A lot of people in here want higher taxes...

[CosmicCowboy]

So how many of you actually PAY income taxes?

[Th'Pusher]

So how many of you actually PAY income taxes?

I do!

[CosmicCowboy]

The half that don't pay income tax obviously want the half that does to pay more so they can get more. It's only human nature.

[CosmicCowboy]

I do!

Do you want to pay more?

Do you think you get fair value for the taxes you pay?

[CosmicCowboy]

I definitely don't.

[Pelicans78]

Do you want to pay more?

Do you think you get fair value for the taxes you pay?

I know I don't want to pay more federal taxes unless it solely pays for defense, security, public utilities, infrastructure, roads, bridges, levees, natural disasters. Otherwise, anything else is BS.

[CosmicCowboy]

The half that don't pay income tax obviously want the half that does to pay more so they can get more. It's only human nature.

it's also good politics to cater to the lowest common denominator and promise more free shit.

[Th'Pusher]

Do you want to pay more?

Do you think you get fair value for the taxes you pay?

I would pay more in taxes in exchange for a single payer healthcare system...obviously I wouldn't pay for healthcare through my work. Likely a wash...

wrt value, That's a complex question. The federal government is the largest employer in America. That's a lot of jobs...that money goes back into the economy, etc. etc.

[Th'Pusher]

it's also good politics to cater to the lowest common denominator and promise more free shit.

It's also good politics to promise tax cuts across the board regardless of whether it's good policy.

[CosmicCowboy]

It's also good politics to promise tax cuts across the board regardless of whether it's good policy.

Good point but I think lower taxes do more to grow GDP than higher taxes and higher GDP at a lower tax rate can produce more gross dollars than a higher tax rate at a lower GDP.

[TeyshaBlue]

All I know it's there is 2.1 trillion parked overseas. That's a shit load of infrastructure waiting to happen.

[Th'Pusher]

Good point but I think lower taxes do more to grow GDP than higher taxes and higher GDP at a lower tax rate can produce more gross dollars than a higher tax rate at a lower GDP.
I think that depend on where the tax cuts go. As the richest people pay more taxes, they'll obviously reap the lion's share of the benefits of an across the board tax cuts. There's no signification evidence supports your claim.

[TeyshaBlue]

I would pay more in taxes in exchange for a single payer healthcare system...obviously I wouldn't pay for healthcare through my work. Likely a wash...

wrt value, That's a complex question. The federal government is the largest employer in America. That's a lot of jobs...that money goes back into the economy, etc. etc.

+10. :tu

[Pelicans78]

Single-payer health care is a retarded solution.

[Th'Pusher]

All I know it's there is 2.1 trillion parked overseas. That's a shit load of infrastructure waiting to happen.
So are you arguing for repatriation at a lower rate?

[Th'Pusher]

Single-payer health care is a retarded solution.
Solid rebuttal.

[TeyshaBlue]

So are you arguing for repatriation at a lower rate?

Oh, hell no. Imagine what that stack is earning in simple cost of money figures.

[TeyshaBlue]

Pay the fucking taxes on it already.

[CosmicCowboy]

I would pay more in taxes in exchange for a single payer healthcare system...obviously I wouldn't pay for healthcare through my work. Likely a wash...

wrt value, That's a complex question. The federal government is the largest employer in America. That's a lot of jobs...that money goes back into the economy, etc. etc.

Single payer would certainly save me a shitload of money. I pay 100% of healthcare premiums for employees and family and that's up to almost $20,000 a month for my little company. i'm not typical though and it could mean that your average middle class taxpayer could see the taxes going up 4-5 thousand. They have to pay for their health care and also the 'other half" that doesn't pay anything.

[CosmicCowboy]

So are you arguing for repatriation at a lower rate?

Absolutely. If you don't it's not ever coming back. I quoted Tim Cook in another thread...


What do you say in response to Nobel economist Joseph Stiglitz’s comments on Bloomberg [television], where he called Apple’s profit reporting in Ireland a “fraud”?

