Who Gets Booted to Make Room for Kevin Martin

[BillMc]

We've all been talking about this for days (and I'm procrastinating work BIG time) so who do you think ultimately goes:

Bonner?

Butler?

Simmons?

Someone else?

[SpursforSix]

I think it SHOULD be Bonner. But I think it's probably 50/50 between him and Butler.

[BillMc]

Yeah, Yeah I typed "Matin" instead of "Martin"....

[BatManu20]

Timmy

[BillMc]

Timmy

Yeah, he's been a passenger on this train long enough. Old Man River can Walk.

[TXstbobcat]

The red mamba

[100%duncan]

Bonner please, do us all a solid.

[sananspursfan21]

I'm thinking that Duncan guy...

[TDomination]

I want it to be Bonner but I bet it ends up being Butler

[NameLess Scrub]

Unless Pop knows something we don't about how useful he can be in the playoffs, it should be Bonner.

[Kikoluna]

Kyle Anderson.

[Old School 44]

I think it has to be Bonner.

- Simmons is young/athletic and has potential. Don't give up on him yet.
- Butler is older and hasn't played on a championship team. If he were to get waived, he wouldn't be playoff eligible for a team that would sign him. I just don't think the FO would do that to him. He is still new to the Spurs, so him getting waived and coming immediately back as a coach/front office guy isn't likely.
- If Bonner is waived, he can easily transition to the front office/coaching for the team. He's the only one of the three players in question that can readily come back to the team without being on the active roster.

[baseline bum]

Statistically Bonner is the much better player, but Butler sure seems like it to the eye test. And Butler has played twice as many games and 3.5 times as many minutes.

[Mikeanaro]

Who knows but its taking too long I say Bon Bon or maybe Miller I´ve heard his dribbling sucks and he missed the ball like 4 times in a row during last game.

[Mouth is Bleeding]

It should not be Bonner.

There is still that remote chance he could play some clever role in some kind of playoff matchup. Remember stretching Ibaka? And he can guard big men decently within the defensive system and rebound which Butler can't. I'm not saying it's likely that he will be needed at all but he can be thrown in there in ways and doing things that others can't. Or rather when it comes to Butler, there are players who can do everything that he can do and better, Bonner isn't good but at least he is a specialist.

Also there is the stellar reputation and legend of the Spurs franchise that prides itself being different and more like a family. It's not just business, there is more to it and like it or not Bonner has become one of "our" own. A Spur. He wants to keep playing and we don't crush his dreams just like that for the sake of a marginal journeyman who is going from team to team.

[Fireball]

if he had not made these two threes coming from the bench stone cold I would say Bonner, but right now I am not sure anymore

[will_spurs]

I say Simmons.

[Mouth is Bleeding]

Bonner also does all-right taking up minutes against the physicality of Howard and frustrating him with his ginger-whiteness if that's a match-up.

At least there is a chance he can provide some specialist value. Butler is better and much more of an all-rounder but there is nothing special about him unfortunately.

[Leetonidas]

Might as well cut Tim, dude is pretty much just a statpadder now tbh

[TheDoctor]

Kyle Anderson.

SAGirl:
https://knockturnalemissions.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/2ey9flyjpg.gif

[Dex]

I figured it was pretty much a foregone conclusion that Bonner would be the one getting cut for Martin.

Then on Saturday, Pop goes ahead and gives Bonner his most minutes of the season while relegating Butler to a minute of mop-up action.

Oi...

[K...]

Simmons. What he has shown is nothing unique. His special skill was passing. But his lack of fundamentals and his age make him a low topside value. Also he will be claimed, thus the spurs get some saving n

I wouldn't bet money on this though, this is just my gut.

On Bonner being claimed....imagine you think he'd be a good coach. Claim him. Convince him to stay. It's worth it I think if you need a coaching prospect. Pop coaching tree is as hot as ever and player coaches like like Walton, Fisher, and Kidd suggest teams are ok with inexperienced former players

[Kawhitstorm]

Statistically Bonner is the much better player, but Butler sure seems like it to the eye test. And Butler has played twice as many games and 3.5 times as many minutes.

