Spurs winning with ELITE defense

[dabom]

I'm loving it. :lol

[dabom]

With Kawhi getting more buckets, Tim is allowed to expend more energy on defense. And LMA gets a piece of all that too. He hustles on D and O. If any of those slack, the other 2 pick it up for them. And Tony playing good too. :toast

[spursistan]

Our front-court is too overwhelming, tbh..look at Zaza Pachluia numbers coming into this game. He was made a total non-factor (0 rebs after getting in double digit the last 4 :lol)..



Wed 11/25


@

SA (http://espn.go.com/nba/team/_/name/sa/san-antonio-spurs)


L 83-88 (http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?id=400828111)
21
1-4
.250
0-0
.000
2-2
1.000
0
0
0
0
4
1
4


Tue 11/24


@

MEM (http://espn.go.com/nba/team/_/name/mem/memphis-grizzlies)


L 96-110 (http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?id=400828098)
28
2-6
.333
0-1
.000
9-10
.900
10
3
0
1
3
3
13


Sun 11/22


@

OKC (http://espn.go.com/nba/team/_/name/okc/oklahoma-city-thunder)


L 114-117 (http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?id=400828086)
34
4-8
.500
0-0
.000
4-7
.571
10
6
3
1
5
5
12


Fri 11/20


vs

UTAH (http://espn.go.com/nba/team/_/name/utah/utah-jazz)


W 102-93 (http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?id=400828071)
39
6-11
.545
0-0
.000
3-4
.750
12
4
0
2
2
1
15


Wed 11/18


@

BOS (http://espn.go.com/nba/team/_/name/bos/boston-celtics)


W 106-102 (http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?id=400828055)
32
5-7
.714
0-0
.000
4-4
1.000
12
3
1
0
3
4
14

[Tbiggums47]

Great insight. The Warriors are a great team but 2 things: 1. Although they won they championship last season. They were never seriously tested IMO. 2. I hope they continue to believe all the hype about themselves because to me they are champions by default. And as the media does every year The Spurs have injury issues... They are simply dismissed as old and done when in reality... This team was the previous years champions coming off of back to back finals. By default The Warriors are placed as the new standard... Along with other teams who backed into their status bcause of the health issues of The Spurs. I think this premature hype will dissipate when The Healthy Spurs team emerges to prove that The Warriors rise while impressive is premature IMO.

[Johnny RIngo]

Defense is 1st in DRtg. Offense is 10th in ORtg. Not bad for an early season start but SA needs to be much better on O to beat Golden State I think.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

Great insight. The Warriors are a great team but 2 things: 1. Although they won they championship last season. They were never seriously tested IMO. 2. I hope they continue to believe all the hype about themselves because to me they are champions by default. And as the media does every year The Spurs have injury issues... They are simply dismissed as old and done when in reality... This team was the previous years champions coming off of back to back finals. By default The Warriors are placed as the new standard... Along with other teams who backed into their status bcause of the health issues of The Spurs. I think this premature hype will dissipate when The Healthy Spurs team emerges to prove that The Warriors rise while impressive is premature IMO.

Its amazing to me that a 12-3 Spurs team is flying under the radar but that is the level of dick sucking that GS is getting

[SAGirl]

Great insight. The Warriors are a great team but 2 things: 1. Although they won they championship last season. They were never seriously tested IMO. 2. I hope they continue to believe all the hype about themselves because to me they are champions by default. And as the media does every year The Spurs have injury issues... They are simply dismissed as old and done when in reality... This team was the previous years champions coming off of back to back finals. By default The Warriors are placed as the new standard... Along with other teams who backed into their status bcause of the health issues of The Spurs. I think this premature hype will dissipate when The Healthy Spurs team emerges to prove that The Warriors rise while impressive is premature IMO.
:flag:

[DMC]

It's really naive to think the team with the best record in the league in the RS, and who won the NBA championship wasn't ever "really tested". They played over 100 games. They were tested.

[r0drig0lac]

It's really naive to think the team with the best record in the league in the RS, and who won the NBA championship wasn't ever "really tested". They played over 100 games. They were tested.

I agree, I think people just do not want to see reality, this gsw team appears to be one of the most complete teams ever, especially for the current set of rules, they have no apparent failures ....so far.

[DMC]

I agree, I think people just do not want to see reality, this gsw team appears to be one of the most complete teams ever, especially for the current set of rules, they have no apparent failures ....so far.
If they have a weakness it's not a bad one; they get a big lead and they play monkey ball until they give up the lead. So far it's not cost them a game.

[ducks]

Defense is 1st in DRtg. Offense is 10th in ORtg. Not bad for an early season start but SA needs to be much better on O to beat Golden State I think.
Please let pop think he know more then u

[BillMc]

With Kawhi getting more buckets, Tim is allowed to expend more energy on defense. And LMA gets a piece of all that too. He hustles on D and O. If any of those slack, the other 2 pick it up for them. And Tony playing good too. :toast

This.