I didn’t hear it. But if anybody said that, they don’t know what they’re talking about. Let me explain what goes on with our international taxes. The money that’s in Ireland that he’s probably referring to is money that is subject to U.S. taxes. The tax law right now says we can keep that in Ireland or we can bring it back. And when we bring it back, we will pay 35 percent federal tax and then a weighted average across the states that we’re in, which is about 5 percent, so think of it as 40 percent. We’ve said at 40 percent, we’re not going to bring it back until there’s a fair rate. There’s no debate about it. Is that legal to do or not legal to do? It is legal to do. It is the current tax law. It’s not a matter of being patriotic or not patriotic. It doesn’t go that the more you pay, the more patriotic you are.

[Th'Pusher]

Pay the fucking taxes on it already.
:tu

[Th'Pusher]

Absolutely. If you don't it's not ever coming back. I quoted Tim Cook in another thread...
i don't have a problem with lowering the corporate tax rate as long as it removes the loopholes and levels the playing field so large connected companies pay little to nothing while small and mid-sized companies pay the higher rates.

There should be no need for a lower repatriation rate in that case.

[CosmicCowboy]

i don't have a problem with lowering the corporate tax rate as long as it removes the loopholes and levels the playing field so large connected companies pay little to nothing while small and mid-sized companies pay the higher rates.

There should be no need for a lower repatriation rate in that case.

Tim Cook again...


In the meantime, it’s important to look at what we do pay. Our marginal rate, our effective rate in the U.S. is over 30 percent. We are the largest taxpayer in the United States. And so we’re not a tax dodger. We pay our share and then some. We don’t have these big loopholes that other people talk about. The only kind of major tax credit that we get is the R&D tax credit, which is available to all companies in the United States. That’s important to know. The second thing I would point out is we have money internationally because we have two-thirds of our business there. So we earn money internationally. We didn’t look for a tax haven or something to put it somewhere. We sell a lot of product everywhere. And we want to bring it back, and we’ve been very honest and straightforward about that.

[Th'Pusher]

Tim Cook again...

Again, I don't mind lowering the corporate tax rate to a fairer rate across the board. If this is the case, there should be no need for a special one-off repatriation rate which have proved ineffective in the past.

[TeyshaBlue]

Tim Cook again...

Cook needs to factor the 6-8% annualCOM gains in that cash before he whines about paying 40%. What an asshole.

[Th'Pusher]

Single payer would certainly save me a shitload of money. I pay 100% of healthcare premiums for employees and family and that's up to almost $20,000 a month for my little company. i'm not typical though and it could mean that your average middle class taxpayer could see the taxes going up 4-5 thousand. They have to pay for their health care and also the 'other half" that doesn't pay anything.

Your situation is atypical. The vast majority of people get their health insurance through their employer and most pay for a portion of it. I have a hard time believing middle class tax payers would see increases of $4-5k after taking into account (deducting) what they pay for healthcare today. Especially considering significant cost controls could be introduced with a single payer or hybrid system.

[CosmicCowboy]

Again, I don't mind lowering the corporate tax rate to a fairer rate across the board. If this is the case, there should be no need for a special one-off repatriation rate which have proved ineffective in the past.

It's really hard to grow a small company with the corporate tax rate. I actually have to take money as salary/bonus out of the company that I don't really need in order to limit double taxation. At 50K retained earnings it starts at 15%, at 75K it goes to 25% and at 100K it goes to 34%. No way I'm leaving more than 75K retained earnings.

[Th'Pusher]

It's really hard to grow a small company with the corporate tax rate. I actually have to take money as salary/bonus out of the company that I don't really need in order to limit double taxation. At 50K retained earnings it starts at 15%, at 75K it goes to 25% and at 100K it goes to 34%. No way I'm leaving more than 75K retained earnings.

That's a result of a shitty corporate tax structure which has evolved over time with a shitload of special interest loopholes. I'm all for simplifying the tax code (corporate and personal) the difficult thing is eliminating the loopholes.

[CosmicCowboy]

That's a result of a shitty corporate tax structure which has evolved over time with a shitload of special interest loopholes. I'm all for simplifying the tax code (corporate and personal) the difficult thing is eliminating the loopholes.

The system makes it really hard to borrow money to start a business. lets say you borrow $500,000 due in 5 years. Not even counting interest you have to pay taxes on earnings BEFORE you can pay principal...so with our tax code you have to make $700,000 just to pay off the money you borrowed before you can make a dime personally.

[ElNono]

So how many of you actually PAY income taxes?

