Pau Gasol

[coachmac87]

Just thoughts and opinions of his play and role so far?

The best thing he's doing right now is shooting the basketball..which is good and all but he's capable of a lot more. I'm honestly surprised the Spurs haven't made him more involved in the offense especially in the post. If he's just going to be just another guy and his looks become inconsistent and he's just a spot shooter/scorer I think thats bad for the Spurs.

He's our 3rd best offensive weapon and I do feel he's capable of averaging 15/9/4 on this team. Maybe going to bench maximizes his play? I really dunno but he's got to become more involved if this team wants to reach its potential.

[Joseph Kony]

His offense has been solid but his defense has left much to be desired. he challenges shots at the rim but he's lazy rotating and he gives shitty effort going for the boards. I'm hoping he's just old and pacing himself but his effort has been meh overall thus far, imo

[MaNu4Tres]

You're asking to lose if you want Pau to get more touches in the post. In fact, post play has become very overrated and is a very inefficient aspect in an offense.

So far this year, Pau is 4 for 13 in post play opportunities, shooting a whopping 31% from plays in the post -- which equals out to .71 PPP ( not good). Last year in Chicago? He shot 80 for 205 in post plays, shooting 40%. That is not good at all. So far this year he's only drawing a foul 13% of the time in such scenarios. If Spurs were to go to him more in the post, the Spurs would suffer because he's terribly inefficient and teams don't have to double -- so weak-side stays out on their man. Hardly anyone in the league is worthy of a double team in the post except for maybe 3 players ( and that's only if they get hot).

Hell they don't even double Aldridge, for good reason. His post play is very pedestrian converting at a 48% clip in post plays shooting 11 for 23. That's not great, or good enough to warrant substantial amount of volume. It's also not good enough to command double teams. If it's not good enough to command double teams, then its a play that only really has one option, and that is for Aldridge to create over a decent contest because he doesn't have the foot speed to face his man up and take his guy off the dribble.

That is why initiated offense from the perimeter is so much more valuable, because there's several efficient options that can be manufactured out of it.

So I respectfully disagree, post play is very overrated and very inefficient for the most part -- especially from 36 year old Pau Gasol.

[Fireball]

Sadly his post moves are not better than TD's from his final seasons. His shot from midrange and 3 is there, but Lamarcus is giving us the same thing as well.

His defense is awful right now ... you can see that we miss Timmy as the linebacker who coordinates the defense. Pau will catch up, but not enough to have the impact we need to be really succesful.

[Big P]

Marc Stein: Something to monitor: In the 113 minutes LaMarcus Aldridge and Pau Gasol have played together, San Antonio has been outscored by 25 points. – via Twitter ESPNSteinLine

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Spurs don't need even more iso and post up plays on top of Kawhi's and LMA's. Pau is shooting well and this is enough offensively. His greatest value offensively would be to draw a rim protecting big away from the basket - he did it well with Whiteside, but couldn't with DeAndre.

He needs to be at least average on defense though and he's well below that so far.

[MaNu4Tres]

Spurs don't need even more iso and post up plays on top of Kawhi's and LMA's. Pau is shooting well and this is enough offensively. He needs to be at least average on defense though and he's well below that so far.

Reason why I was against the signing. Volume on offense wasn't there for the role next to Aldridge and Kawhi and his value is strictly tied to usage on offense (since he's a poor team defender in space). Sad thing is, even if there was usage for him to fill, he's not efficient enough to be a good go to option -- just ask the Bulls.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Reason why I was against the signing. Volume on offense wasn't there for the role next to Aldridge and Kawhi and his value is strictly tied to usage on offense (since he's a poor team defender in space). Sad thing is, even if there was usage for him to fill, he's not efficient enough to be a good go to option -- just ask the Bulls.

I'm OK with Gasol's signing, he was the best overall player available and while he's poor defensively if he's able to continue hitting the outside shot and if he's able to draw the likes of DeAndre, Adams or Ibaka away from the paint he'd be helping Kawhisos and LMAisos tremendously without the need to score too much or play on the low block at all.

