Pau vs. Tim for the "Tim only struggled b/c of Adams/Ibaka/Kanter" crowd

[Kawhitstorm]

You do know that Tim ACTUALLY played in April right? Pop was trying to give him reps before the postseason started so let's see how he fared:



Split
Value
G
GS
MP
FG
FGA
3P
3PA
FT
FTA
ORB
TRB
AST
STL
BLK
TOV
PF
PTS
FG%
3P%
FT%
TS%
USG%
ORtg
DRtg
+/-
MP
PTS
TRB
AST


Month
October
2
2
55
7
15
0
0
9
9
3
14
1
2
3
3
4
23
.467

1.000
.607
17.3
115
93
+16.0
27.5
11.5
7.0
0.5



November
15
15
418
59
112
0
1
25
35
34
139
50
12
26
30
43
143
.527
.000
.714
.561
17.3
108
91
+15.3
27.8
9.5
9.3
3.3



December

11
11
273
37
73
0
0
12
18
16
72
34
8
11
21
21
86
.507

.667
.531
17.0
102
94
+21.5
24.8
7.8

6.5
3.1




January
9
9
214
32
66
0
1
12
16
11
54
25
11
9
9
20
76
.485
.000
.750
.520
17.2
111
96
+21.5
23.8
8.4
6.0
2.8



February

7
7
152
18
49
0
0
9
12
11
48
17
3
9
9
15
45
.367

.750
.415
19.3
93
100
+4.5
21.7
6.4
6.9
2.4



March
12
11
285
44
81
0
0
16
26
28
88
28
10
13
11
17
104
.543

.615
.563
16.9
117
98
+15.7
23.7
8.7
7.3
2.3



April

5
5
140
18
45
0
0
9
15
12
32
8
1
7
7
5
45
.400

.600
.436

19.6
92

107
-9.4

28.0
9.0
6.4
1.6






Split
Value
G
GS
MP
FG
FGA
3P
3PA
FT
FTA
ORB
TRB
AST
STL
BLK
TOV
PF
PTS
FG%
3P%
FT%
TS%
USG%
ORtg
DRtg
+/-
MP
PTS
TRB
AST


Month
October
3
3
94
15
32
0
2
4
4
4
23
6
3
10
6
7
34
.469
.000
1.000
.504
19.3
95
90
-2.6
31.3
11.3
7.7
2.0



November
12
12
343
70
171
0
5
31
42
27
131
29
8
18
13
21
171
.409
.000
.738
.451
25.9
97
95
-3.9
28.6
14.3
10.9
2.4



December

14
14
468
101
203
4
10
60
75
39
157
48
7
37
32
35
266
.498
.400
.800
.564
24.8
113
99
+5.2

33.4
19.0
11.2
3.4



January
15
15
486
107
213
5
9
42
51
33
173
60
6
26
39
24
261
.502
.556
.824
.554
25.0
109
102
+2.9
32.4
17.4
11.5
4.0



February

11
11
374
76
161
8
18
43
50
19
124
66
8
16
24
24
203

.472
.444
.860
.555
24.4
114
105
-0.4
34.0
18.5
11.3
6.0



March
12
12
366
66
154
4
17
35
46
24
129
69
7
24
40
26
171
.429
.235
.761
.491
25.5
97
103
-5.7
30.5
14.3
10.8
5.8



April
5
5
160
32
61
3
8
14
21
9
56
16
3
15
10
11
81
.525
.375
.667
.577
23.2
112

104
-12.5
32.1
16.2
11.2
3.2



When Pau had his FULL compliment of teammates in December (Bulls beat the Spurs during that span) he was ACTUALLY better than PRE-injury Tim::wow
-Tim: +8 net rtg
-Pau: +14 net rtg

:hat

Pau struggled when Butler/Rose/Noah were out w/ injuries & he had to carry the offense (check out his assist numbers) while having to also manning the paint ala Tim in 2014-15 when the Spurs were wrecked w/ injuries. He held up in February but he wore down in March then bounced back when Butler/Rose returned back to the lineup to finish the season.

**Ignore the boxscore +/- b/c the Bulls were a lotto team**

[Mr. Body]

Tim in his prime would have ripped up any of those guys.

[Jdspur20]

Tim in his prime would have ripped up any of those guys.

Agree but that's not what the OP is saying.

[SpursFan86]

I don't think there should be much doubt at all that Pau will be an upgrade over last year's Duncan...especially the post-knee injury Duncan we saw down the stretch of the season and in the playoffs.

