Why does Russia want Trump? It's all about oil. Why does Trump want Russia?

[boutons_deux]

It's all about money (http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/12/12/1609948/-Why-does-Russia-want-Trump-It-s-all-about-oil-Why-does-Trump-want-Russia-It-s-all-about-money)

Oil and natural gas aren’t just a part of Russia’s economy, they are the economy.

Up until 2014, oil accounted for 50 percent of revenue (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-05-17/russia-learns-to-live-after-crash-as-post-oil-path-takes-shape) going into the budget. As long as oil and gas prices were high, Putin was able to float along, using oil profits to prop up the Russian economy and his own popularity. But as oil and gas fell, so did Putin’s ability to pretend that his policies were bringing improvement.

Since 2014, the value of the ruble has plunged to a third of its former value against the dollar.

The reason is the same as the reason the coal industry is going under: fracking. Fracking for oil and natural gas has filled the US market to overflowing. It’s the reason that gas is $2 at the pump, the reason that the largest coal companies in the world are bankrupt, and the reason that over 160 oil companies have also gone bankrupt this year. Prices are so low, companies and countries that depend on fossil fuels for revenue are feeling a huge squeeze.

Those low prices crimp not just Putin’s ability to show largess at home, but slow his program to move the Russian economy to a more diverse base. And, most importantly of all, low energy prices restrict Russia’s military ability, both because less funds are available to drive military expansion, and Western nations are less inclined to look the other way based on their own population needs for natural gas pipelines controlled by Russia.

There are three things Putin needs:

short term capital to pad out his shrinking budget,

long term investment to fuel his ambitious expansion schemes, and

someone to take the Paris Agreement off the table so all that oil in Russia keeps getting sold.

So … what to do about it (https://thinkprogress.org/trump-putin-and-exxonmobil-team-up-to-destroy-the-planet-fb88650acfa1#.opgtfw2tg)? The answer is: Hire Donald Trump.

The aligning interests between Russian President Vladimir Putin, Russia’s choice for U.S. president (Donald Trump), and Big Oil represents the gravest threat to humanity (and democracy) since the rise of the Axis powers in the 1930s.



The three things Russia wants? They’re all things Trump can deliver.

Trump’s leading Secretary of State candidate, Rex Tillerson (http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/12/10/1609563/-Putin-awarded-Rex-Tillerson-Exxon-CEO-apparently-to-get-the-nod-for-secretary-of-State-next-week), has worked for just one company his whole life: Exxon. That doesn’t make Tillerson an expert in foreign affairs. It doesn’t make him an expert in business. It makes him an expert in a very limited subset of the oil and gas business. For Trump’s purposes,Tillerson has very specific skills. (http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/309890-russias-head-of-foreign-affairs-applauds-trumps-secretary-of)

Aleksey Pushkov, the head of Russia's Foreign Affairs Committee, tweeted high praises of Donald Trump's reported pick for secretary of State, Rex Tillerson, who has very close ties with Russian President Vladimir Putin.


Exxon has been working directly with Russia to secure drilling rights in previously virgin areas of the high Arctic. It’s a deal that earned Tillerson the “Order of Friendship” medal in 2012—the highest award Russia gives to non-citizens.

Mr. Trump called it “a great advantage” that Mr. Tillerson already knows “many of the players,” noting that he does “massive deals
in Russia.”​ Massive doesn’t even do them justice.

Those deals, valued at between $500 billion and $1 trillion, are at risk because of US sanctions against Russian officials that were imposed after Russia’s invasion of Crimea and other areas in Ukraine.

Tillerson already lobbied Congress successfully to stop a more extensive sanction bill from becoming law. Now he wants the rest of it put away.

To get a sense of just how large the deal is, Russia’s entire annual budget is around $200 billion dollars. That number currently includes a budget deficit of about $21 billion a year. On a percentage basis, that’s not all that different from the US. Except that the US annual budget is edging $3.8 trillion while running a deficit of about $500 billion. The difference here isn’t just scale, it’s that no one wants to lend money to Russia, especially not when their currency is in the tank.

Russia just surprised most observers by selling off 20 percent of Rosneft, it’s state controlled oil company, to a group of Middle Eastern investors for $11.3 billion. That deal sets the current value for what remains at Rosneft at just over $45 billion. So, in the current market, Russia could sell off its entire state-owned oil company and get enough money to address its budget crunch for a couple of years.

Or … it can make the Exxon deal and have a steady stream of income that closes that budget gap through decades. The Exxon deal is bigger than all of Rosneft by a factor of 12 or more. In fact, the deal is bigger than the market capitalization of Exxon and Rosneft combined. It could be the biggest business deal (http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/watch/-500-billion-opportunity-for-exxon-russia-in-trump-cabinet-pick-827731523790) in history.

The influx of capital from the partial sale of Rosneft lets Putin patch over the yawning gaps in his budget in the short term.
Tillerson and Trump can deliver for Putin, giving him a deal that would bolster his own popularity, cement his authoritarian regime in place, and allow Russia to flex its muscles without worrying that every tank and plane might be resented by people surrendering butter for bullets.

All Trump has to do is see to it that, miraculously, the sanctions that stood in the way of the Exxon deal get neatly brushed aside and let Tillerson finish writing the largest agreement ever. With, perhaps, a few paltry billion sliding under, over, or alongside the table.

Trump can also assure Russia that all that delicious oil and gas keeps getting burned and doesn’t end up stashed in the ground because of concerns over climate change. What’s the biggest reason that Donald Trump won’t make a commitment to basic science and admit (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2016/12/11/trump-says-nobody-really-knows-if-climate-change-is-real/?utm_term=.be0e290f0bcc) that manmade global warming is occurring? Russia needs to sell oil.

In theory, getting out of the Paris agreement is difficult, and both President Obama and the leaders of 190 nations have rushed through the agreement to make it that way. In practice, Trump doesn’t have to do a thing except talk down the agreement and ignore its limits. Penalty: $0. And US detachment from the agreement will probably result in other nations shrugging and trying to make a buck while the sun is still visible through the haze.

That’s two of Putin’s concerns down. What about the third? What can Donald Trump do that would drive up the price of oil and gas so that Putin, and Exxon, not only enjoy their massive drill-the-holy-hell out of the Arctic deal, but get maximum profit on every barrel?

There are more choices here than you might think.

Trump could try a plain-old political solution, such as providing price supports on US oil and gas under the guise of a “jobs program” that would put all those exploration and drilling workers idled by low prices back to work. Sure, that’s just paying corporations huge sums to hire a few people but … see the Carrier deal. Now imagine that deal x1,000. Oil, and to a lesser extent natural gas, are fungible commodities, so prop up the prices in the US, and Vladimir Putin gets what he needs to roll into the Balkans.

Putin and Trump could also go with a kind of joint strong arm solution. One of the reasons that prices are so low is because OPEC can’t get its act together.

But if both Trump and Putin let it be known that, say “no planes for the Saudis” unless they crank back production, it could generate just enough lowered supply to give both Putin and Trump a nice look-at-all-those-jobs bounce at home.

Finally, there’s an option that may be all too appealing to Trump. He could bomb someone.

Just imagine a “hey, my new guys in intelligence who are so much smarter than the people we replaced, absolutely knew Iran was about to get the bomb, so we just had to go in.” And destroy their, uh, oil facilities. Hopefully, without giving in to Trump’s itch to use The Bomb ourselves. Trump and Putin might also choose to engage in some creative destruction in Syria and Iraq, under the aegis of “keeping oil away from ISIS.” Or heck, Trump could just muster a little instability anywhere that has a pump.

Trump can deliver for Putin on Exxon to keep Russia sitting high for decades.

He can drop the Paris agreement making both US fossil fuel companies and Putin grin.