[coachmac87]

Whether you liked the signing or not..The Spurs must continue playing to their strengths which is low post/ISO ball and get teams in foul trouble..impose your will and the rest will follow tbh

[LaMarcus Bryant]

I never expected his defense to be this bad tbh.
I'm hoping he's loafing it.

[Poolboy5623]

I'm not sure which is worse....his post game or defense?

[cd98]

Pau in theory could be a better defender than Duncan given their ages and Pau is a little longer and probably quicker, but Tim had the team defense down and I don't think Pau will be there, even by mid season. The Spurs will still beat the bad teams, but to beat the best, they will struggle.

[HarlemHeat37]

I hated the signing, but I won't judge him, yet..it's evident that he's not trying to step on any toes IMO, he's still very hesitant and reluctant to do his thing..

The picture will be more clear in January, although the Gasol-Aldridge duo already looks questionable(mostly due to the latter's regression on defense)..

[HarlemHeat37]

Pau in theory could be a better defender than Duncan given their ages and Pau is a little longer and probably quicker, but Tim had the team defense down and I don't think Pau will be there, even by mid season. The Spurs will still beat the bad teams, but to beat the best, they will struggle.

As many Spurs' players have stated since Tim's retirement, the biggest loss with Duncan is out is his basketball IQ and the fact that he was essentially a coach on the floor, tbh..not only did he anchor the defense, physically, but he was the vocal leader and QB on the defensive end of the floor..

I expect the defensive chemistry to improve once Green returns, though, as I think he will be the new QB of the defense, vocally..

[Chinook]

I expect the defensive chemistry to improve once Green returns, though, as I think he will be the new QB of the defense, vocally..

I hope so, and it's certainly possible given that he is often the one who calls out sets and defenses as it is. But I didn't like how he seemed to shrink completely away from the leadership role they tried to give him during the off-season. He'd help out a ton if he stepped up behind Kawhi, as no one else looks to be doing it.

[coachmac87]

I hated the signing, but I won't judge him, yet..it's evident that he's not trying to step on any toes IMO, he's still very hesitant and reluctant to do his thing..

The picture will be more clear in January, although the Gasol-Aldridge duo already looks questionable(mostly due to the latter's regression on defense)..



Exactly. Once Pau stops trying to fit it and asserts himself to be our 3rd best player the better the Spurs will be. Will it be good enough?? I dunno but Pau can't continue to put up 9/6 and expect good things when it matters

[spursistan]

As many Spurs' players have stated since Tim's retirement, the biggest loss with Duncan is out is his basketball IQ and the fact that he was essentially a coach on the floor, tbh..not only did he anchor the defense, physically, but he was the vocal leader and QB on the defensive end of the floor..

I expect the defensive chemistry to improve once Green returns, though, as I think he will be the new QB of the defense, vocally..

Hopefully, tbh..At least Parker being this shitty won't have the audacity to give him the stink eye and let him shrivel back in his shell..Don't look now but Green has become 3rd most tenured player on the Spurs roster after TP/Manu :wow..

[Chinook]

Hopefully, tbh..At least Parker being this shitty won't have the audacity to give him the stink eye and let him shrivel back in his shell..Don't look now but Green has become 3rd most tenured player on the Spurs roster after TP/Manu :wow..

Last time I counted, he has as many or more accrued consecutive seasons with his club as the most-tenured player on like 22/29 other teams.

[spursistan]

Last time I counted, he has as many or more accrued consecutive seasons with his club as the most-tenured player on like 22/29 other teams.

He's really come a long way. I don't recall a player going from the scrap heap on the margins of the league to be essentially a "core member" (it is poor man's Big 3 of KL/LMA/DG :lol) of a contender team in only 5 seasons.

With his below market contract, playoffs track record, and the skill-set as an elite 3&D in a perimeter-oriented league, he's got a sweat equity in the team that probably only a big fish like Durant would have gotten him moved from. Just hoping he won''t be sacrificed as they look to upgrade the PG position next summer..

[SAGirl]

To me the concern is on defense. I don't care that much offensively bc Kawhi has been dominating the ball, then LMA occasionally. Unless the SL moves the ball more and gets to be more egalitarian, there won't be enough for Pau to put up 15, specially if he doesn't play some minutes with the bench. He's shooting and passing well. He's getting shots spotting up and in PnP. Offensively he's been fine.