[Tbiggums47]

It's really naive to think the team with the best record in the league in the RS, and who won the NBA championship wasn't ever "really tested". They played over 100 games. They were tested.
im merely suggesting that Golden State DID NOT have to beat "Elite Teams" in their title run. I didn't say they weren't good. Don't get it twisted my friend. There isn't any "nativity" in that statement. It's a fact.....No disrespect. Spurs,clippers,OKC? ��??? Think about it!

[Mel_13]

670612655351050240

[DMC]

im merely suggesting that Golden State DID NOT have to beat "Elite Teams" in their title run. I didn't say they weren't good. Don't get it twisted my friend. There isn't any "nativity" in that statement. It's a fact.....No disrespect. Spurs,clippers,OKC? ??? Think about it!

It's bullshit. The elite team won the ring, and they've proven that by being 17-0 this season. The Spurs couldn't get over the Clippers who couldn't get over the Rockets who couldn't get over the Warriors. That's how the tiers work.

Let's talk elite for a second:



Spurs had to win the last RS game against the shitty Pelicans. They couldn't thus they didn't get the right matchup.
Golden State beat the Pelicans 4-0 in the playoffs.
That eliminates the Spurs as being "elite" this season, compared to the Warriors.
Warriors only lost 3 games en route to the Finals.
The team that beat the team that beat us only won ONE game against the Warriors.


So who were these elite teams?

Dallas?
Clippers?

No.

You're hemming and hawing around to say the Spurs were the elite team. They got their shit pushed in by the team that couldn't beat a washed up JSmoove and Jason fucking Terry, who won only one game against the eventual champs.

Delusional people infest these types of forums. Just change the names in the post to "Lakers" and "Kobe" and it's indistinguishable from LG.com.

[Tbiggums47]

It's bullshit. The elite team won the ring, and they've proven that by being 17-0 this season. The Spurs couldn't get over the Clippers who couldn't get over the Rockets who couldn't get over the Warriors. That's how the tiers work.

Let's talk elite for a second:



Spurs had to win the last RS game against the shitty Pelicans. They couldn't thus they didn't get the right matchup.
Golden State beat the Pelicans 4-0 in the playoffs.
That eliminates the Spurs as being "elite" this season, compared to the Warriors.
Warriors only lost 3 games en route to the Finals.
The team that beat the team that beat us only won ONE game against the Warriors.


So who were these elite teams?

Dallas?
Clippers?

No.

You're hemming and hawing around to say the Spurs were the elite team. They got their shit pushed in by the team that couldn't beat a washed up JSmoove and Jason fucking Terry, who won only one game against the eventual champs.

Delusional people infest these types of forums. Just change the names in the post to "Lakers" and "Kobe" and it's indistinguishable from LG.com.

No DMC. YOU ARE WRONG. Look at that schedule. Who have they been dominating? Cupcakes!! You are seriously, Misinterpreting my take. And your take is totally bullshit... LOL....What I'm saying IS: The Spurs are a year removed from being NBA champions AND with back to back finals appearances... AND that's a fact JACK. You can discount those facts anyway you want to.... IMO injuries led to GSW title run.... And whether you See it that way or not is YOUR perspective. So I won't allow YOU and any GSW Buttlickers Dismiss this team as a has been... YOU CANT DO IT. IMO until Proven different. And Yes.... This year they'll have to prove it.....And if you haven't noticed Da Spurs a a pretty good defensive team...N And I believe they'll only get better. Last time I checked this was a forum to place an opinion. RIGHT?No disrespect as I Said before..... I happen to believe you are wrong.... But time will tell us the truth!.. Delusional or not... Stop the hating....Peace!

[kawhidoyoudothistome]

It's bullshit. The elite team won the ring, and they've proven that by being 17-0 this season. The Spurs couldn't get over the Clippers who couldn't get over the Rockets who couldn't get over the Warriors. That's how the tiers work.

Let's talk elite for a second:



Spurs had to win the last RS game against the shitty Pelicans. They couldn't thus they didn't get the right matchup.
Golden State beat the Pelicans 4-0 in the playoffs.
That eliminates the Spurs as being "elite" this season, compared to the Warriors.
Warriors only lost 3 games en route to the Finals.
The team that beat the team that beat us only won ONE game against the Warriors.


So who were these elite teams?

Dallas?
Clippers?

No.

You're hemming and hawing around to say the Spurs were the elite team. They got their shit pushed in by the team that couldn't beat a washed up JSmoove and Jason fucking Terry, who won only one game against the eventual champs.

