Tom Rivers doesn"t feel there is a gap between Warriors and Clips

[lefty]

And Pierce said the Clips have a superteam

[SAGirl]

They are delusional, but I prefer that to going all woe is me we are going to lose, lets just skip 82 games and give the GSW the championship already.

[spursistan]

they have actually the second best starting 4 (CP3/Blake/DJ/Redick) in the NBA..But this is cheap bulletin board material for the Dubs from Doc and his perennial losers for the second straight season ..

[Chinook]

They are delusional, but I prefer that to going all woe is me we are going to lose, lets just skip 82 games and give the GSW the championship already.

Better watch out, lest you be accused of having a vanilla take.

[SAGirl]

Better watch out, lest you be accused of having a vanilla take.
I have been seeing references to my being a recent fan as being naive.. lol
I like how Solid D is a decades old fan apparently and still keeps optimistic. I know there are others I am forgetting who are similar in following the team for a long time and being optimistic.

[Dex]

They are delusional, but I prefer that to going all woe is me we are going to lose, lets just skip 82 games and give the GSW the championship already.

For real...everyone thought the league was over when the SuperFriends teamed up in Miami. It took a year for them to get their shit together, and they just barely walked away with 2 out of 4 titles during their run.

[SAGirl]

For real...everyone thought the league was over when the SuperFriends teamed up in Miami. It took a year for them to get their shit together, and they just barely walked away with 2 out of 4 titles during their run.

And this GSW is not necessarily going to be together for 4 seasons. Almost the entirety of their team with the exception of Raymond and Klay are FA next offseason and Durant has his PO soon too. http://www.spotrac.com/nba/free-agents/2017/golden-state-warriors/

The CBA may affect this to some degree, but it's really unknown how long they can keep these guys together.
Golden State Warriors 2017 Free Agents



PLAYER (14)
POS.
AGE
EXP
STATUS
2016-2017 CAP HIT


Stephen Curry (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/6287/)
PG
28
8
UFA
$12,112,359


Andre Iguodala (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2652/)
SG
32
13
UFA
$11,131,368


Shaun Livingston (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2477/)
PG
31
12
UFA
$5,782,450


Zaza Pachulia (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2203/)
C
32
14
UFA
$2,898,000


Phil Pressey (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/13381/)
PG
25
4
UFA
$1,015,696


Ian Clark (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/13442/)
SG
25
4
UFA
$980,431


David West (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2613/)
PF
36
14
UFA
$980,431


JaVale McGee (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/6159/)
C
28
9
UFA
$980,431


Anderson Varejao (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2265/)
PF
33
13
UFA
$980,431


****** Williams (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/6904/)
SG
27
5
UFA
$980,431


James McAdoo (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/15783/)
SF
23
3
UFA
$980,431


Elgin Cook (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/21061/)
SF
23
1
RFA
$543,471


Cameron Jones (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/13601/)
SG
27
1
RFA
$543,471


Scott Wood (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/21080/)
SF
26
1
RFA
$543,471

[Chinook]

And this GSW is not necessarily going to be together for 4 seasons. Almost the entirety of their team with the exception of Raymond and Klay are FA next offseason and Durant has his PO soon too. http://www.spotrac.com/nba/free-agents/2017/golden-state-warriors/

The CBA may affect this to some degree, but it's really unknown how long they can keep these guys together.
Golden State Warriors 2017 Free Agents



PLAYER (14)
POS.
AGE
EXP
STATUS
2016-2017 CAP HIT


Stephen Curry (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/6287/)
PG
28
8
UFA
$12,112,359


Andre Iguodala (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2652/)
SG
32
13
UFA
$11,131,368


Shaun Livingston (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2477/)
PG
31
12
UFA
$5,782,450


Zaza Pachulia (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2203/)
C
32
14
UFA
$2,898,000


Phil Pressey (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/13381/)
PG
25
4
UFA
$1,015,696


Ian Clark (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/13442/)
SG
25
4
UFA
$980,431


David West (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2613/)
PF
36
14
UFA
$980,431


JaVale McGee (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/6159/)
C
28
9
UFA
$980,431


Anderson Varejao (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2265/)
PF
33
13
UFA
$980,431


****** Williams (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/6904/)
SG
27
5
UFA
$980,431


James McAdoo (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/15783/)
SF
23
3
UFA
$980,431


Elgin Cook (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/21061/)
SF
23
1
RFA
$543,471


Cameron Jones (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/13601/)
SG
27
1
RFA
$543,471


Scott Wood (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/21080/)
SF
26
1
RFA
$543,471




Durant's PO is for next season, so add him to the list. They have the best 1-4 for the next five seasons, most likely. But they will very possibly struggle at the 5-8 in a way that the Heatles didn't really have to worry about.