It's as simply as Butler being a better defender/more versatile scorer (what's need against the Worriers) & the team not needing another undersized scoring PF. If you just need a guy for the purposes of stretching the floor ala Luke Babbit then Bonner would be a no brainer.

[venitian navigator]

Till some day ago, the obvious choice was Bonner. I like the red rocket but this would still be my choice (maybe a wrong one, considering how well he knows the system).

Now, considering the role of Martin, the man out could be Simmons.
Martin gives what Simmons is supposed to give on offense (going at the rim) but looks like the best shooter, expecially from three point range.
If it goes this way, it would be a choice for offense ('cause defensively Simmons is, or should be, much much better).

I liked Butler a lot and imho, considering how good his defense and understanding of the system has been, and considering he is a good three point shooter, he should not be cut...but i agree the choice could be made evaluating if Butler is able to be give the team the some thing of Bonner (alias be a stretch four).

[timtonymanu]

Simmons.

Pop started him last game, but unfortunately Simmons didn't contribute much. That was his last chance.

I'm not sure why people think Pop playing Bonner over Butler last game means Butler is gone, though? Wouldn't it have made more sense to play Butler heavy minutes if the team was trying to let him go?

[SAGirl]

I voted Butler, but I am probably wrong. It's really between Simmons and Matt.

Matty has one elite nba skill still, he is still an elite 3 pt shooter. Butler is not the shooter Matty is, but he's more versatile defensively, which fits our switching defenses better that is why he's played more, and specially lately, Pop trusted him over Simmons, so I find Pop very reluctant to let him go. This is why I am probably wrong in predicting Butler.

Simmons is really a guy for next season. This late in the season he's unlikely to figure in the playoffs bc he still needs development. I think he's a prospect they still like, and he would not have been cut any other season, but they are in a position now to have to cut Matt who can still knock down a 3 pt shot and space the floor. You can never tell for sure with Matt bc he's stayed ready and has been knocking down shots all season.

To cut Matt at this point Pop has to make a judgement on how much upside he believes Simmons still has and how much better he can get. I believe they asked him to clean up the mistakes and he has, so even though he's been underwhelming lately, they have perhaps seen an improvement they wanted to see enough to keep him.

So end of the line, it might be Matt but I am not certain.

[TheGreatYacht]

Fat head

[BillMc]

It's kind of getting to be like an Agatha Christie mystery. Ten Little Indians. Who will be the next to go...

[BillMc]

I kind of wonder if it should be Andre Miller. It won't be though.

[timtonymanu]

I kind of wonder if it should be Andre Miller. It won't be though.

Tbh, I keep forgetting the Spurs have him. :lol

But yeah, Pop wouldn't do that either. And it seems like Martin and Miller have gotten close on the Timberwolves.

[Keepin' it real]

who gets booted ..

Boban.

[houston spurs fan]

Simmons, no question

[spurraider21]

Porker, tbh

- lefty

[K...]

Let's talk about reasons...who is least valuable? Simmons.

Who is the best guy to cut to show free agents the spurs are loyal: Simmons

Who is the best guy to cut for future value: Bonner

Butler is also a good mentor for KA. He has value next year for that reason.

[YGWHI]

Rasual is tight with DWest and LMA, Simms with the young guys on the team, everyone in Spurs organization loves Bonner...This wait can't be good for the three players or the team chemistry.

[tmtcsc]

I just can't see cutting a guy like Simmons who has so much upside. Bonner probably wouldn't be on the team next year and Butler is more versatile. If Bonner gets cut, there shouldn't be any hard feelings. 2 rings / 3 trips to the finals plus a million reasons in dollar bills not to cry.

[timtonymanu]

I just can't see cutting a guy like Simmons who has so much upside. Bonner probably wouldn't be on the team next year and Butler is more versatile. If Bonner gets cut, there shouldn't be any hard feelings. 2 rings / 3 trips to the finals plus a million reasons in dollar bills not to cry.