Really, the defense has been bad.. I keep thinking he looks out of shape, overweight and is old. Maybe he will get better but it doesn't look good right now.

[Chinook]

Just hoping he won''t be sacrificed as they look to upgrade the PG position next summer..

Especially is hoping he's not sacrificed while Parker is kept. Danny's on his seventh season with the club. When you talk about getting rid of long-time members, it's not as simple as saying Tony's untouchable over Green. Danny would be in the golden generation of like 3/4 of the league.

[szkorhetz]

This is why I preferred DH.
We did choose the organizational fit, not the player we needed.

[coachmac87]

It's quite simple reallly...

The Spurs FO and this board that liked the idea of adding Gasol was because what he brought offensively...things Duncan couldn't do. Gasol wasn't brought here to be a defensive captain although his length and rebounding was better than Duncan...

As of now he's producing just as much as TD did last year...that's not what he was brought here to do....

The sooner he's involved the better

[SAGirl]

Especially is hoping he's not sacrificed while Parker is kept. Danny's on his seventh season with the club. When you talk about getting rid of long-time members, it's not as simple as saying Tony's untouchable over Green. Danny would be in the golden generation of like 3/4 of the league.
Considering that Danny's role is needed next to Kiwi, I can't see it. I considered it briefly near the draft if Spurs wanted to rebuild... that was b4 FA, b4 knowing about Gasol, and while the possibility that they would look to upgrade their star guard situation from Tony/Manu was still up to be considered. I speculated on all sort of trades scenarios.

But once they committed to continue with their group (by not seeking to trade Tony + reupping Manu)... Green is needed to cover for Tony on defense again.. On top of that, now that we know Kawhi has evolved to dominate the ball more than ever he needs Danny more than ever to help on defense, and to shoot the 3.

The odd guy out is Tony... it makes no sense to keep him and trade Danny considering the direction Spurs have taken.

[MaNu4Tres]

It's quite simple reallly...

The Spurs FO and the board that liked the idea of adding Gasol is because what he brought offensively...things Duncan couldn't do. Gasol wasn't brought here to be a defensive captain although his length and rebounding was better than Duncan...

As of now he's producing just as much as TD did last year...that's not what he was brought here to do....

The sooner he's involved the better

It's not quite simply when you break down how he can be involved more.

How do you want him more involved? There's not a good answer, no matter how much you try to spin it.

He's terribly inefficient in post ups and he plays majority of his minutes with two superior players who need the ball.

If he's involved anymore, it won't be better for the Spurs because he's not effective enough to be a play maker from interior because his play doesn't warrant double teams and he's not efficient enough from that area.

He's a secondary role playing spot up shooter from mid-range on out to the three point line these days. A big reason why he put up 16 last year is because he played 31 mpg and was able to get enough volume to yield 16 points per game.

It's like people don't understand this still after the Richard Jefferson era.

He came in a 20 point scorer and he was never going to live up to expectations when his usage was going to decrease significantly. And with good reason, Parker and Manu were much better at creating quality looks for themselves and teammates-- so they deserved more touches. And then you bring in Duncan who needed his touches inside. What fourth option has ever averaged more than 12 points? Not happening.

If this was 2011 or 2012 then I'd agree, Gasol is good enough to warrant more touches because he commands double teams and can be efficient inside. That is not the case anymore. Look it up.

[tbdog]

I think Dedmon deserves the start.

[TheGreatYacht]

He's getting frozen out of the offense by Kobe, I mean Kawhi, per par

[DPG21920]

It's all good because it's basketball discussion, but people have to stop freaking out and diagnosing things this early. That is why I was so vocal early on about bracing yourself for up's and down's.

This team has a lot of new pieces and with Danny out to start things are even more whacky. Then, even if you want to say the starting lineup is the same except one player, while true it underscores how big of a cog was lost in Tim.

Lot going on, lot to figure out, new guys, young guys and a SL that is whacky due to injury. Give it some time before delving too far.

[TD 21]

It's not quite simply when you break down how he can be involved more.