Our starting lineup is almost certainly going to be better than it was last year. Aldridge will have another year under his belt. Pau should be an upgrade over Duncan. Green can't possibly be any worse than he was last year :lol I'm actually very excited to see them play.

Our bench is where the question marks come into play. Is Patty going to have a bounce back season? How will Manu look at 39 years old? Is KA ready to take a step forward and become a consistent contributor off the bench? Are guys like Bertans or LJC going to be worth a damn in their first NBA seasons? How will Dedmon fit in? Shit could either go really well, or really poorly. Could see us having one of the best benches in the league or one of the worst ones :lol

[Kawhitstorm]

Our bench is where the question marks come into play. Is Patty going to have a bounce back season? How will Manu look at 39 years old? Is KA ready to take a step forward and become a consistent contributor off the bench? Are guys like Bertans or LJC going to be worth a damn in their first NBA seasons? How will Dedmon fit in? Shit could either go really well, or really poorly. Could see us having one of the best benches in the league or one of the worst ones :lol

The Cavs bench was pretty mediocre until they made the Frye trade.

Mozgov/Shumpert/Sideshow Bob were horrific in the regular season, Delly had regressed & Dick Jefferson was their best backup wing.:lol

Maybe Patty can have a contract year season & Fat Head will have a breakout season. I've a feeling someone like Carlos Boozer is going to end up being the backup PF since he was PATFO fall back plan if D-Worst didn't sign:

618112007741550592

749319733191712768

Already brown nosing::lol

752535751326330880

[Joseph Kony]

The Cavs bench was pretty mediocre until they made the Frye trade.

Mozgov/Shumpert/Sideshow Bob were horrific in the regular season, Delly had regressed & Dick Jefferson was their best backup wing.:lol

Maybe Patty can have a contract year season & Fat Head will have a breakout season. I've a feeling someone like Carlos Boozer is going to end up being the backup PF since he was PATFO fall back plan if D-Worst didn't sign:

618112007741550592

749319733191712768

Already brown nosing::lol

752535751326330880
jesus fuck no :vomit:

[Jdspur20]

Boozer would be an ok option for a 4th big man.

[Kawhitstorm]

Boozer would be an ok option for a 4th big man.

Out of all the free agent big men who fall into the "vet" category, Brandon Bass would be the PERFECT 4th big but he opted out of a 3 mill guaranteed deal so he's looking to get paid. So, it's basically Boozer/D-Lee/Big Baby.:lol

[TD 21]

Out of all the free agent big men who fall into the "vet" category, Brandon Bass would be the PERFECT 4th big but he opted out of a 3 mill guaranteed deal so he's looking to get paid. So, it's basically Boozer/D-Lee/Big Baby.:lol

No, he wouldn't. Bass can't space to three and isn't much of a passer either.


And I don't think anyone thinks Duncan's struggles were because of a particular opponent, though they were magnified/exacerbated by it. His struggles were because his one decent knee was shot. End of story.

Posting raw totals is antiquated and silly though. Raw totals are largely based on circumstance. Gasol's role will now be similar to Duncan's and as such, his numbers will decline significantly. It won't necessarily mean he's any worse than last season though.

[Kawhitstorm]

His struggles were because his one decent knee was shot. End of story.

Except Pau was better when Tim had one good knee (see December)


Posting raw totals is antiquated and silly though.
Raw totals?:lmao

Move the wool covering your eyes b/c the list INCLUDES ORtg/DRtg/TS%/USG%...etc

[TD 21]

Except Pau was better when Tim had one good knee (see December)


Raw totals?:lmao

Move the wool covering your eyes b/c the list INCLUDES ORtg/DRtg/TS%/USG%...etc

No reading comprehension whatsoever. I said Duncan's struggles were because his one previously decent knee was shot, not "he was better than Gasol in the first half of the season".

[Kawhitstorm]

No reading comprehension whatsoever. I said Duncan's struggles were because his one previously decent knee was shot, not "he was better than Gasol in the first half of the season".

Buddy, you were in the other post arguing that Tim was a better finisher than Pau even AFTER his knee was shot: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=262124&page=2&p=8665693&viewfull=1#post8665693

:wakeup

[TD 21]

Buddy, you were in the other post arguing that Tim was a better finisher than Pau even AFTER his knee was shot: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=262124&page=2&p=8665693&viewfull=1#post8665693

:wakeup

Ah, now it's move the goal post time and refer to another thread.

Buddy, I never said that. I said the numbers don't support this notion that Gasol is in a different league as a finisher.

[Kawhitstorm]

Ah, now it's move the goal post time and refer to another thread.

