Conspiracy Theory: 9/11 was caused by Osama Bin Laden/Al Quada (MYTH)

[Ghazi]

The single biggest proof that American society has turned into Animal Farm is that in 2016 it is blatantly obvious that 9/11 was nothing more than a Neoconservative/Zionist inside job to justify imperialist aggression in the form of "War ON Terrorism" and Americans are still too ignorant and too pussified to do anything about it. If something like this happened in any other country there would be a revolution... but Americans are subdued by pizza, chips, Iphone, Twitter, etc... it's a damn shame.

The Neocons and Zionists in the Mid 90s outlined a plan in "Project for a New American Century" in which they wanted to wipe out Syria, Iraq, Iran, Libya, and Afghanistan in order for there to be a Middle East entirely subservient to the United States. Enter 9/11 which creates a wave of Islamophobia and fear and panic which Bush and his cronies use to justify invading Afghanistan and Iraq. The war in Afghanistan was also about oil pipelines, not about wiping out the fake enemy which STILL hasn't been wiped out. This had momentum in the early 2000s after Baghdad was conquered but now is a failed abortion. They will never conquer Iran and the Zionist state is expected to collapse by 2025.

Yet Americans are still mostly under the notion that 19 random towelheads in a cave were expert enough to set up such an operation that could only be orchestrated by the CIA... it baffles me.

[baseline bum]

Advice for Guys who Hire Backpage Escorts

I thought I would start a blog to advise Guys on dealing with Backpage Escorts, especially if you feel you have been scammed, cheated, or didn't get what you paid for and how you can get even.

First, you should ask her what she services she does or won't do when you call her. Don't be disrespectfull, don't be crude or rude but be direct and make sure she is going to do the things you expect her to do.

The Second thing to do is to get her to agree to the full time your paying for. If its a half hour, hour, 2 hours whatever, get her to agree to it over the phone. Then before you pay her, have her agree again to the full amount of time your paying for. Then set your timer on your cell phone or her phone or a clock in the room so there is no disagreement when the time is up. The room depends on the situation. If she coming to your hotel room fine. If it's your place or hers thats fine too. But if you meet at a hotel, then she pays for the room. Why...because she can use it for future clients. If you pay for the room, then make sure she agrees to take it out of her fee if she gets the room key and future use of the room.

The third thing you should do is save the webpage with the ad. In Internet Explorer just click page-then save as-then choose Webpage HTML Only. If your not comfortable doing that, you can always use a screen grabber program such as ScreenHunter, which will save your computer screens content to a .jpg picture. Ads can be pulled at any time. By saving the page or doing a screengrab, you have all the information from the ad for future reference. If she calls you and its a different phone number then the one you called, save that one too...you might need it

Always bring your own condoms...Most girls don't bring that many with. The reason they don't, is if you break the 3 condoms she brought...it's over if you didn't bring any more regardless of your agreement. Girls will not continue without condoms. You should bring the right size that fits you. Cause if it comes off she gonna wanna stop. I always bring at least 4..more if its for a couple hours or multiple girls at a time. Those thing break real easy when you having fun.

Have you ever met with an escort, exchanged money and then she says I don't do blowjobs...which most of us usually start out with. I can tell you from experience that when a girl starts out by saying "I don't do blowjobs".it's only going to go downhill there. The next thing she is going to tell you is she doesn't do this position or that postion or she only does doggie. The only things an escort should be refusing to do when she charges $150, $200, $250 or more per hour is to refuse to allow you to perform oral sex ON HER or ANAL, which is extra if she does it at all.. Always find out before you exchange the money. Although it's probably not gonna work, you could try to ask for your money back before things get started. Or try to renegotiate. Don't make a gigantic scene but do be firm. If she refuses and you proceed, Which most of us are going to do anyways,...be carefull. At least your forewarned.

Another warning sign is your there and things start going and she talks all the time and doesn't seem very attentive. Or she is all matter of fact and dosen't seem into it. If you don't hear any enthusiasm, fake or not... your probably gonna be dissatisfied. Typically girls that do that are trying to bring something up. Some way to get you to cut it short. She will come up with some excuse like...I need a bus ticket so my cousin can come to town or some other lame excuse to get you to stop. She is playing on your sympathies to scam you, to get a ride, to get you to do something for her. At any rate your probably gonna hear some sob story and she wants you to do something for free. She might even say that after you do what she wants you can finish and she gonna give you more or "extra". Don't fall for it. She scamming you. Once you stop and put your clothes back on, its over. One other thing, if she says my "cousin" what she almost always means is girlfriend...romantic girlfriend.

If she calls you the next day, next week and says that she really needs to pay her rent..or something...Don't do it. She has already sized you up and has figured she can maniulate you and con you, and run game on you. If a girl calls and asks how your doing and if you need anything...welll she is just being a good saleswoman. But if she calls and its a sob story...Forget her, hang up, don't answer her calls, stay away..there are plenty of other girls who are drama free.

Tips...Don't give a tip unless you feel it was exceptional service. When you tip someone who gives you mediocore service your only telling her that she doing a great job when she isn't. Absolutely never give a tip if she asks for one...she conning you..don't fall for it.

Bring only the money your willing to spend, your ID, condoms, and cell phone. Leave your wallet locked in the car. Leave anything of value that could be stolen locked in your car. If she is coming to your hotel room...take your wallet and valuables and lock them in your car. Most escorts aren't thieves, but you shouldn't temp anyone either. Remember your dealing with a stranger..someone you know nothing about.

Friendships...BEWARE TREAD LIGHTLY...Most friendships with an escort fail. They fail because an escort is only going to use the friendship to either sell you more services, or get you to do things for free that she would normally have to pay for. Unless you have negotiated a deal, your not going to get anything except a thank you. I would strongly advise that you if you do negeotiate a deal that you get her services before you do anything for her. Remember if you agree to do something and there is no negotiation, you are dong it out of the kindness of your heart because she isn't going to give you any service after she has gotten what she wanted., regardless of what has been said or promised.

What to do if your have been scammed. The best thing you can do is go to your computer, go to Backpage.com and take out an ad. Don't be fooled, these escorts are only interested in the Money. It's the Money...the Money.. the Money. Don't delude yourself into thinking that it is anything more then the money no matter what she says or how she makes you feel. Girls who scam you think they are untouchable and that you are powerless to do anything to them. If you get ripped off or scammed then you need to tax her. You need to cut off her money. An ad on Backpage is only a couple dollars which is nothing if your scamed for $100 or more. Used the word Scam, or Fraud and the title of the girls ad to let other users of Backpage Escorts know not to patronize this girl. Use all of the phone numbers that you know she has or is associated with. If she uses an incall place...use the address. Hotel...the name and location of the hotel. Although backpage is really limited in the amount of words you can use, you can fit more information by not using spaces. Use - instead or _ or * Thats why the girls word their ads the way they do, to get everything to fit in the limited space Backpage gives them. I have placed fraud/scam ads. They work. First she or her girlfriends are going to call and complain. Believe me she knows who placed the ad because she knows who she just scammed. Don't bother answering, it means your ad is working and you can enjoy the fact that you were able to get a little justice. Guys have emailed me from my ads asking question and thanking me for alerting them. You don't have to respond, and when you write the ad you have the option not to receive emails. Although she is only going to lose money in the short term, she is going to miss out on some moeny. She will have to change her phone number or move. Fraud ads let the escorts know that this kind of conduct is not going to be tollerated by the people who respond to their ads. It also lets girls who are comtemplating placing an ad with the idea of conning people, that clients do have options when a girl cons them. Most girls do what they say and keep their agreements and provide a needed service that clients enjoy. But some girls look at guys, especially white guys, as tricks who can be maniulated and fooled cause they believe they are naive and easily conned.

One girl pissed me off so much, I got out my latex gloves, loaded paper from the middle of the pack into my printer, fired up my word processor and wrote an anonymous letter to the local police department in the area she operates in. I printed her ad and put it in the envelope with my complaint and mailed it to the police.

