NBA: 1986 Celts vs 2014 Spurs [Archive]

Killakobe81

03-24-2016, 08:36 PM

Those 72 win Bulls team are overrated. The 92 Bulls were the best of the Bulls.

85 wasn't that great. Bad boys probably won't stand the test of time because of the way they introduced thug ball, which is why I consider daly to be one of the best coaches of all time.

92 Bulls, 83 Sixers, 01 Lakers, 87 Lakers and 86 Celtics were legit though. I'd throw in the Walton Blazers, and even the Reed Knicks. Those were some devastating team.s

I agree actually on 92. but what made the 72 version filthy want Rodman who was overrated if you ask me (bulls not Pistons version) but Pippen was in his prime while MJ was at the end of his. in 92 Jordan was abeast but Pip was nowwhere as good as he was on the 72 team. That is also why the 2001 Laker team was so deadly becuase Kobe became a 1B in 2000. Kobe was the clear #2

Spurtacular

03-24-2016, 09:14 PM

Those 72 win Bulls team are overrated. The 92 Bulls were the best of the Bulls.

85 wasn't that great. Bad boys probably won't stand the test of time because of the way they introduced thug ball, which is why I consider daly to be one of the best coaches of all time.

92 Bulls, 83 Sixers, 01 Lakers, 87 Lakers and 86 Celtics were legit though. I'd throw in the Walton Blazers, and even the Reed Knicks. Those were some devastating team.s

All those teams you mention would kick the 01 Lakers ass though. The 01 Lakers (technically 02) basically needed the refs mercy to survive the Kings, who had their 1A playing injured.

ambchang

03-24-2016, 10:01 PM

I agree actually on 92. but what made the 72 version filthy want Rodman who was overrated if you ask me (bulls not Pistons version) but Pippen was in his prime while MJ was at the end of his. in 92 Jordan was abeast but Pip was nowwhere as good as he was on the 72 team. That is also why the 2001 Laker team was so deadly becuase Kobe became a 1B in 2000. Kobe was the clear #2

Stop putting your Kobe bullshit in here. 2001 lakers were great because shaq was a one man wreaking crew. Kobe was 1b until 2003, when shaqs dominance declined. 2001 shaq had one of the greatest seasons ever and you had to say Kobe was a 1b that year. And you wonder why people don't take you seriously?

96 Pippen was great but 96 Jordan was no where near the 92 Jordan.

Killakobe81

03-24-2016, 10:51 PM

Stop putting your Kobe bullshit in here. 2001 lakers were great because shaq was a one man wreaking crew. Kobe was 1b until 2003, when shaqs dominance declined. 2001 shaq had one of the greatest seasons ever and you had to say Kobe was a 1b that year. And you wonder why people don't take you seriously?

96 Pippen was great but 96 Jordan was no where near the 92 Jordan.

Calm your ass down, clown ... you do realize you agreed with me, that Kobe was the 1B? Shaq was dominant in 2000 yet the Blazers pushed us to 7 in the WCF and Sacto pushed us to a last game in the first round as well if iirc. I am not here saying that shaq wasnt the dominant force of the 3 peat ... same with MJ in 1992 but when you are talking about what makes a TEAM truly dominant its the quality of the #2 that makes a difference. You are always talking team accomplishment all the time but what makes truly all time great teams it's not just the quality of the #1 it's the quality of the #2
That is why for me the 85 Lakers were the better team than 87 because 85 Kareem was superior to the 87 version. Worthy was better in 87, sure but Cooper was also better in 1987 athletically.

Back to the 2001 LakersShaq's dominance didnt mean shit when the Lakers were getting swept by the Jazz and the Spurs. It took Kobe getting closer to his level for us to become dominant as a team.
That is the same for the 72 bulls as good as MJ was in 1992 Pippen was not a reliable scorer and MJ had to do a whole bunch more he wasnt even as good a play-maker in 92 ...Pip got more dominant as the Bulls continued to win.

I'll be honest Amb I am disappointed you took a simple statement and turned it in to Kobe bashing bullshit. We were having a good discussion about all-time great teams and then had to ruin it.
My comment was not taking anything away from Shaq who was a truly dominant player but until Kobe became one as well the Lakers were getting swept by a choker like Mailman because he had a great #2 ...get the point? Or was the one-man wrecking crew not good enough to beat a player that everyone on here bashes repeatedly?
It was Until kobe became great that the those Lakers became great ...that was a fact. Shaq was already dominant. Fox and horry were established role players. We even had Glen Rice a proven shooter. But our role players like horry couldnt help Shaq win he needed that #2 ...just like Lebron needed Wade.
and I would say out of the teams mentioned above the best ones have great #2's.

86 Celts McHale
72 win bulls prime pippen
2001 Lakers Frobe
85 Lakers Kareem
87 Lakers Worthy
83 Sixers Dr.J

That is where you seperate the great teams ...

Killakobe81

03-24-2016, 11:10 PM

All those teams you mention would kick the 01 Lakers ass though. The 01 Lakers (technically 02) basically needed the refs mercy to survive the Kings, who had their 1A playing injured.

WTF you talking about? We are talking the 2001 team that went 16-1 through the playoffs. they swept Sacramento. Please get out of this thread if you do not know your facts, no disrespect.

2001 Lakers had Shaq (by the playoffs) in dominant form ...
Fisher who was rested from a broken foot bombing 3's all over the spurs in the playoffs ...
Horry in his prime
Fox at the end of his ...
Kobe ascendant ...

I think you can make a case for the 2001 Lakers being at least a top 3 or 4 dominant team, tbh.

Killakobe81

03-24-2016, 11:13 PM

Those 72 win Bulls team are overrated. The 92 Bulls were the best of the Bulls.

85 wasn't that great. Bad boys probably won't stand the test of time because of the way they introduced thug ball, which is why I consider daly to be one of the best coaches of all time.

92 Bulls, 83 Sixers, 01 Lakers, 87 Lakers and 86 Celtics were legit though. I'd throw in the Walton Blazers, and even the Reed Knicks. Those were some devastating team.s

How old are you? :lol
Did you actually see those teams play? And if you did... your Kobe hate makes more sense .to me now. if you watched those teams play even as kid of course Kobe's ball dominant ways would rub you the wrong way ...although not sure why Mj's ways dont do the same ...but whatever.

Killakobe81

03-24-2016, 11:22 PM

Those 72 win Bulls team are overrated. The 92 Bulls were the best of the Bulls.

85 wasn't that great. Bad boys probably won't stand the test of time because of the way they introduced thug ball, which is why I consider daly to be one of the best coaches of all time.

92 Bulls, 83 Sixers, 01 Lakers, 87 Lakers and 86 Celtics were legit though. I'd throw in the Walton Blazers, and even the Reed Knicks. Those were some devastating team.s

ESPN had them ranked 7th alltime a few years back behind the 1987 squad and the 86 Celts and the 72 win Bulls but when you say wasnt that great that seems dismissive to me. I think they are better than the 1983 Sixers tbh ...

Kawhitstorm

03-24-2016, 11:43 PM

I think you can make a case for the 2001 Lakers being at least a top 3 or 4 dominant team, tbh.

The 2001 Lakers faced:

-A dysfunctional Blazers squad that was equivalent to the current Rockets
-A Kings squad w/ Jason Williams committing more turnovers than assists:lmao
-A Spurs squad w/ a geriatric supporting cast & without it's 2nd leading scorer

The 2001 Sixers were a Vince 3 away from being bounced in the 2nd rd & beat the Bucks only b/c of the Zebras. Those same Sixers had a chance to win the first 3 games (Gm 3 was for the taking until the final second); they went down 2-1 after Horry hit the dagger 3 in Gm 3 & never recovered.

Kirby was pretty ordinary when he FINALLY went up against a team w/ hard-nosed perimeter defenders & ACTUALLY had to play defense on the other end. He was more inefficient that Iverson who was playing 1-on-5 on offense.:lmao (Reggie/Ray Allen/Vince fared MUCH BETTER against the Sixers than Kirby)

The 2004 Pistons would have been the 2001 Lakers kryptonite b/c they played the same brand of defense as the Sixers except with better personnel & had perimeter players that would make Kirby work while making his life miserable on the other end.

Killakobe81

03-24-2016, 11:50 PM

The 2001 Lakers faced:

-A dysfunctional Blazers squad that was equivalent to the current Rockets
-A Kings squad w/ Jason Williams committing more turnovers than assists:lmao
-A Spurs squad w/ a geriatric supporting cast & without it's 2nd leading scorer

The 2001 Sixers were a Vince 3 away from being bounced in the 2nd rd & beat the Bucks only b/c of the Zebras. Those same Sixers had a chance to win the first 3 games (Gm 3 was for the taking until the final second); they went down 2-1 after Horry hit the dagger 3 in Gm 3 & never recovered.

Kirby was pretty ordinary when he FINALLY went up against a team w/ hard-nosed perimeter defenders & ACTUALLY had to play defense on the other end. He was more inefficient that Iverson who was playing 1-on-5 on offense.:lmao (Reggie/Ray Allen/Vince fared MUCH BETTER against the Sixers than Kirby)

The 2004 Pistons would have been the 2001 Lakers kryptonite b/c they played the same brand of defense as the Sixers except with better personnel & had perimeter players that would make Kirby work while making his life miserable on the other end.

That blazers team was uber talented ... this year's Rox is not even close even those Jwill Kings were also better.
Prime Cwebb is a better player than Harden. they also had a better coach and role players.
LOL NO WAY THOSE Pistons beat the 2001 Lakers ... but whatever. Cant be proven. but I do notice spur fan always tries to discredit teams when they dont like them. It's the same whining about the Warriors last year or the Heat in 2013 ... yawn.

Kawhitstorm

03-24-2016, 11:57 PM

That blazers team was uber talented ... this year's Rox is not even close even those Jwill Kings were also better.
Prime Cwebb is a better player than Harden. they also had a better coach and role players.
LOL NO WAY THOSE Pistons beat the 2001 Lakers ... but whatever. Cant be proven. but I do notice spur fan always tries to discredit teams when they dont like them. It's the same whining about the Warriors last year or the Heat in 2013 ... yawn.

Bruh, you claimed those Lakers were top 3 & I gave you a rebuttal. The 2001 Sixers would have been swept by an all-time top 5 squad while not breaking 90.

Killakobe81

03-25-2016, 12:02 AM

Bruh, you claimed those Lakers were top 3 & I gave you a rebuttal. The 2001 Sixers would have been swept by an all-time top 5 squad while not breaking 90.