Delusional people infest these types of forums. Just change the names in the post to "Lakers" and "Kobe" and it's indistinguishable from LG.com.

We were the nightmare MU for them in last year's PO run. Sadly, we could not get our shit together and lost to an ailing CP3 and fucking Austin Rivers. We by far have the greatest chance against them this season, though Cleveland is always a threat.

[DMC]

We were the nightmare MU for them in last year's PO run. Sadly, we could not get our shit together and lost to an ailing CP3 and fucking Austin Rivers. We by far have the greatest chance against them this season, though Cleveland is always a threat.

Ok maybe the Wizards are the nightmare matchup for the Spurs. What does that even mean? It doesn't make the Spurs the better team in the scheme of 30 teams in an 82 game season. If we cannot get past the 1st round, we aren't the "elite" team they dodged.

[DMC]

No DMC. YOU ARE WRONG. Look at that schedule. Who have they been dominating? Cupcakes!! You are seriously, Misinterpreting my take. And your take is totally bullshit... LOL....What I'm saying IS: The Spurs are a year removed from being NBA champions AND with back to back finals appearances... AND that's a fact JACK. You can discount those facts anyway you want to.... IMO injuries led to GSW title run.... And whether you See it that way or not is YOUR perspective. So I won't allow YOU and any GSW Buttlickers Dismiss this team as a has been... YOU CANT DO IT. IMO until Proven different. And Yes.... This year they'll have to prove it.....And if you haven't noticed Da Spurs a a pretty good defensive team...N And I believe they'll only get better. Last time I checked this was a forum to place an opinion. RIGHT?No disrespect as I Said before..... I happen to believe you are wrong.... But time will tell us the truth!.. Delusional or not... Stop the hating....Peace!
Jesus fucking Christ you retarded faggot, learn to type.

[kawhidoyoudothistome]

Ok maybe the Wizards are the nightmare matchup for the Spurs. What does that even mean? It doesn't make the Spurs the better team in the scheme of 30 teams in an 82 game season. If we cannot get past the 1st round, we aren't the "elite" team they dodged.

I never said they were lol. I'd agree with not wanting to face Washington. I hate how well Washington can hit threes against us. We may not be the "elite" team they dodged, but we were the team they didn't want to face...or maybe they did just to see if they could beat us in a 7 game series. They're emulating us. Mus are MUs. We MU well with them, man. Our two best wing defenders regularly do well against them.

[Tbiggums47]

Jesus fucking Christ you retarded faggot, learn to type.
LOL.....
Just what I thought..... You are an Incompetent Imbecile.... LOL... If I can't type? How were you able to read it? You Dumbass!!! Here's a penny..... Please buy a clue. I'll learn to type when you learn to think rationally...OK?? Again NO Disrespect... YOU ARE WRONG!!!! Obviously you can't respond with any intelligence .... BUT name calling.... Delusional....Right?

[Agloco]

V
It's bullshit. The elite team won the ring, and they've proven that by being 17-0 this season. The Spurs couldn't get over the Clippers who couldn't get over the Rockets who couldn't get over the Warriors. That's how the tiers work.

Let's talk elite for a second:



Spurs had to win the last RS game against the shitty Pelicans. They couldn't thus they didn't get the right matchup.
Golden State beat the Pelicans 4-0 in the playoffs.
That eliminates the Spurs as being "elite" this season, compared to the Warriors.
Warriors only lost 3 games en route to the Finals.
The team that beat the team that beat us only won ONE game against the Warriors.


So who were these elite teams?

Dallas?
Clippers?

No.

You're hemming and hawing around to say the Spurs were the elite team. They got their shit pushed in by the team that couldn't beat a washed up JSmoove and Jason fucking Terry, who won only one game against the eventual champs.

Delusional people infest these types of forums. Just change the names in the post to "Lakers" and "Kobe" and it's indistinguishable from LG.com.

I get your point but I'm disappointed to see an "A>B and B>C thus A>C" post from you. I happen to agree with the premise that GS was/is elite, but you can't build your argument using that kind of logic. Sports matchups are a bit more involved than that.

Simply pointing at advanced stats shows us pretty much everything we need to know.

[Kool Bob Love]

DMC hasn't been the same without Thread.

[Yuixafun]

If the Warriors are some all time dominant great team, how did Lebron James and company of scrubs win 2 fucking games against them.

The fact that the Warriors faced teams with significant injuries to key players made it an easier run to their ring.

The fact that they didn't play the Spurs, who just weeks before defeated them in emphatic fashion, with KL basically sealing his DPOY by making Curry look average, and collecting 7 steals, made it easier for the Warriors. Belief is an invaluable thing, and I don't think last year the Warriors deep down believed they would beat the Spurs, just because of our previous recent successes, our coaching and personnel.

They may now.