You can always threaten to or call the cops. I can tell you for a fact that 100% of these girls do not want it known publicly that they are an escort, and they certainly don't want the police involved. If she pisses you off enough it might be worth it to you to call the police. Your only going to get a misdemeanor. Most guys wouldn't do this...Although I would in a really bad situation...especially if she steals from you. In fact if she does steal from you, call the cops and don't let her leave. Have you heard about the story of Charlie Sheen being violent and "out of control" when he had an escort at a New York Hotel room. He was violent and out of control because she stole his very expensive watch. She locked herself in the bathroom and called the police. The cops searched her when she came out and didn't find his watch. Where do you think she put it? They didn't strip search her.

If the services you received were terrible and not worth what you spent, then take out a backpage ad and let the rest of us know. Tell us why it was terrible and why you feel cheated. The rest of us would really appreciate it and would avoid a girl like that. A girl who gives bad service should know she does. Alot of girls get into this thinking about the money...and not the service they give. Some girls don't care and want to rush you and try to get rid of you as fast as she can. I hate it when a girl stokes me really hard and fast thinking she can make me cum and get it over quick. All she ends up doing is ruffing up my little buddy and making me mad. Don't let a girl try to upsell you penetration or another girl after you have already paid for a BJ or some other service. Take out an ad and let her know that upselling ain't cool

Well I think that is enough to start, feel free to add something or some of your horror stories. Remember if you don't call a girl out on backpage for the shit she does, she is only going to do it again and again. Let her know that shit ain't cool. Take out a Backpage ad and make sure you put it in the escort section.

Remember what Charlie Sheen said, " Your not paying her for sex, Your paying her to leave when its over"

Be carefull...be safe

R.J.

[baseline bum]

The proof that 9/11 was an inside job is crushing. Here's some of it. If the links to the videos are dead, do YouTube searches on the titles.

(As of now some of the links to the videos are not hotlinks to you'll have to copy and paste them. I don't know why they didn't come out as hotlinks. They may turn into hotlinks later. Sorry for the inconvenience)


September 11 -- The New Pearl Harbor (FULL)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DOnAn_PX6M

Pilot Who Flew The Airplanes That Crashed on 9/11 Speaks Out!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IXA-enq65ng

Explosives Technician - Loader - AE911Truth.org
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5IgqJXyLbg

ARCHITECTS AND ENGINEERS FOR 911 TRUTH (full unreleased version)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-V1CiuGMJo

9/11: Explosive Evidence - Experts Speak Out (Free 1-hour version) AE911Truth.org
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ddz2mw2vaEg

Was the 9-11 Attack the 2001 Version of "Operation Northwoods"?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIoK9wvJyyU

Operation Northwoods document
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFku_mDwbsE

Painful Deceptions. 911 analysis by Eric Hufschmid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=701IvmLCAs0


This photo released by the government shows that the craft that hit the Pentagon was too small to be a 757 if there was indeed a craft there.
http://www.911-strike.com/ldsxox1.gif


There are plausible motives.

9/11 False Flag Conspiracy - Finally Solved (Names, Connections, Motives)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAAztWC5sT8

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/new-american-century/

http://www.globalresearch.ca/search?q=lithium
http://www.globalresearch.ca/search?q=iraq+oil&x=13&y=15

http://www.globalresearch.ca/iran-s-euro-denominated-oil-bourse-to-open-in-march-us-dollar-crisis-on-the-horizon/1937

NEW 2015! Solving 9/11 Christopher Bollyn Live in Dallas TX Feb 12, 2015
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVHstSrC1CQ


People who still believe the official story should check this info out.

Why Can't They See The Truth? Psychologists Help 9 11 Truth Deniers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Xzmprkpxac

http://www1.ae911truth.org/faqs/821-why-do-good-people-become-silentor-worseabout-911-.html


People who promote the no-plane theory or the mini-nuke theory are government plants trying to discredit the truth movement. Real truthers don't believe in those theories.

provocateurs,shills and disinfo agents
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYedTmaHt1A
(7:20 time mark)


Remember that a lot of pro-official version posters know that 9/11 was an inside job as well as the truthers do.
http://www.whale.to/m/disin.html
https://cultureofawareness.com/2012/09/26/disinformation-campaign-exposure-confessions-of-a-paid-disinformation-poster/

They get paid to try to obfuscate the inside job proof. Lately they've been making a lot of trash posts such as the one before this one.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aewhr16qXU

[baseline bum]

Hey baseline bum...

Why don't you debate your position instead of engaging in name-calling. Tell us why you don't believe the government did it. You just look like a horse's a-s when you just spew empty insults and don't debate the actual evidence.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aewhr16qXU

[Ghazi]

What did Al Quada gain from 9/11? What did Bush and his cronies have to gain from 9/11? Even with 0 proof common sense dictates that it was a masterful PLOT... and yet there's a lot of evidence suggesting that the story we're being spoonfed is not based on realities.

[Ghazi]

Did 9/11 serve as a recruiting tool for Al Quada? No
Did 9/11 serve as a recruiting tool for the US military? Yes
Did Al Quada expand on its "momentum" from 9/11? No
Did the Neocons use 9/11 as a justification for invading Afghanistan and Iraq? Yes

There surely will come a day when George Bush's reputation will be disgraced (as if it isn't already) when this cover up gets exposed entirely.

[baseline bum]

Hey basline bum...

You seem to be a very simple-minded person.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1tFaoakzJ8

[RandomGuy]

The single biggest proof that American society has turned into Animal Farm is that in 2016 it is blatantly obvious that 9/11 was nothing more than a Neoconservative/Zionist inside job to justify imperialist aggression in the form of "War ON Terrorism" and Americans are still too ignorant and too pussified to do anything about it. If something like this happened in any other country there would be a revolution... but Americans are subdued by pizza, chips, Iphone, Twitter, etc... it's a damn shame.

The Neocons and Zionists in the Mid 90s outlined a plan in "Project for a New American Century" in which they wanted to wipe out Syria, Iraq, Iran, Libya, and Afghanistan in order for there to be a Middle East entirely subservient to the United States. Enter 9/11 which creates a wave of Islamophobia and fear and panic which Bush and his cronies use to justify invading Afghanistan and Iraq. The war in Afghanistan was also about oil pipelines, not about wiping out the fake enemy which STILL hasn't been wiped out. This had momentum in the early 2000s after Baghdad was conquered but now is a failed abortion. They will never conquer Iran and the Zionist state is expected to collapse by 2025.

Yet Americans are still mostly under the notion that 19 random towelheads in a cave were expert enough to set up such an operation that could only be orchestrated by the CIA... it baffles me.

WOW... a new 9-11 conspiracy thread.

Been a while since we went down that well-worn path.

So were there really four hijacked planes or what?

Outline your version of events that day?

Real planes? holograms? super space satellites? missiles? chemtrails? what.

Do tell.

[RandomGuy]

What did Al Quada gain from 9/11? What did Bush and his cronies have to gain from 9/11? Even with 0 proof common sense dictates that it was a masterful PLOT... and yet there's a lot of evidence suggesting that the story we're being spoonfed is not based on realities.

Al Qaeda stood to gain a huge propaganda victory for their brand of religious/ideological nutbaggery.

Have you ever bothered reading what they said about it?

Or that they bombed the WTC before in a lame ass attempt to bring down the exact same towers? Or did you forget about that?

[RandomGuy]

Oooh maybe we could have another discussion about controlled demolition.

I like physics.

[RandomGuy]

WHUT WHUT? Ghazi .... yoo hoo...

[TeyshaBlue]

Cosmocrickets, :lol

[da_suns_fan]

Hey baseline bum...

Why don't you debate your position instead of engaging in name-calling. Tell us why you don't believe the government did it. You just look like a horse's a-s when you just spew empty insults and don't debate the actual evidence.