And he can either take enough production off the market, or make that production uncertain enough, to drive up prices and maximize profits.

http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/12/12/1609948/-Why-does-Russia-want-Trump-It-s-all-about-oil-Why-does-Trump-want-Russia-It-s-all-about-money?detail=email&link_id=14&can_id=4217e8eb109c68bd0c2e4143dd2d8c15&source=email-shocker-house-benghazi-committee-is-done&email_referrer=shocker-house-benghazi-committee-is-done&email_subject=shocker-house-benghazi-committee-is-done

[Clipper Nation]

How dare Trump work to improve relations with another world superpower instead of sabre-rattling for war against their country! Doesn't he realize that the globalists have money to make? :rolleyes

[boutons_deux]

How dare Trump work to improve relations with another world superpower instead of sabre-rattling for war against their country! Doesn't he realize that the globalists have money to make? :rolleyes

goddam you're stupid.

Trash and Exxon are going to enrich Russia, by pushing up the price of oil, so Russia can keep expanding its military while buying off the Russian people.

I bet by 2020, we'll see TX gasoline at $3 or more.

"improve relations"" :lol

[hater]

Better to be allied with the 2nd most powerful nuclear power than a bunch of extremist saber ratling desert snakes imo

[Dirk Oneanddoneski]

Better to be allied with the 2nd most powerful nuclear power than a bunch of extremist saber ratling desert snakes imo

Agreed

Slavs > sand monkeys

[mavsfan1000]

Why does Hillary and the media blame Russia on everything? Bunch of poor losers.

[Clipper Nation]

Why does Hillary and the media blame Russia on everything? Bunch of poor losers.

The left is just pissed that Russia is no longer the Communist "utopia" they once loved. When the Soviets were marching dissidents off to the gulags and starving people on purpose, the Walter Durantys of the world were telling us about how amazing the USSR was. Now that Russia is no longer a radical-left stronghold, they're the root of all evil according to the libtards.

[boutons_deux]

"The left is just pissed that Russia is no longer the Communist "utopia" they once loved"

You Lie

and all you Russia lovers are gullible, conned fuckoffs. Putin is playing chess and you guys are playing with yourselves.

Trash says he admires murderer Putin and Russia, and you rats follow the Pied Piper. "duh, yeah, yeah, I like Putin, too, he's cool."

[ducks]

goddam you're stupid.

Trash and Exxon are going to enrich Russia, by pushing up the price of oil, so Russia can keep expanding its military while buying off the Russian people.

I bet by 2020, we'll see TX gasoline at $3 or more.

"improve relations"" :lol
if you know so much why do you not run for office?

[Wild Cobra]

How dare Trump work to improve relations with another world superpower instead of sabre-rattling for war against their country! Doesn't he realize that the globalists have money to make? :rolleyes

What surprises me are the liberals supporting remaining in a cold war like mentality with Russia.

What happened to compassion? Accepting other cultures? And everything else they claim to champion?

It is so funny they can't see past their own bigotry.

[pgardn]

Better to be allied with the 2nd most powerful nuclear power than a bunch of extremist saber ratling desert snakes imo

Not when the leader is basically a thug. And Russia has no intent on cooperation. They are an economic basket case with nukes and a lot of people.

[pgardn]

What surprises me are the liberals supporting remaining in a cold war like mentality with Russia.

What happened to compassion? Accepting other cultures? And everything else they claim to champion?

It is so funny they can't see past their own bigotry.

Compassion for Putin. Are you fkn kidding?

[Wild Cobra]

Compassion for Putin. Are you fkn kidding?

Have you ever tried to see things from his perspective?

[mavsfan1000]

Russia has a bad relationship with Hillary. It's not that they wanted Trump so badly as they hated Hillary.

[Wild Cobra]

Russia has a bad relationship with Hillary. It's not that they wanted Trump so badly as they hated Hillary.

Same reason I went for Trump. I dislike him less than Hillary.

[TDMVPDPOY]

all these deals dont mean shit to the american taxpayer cause how much of it will be paid in tax? likely NIL.

[hater]

Russia has a bad relationship with Hillary. It's not that they wanted Trump so badly as they hated Hillary.

Everyone had a bad relatinship with Hillary except the Saudis imo

[boutons_deux]

Have you ever tried to see things from his perspective?

... which is?

[pgardn]

Have you ever tried to see things from his perspective?

Sure.

He wants complete control of more than what he has now. He is willing to possibly sanction the poisoning and shooting of his own political opponents. He sees a vast mineral and land wealthy region that can't even feed its own people and realizes he has more control if the country stays almost completely dependent on oil and arms. This gives him a smaller swath of industry to keep in line and stay in power.

He hates the fact that East Germany and other Eastern European nations are no longer under the control of the USSR and bristles. Dictators are scared of countries that have the ability to change leaders and ideas so quickly. He longs for Brezhnev times.

[pgardn]

Russia has a bad relationship with Hillary. It's not that they wanted Trump so badly as they hated Hillary.

And they have no clue as to what Trump will do regarding the Russians. Trump will have to face the facts and history eventually. This is why all this talk about the Russians influencing the election enough to give Trump a win is democratic sour grapes. The Russians were involved, we will have to change and react accordingly. But what the Russians mainly did is show they have new ways of screwing with elections and causing disruption. Which they really don't have to worry about themselves.

We will mess with them. It just depends on whether we ever find out. The Russians are not fond of telling their people the difficulties the government has due to getting one upped. It just may be a wink from us and a nod from them acknowledging they get it. We f your process you can f with our ___________.

[CosmicCowboy]

Relatively speaking the Russians aren't that bad. We get our panties all in a wad about their "human rights" violations while ignoring worse from our "allies". Maybe it's time we looked at the world from a different perspective.

[Wild Cobra]

Relatively speaking the Russians aren't that bad. We get our panties all in a wad about their "human rights" violations while ignoring worse from our "allies". Maybe it's time we looked at the world from a different perspective.

Libtards are incapable of that.

[Winehole23]

Relatively speaking the Russians aren't that bad. We get our panties all in a wad about their "human rights" violations while ignoring worse from our "allies". Maybe it's time we looked at the world from a different perspective.Appeasement!

[mavsfan1000]

Relatively speaking the Russians aren't that bad. We get our panties all in a wad about their "human rights" violations while ignoring worse from our "allies". Maybe it's time we looked at the world from a different perspective.
The mainstream media has us brainwashed. You gotta look past the libtard tinted glasses the media gives us.

[hater]

The Russian boogeyman population control trick has been used since Truman imo

Its just an easy tool to control the retards. Good thing it seems to not be working anymore thanks to the interwebs

[pgardn]

Relatively speaking the Russians aren't that bad. We get our panties all in a wad about their "human rights" violations while ignoring worse from our "allies". Maybe it's time we looked at the world from a different perspective.

Maybe it's time people read more about Vladimir Putin and the Russians continued wish to have a destabilized Europe.

[pgardn]

The mainstream media has us brainwashed. You gotta look past the libtard tinted glasses the media gives us.

Yeah.

Just read RT news like Hater and you will have it all figured out.
shm...

And what was East Germany, Poland, the Cech Republic, Slovenia, Latvia, Estonia, Georgia, Ukraine... all laugh at the fools. Go read some history. Let's go throw an all girl possibly lesbian band in jail for whatever when ever, And make it basically illegal to be gay or lesbian, let my biker friends beat them up.

The country and leader are exactly what Trump has spoke against. Big government running inefficiency through huge corruption. But of course no one worries about this because you have no frkn clue what it's like to live there.

Awwh shucks, it's not so bad.

[boutons_deux]

Relatively speaking the Russians aren't that bad. We get our panties all in a wad about their "human rights" violations while ignoring worse from our "allies". Maybe it's time we looked at the world from a different perspective.