I pay income tax, both federal and state.

[Spurminator]

I have had no problem or issue with paying a higher tax rate as I've increased my income and could easily afford more. I'd be happy to pay more for better teachers, infrastructure, law enforcement, and social safety net.

[SnakeBoy]

So how many of you actually PAY income taxes?

A better way to ask is what percentage of their salary do they actually pay in federal income tax. I asked that once years ago and I think only you and Drachen were willing to answer. The biggest "raise taxes" posters wouldn't answer and called the question unfair...meaning they aren't paying shit.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Raising the corporate tax wouldn't result in more taxes being paid. Corps just change their accounting to decrease their exposure. What it does do is cause business to reinvest and upgrade their shit. I'm tired of the nihilist Milton Friedman motto of business' only purpose is to make money for shareholders. What does need to be done is taxing the shit out of bonuses particularly to executives.

The problem with health care currently is that it puts the onus on business to pay it. Tying it to payroll makes it hard to raise wages. It also puts even more of an onus on small business because of US health cares divide and conquer practice. You cannot negotiate a better price with only 6 employees as opposed to those with 1000.

Single payer helps business and worker. It just doesn't help big business and certain industries. Fuck em I say.

[Warlord23]

You guys whine too much. In the UK, I'm paying:
- 40% marginal income tax rate on more than two-thirds of my gross income
- 6% national insurance (to cover specific benefit programs)
- A fixed council tax which funds local services
- 20% VAT on goods and services

I do think I pay too much. But I also understand the problems faced by most developed countries - an aging population and insufficient working age adults supporting them. Countries have tried to encourage immigration from developing countries to fix that imbalance, but that brings another set of issues with it. Global trade and the difficulty in moving away from manufacturing towards high-end services is an ongoing problem. There are no easy solutions: the Conservatives will protect the portion of the welfare bill that is targeted at older people, and Labour / Lib Dems will try and protect the part that is aimed at younger adults. At least we don't waste money on the military-industrial complex like the US does, and people don't die because they don't have medical cover.

I would like to see a re-balancing of how tax money is spent. A reduction in public sector and senior citizen pensions, tightening welfare benefits, industry subsidies and government administrative expenses - a gradual increase in infrastructure (especially broadband), education and health services.

[Th'Pusher]

A better way to ask is what percentage of their salary do they actually pay in federal income tax. I asked that once years ago and I think only you and Drachen were willing to answer. The biggest "raise taxes" posters wouldn't answer and called the question unfair...meaning they aren't paying shit.

Ok snake. What was your effective tax rate?

[Splits]

I've posted my W2s the past two years. I bet I pay more in taxes than most of this board makes. And I still think it's too low.

[CosmicCowboy]

I've posted my W2s the past two years. I bet I pay more in taxes than most of this board makes. And I still think it's too low.

link?

[sickdsm]

Would greatly prefer national and state sales tax/flat tax.

[boutons_deux]

Would greatly prefer national and state sales tax/flat tax.

Horribly, INTENTIONALLY regressive. Typical fuck-the-poor rightwingnut strategy.

[RandomGuy]

So how many of you actually PAY income taxes?

I do.

I also don't feel any disinclination to make more money because of taxes. Not buying that myth.

[boutons_deux]

I do.

I also don't feel any disinclination to make more money because of taxes. Not buying that myth.

that myth trashed decades ago in Sweden, other Scandinavian high-tax countries.

[pgardn]

The half that don't pay income tax obviously want the half that does to pay more so they can get more. It's only human nature.

I most likely pay more income tax than you do.

And yes I would be willing to pay more in income tax. Especially if I knew more was going to public education and infrastructure. I would benefit in the long run.

[boutons_deux]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14045953_1113264815395188_1696931017993382007_n.pn g?oh=fff6fd48c3c7fbe01ee803ec7f203ec8&oe=5816BCBF

Looks like the majority of Americans are tired of the failed policies of trickledown economics.

69% of Americans support an increase on the tax rate of those making $250,000 or more.

And that includes 54% of Republicans and 68% of Independents!

https://www.facebook.com/berniesanders/photos/a.324119347643076.89553.124955570892789/1113264815395188/?type=3&theater

The tax code is rigged.

The riggers have fantastic power and wealth (ownership of slavish politicians) to keep it rigged.