The government didnt do it because the government isnt remotely competent enough to pull something like that off.

Ive seen in with my own eyes when I was in the military and when I worked for a national defense contractor. I worked on a project called "Future Combat Systems". The government spent 16 BILLION dollars on the project and ended up with nothing. Trust me, the government isnt very good at execution.

I know its sensational and fun for conspiracy theorists, but the truth is the government got caught with its pants down on 9/11. They werent "all-knowing", they were clueless.

[Nbadan]

I know its sensational and fun for conspiracy theorists, but the truth is the government got caught with its pants down on 9/11. They werent "all-knowing", they were clueless

Well, they weren't exactly clueless....there were a lot of immanent attack warnings that were ignored...and that is where the govt. involvement needs to be investigated further....who knew what and when did they know it.....

[Nbadan]

Oooh maybe we could have another discussion about controlled demolition.

I like physics.

Why don't we talk about the incredible mathematical odds of three near free falling buildings when none have ever occurred before...4 successful skyjackings and 3 successful strikes..19 terrorists, or more entering the country despite being on more CIA/German Intelligence/FBI..etc...terror watch lists than Usama bin Laden....the role that Saudi intelligence played in the attacks...etc...etc...etc...

[Ghazi]

Al Quada was founded in the early 80s by USA to combat the Soviets in Afghanistan.



[da_suns_fan]

How much of the info in post #3 have you looked at?

What would it take for you to possibly believe that it wasnt a conspiracy? That Al Queda hijacked four planes and crashed them into US landmarks?

Is there ANYTHING that could possibly change your mind?

As I said, I know the government didnt do it because the government isnt nearly that capable. My experience with the government is the BUREAUCRACY prevents much of anything from getting done.

My brother just recently joined the Navy Jag as a lawyer and was blown away by all of the bizarre processes that needed to be completed that no one seemed to know how to complete. Just getting a military ID was a huge pain in the ass.

"Get used to it" is what I told him.

I think you would have to experience yourself to appreciate it. I remember when I was refinancing my house with a VA loan I needed a copy of my discharge papers. What a freaking nightmare that was. You would think I was the first person on the planet who ever needed a copy of his/her discharge papers.

[RandomGuy]

...

Yet Americans are still mostly under the notion that 19 random towelheads in a cave were expert enough to set up such an operation that could only be orchestrated by the CIA... it baffles me.


WOW... a new 9-11 conspiracy thread.

Been a while since we went down that well-worn path.

So was there really four hijacked planes or what?

Outline your version of events that day?

Real planes? holograms? super space satellites? missiles? chemtrails? what.

Do tell.


Al Quada was founded in the early 80s by USA to combat the Soviets in Afghanistan.



okaaay. So?

You haven't told me what you think really happened on 9-11. Flesh it out.

[RandomGuy]

Why don't we talk about the incredible mathematical odds of three near free falling buildings when none have ever occurred before...4 successful skyjackings and 3 successful strikes..19 terrorists

Meh. You had your chance. You failed. Let Ghazi have a go.

[RandomGuy]

What would it take for you to possibly believe that it wasnt a conspiracy? That Al Queda hijacked four planes and crashed them into US landmarks?

Is there ANYTHING that could possibly change your mind?

As I said, I know the government didnt do it because the government isnt nearly that capable. My experience with the government is the BUREAUCRACY prevents much of anything from getting done.

My brother just recently joined the Navy Jag as a lawyer and was blown away by all of the bizarre processes that needed to be completed that no one seemed to know how to complete. Just getting a military ID was a huge pain in the ass.

"Get used to it" is what I told him.

I think you would have to experience yourself to appreciate it. I remember when I was refinancing my house with a VA loan I needed a copy of my discharge papers. What a freaking nightmare that was. You would think I was the first person on the planet who ever needed a copy of his/her discharge papers.

Heh, I went right out after getting discharged and had two different courthouses put the DD-214 on microfiche in case I ever needed copies. I head some horror stories about what it takes to get copies from the army if you lose them.

BTW, Cosmored is quite insane. Not sure if you ever read his "moon landing was a hoax" thread, still going after 5+ years. His brain is broken in a fundamental way somehow. I would guess some form of autism, but that is just my guess.

[RandomGuy]

I know its sensational and fun for conspiracy theorists, but the truth is the government got caught with its pants down on 9/11. They werent "all-knowing", they were clueless.

Occams razor for the win.

http://muslimsi.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/quote-occam-s-razor-no-more-things-should-be-presumed-to-exist-than-are-absolutely-necessary-i-e-the-william-of-occam-372636.jpg

[da_suns_fan]

None of what you said makes the proof of a conspiracy go away. Evidently there are some sectors of the government that are incompetent and others that are competent. You only saw the incompetent part.

How much of the info in post #3 have you looked at?

So you want it both ways. Every branch is government is inept except the super secret group of THOUSANDS OF LUNATICS who wanted to kill Americans and make it look like terrorists.

[baseline bum]

How much of the info in post #3 have you looked at?

No one reads your retarded link spam. Also we landed on the moon in 1969.

[Ghazi]

So you want it both ways. Every branch is government is inept except the super secret group of THOUSANDS OF LUNATICS who wanted to kill Americans and make it look like terrorists.

The Bush and Bin Laden families have intimate connections. It wasn't everyone in the US government that was in on it.

It was conveniently used as a propaganda tactic to justify invading AFghanistan and Iraq, two wars that had nothing to do with eliminating terrorism whatsoever.

15 years into the War on terrorism and terrorism still exists. Nazi Germany folded after 6 years, fucking Al Quada is still around in 2016.

There was no such a thing as a war on terrorism, it was just an imperialist ploy that needed a false-flag operation to get it going... that was 9/11

9/11 wouldn't even be the first false-flag operation in American history.... Gulf of Tonkin comes to mind.

[Nbadan]

Meh. You had your chance. You failed. Let Ghazi have a go.

Failed....most Americans still believe that there was a larger conspiracy which occurred on 911 than was revealed in the 911 commission report and I failed...

:lol

[Nbadan]

Oooh maybe we could have another discussion about controlled demolition.

I like physics.

Why don't you post videos of free falling buildings instead.....

[Nbadan]

...didn't RG once accuse Truthers of being manipulated by group think?


The third major Zogby poll regarding 9/11 was conducted in August 2007. It was a telephone interview with a target of 1,000 interviews with randomly selected adults from across the United States, consisting of 71 questions, with a 3.1 percent margin of error.[6]

The results of the 2007 August poll indicate that 51 percent of Americans want the United States Congress to probe President George W. Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney regarding the 9/11 attacks and over 30 percent of those polled seek immediate impeachment. While only 32 percent seek immediate impeachment of Bush and/or Cheney based on their personal knowledge, many citizens appear eager for clear exposure of the facts.

In addition, the poll also found that two-thirds (67 percent) of Americans say the 9/11 Commission should have investigated the collapse of World Trade Center Building 7. Only 4.8 percent of the respondents agreed that members of the U.S. government "actively planned or assisted some aspects of the attack."

i don;t know what to say....these anti-truthers buy into their own BS despite public opinion clearly being against them...and they try and pass off their own conspiracy theory as the real and only truth...yes, in the words of those who support the 911 commission report....George Bush actually got one right.....

[Nbadan]

RG won't post videos of free falling buildings....I will


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-27FGbpBk4

[Nbadan]

RG also won't be interested in this...but you should be....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Laaq44SDgg

[RandomGuy]

...

Yet Americans are still mostly under the notion that 19 random towelheads in a cave were expert enough to set up such an operation that could only be orchestrated by the CIA... it baffles me.


WOW... a new 9-11 conspiracy thread.

Been a while since we went down that well-worn path.

So was there really four hijacked planes or what?

Outline your version of events that day?

Real planes? holograms? super space satellites? missiles? chemtrails? what.

