Offensive performance of the backcourt rotation since March 2nd.

[midnightpulp]

Players in question: Parker, Danny, Mills, Manu. Includes playoffs, where Tony and Patty got to pad a bit in the Memphis series.

33.1PPG on .396 shooting. Take the Memphis padding away, and that number probably drops to 30 points on .375 shooting.

Our top 4 guards can only manage about 3 more points on much worse shooting than Wardell :lol

And believe you me, opposing coaches are aware of this problem.

"We'll just focus our defense on their frontline rotation and Leonard. Their guards ain't beating us."

There's no mystery to what's causing this team's offensive problems. We all knew it, but now the numbers show it. And I don't give a shit what any advanced metrics say in this situation. .396 shooting from 4 key rotation players who all play the same positions won't win against elite teams in the playoffs. It makes the Spurs laughably easy to defend. And yeah, the Spurs have some nice offensive team metrics for the season, but they were bolstered by the first half of the season in which Parker was playing all-star caliber basketball and pre-exploded-testicle Manu was averaging around 10ppg on good shooting. Not to the mention the relatively easy schedule.

"But 67-15."

Credit the elite, historically great defense and Kawhi and LMA exploding as a 1-2 punch over the last 2 months. The former is probably sustainable in the playoffs about 80-90% of the time, but the latter just isn't sustainable (expecting Kawhi and LMA to combine for 50-60ish points each game).

I'm rather worried. This trend hasn't shown signs of stopping. I thought Game 1 was the turnaround, but nope.

[HarlemHeat37]

While it's true that the backcourt play has been poor for most of the season, I disagree that opposing coaches have exploited it..the Thunder have been playing Aldridge and Kawhi 1 on 1 for virtually all their possessions(they finally began doubling Aldridge in the middle of the 3rd), and they have barely used the backcourt defenders to help off their man IIRC..

It seems like a logical move for game 3, though..doubling off Parker's man more often, since they can't stop Aldridge 1 on 1 and he isn't a playmaker..they did adjust to the Parker/Aldridge 2-man game in game 2, though, they stopped giving Aldridge so many wide open Js like we saw in game 1..

[midnightpulp]

While it's true that the backcourt play has been poor for most of the season, I disagree that opposing coaches have exploited it..the Thunder have been playing Aldridge and Kawhi 1 on 1 for virtually all their possessions(they finally began doubling Aldridge in the middle of the 3rd), and they have barely used the backcourt defenders to help off their man IIRC..

It seems like a logical move for game 3, though..doubling off Parker's man more often, since they can't stop Aldridge 1 on 1 and he isn't a playmaker..they did adjust to the Parker/Aldridge 2-man game in game 2, though, they stopped giving Aldridge so many wide open Js like we saw in game 1..

I agree they haven't fully exploited it, but if Donovan has a brain, he'll know where to focus his defense in the next game. Just pack the paint, a la Phil in '04. Our wing rotation and single stretch 4 (Horry) weren't any threat, so Phil just focused on Tony and Tim, who killed the Lakers in the 1st two games.

[HarlemHeat37]

Ya, I was surprised it took them so long to send help vs. Aldridge..even if you assume that he will cool down, they still have no answers for him, he won't have any problems averaging 30 if they keep playing him straight up..

It seems like a logical move to at least try to make the Spurs beat you with their inconsistent shooting and backcourt..

[spursistan]

Green/Manu have shown a pulse in these playoffs so far but Parker/Mills shot looks disgustingly broken..

[HarlemHeat37]

Green/Manu have shown a pulse in these playoffs so far but Parker/Mills shot looks disgustingly broken..

Manu and Green have been by far the 3rd and 4th best players in the playoffs, so far, tbh..

They are #2 and 3 in on/off behind Kawhi, and they are both putting up 64+ True Shooting %s IIRC..

[DPG21920]

How ironic was it that the Waiters for Roberson move is the one that did everything. Waiters hit that big 3 because he was dared, then he was in the middle of the blown call.

Mills, Kawhi missed some shots while Waiters nailed a 3 :lol. Ok.

[$pursDynasty]

Can't have it both ways, praising MVParker for setting the plate with 12 dimes in first OKC game and then after the fact roast him for only having 2 points in selfsame game. He is either a heroballer or isn't scoring enough to justify his playing time. smh. Too many player fans with agenda's jumping on the players that hate when the opportunity arises but not mentioning their fave's when they come up short. TBH the only player fanbase that can crow right now is :lma's every one else has had both good and bad moments.