:lol

You Repugs are so gullible, so connable by Repugs', even Trash's, propaganda




The Putin push: Russian President Vladimir Putin’s favorability among Republicans has grown over two years

Despite Russia's interference in the 2016 presidential election, Republicans have grown to like Putin more

Net favorability of Putin:

Democrats
July 2014: -54
Dec 2016: -62

Republicans
July 2014: -66
Dec 2016: -10

http://www.salon.com/2016/12/14/the-putin-push-russian-president-vladimir-putins-favorability-among-republicans-has-grown-over-two-years/

y'all racists REALLY REALLY REALLY hate the knitter so much you prefer him to a sworn enemy who is conducting war on USA.

:lol

And did y'all know that white supremacists, skinheads are really big in USSR?

[boutons_deux]

Putin Worth $200 Billion, Was 'Stealing As Much Money As He Could' Says Investor

Bill Browder is the CEO of Hermitage Capital Management, an investment fund and asset management firm with offices in the UK and Russia. He formerly was Russia's largest foreign investor – and he formerly supported President Vladimir Putin (http://thenewcivilrightsmovement.com/tags/Vladimir_Putin).

But now he says Pres. Putin is the richest man in the world, with a net worth of $200 billion.

To put that in perspective, Microsoft founder Bill Gates is believed to hold that title, with $76 billion to support it. Or, to put it another way,

Putin, according to Browder, is worth more than the Koch Brothers ($80 billion), Warren Buffet ($58 billion) and GOP political campaign financier Sheldon Adelson ($38 billion) combined.

How did the Russian President amass so much wealth? Browder on Saturday told (http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2015/02/15/putins-net-worth-is-200-billion-says-russias-once-largest-foreigner-investor/) CNN's Fareed Zakaria that "the first eight or 10 years of Putin's reign over Russia, it was about stealing as much money as he could. And some people, including myself, believe that he's the richest man in the world, or one of the richest men in the world, with hundreds of billions of dollars of wealth that was stolen from Russia."

http://www.thenewcivilrightsmovement.com/davidbadash/_200_billion_putin_s_reign_has_been_about_stealing _as_much_money_as_he_could_says_investor

[boutons_deux]

Does Vladimir Putin kill journalists?

After Russian President Vladimir Putin called Donald Trump "very talented," the GOP frontrunner has defended Putin against suspicions that Putin kills journalists who don’t agree him.

It started on MSNBC’s Morning Joe last month when host Joe Scarborough asked about it (http://www.msnbc.com/morning-joe/watch/trump--putin-is-a-leader--unlike-our-president-588186691983).

Trump responded,

"He’s running his country, and at least he’s a leader, unlike what we have on this country. I think our country does plenty of killing also, Joe, so you know."

experts say the political climate in Russia is responsible for the high volume of journalist murders in the country.

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/CvfWcE3jlg2EKf0UjzMfhNiFNHkZ-CKtj3gKiMANqekzarp7wmVGnNc-BABGNk1htT-bOZT3IElg-UiakNlyuLc59GSrPvv2iRuj-_DqMLJe4haHV8gEKvAKQ1og8nWnYSsX-Ds8
http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/article/2016/jan/04/does-vladimir-putin-kill-journalists/

[boutons_deux]

The Putin Paradigm

There is still much we don’t know about how Trump will rule. But in the month since his election, some characteristic patterns have emerged—and they bear some instructive similarities to the style Putin has practiced over many years. Here are a few of them:

Lying is the message. It’s not just that both Putin and Trump lie, it is that they lie in the same way and for the same purpose: blatantly, to assert power over truth itself.

The media is the mirror. Trump, like Putin, has a demonstrably thin skin and short temper when it comes to being criticized by journalists. Trump has also made it clear that his administration will be less open and accessible to the press than those of his predecessors. But perhaps the most important insight came from Buzzfeed, which analyzed (https://www.buzzfeed.com/charliewarzel/trumps-information-universe?utm_term=.wsO3kDXe7#.epNae8KgP) over a year’s worth of Trump’s tweets to figure out where the president-elect gets his information. Trump’s mental universe, as it turns out, is dominated by Breitbart.

Taking charge of a boring world. The real-estate magnate and the KGB agent share a peculiar trait: both seem to be lazy and uninterested in the world they want to dominate.

Interests rather than priorities. Attempts to decipher the process by which Trump is choosing his cabinet have stumbled over the usual question: What are the incoming president’s priorities? But Trump, much like Putin, has neither views nor priorities: he has a thirst for power, and he has interests.

A president behind enemy lines. Many of Trump’s cabinet picks have one thing in common: they are opposed to the very mission of the agencies they have been chosen to lead.

The chosen one. When I published a biography of Putin in 2012, some American reviewers criticized the book for asserting that Putin was merely an “ordinary man [whom voters could invest] with whatever they wanted to see in him.” I argued that an unqualified man of limited intelligence had by accident come to rule a nuclear power.

In both cases, however, the sense of being chosen lends itself to a blurring of borders between the president and the state.

Putin has long equated opposition to him with opposition to the Russian state itself. His perception of mass protests as enemy action stemmed at least in part from this conflation.

Trump, with his tweets about stripping flag burners of US citizenship, seems headed down the same mental road: the electors have not even voted yet, but Trump already thinks that he is the United States and citizenship is his to grant and revoke.

http://www.nybooks.com/daily/2016/12/13/putin-paradigm-how-trump-will-rule/?utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=NYR%20Shirley%20Jackson%20Othello%20T rump%20and%20Putin&utm_content=NYR%20Shirley%20Jackson%20Othello%20Tr ump%20and%20Putin+CID_a7c83746b0315074e3af55f209a3 757c&utm_source=Newsletter&utm_term=The%20Putin%20Paradigm

[boutons_deux]

Trump's Men In Moscow: Trump Disciples Suddenly Showing Up In Russia

Donald Trump hasn't been inaugurated yet, but members of his campaign entourage are already riding the president-elect's coattails all the way to Moscow.

On Monday, Jack Kingston, a former Trump surrogate, briefed American businesspeople in Russia on what they might expect from the incoming administration.

Lifting Western sanctions that were imposed on Russia because of its armed intervention in Ukraine has become the top priority not only for the Kremlin but for foreign companies working in Moscow.

Kingston's Moscow trip coincided with the visit of another Trump disciple (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/08/world/europe/carter-page-donald-trump-moscow-russia.html?_r=0), Carter Page, who once claimed to advise the Republican candidate on energy and Russia policy (http://www.politico.eu/article/the-mystery-of-donald-trumps-man-in-moscow-carter-page-phd/). The Trump campaign later distanced itself from Page (http://www.politico.com/story/2016/09/carter-page-trump-conway-228641) after he came under scrutiny for his ties to Russia.

On Monday, Page held a news conference at the headquarters of Sputnik (https://sputniknews.com/world/201612121048459671-carter-page-trump-adviser-presentation-moscow/), a Russian state-run news agency, where he complained about the proliferation of fake news. :lol

Page lamented the "Cold War mindset" in the U.S. and sang the praises of Rex Tillerson, the Exxon Mobil CEO who expanded his company's footprint in Russia and whom Trump now wants to be his secretary of state.

http://www.npr.org/2016/12/14/505581348/trumps-men-in-moscow-trump-disciples-suddenly-showing-up-in-russia

Any of Trash's people showing up in in the countries of our allies?

[boutons_deux]

FBI Horrified As Spy Says Russia Has Been Supporting And Cultivating Trump For Years

A "veteran" spy is alleging that Russia is cultivating, supporting and assisting Donald Trump and has been for at least five years. The spy said the response from the FBI was "shock and horror."