Do tell.


Al Quada was founded in the early 80s by USA to combat the Soviets in Afghanistan.





okaaay. So?

You haven't told me what you think really happened on 9-11. Flesh it out.


The Bush and Bin Laden families have intimate connections. It wasn't everyone in the US government that was in on it.

It was conveniently used as a propaganda tactic to justify invading AFghanistan and Iraq, two wars that had nothing to do with eliminating terrorism whatsoever.

15 years into the War on terrorism and terrorism still exists. Nazi Germany folded after 6 years, fucking Al Quada is still around in 2016.

There was no such a thing as a war on terrorism, it was just an imperialist ploy that needed a false-flag operation to get it going... that was 9/11

9/11 wouldn't even be the first false-flag operation in American history.... Gulf of Tonkin comes to mind.

So you don't really have a theory.

You just *know* its wrong, "just 'cause." It makes you think you are better than everybody else because you "figured it all out", when you can't explain jack shit, kinda like the flat earthers.

Gotcha. Ghazi is right, and everybody else is just fooling themselves.

Unless of course, you know your theory can't stand up to critical thinking. Is that the case? I'm a bit confused. Can't, or won't flesh it out?

Can you clarify whether you can't given an alternate theory, or just won't?

[RandomGuy]

Why don't you post videos of free falling buildings instead.....

I spoon-fed you the physics. You failed to understand it. Your failure to understand why it is wrong is no longer my problem, Dan.

[RandomGuy]

...didn't RG once accuse Truthers of being manipulated by group think?



i don;t know what to say....these anti-truthers buy into their own BS despite public opinion clearly being against them...and they try and pass off their own conspiracy theory as the real and only truth...yes, in the words of those who support the 911 commission report....George Bush actually got one right.....


Description of Appeal to Popularity

The Appeal to Popularity has the following form:

Most people approve of X (have favorable emotions towards X).
Therefore X is true.

Truth is not dependent on how many people believe a thing.

Do you think it is? Yes or no.

[Nbadan]

Truth is not dependent on how many people believe a thing.

Do you think it is? Yes or no.

Your missing the point again RG...perception is more important than 'truth' .... the US has gone to war based on nothing more than perception...people die everyday based on nothing more than perception....billions of dollars are lost and gained based on nothing but perception....people are arrested, beaten and tortured based on nothing but perception...babies die based on perception...truth....what do you know about truth? You can't handle the truth....

[Nbadan]

I spoon-fed you the physics. You failed to understand it. Your failure to understand why it is wrong is no longer my problem, Dan.

....Spoon fed...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=881eaKn4Jzk

[Xevious]

15 years into the War on terrorism and terrorism still exists. Nazi Germany folded after 6 years, fucking Al Quada is still around in 2016.
And the confederates only lasted four years. What's your point?

[RandomGuy]

Your missing the point again RG...perception is more important than 'truth' .... the US has gone to war based on nothing more than perception...people die everyday based on nothing more than perception....billions of dollars are lost and gained based on nothing but perception....people are arrested, beaten and tortured based on nothing but perception...babies die based on perception...truth....what do you know about truth? You can't handle the truth....

You aren't going to get an argument from me that stupid shit happened because we freaked out about 9-11.

Non sequiturs based on a single word won't get you any closer to proving your magical conspiracy plots that you think are driving all of this.

[RandomGuy]

So Ghazi ran the fuck away.

What does it say about the strength of ones assertions about what is true or not, when they can't be bothered to explain even the smallest thing about them?

I guess we know what to do with the OP's theory.

http://www.khabrainmanchester.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/toilet-paper.jpg

[RandomGuy]

....Spoon fed...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=881eaKn4Jzk


But each floor of the building was ultimately designed to resist support the weight of the structure above it.

This weight would be equal, by definition to ONE mass regardless of whether that mass was one gram or a million tonnes. So the underlying structure can hold ONE mass plus a safety factor of some sort.

That safety factor can be thought of in terms of the mass of the building.

If you assume that safety factor is 200%, then ultimately if the building collapse begins at the 90th floor out of 110, the lower 90 floors could support a structure weighing twice what the upper 20 floors would weigh.

This is the relative forces involved.

The simple physics here shows that the collapse about 25-30 floors down applies a dynamic force to the floor below it of about 29+ times that of the stationary mass.

Meaning that if the truthers are to be believed, the 80 floors below the collapsing section could have easily supported a safety factor of 2900% of the stationary mass.

Follow this logically and apply that to the 30 floors, 30*29, and you get a building that could have conceivedly been almost a thousand stories tall.

Since I have yet to see, even 40 years after the initial construction of the WTC towers, a building that is two miles high, I think it is a safe assumption that the safety factor was much less than 2900%.

In my calculations I ALWAYS gave favorable assumptions to the truther movement, and there was still more than enough force to ultimately collapse the buildng.

"free fall debunked".

For NBADan

[Nbadan]

The OP may be full of shit, but we already know there were more conspirators than we originally knew about, that alone warrants a new investigation....

[RandomGuy]

PE= m *9.8*413= 4073m

Mass is, by definition, simply a measurement of how much force a given amount of material will exert AT REST on an object that is resisting gravity.

SOOOO

The top floor would hit the ground with the same force as a 4073 story building, if that fall was unimpeded.

Now let's consider the fall of the top 30 stories.

They fell through the 3-5 floors of damaged sections and impacted the building below with some amount of force.

Let's call the distance accelerated as 3 floors and be generous. This is 11 meters.

Acceration of an object for 11 meters at 70% of gravity(dan's figure), would yeild an ending velocity of:


v^2= 2ad=2*9.8*.7*11=150=v^2, find the square root of 150, and bada bing, you get 12 meters per second

Substitute this into the kinetic energy equation:
ke= 150*.5*m=ke=75m

This means the 30 floor section impacts the undamaged portion with the kinetic energy of SEVENTY FIVE TIMES ITS MASS.

Think about this for a moment.

The lower section of the building is designed to hold that 30 stories stationary plus a safety margin of 10 or 20%. So the maximum force that the underlying structure could apply to that falling section is 1.2 times its mass.

Further:
That falling section having as much kinetic energy as 75 times its mass means that it is effectively applying the same amount of force at the impact point that a 2270 story building would. if you held it stationary. (simple math: 30*75)
For the statement "the building would not have collapsed without explosives" implies that the building could have been TWENTY TWO TIMES TALLER THAN IT ACTUALLY WAS without collapsing. :rolleyes

STILL FURTHER

Your calculations seem to imply that the building structure below could absorb 30% of the falling energy.

IN JUST THE FIRST 11 METERS OF A 400 METER COLLAPSE THERE IS 62 TIMES THE AMOUNT OF FORCE REQUIRED TO COLLAPSE THE BUILDING.

Your assumption of about 1/3 the energy used to collapse the building is about 20 times what is reasonable. (1/62*20= 1/3) (more actually, if you consider the further distance and mass)

What happens, then when MORE mass is added AND accelerated?

Even if half the mass falls away or off to the side, there is still FAR more force and energy than would be needed to collapse the building WITHOUT ANY EXPLOSIVES.


The funny thing about this bit is that even if you only consider the first 3 meters instead of the first 12 meters, there is still more than enough force to collapse the building.

In response to this, Dan produced a video from a nice young man who also did some calculations, but forgot that gravity didn't stop accelerating mass once it got moving.

So the best the truther movement can come up with are obvious beginners mistakes in physics to support their "it was too strong to collapse without explosives" bit.

Take bad physics, the inability to answer a straight question when asked, taking quotes out of context, outright making shit up, and what do you think a real jury would make out of that, Dan?

[RandomGuy]

Spoon.

Fed.

[Nbadan]

You aren't going to get an argument from me that stupid shit happened because we freaked out about 9-11.

Non sequiturs based on a single word won't get you any closer to proving your magical conspiracy plots that you think are driving all of this.

