Houston Should Be Evacuated

[Nbadan]

http://img365.imageshack.us/img365/1672/09220330goes0im.jpg

Models show 'massive devastation' in Houston
Damages could cost up to $50 billion -- 10 times Allison's cost
By ERIC BERGER
Copyright 2005 Houston Chronicle


Houston's perfect storm would feed on late summer's warm waters as it barreled northward across the Gulf of Mexico, slamming into the coast near Freeport.

A landfall here would allow its powerful upper-right quadrant, where the waves move in the same direction as the storm, to overflow Galveston Bay. Within an hour or two, a storm surge, topping out at 20 feet or more, would flood the homes of 600,000 people in Harris County. The surge also would block the natural drainage of flooded inland bayous and streams for a day or more.

Coastal residents who ignored warnings to flee would have no hope of escape as waters swelled and winds roiled around their homes. Very likely, hundreds, perhaps even thousands, would die.

Meanwhile, as the storm moved over western Harris County, its most dangerous winds, well in excess of 120 mph even inland, would lash the Interstate 45 corridor, including Clear Lake, the Texas Medical Center and downtown.

Many older buildings could not withstand such winds.

Anything not tied down, from trees to mobile homes to light poles, would become missiles, surreally tumbling and flying through the air, flattening small houses, shattering skyscraper windows and puncturing roofs.

"Unfortunately, we're looking at massive devastation," said Roy Dodson, president of the engineering firm Dodson & Associates, which Harris County asked to model realistic "worst-case scenarios" for a major hurricane hitting the area.

Dodson's firm modeled more than 100 storms of varying power, speed and landfall. It concluded that a large Category 4 or Category 5 -- a storm only moderately larger than the four that struck Florida last summer -- would cause as much as $40 billion to $50 billion in damage. That's 10 times the cost of Tropical Storm Allison and approximately the city of Houston's entire budget for the next 15 years.

And this wasn't an academic exercise. Of the 17 Category 4 and Category 5 storms that have struck the United States since 1900, three, all Category 4 storms, have hit the Greater Houston area -- unnamed storms in 1900 and 1915 and Carla in 1961.

Coastal development

With considerable coastal development since then and lower elevations because of groundwater pumping, no one knows what will happen when a major storm hits. But what's clear is that models of a hurricane's three modes of destruction -- winds, storm surge and inland flooding from heavy rainfall -- offer little comfort.

With sustained winds between 131 mph and 155 mph, the power of a Category 4 storm exceeds that of most building codes.

Houston's commercial building rules call for structures to withstand three-second bursts of at least 110 mph, said Dennis Wittry, managing director of Houston Structural Operations at Walter P. Moore, an engineering firm.

Newer skyscrapers, including many built during Houston's downtown boom in the '80s, were modeled in wind tunnels to determine their performance in extreme weather events. Most should survive the storm, Wittry said. And the downtown window loss like that experienced during Hurricane Alicia, a Category 3 storm that struck in 1983, actually could be less in a bigger storm.

That's because roofs that were then anchored by gravel -- which become bullets in high winds -- are now held down by specialized concrete that should not blow off, Wittry said.

Residential homes, built with less exacting standards and lesser materials, would fare worse.

"You'll definitely see more significant damage in residential construction," he said. "Lower-end homes, or some homes in older areas, would probably be completely destroyed."

Tie-downs, a structural device that prevents wind blowing over a structure, creating a vortex and sucking off the roof, have been mandatory only since the late 1980s, Wittry said.

Various studies of a large storm hitting the Houston area have estimated that 100,000 to 125,000 homes would be destroyed.

20-foot wall of water

More devastation would be caused by winds blowing over the Gulf of Mexico and pushing surface water inland -- creating up to a 20-foot storm surge. Such a wall of water would swamp most development near Galveston Bay, including Texas City, Kemah and Johnson Space Center. Varying levels of water would flood much of the area between Sam Houston Parkway and the bay.

On Galveston Island, the seawall could hold back much of the storm surge, but at some point the water would creep onto the island from the bay side. The island's highest point is just 22 feet above sea level.

Much like a river becomes deeper and more turbulent when it narrows, a storm surge also can increase in height and intensity when its source of water narrows. Dodson said this has profound implications for the Port of Houston. Some models ended with a 30-foot wall of water in the Ship Channel near the port's turning basin, he said. "It would be huge," he said. "It could overwhelm chemical storage facilities, water treatment plants and other sensitive areas."

The port's severe-weather plan calls for most cargo ships to exit the facility and weather the storm at sea in preparation for the possibility of flooded buildings.

waves expert at Texas A&M University at Galveston, Vijay Panchang, said he and colleagues were surprised when they observed wave data associated with Hurricane Ivan shortly before it slammed into Alabama last September.

A wave-measuring buoy about 60 miles south of Dauphin Island, before it snapped, registered an average wave height of about 50 feet, Panchang said. That means the biggest waves were a staggering 100 feet tall. Such wave heights, according to his modeling, should only occur every 300 years or so.