A “veteran” spy is alleging that Russia is cultivating, supporting and assisting Donald Trump and has been for at least five years. The spy said the response from the FBI was “shock and horror.”The report alleges that Trump and his “inner circle” have accepted a regular “flow of intelligence from the Kremlin and that Russian intelligence claims to have “compromised” Trump on his visits and could “blackmail him”.David Corn at Mother Jones reported: (http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/10/veteran-spy-gave-fbi-info-alleging-russian-operation-cultivate-donald-trump)

Mother Jones has reviewed that report and other memos this former spy wrote.

The first memo, based on the former intelligence officer’s conversations with Russian sources, noted,

“Russian regime has been cultivating, supporting and assisting TRUMP for at least 5 years. Aim, endorsed by PUTIN, has been to encourage splits and divisions in western alliance.”

It maintained that Trump “and his inner circle have accepted a regular flow of intelligence from the Kremlin, including on his Democratic and other political rivals.”

It claimed that Russian intelligence had “compromised” Trump during his visits to Moscow and could “blackmail him.”

It also reported that Russian intelligence had compiled a dossier on Hillary Clinton based on “bugged conversations she had on various visits to Russia and intercepted phone calls.”

The former intelligence officer says the response from the FBI was “shock and horror.”

The FBI, after receiving the first memo, did not immediately request additional material, according to the former intelligence officer and his American associates. Yet in August, they say, the FBI asked him for all information in his possession and for him to explain how the material had been gathered and to identify his sources.

The former spy forwarded to the bureau several memos—some of which referred to members of Trump’s inner circle. After that point, he continued to share information with the FBI. “It’s quite clear there was or is a pretty substantial inquiry going on,” he says.

In August, Corn reports, the FBI asked the spy for all information related to his findings and he “continued to share information with the FBI” which he says made it clear there was a “pretty substantial inquiry going on.”

http://www.politicususa.com/2016/11/01/spy-russia-cultivating-trump.html

I bet Pootin has LOTS of videos of Trump fucking whores, snorting coke, all supplied by Pootin.

[DMC]

Can't believe Trump isn't going to continue in the footsteps of "kill the po po" Obama, by turning his attention toward meddling in local racial affairs and ignoring the world stage.

[hater]

ya heard it here first. Trump ExxonMobil Sec will order a war in Venezuela. an other regional countries...

[HI-FI]

ya heard it here first. Trump ExxonMobil Sec will order a war in Venezuela. an other regional countries...
What makes you think that? Not a fan of the pick?

[Winehole23]

Can't believe Trump isn't going to continue in the footsteps of "kill the po po" Obama, by turning his attention toward meddling in local racial affairs and ignoring the world stage.How moronic.

Why is Russia pissed off at us? Obviously it must be the supine foreign policy of the last eight years in Europe.

Drone wars in seven different countries? What a pussy.

Yemen, Syria, Honduras, Iraq again? Afghanistan, still? I thought Obama promised to get us out of that.

There is no war on police and Obama didn't foment one - he just had some mild criticism.

Some of you internet tough guys have awfully thin skins.

[Winehole23]

Nothing to compare really to GWB laying down like a pussycat when Russia steamrolled Georgia.

[Th'Pusher]

How moronic.

Why is Russia pissed off at us? Obviously it must be the supine foreign policy of the last eight years in Europe.

Drone wars in seven different countries? What a pussy.

Pakistan, Yemen, Syria, Honduras, Iraq again? Afghanistan, still? I thought Obama promised to get us out of that.

There is no war on police and Obama didn't foment one - he just had some mild criticism.

Some of you internet tough guys have awfully thin skins.

If you haven't noticed, since DMC began his tour through the political forum, which just so happened to coincide with the election, he's been dropping unsubstantiated controversial takes in an effort to garner attention.

I applaud your challenge. When presented with enough fact based opposition DMC consistently tucks his tail and moves on to another subject.

[Winehole23]

DMC has more than a few good takes, but that wasn't one of them. His rhetorical ecstasies against board libs lead him to absurdity at times.

It's an occupational hazard. No regular poster is immune. Add a drink or two and we all succumb.

[Winehole23]

Dialect shifting. Dumbing himself down to the level of boutons, most likely.

Not so wise in a public forum.

[Clipper Nation]

DMC is one of the elite posters in the political forum, tbh. Consistently great takes, hasn't lost to any of the board libs in an argument yet.

[Winehole23]

lol internetz victories. how puny and sad.

[Winehole23]

undefeated online! I say so!

[DMC]

How moronic.

Why is Russia pissed off at us? Obviously it must be the supine foreign policy of the last eight years in Europe.

Drone wars in seven different countries? What a pussy.

Yemen, Syria, Honduras, Iraq again? Afghanistan, still? I thought Obama promised to get us out of that.

There is no war on police and Obama didn't foment one - he just had some mild criticism.

Some of you internet tough guys have awfully thin skins.

Any criticism against the police during instances where the facts weren't known, from a black president regarding deaths of black people isn't "mild". He was meddling. He meddled in the Trayvon Martin case. He meddled in the professor vs the officer "mistaken identity" case. He became the black man who was elected president instead of the president who happened to be a black man. He had a voice for black people instead of a voice for all people. BLM sprang up under his watch (black and blue tbh).

Heaven forbid Trump not get into that shit and instead focus on foreign relations and leveling the playing field for American businesses on global trade.

Thin skin is the net-speak for inconvenient truth at unwelcome times.

[DMC]

If you haven't noticed, since DMC began his tour through the political forum, which just so happened to coincide with the election, he's been dropping unsubstantiated controversial takes in an effort to garner attention.

I applaud your challenge. When presented with enough fact based opposition DMC consistently tucks his tail and moves on to another subject.

How would you know? You've yet to present a cogent thought in text. Every time you open your suck something nebulous flops out like a retarded fetus produced by too many skull fuckings from random posters.

[Th'Pusher]

How would you know?

Because I can read. Like when you attempted to discuss healthcare policy with your narrow focus an the poor and lazy, a weak argument ElNono quickly dismantled.

You take categorical positions that please the likes of Wild Cobra and ClipperNation (see him up steam suckling your cock) as they frequently diminish liberal views, but they're completely unserious policy prescriptions. They're shock value fodder.

[DMC]

Because I can read. Like when you attempted to discuss healthcare policy with your narrow focus an the poor and lazy, a weak argument ElNono quickly dismantled.

You take categorical positions that please the likes of Wild Cobra and ClipperNation (see him up steam suckling your cock) as they frequently diminish liberal views, but they're completely unserious policy prescriptions. They're shock value fodder.

El Nono didn't dismantle anything. He just had a different opinion. You wouldn't know the difference because unlike many here, you lack the IQ to hold your own ground in any of these discussions. You'll interject, but soon you're sent scurrying back to the safety of apathy like the child you are.

[Winehole23]

He meddled in the professor vs the officer "mistaken identity" case.the facts were known there. the Cambridge PD arrested Henry Louis Gates at home. essentially for complaining about being treated like a suspicious intruder.

whatever one thinks of the propriety of the president commenting about particular cases (it's not, but Obama didn't materially effect process or result in either case) -- that hardly amounted to encouraging wholesale slaughter of LE, which did not result either.

your passion for this topic seems a bit overblown.

[Th'Pusher]

El Nono didn't dismantle anything. He just had a different opinion. You wouldn't know the difference because unlike many here, you lack the IQ to hold your own ground in any of these discussions. You'll interject, but soon you're sent scurrying back to the safety of apathy like the child you are.

:lol yeah. You really held your own with your argument for zero forced wealth redistribution with all those historical examples you were able to provide with tons of data to back it up.

[Winehole23]

Thin skin is the net-speak for inconvenient truth at unwelcome times.Nah. You've blown it out of proportion.

[DMC]

the facts were known there. the Cambridge PD arrested Henry Louis Gates at home. essentially for complaining about being treated like a suspicious intruder.

whatever one thinks of the propriety of the president commenting about particular cases (he didn't materially effect process or result in either case) -- that hardly amounted to encouraging wholesale slaughter of LE, which did not result either.

your passion for this topic seems a bit overblown.