...not just stupid shit RG.....shit that has never happened before...

....3 buildings falling from fire
....simultaneous successful hijackings
....20+ terrorists, on the terror list, getting into the country undetected
....air defense drills going on on 911 (surprise)
....clone transponder signals coming form some of the hijacked planes
....mystery cell phone calls from planes moving between cell phone towers (anyone with a cell phone knows this pain)
....planes traveling at well above their g level...

I could go on and on and on....

[Nbadan]

Spoon.

Fed.

served....

[Nbadan]

...not just stupid shit RG.....shit that has never happened before...

....3 buildings falling from fire
....simultaneous successful hijackings
....20+ terrorists, on the terror list, getting into the country undetected
....air defense drills going on on 911 (surprise)
....clone transponder signals coming form some of the hijacked planes
....mystery cell phone calls from planes moving between cell phone towers (anyone with a cell phone knows this pain)
....planes traveling at well above their g level...

I could go on and on and on....

When you look at each of these things that happened individually you could say, well, buildings could fall from fire into their own footprint.....never happened before but it could happen..

[Nbadan]

....simultaneous hijackings in the US.....could happen....

[Nbadan]

Terrorists, some of who fought for Bin Laden in Chechnya, Afghanistan..etc.. getting into the US undetected...could happen....

[DarrinS]

lol, twoofers

[Nbadan]

Air defense drills for our National air defense system over Washington and NY on at NORAD, confusing our fighters in the air and somehow producing mystery transponder signals....could happen....

[Nbadan]

...cell phone calls from planes traveling 500+mph.........could happen....

[Nbadan]

Planes making incredible turns at speeds they were not designed to fly by at least one pilot who just weeks prior was kicked out of flight school because he could not fly a signal engine plane....could happen...

[RandomGuy]

...not just stupid shit RG.....shit that has never happened before...

....3 buildings falling from fire
....simultaneous successful hijackings
....20+ terrorists, on the terror list, getting into the country undetected
....air defense drills going on on 911 (surprise)
....clone transponder signals coming form some of the hijacked planes
....mystery cell phone calls from planes moving between cell phone towers (anyone with a cell phone knows this pain)
....planes traveling at well above their g level...

I could go on and on and on....

The individual elements of this well worn schtick were long ago debunked to anyone with any sense.

"It never happened before" is meaningless, and is ridiculous on its face. "No one ever flew a heavier than air craft before, therefore it didn't happen".

[RandomGuy]

...cell phone calls from planes traveling 500+mph.........could happen....

There were no "cell phone" calls from the planes. Factually incorrect.

http://travelskills.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Screen-Shot-2014-09-23-at-5.12.23-PM.png

Calls were made from the planes, by systems designed to transmit voice at altitude.

You do know this technology existed back then right? Is this some sort of mystery to you?

[RandomGuy]

When you look at each of these things that happened individually you could say, well, buildings could fall from fire into their own footprint.....never happened before but it could happen..

Buildings didn't "fall into their own footprint". Also factually incorrect.

http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20101231073424/wtcdemolition/images/8/8a/FEMAdebrimap.jpg

[RandomGuy]

The single biggest proof that American society has turned into Animal Farm is that in 2016 it is blatantly obvious that 9/11 was nothing more than a Neoconservative/Zionist inside job to justify imperialist aggression in the form of "War ON Terrorism" and Americans are still too ignorant and too pussified to do anything about it. If something like this happened in any other country there would be a revolution... but Americans are subdued by pizza, chips, Iphone, Twitter, etc... it's a damn shame.

The Neocons and Zionists in the Mid 90s outlined a plan in "Project for a New American Century" in which they wanted to wipe out Syria, Iraq, Iran, Libya, and Afghanistan in order for there to be a Middle East entirely subservient to the United States. Enter 9/11 which creates a wave of Islamophobia and fear and panic which Bush and his cronies use to justify invading Afghanistan and Iraq. The war in Afghanistan was also about oil pipelines, not about wiping out the fake enemy which STILL hasn't been wiped out. This had momentum in the early 2000s after Baghdad was conquered but now is a failed abortion. They will never conquer Iran and the Zionist state is expected to collapse by 2025.

Yet Americans are still mostly under the notion that 19 random towelheads in a cave were expert enough to set up such an operation that could only be orchestrated by the CIA... it baffles me.

and you are still an idiot, who ran away from his own thread as soon as anyone pressed him on his bullshit.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/e8/db/6e/e8db6ebd8dd82b63dfad49026060566c.jpg

BUCK BUCK BUCK BAGOOOOCK!!

[CosmicCowboy]

Buildings didn't "fall into their own footprint". Also factually incorrect.

For all practical purposes Tower 1 & 2 did. When the structural steel at the fire floors got red hot it lost it's strength and the concrete floors above started pancaking and stacking. Then the combined weight of the floors became too much for the lower structures to handle and the floors literally pancaked on top of each other in layers. Obviously there was a lot of debris ejected but for the most part it was a vertical stack.

[RandomGuy]

For all practical purposes Tower 1 & 2 did. When the structural steel at the fire floors got red hot it lost it's strength and the concrete floors above started pancaking and stacking. Then the combined weight of the floors became too much for the lower structures to handle and the floors literally pancaked on top of each other in layers. Obviously there was a lot of debris ejected but for the most part it was a vertical stack.

Pretty much. But not quite as neat as Dan would like.

The problem that the conspiratards miss is that the explosives they think were used produce ejecta that would have scattered shards of stuff for literally miles away. They then retreat to "thermite", and fail to produce evidence for that either.

[CosmicCowboy]

Pretty much. But not quite as neat as Dan would like.

The problem that the conspiratards miss is that the explosives they think were used produce ejecta that would have scattered shards of stuff for literally miles away. They then retreat to "thermite", and fail to produce evidence for that either.

That's just a dumb theory. Bottom line when steel gets red hot it loses it's physical strength properties. The trusses bowed, tons of weight started collapsing and the central column couldn't hold it and failed.

[RandomGuy]

That's just a dumb theory. Bottom line when steel gets red hot it loses it's physical strength properties. The trusses bowed, tons of weight started collapsing and the central column couldn't hold it and failed.

Eyup. Impact damage, and prolonged fire softening structural steel.

Physics does the rest. As I pointed out to the demolition people, it is a bit like a man holding a 100 pound bag over his head. He can do so, up to the limits of his endurance, but that is what the bottom part of the building did for decades.

Then you had the beginnings of a collapse, and that static force becomes a dynamic one. Drop that same 100 pound bag from 10-12 feet over that same man, and you get that thing imparting over half a ton of force (i.e. "weight") at point of impact, far more than the man can hold up.

Remember "weight" is just a measurement of force.

I gained a whole new appreciation for the energy of motion doing the learnin' for all that.

[Nbadan]

There were no "cell phone" calls from the planes. Factually incorrect.

http://travelskills.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Screen-Shot-2014-09-23-at-5.12.23-PM.png

Calls were made from the planes, by systems designed to transmit voice at altitude.

You do know this technology existed back then right? Is this some sort of mystery to you?

We've gone through this before RG....it's in your 911 commission report bible.....of course there were cell phone calls made from 911 planes...

[Nbadan]

Buildings didn't "fall into their own footprint". Also factually incorrect.

http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20101231073424/wtcdemolition/images/8/8a/FEMAdebrimap.jpg

Really?

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/images/2010/09/457945.jpg

[Nbadan]

Other building collapses...

http://s2.dmcdn.net/J1E5_.jpg

[Nbadan]

http://www.irishtimes.com/polopoly_fs/1.2528024.1455017466!/image/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/box_620_330/image.jpg

[Nbadan]

http://online.wsj.com/media/shanghai_building_cs_20090629035740.jpg

[Nbadan]

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQjU53Cx81xhqMMxLhP36wE8f8HX-YHRn51-_nCZYym7TIJ2hnX

[Nbadan]

For all practical purposes Tower 1 & 2 did. When the structural steel at the fire floors got red hot it lost it's strength and the concrete floors above started pancaking and stacking. Then the combined weight of the floors became too much for the lower structures to handle and the floors literally pancaked on top of each other in layers. Obviously there was a lot of debris ejected but for the most part it was a vertical stack.