Either Ivan's waves were a freak event, or hurricane forecasters may need to adjust their wave expectations for large storms in the warm Gulf waters.

"This is from a storm that hit only a few hundred miles to the east of us," he said. "There's nothing to say that another storm won't create really big waves for us."

These large waves caused by Ivan may have been as responsible, if not more so, than the storm surge for severely damaging the I-10 bridge bear Pensacola, Fla., Panchang said.

Surprises after landfall

Engineers and forecasters say the most unpredictable element of a storm comes after landfall, when it either dumps rain and floods creeks and bayous or moves quickly enough that relatively little rain falls.

Tropical Storm Allison probably isn't a good model for what to expect. The system was so poorly organized and slow moving that some hurricane forecasters say it wasn't a tropical storm. In some areas of the city, enough rain fell to classify Allison as a 10,000-year rainfall event. Still, because a large hurricane's storm surge likely would block the flow of bayou waters into Galveston Bay, any significant rainfall could back up into inland streets and homes quickly, Dodson said.

The last major hurricane most Houston residents remember was Alicia, which made landfall on the west end of Galveston Island in August 1983.

Unfortunately, planners say, as devastating as that storm was, it's a poor predictor of what to expect from a larger, Category 4 or bigger storm.

Alicia's highest sustained winds on land were measured at 96 mph. Most of the Greater Houston area received just 5 inches of rain. Storm surges across much of the area were less than 10 feet, although Seabrook measured 12 feet.

The storm spawned 23 tornadoes, killed 21 people and destroyed 2,300 homes.

"Alicia was a marginal Category 3," Dodson said. "Its rainfall doesn't come close to this area's top 20 historical floods.

"I guess what I'm saying is that I hope people don't ignore evacuation warnings because they remember that things weren't apocalyptic during Alicia."

Houston Cronicle (http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/metropolitan/3046592)

Let's not make the same mistakes as were made with Katrina. Rita is a killer and people in Houston and Galveston, Texas City, Freeport, Bay City and the surrounding areas need to evacuate.

[Nbadan]

Free Housing!!

http://www.hurricanehousing.org/results.html?zip=78705&distance=50

For anyone who is looking for a place to evacuate out of Houston or the Coastal region. It's sponsored by moveon.org so you'll probably get to smoke and drink more than with a right-winger, no promises though ..... but seriously, we all know Rita is a monster. Please pass this link along to anyone in serious need.

[Charlie]

How come the basement is not an option anymore?

[Triumph]

i agree with dan...will wonders never cease...good post dan. :tu

[ididnotnothat]

How come the basement is not an option anymore?

Do homes even come with basements these days?

[Marcus Bryant]

There's a mandatory evacuation in effect. All major roads out of Houston heading west and north are being made one way.

[Nbadan]

Traffic lanes jammed out of Houston, cars breaking down and running out of gas. Josh Marshall thinks we could be another day away from another national disgrace...


September 22, 2005 -- 12:53 PM EDT

TPM Reader LH reports in ...

A brief note on the evacutation of the Houston area. Galveston and all the coast was successfully evacuated but Wednesday night there occured throughout Houston a simultaneous mass (hysterical) evacuation. All the freeways and highways leaving Houston are at a dead standstill as of 11am Thursday. People have been in their vehicles as long as 12 hours without traveling more than 40 miles. Now they are running out of gas and there will soon be another chaotic storm evacuation situation. The local government and the mayor of Houston don't seem to realize that cars need gas and folks need facilities. The city has waited too long to open all freeway lanes to outbound traffic. The truth is, the feds, state, and locals do not know how to evacuate a major metropolitan area. Another catastrophe is only a day away.

Let's hope not.

-- Josh Marshall

Talking Points Memo (http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/week_2005_09_18.php#006606)

[Ocotillo]

Did anyone see the UT computer models of what will happen to Galveston if they get a direct hit. It was as mesmerizing as watching that JetBlue airliner land.

[Nbadan]

Houston chronicle Hurricane blog (http://blogs.chron.com/rita)

Scary traffic stories so far. Sitting in traffic for many hours, little or no gas or bottled water left, poor people without buses. Sounds depressingly familiar.

[Ocotillo]

I am in Waco today and have run into some folks evacuating. The stories are true. One woman's nephew left Baytown yesterday at 11:00am and got to Waco at 4:00am.

[DrRich]

Funny, I saw on GMA this morning video footage of Galveston using thier school buses to drive people out of Galvestion. And IH10 and IH45 are now one way from Seguin and Buffalo, respectively. So the traffic is moving a little more smoothly, but still really slow I'm Sure. Gas trucks are also being deployed.

WOAI Reporting (http://www.woai.com/news/local/story.aspx?content_id=A4FF4611-992E-432A-93CE-C1EB99D55AB7)

Governor Rick Perry says fuel trucks are being dispatched along Texas evacuation routes to help motorists who are fleeing Hurricane Rita.

Perry today announced the fuel will be available, such as along Interstate 45, where some drivers have run out of gas due to the slow traffic flow.

