Murray

[duncan2k5]

The more I see him play, the more I'm convinced he needs minutes...he is quick, gets to the rim at will, can collapse the defense, and he puts big men on skates when they switch the pick and roll...plus his defense is disruptive...as he gets more playing time and experience, he will be a good defender with his length...he even hit a 3 with no hesitation, which shows he is working on that shot...this kid is a big deal

[spursparker9]

Probably can easily average 15 pts, 5 rebs, 5 asts if given minutes on bad team

[Trueblood]

While I totally agree on your assessment of his skills I have to disagree that he should have more playing time. The sample we're seeing is mostly garbage time minutes where he is playing against fringe d leaguers. Even Anderson looks passable against them. When he's up against starting caliber players he turns the ball over to much. Tony may not be able to get to the rim the way he used to but he still has a decent turnover rate. Currently the spurs turn the ball over an average of 13 times a game. While that's not the best rate in the league it's a great rate for a team that passes as much as the spurs. If Murray had more minutes early that number would significantly increase as well as our losses. He's still really young and I believe d league and garbage time combined with a full off-season of working on his ball control is the right combination. Starting him or even putting him as the first of the bench would be pointing away our playoff seeding and any hopes for home court advantage. Of course given how we've played at home compared to away that might not be a bad thing...

[Chinook]

Nah. The dude needs to be in Austin working on his body and game. There are things he can do this year, but his issues aren't things that can be worked out on the bench. The big club can't give him the attention he needs.

[Fireball]

He looked better in his Last two outings but still is far away from being a player in a Spurs Uniform. Let him develop in Austin ...

[GSH]

Probably can easily average 15 pts, 5 rebs, 5 asts if given minutes on bad team


Give him some good teammates and he'd average a triple-double.

[cd98]

While I totally agree on your assessment of his skills I have to disagree that he should have more playing time. The sample we're seeing is mostly garbage time minutes where he is playing against fringe d leaguers. Even Anderson looks passable against them. When he's up against starting caliber players he turns the ball over to much. Tony may not be able to get to the rim the way he used to but he still has a decent turnover rate. Currently the spurs turn the ball over an average of 13 times a game. While that's not the best rate in the league it's a great rate for a team that passes as much as the spurs. If Murray had more minutes early that number would significantly increase as well as our losses. He's still really young and I believe d league and garbage time combined with a full off-season of working on his ball control is the right combination. Starting him or even putting him as the first of the bench would be pointing away our playoff seeding and any hopes for home court advantage. Of course given how we've played at home compared to away that might not be a bad thing... Amen. As much as Parker has declined, people are going overboard with the notion that a veteran point guard that knows the Spurs system inside out and that at least knows the team defense scheme is somehow replaceable with a rookie that is turnover prone in the D-League. Turnovers will mean first round exit in the playoffs this year...Pop is going with the veterans.

[Cry Havoc]

The more I see him play, the more I'm convinced he needs minutes...he is quick, gets to the rim at will, can collapse the defense, and he puts big men on skates when they switch the pick and roll...plus his defense is disruptive...as he gets more playing time and experience, he will be a good defender with his length...he even hit a 3 with no hesitation, which shows he is working on that shot...this kid is a big deal

He has potential but no polish. He would get absolutely bulldozed by NBA point guards, especially once they got used to seeing his handles and tendencies.

One of the biggest things that sets NBA ball handlers apart is their ability to improvise and be safe with the ball against different forms of pressure and different attacks. I have confidence that Murray isn't there yet and would have extreme difficulty dealing with that. A half court trap from two NBA players is worlds apart from one from two college kids.

[100%duncan]

Nah. The dude needs to be in Austin working on his body and game. There are things he can do this year, but his issues aren't things that can be worked out on the bench. The big club can't give him the attention he needs.

This. Pretty clear that they dont have a plan for him this season, better play 35 mins in the dleague than rot in the bench

[bklynspursfan]

Nah. The dude needs to be in Austin working on his body and game. There are things he can do this year, but his issues aren't things that can be worked out on the bench. The big club can't give him the attention he needs.

+1

[Mr. Body]

He isn't even close to seeing the game develop properly. It will take time.

[gambit1990]

he should be playing. tony's playing 25 minutes... give 10 of those to murray.

[Das Texan]

http://sports.cbsimg.net/images/visual/whatshot/120915_pop.jpg
This season is not for this Murray kid.

[SpursforSix]

:pop: Fifteen million?!???!!??