And of course, the multi-millionaire politicians would never vote themselves higher taxes.

[pgardn]

A better way to ask is what percentage of their salary do they actually pay in federal income tax. I asked that once years ago and I think only you and Drachen were willing to answer. The biggest "raise taxes" posters wouldn't answer and called the question unfair...meaning they aren't paying shit.

This is a good point. I would have to go back and look as this can vary a great deal for people like me.

[CosmicCowboy]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14045953_1113264815395188_1696931017993382007_n.pn g?oh=fff6fd48c3c7fbe01ee803ec7f203ec8&oe=5816BCBF

Looks like the majority of Americans are tired of the failed policies of trickledown economics.

69% of Americans support an increase on the tax rate of those making $250,000 or more.

And that includes 54% of Republicans and 68% of Independents!

https://www.facebook.com/berniesanders/photos/a.324119347643076.89553.124955570892789/1113264815395188/?type=3&theater

The tax code is rigged.

The riggers have fantastic power and wealth (ownership of slavish politicians) to keep it rigged.

And of course, the multi-millionaire politicians would never vote themselves higher taxes.



Fuck the jealous 69%. It's already 33% over $190,000.

[boutons_deux]

Fuck the jealous 69%. It's already 33% over $190,000.

not jealous, people are tired of being screwed while the 1% make out like bandits.

[CosmicCowboy]

not jealous, people are tired of being screwed while the 1% make out like bandits.

Sounds like a jealous bitch to me.

Not my fault you aren't happy with your income.

[boutons_deux]

Sounds like a jealous bitch to me.

Not my fault you aren't happy with your income.

... just another fucked up, wrong post from self-congratulating, fuck-all-y'all and look-at-how-high-my-taxes-are whiny CosmicParasite.

[CosmicCowboy]

... just another fucked up, wrong post from self-congratulating, fuck-all-y'all and look-at-how-high-my-taxes-are whiny CosmicParasite.

I get paid what people think I'm worth. I trade value for dollars.

Whats your excuse?

[sickdsm]

It really doesn't matter what the majority feel. It matters what is right and just.



Would hitler be justified in persecuting the jews if the majority were in favor that way?


Do you feel the same way regarding enviromental issues?

[sickdsm]

Taxes should be tax deductible also.

[DMX7]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14045953_1113264815395188_1696931017993382007_n.pn g?oh=fff6fd48c3c7fbe01ee803ec7f203ec8&oe=5816BCBF

Looks like the majority of Americans are tired of the failed policies of trickledown economics.

69% of Americans support an increase on the tax rate of those making $250,000 or more.

And that includes 54% of Republicans and 68% of Independents!

https://www.facebook.com/berniesanders/photos/a.324119347643076.89553.124955570892789/1113264815395188/?type=3&theater

The tax code is rigged.

The riggers have fantastic power and wealth (ownership of slavish politicians) to keep it rigged.

And of course, the multi-millionaire politicians would never vote themselves higher taxes.



So many of the wealthiest people aren't making most of their money through ordinary salaries. They make it through capital gains, qualified dividends, and all sorts of other things that shield them from higher tax rates that effect salaries.

[Spurminator]

Tax rate should not be seen as a fix for wealth inequality.

[CosmicCowboy]

Tax rate should not be seen as a fix for wealth inequality.

True.

It's not finite like a pie where you can only add to the smaller slice by taking away from the bigger slice. A healthy growing economy is the best equalizer and you don't get that by raising taxes.

[boutons_deux]

True.

It's not finite like a pie where you can only add to the smaller slice by taking away from the bigger slice. A healthy growing economy is the best equalizer and you don't get that by raising taxes.

CC WRONG again.

Nearly all growth in income, aka bigger pie, since the Banksters' Great Depression has gone to the top 5%, while the 95% has been losing income and net worth, where it existed.

[CosmicCowboy]

CC WRONG again.

Nearly all growth in income, aka bigger pie, since the Banksters' Great Depression has gone to the top 5%, while the 95% has been losing income and net worth, where it existed.

So?

It's not like the top 5% stole it from the bottom 95%.

The simple fact is all those middle class assembly line manufacturing jobs are gone for good. They aren't coming back no matter what Trump or Hillary do.