[baseline bum]

For real...everyone thought the league was over when the SuperFriends teamed up in Miami. It took a year for them to get their shit together, and they just barely walked away with 2 out of 4 titles during their run.

Yeah, but that was mostly about all the damage Wade had put on his body catching up to him. I suppose we could see a similar situation with Curry or Durant based on their injury histories, but healthy they're going to be a monster.

[Spurtacular]

And this GSW is not necessarily going to be together for 4 seasons. Almost the entirety of their team with the exception of Raymond and Klay are FA next offseason and Durant has his PO soon too. http://www.spotrac.com/nba/free-agents/2017/golden-state-warriors/

The CBA may affect this to some degree, but it's really unknown how long they can keep these guys together.
Golden State Warriors 2017 Free Agents



PLAYER (14)
POS.
AGE
EXP
STATUS
2016-2017 CAP HIT


Stephen Curry (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/6287/)
PG
28
8
UFA
$12,112,359


Andre Iguodala (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2652/)
SG
32
13
UFA
$11,131,368


Shaun Livingston (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2477/)
PG
31
12
UFA
$5,782,450


Zaza Pachulia (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2203/)
C
32
14
UFA
$2,898,000


Phil Pressey (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/13381/)
PG
25
4
UFA
$1,015,696


Ian Clark (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/13442/)
SG
25
4
UFA
$980,431


David West (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2613/)
PF
36
14
UFA
$980,431


JaVale McGee (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/6159/)
C
28
9
UFA
$980,431


Anderson Varejao (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/2265/)
PF
33
13
UFA
$980,431


****** Williams (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/6904/)
SG
27
5
UFA
$980,431


James McAdoo (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/15783/)
SF
23
3
UFA
$980,431


Elgin Cook (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/21061/)
SF
23
1
RFA
$543,471


Cameron Jones (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/13601/)
SG
27
1
RFA
$543,471


Scott Wood (http://www.spotrac.com/redirect/player/21080/)
SF
26
1
RFA
$543,471




They're gonna keep their core four in tact and make the necessary moves to remain the team to beat, probably.

[apalisoc_9]

There's obviously a clear gap, but why would cuckrivers even say that knowing they're one of the 3 teams that can legit upset Golden State?

[Chinook]

Yeah, but that was mostly about all the damage Wade had put on his body catching up to him. I suppose we could see a similar situation with Curry or Durant based on their injury histories, but healthy they're going to be a monster.

The Heat had more stable depth. Durant and Curry being free agents means they'll have to dump talent two years in a row. The Heatles had Miller and Haslem to grow with them in addition to multiple chances to use the MLE. Not to mention that Lebron is on another level than anyone GS has and that Bosh would be at absolute worst the third-best member of the Warriors.

[SAGirl]

Durant's PO is for next season, so add him to the list. They have the best 1-4 for the next five seasons, most likely. But they will very possibly struggle at the 5-8 in a way that the Heatles didn't really have to worry about.
Something like that would affect their records through the RS as they need to ride their horses and risk injury or rest guys here or there. When Livingston and Iggy are gone, they will see a falloff.

The CBA may affect all of these contracts to some unknown degree right now as well. It's speculative but there are measures like taking the limit to the top max out of the top player in the team. If something like that were to happen things like pride and who gets what become an issue. It's really unknown what happens with the CBA, but long term I have my doubts they keep these guys together for as long as the heatles stuck. A lot happens in 4 seasons, and at the end of it, it crumbles from the pressure.

Heh! for all we know Durant gets his ring then goes his own way because he wants to clean up his legacy and not be coattail riding. lol Once the pressure to win a 'ship is gone, he could go wherever. And if they underachieve, Durant will be blamed.

[TD 21]

They are delusional, but I prefer that to going all woe is me we are going to lose, lets just skip 82 games and give the GSW the championship already.

So you admit to being delusional?

Obviously, no team, especially an elite one, should have that attitude. But we're not on the team, so we don't have to pretend or try to convince ourselves.

I'm not "giving them the championship already". I'm saying, they're going to be in the WCF and for reasons I stated in my thread, I don't believe the Spurs can beat them at full strength, hence my logic that the Spurs aren't contenders.



Better watch out, lest you be accused of having a vanilla take.