I said a case can be made I didnt say I would make it ...
Losing one game is a dumb argument especially when that Laker steam had almost 2 weeks off before the first Finals game.
Also didnt the 2014 Spurs get pushed to 7 games in round one? :wakeup
The 86 Celts did not sweep a shitty rox teams that had multiple guards who were rumored to be snorting cocaine:lol

We can do that all day.Cherry pick losses that makes X team not so dominant. I am taking the 2001 Lakers mostly because of Shaq but Kobe was rising the role players were filthy clutch ... over everyone sans 80's Lakers/Celts and Mj's Bulls. just my opinion arguing hypotheticals on the internet bores me. You said your piece I said mine let's move on.

If you want to pick apart a great Lakers team the repeat Kobepau Lakers were very good but outside of the Rox probably the weakest team to repeat as champs ...
yet they did it and the great 2014 Spurs were one shot away ... and didnt finish. They did.

I do think the 2014 spurs were than THOSe Laker teams.

UNT Eagles 2016

03-25-2016, 12:10 AM

:lol JJ Reddick
:lol Guests

Kawhitstorm

03-25-2016, 12:44 AM

I said a case can be made I didnt say I would make it ...
Losing one game is a dumb argument especially when that Laker steam had almost 2 weeks off before the first Finals game.

I CLEARLY stated the Sixers had a chance to win the first THREE games. Gm 3 came down to an Horry 3 w/ under a minute & the Sixers still had a chance to send it to OT. Once they lost Gm 3, they lost all the momentum the had from Gm 1.

Also didnt the 2014 Mavs get pushed to 7 games in round one? :wakeup

Yeah, the Spurs weren't sleep walking (esp. Porker w/ his dribble, dribble) b/c it was a 1st rd series against an opponent they had trashed in the regular season. The Mavs had all the momentum going into Gm 7 & absolutely got trashed by the REAL Spurs squad.

The 86 Celts did not sweep a shitty rox teams that had multiple guards who were rumored to be snorting cocaine:lol

Dummy, Cocaine is a performance ENHANCING drug. Plus, the Rockets also had Hakeem/Sampson to go up against the Chief/McHale. Oh, they only beat your beloved Lakers in 5.

We can do that all day.Cherry pick losses that makes X team not so dominant. I am taking the 2001 Lakers mostly because of Shaq but Kobe was rising the role players were filthy clutch

Kirby in '00-01 wasn't better than Iverson, Ray Allen, Vince, Pierce, T-Mac so let's not act like he was 2006 Wade or some shyt. His Finals appearance have been underwhelming when he had to expend energy on defense: 2001, 2004, 2008, 2010.

Yob7Ov9-wW0

If you want to pick apart a great Lakers team the repeat Kobepau Lakers were very good but outside of the Rox probably the weakest team to repeat as champs .

MVPau was MARGINALLY better than Kirby in 2010:lmao

http://dberri.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/nbafinals2010.jpeg

Killakobe81

03-25-2016, 12:53 AM

I CLEARLY stated the Sixers had a chance to win the first THREE games. Gm 3 came down to an Horry 3 w/ under a minute & the Sixers still had a chance to send it to OT. Once they lost Gm 3, they lost all the momentum the had from Gm 1.

Yeah, the Spurs weren't sleep walking (esp. Porker w/ his dribble, dribble) b/c it was a 1st rd series against an opponent they had trashed in the regular season. The Mavs had all the momentum going into Gm 7 & absolutely got trashed by the REAL Spurs squad.

Dummy, Cocaine is a performance ENHANCING drug. Plus, the Rockets also had Hakeem/Sampson to go up against the Chief/McHale. Oh, they only beat your beloved Lakers in 5.

Kirby in '00-01 wasn't better than Iverson, Ray Allen, Vince, Pierce, T-Mac so let's not act like he was 2006 Wade or some shyt. His Finals appearance have been underwhelming when he had to expend energy on defense: 2001, 2004, 2008, 2010.

MVPau was MARGINALLY better than Kirby in 2010:lmao

http://dberri.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/nbafinals2010.jpeg

Sure, cocine is a helluva drug ...in my rick James voice.

Just ask Len Bias how much it helps.

I am done. Agenda is an agenda.

not getting in to any Kobe debates amb tried that shit. We are talking the 2001 Lakers and shaq was shitting on every team he faced as long as he did not get in foul trouble. including dikembe and those sixers. Kobe provided the defense play-making and the role guys clutch shooting. Out of the teams i have seen with my own eyes they are arguably top 5. You disagree? Make your own list.

Kawhitstorm

03-25-2016, 01:00 AM

Just ask Len Bias how much it helps.

Len Bias had a heart problem that was induced by cocaine. Energy drinks can cause the same effect.:lol

We are talking the 2001 Lakers and shaq was shitting on every team he faced as long as he did not get in foul trouble.

Oh, we're going to act like Tim didn't drop 40/15/3/4 (15-26) compared to his 19/14/4/1 (8-21) in Gm 2 of the WCF? :lol (Tim was getting triple teamed in the 4th quarter while Admiral or Rose were playing Shaq 1-on-1 w/ Tim on the weakside)

Tim whooped his ass in '99 when it was a fair fight, neutralized him in 2001 while playing 1-on-5, outplayed him & Kirby in 2002 when he was undermanned & ended their *tainted* 3peat single handily in 2003. (Kirby was playing 1-on-1 the entire time:lol)

*Tim was injured in 2000 & the Kings got hosed by the refs in 2002.

Thread

03-25-2016, 02:42 AM

Tim was injured in 2000 & the Kings got hosed by the refs in 2002.

Only pussies & assholes blame injuries & the officiating.

Kawhitstorm

03-25-2016, 02:48 AM

Only pussies & assholes blame injuries & the officiating.

Only sore losers claim asterisk after actually PLAYING in the postseason, being a 100% healthy & not having any officiating controversies.:lol

Thread

03-25-2016, 03:12 AM

Only sore losers claim asterisk after actually PLAYING in the postseason, being a 100% healthy & not having any officiating controversies.:lol

Only pussies & assholes blame injuries & the officiating.

ambchang

03-25-2016, 06:21 AM

Calm your ass down, clown ... you do realize you agreed with me, that Kobe was the 1B? Shaq was dominant in 2000 yet the Blazers pushed us to 7 in the WCF and Sacto pushed us to a last game in the first round as well if iirc. I am not here saying that shaq wasnt the dominant force of the 3 peat ... same with MJ in 1992 but when you are talking about what makes a TEAM truly dominant its the quality of the #2 that makes a difference. You are always talking team accomplishment all the time but what makes truly all time great teams it's not just the quality of the #1 it's the quality of the #2
That is why for me the 85 Lakers were the better team than 87 because 85 Kareem was superior to the 87 version. Worthy was better in 87, sure but Cooper was also better in 1987 athletically.

Back to the 2001 LakersShaq's dominance didnt mean shit when the Lakers were getting swept by the Jazz and the Spurs. It took Kobe getting closer to his level for us to become dominant as a team.
That is the same for the 72 bulls as good as MJ was in 1992 Pippen was not a reliable scorer and MJ had to do a whole bunch more he wasnt even as good a play-maker in 92 ...Pip got more dominant as the Bulls continued to win.

I'll be honest Amb I am disappointed you took a simple statement and turned it in to Kobe bashing bullshit. We were having a good discussion about all-time great teams and then had to ruin it.
My comment was not taking anything away from Shaq who was a truly dominant player but until Kobe became one as well the Lakers were getting swept by a choker like Mailman because he had a great #2 ...get the point? Or was the one-man wrecking crew not good enough to beat a player that everyone on here bashes repeatedly?
It was Until kobe became great that the those Lakers became great ...that was a fact. Shaq was already dominant. Fox and horry were established role players. We even had Glen Rice a proven shooter. But our role players like horry couldnt help Shaq win he needed that #2 ...just like Lebron needed Wade.
and I would say out of the teams mentioned above the best ones have great #2's.

86 Celts McHale
72 win bulls prime pippen
2001 Lakers Frobe
85 Lakers Kareem
87 Lakers Worthy
83 Sixers Dr.J

That is where you seperate the great teams ...

My fault, I meant to say Kobe wasn't 1b until 2003. He was the clear robin until then. If you can even call him robin. He's the Hawkeyes or black widow up till around 2002. Became robin for the year, then more of an equal billing in 2003 when shaq declined and the lakers went nowhere.

And no, shaq didn't get swept by the Jazz because he didn't have a #2, it's because he had rambis or whoever it was as a patch instead of kfc, and 98 shaq is no where as dominant as 2001 shaq. It's like you saying 85 Kareem was as dominant as 80 Kareem, it's just not the case.

I'm fine with with Kobe being the number 2, he earned it since around 1999/2000, but no way in hell was he the 1b until at least 2003. Shaq ran that team. Nobody called Pippen a 1b, he was the clear #2. Same with mchale, and Kobe had that role during the three peat.

And you are disappointed with me? Look at the quote I originally responded to, the entire thing was Kobe propaganda, trying to sneak Kobe into the conversation and draw equivalence of him with the most dominant version of shaq. If I said Parker was the clear 1b to Duncan in 2003, it would be a clear propaganda move to boost up Parker and would be an insult to Duncan as well.

Sure the best teams needed a #2. Pippen was that on the 92 bulls, and Kobe was that on the 01 lakers. Neither of them were 1bs.

To nitpick, magic was 1b in 85 still. Kareem was the 1a.

Killakobe81

03-25-2016, 06:44 AM

My fault, I meant to say Kobe wasn't 1b until 2003. He was the clear robin until then. If you can even call him robin. He's the Hawkeyes or black widow up till around 2002. Became robin for the year, then more of an equal billing in 2003 when shaq declined and the lakers went nowhere.

And no, shaq didn't get swept by the Jazz because he didn't have a #2, it's because he had rambis or whoever it was as a patch instead of kfc, and 98 shaq is no where as dominant as 2001 shaq. It's like you saying 85 Kareem was as dominant as 80 Kareem, it's just not the case.

I'm fine with with Kobe being the number 2, he earned it since around 1999/2000, but no way in hell was he the 1b until at least 2003. Shaq ran that team. Nobody called Pippen a 1b, he was the clear #2. Same with mchale, and Kobe had that role during the three peat.