Why does mistaken identity qualify for a presidential intervention?

You ignored my other points.

Of course it seems overblown. There's a new effigy to burn.

[DMC]

Nah. You've blown it out of proportion.

repetitive argument

[DMC]

:lol yeah. You really held your own with your argument for zero forced wealth redistribution with all those historical examples you were able to provide with tons of data to back it up.

I asked which society you wanted to emulate and you never responded. If you want change, you have to either have a template in mind or you have to build from scratch. Building from scratch means you don't have a template.

I realize that goes over your head.

[Winehole23]

Why does mistaken identity qualify for a presidential intervention?I've already acknowledged it doesn't. I think it's inappropriate and frankly beneath the office.


You ignored my other points.Is there one crying out for a reply? I mostly see emotive prose.

[DMC]

I've already acknowledged it doesn't. I think it's inappropriate and frankly beneath the office.

Is there one crying out for a reply? I mostly see emotive prose.

You cherry picked one and thought it cried out for a reply. Using that, you presumed to discount my entire post. Now you're saying the professor statement was the only thing in the post that deserved a response.

So you agree the POTUS meddled. What are you arguing against? It's not just beneath the office, we're not talking about royalty here. It's about precedence, the message "we aren't being treated fairly" sends to the rest of nation by the POTUS. The finger on the scale in favor of the black person right away, as if it's a pressing national security issue. Meanwhile there are cases of mistaken identity all across the USA on a daily basis by cops, and by the federal government.. and nary a peep from POTUS.

Yes it fueled the fire and yes there are likely dead cops due to some of it. There will likely be more. He gave some legitimacy to knee jerk judgement of viral videos of shootings where context is absent and only one side of the story is told. As the truth unfolds, it's presented as a side note.

So we just spent 8 years with a community organizer (one I voted for btw) running a micro-Al Sharpton style presidency and somehow Trump's friendliness toward another superpower is more of an issue. As if the saber rattling Obama is doing in his 11th hour isn't just noise.

[Winehole23]

What you said about Obama being absent from the world stage to be a racial justice warrior is overblown and factually false. Again, why is Russia pissed off at us?

[DMC]

What you said about Obama being absent from the world stage to be a racial justice warrior is overblown and factually false. Again, why is Russia pissed off at us?

First establish that Russia is pissed off at us.

[DMC]

and btw, I didn't say Obama ignored the world stage. You inferred it then attributed it to me.

[Winehole23]

Trump isn't going to continue in the footsteps of "kill the po po" Obama, by turning his attention toward meddling in local racial affairs and ignoring the world stage.

[DMC]

"his" being Trump's

In other words, Trump isn't going to ignore the world stage because he's busy trying to follow in Obama's footsteps of meddling in local affairs.

[boutons_deux]

First establish that Russia is pissed off at us.

Russia-facing NATO/USA missiles in eastern Europe

NATO military exercises on Russia's borders.

USA deposing Putin's puppet in Ukraine.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-06-14/nato-begins-encirclement-russia

http://archive.larouchepac.com/node/30422

[Th'Pusher]

I asked which society you wanted to emulate and you never responded. If you want change, you have to either have a template in mind or you have to build from scratch. Building from scratch means you don't have a template.

I realize that goes over your head.

I didn't respond, because the horse had been beaten and you began shifting the argument. You were unable to effectively support your position that absolutely no forced wealth redistribution was good or even possible as you were unable to provide a single example of it ever being implemented successfully after multiple requests.

[DMC]

I didn't respond, because the horse had been beaten and you began shifting the argument. You were unable to effectively support your position that absolutely no forced wealth redistribution was good or even possible as you were unable to provide a single example of it ever being implemented successfully after multiple requests.

I see. So you walk away from a discussion and it's justified, but if I do it I'm running scared.


:lol shifting the argument? How, by asking you to specify which society you wanted to emulate? Since you were insisting what hasn't been done cannot be done, I was asking which you wanted to copy.

[Th'Pusher]

I see. So you walk away from a discussion and it's justified, but if I do it I'm running scared.


:lol shifting the argument? How, by asking you to specify which society you wanted to emulate? Since you were insisting what hasn't been done cannot be done, I was asking which you wanted to copy.

Societies I want or don't want to emulate have no bearing on your ability to support your position.

[pgardn]

DMC has more than a few good takes, but that wasn't one of them. His rhetorical ecstasies against board libs lead him to absurdity at times.

It's an occupational hazard. No regular poster is immune. Add a drink or two and we all succumb.

He denies the drink.

The man does go completely sideways though, it's strange.

[DMC]

Societies I want or don't want to emulate have no bearing on your ability to support your position.
That's because you don't get to dictate and steer my narrative. If you want to play the empirical card, then you'll have to ante up.

[DMC]

He denies the drink.

The man does go completely sideways though, it's strange.

I'm not a drinker but I will drink one tonight in honor of Craig Sager.

[pgardn]

I'm not a drinker but I will drink one tonight in honor of Craig Sager.

We both will.

[TeyshaBlue]

We both will.

In

[Th'Pusher]

That's because you don't get to dictate and steer my narrative. If you want to play the empirical card, then you'll have to ante up.

If you can make your argument without empirical data, go right ahead.

[Winehole23]

Why is Russia pissed?

NATO enlargement in the erstwhile Soviet sphere, economic sanctions, color coded revolutions, conventional and nuclear arms posture, HRC shit talking and driving down the price of oil. To say nothing of our (now apparently failed) attempt to establish a new pipeline for natural gas through Syria to Europe.

That's just off the top of my head. Is that so implausible?

[Axl Rose]

Why is Russia pissed?

NATO enlargement in the erstwhile Soviet sphere, economic sanctions, color coded revolutions, conventional and nuclear arms posture, HRC shit talking and driving down the price of oil. To say nothing of our (now apparently failed) attempt to establish a new pipeline for natural gas through Syria to Europe.

That's just off the top of my head. Is that so implausible?


Bingo

[Winehole23]

So you agree Russia had good motives to fuck with our election and did?

[Axl Rose]

Anyone could have motives, motives don't mean anything. Post proof

[Winehole23]

Ha. Ask the CIA and the FBI.

Their claim, their burden.

[Winehole23]

I don't think HRC lost because of Russia. She lost for a multitude of reasons, many of them under her control, but I don't think that's a good reason not to take foreign influences serioisly. A number of people pooh-poohing Trump's ties to Russia were screeching about HRC's ties to Gulf States through her foundation or James Riady and Johnny Chung back in Bill Clinton's day.

Looks a lot like selective attention to a legit issue.

[Winehole23]

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/dec/18/leak-rex-tillerson-director-bahamas-based-us-russian-oil-company

[Wild Cobra]

So you agree Russia had good motives to fuck with our election and did?

I don't think it was Russia, but for the sake of argument let's say they did.

What I see is an administration and leftists presidential candidates publicly claiming they want to bring down Putin and hurt Russia. If you were Putin, what would you do?

What measures would the US intelligence community take if Putin was saying he wanted to bring us down?

I don't think it was Russia, but if it was, I most certainly don't blame them. I would say the demonrats did it to themselves in their "holier than though" philosophy.

[Axl Rose]

Ha. Ask the CIA and the FBI.

Their claim, their burden.im asking you because you're taking it as fact and repeating it

[Winehole23]

if you read through the thread, it's clear I don't take it as a demonstrated fact. I blame HRC for losing the election.

[Winehole23]

Russian hacking needn't be a demonstrated certainty in order to take it seriously. a lot of Trumpistas are dismissing it lightly because they like the result of the election, but if the election really was fucked with, that's a fairly serious matter.

cyberwarfare is real; dismissing the possibility reflexively could be foolish, cynical or both.