How do you want him more involved? There's not a good answer, no matter how much you try to spin it.

He's terribly inefficient in post ups and he plays majority of his minutes with two superior players who need the ball.

If he's involved anymore, it won't be better for the Spurs because he's not effective enough to be a play maker from interior because his play doesn't warrant double teams and he's not efficient enough from that area.

He's a secondary role playing spot up shooter from mid-range on out to the three point line these days. A big reason why he put up 16 last year is because he played 31 mpg and was able to get enough volume to yield 16 points per game.

It's like people don't understand this still after the Richard Jefferson era.

He came in a 20 point scorer and he was never going to live up to expectations when his usage was going to decrease significantly. And with good reason, Parker and Manu were much better at creating quality looks for themselves and teammates-- so they deserved more touches. And then you bring in Duncan who needed his touches inside. What fourth option has ever averaged more than 12 points? Not happening.

If this was 2011 or 2012 then I'd agree, Gasol is good enough to warrant more touches because he commands double teams and can be efficient inside. That is not the case anymore. Look it up.

:tu



It's quite simple reallly...

The Spurs FO and this board that liked the idea of adding Gasol was because what he brought offensively...things Duncan couldn't do. Gasol wasn't brought here to be a defensive captain although his length and rebounding was better than Duncan...

As of now he's producing just as much as TD did last year...that's not what he was brought here to do....

The sooner he's involved the better

The only area Gasol is a clear upgrade on Duncan in, is range shooting. His length probably isn't "better" (his height is, but I've never seen a player block shots or rebound with their head) and his rebounding isn't either (he's corralled a superior percentage the past 2 seasons, but his contested rebound percentage is poor and his team rebounded better with him off the floor).

Whether it's their forte or not, to a certain extent, the center has to be the "defensive captain" just because of the nature of the position. They've got the best view of the opposing offense and because of their size and proximity to the rim, are often the biggest impediment to it.

[TheDoctor]

795786877097885696

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

This is why I preferred DH.
We did choose the organizational fit, not the player we needed.

Dwight got $23 mil per. The Spurs could never compete for him, he was not a realistic option at all.




The odd guy out is Tony... it makes no sense to keep him and trade Danny considering the direction Spurs have taken.

It does make sense - they're trading contracts, not players. Tony's contract is bad and he doesn't have even a neutral trade value. The only possibility for a trade, IF they decide to do it which is highly unlikely, would be to some team trying to meet the salary floor. Danny, on the other hand, has a very tradable contract and could fetch an actual asset. If they go after Chris Paul next summer, Danny will be the first on the block.

[SAGirl]

Dwight got $23 mil per. The Spurs could never compete for him, he was not a realistic option at all.



It does make sense - they're trading contracts, not players. Tony's contract is bad and he doesn't have even a neutral trade value. The only possibility for a trade, IF they decide to do it which is highly unlikely, would be to some team trying to meet the salary floor. Danny, on the other hand, has a very tradable contract and could fetch an actual asset. If they go after Chris Paul next summer, Danny will be the first on the block.
Roger that,.... we are saddled with Tony.

[Chinook]

Dwight got $23 mil per. The Spurs could never compete for him, he was not a realistic option at all.



It does make sense - they're trading contracts, not players. Tony's contract is bad and he doesn't have even a neutral trade value. The only possibility for a trade, IF they decide to do it which is highly unlikely, would be to some team trying to meet the salary floor. Danny, on the other hand, has a very tradable contract and could fetch an actual asset. If they go after Chris Paul next summer, Danny will be the first on the block.

You pay the price to move Parker. He makes negative sense with Paul anyway. And that's before getting into the fact that Parker's deal is larger and that Danny's deal isn't enough cap savings.

[Ice009]

Could the Spurs have opened up enough money if they wanted to go after Whiteside or Dwight Howard? After watching Whiteside destroy us earlier last week, I wondered why they never went after him. I would have taken his defense and rebounding any day of the week over Pau's offensive fit.

[Chinook]

Could the Spurs have opened up enough money if they wanted to go after Whiteside or Dwight Howard? After watching Whiteside destroy us earlier last week, I wondered why they never went after him. I would have taken his defense and rebounding any day of the week over Pau's offensive fit.