And you are disappointed with me? Look at the quote I originally responded to, the entire thing was Kobe propaganda, trying to sneak Kobe into the conversation and draw equivalence of him with the most dominant version of shaq. If I said Parker was the clear 1b to Duncan in 2003, it would be a clear propaganda move to boost up Parker and would be an insult to Duncan as well.

Sure the best teams needed a #2. Pippen was that on the 92 bulls, and Kobe was that on the 01 lakers. Neither of them were 1bs.

To nitpick, magic was 1b in 85 still. Kareem was the 1a.

You sa y it was 2003 i say it was the 2001 playoffs vs sacto especually the two road games and Kobe proved tflhat vs yiur Spurs as well. Again this not all about him its about the more dominant team Shaq was doininant in 97 98, 99 yet we were still lising when it mattered. Horry was in his prime always clutch but we could not win. Of hourse PJ deserves praise for 2000 because ge did motivate shaq ti get in shape but the biggest key was Kobe improving enough for us to trade for Rice's shooting. The 2000 team needed that because Fisher was not ready to provide that yet as a starter.

And nitpick is what you do best.

In 1985 Magic waa the driving force not Kareem even if was still out leading scoree And although Worthy was our #3 it was he and Magic that drove us because both choked in 84. Magic was tragic and henderson stole the ball ftom worthy. They drove us in 1985 even if Kareem was the clear #2 and Finals mvp. I know it was team the first team i followed for a whole season all 82 plus ...

ambchang

03-25-2016, 06:46 AM

How old are you? :lol
Did you actually see those teams play? And if you did... your Kobe hate makes more sense .to me now. if you watched those teams play even as kid of course Kobe's ball dominant ways would rub you the wrong way ...although not sure why Mj's ways dont do the same ...but whatever.

I think I'm about the same age as you but there are tapes, and those Knicks and Blazers team were a thing of beauty. People are googoogaaing over the Spurs and Warriors offense now but it was done back the. Sure the defense wasn't as complex back the. Nor the players movement as aesthetically pleasing, but the offenses were similar. We went away from that because the rules favoured one on one offense for a long time.

I don't hate Kobe, I dislike him because he's horribly overrated. He's ball dominant without being dominant, he coasted on defense for long stretches of his career despite him having the capability to do so, and o my do enough to get his brand going rather than help his team win. You'd say 5 rings but look at it closely and he was carried to three back in the three peat, and get way more credit than he deserved in the repeat. He clearly puts his own legacy and ego above the team, and lucked out in the other years. You can say Jordan was the same earlier in his career, but he adapted and trusted his teammate to two three peats, and was absolutely dominant in those years. I never really liked Jordan and didn't think he's as clear cut as the GOAT as people make him out to be, but you have to appreciate his true dominance. I never really liked shaq either, but he was dominant.

Btw, I liked Kobe during the threepeat, he was good. He played his role and out in great defense, it's when he ran shaq and Phil out of town to chase his own scoring numbers the mj complain about management that I started to dislike him. He's disingenuous and selfish.

ambchang

03-25-2016, 06:49 AM

ESPN had them ranked 7th alltime a few years back behind the 1987 squad and the 86 Celts and the 72 win Bulls but when you say wasnt that great that seems dismissive to me. I think they are better than the 1983 Sixers tbh ...

Don't get me wrong. The 85 lakers team were probably one of the better teams ever, but we are talking about the best of the best. You don't talk about Barkley when you talk about the GOAT.

That said, I'd put the 83 sixers above the 85 lakers. Malone was just way too much that year.

Killakobe81

03-25-2016, 06:51 AM

I think I'm about the same age as you but there are tapes, and those Knicks and Blazers team were a thing of beauty. People are googoogaaing over the Spurs and Warriors offense now but it was done back the. Sure the defense wasn't as complex back the. Nor the players movement as aesthetically pleasing, but the offenses were similar. We went away from that because the rules favoured one on one offense for a long time.

I don't hate Kobe, I dislike him because he's horribly overrated. He's ball dominant without being dominant, he coasted on defense for long stretches of his career despite him having the capability to do so, and o my do enough to get his brand going rather than help his team win. You'd say 5 rings but look at it closely and he was carried to three back in the three peat, and get way more credit than he deserved in the repeat. He clearly puts his own legacy and ego above the team, and lucked out in the other years. You can say Jordan was the same earlier in his career, but he adapted and trusted his teammate to two three peats, and was absolutely dominant in those years. I never really liked Jordan and didn't think he's as clear cut as the GOAT as people make him out to be, but you have to appreciate his true dominance. I never really liked shaq either, but he was dominant.

Btw, I liked Kobe during the threepeat, he was good. He played his role and out in great defense, it's when he ran shaq and Phil out of town to chase his own scoring numbers the mj complain about management that I started to dislike him. He's disingenuous and selfish.

Both mj and kobe were selfish Shaq too that is whyvthey all needed Phil and Tex tbh

Killakobe81

03-25-2016, 06:52 AM

Don't get me wrong. The 85 lakers team were probably one of the better teams ever, but we are talking about the best of the best. You don't talk about Barkley when you talk about the GOAT.

That said, I'd put the 83 sixers above the 85 lakers. Malone was just way too much that year.

Moses was a beast but im still taking the 85 lakers because of the #2, #3, #4 on the 85 ate all better by comparison. Moses was the better #1.

baseline bum

03-25-2016, 06:55 AM

Only pussies & assholes blame injuries & the officiating.

Neal never raped

ambchang

03-25-2016, 06:56 AM

You sa y it was 2003 i say it was the 2001 playoffs vs sacto especually the two road games and Kobe proved tflhat vs yiur Spurs as well. Again this not all about him its about the more dominant team Shaq was doininant in 97 98, 99 yet we were still lising when it mattered. Horry was in his prime always clutch but we could not win. Of hourse PJ deserves praise for 2000 because ge did motivate shaq ti get in shape but the biggest key was Kobe improving enough for us to trade for Rice's shooting. The 2000 team needed that because Fisher was not ready to provide that yet as a starter.

And nitpick is what you do best.

In 1985 Magic waa the driving force not Kareem even if was still out leading scoree And although Worthy was our #3 it was he and Magic that drove us because both choked in 84. Magic was tragic and henderson stole the ball ftom worthy. They drove us in 1985 even if Kareem was the clear #2 and Finals mvp. I know it was team the first team i followed for a whole season all 82 plus ...

Face it. Phil made more difference than anything. Kobe got way better in 2002 due to rule changes ( see other perimeter players like pierce, carter, tmac, iverson, Allen) but was still #2.

We can nitpick on 85, but Kareem was the man. Magic was still 1b

Killakobe81

03-25-2016, 06:57 AM

I think I'm about the same age as you but there are tapes, and those Knicks and Blazers team were a thing of beauty. People are googoogaaing over the Spurs and Warriors offense now but it was done back the. Sure the defense wasn't as complex back the. Nor the players movement as aesthetically pleasing, but the offenses were similar. We went away from that because the rules favoured one on one offense for a long time.

I don't hate Kobe, I dislike him because he's horribly overrated. He's ball dominant without being dominant, he coasted on defense for long stretches of his career despite him having the capability to do so, and o my do enough to get his brand going rather than help his team win. You'd say 5 rings but look at it closely and he was carried to three back in the three peat, and get way more credit than he deserved in the repeat. He clearly puts his own legacy and ego above the team, and lucked out in the other years. You can say Jordan was the same earlier in his career, but he adapted and trusted his teammate to two three peats, and was absolutely dominant in those years. I never really liked Jordan and didn't think he's as clear cut as the GOAT as people make him out to be, but you have to appreciate his true dominance. I never really liked shaq either, but he was dominant.

Btw, I liked Kobe during the threepeat, he was good. He played his role and out in great defense, it's when he ran shaq and Phil out of town to chase his own scoring numbers the mj complain about management that I started to dislike him. He's disingenuous and selfish.

Of course there are tapes ...that great Blazers,team btw was down 2-0 to one man wrecking crew in the Finals ...but even if yiu saw those finals pretty sure you didbt see much of the regular season run and the best of the best you cant truly judge without the whole body of work ...which is why for me the 2001 lakers fall short of the 80s teams even the 83 sixers because they only turned it on truly the last 30 games plus the playoffs our most dominant player was coadting and the team mostly followed suit.
But if you asked who would win or who was more dominant come playoffs it was 2001 over 83 sixers. I also take 85 lakers because like the spurs in 2014 that squad was on a mission and not many teams could of brat them not even Moses squad

ambchang

03-25-2016, 07:00 AM

Both mj and kobe were selfish Shaq too that is whyvthey all needed Phil and Tex tbh

Jordan and shaq adjusted. Kobe didn't.

ambchang

03-25-2016, 07:02 AM

Moses was a beast but im still taking the 85 lakers because of the #2, #3, #4 on the 85 ate all better by comparison. Moses was the better #1.

Dr j cheeks and Andrew toney were the bomb. Bobby Jones was still great as well. Those sixers were extremely talented.

ambchang

03-25-2016, 07:06 AM

Of course there are tapes ...that great Blazers,team btw was down 2-0 to one man wrecking crew in the Finals ...but even if yiu saw those finals pretty sure you didbt see much of the regular season run and the best of the best you cant truly judge without the whole body of work ...which is why for me the 2001 lakers fall short of the 80s teams even the 83 sixers because they only turned it on truly the last 30 games plus the playoffs our most dominant player was coadting and the team mostly followed suit.
But if you asked who would win or who was more dominant come playoffs it was 2001 over 83 sixers. I also take 85 lakers because like the spurs in 2014 that squad was on a mission and not many teams could of brat them not even Moses squad

Moses will neutralize shaq. Just my opinion. He dominated a semi prime Kareem, he can play prime shaq to a stand still. Moses was strong enough to guard shaq.

The Blazers were down 0-2 because that sixers team was very talented, but they adjusted and then dominated. That's what great teams do, they have enough talent and versatility that if you close one door, they open another.

As for 85 lakers, sure they were on a mission, but that doesn't out them as one of the greatest teams ever. I won't out the 14 Spurs as one of the greatest teams ever. In fact, I thought the 05 Spurs were the best of the Spurs championship teams. But that's just me.

da_suns_fan

03-25-2016, 02:03 PM

Well the 1987 Celtics made it back to the NBA finals.

How did the 2015 Spurs do?

Thread

03-25-2016, 02:49 PM

Well the 1987 Celtics made it back to the NBA finals.

How did the 2015 Spurs do?

...face ass down at Staples.

baseline bum

03-25-2016, 03:01 PM

...face ass down at Staples.