[Winehole23]

it's possible all in the same breath that HRC and no one else is responsible for losing, that whining about Russian interference in the election is sour grapes, and that the Russians really did fuck with us.

if they did, wouldn't you want to know how?

[Winehole23]

"his" being Trump's

In other words, Trump isn't going to ignore the world stage because he's busy trying to follow in Obama's footsteps of meddling in local affairs.or tweet at 3am when a celebrity hurts his feelings or the media runs an unflattering pic.

[DMC]

So you agree Russia had good motives to fuck with our election and did?

I think they had motives. I think their motives could be to fuck with Clinton, not so much the election. Pretty sure Russia had nothing to do with shutting Bernie Sanders out or HRC using "basket of deplorables" comment. All you could accuse Russia of is divulging the truth about just one candidate. I'd say that's fucking with Clinton, not with the election.

CNN tampered with the election much more so than did Russia and they got off without a scratch. Donna B gave one candidate an unfair debate advantage. There's your dishonesty. Unveiling that she did it isn't dishonest and it's amusing to see people try to gas light the forum into thinking that somehow removing the smokescreen is tampering.

As for motive, Iraq had motive to have WMDs. Reports said they did. Off we went.

[Winehole23]

petty vindictiveness has been a constant theme with DJT -- are you sure we're talking about the same Trump?

[Wild Cobra]

CNN tampered with the election much more so than did Russia and they got off without a scratch. Donna B gave one candidate an unfair debate advantage. There's your dishonesty. Unveiling that she did it isn't dishonest and it's amusing to see people try to gas light the forum into thinking that somehow removing the smokescreen is tampering.


Oh so true.

The media creates an imbalance that the unflavored candidate has a hard time overcoming.

[DMC]

or tweet at 3am when a celebrity hurts his feelings or the media runs an unflattering pic.

People want him to be more stoic, isolated and only speak through speech writers. That's not change. You can't always tailor your candidate to your liking. As a country you get what you get. Social media is here to stay, Donald likes it. If Media didn't fuck him for the entire election period maybe they'd have a better shot at getting some canned responses.

[Winehole23]

I think they had motives. I think their motives could be to fuck with Clinton, not so much the election. Pretty sure Russia had nothing to do with shutting Bernie Sanders out or HRC using "basket of deplorables" comment. All you could accuse Russia of is divulging the truth about just one candidate. I'd say that's fucking with Clinton, not with the election.

CNN tampered with the election much more so than did Russia and they got off without a scratch. Donna B gave one candidate an unfair debate advantage. There's your dishonesty. Unveiling that she did it isn't dishonest and it's amusing to see people try to gas light the forum into thinking that somehow removing the smokescreen is tampering.If one assumes that all Russia did was to reveal true information about one candidate, then I more or less agree with you. But that's assuming a lot. For example that all the wikileaks material was 100% bona fide and undicked-with, which we don't know.


I don't presume Russia holds itself above promulgating disinformation. Had it done so would you feel just the same about their participation in the presidential campaign?

[Winehole23]

People want him to be more stoic, isolated and only speak through speech writers. That's not change. You can't always tailor your candidate to your liking. As a country you get what you get. Social media is here to stay, Donald likes it. If Media didn't fuck him for the entire election period maybe they'd have a better shot at getting some canned responses.not acting like a spoiled child would be enough, tbh

[DMC]

If one assumes that all Russia did was to reveal true information about one candidate, then I more or less agree with you. But that's assuming a lot. For example that all the wikileaks material was 100% bona fide and undicked-with, which we don't know.


Working from what we know isn't assuming a lot. Assuming a lot is to posit other possibilities and dwell on them as if they are known facts. That's a slippery slope that we have no need to employ.


I don't presume Russia holds itself above promulgating disinformation. Had it done so would you feel just the same about their participation in the presidential campaign?

I don't care to speculate how I would feel based on hypotheticals. That kind of thing is how division is created unnecessarily. Visit it when it becomes an issue.

[DMC]

not acting like a spoiled child would be enough, tbh

In public, you mean? If he was cigar raping his intern would that be better? How about bombing an aspirin factory the day before his impeachment hearing? There are bigger things to worry about than the POTUSe's tweets.

[Spurminator]

810316404654100480

[Trill Clinton]

810316404654100480

disgusting

[Axl Rose]

Russian hacking needn't be a demonstrated certainty in order to take it seriously. a lot of Trumpistas are dismissing it lightly because they like the result of the election, but if the election really was fucked with, that's a fairly serious matter.

cyberwarfare is real; dismissing the possibility reflexively could be foolish, cynical or both.
As long as they keep the psychotic left out of power I don't care who hacks what. I honestly think this was our last election.

[Winehole23]

In public, you mean? If he was cigar raping his intern would that be better? How about bombing an aspirin factory the day before his impeachment hearing? There are bigger things to worry about than the POTUSe's tweets.sure, that was some bullshit. I denounced it on SR at the time.

But it''s silly to pretend the president has a private life on Twitter. If he wants to vent privately, do it privately.

Twitter is social media, not one's closet or the bathroom mirror. What the president says matters no matter where he says it.

[Winehole23]

As long as they keep the psychotic left out of power I don't care who hacks what. I honestly think this was our last election.I think you're wrong about that. We lived through Clinton, Bush and Obama to see more elections.

Wanna bet?

[Winehole23]

Working from what we know isn't assuming a lot. Assuming a lot is to posit other possibilities and dwell on them as if they are known facts. That's a slippery slope that we have no need to employ.


I don't care to speculate how I would feel based on hypotheticals. That kind of thing is how division is created unnecessarily. Visit it when it becomes an issue.

But you take possible disinfo and agitprop as a given truth. And refuse to allow that Russian dirty tricks might go beyond leaking true facts about only one candidate.

[Winehole23]

Supposing the Russians had politically damaging info about Trump and chose not to share it, and instead shared only politically damaging information, true and false, about his opponent, isn't that a thumb on the scale in the supranational electronic sensorium?

[Winehole23]

How heavily invested is Russia in Trump and vice versa?

Do we deserve to know it?

Why or why not?

[Winehole23]

If Trump would reveal his taxes like all his processors going back 50 years, it wouldn't be so speculative.

What is Trump hiding? If he has nothing to hide, it costs him nothing to reveal it.

[Wild Cobra]

If Trump would reveal his taxes like all his processors going back 50 years, it wouldn't be so speculative.

What is Trump hiding? If he has nothing to hide, it costs him nothing to reveal it.

I thought he was waiting until after the audit.

Stop with the stupid BS complaints.

[Winehole23]

I thought he was waiting until after the audit.

Stop with the stupid BS complaints.it's not stupid. its not BS.

if it was Hilary, you'd be screaming from the rooftop.

[Winehole23]

As long as they keep the psychotic left out of power I don't care who hacks what. I honestly think this was our last election.Wishful thinking.

[Winehole23]

Fuck all that noise. You're gonna lose.

[Wild Cobra]

it's not stupid. its not BS.

if it was Hilary, you'd be screaming from the rooftop.
Not if she was in the middle of an audit process.

[Winehole23]

Ha.

You'd give Hilary Clinton a pass if the IRS was auditing her taxes.

[Winehole23]

you wouldn't be wondering what the problem was?

[Winehole23]

too rich

[Winehole23]

WC would give Hilary Clinton the benefit of a doubt, and excuse her from disclosing her returns during a presidential campaign, if there was an IRS audit.

[Wild Cobra]

you wouldn't be wondering what the problem was?

Maybe, maybe not.

I'll bet her tax return is under 5% as complicated as Trump's.

[DMC]

sure, that was some bullshit. I denounced it on SR at the time.

But it''s silly to pretend the president has a private life on Twitter. If he wants to vent privately, do it privately.