The Texas Department of Transportation’s (TxDOT) San Antonio and Yoakum Districts are working in conjunction with Alexander Oil to provide fuel to motorists traveling down IH 10. TxDOT has stationed 14 trucks along IH 10, which will provide stranded motorists with 5 gallons of fuel, enabling them to reach Seguin. Motorists will be able to refuel in town. The Texas Department of Transportation will be providing this service until it is no longer required.

Perry also spoke to President Bush today and asked that ten-thousand federal troops be pre-positioned to help Texas before and after Rita makes landfall.

That's in addition to the five-thousand Texas national guard troops that the governor has called to duty.

Also, Texas authorities have begun airlifting special needs and other people from the Beaumont and Houston areas -- about nine-thousand folks.

Homeland security officials say those evacuees will be transported to San Antonio, Amarillo, El Paso, Dallas, Fort Worth and Lubbock.

I guess we see just how prepared state and local officials should be!! What a novel thought: using school buses to evacuate people!! :rolleyes

[Nbadan]

Moving people in buses from Galveston to Houston is hardly a rescue plan, but whatever floats your boat, oh and by the way, if Louisiana had the resources that Tx does I'm sure Governor Blanco would have done anything that was necessary. Neither the City of NO, nor the State of Louisiana own school buses. Remember that New Orleans evacuated 80% of its residents in 2 days with minimal federal assistance, hummm, I wonder how many Houstoners have made it out of town so far?

[DrRich]

You mean the 180 buses in NO that were under water because the mayor didn't use them?

[Marcus Bryant]

Oh, so now there were no school buses in NO. :lol

[Nbadan]

The City/State did not own those buses, they are privately owned, but that's something Sean Hannity always forgets to mention.

Meanwhile, the evacuation of Houston seems to be going just maaaarrvelooussss..check out this Houston highway cam...

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/9255/houston4vb.jpg

This is just a few minutes old.

Houston TransGuide (http://traffic.houstontranstar.org/cameras/camtext.aspx)

[Marcus Bryant]

Doesn't matter. The buses were at the city and state's disposal had they actually prepared.

Adjust your tinfoil hat, kiddo.

[Marcus Bryant]

The City/State did not own those buses, they are privately owned, but that's something Sean Hannity always forgets to mention.

Meanwhile, the evacuation of Houston seems to be going just maaaarrvelooussss..check out this Houston highway cam...

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/9255/houston4vb.jpg

This is just a few minutes old.

Houston TransGuide (http://traffic.houstontranstar.org/cameras/camtext.aspx)


What should Houston have done differently?

[Nbadan]

What should Houston have done differently?

Used the school buses!

:lol

[Nbadan]

Doesn't matter. The buses were at the city and state's disposal had they actually prepared.

Adjust your tinfoil hat, kiddo.

We've gone through this before, but if you care to rehash old arguments, do so at your own peril. Where were these school buses, with no air conditioning, no bathrooms, and no plans for gas beyond what was already in the gas tanks going to go? I heard a caller ask Jeff Bolton that question on OAI one day, and the only answer he had was North...North where? There was no regionally coordinated evacuation plan for New Orleans, as unfortunately, there seems to be no Federally coordinated evacuation plan for Houston.

[Marcus Bryant]

Presumably they would have ended up someplace better than 12 feet below sea level. Duh.

[SpursWoman]

Presumably they would have ended up someplace better than 12 feet below sea level. Duh.


Well, they could piss in it, anyway. :fro

[Nbadan]

Presumably they would have ended up someplace better than 12 feet below sea level. Duh.

Yeah. like along the stretch of I-10 that ended up in the Gulf.

:rolleyes

[DrRich]

I'm sure you guys have covered this before in the multiple blame Bush threads, but where exactly does to sy it is the federal governments job to have an evacuation plan for one particular city. I would be under the assumption that that is the city and state gorvernments job. I know go there at my own peril.

[DrRich]

Yeah. like along the stretch of I-10 that ended up in the Gulf.

:rolleyes

By that time the buses were also under water. If the buses had been used, they would have been out of NO by the time the hurricane hit. BTW, Dan you do know there are other roads besides I-10 out of NO, right?

[Marcus Bryant]

Yeah. like along the stretch of I-10 that ended up in the Gulf.

:rolleyes


Please. If NO had evacuated ahead of the storm like Galveston did then that wouldn't be a problem.

[Nbadan]

I'm sure you guys have covered this before in the multiple blame Bush threads, but where exactly does to sy it is the federal governments job to have an evacuation plan for one particular city. I would be under the assumption that that is the city and state gorvernments job. I know go there at my own peril.

It says so in the WH written, National Response Plan and the Stafford Act, but beyond that, the Federal government is the only entity with the resources and the coordination level already in place to deal with a crisis on this nature. Right now, the highways out of the Galveston-Houston gulf coast region should be being directed out by National Guard. Private buses should be commandeered by FEMA and the sick and elderly should be moved away from the SE Texas area.