[HarlemHeat37]

He's shown flashes as a scoring guard in his limited time..however, it's very evident that he has no idea how to run a team, control the pace or pass the ball, right now..it's understandable at his age, but he's nowhere near ready to play serious NBA minutes:lol

[SPURt]

I'm excited for the potential of Murray, two things will happen:

1. Murray will start at least one more game this season should he remain healthy. Pop will give him as many minutes as the ability to win dictates.

2. Murray will not contribute these playoffs unless a championship dooming rash of injuries break out.

Anyone hoping for something different is hoping for the impossible. He can get to the rim and his size makes his defensive potential high but until he can shoot a three and play within the team Pop's rape stick will be firmly lodged between his butt cheecks.

[gambit1990]

we don't even need a lot from him. he just needs to be active defensively.

[HarlemHeat37]

I don't think people understand how difficult it is to play against good NBA teams, especially once when they have a scouting report on that player:lol it's a completely different game than going up against bench warmers on the Pelicans or Kings..

Look at Simmons..he consistently struggles against good defenses outside of transition points(while looking great vs. sloppy, undisciplined teams), and he's currently a lot more polished than Murray(and plays a much easier position to learn)..

[KDKSpurs24]

A lot of people seem to forget that playing time helps someone gain the experience they need. If this guy is thrown into the fire with this veteran team I believe he would respond very well. He would improve a lot and learn from his mistakes. I feel he has the talent and the attitude it takes to not be overwhelmed by the moment. He's a special exception, imo.

[gambit1990]

A lot of people seem to forget that playing time helps someone gain the experience they need. If this guy is thrown into the fire with this veteran team I believe he would respond very well. He would improve a lot and learn from his mistakes. I feel he has the talent and the attitude it takes to not be overwhelmed by the moment. He's a special exception, imo.
well put.

there used to be a time where teams didn't have the luxury of assigning a player to their d league team and recalling them.

yeah, murray's raw. let him get some burn.

[duncan2k5]

By ur guys logic, once NBA teams get accustomed to anyone's game, they will be stopped...this dude has elite handles...he is not gonna suddenly get stripped...playing time will aid his decision making... Keep in mind he is a first round talent that was once projected to be in the lottery...there are worse point guards in the NBA than him getting significant burn...he will help us when our offense gets stagnant with the starting unit because he can create off the dribble...currently kawhi is the only player in the starting lineup that can break down the defense when our offense breaks down...that's why we tend to go on these droughts... No dynamic players... Everyone is a jumoshooter, and parker isn't even that...the couple turnovers he may have will be overshadowed by the good he will bring...he did pretty good against starting level pg when he got some burn, and learning goes 2 ways...players will leads his tendencies, and he will learn theirs...difference is that he is 6'5 and athletic with insane handles...guess who wins that battle?

[Em-City]

Overstating Murray's handles gets you nowhere

[rjv]

the waiving of nico today seems to suggest FO not paying any attention to the ST experts yet again.

[Spurtacular]

Nah. The dude needs to be in Austin working on his body and game. There are things he can do this year, but his issues aren't things that can be worked out on the bench. The big club can't give him the attention he needs.

Spurs might figure they need him on nights players rest. No games can be wasted in pursuit of top seed.

[Mr. Body]

the waiving of nico today seems to suggest FO not paying any attention to the ST experts yet again.

I fund this hard to believe. The posters here are all brilliant.

[Russ]

the waiving of nico today seems to suggest FO not paying any attention to the ST experts yet again.

Will they ever learn?

:lol

[Mnky]

Murray will get more starts because Parker will get more rest, and pop doesn't like changing the rotation. Parker will then follow up each of those by forcing shots to prove himself. Maybe he finds something we can work with in the process, who knows.

[cutewizard]

While I totally agree on your assessment of his skills I have to disagree that he should have more playing time. The sample we're seeing is mostly garbage time minutes where he is playing against fringe d leaguers. Even Anderson looks passable against them. When he's up against starting caliber players he turns the ball over to much. Tony may not be able to get to the rim the way he used to but he still has a decent turnover rate. Currently the spurs turn the ball over an average of 13 times a game. While that's not the best rate in the league it's a great rate for a team that passes as much as the spurs. If Murray had more minutes early that number would significantly increase as well as our losses. He's still really young and I believe d league and garbage time combined with a full off-season of working on his ball control is the right combination. Starting him or even putting him as the first of the bench would be pointing away our playoff seeding and any hopes for home court advantage. Of course given how we've played at home compared to away that might not be a bad thing...