Twitter is social media, not one's closet or the bathroom mirror. What the president says matters no matter where he says it.

Mark Cuban can do it as a team owner and that's ok, but the POTUS can't do it even though it's totally legal? You do realize he thrives on finding these loopholes that the others had eons to close, right? I mean, hell, create some walls, he's into that.

[DMC]

But you take possible disinfo and agitprop as a given truth. And refuse to allow that Russian dirty tricks might go beyond leaking true facts about only one candidate.

I don't entirely dismiss it. It's quite a sad statement to say I trust the Russians as much as I trust my own government, and the evidence seems to point toward the emails being real, and people have been fired from the text of those messages. Hell, Anthony Weiner's texts could have been hacked. We're ok with assuming they weren't though.

Anyhow, what's so damaging about anything in the hacked emails that they haven't openly admitted to or that some entity with inside knowledge hasn't treated as fact? CNN fired Donna over it, they must have believed it.

[DMC]

The worst things about Hillary were made known by Hillary. The emails just showed her campaign staff is not much different than any company that serves the public, they all hate the customers and each other, at the root level.

[Winehole23]

Mark Cuban can do it as a team owner and that's ok, but the POTUS can't do it even though it's totally legal? You do realize he thrives on finding these loopholes that the others had eons to close, right? I mean, hell, create some walls, he's into that.Not everything that's legal to do is a good idea.

What the President says matters more than what you and me and NBA owners say. The President using Twitter ro spread lies and stoke the passion of the mob against whoever crosses him is not only dishonorable, but abusive. Great power, great responsibility.

If he keeps it up he'll get someone killed.

[boutons_deux]

If he keeps it up he'll get someone killed.

...and he won't give a fuck. no money out of his pockets, no ding on his disordered ego

[CosmicCowboy]

Not everything that's legal to do is a good idea.

What the President says matters more than what you and me and NBA owners say. The President using Twitter ro spread lies and stoke the passion of the mob against whoever crosses him is not only dishonorable, but abusive. Great power, great responsibility.

If he keeps it up he'll get someone killed.

I admit I have my reservations about Trump.

I was a lot more anti-Hillary than pro-Trump before the election.

I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, however.

It's almost guaranteed he will make mistakes but hopefully he will learn from them.

I think that behind the bluster he realizes that.

Hopefully he makes some good decisions behind that desk.

[boutons_deux]

"give him the benefit of the doubt"

... after his LYING campaign

... while he's tweeting bullshit?

... after his staff picks?

... after his caving to Ryan on Medicare?

the momentum DOWNWARD for the 95%, and esp for Trash's voters, is set, and it won't change. will be 4 years of destruction, even if Flynn doesn't bomb Iran.

[CosmicCowboy]

"give him the benefit of the doubt"

... after his LYING campaign

... while he's tweeting bullshit?

... after his staff picks?

... after his caving to Ryan on Medicare?

the momentum DOWNWARD for the 95%, and esp for Trash's voters, is set, and it won't change. will be 4 years of destruction, even if Flynn doesn't bomb Iran.






Boo still massively butthurt over Saint Hillary getting exposed. So Sad.

[DMC]

Not everything that's legal to do is a good idea.

Of course not. Doesn't make it a crime just because you don't think it's a good idea though, so why are so many acting like he's committing a crime like using a public server for confidential email?


What the President says matters more than what you and me and NBA owners say. The President using Twitter ro spread lies and stoke the passion of the mob against whoever crosses him is not only dishonorable, but abusive. Great power, great responsibility.

What NBA team owner says matter more than what NBA player says (see Donald Sterling). It's a pyramid and it does matter, but with greater power comes greater freedom to fuck up if you so choose. He so chooses. Same with DJT.


If he keeps it up he'll get someone killed.
Won't be Chris Stevens, Glen Doherty, Sean Smith or Tyrone Woods.

[Winehole23]

Maybe, maybe not.

I'll bet her tax return is under 5% as complicated as Trump's.your belief in your own fair-mindedness and the simplicity of HRC's tax returns is touching.

[Winehole23]

Of course not. Doesn't make it a crime just because you don't think it's a good idea though, so why are so many acting like he's committing a crime like using a public server for confidential email?

What NBA team owner says matter more than what NBA player says (see Donald Sterling). It's a pyramid and it does matter, but with greater power comes greater freedom to fuck up if you so choose. He so chooses. Same with DJT.

Won't be Chris Stevens, Glen Doherty, Sean Smith or Tyrone Woods.lol comparing POTUS to NBA figures. You must be sports mad. ;-)

[Wild Cobra]

your belief in your own fair-mindedness and the simplicity of HRC's tax returns is touching.
I didn't say it was simple you fucking moron.

Seriously... Do you think Trumps tax return will not be 20 times the papers, or more, than the Clinton's?

Do you seriously believe it isn't more complex?

[boutons_deux]

so return complexity is an excuse for not publishing them? :lol

[Winehole23]

So like, if it's ok for ballers and owners to do it, it's ok for POTUS too?

[Adam Lambert]

lets be honest with ourselves, wild cobra is the kind of person that would call an ikea instruction manual too complex to comprehend so his opinion of tax returns is pretty worthless

[Winehole23]

so return complexity is an excuse for not publishing them? :lolDJT is a special snowflake. Social and political norms no longer apply.

[DMC]

lol comparing POTUS to NBA figures. You must be sports mad. ;-)

POTUS is a government employee. There's always been too much stigma attached to the office, and it's become too much like a monarchy. The fact that you had Hillary and Donald as choices should be enough to illustrate just how overblown the honor facade has become.

Yes Donald is too wordy and I would prefer he tighten it up. However, he's not there to do what I want and won't do it how I want him to do it. He's going to be Donald Trump. Put Rosie O'Donnell there and expect her to act like Margret Thatcher. It's not going to happen.

The faux panic from the media and the libtards just legitimizes Donald's social media presence. If they acted like it was just another day, maybe Donald would use normal outlets to communicate and he probably will anyhow once he's surrounded by folks who are there solely to speak for him. Right now he has Conway.

It's amusing that folks cannot even wait to see what he's going to do before jumping off the cliffs.

[Wild Cobra]

so return complexity is an excuse for not publishing them? :lol

Not at all.

He said it wouldn't be right to release them until the audit is completed.

But then, your pundits never tell you the truth of matters.

Wouldn't you like the IRS audit to verify his return is accurate?

[DMC]

So like, if it's ok for ballers and owners to do it, it's ok for POTUS too?

That's the point. It's not ok for them to do it. There's backlash when they do it. They have the POWER to do it though, and as long as they do not cross the lines with NBA officials, they can just be "odd" owners. Start talking about keeping darkies out though, even if it's recorded against your knowledge, and you're going to swing from a rope of public opinion less forgiving than the Apaches.

[Wild Cobra]

Why is this ignored?



On June 14, 2016, according to The Washington Post, the DNC acknowledged a hack[42] which was claimed by Guccifer 2.0.[4][5][6][7][32][43]

On July 18, 2016, Guccifer 2.0 provided exclusively to The Hill numerous documents and files covering political strategies,[2] including but not limited to correlating the banks that received bailout funds with Republican Party and Democratic Party donations.[2]

On July 22, 2016, the Guccifer 2.0 stated he hacked, then leaked, the DNC emails to WikiLeaks.[4][5][6][7][32][43] “Wikileaks published #DNCHack docs I'd given them!!!”, tweeted Guccifer 2.0.[7]

On September 13, 2016, during a conference, an unknown and remote representative of Guccifer 2.0 released almost 700 megabytes (MB) worth of documents from the DNC.[44] Forbes also obtained a copy of those.[8] Still according to Forbes, on September 12, 2016, ahead of that conference, Guccifer posted a public Twitter message in which he confirmed that his representative was legitimate.[8] The Russian government denied any involvement.[44] The DNC, the DCCC, U.S. intelligence officials, and other experts speculated about Russia involvement.[44] NGP VAN, who state they are the “leading technology provider” for the Democratic campaigns, declined to comment on Guccifer 2.0's recent statements.[8]

On October 4, 2016, Guccifer 2.0 released documents and claimed that they were taken from the Clinton Foundation and showed "corruption and malfeasance" there.[45] Security experts quickly determined that the release was a hoax; the release did not contain Clinton Foundation documents, but rather consisted of documents previously released from the DNC and DCCC thefts, data aggregated from public records, and documents that were fabricated altogether as propaganda.[45][11] Singled out as particularly absurd was the idea that Clinton's team would have actually named a file "Pay for Play" on their own server, as Guccifer 2.0's screenshots of the alleged "hack" show.[45][9][10]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guccifer_2.0

[Winehole23]

oh right, after watching him on TV for years, we have no idea what he'll do.

