't say that present day unions are ideal or somehow free of any guilt. I think they need to be regulated just like the companies that they work under. As of now there is much that is wrong with unions, but it's a fallacy that the FLSA eliminates all potential wrongdoings from corporations in regard to working conditions and pay. That just establishes the absolute most incredibly basic level of treatment a worker can have, and completely ends there. It's like saying, "Well we have the Constitution, we don't need any other rights or protections as citizens!"

You're continuously moving goalposts. Where did I even hint that the FLSA "eliminates all potential wrongdoing from corporations in regard to working conditions and pay"? Unions don't do that either.

Let's not stack errors here.


Come on. If the FSLA was such a self-contained success, we would be in much better shape in this country, especially with regard to the working poor. As it is, we have some of the worst work life balances in the "developed" world: http://mic.com/articles/104712/the-best-and-worst-countries-for-work-life-balance-the-u-s-doesn-t-rank-well#.ouPBXdrfA We are also one of the only developed nations that has no mandated leave or coverage for parents. It's completely bogus to say that we have no need for unions because we have a baseline level of subsistence rights for workers.
"Self contained success" <-----another goal post has moved.

"We would be in much better shape" <---- ambiguous, non-falsifiable claim. Regardless where we are now, you can always say we would be in better shape if...

"working poor". How many working poor are in cities like Detroit that are rife with unions, and they cannot get a job because non-performers cannot be fired?

"Mandated leave" FMLA says hello:

The FMLA entitles eligible employees of covered employers to take unpaid, job-protected leave for specified family and medical reasons with continuation of group health insurance coverage under the same terms and conditions as if the employee had not taken leave. Eligible employees are entitled to:


Twelve workweeks of leave in a 12-month period for:

the birth of a child and to care for the newborn child within one year of birth;
the placement with the employee of a child for adoption or foster care and to care for the newly placed child within one year of placement;
to care for the employee’s spouse, child, or parent who has a serious health condition;
a serious health condition that makes the employee unable to perform the essential functions of his or her job;
any qualifying exigency arising out of the fact that the employee’s spouse, son, daughter, or parent is a covered military member on “covered active duty;” or




Twenty-six workweeks of leave during a single 12-month period to care for a covered servicemember with a serious injury or illness if the eligible employee is the servicemember’s spouse, son, daughter, parent, or next of kin (military caregiver leave).


So are you complaining because it's unpaid? Should a business owner be forced to pay for your decision to have a child? How's Mexico's FMLA, because that's one of the places union jobs are going. FMLA in Mexico means they all crossed the river to enter the States.

"it's bogus to say...." No it's not. If you look at the underlying reasons unions were founded, those reasons no longer exist, yet the old establishment of unions still clings to life, barely, because people raised on it are frightened of being weened off of the tit. In a workforce that grades you on performance instead of tenure, you have to perform. In a union, you just hang around for years and collect a pension when you retire. You don't have to be proficient at anything.

Unions are like churches; their congregations pour money into the collection plates and swear up and down that the church is a pillar of the community, yet the leadership is fat and lazy and molesting the shit out of the congregation.

Look at the dwindling percentage of union organized labor jobs now in the US vs 20 years ago. See how it's falling off. That's usually a sign that an appendage is about to be dropped.

[Solid D]

Outsourcing cheap labor and controlling small farmers can be a curse in times of true need.

One EMP can set high tech back a hundred pegs.

[Solid D]

Anyway, it seems like the coaches are onto the truth of the matter.

[spursistan]

Rick Carlisle echoes Pop sentiment..juts somebody trying to be relevant..

669184492570021889

[tholdren]

Yeah, fuck worker's rights! Let's go back to sweatshops!

You're an idiot. You've probably never had a job. Unions, for the most part are ridiculous

[Godbama]

I spent a great deal of 2004 (age 9-10) working about that long every day on my uncle's ranch while my mom and grandma were fighting about how my mom might be able to afford to finish going back to college. It was kind of rough, especially since Nebraska winters are brutal, but a good experience nonetheless. Pampered liberals, on the other hand, will never understand the value and importance of work and the inherent problem with socialism.
lmao someone frame this

so weird having a team with a reputation for cosmopolitan internationalism and intellectualism in a state with so many...no offense...ooga boogas
but then they did moooore or less fight Mexico because they loved slavery so much sooooooo

keep fighting the good fight against the real enemies of this country, labor rights and entitlement.

lmfao, dumbasses these days would probably call Dwight Eisenhower and Richard Nixon "socialists" at this point. The irony is there's nothing remotely old school about your views and politics, actually. Heeeell you'd probably find Teddy Roosevelt a liberal commie dirtbag. The likes of Barry Fucking Goldwater (who was decisively destroyed in national elections because the America public thought he was TOO right wing) would be laughed out of today's GOP as not conservative enough, declared a RHINO, or a Ron Paul fringe type at best. Barack Obama and most of the Democratic mainstream are more or less Rockefeller Republicans for christsakes, are you even familiar with the term?
nothing old school at all here. More like a new school of neoreactionary cryptofascist saps who are even worse than smelly hippies since they don't have free love or cool drugs or fun music

[Cry Havoc]

You're an idiot. You've probably never had a job. Unions, for the most part are ridiculous

You should make a couple dozen threads on it.

[DJR210]

maybe they're a blessing in disguise

My first thought exactly.

[UNT Eagles 2016]

So you researched the industrial revolution but still don't understand the massive impact it had on the health of working class families?

And guess what countries have the healthiest economies in the world? Social democracies! It's almost like we DO need government to regulate insanely greedy corporations.

Anyway. That's for the political forum. I just take issue with anyone who tries to trumpet the free market as the deus ex machina of the economy, when anyone with a degree in economics (who isn't getting paid by a right-wing investor) would laugh at that notion.

:lmao

You do realize that 95% of public universities are pervasively and absolutely biased to the left, correct? This includes the one I currently attend, though being in the business college mitigates that a bit thankfully.


Leave the business building here and it's naught but a bunch of gross smelly androgynous hipsters with awful dyed hair, scuzzy tattoos and classless face piercings calling for Bernie Sanders and a permanent end to capitalism.