And even if all the teams were healty and they played the Spurs, the Warriors still might have won it all.

Then no one could say anything. But there were mitigating factors.

So if people want to put an asterisk next to the Spurs NBA Championship during the lock out shortened year... Then fuck it, let us put hand gesture quotation marks when we say NBA Championship Warriors, because they were fully healthy while everyone else was down strong players, and they didn't go through their biggest foil, the Spurs.

The Cavs won 2 game with just Lebron and a broken team, an inferior coach, and no one to defend Stephen Curry. You don't the Spurs would have done maybe a little better, like 2 more wins better, when they're that close to a back back Championship against a darling team first time in the deep waters?

[Solid D]

I agree! The Spurs do have an elite defense. The best they've had in many years and they are getting better. The Warriors also have an excellent defensive team. Why discredit them? GS currently ranks 6th (Spurs 4th) in Opp FG% and the Warriors defend the arc better than any team in the NBA at .294 (Spurs 6th .328). In defensive efficiency, the Spurs are 1st at 93.4 (GS is 5th 96.4). The Spurs are dominant this year in defensive rebounding, leading the league DR efficiency at 80.4. The Warriors are no slouches at blocks/gm ranking them 3rd at 6.4/gm (Spurs 4th 6.3)...however, the Warriors see more opponent trips per game than the Spurs do, due to the high pace at which GS plays.
Another great stat is the Spurs at currently ranked 3rd in fewest allowed fast break pts/gm at 10.3. That has got to please coach Hammon and the rest of the Spurs' coaching staff. :)

[DAF86]

For all the bitching LMA has gotten he has played awesome defense, imho.

[DMC]

V

I get your point but I'm disappointed to see an "A>B and B>C thus A>C" post from you. I happen to agree with the premise that GS was/is elite, but you can't build your argument using that kind of logic. Sports matchups are a bit more involved than that.

Simply pointing at advanced stats shows us pretty much everything we need to know.

In a tiered system, if you're not able to get past the lower tier, you do not belong on the highest tier for whatever reason. The NBA playoffs are a tiered system. The term "elite" is being used here to describe a team that's somehow better than a team the "elite" team couldn't beat. That in and of itself doesn't make any sense. If A, B and C were side by side the analogy you used would be accurate, but in a tiered system they aren't side by side. The elite team should be able to beat all other teams in the playoffs, not just that one team that won the ring. Otherwise you're saying if we didn't have to go through tougher teams we would have been in the Finals because we could have beaten GS. That puts us right where you're saying the GSW are.

As I said, the Wizards could possibly have beaten the Warriors in the Finals. We'll never know, because they didn't get there.

[DMC]

I never said they were lol. I'd agree with not wanting to face Washington. I hate how well Washington can hit threes against us. We may not be the "elite" team they dodged, but we were the team they didn't want to face...or maybe they did just to see if they could beat us in a 7 game series. They're emulating us. Mus are MUs. We MU well with them, man. Our two best wing defenders regularly do well against them.

Too many people judge their team based on what they are capable of instead of what they do. If we can be sacked by a poor matchup scenario in the 1st round, then we should have beaten the Pelicans, or is that also a poor matchup?

[UNT Eagles 2016]

DMC

That one GNSF guy from way above is an idiot, but I have to disagree with you here on a few things.


First of all, think about it this way. In 2007, the Mavs were on a revenge tour after the heartbreaking Finals loss from the year prior, and were absolutely dominant against literally every team in the NBA except for the We Believe Warriors. In most simulations, they would have drawn a different team in the first round (like the Nuggets, Lakers or Clippers) and swept them, beat the Jazz in 5 in the second round, beat the Spurs in 5/6 in the WCF and won the Finals over the Cavs pretty convincingly. Unfortunately for the Mavs, they ran into literally the one team out of 29 that could possibly beat them that year: the dreaded We Believe Warriors. And so the Mavs suffered an untimely death at the hands of their one kryptonite, and the Spurs were able to cruise against the Jazz and Cavs to an easy title after getting past the Suns that year. Does that mean that the Spurs should be stripped of that title or be given an asterick simply because they didn't play the best team/the team that would definitely have beaten them? No. But it's undeniable that the Mavs were the class of the league in 2007.


Secondly, I don't consider the present-day Warriors a top 5 defense, at all. I'd rank them as middling on that end despite their high analytical D-rating. What D-rating doesn't take into account is that it sort of plays off the offense of a team, and that's how the Suns would consistently be ranked high in D-rating despite the fact they were bad on that end. The reason the Warriors have a high D-rating is their offense; as they are constantly running and scoring quickly, other teams find themselves down double digits quickly even with their average level of offense and they quickly become psychologically demoralized and resort to jacking up bad shots to try to get back in the game quickly, but that's a losing strategy against the Warriors (though teams, especially young teams, will do it anyway because it's a natural mechanism to want to match a team like that quickly to save face). That mainly explains why the Warriors' opponents shoot the lowest from 3-point territory; this is primarily due to the fact that opponents take more ill-advised jumpers (that usually result in bricks and transition scores the other way) against the Warriors than against any other team because they're simply trying and failing to shoot themselves back in the game quickly.