NIST rejected the pancake theory....

[Nbadan]

That's just a dumb theory. Bottom line when steel gets red hot it loses it's physical strength properties. The trusses bowed, tons of weight started collapsing and the central column couldn't hold it and failed.

There were multiple central columns ....at some point the opposing forces would have slowed down the collapse under your pancake theory....

[Nbadan]

Plus, there was no pancaking from the top in WTC7.....the central trusses collapsed by fire according to the 911 Commission report....

[FuzzyLumpkins]

...not just stupid shit RG.....shit that has never happened before...

....3 buildings falling from fire
....simultaneous successful hijackings
....20+ terrorists, on the terror list, getting into the country undetected
....air defense drills going on on 911 (surprise)
....clone transponder signals coming form some of the hijacked planes
....mystery cell phone calls from planes moving between cell phone towers (anyone with a cell phone knows this pain)
....planes traveling at well above their g level...

I could go on and on and on....

You cannot argue the math so you come with this shit? You can go on with your tin foil shit all day I'm sure but your root argument remains shit.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

NIST rejected the pancake theory....

The concluded in their own words:


NIST’s findings do not support the “pancake theory” of collapse, which is premised on a progressive failure of the floor systems in the WTC towers (the composite floor system—that connected the core columns and the perimeter columns—consisted of a grid of steel “trusses” integrated with a concrete slab; see diagram). Instead, the NIST investigation showed conclusively that the failure of the inwardly bowed perimeter columns initiated collapse and that the occurrence of this inward bowing required the sagging floors to remain connected to the columns and pull the columns inwards. Thus, the floors did not fail progressively to cause a pancaking phenomenon.

You have to love people that cite something for convenience but reject the other conclusions such as


NIST’s findings also do not support the “controlled demolition” theory since there is conclusive evidence that:
the collapse was initiated in the impact and fire floors of the WTC towers and nowhere else, and;

the time it took for the collapse to initiate (56 minutes for WTC 2 and 102 minutes for WTC 1) was dictated by (1) the extent of damage caused by the aircraft impact, and (2) the time it took for the fires to reach critical locations and weaken the structure to the point that the towers could not resist the tremendous energy released by the downward movement of the massive top section of the building at and above the fire and impact floors.

Video evidence also showed unambiguously that the collapse progressed from the top to the bottom, and there was no evidence (collected by NIST or by the New York City Police Department, the Port Authority Police Department, or the Fire Department of New York) of any blast or explosions in the region below the impact and fire floors as the top building sections (including and above the 98th floor in WTC 1 and the 82nd floor in WTC 2) began their downward movement upon collapse initiation.

In summary, NIST found no corroborating evidence for alternative hypotheses suggesting that the WTC towers were brought down by controlled demolition using explosives. NIST also did not find any evidence that missiles were fired at or hit the towers. Instead, photographs and videos from several angles clearly show that the collapse initiated at the fire and impact floors and that the collapse progressed from the initiating floors downward until the dust clouds obscured the view.

It wasn't 'pancake because of the trussing of the exterior columns. It is also the mechanism by which they explain the trajectory of the collapse. Of the other buildings you used you obviously did not look for ones built using the same techniques. You clearly just biased towards 'different.'

Don't be a sophist piece of shit.

[Nbadan]

From LZ's own link


NIST’s findings do not support the “pancake theory” of collapse

That's the only point I made....everything else is LZ panty-wetting....

[Nbadan]

Thus, the floors did not fail progressively to cause a pancaking phenomenon.

[Nbadan]

Rg and Fuzzy don't not want you to see this....

Detailed Account of Telephone Calls From September 11th Flights
http://911research.wtc7.net/planes/evidence/calldetail.html

http://911research.wtc7.net/planes/evidence/docs/exhibit/EdwardFeltPic.png

For example, the slide in the right-hand column for Edward Felt indicates that he used a cell phone.

[Nbadan]

Eyewitnesses...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nQrpLp-X0ws

[Nbadan]

Dan Rather....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koUl7arMncs

[Nbadan]

Windsor tower madrid...burned for 20 consecutive hours..


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4MjsVnasLA

[Nbadan]

Fire Weakens Steel but not Woman Waving in WTC North Tower


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3151MqXu52s

[Nbadan]

What really happened...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-wXcJA-et0

[z0sa]

Gross negligence seems much more likely than any concrete conspiracy. Flight 93 crashing into a field proves as much.

[Nbadan]

George Bush...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpMzkIR1ymw

[Nbadan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpcJyn3N5ks

[Nbadan]

Kurt Sonnenfeld....first some background....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0I6yEezSDV8

[Nbadan]

And now....The Kurt Sonnenfeld videos.......


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjEWLWxtNHg

[Nbadan]

Part 2


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtLSJtyysJ8

[Nbadan]

finally, for those of you who still have doubts...

MIT Engineer Disputes 911 Theory of the WTC Collapse-Part 1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8W-t57xnZg
MIT Engineer Disputes 911 Theory of the WTC Collapse-Part 2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qW81Cd7nNH8

Of course, RG won't watch any of these....so.....

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Spam away the same old shit. You cannot make a cogent argument on your own. Thinking for yourself is not your strong suit. Confirmation bias sophistry at it's finest.

[Nbadan]

What ever Fuzzy....one final spoonfeeding for RG...



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YRUso7Nf3s

[RandomGuy]

NIST rejected the pancake theory....

Initially.

Read the report.

[RandomGuy]

We've gone through this before RG....it's in your 911 commission report bible.....of course there were cell phone calls made from 911 planes...

No, there weren't.

But hey, your claim, your burden of proof.

Please show where "cell" phone calls were made.

Remember "cellular" includes seat back phones, twit.

[RandomGuy]

What ever Fuzzy....one final spoonfeeding for RG...



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YRUso7Nf3s

:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao

Ok, thanks for the funny.

"why do falling things keep accelerating?"

HOLY FUCK that is funny.

The guy does some ill-designed experiments in his back yard, misses the main concepts, and then, like every other twoofer moron, buys into, and regurgitates every stupid theory and assertion about the towers collapse without spending an iota of time/effort doing any critical thinking.

The flaws in his experiment were readily obvious to me. Care to guess what the fatal one is? Or do you care?

The only thing this video is good for, aside from the laugh factor, is to demonstrate just how bad twoofers are at actually reasoning. The throw away line at the end, scoffing about the engineers with their "equations" was particularly telling.

[RandomGuy]

From LZ's own link


That's the only point I made....everything else is LZ panty-wetting....

If you read the context they were talking about the initiation of the collapse. If my memory of it is correct. Feel free to actually read the whole thing, sophist.

[RandomGuy]

(reads previous page with 8 or 9 youtubes from conspiracy buffs)

oh shit, here comes the youtube spam.

Fuck I almost forgot what it is like arguing with twoofers.

Not going to watch any of it. Already done, and every single time it was a waste. Every single fucking time.

The clips never say what the twoof movement thinks they do, and get shit wrong all the time.

Lies, mistakes, and cherry picking.

Not convincing.

[RandomGuy]

Rg and Fuzzy don't not want you to see this....

Detailed Account of Telephone Calls From September 11th Flights
http://911research.wtc7.net/planes/evidence/calldetail.html

http://911research.wtc7.net/planes/evidence/docs/exhibit/EdwardFeltPic.png

For example, the slide in the right-hand column for Edward Felt indicates that he used a cell phone.

And the source of the information about it being "his cell phone"?

A 9-11 conspiracy website picture caption?

That is what you are hanging your hat on?

Really?