They could have, yes.

[Kidd K]

Imo Duncan could have won any of them from '01-'07, and should have won in 2013.

[Ice009]

They could have, yes.

Why do you think they didn't go after Whiteside? Character issues, or do you think they weren't sold on him?

Howard, I figure, they wouldn't have wanted to pay him that much as I doubt they thought he was worth his market price.

[Chinook]

Why do you think they didn't go after Whiteside? Character issues, or do you think they weren't sold on him?

Howard, I figure, they wouldn't have wanted to pay him that much as I doubt they thought he was worth his market price.

I think they didn't want to make the further financial sacrifices that would have been necessary for them to keep get him. It would've probably required them to let Manu go. Spurs had like $21-22 Million in cap space, IIRC, but Murray, LJC and Manu took up around $6 Million when you factor in cap holds and roster charges, so they didn't have all that much to use on Pau.

Personally, I wasn't too much on the Whiteside caravan as it was. It was on some combo of Clarkson/Gordon and Sullinger/Amir (whoever got released -- ended up being Jared). I loved Dedmon but he was still an RFA at the time. I think getting Dewayne and Lee for what they did just underscores them going for a guard. But that's just me.

[gambit1990]

his body language can read very poorly at times.

not new but i guess it's just more apparent since i'm seeing a lot more of him.

[coachmac87]

Soursbare 29th in league in pints in the paint according to Pop...


That's unacceptable with Pau and LMA

[MaNu4Tres]

Soursbare 29th in league in pints in the paint according to Pop...


That's unacceptable with Pau and LMA

They get most of their points off Pick and Pops because they aren't that great on the block going towards the basket. They still resort to more mid-range even from the post -- most specifically Aldridge. Gasol resorts to his inefficient hook that has gone in 31% of the time so far this year.

Its more unacceptable for our wing/ ballhandlers in PnRs that aren't able to consistently get into the lane and when they do they're not converting attempts. They're also not creating enough opportunities for the front-court to finish inside.

[DMC]

What I've seen of his defensive effort is matadorish, and appears he's either out of position or just not interested in defending hard.

[ViceCity86]

Next suggestion: Tony Parker isolations

[boutons_deux]

not interested in defending hard.

Pau doesn't do anything hard

[kaji157]

Stop crying please, it´s been just 7 games into the season, he has to learn lots of things.
Did anyone learn something from last year with Aldridge.
Spurs learning curve is at least 4 months. After that we will have a better picture.

Not to say that we are without Danny and TP is playing like shit.

Things will be better in a couple of months.

[thekingrobert]

he screams and flops a lot

[coachmac87]

I think it's time to really consider him going to the bench and being a focal point on the offensive end. It's just not happening in the SL..id rather experiment now then wait unti later tbh.

And I also think Pau may be up for it due to his poor play and lack of touches in the SL. I also would like to see Dedmond, Kawhi, Green start games and see if the defense improves

[SAGirl]

Just thoughts and opinions of his play and role so far?

The best thing he's doing right now is shooting the basketball..which is good and all but he's capable of a lot more. I'm honestly surprised the Spurs haven't made him more involved in the offense especially in the post. If he's just going to be just another guy and his looks become inconsistent and he's just a spot shooter/scorer I think thats bad for the Spurs.

He's our 3rd best offensive weapon and I do feel he's capable of averaging 15/9/4 on this team. Maybe going to bench maximizes his play? I really dunno but he's got to become more involved if this team wants to reach its potential.
old remark made back in early Nov. 2016, early season.
Now in the playoffs... dude is looking like a bust of a signing if that 3 pt shot is not on fire.
He was shooting over 50% on 3s which is unsustainable.
I ma very disappointed in Pau Gasol tbh...

for the record.. just found this thread while I was searching for something else... and it was interesting how observations from so early in the season already told us a lot about this player.

[coachmac87]

I still don't know if Pop would've had the balls moving him to the bench if he didn't break his hand..it's odd Gasol became the best shooter of his career off a broken hand and moving to br bench.

Question will be if him going to the bench will play a role in offseason decisions of opting in or out tbh