They were selling your shit

baseline bum

03-25-2016, 03:02 PM

Well the 1987 Celtics made it back to the NBA finals.

How did the 2015 Spurs do?

Same as the 83 Sixers who are also regarded among the top teams in NBA history.

Killakobe81

03-25-2016, 06:32 PM

Moses will neutralize shaq. Just my opinion. He dominated a semi prime Kareem, he can play prime shaq to a stand still. Moses was strong enough to guard shaq.

The Blazers were down 0-2 because that sixers team was very talented, but they adjusted and then dominated. That's what great teams do, they have enough talent and versatility that if you close one door, they open another.

As for 85 lakers, sure they were on a mission, but that doesn't out them as one of the greatest teams ever. I won't out the 14 Spurs as one of the greatest teams ever. In fact, I thought the 05 Spurs were the best of the Spurs championship teams. But that's just me.

The Blazers didnt play the sixers, they played the Nets.
Moses was strong but not as strong as Shaq and would be giving up a few inches as well as quickness. Moses had a sturdy bade and great center of gravitt but he wouldnt be able to stop a prime Shaq ...in my JohhntyCochran voice ....nicca please.

The rest i dont cate to argue because your biased and there is no point.

baseline bum

03-25-2016, 06:48 PM

The Blazers didnt play the sixers, they played the Nets.

He's talking about the 77 team

baseline bum

03-25-2016, 06:53 PM

And yeah, the 77 Blazers were fucking incredible to watch. Damn Walton would have been the best bigman ever if not for his feet.

ambchang

03-25-2016, 06:54 PM

The Blazers didnt play the sixers, they played the Nets.
Moses was strong but not as strong as Shaq and would be giving up a few inches as well as quickness. Moses had a sturdy bade and great center of gravitt but he wouldnt be able to stop a prime Shaq ...in my JohhntyCochran voice ....nicca please.

The rest i dont cate to argue because your biased and there is no point.

I was talking about the 77 Blazers who played the 6ers in the finals. Or are we talking about the same stuff?

Shaq was guarded by Malik rose some times. As long as you are comparatively strong and quick enough, you stand a chance against shaq. Moses can move shaq out of his comfort area and due to his range, it doesn't matter if shaq shoots over you. I'm not saying Moses will stop shaq, I'm saying Moses will neutralize shaq.

Molotov

03-25-2016, 08:09 PM

Bulls Rodman played Shaq well, when he played for Orlando, IMO TBH.

Killakobe81

03-25-2016, 08:41 PM

I was talking about the 77 Blazers who played the 6ers in the finals. Or are we talking about the same stuff?

Shaq was guarded by Malik rose some times. As long as you are comparatively strong and quick enough, you stand a chance against shaq. Moses can move shaq out of his comfort area and due to his range, it doesn't matter if shaq shoots over you. I'm not saying Moses will stop shaq, I'm saying Moses will neutralize shaq.
My bad i was the one confused

Kawhitstorm

03-25-2016, 10:21 PM

The Blazers didnt play the sixers, they played the Nets.
Moses was strong but not as strong as Shaq and would be giving up a few inches as well as quickness. Moses had a sturdy bade and great center of gravitt but he wouldnt be able to stop a prime Shaq ...in my JohhntyCochran voice ....nicca please.

PRIME Shaq shot 44% while mainly being guarded by washed up Admiral/Malik Rose/Mark Bryant in '02.:lol

FOH w/ that PRIME Moses wouldn't have a chance against Shaq BS when Malik Rose used to piss him off by using his low center of gravity which resulted in him drawing charges. Moses would have been able to hold his ground & still challenge his shots unlike 6'6" Rose who need weakside help.

Spurtacular

03-26-2016, 08:37 PM

PRIME Shaq shot 44% while mainly being guarded by washed up Admiral/Malik Rose/Mark Bryant in '02.:lol

spurraider21

03-26-2016, 09:05 PM

The 86 Celtics had the most devastating break I have ever seen thanks to Bird's touch passes. Bird and Walton on the same team was so fucking unfair to the rest of the league. :lol
:lmao bird

If belinelli played in the 80's he would be bird

/retards

Spurtacular

03-27-2016, 12:21 PM

:lmao bird

If belinelli played in the 80's he would be bird

/retards

This has to be the stupidest thing you've ever said, chump.

Thread

03-27-2016, 12:23 PM

This has to be the stupidest thing you've ever said, chump.

But, it has a grain of truth to it & is arguable.

Spurtacular

03-27-2016, 12:35 PM

But, it has a grain of truth to it & is arguable.

Well, Bird was better than Magic. So, you must think Magic sucks.

baseline bum

03-27-2016, 01:58 PM

But, it has a grain of truth to it & is arguable.

They were selling your shit

KL2

03-27-2016, 02:29 PM

PRIME Shaq shot 44% while mainly being guarded by washed up Admiral/Malik Rose/Mark Bryant in '02.:lol

FOH w/ that PRIME Moses wouldn't have a chance against Shaq BS when Malik Rose used to piss him off by using his low center of gravity which resulted in him drawing charges. Moses would have been able to hold his ground & still challenge his shots unlike 6'6" Rose who need weakside help.

Malik Rose was 6'6 250+, same with Corliss Williamson (Pistons) who also gave Shaq trouble posting up.

Moses was like 6'10 240 in his prime (215lb rookie), his center of gravity wasn't nearly as low as Rose's nor was he ever as strong, dude would get straight bullied by Shaq just as Olajuwon did.

To the OP, Spurs by destruction.

Kawhitstorm

03-27-2016, 07:05 PM

Moses was like 6'10 240 in his prime (215lb rookie), his center of gravity wasn't nearly as low as Rose's nor was he ever as strong, dude would get straight bullied by Shaq just as Olajuwon did.

Moses was BIGGER than Hakeem who was listed as 255. If you believe Moses was 240 then I have land in my backyard to sell you.:lol Besides, it's not how much you weight but how the weight is distributed. Admiral had a strong upper body but skinny legs meanwhile Hakeem's weight was evenly distributed. Moses was hips/upper body just like Shaq.

The most ACCURATE measurement are the ones "Draftexpress" so let's take a look at some draft combines profiles:

-Anthony Davis: 222
-KG: 217
-Towns: 250
-Dwight: 240
-Tim: 249
-Sheed: 230
-Camby: 223
-Pau: 227
-Mourning: 249
-Cousins: 292:wow (now 270)
-Shaq: 303
-Julius Randle: 249

Meanwhile, Admiral is listed as 235 & Dirk is listed as 237 on Bball ref. I guess Admiral was at a weight disadvantage when he went up against Dirk.:lmao (the pre-1990s bio-stats are way off:lol)

On wiki it states: "Malone stood 6 feet 10 inches (2.08 m) and weighed 260 pounds (120 kg)". That sounds about right b/c he was built like Cousins w/ less body fat.:lol Otherwise, you are claiming Moses in his prime weighed 10 lbs less than Julius Randle.:lmao

Moses had super strong hips which made him difficult to box-out & a super strong upper body that allowed him to finish through contact ala Shaq. He also had long arms which allowed him to snatch rebounds & defend player much taller than him such as Kareem.

He was the best defensive force in the paint the year he led Philly to a title b/c he didn't have to carry the offense unlike his day w/ the Rockets. He bullied Kareem in the paint during the '83 Finals which forced Kareem to pump iron during the summer (Kareem went up against Wilt/Gilmore numerous time but they didn't bully him like Moses did in two separate playoff series)

Spurtacular

03-29-2016, 02:04 PM

Well the 1987 Celtics made it back to the NBA finals.

How did the 2015 Spurs do?

With everyone but Bird basically banged up, too. McHale should've been out for the season; and the Chief could've used 2-4 months rest for his ankles. Ainge as well but not as bad.

Thread

03-29-2016, 02:10 PM

------With everyone but Bird basically banged up, too. McHale should've been out for the season; and the Chief could've used 2-4 months rest for his ankles. Ainge as well but not as bad.------

------It was all a crock of shit to get the Lakers to back away.------ - Jabbar --- he gathered his flock, they took out steely knives & filleted the beast.

baseline bum

03-29-2016, 02:13 PM

------It was all a crock of shit to get the Lakers to back away.------ - Jabbar --- he gathered his flock, they took out steely knives & filleted the beast.

They were selling your shit

apalisoc_9

03-29-2016, 02:14 PM

86 celtics wont make it in the playoffs in todays nba

Spurtacular

03-29-2016, 02:42 PM

------It was all a crock of shit to get the Lakers to back away.------ - Jabbar --- he gathered his flock, they took out steely knives & filleted the beast.

The x-rays would say otherwise. The game footage would say otherwise. Celts were a superior team when healthy; no need for that Mike Miller playing possum gamesmanship.

Spurtacular

03-29-2016, 02:43 PM

86 celtics wont make it in the playoffs in todays nba

I know you're not this stupid. So, you must put a bigger premium on trolling than I had even figured.

Thread

03-29-2016, 04:33 PM

The x-rays would say otherwise. The game footage would say otherwise. Celts were a superior team when healthy; no need for that Mike Miller playing possum gamesmanship.

Horseshit. We'd gotten distracted before. We'd had our pants taken down before. We'd been bamboozled before. We'd been hoodwinked before. Not that time. Uh, uh. Nope. That time we broke their fuckin' hole.

Spurtacular

03-29-2016, 04:41 PM

Horseshit. We'd gotten distracted before. We'd had our pants taken down before. We'd been bamboozled before. We'd been hoodwinked before. Not that time. Uh, uh. Nope. That time we broke their fuckin' hole.

You're a disgrace to Laker fans, tbh (if that's possible).

Thread

03-29-2016, 04:44 PM

You're a disgrace to Laker fans, tbh (if that's possible).

I never defend my fandom.

It's my religion.

baseline bum

03-29-2016, 04:48 PM

I never defend my fandom.

It's my religion.

They were selling your shit

Spurtacular

03-29-2016, 04:49 PM

I never defend my fandom.

It's my religion.

I ain't about to chew on your canned points, bro.

Thread

03-29-2016, 06:28 PM

Oh, yeah, I remember it well:::McHale, Parrish hopin' all over on one foot,,,Stockton moanin' & groanin'..."This is just terrible. I've never seen anything like this, and yet they're still competing, still aspiring to win the title. I'm just in awe of these Celtics, of these Boston Celtics." Me? Dumbass me...sittin' on the couch fallin' for it. Yeah,,, "Oh, God." You know who didn't fall for it? Jabbar. He'd been thru it all in '74 when they'd givin' him the old okey-doke. This time they accounted for everyone cept Jabbar.

tee, hee.

