Best SF in the League (espn insider request)

[DAF86]

Can somebody please post this article here?

http://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/18538416/nba-player-rankings-lebron-james-kawhi-leonard-kevin-durant-best-sf-year

[spurraider21]

It's brandon Ingram

[Rummpd]

Can't post all but this is the important part:

This is where Leonard truly stands out, as he has delivered an average game score of 25.9, far and away the best average of the group. Just how good is that? According to Basketball-Reference.com, Michael Jordan is the only player to average a game score that high for an entire season.


Best Average Game Scores Versus Top Small Forwards


Player

Avg. game score


Kawhi Leonard 25.9
Giannis Antetokounmpo 21.8
Kevin Durant 21.3
LeBron James 20.3
Carmelo Anthony 16.6

Leonard hasn't quite entered the discussion for the MVP award with Russell Westbrook and James Harden, but if he keeps playing like this he could make the race even more interesting. He has taken his game to rarefied air, right alongside James and Durant for the title of best small forward in the NBA. Even if LeBron and KD would still be the top choices to win a playoff series right now, Leonard deserves to be considered at their level halfway through this season

[diego]

Hadn't seen this posted might as well go here

http://www.fanragsports.com/nba/spurs/harper-kawhi-leonard-left-block-death-opposing-defenses/

[picnroll]

Might as well add this

http://hoopshype.com/2017/01/24/charles-barkley-warriors-would-never-lose-if-they-had-kawhi-leonard-instead-of-kevin-durant/

[Dex]

Hadn't seen this posted might as well go here

http://www.fanragsports.com/nba/spurs/harper-kawhi-leonard-left-block-death-opposing-defenses/

Great article right there. Kawhi truly has become a master of his craft on the post.

The article speculates that the Spurs should dump it into Leonard in the post more, but I contest that they should save that for the playoffs. Giving opponents a steady diet of that now just gives them more time to game plan against it, and could take the rest of the team out of their rhythm if we just rely on Kawhobe all the time.

[apalisoc_9]

Should be the clear cut MVP...Media trying to sell narratives like a crooked salesman.

[apalisoc_9]

Hadn't seen this posted might as well go here

http://www.fanragsports.com/nba/spurs/harper-kawhi-leonard-left-block-death-opposing-defenses/

Fatigue.

Posting up an incredible amount will get you tired really quick. It's important they use his post up whenever it is needed. I agree that more would be nice, but a significant change down low can really have a toll on your body.

[Horse]

Can't post all but this is the important part:

This is where Leonard truly stands out, as he has delivered an average game score of 25.9, far and away the best average of the group. Just how good is that? According to Basketball-Reference.com, Michael Jordan is the only player to average a game score that high for an entire season.
Why would anyone pick kd over Kahwi in a playoff series all that cuck does is fall down.

Best Average Game Scores Versus Top Small Forwards


Player

Avg. game score


Kawhi Leonard 25.9
Giannis Antetokounmpo 21.8
Kevin Durant 21.3
LeBron James 20.3
Carmelo Anthony 16.6

Leonard hasn't quite entered the discussion for the MVP award with Russell Westbrook and James Harden, but if he keeps playing like this he could make the race even more interesting. He has taken his game to rarefied air, right alongside James and Durant for the title of best small forward in the NBA. Even if LeBron and KD would still be the top choices to win a playoff series right now, Leonard deserves to be considered at their level halfway through this season
Why would anyone pick kd over Leonard in a playoff series all that cuck does in falldown in crunchtime.

[BillMc]

Why would anyone pick kd over Leonard in a playoff series all that cuck does in falldown in crunchtime.

Worst go to move in history, tbh. :lol

[Kawhitstorm]

This is where Leonard truly stands out, as he has delivered an average game score of 25.9, far and away the best average of the group. Just how good is that? According to Basketball-Reference.com, Michael Jordan is the only player to average a game score that high for an entire season.

ESPN Insider stealing my nuggets:rolleyes: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=265372&highlight=kawhi+jordan

[FkLA]

Great article right there. Kawhi truly has become a master of his craft on the post.

The article speculates that the Spurs should dump it into Leonard in the post more, but I contest that they should save that for the playoffs. Giving opponents a steady diet of that now just gives them more time to game plan against it, and could take the rest of the team out of their rhythm if we just rely on Kawhobe all the time.

He's been a monster in the post since 14-15, specifically in the second half of the season after he returned from injury. That's really what allowed him to make the jump and become a legit first option. Earlier in the year this season they were kind of ignoring that aspect of his game and just exclusively giving him the ball at the top of the key. I was literally begging for Kawhi post-ups in game threads. I think it's been more balanced as of late though.