Believing the Spurs are a contender isn't necessarily vanilla, but giving no actual reason(s) as to why and reciting cliche shit like "what about '03?", "they're still one of the best teams", "super teams don't always win in year 1" and my personal favorite "they just need to play well", is.



For real...everyone thought the league was over when the SuperFriends teamed up in Miami. It took a year for them to get their shit together, and they just barely walked away with 2 out of 4 titles during their run.

The "SuperFriends" had to deal with Spurs teams that were better than any of the current Spurs, Cavaliers or Clippers, James's and Wade's games weren't the hand in glove fit that the Warriors' core should be and after the 1st year, Wade was past his prime.

[DMC]

Spurs couldn't beat Durant (who couldn't beat Steph and Klay) with Tim Duncan. Now somehow the Spurs are supposed to beat Durant, Steph and Klay without Tim Duncan?

[baseline bum]

The Heat had more stable depth. Durant and Curry being free agents means they'll have to dump talent two years in a row. The Heatles had Miller and Haslem to grow with them in addition to multiple chances to use the MLE. Not to mention that Lebron is on another level than anyone GS has and that Bosh would be at absolute worst the third-best member of the Warriors.

Meh. I'd take Iguodala over a washed up Haslem any day. Maybe 2006 Haslem you could make an argument for but not 2010 Haslem. And Livingston is such a valuable bench player, as great a shooter as Miller was I might take Livingston for his defense and ability to score in the post. Are they going to have to clear capspace to bring Durant back next summer when he opts out though?

[SAGirl]

So you admit to being delusional?

Obviously, no team, especially an elite one, should have that attitude. But we're not on the team, so we don't have to pretend or try to convince ourselves.

I'm not "giving them the championship already". I'm saying, they're going to be in the WCF and for reasons I stated in my thread, I don't believe the Spurs can beat them at full strength, hence my logic that the Spurs aren't contenders.




Believing the Spurs are a contender isn't necessarily vanilla, but giving no actual reason(s) as to why and reciting cliche shit like "what about '03?", "they're still one of the best teams", "super teams don't always win in year 1" and my personal favorite "they just need to play well", is.




The "SuperFriends" had to deal with Spurs teams that were better than any of the current Spurs, Cavaliers or Clippers, James's and Wade's games weren't the hand in glove fit that the Warriors' core should be and after the 1st year, Wade was past his prime.
I made the comment in reference to Paul Pierce stating the Clippers have a super team. I think they are delusional on that. They have a good team, maybe even a very good elite team, but I think they are not a super team by any measure.

[Spurtacular]

Spurs couldn't beat Durant (who couldn't beat Steph and Klay) with Tim Duncan. Now somehow the Spurs are supposed to beat Durant, Steph and Klay without Tim Duncan?

Didn't, not couldn't TBH.

[tbdog]

We are all secretly hoping that Warriors have internal issues, and that Klay does miss not having scoring opportunities, that Green can't play small center more so than previous years, that Durant getting boo'd every venue catches up to him, that Iggy legs stop giving him the lift, and losing Bogut was a big deal.

[Chinook]

Meh. I'd take Iguodala over a washed up Haslem any day. Maybe 2006 Haslem you could make an argument for but not 2010 Haslem. And Livingston is such a valuable bench player, as great a shooter as Miller was I might take Livingston for his defense and ability to score in the post. Are they going to have to clear capspace to bring Durant back next summer when he opts out though?

Yes. All those guys are likely gone. And they won't have Zaza either. Just the room exception.

[baseline bum]

Yes. All those guys are likely gone. And they won't have Zaza either. Just the room exception.

According to Larry Coon's CBA FAQ Durant would have a cap hold of around $31.8 million (120% of his 2016-17 salary) as a Non Bird FA. Curry's cap hold would be $18.2 million as a Bird FA (150% of previous year). Add $17.8 million for Thompson and $16.4 million for Green and you're at $84.2 million. Add another $2.1 million for Damian Jones and Patrick McCaw and you're at $86.3 million. I assume they'll tell Iguodala they'd need him to take $12 million to stay, leaving them $3.7 million which can cover the cap hold for 5 empty roster spots under 12. So they lose Livingston. Or if Iguodala won't take $12 million they renounce him and keep Livingston's $11 million cap hold (190% of his previous year salary as a Bird FA making less than league average). So yeah, it doesn't look like they can keep both Iggy and Livingston unless they're willing to take big paycuts, but they should be able to hold onto one.

Durant would be taking a little less than a $2 million paycut to sign with the non Bird exception instead of a max salary in a $102 million cap, but I have to imagine he knew this would be coming and is ok with that until GS can get full Bird rights.