Bonner is who I'm hoping gets cut, but we've been anticipating his last year as a Spur for how long now that I'm convinced will never end. :lol

[Solid D]

Probably Butler, unless the Spurs offer Matt a staff position and he agrees. Butler has been a much better contributor this season, however.

[MoSpur]

Butler

[steeledl]

When will we know..... I'd be bummed if it's anyone but Bonner. If it's Simmons, I'd be hurt .

[BillMc]

Do you really cut someone on a road trip? Seems awkward. Does he have to fly home on his own? But Martin should be available tomorrow, so....

[buttsR4rebounding]

If everyone would forget about Simmons being the D-League tournament MVP and just look at his NBA body of work and his age then it becomes obvious that he will not be a difference maker or be more than a 2nd tier bench player. Martin will take any minutes he would have gotten going forward. So if the focus is on winning THIS year he is the obvious choice.

[Leebrix]

Don't even know why Simmons is in the discussion tbh. Head of the juice unit! Lol. He's young and has alot of future potential. He's hadd a rough couple weeks but has played great all year. Will become better with couple years exp.

Cut Bonner.

[DMC]

SAGirl:
https://knockturnalemissions.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/2ey9flyjpg.gif


Oh LAWD has MERCY dat PO CHILD!

[FaM0us Skins]

Bonner.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Probably Butler, unless the Spurs offer Matt a staff position and he agrees. Butler has been a much better contributor this season, however.


Butler is infinitely more valuable for matchups against the Clips and Warriors.

We'd also be hosing a veteran who came on the cheap.

In short, this would be a terrible move by the front office on multiple fronts.

You waive Bonner with a gentlemen's agreement to put him on the end of the bench as a coach.

[K...]

Don't even know why Simmons is in the discussion tbh. Head of the juice unit! Lol. He's young and has alot of future potential. He's hadd a rough couple weeks but has played great all year. Will become better with couple years exp.

Cut Bonner.

He was the juice unit. He's not the only young player with upside. He won't play this year and no guarantee he'll play next year.

[Darius Bieber]

I kind of wonder if it should be Andre Miller. It won't be though.

Eh, we need a third PG in case something happens to Patty or Tony (God forbid)

[Texas_Ranger]

think it'll be Butler.... hope for Bonner. But to tbh, none of this players will do shit in the playoffs, so idc really.

[baseline bum]

We'd also be hosing a veteran who came on the cheap.


It's not really hosing Butler. He was a minimum player last year too on the Wizards. Though I'm mildly rooting for him to stay over Bonner.

[dbestpro]

looking at the 12 man rotation I say if Pop wants to use Boban in the playoffs, he will let Butler go, if he wants to use Butler, he will let Bonner go. Either way Bonner is not going to be on the 12 man playoff roster. Simmons will stay, but will not be on the 12 man roster, either.

[slick'81]

Sure as fuck isnt bon bon

[TDomination]

think it'll be Butler.... hope for Bonner. But to tbh, none of this players will do shit in the playoffs, so idc really.

i disagree

if simmons was able to play like he was earlier in the year, he would be a HUGE spark off the bench in the playoffs. I could see Butler playing a few important minutes in the playoffs and same goes for Bonner (especially if we play Thunder)

it might just be a few minutes and just a few games but sometimes those few minutes can make a difference between a W or an L.

The longer this goes on, the less sure i feel about who is going to be cut.

[cjw]

Simmons is fully non-guaranteed at $875k this offseason. Very valuable either as an end of rotation guy at a controlled cost, or as a trade piece if a team is eagerly looking to free up cap space heading into free agency.

For example, Spurs are unlikely to be players in FA next year. The Spurs will be over the tax around the draft (limits incoming salary to about $1.2 million) and under the tax once the league year starts ($1.4 million of incoming). If Simmons isn't in their plans for next year, at the very least he'd be a tradable contract that can be cut for nothing until the end of July for a team looking to cut salary. Not saying it will happen, but there's a reason RC structured the contract that way. He had all the bargaining power.

Spurs will be required to tap into the MLE to sign Boban. Don't think he'll be cut, but he has significantly less value going forward than he did this year at a higher price tag.