[Mugen]

You absolutely double Aldridge if you're Donovan. Especially on the road where I don't think Green/Patty/Porky will have much success.

It's basically up to Kawhi/Manu to have monster games to steal one on the road. Unless the defense is just straight dominant......

[spursistan]

Manu and Green have been by far the 3rd and 4th best players in the playoffs, so far, tbh..

They are #2 and 3 in on/off behind Kawhi, and they are both putting up 64+ True Shooting %s IIRC..
At some point Pop is going to have to ram up Manu minutes in preparation for next series..

[tholdren]

Players in question: Parker, Danny, Mills, Manu. Includes playoffs, where Tony and Patty got to pad a bit in the Memphis series.

33.1PPG on .396 shooting. Take the Memphis padding away, and that number probably drops to 30 points on .375 shooting.

Our top 4 guards can only manage about 3 more points on much worse shooting than Wardell :lol

And believe you me, opposing coaches are aware of this problem.

"We'll just focus our defense on their frontline rotation and Leonard. Their guards ain't beating us."

There's no mystery to what's causing this team's offensive problems. We all knew it, but now the numbers show it. And I don't give a shit what any advanced metrics say in this situation. .396 shooting from 4 key rotation players who all play the same positions won't win against elite teams in the playoffs. It makes the Spurs laughably easy to defend. And yeah, the Spurs have some nice offensive team metrics for the season, but they were bolstered by the first half of the season in which Parker was playing all-star caliber basketball and pre-exploded-testicle Manu was averaging around 10ppg on good shooting. Not to the mention the relatively easy schedule.

"But 67-15."

Credit the elite, historically great defense and Kawhi and LMA exploding as a 1-2 punch over the last 2 months. The former is probably sustainable in the playoffs about 80-90% of the time, but the latter just isn't sustainable (expecting Kawhi and LMA to combine for 50-60ish points each game).

I'm rather worried. This trend hasn't shown signs of stopping. I thought Game 1 was the turnaround, but nope.

This is obvious. It's why SA went in for Martin. The odd thing is, they picked up Martin for nights like last night, but didnt play him..... eerily reminiscent of disappointing playoff exits where Spurs stubbornly try to outshoot the odds with "their" players.

[Seventyniner]

At some point Pop is going to have to ram up Manu minutes in preparation for next series..

He might have to do it to win this series. Pop always says to the media that he doesn't look ahead to future matchups and only worries about the team in front of him. I'm inclined to believe him.

[diego]

Manu and Green have been by far the 3rd and 4th best players in the playoffs, so far, tbh..

They are #2 and 3 in on/off behind Kawhi, and they are both putting up 64+ True Shooting %s IIRC..

and yet midnight is lumping them in with parker and mills, while giving a free pass for duncan, diaw (fattest invisible man on earth), and west who have also been underwhelming on offense (in fact, all of those guys are below 50 TS% with the exception of diaw who has taken all of 6 shots over two games).

the comparison with curry is asinine. their roles are completely different. do the same exercise for green+bogut+speights+ezeli vs LMA and the result is almost the same- better %age and a slightly lower point total for LMA. "We'll just focus our defense on their guard rotation and iguodala. Their bigs ain't beating us." :rolleyes

Now if this thread is to argue for more green and manu/shorter leash for mills and parker, I agree (especially mills, parker can at least be a setup man if his shot isnt falling). If its to argue for putting miller and martin in the rotation, I think thats a desperation move that one loss does not warrant. besides, ending debacle and missed open shots not withstanding, the bigger problem for the spurs last night was defense- durant and westbrook both went off, kanter ibaka and adams all scored double digits efficiently, lost the rebounding battle, gave up a lot FT- defense, rebounding, interior play is the supposed strength of this team and that is where they failed.

[SAGirl]

and yet midnight is lumping them in with parker and mills, while giving a free pass for duncan, diaw (fattest invisible man on earth), and west who have also been underwhelming on offense (in fact, all of those guys are below 50 TS% with the exception of diaw who has taken all of 6 shots over two games).

the comparison with curry is asinine. their roles are completely different. do the same exercise for green+bogut+speights+ezeli vs LMA and the result is almost the same- better %age and a slightly lower point total for LMA. "We'll just focus our defense on their guard rotation and iguodala. Their bigs ain't beating us." :rolleyes

Now if this thread is to argue for more green and manu/shorter leash for mills and parker, I agree (especially mills, parker can at least be a setup man if his shot isnt falling). If its to argue for putting miller and martin in the rotation, I think thats a desperation move that one loss does not warrant. besides, ending debacle and missed open shots not withstanding, the bigger problem for the spurs last night was defense- durant and westbrook both went off, kanter ibaka and adams all scored double digits efficiently, lost the rebounding battle, gave up a lot FT- defense, rebounding, interior play is the supposed strength of this team and that is where they failed.
Good quality post :tu

[SouthernFried]

The Starting back court killed us in last year's playoffs...and nothing has changed this year.