[Wild Cobra]

Whinehole...

Do you have any reason to believe this is not a picture of his tax return:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CRX8NzAVEAQwU8G.jpg (https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/654706635663773696/photo/1)

Bill and Hillary's is only 44 pages.

[Winehole23]

I don't doubt for second DJT is way richer and his taxes way more complex.

So he gets a pass on conflicts of interest becase it's hardsr to untangle?

God forbid public service should inconvenience a very rich man. It's obviouly discrimination to burden him with the same expectations we laid on his predecessors.

[Wild Cobra]

I don't doubt for second DJT is way richer and his taxes way more complex.

So he gets a pass on conflicts of interest becase it's hardsr to untangle?

God forbid public service should inconvenience a very rich man. It's obviouly discrimination to burden him with the same expectations we laid on his predecessors.

Why don't you wait for his audit to be finished, and go from there. To do otherwise I think is foolish.

[boutons_deux]

Why don't you wait for his audit to be finished, and go from there. To do otherwise I think is foolish.

Now that Trash is Pres, he won't ever release his tax returns. The audit excuse was a, surprise, LIE

[lefty]

Vlad owning Murica as usual :lol

[boutons_deux]

Vlad owning Murica as usual :lol

https://youtu.be/kvDMlk3kSYg

[Winehole23]

Why don't you wait for his audit to be finished, and go from there. To do otherwise I think is foolish.Nothing prevents DJT from releasing his taxes -- except his own sense of political self-preservation.

[Adam Lambert]

Whinehole...

Do you have any reason to believe this is not a picture of his tax return:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CRX8NzAVEAQwU8G.jpg (https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/654706635663773696/photo/1)



i do
its not his tax return because it's on his desk and not his team of accountants

this isnt a tax return, its a photo op you retarded fuck

[tlongII]

i do
its not his tax return because it's on his desk and not his team of accountants

this isnt a tax return, its a photo op you retarded fuck

He still has to sign it dumbass.

[Xevious]

What surprises me are the liberals supporting remaining in a cold war like mentality with Russia.

What happened to compassion? Accepting other cultures? And everything else they claim to champion?

It is so funny they can't see past their own bigotry.
I haven't read this entire thread, but some of you have things reversed here. Putin is the one longing for the good ol' Soviet days, not the liberals. It's obvious why Putin would prefer Trump over Hillary, but it isn't clear why Trump blindly defends Putin. He goes as far as calling every US intelligence agency incompetent in order to shift eyes away from Russia. Why? I'm not a Clinton supporter at all... I just find this behavior odd, and more than a little troubling.

[CosmicCowboy]

i do
its not his tax return because it's on his desk and not his team of accountants

this isnt a tax return, its a photo op you retarded fuck

Well, we know mama's boy has obviously never signed a tax return.

[Fabbs]

I haven't read this entire thread, but some of you have things reversed here. Putin is the one longing for the good ol' Soviet days, not the liberals. It's obvious why Putin would prefer Trump over Hillary, but it isn't clear why Trump blindly defends Putin. He goes as far as calling every US intelligence agency incompetent in order to shift eyes away from Russia. Why? I'm not a Clinton supporter at all... I just find this behavior odd, and more than a little troubling.

[boutons_deux]

"clear why Trump blindly defends Putin"

... Vlad has hours of videos of Trash in Moscow with whores and coke. Vlad has compromised Trash.

Vlad may have also slipped Trash a few $100M cash into a foreign account(s) to get Trash's beauty contest into Moscow.

Use your imagination, it's probably inadequate to imagine all the corrupt shit that goes on between corrupt multi-billionaires, esp transnationally.

Anybody think either Vlad or Don The Con have ANY respect for ANY laws? :lol

[CosmicCowboy]

:lol mid day Boo meltdown laugh.

[Xevious]

I'd also add that it's pretty disgusting that some Americans are okay with foreign powers interfering with our elections as long as the end result aligns with their own political beliefs.

[Xevious]

:lol mid day Boo meltdown laugh.
I mostly ignore his posts, but this is one instance that Trump seems to have some Russian assets that haven't been disclosed, or Putin has something personal on Trump. I don't see many other options here.

[spurraider21]

Whinehole...

Do you have any reason to believe this is not a picture of his tax returni dont get it. was the argument ever made that trump doesn't have tax returns?

[spurraider21]

saying we cant look at trump's returns while under audit is like saying we shouldn't read clinton's emails while the fbi is investigating. and why wouldn't he at least reveal returns of previous years which are not currently under audit?

not releasing them was a calculated move, and i can respect that. but its hard to buy into the audit excuse

[DMX7]

saying we cant look at trump's returns while under audit is like saying we shouldn't read clinton's emails while the fbi is investigating

You can forget about ever seeing his tax returns unless they're hacked. That whole charade about him releasing the returns once the audit is over is pointless now. He got elected without doing it and now he knows he doesn't have to show them even if he runs for reelection. The audit will never be "over"... remember we can't see any of them because of "linkage" :lol anyway.

[Adam Lambert]

He still has to sign it dumbass.


Well, we know mama's boy has obviously never signed a tax return.

are you fucktards seriously saying you think he has to sign every page of that obviously fake stack of papers? you think his high dollar cpas print out thousands of pages and stack them on his desk like that? no one could be that stupid. suck his dick some more you gullible cocksuckers.

[tlongII]

are you fucktards seriously saying you think he has to sign every page of that obviously fake stack of papers? you think his high dollar cpas print out thousands of pages and stack them on his desk like that? no one could be that stupid. suck his dick some more you gullible cocksuckers.

Did you see the tabs in the stacks? Those are the pages he has to sign. You should get a job sometime.

[CosmicCowboy]

are you fucktards seriously saying you think he has to sign every page of that obviously fake stack of papers? you think his high dollar cpas print out thousands of pages and stack them on his desk like that? no one could be that stupid. suck his dick some more you gullible cocksuckers.

Quit living off mamas tit and get a job, faggot and you would understand about signing tax returns.

[Winehole23]

That's the point. It's not ok for them to do it. There's backlash when they do it. They have the POWER to do it though, and as long as they do not cross the lines with NBA officials, they can just be "odd" owners. Start talking about keeping darkies out though, even if it's recorded against your knowledge, and you're going to swing from a rope of public opinion less forgiving than the Apaches.I thought you were stressing the opposite. Are you talking about Danny Ferry? Donald Sterling? Both?

This is actually an interesting point: pro sports maybe does not have the gravitas of government, or even popular culture. But what's special in pop culture and pro sports wields special powers. Notably, being an employer.

[DMC]

I thought you were stressing the opposite. Are you talking about Danny Ferry? Donald Sterling? Both?

This is actually an interesting point: pro sports maybe does not have the gravitas of government, or even popular culture. But what's special in pop culture and pro sports wields special powers. Notably, being an employer.

Mark Cuban. The three you mentioned cross the lines. I already mentioned Cuban.