[RandomGuy]

then there is the fact that even if you get to "cell phone" call, the flight was buzzing at an altitude that makes it possible.

https://sites.google.com/site/wtc7lies/Flight93altitudeprofilesm-full.jpg

https://sites.google.com/site/wtc7lies/flight93page1

leaving us with a "so what?"

Hell, let's grant some measure of truth to the caption.

What does it show? That the plane was low enough to make a call near the end of its flight? Didn't we already know that?

so
fucking
what?

Ghazi still chickening out of his own thread.

[RandomGuy]

finally, for those of you who still have doubts...

Of course, RG won't watch any of these....so.....

I spent my time watching this shit a while back. You're right.

You won't return the favor. You expect everybody else to watch your shitty videos, then hide your head in the sand when given material to watch in turn that refutes your point very thoroughly.


Why would anyone watch your material when you aren't honest or interested enough in the truth to do the same?

[pgardn]

So Ghazi ran the fuck away.

What does it say about the strength of ones assertions about what is true or not, when they can't be bothered to explain even the smallest thing about them?

I guess we know what to do with the OP's theory.

http://www.khabrainmanchester.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/toilet-paper.jpg

[z0sa]

The question any truther avoids answering is... why plan a conspiracy when gross negligence is so much easier to pull off and infinitely harder to prove?

[Nbadan]

The question any truther avoids answering is... why plan a conspiracy when gross negligence is so much easier to pull off and infinitely harder to prove?

The perpetrators weren't gonna leave anything to chance...this was military precision and planning...once the hijackers committed, it was a go...and even that they didn't leave to chance...

[Nbadan]

They only had this one chance, on that one day to get this right...we don't know everyone who was involved but those who would have needed to be involved include Dick Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld.....

[Nbadan]

Dick Cheney orchestrated the NORAD simulations on Sept 11th that made the attacks a success....

[Nbadan]

How do you know NIST is lying?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YaFGSPErKU

[Nbadan]

On cell phones...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ed2kFQu6Ux0

[Nbadan]

Ted Olsen cell phone calls..


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJA2zH1gc1Q

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Molten metal, cell phones, free fall, demolitions, etc. Posting the same shit that has been discussed and refuted as if those discussions never took place is the stuff of WC and DarrinS. Good job.

[Nbadan]

Molten metal, cell phones, free fall, demolitions, etc. Posting the same shit that has been discussed and refuted as if those discussions never took place is the stuff of WC and DarrinS. Good job.

Just because you ignored them before does not mean they are no longer anomalies...testimony of cell phone calls from 911 planes comes from the Zacarias Moussaoui trial not from some conspiratorial website as RG claims...The 911 Commission could only verify two cell phones calls made from hijacked planes, but clearly, just from testimony of family who received the calls, there were others...

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Just because you ignored them before does not mean they are no longer anomalies...testimony of cell phone calls from 911 planes comes from the Zacarias Moussaoui trial not from some conspiratorial website as RG claims...The 911 Commission could only verify two cell phones calls made from hijacked planes, but clearly, just from testimony of family who received the calls, there were others...

Again your assertions have been rebutted before even in this thread. You just ignore them and regurgitate the same shit. It is exactly what DarrinS and WC do. Again good job.

You are waving your hands at the use of 'cell phone' in the transcripts and has been argued in this thread included the seat phones. You just ignore this like those dickheads do and then wait awhile to repeat the same shit again. You don't do anything do discount that possibility and then claim it's Cheney. It's kinda funny like watching a Jerry Lewis movie but at the end of the day all I can do is pity you.

[Nbadan]

Again your assertions have been rebutted before

Nothing has been 'rebutted' Fuzzy...you 'Bush got one right crowd' do everything you can to avoid talking seriously about anything....not once in this thread nor any other 911 thread has the cell phone call issue ever been settled....you guys just regurgitate the same old tired conspiracy theory moon-bat talking points...

[RandomGuy]

Just because you ignored them before does not mean they are no longer anomalies...testimony of cell phone calls from 911 planes comes from the Zacarias Moussaoui trial not from some conspiratorial website as RG claims...The 911 Commission could only verify two cell phones calls made from hijacked planes, but clearly, just from testimony of family who received the calls, there were others...

Debunked is not "ignored".

They are being ignored now, because they are just as debunked now, as the first 1,000 times you presented the material.

[RandomGuy]

Nothing has been 'rebutted' Fuzzy...you 'Bush got one right crowd' do everything you can to avoid talking seriously about anything....not once in this thread nor any other 911 thread has the cell phone call issue ever been settled....you guys just regurgitate the same old tired conspiracy theory moon-bat talking points...

What is there to rebut? Some phone calls were made. and?

What do you think says? What theory does it support to you?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Nothing has been 'rebutted' Fuzzy...you 'Bush got one right crowd' do everything you can to avoid talking seriously about anything....not once in this thread nor any other 911 thread has the cell phone call issue ever been settled....you guys just regurgitate the same old tired conspiracy theory moon-bat talking points...

So now you make it about supporting Bush? You're flailing now with the Pee Wee routine.

[RandomGuy]

What ever Fuzzy....one final spoonfeeding for RG...



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YRUso7Nf3s

:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao

Ok, thanks for the funny.

"why do falling things keep accelerating?"

HOLY FUCK that is funny.

The guy does some ill-designed experiments in his back yard, misses the main concepts, and then, like every other twoofer moron, buys into, and regurgitates every stupid theory and assertion about the towers collapse without spending an iota of time/effort doing any critical thinking.

The flaws in his experiment were readily obvious to me. Care to guess what the fatal one is? Or do you care?

The only thing this video is good for, aside from the laugh factor, is to demonstrate just how bad twoofers are at actually reasoning. The throw away line at the end, scoffing about the engineers with their "equations" was particularly telling.

[RandomGuy]

I figured it out in rather short order. The guy in the video talks a lot about theories and evidence, then completely fails to understand gravity, kinetic energy, and the structure of the building.

He fails to understand the basic structure of the building, and seems to think he can adequately represent the hollow floors of the world trade center with a bunch of cinderblocks stacked on top of each other.

The buildings had floors, and open space between the floors.

X


X


X


X


Bam, first floor hits second floor, and they both start falling.


Dudes model looks like:

X


X
X
X
X

Of course the first cinderblock absorbs the falling mass. What the fucktard didn't get is that there was no solid support to keep the two crumbled, falling cinderblocks from simply falling again USING THE SPACE BETWEEN FLOORS TO ACCELERATE AND GAIN MORE KINETIC ENERGY on the floor below it, unlike his model where he stacked all the remaining cinderblocks directly on top of each other.

Fucking duh, just like I have been trying to get through your fucking thick skull for years.

MORE fail.

[RandomGuy]

But each floor of the building was ultimately designed to resist support the weight of the structure above it.

This weight would be equal, by definition to ONE mass regardless of whether that mass was one gram or a million tonnes. So the underlying structure can hold ONE mass plus a safety factor of some sort.

That safety factor can be thought of in terms of the mass of the building.

If you assume that safety factor is 200%, then ultimately if the building collapse begins at the 90th floor out of 110, the lower 90 floors could support a structure weighing twice what the upper 20 floors would weigh.

This is the relative forces involved.

The simple physics here shows that the collapse about 25-30 floors down applies a dynamic force to the floor below it of about 29+ times that of the stationary mass.

Meaning that if the truthers are to be believed, the 80 floors below the collapsing section could have easily supported a safety factor of 2900% of the stationary mass.

Follow this logically and apply that to the 30 floors, 30*29, and you get a building that could have conceivedly been almost a thousand stories tall.

Since I have yet to see, even 40 years after the initial construction of the WTC towers, a building that is two miles high, I think it is a safe assumption that the safety factor was much less than 2900%.

In my calculations I ALWAYS gave favorable assumptions to the truther movement, and there was still more than enough force to ultimately collapse the buildng.