We are a service economy servicing a service economy and a lot of those jobs don't pay shit because they don't require shit talent to do them.

Massive immigration and the underground economy hasn't helped either...they work for cheap so fewer unskilled jobs are available for the perpetual underclass.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Sounds like a jealous bitch to me.

Not my fault you aren't happy with your income.

Everyone compares themselves with everyone else. 90% of the new wealth goes to the 1%, wages are stagnant for 30 years, and as soon as the Arabs normalize their output the price of everything is going to start to rise again.

I bet you say the same thing when your old lady gets mad when she finds you trolling the playground. Just because they are jealous doesn't mean that the sentiment is justified, pedofattie.

[SnakeBoy]

Ok snake. What was your effective tax rate?

I'm not going to dig out my tax returns for details but I know last year it was 19% of gross including self employment tax which was pretty sweet I think. Been able to take some nice deductions as well as max out the SEP for the past few years...it's nice.

And you?

[SnakeBoy]

So?

It's not like the top 5% stole it from the bottom 95%.



Boutons thinks if other people had less he would have more

[Xevious]

I agree that taxing the rich at a higher rate does not fix wealth inequality, but trickle down economics doesn't work either. Stimulating the economy and raising wages for the middle class should be viewed as a separate issue instead of thinking some silver bullet tax adjustment is going to change things. So the question is, what is the increase in tax revenue used for?

[boutons_deux]

It's not like the top 5% stole it from the bottom 95%.


goddam, you're so full shit you misinform yourself.

Predatory lending, liar's loans, violatons of Federal regulations governing Federally insured mortgages, and up to 6M homes STOLEN through fraudulent foreclosures, most often with systematic broken chain of title, aka, MERS, robo-signing, foreclosure mills, etc, etc.

For-profit health is clearly form of theft, to enrich mgmt and

hedge funds, P/E outfits pilfer exorbitant, hidden fees from pension funds

[Th'Pusher]

...

[Th'Pusher]

Fuck the jealous 69%. It's already 33% over $190,000.

That would be 33% on every dollar of taxable income over $190,000. So if you made $190K per year and every single dollar of it was taxable, meaning you have no deductions (which is basically impossible), you would pay an effective tax rate 26.8%.

You love to throw around these high tax rates, but effective tax rates are what matter.

[Th'Pusher]

I'm not going to dig out my tax returns for details but I know last year it was 19% of gross including self employment tax which was pretty sweet I think. Been able to take some nice deductions as well as max out the SEP for the past few years...it's nice.

And you?


~22% of gross. Refinanced my house at a few years ago at 2.55% (which is great), but I'm not paying and therefor deducting nearly as much interest.

[TeyshaBlue]

Nice rate but the mortgage interest deduction does stuck. I did a refi last year and didn't anticipate the hit.

[RandomGuy]

True.

It's not finite like a pie where you can only add to the smaller slice by taking away from the bigger slice. A healthy growing economy is the best equalizer and you don't get that by raising taxes.

What if the economy grows and the only people benefitting from that growth are the people at the top?

How much of our economy should go to service the fabulously wealthy?

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/09/23/article-2207353-05C530900000044D-665_634x408.jpg

When do we say that we value the education of poor children more than the ability of the Kardashians to buy another $10,000 pair of fucking shoes?

[rmt]

What if the economy grows and the only people benefitting from that growth are the people at the top?

How much of our economy should go to service the fabulously wealthy?

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/09/23/article-2207353-05C530900000044D-665_634x408.jpg

When do we say that we value the education of poor children more than the ability of the Kardashians to buy another $10,000 pair of fucking shoes?

It's not the Kardashians buying $10k worth of shoes that's affecting poor children's education (and it's not for lack of taxpayer dollars spent either). More likely, the culprit is Democrat's resistance to school choice, their strong support of teachers' union (and the ability to get rid of bad teachers) and parental non-involvement. I don't follow the Kardashians, but if they have found a way to parlay their talent/life, etc into money and people follow then, then more power to them. I don't see why they should be blamed for poor kids' education or why anyone should be criticizing how anyone spends their own money. Others also have that freedom to try to earn money.