[HarlemHeat37]

DMC

That one GNSF guy from way above is an idiot, but I have to disagree with you here on a few things.


First of all, think about it this way. In 2007, the Mavs were on a revenge tour after the heartbreaking Finals loss from the year prior, and were absolutely dominant against literally every team in the NBA except for the We Believe Warriors. In most simulations, they would have drawn a different team in the first round (like the Nuggets, Lakers or Clippers) and swept them, beat the Jazz in 5 in the second round, beat the Spurs in 5/6 in the WCF and won the Finals over the Cavs pretty convincingly. Unfortunately for the Mavs, they ran into literally the one team out of 29 that could possibly beat them that year: the dreaded We Believe Warriors. And so the Mavs suffered an untimely death at the hands of their one kryptonite, and the Spurs were able to cruise against the Jazz and Cavs to an easy title after getting past the Suns that year. Does that mean that the Spurs should be stripped of that title or be given an asterick simply because they didn't play the best team/the team that would definitely have beaten them? No. But it's undeniable that the Mavs were the class of the league in 2007.


Secondly, I don't consider the present-day Warriors a top 5 defense, at all. I'd rank them as middling on that end despite their high analytical D-rating. What D-rating doesn't take into account is that it sort of plays off the offense of a team, and that's how the Suns would consistently be ranked high in D-rating despite the fact they were bad on that end. The reason the Warriors have a high D-rating is their offense; as they are constantly running and scoring quickly, other teams find themselves down double digits quickly even with their average level of offense and they quickly become psychologically demoralized and resort to jacking up bad shots to try to get back in the game quickly, but that's a losing strategy against the Warriors (though teams, especially young teams, will do it anyway because it's a natural mechanism to want to match a team like that quickly to save face). That mainly explains why the Warriors' opponents shoot the lowest from 3-point territory; this is primarily due to the fact that opponents take more ill-advised jumpers (that usually result in bricks and transition scores the other way) against the Warriors than against any other team because they're simply trying and failing to shoot themselves back in the game quickly.

http://5.kicksonfire.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Confused-Gary-Payton.gif?d25dc5

[apalisoc_9]

http://5.kicksonfire.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Confused-Gary-Payton.gif?d25dc5
:lol

That guy has some awful takes...

[ducks]

:lol

That guy has some awful takes...
You must watch him alot

[Solid D]

In 2013-14, (Spurs 5th championship season) the top 5 defensive teams per Basketball Reference site were (1) Indiana, (2) Chicago, (3) SA, (4) Golden State, and (5) OKC. The Spurs had the best Overall/Net Point Diff +/-.

In 2014-15 (Warriors 2nd championship season) the top 5 defensive teams per Basketball Reference site were (1) Golden State, (2) SA, (3) Memphis, (4) Milwaukee, and (5) Washington. The Warriors had the best Overall/Net Point Diff +/-.

Thus far, in 2015-16 the top 5 defensive teams per Basketball Reference site are (1) SA, (2) Indiana , (3) Miami, (4) Boston , and (5) Golden State. The Warriors have the best Overall/Net Point Diff +/-.

[DMC]

DMC (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=20665)

That one GNSF guy from way above is an idiot, but I have to disagree with you here on a few things.


First of all, think about it this way. In 2007, the Mavs were on a revenge tour after the heartbreaking Finals loss from the year prior, and were absolutely dominant against literally every team in the NBA except for the We Believe Warriors. In most simulations, they would have drawn a different team in the first round (like the Nuggets, Lakers or Clippers) and swept them, beat the Jazz in 5 in the second round, beat the Spurs in 5/6 in the WCF and won the Finals over the Cavs pretty convincingly. Unfortunately for the Mavs, they ran into literally the one team out of 29 that could possibly beat them that year: the dreaded We Believe Warriors. And so the Mavs suffered an untimely death at the hands of their one kryptonite, and the Spurs were able to cruise against the Jazz and Cavs to an easy title after getting past the Suns that year. Does that mean that the Spurs should be stripped of that title or be given an asterick simply because they didn't play the best team/the team that would definitely have beaten them? No. But it's undeniable that the Mavs were the class of the league in 2007.