[Chinook]

According to Larry Coon's CBA FAQ Durant would have a cap hold of around $31.8 million (120% of his 2016-17 salary) as a Non Bird FA. Curry's cap hold would be $18.2 million as a Bird FA (150% of previous year). Add $17.8 million for Thompson and $16.4 million for Green and you're at $84.2 million. Add another $2.1 million for Damian Jones and Patrick McCaw and you're at $86.3 million. I assume they'll tell Iguodala they'd need him to take $12 million to stay, leaving them $3.7 million which can cover the cap hold for 5 empty roster spots under 12. So they lose Livingston. Or if Iguodala won't take $12 million they renounce him and keep Livingston's $11 million cap hold (190% of his previous year salary as a Bird FA making less than league average). So yeah, it doesn't look like they can keep both Iggy and Livingston unless they're willing to take big paycuts, but they should be able to hold onto one.

Durant's cap hold is irrelevant. The Warriors need all of the cap room for his first season. Depending on the cap, that might take more room. And don't forget the need for a starting center. I have a feeling that come next post-season thaf will be a bigger issue than they're assuming.

[baseline bum]

Durant's cap hold is irrelevant. The Warriors need all of the cap room for his first season. Depending on the cap, that might take more room. And don't forget the need for a starting center. I have a feeling that come next post-season thaf will be a bigger issue than they're assuming.

But do they need to clear space for Durant? With the cap falling to $102 million it's a very small difference between what they can offer as a 35% of the cap max salary vs what they could using the Non Bird exception, it's like $1.75 million on the base salary and eithe way he's at 4.5% non-compounded raises. It seems like he could sign another 1+1 with the non Bird exception and then get 7.5% raises signing as Early Bird next summer, just like LeBron in Cleveland. I don't recall the Cavs ever dumping salary in the summer of 2015 to re-sign LeBron to that second year. Or am I wrong there? I mean they were massively over the cap in 2015-16.

[DMC]

Didn't, not couldn't TBH.
Same thing.

[140]

Bend over, I'll make you feel a gap

[Chinook]

But do they need to clear space for Durant? With the cap falling to $102 million it's a very small difference between what they can offer as a 35% of the cap max salary vs what they could using the Non Bird exception, it's like $1.75 million on the base salary and eithe way he's at 4.5% non-compounded raises. It seems like he could sign another 1+1 with the non Bird exception and then get 7.5% raises signing as Early Bird next summer, just like LeBron in Cleveland. I don't recall the Cavs ever dumping salary in the summer of 2015 to re-sign LeBron to that second year. Or am I wrong there? I mean they were massively over the cap in 2015-16.

That's all assuming the owners don't write something into the rules to prevent that. Personally, I had no idea the non-Bird exception was that robust (as you might've known if you happened to be on before I deleted my initial reply last night). I think that's a huge hole the league could close this summer. Could also see the raising the cap holds of players like Curry to close the loophole that Warriors are trying to expose even more. If you had both Steph and KD at like $35 Million with Klay and Draymond, the youngsters and cap holds, they'd be completely capped out.

[Fabbs]

Didn't, not couldn't TBH.
Thank you.


Same thing.
:lol
bullshit

[baseline bum]

That's all assuming the owners don't write something into the rules to prevent that. Personally, I had no idea the non-Bird exception was that robust (as you might've known if you happened to be on before I deleted my initial reply last night). I think that's a huge hole the league could close this summer. Could also see the raising the cap holds of players like Curry to close the loophole that Warriors are trying to expose even more. If you had both Steph and KD at like $35 Million with Klay and Draymond, the youngsters and cap holds, they'd be completely capped out.

Yeah I was pretty surprised the Non Bird Exception was so good also until seeing it on Larry Coon's page last night. Looks like GSW did a solid for themselves in negotiating that into the CBA after they lost Arenas when there was nothing like that in the pre-2005 CBA.

[Spurtacular]

Same thing.

Not really.

[Molotov]

Bend over, I'll make you feel a gap


:lol

[Clipper Nation]

Good. By his own logic, he should be fired as both GM and coach if we don't make the Finals this year.

[TDMVPDPOY]

this the clown wanted to sign KG, lol trying to revive his coachin career

[DMC]

Thank you.


:lol
bullshit
Only quitters and excuse makers differentiate between the two. If they could have they would have. Whatever prevented it meant they couldn't.

[DMC]

Not really.
Sure it is. See my explanation above.