If predictions come true that this thing stalls out in SE Texas, as I think it will, we could have a real catastrophe on our hands soon.

[DrRich]

Dan, once again you have such a positive outlook on life? Remind me to come to you when I need a pep talk!

[Nbadan]

Please. If NO had evacuated ahead of the storm like Galveston did then that wouldn't be a problem.

There are still people in Galveston thinking that a 15 foot sea wall is going to protect them. Some parts of Galveston have no sea wall at all.

The point is, is that there is no coordination for massive civilian evacuation by the Federal Government. They should be taking a much more pro-active role by delivering fuel to gas stations, delivering drinking water to stations along the highway, mobile hospital facilities should aready be operating in West Texas. People should be encouraged to car pool. HOL lanes should be reserved for commercial buses headed out of town only.

[2pac]

Dan - why do you hate America?

BTW: Looks like I am sitting it out in the long haul. You gonna tell me how I am supposed to feel, and the hardships I am really facing, because you seem to give everyone else their opinion.

[Nbadan]

Dan, once again you have such a positive outlook on life? Remind me to come to you when I need a pep talk!

I don't think people quiet understand the consequences of what is going to happen. 16 of 18 refiners in the area have already shut down production because of Rita. As I am typing this there is gas-shock reverberating through-out TX as officials try and pump as much fuel as they can into the Houston area. Get ready to sit in gas lines, and that's if you can find it.

[Nbadan]

Dan - why do you hate America?

BTW: Looks like I am sitting it out in the long haul. You gonna tell me how I am supposed to feel, and the hardships I am really facing, because you seem to give everyone else their opinion.

Look, I have been telling everyone for weeks to prepare for something like this. A year ago I posted that a hurricane was headed for the Galveston-Houston area. Some people like Cecil Collins chose to take my advice, others chose to just mock me. Whatever, we are all grown adults who have to live with our own decisions, right?

Good luck to you bro, where-ever you are.

:hat

[Marcus Bryant]

The people who think a 15 foot sea wall in Galveston is going to protect them despite ample opportunity to evacuate have made a choice. Are you arguing that FEMA should round up people and put them in concentration camps? You better adjust that tin foil.

[SpursWoman]

Look, I have been telling everyone for weeks to prepare for something like this. A year ago I posted that a hurricane was headed for the Galveston-Houston area. Some people like Cecil Collins chose to take my advice, others chose to just mock me. Whatever, we are all grown adults who have to live with our own decisions, right?

Good luck to you bro, where-ever you are.

:hat


You predict a hurricane in the peak of hurricane season and now all of the sudden you're psychic? And that somehow it took some sort of extra-sensory perception to figure that the Gulf might be due for one? Damn, Dan....that's pretty funny. :lmao

[Nbadan]

You predict a hurricane in the peak of hurricane season and now all of the sudden you're psychic? And that somehow it took some sort of extra-sensory perception to figure that the Gulf might be due for one? Damn, Dan....that's pretty funny. :lmao

You know it's a little more than that SW. I named New Orleans and Galveston-Houston in particular despite the fact that no hurricane has gone into the NW Gulf in some years. Next Hurricane season, I'll give you the opportunity to name the major metropolitan centers that will be affected by Hurricanes, and we'll see how well you do.

[SpursWoman]

You know it's a little more than that SW. I named New Orleans and Galveston-Houston in particular despite the fact that no hurricane has gone into the NW Gulf in some years. Next Hurricane season, I'll give you the opportunity to name the major metropolitan centers that will be affected by Hurricanes, and we'll see how well you do.


Unless you can show me a picture of you holding the winning ticket of that $250 million Mega Millions jackpot, I ain't buyin' it. :lol

[Dos]

I predict there will be a hurricane next year probably on the gulf coast...

thanks,
Nbadan

[Marcus Bryant]

danny boy also predicted a Kerry victory brought on by a great progressive surge across the continent.

BTW...I saw a loaf of bread priced at greater than $5 yesterday. Thus, my prediction of a bread shortage brought on by a major gulf coast hurricane has come true and my crystal balls are infalliable.

That, or I went to a Central Market.

[MannyIsGod]

You know it's a little more than that SW. I named New Orleans and Galveston-Houston in particular despite the fact that no hurricane has gone into the NW Gulf in some years. Next Hurricane season, I'll give you the opportunity to name the major metropolitan centers that will be affected by Hurricanes, and we'll see how well you do.
You're a fucking moron. You predicted it? You're so full of shit. Is there anything you don't take credit for predicting? You want to see a real prediction? Check out my last post in my blog, and the date.

[scott]

I theorize the hurricane strikes can be predicted using the circular representation of Phi, the Golden Ratio.

However, I don't have the time or interest to prove it. You will have to take my word for it, and when I'm right give me proper credit.

[Nbadan]

I theorize the hurricane strikes can be predicted using the circular representation of Phi, the Golden Ratio.

However, I don't have the time or interest to prove it. You will have to take my word for it, and when I'm right give me proper credit.

Well, that's good enough for me.