Secondly, I don't consider the present-day Warriors a top 5 defense, at all. I'd rank them as middling on that end despite their high analytical D-rating. What D-rating doesn't take into account is that it sort of plays off the offense of a team, and that's how the Suns would consistently be ranked high in D-rating despite the fact they were bad on that end. The reason the Warriors have a high D-rating is their offense; as they are constantly running and scoring quickly, other teams find themselves down double digits quickly even with their average level of offense and they quickly become psychologically demoralized and resort to jacking up bad shots to try to get back in the game quickly, but that's a losing strategy against the Warriors (though teams, especially young teams, will do it anyway because it's a natural mechanism to want to match a team like that quickly to save face). That mainly explains why the Warriors' opponents shoot the lowest from 3-point territory; this is primarily due to the fact that opponents take more ill-advised jumpers (that usually result in bricks and transition scores the other way) against the Warriors than against any other team because they're simply trying and failing to shoot themselves back in the game quickly.

Dallas finished with the best record in the West. They got beaten by a hot shooting GSW team. It's quite possible the Spurs would have been beaten by the same team if they met them in the 1st round. It doesn't mean the GSW were the best team in the league, but it does mean the Mavs weren't.

It doesn't matter what seeding you get, if you cannot beat your match up you're not good enough to be a champion. You can look for loopholes in matchups and such, and sure some teams match up better with others, but you have to consider how they got there. The Spurs could have avoided meeting the Clippers in the 1st round had they beaten the 8th seeded Pelicans, but they didn't. It was only one game, but it was an important game. Pop resting guys as if he didn't care late in the season was part of that, but then part of the loss to the Clippers was intentionally fouling Jordan while we were up 12 in the 2nd quarter. It's never about what the team is capable of, or what they have shown they can do in the past, but what they did in that series. In that series, they lost. If they played the Clippers 10 series of 7 games each, it's likely they win more than they lose, but they lost that series. Then the Clippers lost to Houston. So yes it does matter what team beat what team. I don't care about ratings, all that shit is out the window once the playoffs starts. Teams don't win and lose on paper, but on the court.

[Mel_13]

DMC

That one GNSF guy from way above is an idiot, but I have to disagree with you here on a few things.


First of all, think about it this way. In 2007, the Mavs were on a revenge tour after the heartbreaking Finals loss from the year prior, and were absolutely dominant against literally every team in the NBA except for the We Believe Warriors. In most simulations, they would have drawn a different team in the first round (like the Nuggets, Lakers or Clippers) and swept them, beat the Jazz in 5 in the second round, beat the Spurs in 5/6 in the WCF and won the Finals over the Cavs pretty convincingly. Unfortunately for the Mavs, they ran into literally the one team out of 29 that could possibly beat them that year: the dreaded We Believe Warriors. And so the Mavs suffered an untimely death at the hands of their one kryptonite, and the Spurs were able to cruise against the Jazz and Cavs to an easy title after getting past the Suns that year. Does that mean that the Spurs should be stripped of that title or be given an asterick simply because they didn't play the best team/the team that would definitely have beaten them? No. But it's undeniable that the Mavs were the class of the league in 2007.


Secondly, I don't consider the present-day Warriors a top 5 defense, at all. I'd rank them as middling on that end despite their high analytical D-rating. What D-rating doesn't take into account is that it sort of plays off the offense of a team, and that's how the Suns would consistently be ranked high in D-rating despite the fact they were bad on that end. The reason the Warriors have a high D-rating is their offense; as they are constantly running and scoring quickly, other teams find themselves down double digits quickly even with their average level of offense and they quickly become psychologically demoralized and resort to jacking up bad shots to try to get back in the game quickly, but that's a losing strategy against the Warriors (though teams, especially young teams, will do it anyway because it's a natural mechanism to want to match a team like that quickly to save face). That mainly explains why the Warriors' opponents shoot the lowest from 3-point territory; this is primarily due to the fact that opponents take more ill-advised jumpers (that usually result in bricks and transition scores the other way) against the Warriors than against any other team because they're simply trying and failing to shoot themselves back in the game quickly.

Nice story, but those two things just aren't true.

[ceperez]

It's bullshit. The elite team won the ring, and they've proven that by being 17-0 this season. The Spurs couldn't get over the Clippers who couldn't get over the Rockets who couldn't get over the Warriors. That's how the tiers work.

Let's talk elite for a second:



Spurs had to win the last RS game against the shitty Pelicans. They couldn't thus they didn't get the right matchup.
Golden State beat the Pelicans 4-0 in the playoffs.
That eliminates the Spurs as being "elite" this season, compared to the Warriors.
Warriors only lost 3 games en route to the Finals.
The team that beat the team that beat us only won ONE game against the Warriors.


So who were these elite teams?

Dallas?
Clippers?

No.

You're hemming and hawing around to say the Spurs were the elite team. They got their shit pushed in by the team that couldn't beat a washed up JSmoove and Jason fucking Terry, who won only one game against the eventual champs.