-------------------------------------

:bobo

[gambit1990]

the waiving of nico today seems to suggest FO not paying any attention to the ST experts yet again.
not defending everyone on spurstalk but i never anyone say the spurs needed nico.

[spurs1990]

Murray will get more starts because Parker will get more rest, and pop doesn't like changing the rotation. Parker will then follow up each of those by forcing shots to prove himself. Maybe he finds something we can work with in the process, who knows.

To think years past who would've expected Popovich to give any run to a 19 yr old rookie much less starting at PG.

And as you state during Parkers rest games young Murray will be toting the ball to a pool of seasoned and championship vets in the starting lineup.

It'll make those particular games very appealing to watch.

[AFBlue]

Needs to gain 20 pounds and learn how to finish through contact. Why would you advocate for more minutes when he'd take away minutes from proven guys like Tony and Patty. That's just plain stupid.

[Quadzilla99]

Give him some good teammates and he'd average a triple-double.

Rofl. Okay.

[Captivus]

This guy...Im hyped about Murray...looks nasty! sometimes!!

[CGD]

Needs to go wherever he can get the most reps. Same for Bertans frankly.

[rjv]

not defending everyone on spurstalk but i never anyone say the spurs needed nico.

I was referring more to the subject of this thread and how the release of Nico certainly suggests the Spurs FO has a different perspective on Murray than our ST experts do.

[cd98]

I think he'all get run against bad teams, but absent injury and the occasional Parker rest, he'll be racking up D League starts.

[sexinthatsx]

He still dribbles way too high, he will easily get picked off in the NBA over and over and over again. He is a pretty strong finisher at the rim, but he needs to develop on his decision making and bball IQ.

[DAF86]

This guy being the truth would be such a huge fucking win for us. It's exactly what we need.

[BillMc]

On a serious note, the timing of Murray's development could be huge with Tony fading, Patty and Manu likely leaving, which is why punting on Nico was such a surprise.

Murray may have to grow up quickly.

[SAGirl]

On a serious note, the timing of Murray's development could be huge with Tony fading, Patty and Manu likely leaving, which is why punting on Nico was such a surprise.

Murray may have to grow up quickly.
originally I predicted him as the most impactful rookie due precisely to need... He still has a lot of time to earn that Nostradamus prediction for me... :lol

[BillMc]

originally I predicted him as the most impactful rookie due precisely to need... He still has a lot of time to earn that Nostradamus prediction for me... :lol
:bobo
Like the mythical Cassandra you have the gift of prophecy but hopefully not her curse that no one will believe you.:lol

[SAGirl]

:bobo
Like the mythical Cassandra you have the gift of prophecy but hopefully not her curse that no one will believe you.:lol
Lol I have more sense of humor than it shows... Lol
I try to avoid troll takes though and hate wagons which is what passes for humor in the forum. :tu. Hopefully kid shows up. He was my draft pick too. I was bound to get a good prediction on someone!!! :toast

[spurs1990]

On a serious note, the timing of Murray's development could be huge with Tony fading, Patty and Manu likely leaving, which is why punting on Nico was such a surprise.

Murray may have to grow up quickly.

This talk of Patty Mills leaving is not what I want to hear. I can't think of a (role) player I wanted to finish his career here more than Mills.
Very much hope there's some salary cap gymnastics that can meet his worth in 2017.

[dabom]

Spurs gotta keep their talent. There is only so much a superstar like kawhi can take.

[BillMc]

Spurs gotta keep their talent. There is only so much a superstar like kawhi can take.
RC is as sharp as they come and Spurs are producing 60 win seasons. I think they'll keep the talent. Only problem is Patty wants to be a starter somewhere which is understandable as he's been a career backup. In his Spurs time he's gone from a fringe NBA player to a champion and serious 6th man of the year candidate. He also was a factor in wooing LMA. The problem is he won't want to be a stopgap between Parker and Murray for a year or so at best. We may lose him. Everyone else I trust PATFO to keep,if they want them.

[spurs1990]

If he leaves I hope he gets a near-max deal along with his starting role.

I'll cheer the hell for him unless he's on a rival.

[SAGirl]

RC is as sharp as they come and Spurs are producing 60 win seasons. I think they'll keep the talent. Only problem is Patty wants to be a starter somewhere which is understandable as he's been a career backup. In his Spurs time he's gone from a fringe NBA player to a champion and serious 6th man of the year candidate. He also was a factor in wooing LMA. The problem is he won't want to be a stopgap between Parker and Murray for a year or so at best. We may lose him. Everyone else I trust PATFO to keep,if they want them.
Good take.:tu

[BillMc]

If he leaves I hope he gets a near-max deal along with his starting role.