[BillMc]

The longer this goes on, the less sure i feel about who is going to be cut.

This long delay is possibly for one of two reasons:

1) They had to wait on Martin for some reason (probably to pass his physical, but could be something else)

2) They wanted to make some type of arrangement for the guy about to be cut. You wouldn't make such an arrangement for journeyman Butler or a d-league guy like Simmons. It would only be the case if they were trying to get Bonner to retire and take a FO/coaching position. Bonner, who said at the beginning of the season he'd like to play one or two more years might want to think about if he really wanted to hang it up and accept a position with the Spurs or hope to catch on with another team next year. They might have given him a few days to consider it especially if they new there would be a delay in Martin making his debut.

[Old School 44]

This long delay is possibly for one of two reasons:

1) They had to wait on Martin for some reason (probably to pass his physical, but could be something else)

2) They wanted to make some type of arrangement for the guy about to be cut. You wouldn't make such an arrangement for journeyman Butler or a d-league guy like Simmons. It would only be the case if they were trying to get Bonner to retire and take a FO/coaching position. Bonner, who said at the beginning of the season he'd like to play one or two more years might want to think about if he really wanted to hang it up and accept a position with the Spurs or hope to catch on with another team next year. They might have given him a few days to consider it especially if they new there would be a delay in Martin making his debut.

Based on the poll results, if it's not Bonner, get ready for the meltdown threads.
:wakeup

[BillMc]

Based on the poll results, if it's not Bonner, get ready for the meltdown threads.
:wakeup

Yes, the "Bonner's Still Here" outrage would be amusing. :lol

[Mugen]

I'd be shocked if it wasn't Butler or Simmons tbh.

[benefactor]

Based on the poll results, if it's not Bonner, get ready for the meltdown threads.
:wakeup
People have been melting down over Bonner for the better part of a decade now. Wet water is wet tbh.

[Anonymous Cowherd]

I don't get why it wouldn't be Butler. If we don't cut him, how does he keep getting minutes with K-Mart now in the rotation?
And this isn't like it's his first time taking the min, so it's not a snub. And we signed him up as a min pickup, it's not like he left money on the table to join us. And with Miller already joining at 39 and K-Mart being 33, we shouldn't be cutting someone in their mid-twenties.

[Uriel]

I cannot, for the life of me, understand this message board's love affair with Rasual Butler. While it's true that Matt Bonner is no longer a significant contributor, it's also true that he's a niche player that possesses a skill set that is useful in certain matchup situations (e.g. Serge Ibaka).

Butler has played well this season. But if we keep him, he will be one among 7 wing players on the roster, which is a logjam, to say the least. Butler is the most expendable.

[HarlemHeat37]

I cannot, for the life of me, understand this message board's love affair with Rasual Butler. While it's true that Matt Bonner is no longer a significant contributor, it's also true that he's a niche player that possesses a skill set that is useful in certain matchup situations (e.g. Serge Ibaka).

Butler has played well this season. But if we keep him, he will be one among 7 wing players on the roster, which is a logjam, to say the least. Butler is the most expendable.

Butler is probably a better PF/C than Bonner, right now..

[spurs10]

Well I'm sure it hasn't been easy but they obvious thought Miller and Martin were worth grabbing. My original thought was Matt because he hasn't been playing and he's toward the end of his career. I've also been impressed with Butler being able to step right in and be effective right of the bat. I could see Pop being more inclined to play Butler over Simmons in these playoffs, but Simmons is a good semi-young prospect for the future. So.............I have no clue! :downspin:

[BillMc]

Oops wrong thread.

As someone just said Butler and Bonner both inactive tonight. Interpret that however you wish.

[HarlemHeat37]

I've been one of the biggest Bonner defenders on this forum for years, but did everybody forget how bad he looked, last season? He played 900+ minutes, which is a sufficient sample size, and he looked terrible, overall..

[spursistan]

706993771058216960
Could be final look at Simmons??

[Dex]

At this point, my gut says it's gonna be Butler. :pctoss

I know Martin makes him pretty redundant, but still...he came in and provided a nice shot in the arm for the team. Feels kinda dirty to just leave him hanging high and dry now...dude obviously has championship aspirations, and unlike Bonner, doesn't really have a place with the team if he gets waived.