Spurtacular

03-29-2016, 07:32 PM

baseline bum

03-29-2016, 07:35 PM

Thread

03-29-2016, 08:37 PM

Jibberish

No, Jabbar.

baseline bum

03-29-2016, 08:45 PM

No, Jabbar.

They were selling your shit

KL2

03-30-2016, 01:35 PM

Moses was BIGGER than Hakeem who was listed as 255. If you believe Moses was 240 then I have land in my backyard to sell you.:lol Besides, it's not how much you weight but how the weight is distributed. Admiral had a strong upper body but skinny legs meanwhile Hakeem's weight was evenly distributed. Moses was hips/upper body just like Shaq.

The most ACCURATE measurement are the ones "Draftexpress" so let's take a look at some draft combines profiles:

-Anthony Davis: 222
-KG: 217
-Towns: 250
-Dwight: 240
-Tim: 249
-Sheed: 230
-Camby: 223
-Pau: 227
-Mourning: 249
-Cousins: 292:wow (now 270)
-Shaq: 303
-Julius Randle: 249

Meanwhile, Admiral is listed as 235 & Dirk is listed as 237 on Bball ref. I guess Admiral was at a weight disadvantage when he went up against Dirk.:lmao (the pre-1990s bio-stats are way off:lol)

On wiki it states: "Malone stood 6 feet 10 inches (2.08 m) and weighed 260 pounds (120 kg)". That sounds about right b/c he was built like Cousins w/ less body fat.:lol Otherwise, you are claiming Moses in his prime weighed 10 lbs less than Julius Randle.:lmao

Moses had super strong hips which made him difficult to box-out & a super strong upper body that allowed him to finish through contact ala Shaq. He also had long arms which allowed him to snatch rebounds & defend player much taller than him such as Kareem.

He was the best defensive force in the paint the year he led Philly to a title b/c he didn't have to carry the offense unlike his day w/ the Rockets. He bullied Kareem in the paint during the '83 Finals which forced Kareem to pump iron during the summer (Kareem went up against Wilt/Gilmore numerous time but they didn't bully him like Moses did in two separate playoff series)

Prime Malone was around 230-240, he reached 260 late in his career when he was past his prime. Look on google images for yourself, they have his rookie pic where he looks like a twig (215lb range), and when he was old and fat around 260. He was around 230-240 in his prime. He was not a strong guy, strong in his time era, sure, not in this one.

Draftexpress only started tracking the weights of players around like '95 or so, somewhere around '90. The weights you see listed for older generation players such as Kemp, Robinson, Malone, MJ etc. are generally from when their weight peaked and they were on the decline, tail end of their careers.

The weights you see for the younger generation players is their rookie weight, just isn't updated because guys get so big so fast. Most of the weights you can find through google:

-Davis (222 rookie), 253lbs (now)
-Howard (240 rookie) 260-270lbs (now)
-Butler (222lb rookie) 235 (now)
-KG (217lb rookie) 253 (prime)
-Robinson (230 rookie) 250 (prime)
-Nowitzki (No idea rookie weight, 240 prime)
-Bosh (225lb rookie) 250 (prime)

Guys do have different genetics, however the average rookie in today's game does weigh just as much or more than the average older gen. player did when they reached their peak weights.

Just for perspective:
Malone around 250lbs:
http://cdn2-b.examiner.com/sites/default/files/styles/image_content_width/hash/2a/c0/2ac0d95e1428dca594e3fb175305d6b8.jpg?itok=83SBTaRc

Randle 250lbs (rookie weight):
http://img.bleacherreport.net/img/article/media_slots/photos/001/207/372/hi-res-187812855-julius-randle-of-the-kentucky-wildcats-celebtraes-a_crop_exact.jpg?w=340&h=226&q=85

JR is significantly bigger/stronger and in much better shape, 250 is his rookie weight, he will fill out to 260+ easily.

ambchang

03-30-2016, 04:24 PM

Prime Malone was around 230-240, he reached 260 late in his career when he was past his prime. Look on google images for yourself, they have his rookie pic where he looks like a twig (215lb range), and when he was old and fat around 260. He was around 230-240 in his prime. He was not a strong guy, strong in his time era, sure, not in this one.

Draftexpress only started tracking the weights of players around like '95 or so, somewhere around '90. The weights you see listed for older generation players such as Kemp, Robinson, Malone, MJ etc. are generally from when their weight peaked and they were on the decline, tail end of their careers.

The weights you see for the younger generation players is their rookie weight, just isn't updated because guys get so big so fast. Most of the weights you can find through google:

-Davis (222 rookie), 253lbs (now)
-Howard (240 rookie) 260-270lbs (now)
-Butler (222lb rookie) 235 (now)
-KG (217lb rookie) 253 (prime)
-Robinson (230 rookie) 250 (prime)
-Nowitzki (No idea rookie weight, 240 prime)
-Bosh (225lb rookie) 250 (prime)

Guys do have different genetics, however the average rookie in today's game does weigh just as much or more than the average older gen. player did when they reached their peak weights.

Just for perspective:
Malone around 250lbs:
http://cdn2-b.examiner.com/sites/default/files/styles/image_content_width/hash/2a/c0/2ac0d95e1428dca594e3fb175305d6b8.jpg?itok=83SBTaRc

Randle 250lbs (rookie weight):
http://img.bleacherreport.net/img/article/media_slots/photos/001/207/372/hi-res-187812855-julius-randle-of-the-kentucky-wildcats-celebtraes-a_crop_exact.jpg?w=340&h=226&q=85

JR is significantly bigger/stronger and in much better shape, 250 is his rookie weight, he will fill out to 260+ easily.

Weight is so important. That's why Oliver Miller is the goat.

Kawhitstorm

03-30-2016, 07:46 PM

KL2

03-31-2016, 04:11 PM

So, You're telling me Moses weighed the same as Dirk & less 10-20 lbs LESS than KG/Davis.:lmao

Zach Randolph is listed as 270 but he LOOKS smaller than Randle. Moses had the same frame/definition as Tim, he was just 2 inches shorter. Basically, Moses is Z-Bo w/ less body-fat & an inch taller, which should put him in the 255 range.

Moses Malone rookie, 215lb range:
http://www.remembertheaba.com/tributematerial/PlayerMaterial/MosesMalone/MaloneFreeThrow.jpg

MM 230-240 range is the Hawks pic I posted.

250-260 range is when he was old, fat and out of shape:
http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/Cards/Basketball/2289/2289-681414Fr.jpg

Z-Bo isn't smaller than Randle, they're roughly the same size, Z-Bo is insanely strong, just has a lot more fat.

This is the new era, many SF's are just as big/strong as the old school bigs were, you have one on your team:
http://images.solecollector.com/complex/image/upload/ygwikxhc0bume7mbwmzo.jpg

Kawhitstorm

03-31-2016, 04:32 PM

250-260 range is when he was old, fat and out of shape:

Wes Unseld weight like 290 lbs:

http://ww3.hdnux.com/photos/40/73/17/8631286/5/920x920.jpg

Hakeem: 255

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/e2/93/f5/e293f510ee18e29f4112c670400f806d.jpg

Looks like Shaq next to Ewing (240):

http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/basketball-new-york-knicks-patrick-ewing-in-action-vs-philadelphia-picture-id81341137

Robert Horry: 240 (couldn't guard centers)

http://cache1.asset-cache.net/gc/632210-dec-2001-robert-horry-of-the-los-angeles-lakers-gettyimages.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=BKoF52%2BdYhG0EtJyW83O4A3mNl5h5SatgEmpv3N1qdCYDT 4TkuzifOsBsTmU7X5GPlgw8cB6M2g3fq4VTZUfxeZ6IljGgy3I FqxfL%2BCXvmM%3D

KL2

03-31-2016, 08:13 PM

[QUOTE=Kawhitstorm;8505089]Wes Unseld weight like 290 lbs:

Wes Unseld was listed at 245lbs at his peak lol, and it's not like he was lean either, he was bulky and fat. Kawhi Leonard is practically the same weight as him except lean and agile. And before you say something like "Leonard isn't 240lbs" just use Stanley Johnson or Khris Middleton for reference, Johnson 245, Middleton 235.

Hakeem: 255

Looks like Shaq next to Ewing (240)

Robert Horry: 240 (couldn't guard centers)

I'm not sure what Olajuwon weighed at that time, same with Ewing, both guys bulked up late in their careers like everyone else. And be honest lol, Malone looks like shit, look at that gut. 240lbs isn't big anymore for true big men, Ibaka is around 245lbs (still listed at his old weight), even he has strength issues. And as far as Horry, he was around 220 with the Rockets, bulked up to 240 late in his career.
http://img.bleacherreport.net/img/images/photos/002/505/167/IbakaDrvis_crop_north.jpg?w=630&h=420&q=75

This is what Aldridge looked like at 240 (still listed at his rookie weight)
http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/teamsites/images/legacy/blazers/120406_aldridge_article.jpg

Kawhitstorm

03-31-2016, 09:09 PM

Wes Unseld was listed at 245lbs at his peak lol, and it's not like he was lean either, he was bulky and fat.

Unseld wasn't necessarily fat, he was built like Barkley w/ tree trunk legs. The picture I posed was during Wes Unseld's mid-career (late 70s) as that was when Moses moved to the NBA from the ABA.

Wes Unseld:
Height: 6-5.75
Playing Weight:
245 - rookie
265 - mid career
280 - late career

Kawhi Leonard is practically the same weight as him except lean and agile. And before you say something like "Leonard isn't 240lbs" just use Stanley Johnson or Khris Middleton for reference, Johnson 245, Middleton 235.

Kawhi is actually BIGGER than Faried & Joe Johnson is also just as big as Carmelo

I'm not sure what Olajuwon weighed at that time, same with Ewing, both guys bulked up late in their careers like everyone else. And be honest lol, Malone looks like shit, look at that gut. 240lbs isn't big anymore for true big men, Ibaka is around 245lbs (still listed at his old weight), even he has strength issues. And as far as Horry, he was around 220 with the Rockets, bulked up to 240 late in his career

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-rSE2zJNY6Ts/VRuEFsjVi4I/AAAAAAAAF4Q/aw75RijMqGw/s0/Measurement%2520data%25204-1-15.jpg

Kawhitstorm

03-31-2016, 09:24 PM

@KL2 (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=35686)

Elvin Hayes (in front of Moses) was 240:

http://cache4.asset-cache.net/gc/51439625-the-eastern-conference-all-stars-pose-for-a-gettyimages.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=DVGGCcQsa0dKr9GQRF47vmHlWitgVKVtsp13Nt9BIoxsnB6q 6suQ0uGQ9o7%2FxJSStErJ9z5kRuJVB9i4NunSqPeY%2F58Tq7 asBaZA5hlFPNM%3D

Hakeem in college looks like a a small-forward next to Moses.