This might be the worst starting back court in the playoffs. How far can we go with it? We'll see...

[midnightpulp]

and yet midnight is lumping them in with parker and mills, while giving a free pass for duncan, diaw (fattest invisible man on earth), and west who have also been underwhelming on offense (in fact, all of those guys are below 50 TS% with the exception of diaw who has taken all of 6 shots over two games).

the comparison with curry is asinine. their roles are completely different. do the same exercise for green+bogut+speights+ezeli vs LMA and the result is almost the same- better %age and a slightly lower point total for LMA. "We'll just focus our defense on their guard rotation and iguodala. Their bigs ain't beating us." :rolleyes

Now if this thread is to argue for more green and manu/shorter leash for mills and parker, I agree (especially mills, parker can at least be a setup man if his shot isnt falling). If its to argue for putting miller and martin in the rotation, I think thats a desperation move that one loss does not warrant. besides, ending debacle and missed open shots not withstanding, the bigger problem for the spurs last night was defense- durant and westbrook both went off, kanter ibaka and adams all scored double digits efficiently, lost the rebounding battle, gave up a lot FT- defense, rebounding, interior play is the supposed strength of this team and that is where they failed.

:lol Funny enough, that's exactly how the Spurs should defend Golden State, because, in fact, it's their perimeter players who do most of the offensive damage. I know you felt clever typing that, but you didn't think it through enough.

As for the pretty metrics of Green right now, his great game 1 surely inflated his metrics and TS%. Not to mention, most of the Spurs' playoff metrics will look good because we faced a lottery team in the first round and won 3 out 4 games by over 20 points.

I give Duncan "a pass," because he's 40. I've been holding my breath for the last 3 seasons waiting for the wheels to fall off, and they finally did (maybe). Mills, Green, and Parker are in their relative primes (I know Parker is 33, but age can't wholly explain his struggles) I agree calling out Diaw. Frustrating player when he reverts to his fat and lazy coasting mode. West played some great defense on Kanter in game 1, but pairing him Boris is sheer stupidity on Pop's part. West should be complemented by a true big, like Duncan or Boban (who probably won't get much playing time). All in all, West has been relatively solid.

The defense was good enough to win at home. You can't expect to hold the Thunder, who have 2 of the best offensive players in the league and good offensive bigs in Kanter and Ibaka, to inefficient shooting numbers every night. There will be games when Durant and Westbrook are simply unstoppable and their role player comes alive enough to offer the necessary support.

I didn't mention Manu, because I think he's the only backcourt player that's improving. I don't care about Green's game 1. A fuckin' fluke as far as I'm concerned now. He followed it up with being 1-8 for most of the night until he finally hit 2 threes when the Spurs were down 8.

[Kawhitstorm]

Ya, I was surprised it took them so long to send help vs. Aldridge..even if you assume that he will cool down, they still have no answers for him, he won't have any problems averaging 30 if they keep playing him straight up..

Coaches tend to be STUBBORN & won't make adjustments until they are knee deep in high waters aka are down 2 games in a series.:lol

-McHale refused to double or put Dwight on LMA when he was murdering T-Jones in 2014 but changed his mind after they went down 2-0
-Clifford refused to make "adjustments" until the Hornets were down 2-0 in the 1st rd against the Heat
-Scott Brooks had WB guarding Porker in 2012 but changed his mind when they went down 2-0
-Scott Brooks also didn't bench Thabo in 2014 until Gm 3
-Nelly didn't double Tim in 2003 until Gm 3
-Feel Jackson didn't decided to pack the paint until Tim/Tony picked & rolled 'em to death to a 2-0 series lead
-Pop used to put Manu in the starting lineup when the Spurs were in trouble (i.e. 2008 vs. Hornets)

[Kawhitstorm]

The Starting back court killed us in last year's playoffs...and nothing has changed this year.

This might be the worst starting back court in the playoffs. How far can we go with it? We'll see...

The worst starting backcourt in the playoffs is actually compromised of to Leastern Conference All-Stars:

http://nba.cdn.turner.com/nba/big/teams/raptors/2016/04/30/1461985688264-NBA-WEB-160429-DEROZANLOWRYPOST.mp4-486170-1.576x324.jpg