"free fall debunked".

For NBADan


PE= m *9.8*413= 4073m

Mass is, by definition, simply a measurement of how much force a given amount of material will exert AT REST on an object that is resisting gravity.

SOOOO

The top floor would hit the ground with the same force as a 4073 story building, if that fall was unimpeded.

Now let's consider the fall of the top 30 stories.

They fell through the 3-5 floors of damaged sections and impacted the building below with some amount of force.

Let's call the distance accelerated as 3 floors and be generous. This is 11 meters.

Acceration of an object for 11 meters at 70% of gravity(dan's figure), would yeild an ending velocity of:


v^2= 2ad=2*9.8*.7*11=150=v^2, find the square root of 150, and bada bing, you get 12 meters per second

Substitute this into the kinetic energy equation:
ke= 150*.5*m=ke=75m

This means the 30 floor section impacts the undamaged portion with the kinetic energy of SEVENTY FIVE TIMES ITS MASS.

Think about this for a moment.

The lower section of the building is designed to hold that 30 stories stationary plus a safety margin of 10 or 20%. So the maximum force that the underlying structure could apply to that falling section is 1.2 times its mass.

Further:
That falling section having as much kinetic energy as 75 times its mass means that it is effectively applying the same amount of force at the impact point that a 2270 story building would. if you held it stationary. (simple math: 30*75)
For the statement "the building would not have collapsed without explosives" implies that the building could have been TWENTY TWO TIMES TALLER THAN IT ACTUALLY WAS without collapsing. :rolleyes

STILL FURTHER

Your calculations seem to imply that the building structure below could absorb 30% of the falling energy.

IN JUST THE FIRST 11 METERS OF A 400 METER COLLAPSE THERE IS 62 TIMES THE AMOUNT OF FORCE REQUIRED TO COLLAPSE THE BUILDING.

Your assumption of about 1/3 the energy used to collapse the building is about 20 times what is reasonable. (1/62*20= 1/3) (more actually, if you consider the further distance and mass)

What happens, then when MORE mass is added AND accelerated?

Even if half the mass falls away or off to the side, there is still FAR more force and energy than would be needed to collapse the building WITHOUT ANY EXPLOSIVES.


The funny thing about this bit is that even if you only consider the first 3 meters instead of the first 12 meters, there is still more than enough force to collapse the building.

In response to this, Dan produced a video from a nice young man who also did some calculations, but forgot that gravity didn't stop accelerating mass once it got moving.

So the best the truther movement can come up with are obvious beginners mistakes in physics to support their "it was too strong to collapse without explosives" bit.

Take bad physics, the inability to answer a straight question when asked, taking quotes out of context, outright making shit up, and what do you think a real jury would make out of that, Dan?

[RandomGuy]

For the statement "the building would not have collapsed without explosives" implies that the building could have been TWENTY TWO TIMES TALLER THAN IT ACTUALLY WAS without collapsing. :rolleyes


Twenty two times. (ok 29 actually, I built in an error that it took Dan years to catch).

That is a building five+ miles tall.

That is essentially what the conspiracy theorists are trying to say, because they want so desperately to rule out simple gravity-fed collapses. They are essentially implying that the world trade center towers could be five miles tall, something that would make any real building engineer laugh you out of her office.

That is what the fucking dolt in the video doesn't want you to know or look up. "stupid equations"

Because those equations, incontrovertible rules of the universe, make the whole fucking stupid goddamn "explosives are required theory" look like the fucking bukkake of dumb that it is.

[RandomGuy]

Dick Cheney orchestrated the NORAD simulations on Sept 11th that made the attacks a success....

What can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.

No, he didn't.

[RandomGuy]

How do you know NIST is lying?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YaFGSPErKU

DhHzMttUKO0

What was claimed to be molten steel was just simply molten aluminum.

http://www.chromalox.com/content/case-studies/case-study-19-Molten-Aluminum-Pot.jpg

Molten aluminum, at the temperatures achieved in the fires in the buildings.

https://citizenfor911truth.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/moltenmetalwtc2-2.jpg

None of your eyewitnesses applied any chemical tests on the "molten" metal, did they?

They can honestly say they saw molten metal. Sure. Molten "steel" assumes quite a bit. A assumption that is never supported by evidence sufficient for any reasonable person to reach the conclusion that the claim holds up.

How did the witnesses in your video conclude that the molten metal was "steel"?

[Clipper Nation]

Twoofers make Flat Earthers look like geniuses.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

The airframes of almost all modern aircraft are made of aluminum. So was the entire facade of the building itself. The wreckage where the jet fuel was centrally burning from would have been a big hunk of aluminum.


But but but steel . . . .

What is sad is he behaves just like Darrin. He knows all of this as he's been told at least half a dozen times. Very similar pathology as the God delusion. He wants to believe it.

[DarrinS]

The airframes of almost all modern aircraft are made of aluminum. So was the entire facade of the building itself. The wreckage where the jet fuel was centrally burning from would have been a big hunk of aluminum.


But but but steel . . . .

What is sad is he behaves just like Darrin. He knows all of this as he's been told at least half a dozen times. Very similar pathology as the God delusion. He wants to believe it.


Lol, at least 3rd mention of me. Obsessed much? :lmao

Rent free

[RandomGuy]

Twoofers make Flat Earthers look like geniuses.

Sometimes they are the same people. Dumb squared.

[RandomGuy]

Lol, at least 3rd mention of me. Obsessed much? :lmao

Rent free

You are merely the tin standard when it comes to presenting someone who reaches bad conclusions on bad evidence, and prefers feeling good about what they believe over truth. twoofers of course being the gold standard, or maybe its the steel standard, we never know because they fail to test the mettle of their arguments.

[Ghazi]

Theres an interview with Osama Bin Ladrn right after 9/11 in which he denies any involvement in the 9/11 attacks

[Clipper Nation]

Theres an interview with Osama Bin Ladrn right after 9/11 in which he denies any involvement in the 9/11 attacks
Well, that settles that I guess. :rolleyes

Taqiyya - Saying something that isn't true as it relates to the Muslim identity.

Tawriya - Intentionally creating a false impression.

[DarrinS]

You are merely the tin standard when it comes to presenting someone who reaches bad conclusions on bad evidence, and prefers feeling good about what they believe over truth. twoofers of course being the gold standard, or maybe its the steel standard, we never know because they fail to test the mettle of their arguments.


I don't think having a non-alarmist take on climate change is on par with 911 trutherism.

[Ghazi]

Well, that settles that I guess. :rolleyes

Taqiyya - Saying something that isn't true as it relates to the Muslim identity.

Tawriya - Intentionally creating a false impression.
More plausible than one man outsmarting a $40 billion a year intelligence network.

[DarrinS]

More plausible than one man outsmarting a $40 billion a year intelligence network.

Wasn't one man

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I don't think having a non-alarmist take on climate change is on par with 911 trutherism.

That's not what I said nor what he said, dimwit. A twofer reminded me of you and you think you have accomplished something. Your parents must be so proud.

[DarrinS]

That's not what I said nor what he said, dimwit. A twofer reminded me of you and you think you have accomplished something. Your parents must be so proud.

the burn

[FuzzyLumpkins]

the burn

you spend too much time trying to tell me you don't care. There are several cliches centered around that idea. Shakespeare understood it. Youre no Shakespeare though.

People that actually don't care don't protest it; they disregard. People that are posturing otoh do. Actions speak louder, dimwit.

[Spurtacular]

1316193949430800389

[Ef-man]

1316193949430800389

So Obama buys Iran’s silence on BinLaden?

He was not president on 9/11/01 and would he not found leverage against and been able to destroy the republican party for letting BinLaden attack US or escape (so why a coverup)? Plus, why would Iran only ask for $152B when they too could have destroyed the republican party?

Moar youtube/tweeter gibberish from the brokeback derp who is sounding more like cosmored everyday.