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/CO9L_NOWIAAYcnP.jpg

Kawhitstorm

03-31-2016, 09:44 PM

@KL2 (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=35686)

Moses was bigger than Robert Parish

http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/moses-malone-of-the-houston-rockets-posts-up-against-robert-parish-of-picture-id90884693

Parish vs. Rookie Shaq (Parish is listed as 230:lmao)

http://cache3.asset-cache.net/gc/493132451-robert-parish-of-the-boston-celtics-boxes-gettyimages.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=X7WJLa88Cweo9HktRLaNXoJwBZmPczaZloab5vBKZgRTLkM5 VMChQQCSOn4iC3jd5l2BVqXpIchYahfKwCni0rsUFdownQ%2FZ BElq6fYrW%2BC6w2%2FVqUASPUF%2Bhbrg1g09

Shaq getting cucked by 40 year old Parish: :lol

idWqbzeV01c

KL2

04-03-2016, 03:38 PM

Unseld wasn't necessarily fat, he was built like Barkley w/ tree trunk legs. The picture I posed was during Wes Unseld's mid-career (late 70s) as that was when Moses moved to the NBA from the ABA.

Wes Unseld:
Height: 6-5.75
Playing Weight:
245 - rookie
265 - mid career
280 - late career

Kawhi is actually BIGGER than Faried & Joe Johnson is also just as big as Carmelo

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-rSE2zJNY6Ts/VRuEFsjVi4I/AAAAAAAAF4Q/aw75RijMqGw/s0/Measurement%2520data%25204-1-15.jpg

Unseld carried quite a bit of fat, he was pretty slow just like most guys that were big in that era. If you were big, you were almost guaranteed to be slow, it's not like today's league at all:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xS8hUd6mAYU

He looks like an old man the way he moves, imagine him trying to guard Aldridge on the perimeter or chasing a guard like Curry around multiple screens.

But these weights pretty much prove my point, the preferred weights are generally around their primes, that's around the size of most rookies in today's league. Lots of these guys are also some of the all time greats in the game too, which usually means they have legit size over the rest of the league. People remember the peak players, but usually not the 2nd and 3rd stringers they also played against.

The entire league is full of these monsters, it's not just a select few, it's practically every roster from top to bottom.

From the SF position alone:
Lebron (prime)-260+
Leonard ) 240+
Melo-240
J. Johnson-240
S. Johnson-240
J. Butler-235
Durant-240
Parker-240
Gay-235? (He bulked up to like 250 with the Raps)
Hayward-230
etc. Lots of these guys like Leonard aren't even at their peak weights.

KL2

04-03-2016, 03:42 PM

[QUOTE=Kawhitstorm;8505451]@KL2 (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=35686)

Moses was bigger than Robert Parish

Parish vs. Rookie Shaq (Parish is listed as 230:lmao)

http://cache3.asset-cache.net/gc/493132451-robert-parish-of-the-boston-celtics-boxes-gettyimages.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=X7WJLa88Cweo9HktRLaNXoJwBZmPczaZloab5vBKZgRTLkM5 VMChQQCSOn4iC3jd5l2BVqXpIchYahfKwCni0rsUFdownQ%2FZ BElq6fYrW%2BC6w2%2FVqUASPUF%2Bhbrg1g09

Shaq getting cucked by 40 year old Parish: :lol

Again, laaaate in Parish's career, early in Shaq's who was really inexperienced but was still giving guys like Olajuwon all they could handle. Shaq was >300lbs as a rookie, he bulked up to 330+ in the late 90's, then continued gaining until he was like 360+ by '04.

Kawhitstorm

04-03-2016, 11:35 PM

Again, laaaate in Parish's career, early in Shaq's who was really inexperienced but was still giving guys like Olajuwon all they could handle. Shaq was >300lbs as a rookie, he bulked up to 330+ in the late 90's, then continued gaining until he was like 360+ by '04.

Shaq was crushing cats as a rookie so 40 yr old Parish being able to handle was no small feat.:lol Moses was bigger/stronger than Parish & was a better defender so miss me w/ Shaq would have crushed him narrative.

Mourning didn't fear Shaq used to go toe-to-toe w/ him including '99-'00 when Shaq was at his PEAK. Mourning wasn't in the same class as Moses & used to get sonned by old ass Ewing.:lol (Zo was a great shot-blocker/quick leaper but an average post defender & okay rebounder b/c he didn't have strong hips)

KL2

04-04-2016, 04:28 PM

Shaq was crushing cats as a rookie so 40 yr old Parish being able to handle was no small feat.:lol Moses was bigger/stronger than Parish & was a better defender so miss me w/ Shaq would have crushed him narrative.

Mourning didn't fear Shaq used to go toe-to-toe w/ him including '99-'00 when Shaq was at his PEAK. Mourning wasn't in the same class as Moses & used to get sonned by old ass Ewing.:lol (Zo was a great shot-blocker/quick leaper but an average post defender & okay rebounder b/c he didn't have strong hips)

That doesn't change the fact that Shaq was a rookie, that's like me posting clips of Leonard getting owned by Gay or Durant years ago. But it's not like Parish stopped Shaq, Shaq still tore him up despite those few highlights. Ewing used to own Mourning when he was younger (Mourning was a rook in '92), sure, but as the years went on Mourning continuously outplayed him, he probably had a handful of good games against him.

The NBA is a cycle, Rooks take around 4 years to first reach their primes and fill out, another 3 to finally peak. Their primes eventually run out, but it's not like they stop progressing as a player, they pick up different skills and things they've learned from being 10+ years pro. They eventually become vets and pick on the younger players still developing as that's when they're most vulnerable.

It's like TD vs Griffin & Cousins years ago, or Gay & KD vs Leonard. TD owned them when they were young, but not anymore, same with Gay & KD owning a young Leonard.

MultiTroll

04-04-2016, 04:45 PM

Pos.
Starter
Bench
Reserve
Inactive

C (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Center_(basketball))
Robert Parish (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Parish)
Bill Walton (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Walton)
Greg Kite (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greg_Kite)

PF (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_forward_(basketball))
Kevin McHale (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_McHale_(basketball))

SF (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_Forward)
Larry Bird (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larry_Bird)

David Thirdkill (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Thirdkill)

SG (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_guard)
Danny Ainge (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danny_Ainge)
Scott Wedman (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott_Wedman)
Rick Carlisle (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rick_Carlisle)

PG (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Point_Guard)
Dennis Johnson (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Johnson)
Jerry Sichting (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_Sichting)
Sam Vincent (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Vincent_(basketball))

MultiTroll

04-04-2016, 04:50 PM

Breakdown
C Timmy Duncan vs Bob Parish
PF LMA vs McHale
SF Bird vs Kawhi
SG Ainge vs Danny Green
PG DJ vs Porker

Kawhitstorm

04-04-2016, 06:48 PM

That doesn't change the fact that Shaq was a rookie, that's like me posting clips of Leonard getting owned by Gay or Durant years ago.

LoL, Kawhi as a rookie wasn't on Shaq level (Shaq was the best rookie since Admiral who was a 24 year old rookie) & 40 year old Parish was no where near KD.:lol

But it's not like Parish stopped Shaq, Shaq still tore him up despite those few highlights.

Shaq is going to get his but it's not like he was steam rolling AARP Parish.

Ewing used to own Mourning when he was younger (Mourning was a rook in '92), sure, but as the years went on Mourning continuously outplayed him, he probably had a handful of good games against him.

NOPE, Ewing used to own Mourning when Zo was an MVP candidate & Ewing was past his prime. We are talking about the same Ewing that was getting outplayed by Rik Smits: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=smitsri01&p2=ewingpa01#stats_games_playoffs::none :lol

1997 playoffs-http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/1997-nba-eastern-conference-semifinals-knicks-vs-heat.html

ET7tk7RhY8Q

9Spkec2GcUM

The NBA is a cycle, Rooks take around 4 years to first reach their primes and fill out, another 3 to finally peak. Their primes eventually run out, but it's not like they stop progressing as a player, they pick up different skills and things they've learned from being 10+ years pro. They eventually become vets and pick on the younger players still developing as that's when they're most vulnerable.

It's like TD vs Griffin & Cousins years ago, or Gay & KD vs Leonard. TD owned them when they were young, but not anymore, same with Gay & KD owning a young Leonard.
Again, Mourning held his own against MVP Shaq.:wakeup

ambchang

04-04-2016, 09:35 PM

That doesn't change the fact that Shaq was a rookie, that's like me posting clips of Leonard getting owned by Gay or Durant years ago. But it's not like Parish stopped Shaq, Shaq still tore him up despite those few highlights. Ewing used to own Mourning when he was younger (Mourning was a rook in '92), sure, but as the years went on Mourning continuously outplayed him, he probably had a handful of good games against him.

The NBA is a cycle, Rooks take around 4 years to first reach their primes and fill out, another 3 to finally peak. Their primes eventually run out, but it's not like they stop progressing as a player, they pick up different skills and things they've learned from being 10+ years pro. They eventually become vets and pick on the younger players still developing as that's when they're most vulnerable.

It's like TD vs Griffin & Cousins years ago, or Gay & KD vs Leonard. TD owned them when they were young, but not anymore, same with Gay & KD owning a young Leonard.

So MVP candidates outplay rookies. :wow. Incredible insights right there. And when those MVPs get older, they no longer dominate but get to hold their own against those same rookies they dominated in the past.

Never thought that was true until you pointed it out.

KL2

04-05-2016, 06:21 PM

LoL, Kawhi as a rookie wasn't on Shaq level (Shaq was the best rookie since Admiral who was a 24 year old rookie) & 40 year old Parish was no where near KD.:lol

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2010/1105/bos_g_shaq92_200.jpg

Against Parish Shaq was inexperienced and hadn't filled out all the way as you can see, not to mention his teams got significantly better throughout the years making him harder to guard. If 90's Shaq could get to the Finals with his young Magic team, imagine what he'd do with prime Kobe, Phil and LA. It's not like those early 00's Lakers squads would even ring in today's league either lol.