[CosmicCowboy]

It's not the Kardashians buying $10k worth of shoes that's affecting poor children's education (and it's not for lack of taxpayer dollars spent either). More likely, the culprit is Democrat's resistance to school choice, their strong support of teachers' union (and the ability to get rid of bad teachers) and parental non-involvement. I don't follow the Kardashians, but if they have found a way to parlay their talent/life, etc into money and people follow then, then more power to them. I don't see why they should be blamed for poor kids' education or why anyone should be criticizing how anyone spends their own money. Others also have that freedom to try to earn money.

True

and to think the Kardashian empire started with a sex tape...:lmao

RG, guess you could try that...:lol

[tlongII]

:lol

[pgardn]

I'm not going to dig out my tax returns for details but I know last year it was 19% of gross including self employment tax which was pretty sweet I think. Been able to take some nice deductions as well as max out the SEP for the past few years...it's nice.

And you?

17% last year. That's lower than other years for sure. I know I have had others over 20%. But I do not ask the accountant to seek out every detail because I am sloppy keeping up. Lazy. Also I no debt. I don't carry inventory etc... Own everything straight up. When was the last time you got audited?

[RandomGuy]

It's not the Kardashians buying $10k worth of shoes that's affecting poor children's education (and it's not for lack of taxpayer dollars spent either). More likely, the culprit is Democrat's resistance to school choice, their strong support of teachers' union (and the ability to get rid of bad teachers) and parental non-involvement. I don't follow the Kardashians, but if they have found a way to parlay their talent/life, etc into money and people follow then, then more power to them. I don't see why they should be blamed for poor kids' education or why anyone should be criticizing how anyone spends their own money. Others also have that freedom to try to earn money.

The only talent these rich kids have is winning the genetic lottery.

My point was more along the line of the widows farthings, when it comes to allocating tax burdens. Progressive income taxes is a very Christian concept in that regard.

[RandomGuy]

True

and to think the Kardashian empire started with a sex tape...:lmao

RG, guess you could try that...:lol


heh, think I will pass.

[Winehole23]

Entitlements and government services are popular on both sides of the aisle but one side demands a pony too: tax cuts.

Republicans think they shouldn't have to pay for entitlements by corresponding cuts in services. It's the two Santa Claus theory.

[Winehole23]

given the trend of wealth accumulation since the 1980's, who can most afford to pay?


The Great Recession and the subsequent recovery from it have deepened the wedge between the very wealthy and everyone else in America, plunging the poor deeper into debt and wiping out two-fifths of the wealth held by families in the heart of the middle class. The wealthiest Americans, meanwhile, appear close to regaining all their losses over the same period, according to a new analysis released Thursday by the Congressional Budget Office (https://www.cbo.gov/publication/51846).


The analysis shows the wealthiest 10 percent of Americans now hold three-quarters of the nation's wealth, up from two-thirds in 1989, and a three percentage-point increase from the start of the recession. Most Americans found themselves with less wealth in 2013 than Americans of a similar age had in 1989; the only age group doing better than its counterparts from a quarter-century ago was senior citizens.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/08/18/the-wealthy-have-nearly-healed-from-recession-the-poor-havent-even-started/

[Winehole23]

in b4 CC suggests that people who have already been flayed need more skin in the game.

[ducks]

people love to give to the government because they spend their money so wisely HUH

I pay as little taxes as possible like most responsible people. I would rather give my money to my kids then the government!

[baseline bum]

people love to give to the government because they spend their money so wisely HUH

I pay as little taxes as possible like most responsible people. I would rather give my money to my kids then the government!

You have kids! Holy fuck that's a scary thought.

[Wild Cobra]

I missed this thread somehow.

I would like everyone who said they pay income taxes qualify that a little better.

When you file your tax return, are you still paying taxes, or is your refund equal or more than what your paid in federal and/or state?

Some people pay taxes out of every paycheck, then get even more back on their return because of things like EIC. These people are not paying taxes. they are using the government as a no interest savings account.

[ducks]

I got solar so I got tax credit:hat Also we get alot of sun in AZ!
I guess that is bad because I use it for my advantage! OH NO I guess it is a good thing I am not running for the President!

[boutons_deux]

I got solar so I got tax credit:hat Also we get alot of sun in AZ!
I guess that is bad because I use it for my advantage! OH NO I guess it is a good thing I am not running for the President!


Your beloved AZ Repug whores protect the AZ electric utilities while screwing distributed solar users.