[dabom]

He's been a monster in the post since 14-15, specifically in the second half of the season after he returned from injury. That's really what allowed him to make the jump and become a legit first option. Earlier in the year this season they were kind of ignoring that aspect of his game and just exclusively giving him the ball at the top of the key. I was literally begging for Kawhi post-ups in game threads. I think it's been more balanced as of late though.

I remember when people were talking shit about his post ups early on and I blamed it on the team not giving it to him in his spots or giving him space. Got a lot of heat. :lol

Those cucks are still around. :lol

[lilbthebasedgod]

His post ups are good. He's also gotten better at passing out of them which was the biggest issue I used to have with it in 2013-2014.

So yeah, agree with it.

Still can't say for sure if he's the best. His defense isn't nearly as good anymore or at the level of Giannis, but he is far more versatile offensively.

[YGWHI]

His post ups are good. He's also gotten better at passing out of them which was the biggest issue I used to have with it in 2013-2014.

So yeah, agree with it.

Still can't say for sure if he's the best. His defense isn't nearly as good anymore or at the level of Giannis, but he is far more versatile offensively.

C'mon stop repeating this stupid narrative that's completely false...There are a lot more than DRtg on defense.


And while some of the on/off numbers make his defense look as though it’s taken a step down, his Synergy (https://www.synergysportstech.com/Synergy/Sport/Basketball/web/teamsst/Video/QuantifiedPlayer2.aspx) numbers offer him some reprieve. He yields just .813 points per possession when he’s the initial defender on the play, and 388 of his 391 defenses have come in man-to-man. That means he’s not getting “help”, he’s doing it himself.

Still, only 63 of the 32o shots have come against him at the rim. That means his Synergy numbers aren’t being “faked” because players beat him and then a reliable defensive big man bails him out (and frankly, no one would describe the Spurs’ starting bigs as that!).

And when he does defend around the rim, he yields just .952 points per possession, which is in the 70th percentile.

And that ain’t all. Only 43 of the shots against him are catch-and-shoots that were “unguarded” meaning that he only loses track of his man about one time per game–and that’s usually because he’s helping.

The only play type his numbers aren’t in the top third of all defenders is isolation–and that’s because opponents have given up on trying fo the most part. They’ve only attacked him in iso 22 times this season.

And remember, this is the guy who takes sole responsibility for the best player on the opponent every night. You’re better off arguing that basketballs aren’t round than that Kawhi is not still an elite defender.
http://bballbreakdown.com/2017/01/24/mvp-ladder-kawhi-leonard-cant-spurs-leonard-be-mvp/


Also, Kawhi is 30-6 in his head to heads based on efficiency, per hoopsstats. He has won all his head to head against SFs this season, LeBron, KD, Butler, Wiggins, Morris...And the only five games he didn't, Spurs lost. Or he scored 16 points in the 4th to win the game like in Minny...Or he hit a winning shot at the buzzer like against Wizards.

http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/san-antonio-spurs/players/kawhi-leonard/profile/17/27/401

[lilbthebasedgod]

There is a lot more than DRtg. Like opponent field goal percentage, team defense, and man defense. The only response to that people have is "Teams are drawing kawhi away". This would cause his man defense to actually get better but his help defense to get worse. His man defense has been hurting worse than his help defense in the numbers. The numbers go far more in depth to show why he fell off on defense than DRtg and I agree with you that people look at that too much.

Also I never said he is bad at defense. He's a good defender, he just is not conditioned enough to be both DPOY and a offensive monster like this year, he was more balanced last year. Im saying that he's not as good as Giannis on defense who is really extremely good on defense, but he's still good. Its not an insult.

[YGWHI]

-Giannis won't be DPOY and isn't a better defender than Kawhi.

-Kawhi's one on one defense is ELITE

-Kawhi's off ball defense is ELITE

-Kawhi's not regressed on defense like a stupid narrative of stats without context tries to say.

[poeticism707]

Should be the clear cut MVP...Media trying to sell narratives like a crooked salesman.

This.

[cutewizard]

With that exceptional defensive skills,

IS KAWHI LEONARD CAPTAIN AMERICA!!!!!?????

:claw

[cutewizard]

Small forward NIRRRRRRRRRRVVVVVVVVVVVVAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNN NNA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[TheDoctor]

-Giannis won't be DPOY and isn't a better defender than Kawhi.