:hat

[Nbadan]

danny boy also predicted a Kerry victory brought on by a great progressive surge across the continent.

BTW...I saw a loaf of bread priced at greater than $5 yesterday. Thus, my prediction of a bread shortage brought on by a major gulf coast hurricane has come true and my crystal balls are infalliable.

That, or I went to a Central Market.

:lol

Gore won in 2000, if not for the Supreme Court being a Republican-controlled court, W wouldn't of even had a chance in 04 and Kerry would have been a moot point. Although I still contend that Kerry did win - history will prove me right eventually. I can't help it that the Republicans stole both elections. I just calls them as I sees them.

Progressivism is the next big political movement, you just haven't realized it yet. Give it a couple years. You'll come around.

Congratulations on your loaf of bread prediction. Amazing.

[Marcus Bryant]

So your prediction was incorrect.

Also, you have to factor in that the Illuminati and Bilderbergers wanted Kerry, so that's a 10% handicap right there.

[Nbadan]

So your prediction was incorrect.

Also, you have to factor in that the Illuminati and Bilderbergers wanted Kerry, so that's a 10% handicap right there.

I really think you believe that shit, but those of us in the sane world know that it's not hard to change e-votes with no paper trail. Especially when the E-voting companies are sympathetic to your cause and leave gapeing back doors for you to manipulate votes, but alas, I'm wasting key strokes, this requires critical thinking and you have yet shown to possess any.

[Nbadan]

Many Stuck on Way Out of Houston
Filed at 6:33 p.m. ET


HOUSTON (AP) -- Wilma Skinner would like to scream at the officials of this city. If only someone would pick up their phone....

***

With Hurricane Rita breathing down Houston's neck, those with cars were stuck in gridlock trying to get out. Those like Skinner -- poor, and with a broken-down car -- were simply stuck, and fuming at being abandoned, they say.

''All the banks are closed and I just got off work,'' said Thomas Visor, holding his sweaty paycheck as he, too, tried to get inside the store, where more than 100 people, all of them black or Hispanic, fretted in line. ''This is crazy. How are you supposed to evacuate a hurricane if you don't have money? Answer me that?''

Some of those who did have money, and did try to get out, didn't get very far.

Judie Anderson of La Porte, Texas, covered just 45 miles in 12 hours. She had been on the road since 10 p.m. Wednesday, headed toward Oklahoma, which by Thursday was still very far away.

''This is the worst planning I've ever seen,'' she said. ''They say, 'We've learned a lot from Hurricane Katrina.' Well, you couldn't prove it by me.''...

NY Times (http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/national/AP-Rita-Stuck-in-Houston-HK1.html?oref=login)

[Nbadan]

President Carter says Gore won 2000 election
John Byrne


Former U.S. president Jimmy Carter delivered a shocker at an American University panel in Washington Monday: RAW STORY has learned he told the crowd he was certain Al Gore won the 2000 presidential election.

There is "no doubt in my mind that Gore won the election," the erstwhile President declared, saying the 2000 election process "failed abysmally."

He also snubbed the Supreme Court for getting involved, saying it was "highly partisan."


The NORC hand count done by the University of Chicago shows clearly that even if you ignore all of the clearly double-punched ballots--and there were around 50,000 of these and they were clearly meant to go to Gore--that Gore still won the election.

NORC didn't say this: all they did was categorize each ballot and report the totals. So if a ballot had been marked "not counted" by the machine counts, they would examine the ballot and categorize it. Like "three corner hanging Chad for Gore" or "one corner hanging Chad for Bush."

Their results found several thousand ballots that had clear votes--no hanging chads, no problems whatsoever--that the machines simply didn't count, possible because the ballot itself wasn't cut to spec. Counting those ballots, which were 100% undisputable, because they were punched just like the ballots that were counted--Gore won.

Counting hanging chads marked for one candidate or another Gore won, in almost every combination you could find of how to determine the intent of the voter. The only way Bush won Florida in 2000 was if the only recounts were in the heavily democratic Counties as Gore had asked the court (And the Court ruled it would not do, and then instead extending the recount to ALL Counties).

It appears the Democratic Counties actually counted their votes accurately, Gore NOT getting enough votes to overcome Bush's lead. The problem for Bush was in the GOP controlled Counties, it appears all of the GOP votes were counted BUT MANY OF THE DEMOCRATIC VOTE HAD NOT BEEN COUNTED.

Thus Gore picked up the votes he needed to win NOT in the Democratic Counties but in the GOP controlled Counties (Thus Gore should have asked for a full-recount NOT a partial recount). Furthermore the only way Bush would have won Florida was the only one a Florida Judge said HE WOULD NOT HAVE PERMITTED.

In short, the NORC count showed that if Florida law had been followed and all votes had been counted (don't say recount, because we are talking about votes that were not counted at all, much less recounted) Gore would have won the electoral votes.

Remember, even the Supreme Court unanimously said that there were legally cast votes that were never counted in their Bush v Gore decision. But by a 5-4 margin, the Court ruled that the votes didn't have to be counted to decide the election.