Delusional people infest these types of forums. Just change the names in the post to "Lakers" and "Kobe" and it's indistinguishable from LG.com.

I agree that last year that the Spurs were not elite. You can't be elite with both Parker and Spitter playing injured though.

[Tbiggums47]

I agree that last year that the Spurs were not elite. You can't be elite with both Parker and Spitter playing injured though.
Exactly my point. They were not at their best last year. Now to just dismiss them as non factors is not rational. I happen to believe they still are Elite. They just need to prove it. IMO!

[cjw]

Nice story, but those two things just aren't true.

Exactly. It's more likely the W's defensive rating suffers from garbage time than is helped. Less intensity down stretch and less minutes to their best players.

There may be a few thrown away possessions by guys trying to outhero Steph, but not enough to move the needle of their DRtg.

[ceperez]

Exactly my point. They were not at their best last year. Now to just dismiss them as non factors is not rational. I happen to believe they still are Elite. They just need to prove it. IMO!

Well Spurs are obviously better.

LMA is an upgrade of an injured Splitter.
West is an upgrade offensively over Baynes
Anderson is a downgrade offensively from Belinelli, but an upgrade in defense.
Simmons is an upgrade over Cojo
Marjanovic is an upgrade over Ayres

Overall a better team that'll get better over time. We see both Anderson and Simmons both accumulating minutes and become comfortable. That's a big thing to have two other young guys come off the bench and contribute.

[dabom]

Everyone knows Basketball isn't A>B and B>C so A>C. Matchups is a huge thing in basketball. Only a dumbass would say something so fucking stupid. :lmao

[BillMc]

Simmons is an upgrade over Cojo


I hope you're right, of course, but I think it might be a little early to draw that conclusion with certainty.

[ajh18]

The Warriors are a great, great team. Best in the league right now, and I don't think it's fair to downplay their accomplishments.

That said, I also don't think it's right to call them "one of the greatest teams ever." I don't think they would have beaten our 2014 team, and I think that last year we simply couldn't hold up health-wise. The Spurs of 2015 were hobbled and not at the top of their game, and in that state were simply not better than GS. When we played them and were healthy, we did pretty well, which is why many fans on here (unjustly, I feel) downplay the Warriors' success.

They aren't a perfect team by any stretch, but right now they are the best in the league by far. If we, OKC, or Cleveland can get healthy and start clicking though, I don't think there is too much of a gap between those four teams.

[ajh18]

I hope you're right, of course, but I think it might be a little early to draw that conclusion with certainty.

Cojo looked great for Toronto last night, and looks good overall this season. Really happy for the guy. And yet another example of the Spurs developmental abilities, and why I'm still high on Anderson's potential.

Give the Spurs a bit of talent, and they consistently produce decent rotation players. Even ones that don't stick here like Beno, Mahinmi, James Anderson, etc. seem to benefit from their time in the system and carve out decent NBA careers. More recently, Spurs projects we lose via trade or free agency such as George Hill, Baynes, and Cojo manage to do fairly well.

Give the development team a lot of raw talent to work with... and you get Kawhi Leonard.

[Nathan89]

The Warriors are a great, great team. Best in the league right now, and I don't think it's fair to downplay their accomplishments.

That said, I also don't think it's right to call them "one of the greatest teams ever." I don't think they would have beaten our 2014 team, and I think that last year we simply couldn't hold up health-wise. The Spurs of 2015 were hobbled and not at the top of their game, and in that state were simply not better than GS. When we played them and were healthy, we did pretty well, which is why many fans on here (unjustly, I feel) downplay the Warriors' success.

They aren't a perfect team by any stretch, but right now they are the best in the league by far. If we, OKC, or Cleveland can get healthy and start clicking though, I don't think there is too much of a gap between those four teams.

They are clearly one of the greatest teams ever. They are undefeated and they are winning games by large margins. They could very easily have the best record ever this year.

[ajh18]

They are clearly one of the greatest teams ever. They are undefeated and they are winning games by large margins. They could very easily have the best record ever this year.

If they have a great record and win the title this year, I'll say this is the case. Until that, they're having a good run.

The 2011-2012 Spurs had a 20-game win streak going into the OKC series. Not one of the greatest teams ever.

The 2005-2006 Spurs won 63 games, were the defending champs, and never lost more than 2 games in a row until the Mavs series. Also not one of the greatest teams ever.

The 2008-2009 Celtics won 62 games, including a 19 game win streak, and were the defending champions. Lost to the Magic in the EC semifinals. Not one of the greatest teams ever.

My point is, let the Warriors do it again this year before crowning them. Lots of defending champions have huge streaks the following year, but if they lose in the playoffs then I at least don't classify them as one of the greatest ever.