Still....a lot of worrying being done over the 13th-15th guys on the team. #SpursFanProblems

[benefactor]

Butler is probably a better PF/C than Bonner, right now..
:lol...exactly. I have no idea why people keep comparing Butler and Martin when they aren't even close to being the same player. Martin is a better version of Simmons, which is why many people have said he's the one getting cut.

[timtonymanu]

Goodbye, Simmons.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Danny Green

[SAGirl]

706993771058216960
Could be final look at Simmons??
I think they have already made up their mind and don't need to see anyone in particular.
Could be any number of things... Exposure for Simmons so he can picked up by another team, as well as more development time for him if we reach garbage time same as Spurs have done all season.

Its impossible to infer anything other than they don't need to see anything and the decision is made.

[Uriel]

I've been one of the biggest Bonner defenders on this forum for years, but did everybody forget how bad he looked, last season? He played 900+ minutes, which is a sufficient sample size, and he looked terrible, overall..
Bonner had a tennis elbow last season, which explains why his 3-pt shooting was so bad last year (36%), and why it's considerably better this year (55%).

Rasual Butler has also been a net negative for the team (-0.87 RPM) while Bonner has been a huge positive (+1.39).

[HarlemHeat37]

Bonner had a tennis elbow last season, which explains why his 3-pt shooting was so bad last year (36%), and why it's considerably better this year (55%).

Rasual Butler has also been a net negative for the team (-0.87 RPM) while Bonner has been a huge positive (+1.39).

Using Bonner's numbers for a 100 minute sample size is silly, bro:lol

[tholdren]

Bonner had a tennis elbow last season, which explains why his 3-pt shooting was so bad last year (36%), and why it's considerably better this year (55%).

Rasual Butler has also been a net negative for the team (-0.87 RPM) while Bonner has been a huge positive (+1.39).

if you get tennis elbow, and suck at basketball you should get cut. sorry bonner

[sasaint]

Lots of guys competed for the honor tonight.

[spurtech09]

Tony Parker

[Ice009]

Is there still no cut?

What the fuck are these idiots doing?

[cutewizard]

Parker...................lol

[spursistan]

Simmons friggin begging to get cut..

[spursistan]

J Simms can't buy a dunk :lol..

[Spurtacular]

Anderson should've been a spot in the poll, tbh.

[Spurs9]

Anderson should've been a spot in the poll, tbh.

Agreed

[tholdren]

bye bon-bon

[Spurtacular]

I kind of wonder if it should be Andre Miller. It won't be though.

Won't even be a consideration, tbh. A fun compelling thought though.

[pgardn]

SAGirl:
https://knockturnalemissions.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/2ey9flyjpg.gif

This is good stuff!

[BillMc]

Won't even be a consideration, tbh. A fun compelling thought though.

Not after tonight. He's a keeper.

[spursistan]

My last prediction: I think it is going to be Butler, sadly....

[Kawhitstorm]

It DOESN'T matter, who ever ISN'T cut is going to be rotting on the bench ala CoJo/Ayres/Bonner come postseason time.

The REAL roster is:

Tim
LMA
Kawhi
Danny
Porker

West
Diaw
K-Mart/Fat Head
Manu
Patty/Dr. Dre

[Spurtacular]

Not after tonight. He's a keeper.

Even before tonight. They got him to match up with Livingston.

[MultiTroll]

Parker and Bonner.
In the playoffs leading to a Championship, Boban will ave 14 minutes and continue his PER of 30.
Simmons will have several highlight reel slams in the Finals.

[BillMc]

Well, you figure the cut HAS to be made today, doesn't it?

[ceperez]

Messina may have telegraphed the decision by actually playing Bonner first and playing Butler only in garbage time..

Too bad, looks like the Butler is gone.

[ceperez]

I cannot, for the life of me, understand this message board's love affair with Rasual Butler. While it's true that Matt Bonner is no longer a significant contributor, it's also true that he's a niche player that possesses a skill set that is useful in certain matchup situations (e.g. Serge Ibaka).