[whottt]

Progressivism is the next big political movement, you just haven't realized it yet. .


Dan...you are about as progressive as Cotton Mathers, Mr. Hurricane predictor....You are not progressive...you are a hysterical knee jerk alarmist/conspiracy theorist...that's not progressive.

I'll make my prediction for you...You are going to end up as one of those guys that stands on a street corner holding a sign predicting that the world will end that day..

[Nbadan]

Dan...you are about as progressive as Cotton Mathers, Mr. Hurricane predictor....You are not progressive...you are a hysterical knee jerk alarmist/conspiracy theorist...that's not progressive.

I'll make my prediction for you...You are going to end up as one of those guys that stands on a street corner holding a sign predicting that the world will end that day..

:rolleyes

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones Whott.

[Spurminator]

Judie Anderson of La Porte, Texas, covered just 45 miles in 12 hours. She had been on the road since 10 p.m. Wednesday, headed toward Oklahoma, which by Thursday was still very far away.

''This is the worst planning I've ever seen,'' she said. ''They say, 'We've learned a lot from Hurricane Katrina.' Well, you couldn't prove it by me.''...

I agree, they should have either ordered the mandatory evacuation 2 months ago or built more highways last week.

Why is it that the idiots are the most often quoted?

[Yonivore]

I agree, they should have either ordered the mandatory evacuation 2 months ago or built more highways last week.
:lmao Or, better yet, they should have completed development, testing, and deployment of a Star Trek type transporter system as soon as Rita reached Cat 5 status.


Why is it that the idiots are the most often quoted?
Because they most reflect the sensibilities of the media doing the interview.

Y'know, someone with a little ingenuity and an updated version of Microsoft Maps and Streets could get out of Houston and all the way to Austin without ever getting on a major thoroughfare. And, do so in about 3 to 3 1/2 hours. I guarantee some of the roads I've used to get there and back are flowing just fine...a lot of them don't have names and aren't on any printed map.

[Marcus Bryant]

Y'know, someone with a little ingenuity and an updated version of Microsoft Maps and Streets could get out of Houston and all the way to Austin without ever getting on a major thoroughfare. And, do so in about 3 to 3 1/2 hours. I guarantee some of the roads I've used to get there and back are flowing just fine...a lot of them don't have names and aren't on any printed map.

The roads aren't on any map and yet the evacuees must be castigated for not using them?

[Yonivore]

Great Scott! Where's Dr. Emmett Brown when you need him?

[Yonivore]

The roads aren't on any map and yet the evacuees must be castigated for not using them?
I wouldn't be on I-45, I-10, US-59, or US-290...

Hey, if those with the means -- brains and a computer -- would use them and find an alternate route, those without the means would be fine. And, I didn't say "any map," I specifically said, "any printed map." For Christ's sake, it's the 21st century. If you don't have Microsoft Streets, go to the friggin' library and map out a route on Google Earth or Mapquest or maps.google.com...

Baaaa Baaaa Baaaa get me out of here, I can't think for myself! Baaaa Baaaa Baaaa! That's all I hear from these people that are complaining about sitting on the road.

[Spurminator]

I would guess just about every road is packed. Most of those back roads are one lane and don't have gas tankers waiting on cars who run out of gas.

[Yonivore]

I would guess just about every road is packed. Most of those back roads are one lane and don't have gas tankers waiting on cars who run out of gas.

If I had the time and inclination (and gas money), I'd prove to you that I could get to US-290 and Loop 610, in Houston, and back in less than 7 hours.

[Marcus Bryant]

I wouldn't be on I-45, I-10, US-59, or US-290...

Hey, if those with the means -- brains and a computer -- would use them and find an alternate route, those without the means would be fine. And, I didn't say "any map," I specifically said, "any printed map." For Christ's sake, it's the 21st century. If you don't have Microsoft Streets, go to the friggin' library and map out a route on Google Earth or Mapquest or maps.google.com...

Baaaa Baaaa Baaaa get me out of here, I can't think for myself! Baaaa Baaaa Baaaa! That's all I hear from these people that are complaining about sitting on the road.


Your post wasn't that clear. Yeah, I agree about trying to find alternate routes.

[Marcus Bryant]

I would guess just about every road is packed. Most of those back roads are one lane and don't have gas tankers waiting on cars who run out of gas.

True. Also, if I am not mistaken, some of the roads you'd have to use would go down closer to the coast.

[Useruser666]

Just drive on the beach till you hit Florida. :lol

When the impossible is what you need, all you can do is your best. I would probably left early if I was in the area in danger. I also think that some people further inland are evacuating unnecessarily and causing log jams for those closer to the coast.

If I were trying desperately to get out and I10 was blocked like it has been, I would drive on the access road's shoulder on the lanes headed in the opposite direction if I had too.

[RandomGuy]

Houston chronicle Hurricane blog (http://blogs.chron.com/rita)

Scary traffic stories so far. Sitting in traffic for many hours, little or no gas or bottled water left, poor people without buses. Sounds depressingly familiar.