I'll cheer the hell for him unless he's on a rival.

Agreed. Patty is a class act.


Good take.:tu

Cheers:toast

[sexinthatsx]

Spurs can trade Pau and have enough salary to pay Mills next year. That guy completely stops the motion offense on the half-court sets and just looks lost out there at times, not to mention a stat padder.

[itzsoweezee]

With lapro getting cut, Murray spending a bunch of time in Austin is no longer an option. So the whole develop in the D league idea some of you are talking about is simply not what pop has in mind.

[SAGirl]

POP Mentioned double duty.... He's likely going to get both the occasional dleague game that doesn't conflict with the regular season schedule and all the rest games, etc.

[spurtech09]

Would like to see Murray get more mins.......

[CGD]

Can't wait to see where he'll be in two years. The defensive potential of Murray, Green, and Leonard together is tantalizing.

[Raven]

obviously has a ton of talent, but needs every minute he can get for the next few years

[south side spur]

RC is as sharp as they come and Spurs are producing 60 win seasons. I think they'll keep the talent. Only problem is Patty wants to be a starter somewhere which is understandable as he's been a career backup. He won't want to be a stopgap between Parker and Murray for a year or so at best. We may lose him. Everyone else I trust PATFO to keep,if they want them.

They can play together. Mills is more of a 2 guard anyways.

[sasaint]

They can play together. Mills is more of a 2 guard anyways.

A lineup of Pau, LMA, Kawhi, Patty, Dijon would be very playable.

[GSH]

RC is as sharp as they come and Spurs are producing 60 win seasons. I think they'll keep the talent. Only problem is Patty wants to be a starter somewhere which is understandable as he's been a career backup. In his Spurs time he's gone from a fringe NBA player to a champion and serious 6th man of the year candidate. He also was a factor in wooing LMA. The problem is he won't want to be a stopgap between Parker and Murray for a year or so at best. We may lose him. Everyone else I trust PATFO to keep,if they want them.


Do you think Parker can stay a starter for another year? I'm not a Parker-hater, but I have my doubts.

I wonder, though how he would deal with coming off the bench. Manu did it for his whole career, and made it work for him. But even more, I wonder how Parker would feel about moving to the bench, if Patty was the one to move into the starter role?

[sasaint]

Do you think Parker can stay a starter for another year? I'm not a Parker-hater, but I have my doubts.

I wonder, though how he would deal with coming off the bench. Manu did it for his whole career, and made it work for him. But even more, I wonder how Parker would feel about moving to the bench, if Patty was the one to move into the starter role?

Don't you think Tony's role has already evolved a lot in the last couple of seasons - especially this one? It seems to me that he has already relinquished the role of closer to Patty, and he is playing fewer minutes - much less than other starters. So, maybe he will be a token starter and play a few minutes at the beginning of games and spot minutes thereafter for this year and next. Or maybe his reduced role is preparing him for coming off the bench. If he doesn't like it he doesn't have many choices...

[BillMc]

Do you think Parker can stay a starter for another year? I'm not a Parker-hater, but I have my doubts.

I wonder, though how he would deal with coming off the bench. Manu did it for his whole career, and made it work for him. But even more, I wonder how Parker would feel about moving to the bench, if Patty was the one to move into the starter role?

I think if Manu retires then sending Tony to the bench becomes an easy sell for Pop. He just tells Tony he needs him to be the new leader of the bench. I personally don't think Tony has declined as bad as many others here. I think he's adapted well to his new role. As sasaint said, it almost doesn't matter who starts as Patty is getting his minutes and often closes. However in that one interview It seemed starting was goal of Patty's. And that makes the Spurs less attractive over the long haul. I also wonder if Patty is really meant to be a starter. I think he's found a good niche here. But I understand his motives.

[Harry Callahan]

Murray was a good get, especially given the draft pick SA had to get him. Corey Joseph did not look this good this early AT ALL as a low first pick.

A lot of people thought he would not become a player early on. If DM works as hard as CJ did while he was here, good things will happen.

[TheCerebral1]

All I can say is, while his game needs work. He was still the most exciting pick in the last 5 drafts at least. While Anderson has had some value to the team, outside of Simmons being found out of nowhere we've had little impact since George Hill left.

[Spurs9]

Murray just pulled 31 and 12 in the toros game tonight :wow

[BillMc]

Murray just pulled 31 and 12 in the toros game tonight :wow
:hat