-Kawhi's one on one defense is ELITE

-Kawhi's off ball defense is ELITE

-Kawhi's not regressed on defense like a stupid narrative of stats without context tries to say.

This "National" narrative has only one purpose, push Raymond for DPOY tbh. It's the only explanation.

[Chinook]

This "National" narrative has only one purpose, push Raymond for DPOY tbh. It's the only explanation.

Has to be. Can't possibly be because it's true.

[TheDoctor]

Has to be. Can't possibly be because it's true.

I mean, ESPN is no longer disguising its support in games promo. Did you guys saw the "The Worriers are clicking" promo? Totally disgusting.

[lilbthebasedgod]

The "Narrative" is based on analysis of facts. There is no way anyone who is rational and numbers oriented can say that his defense hasn't fell off. The only response has been debunked claims about drawing people out and mindless "But Kawhi is ELITE because he is".

I'm not even pushing anything we have the ability to quantify defense now. If he was elite on on ball defense why doesn't any Stat show that and why are the on ball stats wrong? Drawing him out shoudnt hurt these.

Raymond shouldn't be DPOY

[Kidd K]

Can't post all but this is the important part:

This is where Leonard truly stands out, as he has delivered an average game score of 25.9, far and away the best average of the group. Just how good is that? According to Basketball-Reference.com, Michael Jordan is the only player to average a game score that high for an entire season.


Best Average Game Scores Versus Top Small Forwards


Player

Avg. game score


Kawhi Leonard 25.9
Giannis Antetokounmpo 21.8
Kevin Durant 21.3
LeBron James 20.3
Carmelo Anthony 16.6

Leonard hasn't quite entered the discussion for the MVP award with Russell Westbrook and James Harden, but if he keeps playing like this he could make the race even more interesting. He has taken his game to rarefied air, right alongside James and Durant for the title of best small forward in the NBA. Even if LeBron and KD would still be the top choices to win a playoff series right now, Leonard deserves to be considered at their level halfway through this season

That is pretty impressive. I think VORP is important too though and unfortunately Durant and LeBron are both higher there atm. Kawhi isn't way off though

[RD2191]

His post ups are good. He's also gotten better at passing out of them which was the biggest issue I used to have with it in 2013-2014.

So yeah, agree with it.

Still can't say for sure if he's the best. His defense isn't nearly as good anymore or at the level of Giannis, but he is far more versatile offensively.

:lmao yeah, they just give out those dpoy awards for kicks

[Snaq O'Meal]

With that exceptional defensive skills,

IS KAWHI LEONARD CAPTAIN AMERICA!!!!!?????

:claw

No. Cap used a performance enhancing drug. Kawhi is all natural.

[BillMc]

:lmao yeah, they just give out those dpoy awards for kicks

Since they are giving them out after the season now, who cares. Takes all the fun out it. Awards used to add a bit of theatre as the winner of MVP or DPOY or some of the others had to battle all the snubbed opponents on the way through. Bad call Silver

[GSH]

The Bulls went 55-27 while Jordan was playing baseball. Which proves just how overrated that Jordan guy was. He barely made a difference. :rolleyes


If someone wants to analyze Kawhi's relative strengths and weaknesses, it's one thing. Anyone trying to make the case that Kawhi is "overrated" either terminally stupid, or has some agenda. Since he uses the team's record with Kawhi out, I'm voting for the second. It's back to the other dumbass article that Kawhi's defense is actually hurting the team. I guess it could be an agenda AND terminal stupidity.


(I swear I posted this here earlier. The screen went kind of wonky, and I wound up back at the main forum page. And the post wound up in the game thread? Okay.)

[Cry Havoc]

The Bulls went 55-27 while Jordan was playing baseball. Which proves just how overrated that Jordan guy was. He barely made a difference. :rolleyes


If someone wants to analyze Kawhi's relative strengths and weaknesses, it's one thing. Anyone trying to make the case that Kawhi is "overrated" either terminally stupid, or has some agenda. Since he uses the team's record with Kawhi out, I'm voting for the second. It's back to the other dumbass article that Kawhi's defense is actually hurting the team. I guess it could be an agenda AND terminal stupidity.


(I swear I posted this here earlier. The screen went kind of wonky, and I wound up back at the main forum page. And the post wound up in the game thread? Okay.)

Parker is worthless
Green is super overrated
Kawhi is a system player
Pau can't/won't play defense
LMA is a glorified role player

That sounds like a fucking terrible team. Too bad we're on pace for 66 wins. :hat