It's those damn local officials again. Oh wait, they're Republicans, so they MUST have their s*** together...
:rolleyes

[SpursWoman]

Ya'll are exactly right. They should have waited until today to start evacuating instead of, like MONDAY.

[Crookshanks]

Look folks - anyone who has lived or visited Houston knows that there is traffic gridlock every single workday. The highway systems are simply not built to handle the mass numbers of vehicles trying to leave. At least 2 million are trying to evacuate - that's a lot of cars!

Why must people always place blame? Sometimes bad things happen that are out of the control of anyone - especially the Federal Government!

[ChumpDumper]

Are San Antonians hording supplies like Austinites? It's like they think we're going to be underwater this weekend.

[SpursWoman]

Are San Antonians hording supplies like Austinites? It's like they think we're going to be underwater this weekend.


Yes...it's horrible. I had to pick up a prescription last night, not early but right on schedule...and the line was huge and the pharmacy employees were going bananas....

All the bottled water, bread & toilet paper were GONE. :wow :wow

[Nbadan]

Are San Antonians hording supplies like Austinites? It's like they think we're going to be underwater this weekend.

Hoarding food and supplies locally now is just going to compound a bad situation. Prepare now for high gas and electricity prices. When Rita is done we are going to have to rebuild chunks of SE Texas.

[Crookshanks]

I place the blame on the local news media for inciting widespread panic in San Antonio. By the looks of the lines at the grocery stores and gas stations and the fact that you probably can't find batteries, bottled water, or toilet paper in any of the stores, you'd think we were in the direct line of the hurricane! We probably won't get anything but a FEW scattered showers.

Too many people in San Antonio are dumb sheep!!

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Y'all are fucking idiots. As someone who has travelled to Houston for business roughly 20 times in the last 4 months, let me just say that traffic always sucks in Houston.

3 million people. THREE MILLION PEOPLE. Traffic sucks in Houston pretty much anytime between 7 AM and 6 PM. And that's with multiple loops and roads criss crossing Houston.

Now take all that traffice, and strip it down to essentially 2 roads out of town.

The fact that it's a traffic gridlock isn't surprising to anyone with a brain. But hey they shouldn't have started evacuating until noon today anyway.

Some of y'all are just downright comical in your expectations for the transportation system of this country. Our highways are designed for normal day to day travel, not to evacuate a total of about 4 million people (Houston + surrounding areas) in a few hours.

[Nbadan]

I place the blame on the local news media for inciting widespread panic in San Antonio. By the looks of the lines at the grocery stores and gas stations and the fact that you probably can't find batteries, bottled water, or toilet paper in any of the stores, you'd think we were in the direct line of the hurricane! We probably won't get anything but a FEW scattered showers.

Too many people in San Antonio are dumb sheep!!

People really don't take the time to really inform themselves, but then again you have those wishful thinkers like some of those in the Club that were actually hoping, frothing at the mouth practically, that the Hurricane would head South. Kinda makes ya wonder what the hell they are thinking.

[Spurminator]

There's hoarding in Dallas too.

People want to be afraid.

[Spurminator]

It's those damn local officials again. Oh wait, they're Republicans, so they MUST have their s*** together...
:rolleyes

So do they or don't they?

[spurster]

My sister "only" took 14 hours to drive from Houston to SA yesterday (4am to 6pm). I say only because she did indeed mostly take offroads north of I10. They were packed, but still moving.

[ChumpDumper]

All the bottled water, bread & toilet paper were GONE.Won't it all get soaked when SA is under 20 feet of water?[/panicked numbskull]

[SpursWoman]

That was my thought when I saw the wiped out shelves. (pun intended)

:lol

[ChumpDumper]

[envisions thousands of unopened toilet paper packages floating down Broadway toward downtown]

[Extra Stout]

The NY Times has to bash Houston because it is a red-state city. Texas has been getting a lot of good press lately, and Pravda-on-the-Hudson can't let that stand unchallenged. Texas is supposed to be a third-world hellhole, because it is conservative, with the exception of Austin, which of course is an oasis of super wonderfulness.

They haven't figured out that the mayor is a Democrat. Once they figure that out, they will sing the praises about Houston's wonderful plan and how well it was executed.

So predictable.

At this hour, as the first rain bands approach Houston, the freeways are pretty much empty. Virtually everyone is out of harm's way.

And let's be clear on "harm's way." Thanks to media sensationalism, people think the entire Houston area was going to be obliterated by a major hurricane. Of course, that's not true. There is a significant area of town to the east and southeast which is prone to storm surge, and the areas near the bayous tend to flood. The key is getting those folks to higher ground. Then there are the folks in mobile homes who have to get into a more secure structure.

That has happened. There are some people in safer areas of town who panicked because of Katrina, and want out. Government has to focus on helping the people in the most danger, and not on catering to the most hysterical people. Outside of the areas prone to storm surge and flooding, the best option is to shelter in place. These folks "trapped" in Missouri City and Bellaire are simply hysterical or misinformed.