This is how Repugs do "free market" implementation: We will screw any citizen that BigCorp pays us to screw.

[ducks]

I hate that as a solar user I have to pay more per kilowatt because I use less because APS SUCKS! They say it is only fair HORSESHIT I PAID FOR SOLAR SO I WOULD NOT HAVE TO PAY YOU
JOHN MCCAIN SUCKS!
Jeff flake sucks even more!
I have to pay $25 -$35 in fees just to let them read my fucking metter!

[rmt]

I missed this thread somehow.

I would like everyone who said they pay income taxes qualify that a little better.

When you file your tax return, are you still paying taxes, or is your refund equal or more than what your paid in federal and/or state?

Some people pay taxes out of every paycheck, then get even more back on their return because of things like EIC. These people are not paying taxes. they are using the government as a no interest savings account.

We always pay taxes in April - I refuse to give the govt a free loan/get refund. Hard for us to estimate taxes as my day trading is not a steady/consistent thing.

I'd love to get solar panels but maybe it's not appropriate in Florida? (not a big thing here) - our electricity bill is in the $300s in the summer :-( even with a SEER 18 A/C unit and that's with the temp set at 80 and fans going.

[boutons_deux]

"maybe it's not appropriate in Florida?" :lol

"(not a big thing here)" :lol

The referendum that Kock Bros, ALEC, FL Repugs have written is a huge LIE supported by people who don't understand the LIE, will screw rooftop solar customers forever in FL, will restrict the market, to protect the electric utilities.

[Wild Cobra]

Bouton's is a broken record again...

[Wild Cobra]

We always pay taxes in April - I refuse to give the govt a free loan/get refund. Hard for us to estimate taxes as my day trading is not a steady/consistent thing.


I do the same think. I have W-4 set so I pay at the end of the year, instead of given the feds an interest free loan.

[boutons_deux]

Bouton's is a broken record again...

"Do Your Own Research" -- WC

... about the FL solar bullshit.

[rmt]

"maybe it's not appropriate in Florida?" :lol

"(not a big thing here)" :lol

The referendum that Kock Bros, ALEC, FL Repugs have written is a huge LIE supported by people who don't understand the LIE, will screw rooftop solar customers forever in FL, will restrict the market, to protect the electric utilities.




I don't think my town will let people put them on top of the roofs. I guess they could go on the ground but one would need a big area with no trees around.

[RandomGuy]

I don't think my town will let people put them on top of the roofs. I guess they could go on the ground but one would need a big area with no trees around.

Rooftop solar is both logical and not really all that unattractive. Really not sure what the big deal is.

Distributed power would make the grid a bit more stable.

[boutons_deux]

Really not sure what the big deal is.


the BIG DEAL is protecting the profits and investors of utilities, esp the profits of deregulated, for-profit utilities.

There are technical problems for the grid, requiring investment (loss of profits for utilities) in managing a bi-directional current flow, metering, FIT accounting.

But, of course, DEM govt in CA is forcing PGE, etc into acceptance of rooftop solar, so naturally, CA is OUT FRONT of USA yet again, while regressive, pro-business red/slave/Repug states are mostly trailing badly, esp those in the sun belt, eg, FL, TX.

[rmt]

Rooftop solar is both logical and not really all that unattractive. Really not sure what the big deal is.

Distributed power would make the grid a bit more stable.

When you buy in certain communities, you have to abide by their rules - paint the house certain colors, replace with tile (not shingle) roof, etc.

[boutons_deux]

When you buy in certain communities, you have to abide by their rules - paint the house certain colors, replace with tile (not shingle) roof, etc.

irrelevant, but keep trying, you'll keep being wrong, misinformed, uninformed.

Any HOA association that blocks rooftop solar, which INCREASES a house's resale value, is really fucked up, and in need of a homeowners' revolt.

[RandomGuy]

When you buy in certain communities, you have to abide by their rules - paint the house certain colors, replace with tile (not shingle) roof, etc.

Sometimes yes.

Both laws and Declarations often make exceptions for solar. Ours does.

[boutons_deux]

Distributed power would make the grid a bit more stable.

Actually, no since sunshine isn't "stable".

The grid will have to be made a lot smarter (investments!) to handle multi-directional power flows on top of base load.