Butler has played well this season. But if we keep him, he will be one among 7 wing players on the roster, which is a logjam, to say the least. Butler is the most expendable.

The logic here is that when Spurs go against GSW, you may need those bigger wing players.

[playbonner15]

LOL Bonner's here to stay suckas.

I like Razzy though :(

[turb0time]

Bonner was automatic last night lmao.

[NASpurs]

Just cut someone already ffs, I don't give a fuck who it is anymore.

[Ice009]

Just cut someone already ffs, I don't give a fuck who it is anymore.

lol. It's getting ridiculous if you ask me. Just freaking cut someone and get Martin on board so he can start integrating himself into the team.

[gameFACE]

Bonner hitting treys all of a sudden and Simms giving facials. Playing for their basketball lives. Butler only 5 minutes last night......

[Dex]

Well, Twitter has just devolved into a bunch of nobodies tweeting various sources and asking if they know what's going on with KMart.

As if JMac or Stein is just waiting around for someone to ask them to be like, "Oh thanks So-And-So, here is the news that people have been asking about for the past week"

[ceperez]

Butler cut.... like I said... Messina telegraphed the decision. http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/241137/Spurs-Waive-Rasual-Butler-To-Create-Kevin-Martins-Roster-Spot

[SAGirl]

Butler cut.... like I said... Messina telegraphed the decision. http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/241137/Spurs-Waive-Rasual-Butler-To-Create-Kevin-Martins-Roster-Spot
I will give,you this one ceperez! :tu
I predicted Butler too earlier in this thread but with little conviction. POP has played him a lot lately and he had helped us to a few wins. I don't think the decision was easy, but as I said he had demonstrated to be streaky and Bonner raining all those 3s made it unlikely.

I knew it wasn't red rocket.

[Obstructed_View]

Yeah, the poll should have either said who SHOULD be booted or who WILL get booted. Even though most of us knew who it should be, I had a sinking feeling of who it would end up.

[ceperez]

I will give,you this one ceperez! :tu
I predicted Butler too earlier in this thread but with little conviction. POP has played him a lot lately and he had helped us to a few wins. I don't think the decision was easy, but as I said he had demonstrated to be streaky and Bonner raining all those 3s made it unlikely.

I knew it wasn't red rocket.

I would have preferred PATFO kept Butler.

However, watching what happened in the Wolves game, it was obvious who was getting cut.

[davidbowie]

bonner is spur royalty. easy decision.

[BillMc]

We have our survivors.

https://usatftw.files.wordpress.com/2014/12/screen-shot-2014-12-20-at-9-57-17-pm.png

http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/dam/assets/150721005721-20150720-starters-jonathan-simmons-vegas-championship-game-mvp-00015912.video-player.jpg

[Anonymous Cowherd]

obvious choice is obvious.

[spursistan]

I will give,you this one ceperez! :tu
I predicted Butler too earlier in this thread but with little conviction. POP has played him a lot lately and he had helped us to a few wins. I don't think the decision was easy, but as I said he had demonstrated to be streaky and Bonner raining all those 3s made it unlikely.

I knew it wasn't red rocket.

To great extent Butler inability to hit the 3 at good clip eventually clinched his demise..And, in general, this team needed to address the 3pt shooting as the 3-15 nights are starting to become a worrying trend..neither Mills/Green has shown consistency, too, so might as well have somebody in the Bellini/Neal mode at you disposal as TD 21 (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=17781) has been harping on....let's hope K Mart thrives in that role..

[MultiTroll]

Wonder if any black players have considered filing an employment discrimination case?

[Solid D]

Lol vote count for Butler went from 29 after the announcement to 31. I guess two people didn't want to be wrong.

[Obstructed_View]

Lol vote count for Butler went from 29 after the announcement to 31. I guess two people didn't want to be wrong.

:lol one of those was me. I voted when I came in to comment.

[Solid D]

:lol one of those was me. I voted when I came in to comment.

Haha. No biggie