And while it would be nice to get to Aunt Myrtle's house in Dallas where evacuees get home cooking and a feather mattress, the priority in the evacuation was protecting life. The evacuation plan assumed that getting people out of harm's way would take 33 hours once a mandatory evacuation was called. That was achieved. Yes, it was ugly, hot, and frustrating. There were snafus with the gas tankers and the contraflow that delayed those parts pf the plan. But they got done before the storm hit. The snarled traffic was two days before the storm, not during the storm. The people who ran out of gas either have been rounded up on buses or have been located in area shelters in counties north and west of town. As long as people got at least 10 miles inland or out of the flood zone, and ride out the storm in a decent building, they'll be fine, though obviously uncomfortable and frustrated.

It looks like Houston is going to miss the worst of the storm. I guarantee you that the liberal media will claim that tens of thousands would have died in a direct hit because of incompetent local Republicans and President Bush (somehow), when in reality the evacuation plan was executed rather effectively.

[whottt]

They haven't figured out that the mayor is a Democrat. Once they figure that out, they will sing the praises about Houston's wonderful plan and how well it was executed.


And stick Nagin's neck in the noose when they do it(where it deserves to be BTW)...by all means I hope they do. Leaders who aren't fucking incompetent deserved to be praised...even if they are a Democrat.


I find it hard to believe that Mayor got elected in Houston without appealing to the Republican base though...


And someone else who has earned my respect during both of these Hurricanes is Rick Perry...I thought this guy was a total asshat when he was doing jersey retirements for the Spurs...but he's done a great job of mobilizing the State Response plan and getting the Texas cities to work together.

[whottt]

The Mayor of Galveston is also kicking Nagin's ass.

[Extra Stout]

"They got them for the outlying areas, for the Gulf and Galveston, but they ain't made no preparations for us in the city, for the poor people here. There ain't no (evacuation) buses here. I got nowhere to go." While of course the NY Times is happy to give the impression that Houston is abandoning its poor people, what they don't tell you is that Ms. Skinner gave this interview while on Bellaire Boulevard, ON HIGH GROUND, in SW Houston. That is not an evacuation zone.

I don't expect Ms. Skinner to be an expert on urban topography. She may be scared and frustrated, but the point is she's in a safe area. I expect local and state officials to have their priorities straight and go after people who NEED to be evacuated rather than those who WANT to be evacuated. Thus, Galveston, and areas near the bay, the Ship Channel, and the bayous took priority.

If they'd found an abandoned poor person in the flood-prone northeast side, they'd have a story. But the NY Times doesn't have a story, just an agenda and a distortion.

[Extra Stout]

Judie Anderson of La Porte, Texas, covered just 45 miles in 12 hours. She had been on the road since 10 p.m. Wednesday, headed toward Oklahoma, which by Thursday was still very far away.

"This is the worst planning I've ever seen," she said. "They say, 'We've learned a lot from Hurricane Katrina.' Well, you couldn't prove it by me."If she left 10 PM Wednesday, that would put this report on 10 AM Thursday.

Now it's Friday at 4. Houston-area highways are mostly clear. Even being 45 miles north of La Porte got Ms. Anderson out of the storm surge area. I doubt there will be a follow-up report about how Ms. Anderson successfully reached Oklahoma.

Remember, the Houston/Galveston evacuation plan assumes it will take 33 hours to get people out. That's why they started on Wednesday. That's why we saw traffic jams two days before the storm rather than during the storm.

What the biased NYT did here was take one frustrated, hysterical person and use her to make a false and misleading political point.

[Spurminator]

I think Julie Anderson was interviewed by the AP because I've seen her quote in several stories.

[Extra Stout]

I think Julie Anderson was interviewed by the AP because I've seen her quote in several stories.I think the AP picked up the NYT story.

[SpursWoman]

oasis of super wonderfulness.


:lol :lol

[Extra Stout]

I find it hard to believe that Mayor got elected in Houston without appealing to the Republican base though...The city of Houston leans Democrat. It's the suburbs that are 80% Republican.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

It's messed up seeing the traffic cam of Houston at rush hour with no cars on the roads.

[hussker]

:lol

Gore won in 2000, if not for the Supreme Court being a Republican-controlled court, W wouldn't of even had a chance in 04 and Kerry would have been a moot point. Although I still contend that Kerry did win - history will prove me right eventually. I can't help it that the Republicans stole both elections. I just calls them as I sees them.

Progressivism is the next big political movement, you just haven't realized it yet. Give it a couple years. You'll come around.

Congratulations on your loaf of bread prediction. Amazing.

Hopefully, the Commissioner of MLE (Major League Elections) will eventually revoke the asterisk...Oh, I am sorry, there isn't one! Maybe we should petition to invoke one! :lol

[spurster]

I think the AP picked up the NYT story.
Extra Stout, it' s an AP story, not a NYT story. Like a lot of newspapers, the NYT also has all the AP stories available. You'll have to blame the liberal AP on this one.