[steeledl]

They are clearly one of the greatest teams ever. They are undefeated and they are winning games by large margins. They could very easily have the best record ever this year.


Quality post little brother. Too many Spurs fans sleeping on the Warriors . Scariest team I've ever seen tbh IMHO iirc.

[tmtcsc]

Golden St. has the rest of the league and the media bowing down like pussies. Take a look at the box scores once in a while and tell me how this team wins without Curry scoring in bunches. They can't and they won't. Every year it gets said over and over - the playoffs are an entirely different beast and this year will be no different. What happens when those 3's don't come so easy and frustration sets in? My bet is that GS will fold like lawn chairs.

That being said, the Spurs have A LOT of work to do to become the elite team they want and NEED to be to win #6. They have played a ridiculously soft schedule thus far, and as a result, fluffed up their record. I haven't seen them play a truly great game yet and their rebounding is suspect. Last night was good but they need to play better.

Plenty of season left to go and I'm sure Pop isn't going to allow the team to get injured patting themselves on the back.

[RayTdropout]

that's nice and all but in order to bEat golden state
there pathetic offense needs to step up

[Seventyniner]

The Warriors are damn good, but the 18-0 start is a bit of fools' gold. Their Pythagorean (expected) record is 16-2, only 1.5 games ahead of the Spurs. And that's on an even weaker schedule (-2.34 for the Warriors, -1.76 for the Spurs).

It reminds me of the Heat's 27-game win streak in 2012-2013. At one point they won a double-OT game at home against a bad Kings team. Change one shot in that game and instead of 27 wins in a row, it's 11 wins, 1 loss, 15 wins. Still damn good but not historic. And that Heat team needed a miracle to avoid losing in the Finals.

[spursistan]

It is indeed a historic D, i hope we keep it up..But i guess things will balance out a bit with offense as the season goes on..

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671324798056660992

[dabom]

It is indeed a historic D, i hope we keep it up..But i guess things will balance out a bit with offense as the season goes on..

671324327652950016
671324798056660992


:wow:wow

[spursistan]

:wow

675886085029826560

[spursistan]

677358138664861696

[dabom]

Keep it up my friend.

[UNT Eagles 2016]

D was shit tonight especially in the first half, O carried the day

[Cowboys_Wear_Spurs]

D was shit tonight especially in the first half, O carried the day

No, the D was good. It just that John Wall is that good of a PG. There is a reason he is 4th in apg and 1st in the Eastern Conference. Wall passes were giving the Spurs fit much like the game in Washington.

Wiz came out swing from the fences and they were spent by Halftime. And Boban my their lives a nightmare last night protecting the rim as well. It was funny seeing Blair trying to defend Boban and trying to box him out as well. Spurs have come a long way since then.

[ceperez]

No, the D was good. It just that John Wall is that good of a PG. There is a reason he is 4th in apg and 1st in the Eastern Conference. Wall passes were giving the Spurs fit much like the game in Washington.

Wiz came out swing from the fences and they were spent by Halftime. And Boban my their lives a nightmare last night protecting the rim as well. It was funny seeing Blair trying to defend Boban and trying to box him out as well. Spurs have come a long way since then.

Those were the dark days when Spurs had to rely on Blair to man the paint.

[dabom]

I made a comment in the game thread about how fucking fail blair looked out there trying to get a rebound over Boban. :lmao

[playbonner15]

Those were the dark days when Spurs had to rely on Blair to man the paint.
dat Bonner / Blair frontcourt :lol

[dabom]

dat Bonner / Blair frontcourt :lol

Stop dude. :lmao

[tmtcsc]

Golden St. has the rest of the league and the media bowing down like pussies. Take a look at the box scores once in a while and tell me how this team wins without Curry scoring in bunches. They can't and they won't.

Like I said, GSW better hope their golden boy doesn't get hurt. One man show that needs to score in bunches for them to win.

[dabom]

Like I said, GSW better hope their golden boy doesn't get hurt. One man show that needs to score in bunches for them to win.

[look_at_g_shred]

Like I said, GSW better hope their golden boy doesn't get hurt. One man show that needs to score in bunches for them to win.

[cjw]

He had a pretty pedestrian finals last year and they still won. Not that Lebron has anyone around him that series - team was on the same level as the 07 Cavs team.

[spursistan]

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[Hoops Czar]

Like I said, GSW better hope their golden boy doesn't get hurt. One man show that needs to score in bunches for them to win.

And you learned all this from watching one game? This can be said about any team in the league that loses it's best player.

[spursistan]

682411679599210496

[tmtcsc]

And you learned all this from watching one game? This can be said about any team in the league that loses it's best player.

Well, the one game Curry didn't play in and the boxscores from their wins. They rely on him and his insane shots way too much. He won't get loose in the playoffs like he has in the regular season.