This post was inspired by your claim that there wasn't enough sample size in the playoffs & that it had to do w/ him facing Ibaka/Adams.:lol (Why does it matter where you made the statement unless you're trying to cover it up?.....alas, it's on record:nope)


Buddy, I never said that. I said the numbers don't support this notion that Gasol is in a different league as a finisher.

Look at their April numbers & get back at me.:rolleyes Tim was cooked even after Pop rested him then tried to get him going before the playoffs started.

[TD 21]

This post was inspired by your claim that there wasn't enough sample size in the playoffs & that it had to do w/ him facing Ibaka/Adams.:lol (Why does it matter where you made the statement unless you're trying to cover it up?.....alas, it's on record:nope)



Look at their April numbers & get back at me.:rolleyes Tim was cooked even after Pop rested him then tried to get him going before the playoffs started.

The playoffs are a small sample size and I said it was magnified/exacerbated by him facing Ibaka/Adams. But again, that's another matter altogether.

This originated when you claimed I said he was better than at Gasol at any point last season, which is made up. Then you tried to change the subject because you came off looking like a damn fool.

Who needs an entire season's worth of evidence, when you can isolate one month? :rolleyes

[Kawhitstorm]

This originated when you claimed I said he was better than at Gasol at any point last season, which is made up. Then you tried to change the subject because you came off looking like a damn fool.

I posted their stats from the ENTIRE season & you STILL want more.:lmao


Who needs an entire season's worth of evidence, when you can isolate one month? :rolleyes

I suggest you look at the month of December when Pau had his full compliment of teammates & Tim actually had a good knee.:rolleyes

[TD 21]

Here's the genesis of this . . .


And I don't think anyone thinks Duncan's struggles were because of a particular opponent, though they were magnified/exacerbated by it. His struggles were because his one decent knee was shot. End of story.


Except Pau was better when Tim had one good knee (see December).

What I said had nothing to do with Gasol and I've never claimed in this or any thread that Gasol, all around, wasn't better from start to finish last season.

You either inexplicably completely misunderstood what was said or are flat out making things up.

[Kawhitstorm]

What I said had nothing to do with Gasol and I've never claimed in this or any thread that Gasol, all around, wasn't better from start to finish last season.

You either inexplicably completely misunderstood what was said or are flat out making things up.

Gasol had a TS of 56% in December when he didn't have to play 1-on-5, meanwhile Tim w/ on good knee had a TS% of 53% w/ a majority of his shots coming at the rim. If Pau was playing w/ LMA/Kawhi instead of Noah/Taj/Snell then he would have been shooting 60%.

[TD 21]

Gasol had a TS of 56% in December when he didn't have to play 1-on-5, meanwhile Tim w/ on good knee had a TS% of 53% w/ a majority of his shots coming at the rim. If Pau was playing w/ LMA/Kawhi instead of Noah/Taj/Snell then he would have been shooting 60%.

Again, what does this have to do with what I said?

Here, I'll put it in bold and all caps this time, so maybe you'll comprehend it: GASOL WAS THE BETTER ALL AROUND PLAYER FROM START TO FINISH LAST SEASON, BUT BY PERCENTAGE, HE DIDN'T FINISH BETTER AT THE RIM.

You make some valid points as to why and I agree that he'll probably finish better next season, but that doesn't change the fact that he didn't last season.

[spurraider21]

The Cavs bench was pretty mediocre until they made the Frye trade.

Mozgov/Shumpert/Sideshow Bob were horrific in the regular season, Delly had regressed & Dick Jefferson was their best backup wing.:lol

Maybe Patty can have a contract year season & Fat Head will have a breakout season. I've a feeling someone like Carlos Boozer is going to end up being the backup PF since he was PATFO fall back plan if D-Worst didn't sign:

618112007741550592

749319733191712768

Already brown nosing::lol

752535751326330880
:lmao 2015 tweet abou boozer

[Kawhitstorm]

Here, I'll put it in bold and all caps this time, so maybe you'll comprehend it: GASOL WAS THE BETTER ALL AROUND PLAYER FROM START TO FINISH LAST SEASON, BUT BY PERCENTAGE, HE DIDN'T FINISH BETTER AT THE RIM

Except Gasol was a better finisher at the rim when Butler/Rose were healthy & he was getting dump offs at the rim like Tim in December. A majority of Gasol's shot at the rim (0-3) were from post-ups which he converted at a respectable rate while Tim was HORRIFIC on post-ups aka when he had a defender on his shoulder.

Basically, if Gasol was getting the same looks as Tim then his shooting percentage would be pretty similar to what he put up in December.