NOPE, Ewing used to own Mourning when Zo was an MVP candidate & Ewing was past his prime. We are talking about the same Ewing that was getting outplayed by Rik Smits: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=smitsri01&p2=ewingpa01#stats_games_playoffs::none :lol

1997 playoffs-http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/1997-nba-eastern-conference-semifinals-knicks-vs-heat.html

Ewing was still dropping 20ppg in a heavily reduced role that year, and was at one of the highest weights of his career, you're acting like he was done as an elite player, a younger smaller version would've been at a disadvantage. Younger Ewing was in the 240 range, towards the end of his career he got up to around 260.

Certain guys just have each others numbers, Pau Gasol has held TD to 42% in the playoffs before due to his length, that's probably what bothered Ewing vs Smits:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2008-nba-western-conference-finals-spurs-vs-lakers.html

Again, Mourning held his own against MVP Shaq.:wakeup

*Younger Shaq with a lesser LA squad and Mourning wasn't totally past his prime, he was more experienced/bigger than ever.

Shaq's offense was always great but his defense was shit, any modern big would expose his D and be dropping 30+ on him, especially if they're playing against his Magic/Laker teams. He wasn't totally unstoppable on offense either, if the old Spurs could use Rasho/Rose to slow Shaq down I'm sure the newer Spurs could with Aldridge-TD-West-Diaw and Green-Leonard as help defenders.

Spurtacular

04-29-2016, 12:33 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4Td5QRfzj4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3y7cWmoBCI

Fabbs

01-04-2018, 03:57 PM

Just getting another breath of fresh (well, memory) NBA air and some more testosterone to the board in before tonight's

:lol marquee matchup of Warriorths verthes Rockeths.
:lol todays NBA

86 Celts and 2014 Spurs would have pounded these pussies into submission.
4-0

LkrFan

01-04-2018, 04:49 PM

1) '87 Lakers
2) '96 Bulls
3) '17 Dubs
4) '01 Lakers
5) '86 Celtics

Who cares after that?

UZER

01-04-2018, 05:34 PM

1) '87 Lakers
2) '96 Bulls
3) '17 Dubs
4) '01 Lakers
5) '86 Celtics

Who cares after that?

You do.

'49
'50
'52
'53
'54

Fabbs

01-04-2018, 06:00 PM

You do.

'49
'50
'52
'53
'54

:lol LakerPhan / ST Moderator reduced to thread bumper.

Fabbs

01-04-2018, 06:01 PM

Who cares after that?
Still like that avi, Holmes.

LkrFan

01-04-2018, 06:57 PM

You do.

'49
'50
'52
'53
'54

:lol

LkrFan

01-04-2018, 06:58 PM

Still like that avi, Holmes.

Gracias mi amigo :tu

Spurtacular

01-04-2018, 08:05 PM

You do.

'49
'50
'52
'53
'54

Those were some good Timberwolves teams.

lefty

01-04-2018, 08:16 PM

86 Celtics all day.

Jerry Sichting would run circles around Porker

Fabbs

01-04-2018, 08:18 PM

86 Celtics all day.

Jerry Sichting would run circles around Porker
He's benched.
Prime Patty pre surgery shooting the rock.

Spurtacular

01-04-2018, 09:23 PM

86 Celtics all day.

Jerry Sichting would run circles around Porker

86 C's 4-2, tbh.

Spurtacular

01-04-2018, 09:33 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1LjVfXwUho

lefty

01-04-2018, 09:38 PM

Damn 2nd year Hakeem was already a beast

Spurtacular

01-07-2018, 01:57 AM

https://78.media.tumblr.com/a4ddb52863acee6c60c2a9d241527e87/tumblr_osf7fdSpaA1sdydefo1_400.gif

MultiTroll

03-07-2022, 12:30 PM

Ah some real hoop teams.

lefty

03-07-2022, 01:18 PM

Those real hoops teams would get obliterated today :lol

MultiTroll

03-07-2022, 05:13 PM

Those real hoops teams would get obliterated today :lol
While you might envision celebrating a win by having tofu and flavored water with the Moderns at a safe space near Kevin Durants, i can assure you Bird, McHale, Timmy Duncan etc and i would be throwing beers and shots after the modern phaggots got run 4-0.

lefty

03-07-2022, 05:44 PM

Bird wouldn’t even last one quarter if he played today :lol

ambchang

03-07-2022, 07:36 PM

Jokić is a slower bird and he is dominating.

lefty

03-07-2022, 11:19 PM

Jokić is a slower bird and he is dominating.

He is in much better shape than Bird has ever been
He is also taller and stronger

MultiTroll

03-07-2022, 11:43 PM

^ I'm sure Mo Malone and Robert Parish would cower when Donkey tried one of his nutt kicks.

:lol The ambulance people would be scraping pieces of Donkey off the pavement.

Biggems

03-07-2022, 11:50 PM

Only pussies & assholes blame injuries & the officiating.

The refs hosed the Pistons in game 7 with that BS call in the closing moments. The injury bug hosed the Lakers against the Pistons the following year.

Thread

03-08-2022, 06:17 AM

The refs hosed the Pistons in game 7 with that BS call in the closing moments. The injury bug hosed the Lakers against the Pistons the following year.

I don't blame officiating, injuries, scheduling, any of it. Ever. It's my religion.

ambchang

03-08-2022, 09:06 AM

He is in much better shape than Bird has ever been
He is also taller and stronger

Taller and stronger, yes. In better shape? No way. Bird played heavy minutes every game and jokic gets gassed after 30+ mins.

lefty

03-08-2022, 11:27 AM

Taller and stronger, yes. In better shape? No way. Bird played heavy minutes every game and jokic gets gassed after 30+ mins.
Bird was reckless and KC Jones never developed a bench so he overplayed his stars; all that led to Bird having a short prime/career

Jokic will have a longer career

ambchang

03-08-2022, 01:20 PM

Bird was reckless and KC Jones never developed a bench so he overplayed his stars; all that led to Bird having a short prime/career

Jokic will have a longer career

Not arguing with that. Bird was stupid the way he played and just wrecked his body. He'd be the unquestioned GOAT if he had 3 more years of his prime.

MultiTroll

03-08-2022, 05:28 PM

The refs hosed the Pistons in game 7 with that BS call in the closing moments. The injury bug hosed the Lakers against the Pistons the following year.
He's never been on the receiving end of bad / rigged officiating thus parrots out the false bravado.

MultiTroll

04-19-2022, 07:24 PM

Not arguing with that. Bird was stupid the way he played and just wrecked his body. He'd be the unquestioned GOAT if he had 3 more years of his prime.
Rumors of Birds off court actions derailing his play 500Xs more then his on court wrecking ball.
85 purported bar room argument with some Laker phaggot and broke his hand over a glass. Birds shooting obviously wayy off.
Working on his driveway doing cement work summer of 86 seriously jacked his back.

LkrFan

04-20-2022, 08:03 AM

Where do these All Time Legit Champions place?
How would they do vs each other?

Occasionally the NBA forum needs some legit Championship talk. You Laker posters can take a break and talk about hosiery on sale or some other Lakerworthy subject.

Legit? Here's where I got these two teams all-time:

1) 1987 Lakers
2) 2001 Lakers
3) 2017 Dubs
4) 2018 Dubs
5) 1996 Bulls
6) 2014 Spurs
7) 1986 Celtics

I'm biased of course, but my '87 Lakers were LOADED. I'd take them in a 7-game series vs any team.

LkrFan

04-20-2022, 08:12 AM

Bird wouldn’t even last one quarter if he played today :lol

Bird is Kyle Korver with a green light in today's NBA :lol

The athletes of today are better trained and more skilled, collectively than the players in the 80s. Better offensive and defensive schemes as well vs the antiquated stuff they ran back then.

I think Jordan would thrive in today's NBA, but wouldn't annihilate players athletically like he did back then. Many of today's NBA "scrubs" would do well in the 80s.

lefty

04-20-2022, 09:52 AM

Bird is Kyle Korver with a green light in today's NBA :lol

The athletes of today are better trained and more skilled, collectively than the players in the 80s. Better offensive and defensive schemes as well vs the antiquated stuff they ran back then.

I think Jordan would thrive in today's NBA, but wouldn't annihilate players athletically like he did back then. Many of today's NBA "scrubs" would do well in the 80s.
yeah people look at scoreboards and assume defenses were better in the 90s; that's not how it works.......
They even say defense was better in the 80s even though you had games that would end up 150-149 in regulation and without the 3 pt shooting we have today, but it was still more defensive...lol moving goal posts :lol
"Better fudamuntals back in the days" watch the 84 Finals, defenses literally leaving DJ and Magic wide open at the FT line :lmao , and both Johnsons forcing entry passes to the post with their defenders sagging off to the big men, almost forcing interceptions, instead of shooting.

Also :
:lol

https://twitter.com/TonyCMKE/status/1516810272945623041?s=20&t=O3hspUtIbBjoek0QBctwHg

baseline bum

04-20-2022, 10:13 PM

Rumors of Birds off court actions derailing his play 500Xs more then his on court wrecking ball.
85 purported bar room argument with some Laker phaggot and broke his hand over a glass. Birds shooting obviously wayy off.
Working on his driveway doing cement work summer of 86 seriously jacked his back.

Was actually 83 when he hurt his back. Hard to imagine how he could have three MVP seasons in a row following that injury, Bird was a madman who didn't give a fuck.

baseline bum

04-20-2022, 10:14 PM

lefty

04-20-2022, 10:26 PM

I like in the Showtime book when Michael Cooper thought that shit and Bird lit him the fuck up in their first meeting.

What was Coop thinking :lol
The Lakers player who actually bothered Bird the most on the defensive was Worthy

MultiTroll

04-20-2022, 10:38 PM

Was actually 83 when he hurt his back. Hard to imagine how he could have three MVP seasons in a row following that injury, Bird was a madman who didn't give a fuck.
During the 1985 NBA season, Larry sustained an injury to his back while shoveling crushed rock to create a driveway at his mother’s house.

Larry Bird [2022 Update]: Wife, Career, Net worth & Family (playersbio.com) (https://playersbio.com/larry-bird/#:~:text=During%20the%201985%20NBA%20season%2C%20L arry%20sustained%20an,career%20to%20an%20end%20at% 2036%20years%20old.)

The beginning of the end arrived in 1985 when Bird headed back to French Lick, Indiana. His mother’s home needed a new driveway, and, for all his fame and fortune, Larry Legend wasn’t afraid to get his hands dirty.

Larry Bird Ruined His $24 Million Career by Building a Driveway for His Mother: 'I Was Wondering if I Was Gonna Be in a Wheelchair' (sportscasting.com) (https://www.sportscasting.com/larry-bird-ruined-24-million-career-building-a-driveway/)

MultiTroll

04-20-2022, 10:46 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tR4JjeaAU8

MultiTroll

04-20-2022, 10:51 PM

baseline bum

04-20-2022, 10:57 PM

During the 1985 NBA season, Larry sustained an injury to his back while shoveling crushed rock to create a driveway at his mother’s house.

Larry Bird [2022 Update]: Wife, Career, Net worth & Family (playersbio.com) (https://playersbio.com/larry-bird/#:~:text=During%20the%201985%20NBA%20season%2C%20L arry%20sustained%20an,career%20to%20an%20end%20at% 2036%20years%20old.)

The beginning of the end arrived in 1985 when Bird headed back to French Lick, Indiana. His mother’s home needed a new driveway, and, for all his fame and fortune, Larry Legend wasn’t afraid to get his hands dirty.

Larry Bird Ruined His $24 Million Career by Building a Driveway for His Mother: 'I Was Wondering if I Was Gonna Be in a Wheelchair' (sportscasting.com) (https://www.sportscasting.com/larry-bird-ruined-24-million-career-building-a-driveway/)

You're right, a lot of sources corroborating it as 85. Not sure if I remembered wrong or if where I read it was wrong in saying it was 1983.

baseline bum

04-20-2022, 11:06 PM

The only reasons Celts lost in 85.
Larry Bird's Foolish Involvement in a Bar Fight Cost the Celtics in the 1985 NBA Finals (sportscasting.com) (https://www.sportscasting.com/larry-bird-involvement-bar-fight-cost-celtics-1985-nba-finals/)

Pretty fucking retarded of Bird, definitely sounds like they gave away the 85 Finals and he had a pretty shit series by his standards. Guess it was a gift back though after the way Magic and Worthy gave away the 84 Finals with a couple of boneheaded passes and dribbling out the clock. God a Lakers - Celtics series in 86 would have been a bloodbath Celtics victory though with how much of a cancer Maurice Lucas was and how far Abdul-Jabbar had fallen off. Would have probably hurt Magic's legacy a lot more than losing to Houston if he got his teeth kicked in by that ridiculous 86 Celtics team.

baseline bum

04-20-2022, 11:25 PM

The refs hosed the Pistons in game 7 with that BS call in the closing moments. The injury bug hosed the Lakers against the Pistons the following year.

Turns out that was Riley's fault, running a fucking training camp in their break before the Finals despite the Lakers being old as fuck by 1989.

ambchang

04-21-2022, 07:11 AM

baseline bum

04-24-2022, 06:35 PM

Damn for anyone who never saw the 86 Celtics play, pretty much every game from their 86 season is on youtube

Isitjustme?

04-29-2022, 05:23 PM

Pretty fucking retarded of Bird, definitely sounds like they gave away the 85 Finals and he had a pretty shit series by his standards. Guess it was a gift back though after the way Magic and Worthy gave away the 84 Finals with a couple of boneheaded passes and dribbling out the clock. God a Lakers - Celtics series in 86 would have been a bloodbath Celtics victory though with how much of a cancer Maurice Lucas was and how far Abdul-Jabbar had fallen off. Would have probably hurt Magic's legacy a lot more than losing to Houston if he got his teeth kicked in by that ridiculous 86 Celtics team.

What's the Maurice Lucas story?

Turns out that was

Riley's fault, running a fucking training camp in their break before the Finals despite the Lakers being old as fuck by 1989.

iirc they went 11-0 in the Western conference playoffs before the finals that year too

lefty

04-29-2022, 05:30 PM

The West was ass :lol

baseline bum

04-29-2022, 07:09 PM

What's the Maurice Lucas story?

Lucas thought he was a star and demanded to be one there too when all the Lakers wanted was a rebounder, defender, and enforcer. Supposedly Lucas alienated the whole team which is why he wasn't brought back after one year. Was supposedly a black hole on offense.

iirc they went 11-0 in the Western conference playoffs before the finals that year too

They just barely beat out Phoenix for the division title, the first two sweeps were against a crap Blazers team and a meh Sonics team, and even though they swept the Suns in the WCF 3 of the 4 games were really close. Riley decided to basically hold a second training camp for an old team that needed the rest they were afforded from sweeping Phoenix with that talented 63 win Pistons team still fuming from how close they came to a title the season before coming out of the East. Byron Scott tore his hamstring in a rebounding drill in that camp and then Magic tore his in Game 2, likely a result of that stupid training camp. Not that they would have had much of a chance. The 89 Pistons were better than the 88 Pistons and that 88 Pistons team came the 'phantom foul' from winning over the 88 Lakers team that was far superior to the 89 Lakers while having about a 10% Isiah in Game 7. So I would have still taken Pistons, but in 6 had Scott and Magic not gotten hurt.

MultiTroll

01-24-2023, 01:32 AM

Damn for anyone who never saw the 86 Celtics play, pretty much every game from their 86 season is on youtube
Thank you.

Need an occasional visual of 86 Celts vs 14 Spurs.

Given :rollin todays NBA.

FrostKing

01-24-2023, 05:25 AM

Vs
2017 Warriors
2000 Lakers

FrostKing

01-24-2023, 05:37 AM

1986 Celtics vs 2000 Lakers
'14 Spurs vs '17 Warriors

LkrFan

01-27-2023, 01:12 PM

baseline bum

01-27-2023, 03:20 PM

86 Celtics in 4 tbh

LOL the 86 Rockets took them to 6

LkrFan

01-27-2023, 04:48 PM

LOL the 86 Rockets took them to 6

Dream, if drafted by the Spurs in 97 instead of Jim, would have 7 rangs.

Dream >> JimPERI:lolD

MultiTroll

01-27-2023, 05:08 PM

Occasionally the NBA forum needs some legit Championship talk. You Laker posters can take a break and talk about hosiery on sale or some other Lakerworthy subject.

Dream, if drafted by the Spurs in 97 instead of Jim, would have 7 rangs.

Dream >> JimPERI:lolD
El Cerdo why don't you go shopping?

– Beverly Hills Hosiery (https://beverlyhillshosiery.com/password)

baseline bum

01-27-2023, 06:05 PM

Dream, if drafted by the Spurs in 97 instead of Jim, would have 7 rangs.

Dream >> JimPERI:lolD

If the Lakers drafted McGrady instead of snitch they'd have been a really tough matchup for Olajuwon's Spurs and Hakeem probably doesn't get to 7.

LkrFan

01-27-2023, 07:43 PM

If the Lakers drafted McGrady instead of snitch they'd have been a really tough matchup for Olajuwon's Spurs and Hakeem probably doesn't get to 7.

Touché :lol

FrostKing

01-28-2023, 03:07 AM

Bird vs Leonard is the highlight of the series

On paper I prefer '86 Celtics. Walton vs Diaw/Splitter.

Spurs make it a series with the 3-ball but the Celtics get too many easy baskets in the post against an aging Duncan. All that Boston size vs 03/04 Duncan would be something.

Dirks_Finale

01-28-2023, 07:58 AM

I think Bird torches Leonard.

Bird vs Leonard is the highlight of the series

On paper I prefer '86 Celtics. Walton vs Diaw/Splitter.

Spurs make it a series with the 3-ball but the Celtics get too many easy baskets in the post against an aging Duncan. All that Boston size vs 03/04 Duncan would be something.

lefty

01-28-2023, 02:27 PM

I think Bird torches Leonard.
And Kawhi would torch Bird on the other end

Arcadian

01-31-2023, 02:18 PM

MultiTroll

01-31-2023, 03:43 PM

Not sure who the Celtics are going to have guard Porker, but if it's Ainge i can see lots of fast breaks for Porker.

OTOH Celtics are definitely smart enough to get Ainge shots over smaller Porker.

Dirks_Finale

02-01-2023, 01:41 PM

Idk...I can easily imagine Leonard stuffing Bird's shot multiple times. He wasn't used to dealing with that kind of length and athleticism.

Bird would have his moments too. He'd use his intelligence and fakes to get plenty of shots off. But it wouldn't be a domination.

Rodman was a better defender than Kawhi, IMO - and he did well against him.

But Lefty is correct that Kawhi does his thing against Bird as well.

Brazil

02-02-2023, 09:19 AM

Spurs in 3 tbh...

lefty

02-03-2023, 12:08 PM

Spurs in 3 tbh...
Easily

djohn2oo8

02-03-2023, 01:23 PM

LOL the 86 Rockets took them to 6
Crazy how Sampson fell off

djohn2oo8

02-03-2023, 01:26 PM

If the Lakers drafted McGrady instead of snitch they'd have been a really tough matchup for Olajuwon's Spurs and Hakeem probably doesn't get to 7.
McGrady should have had a longer career than he did. He would never condition his body like he should have.

MultiTroll

07-01-2023, 11:23 AM

Billy Walton on 30 for 30 right now. Spent a fair amount on the 1986 Celts.

Good to reminisce when real hoop was played. Get a break from
:lol Todays NBA.

Bring us back Wemby!

lefty

07-01-2023, 05:31 PM

Billy Walton on 30 for 30 right now. Spent a fair amount on the 1986 Celts.

Good to reminisce when real hoop was played. Get a break from
:lol Todays NBA.

Bring us back Wemby!

lol Danny Green would drip 30 ppg on Walton’s teammates

:lol “real basketball”

FrostKing

07-03-2023, 03:20 AM

Billy Walton on 30 for 30 right now. Spent a fair amount on the 1986 Celts.

Good to reminisce when real hoop was played. Get a break from
:lol Todays NBA.

Bring us back Wemby!
Yaaaa I watched that too. Bulls Gilmore beast.

The John Wooden material. Loved.

The Sixers choked. Didn't they lose to Magic too? Doctor J maybe too nice. And they kinda flirt with that. Everyone loves The Doc. Maybe because too nice?

Beyond that yah the Celtics team him 1 vs 1 with McHale. Parish almost fell off his chair reminiscing. I think I stopped at that point. Have to finish.

Impressive Walton overcame his speech issues. The San Diego stuff where he was going to College but yet playing on weekends. Hilarious NBA at the time.