The elephant in the room isn't French...

[ElNono]

We're an extremely top heavy team... when your two stars shoot 12-36 combined, we're likely to lose... at least Kawhi got to the line.

The defense in the 2nd half was also extremely lackluster...

[TheGreatYacht]

Parker and Manu won't be here forever..... these max players gotta step up

[UNT Eagles 2016]

Because Duncan is gone. Gone forever. No defense to stop a shitty team like the Pelicans from feasting inside and scoring over 110+ points. Last year we were able to beat them at their place because the defense was able to hold them to like 89 points even though our offense had a poor night.

[YGWHI]

We're an extremely top heavy team... when your two stars shoot 12-36 combined, we're likely to lose... at least Kawhi got to the line.

The defense in the 2nd half was also extremely lackluster...

And involved his teammates all game. Team high asts with 6.

I'd expect something like this from our PGs...Wouldn't you?

[Hoops Czar]

4-0 w/o Kawhi this year. And did you just call Softridge a star? :lol

[Kawhitstorm]

Because Duncan is gone. Gone forever. No defense to stop a shitty team like the Pelicans from feasting inside and scoring over 110+ points. Last year we were able to beat them at their place because the defense was able to hold them to like 89 points even though our offense had a poor night.

Spurs have been getting butt fucked in New Orleans/Toronto since Pop has been at the helms.:wakeup

[YGWHI]

Because Duncan is gone. Gone forever. No defense to stop a shitty team like the Pelicans from feasting inside and scoring over 110+ points. Last year we were able to beat them at their place because the defense was able to hold them to like 89 points even though our offense had a poor night.

We lost to Pels our last game in 2015 regular season...Of course, our defense was better with Tim but it's not like we 'never' had stupid losses with him on the team as well.

[marinoman]

The skeezer groupies come out in New orleans
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=e0rLs5rU6BM

[UNT Eagles 2016]

We lost to Pels our last game in 2015 regular season...Of course, our defense was better with Tim but it's not like we 'never' had stupid losses with him on the team as well.

That loss really pissed me the fuck off. We fell from the 2 seed to the 6 seed and had to face the Toenail Clippers without HCA instead of the shitty Mavs with HCA which would have been a sweep for us.

[dabom]

Kinda hard to get space with a known cancer on offense and defense...

[SAGirl]

It has to be top heavy bc Tony and Manu are overpaid. The Spurs are actually getting more than decent production from rookies and guys in minimum contracts like Lee, etc.

[Capt Bringdown]

It has to be top heavy bc Tony and Manu are overpaid. The Spurs are actually getting more than decent production from rookies and guys in minimum contracts like Lee, etc.
Pop and his thank you contracts strike again.

[Hoops Czar]

It has to be top heavy bc Tony and Manu are overpaid. The Spurs are actually getting more than decent production from rookies and guys in minimum contracts like Lee, etc.

So is Aldridge but I don't see anyone bringing up his name.

[SAGirl]

So is Aldridge but I don't see anyone bringing up his name.
You can say he's underperformed, but he has no excuse other than his lack of effort, the other two, though better players when younger, HoF players, are old and it was predictable that they would not be suitable for their role (and contracts) and never mind the need to be rested, minutes managed, reduced, and how brittle they are due to age (Tony more than Manu surprisingly).

[sasaint]

So is Aldridge but I don't see anyone bringing up his name.

Plenty of us bring up his name. Plenty of us didn't want him to begin with.

[YGWHI]

It has to be top heavy bc Tony and Manu are overpaid. The Spurs are actually getting more than decent production from rookies and guys in minimum contracts like Lee, etc.

Pretty much this.

They're not built this way just 'accidentally'...Pop had plenty of options in the offseason but made other decisions.

[YGWHI]

You can say he's underperformed, but he has no excuse other than his lack of effort, the other two, though better players when younger, HoF players, are old and it was predictable that they would not be suitable for their role (and contracts) and never mind the need to be rested, minutes managed, reduced, and how brittle they are due to age (Tony more than Manu surprisingly).

:tu

[Hoops Czar]

Pop and his thank you contracts strike again.

Yet, the franchise got a cool 5M as a going away present. Spurs certainly do have their priorities in order.

[UNT Eagles 2016]

Pop and his thank you contracts strike again.

Trade 'em both to the Bobcats for a 20-lb bag of assorted Belgian truffle chocolates!

[sasaint]

You can say he's underperformed, but he has no excuse other than his lack of effort, the other two, though better players when younger, HoF players, are old and it was predictable that they would not be suitable for their role (and contracts) and never mind the need to be rested, minutes managed, reduced, and how brittle they are due to age (Tony more than Manu surprisingly).

That's +/- half the payroll going to 3 under-performers.

[Hoops Czar]

You can say he's underperformed, but he has no excuse other than his lack of effort, the other two, though better players when younger, HoF players, are old and it was predictable that they would not be suitable for their role (and contracts) and never mind the need to be rested, minutes managed, reduced, and how brittle they are due to age (Tony more than Manu surprisingly).

Not surprising when you take into consideration that Parker has played 10,000 + more regular season minutes and roughly another 3,000 more playoff minutes than Ginobili. Manu's longevity has been saved by him coming off the bench all these years.

[SAGirl]

That's +/- half the payroll going to 3 under-performers.
sadly...
I am reminded of Lebron complaining that they need bodies and that him and Kyrie are playing 44 minute etc. bc they are the real top heavy team. I bet they wish they had some of the guys on minimum deals or rook deals the Spurs have.

This team is getting production from rookies and guys in small or minimum contracts. That is not the issue. It's actually a reason why the team doesn't have assets to trade, their guys are young and in small salaries.

They are paying guys, just that those guys are way past their prime. When they have a bad game tough luck.

But I do agree with Nono in one point, if Kawhi and Lamarcus are this off on the same night it's tough to win like that. Spurs also didn't execute their defensive plan well I bet.

[SAGirl]

Not surprising when you take into consideration that Parker has played 10,000 + more regular season minutes and roughly another 3,000 more playoff minutes than Ginobili. Manu's longevity has been saved by him coming off the bench all these years.
Indeed...and he plays less minutes at this point and has the smaller burden, but he is older, and he looks it. Still... it's an issue and the Spurs have it this season.

[sasaint]

sadly...
I am reminded of Lebron complaining that they need bodies and that him and Kyrie are playing 44 minute etc. bc they are the real top heavy team. I bet they wish they had some of the guys on minimum deals or rook deals the Spurs have.

This team is getting production from rookies and guys in small or minimum contracts. That is not the issue. It's actually a reason why the team doesn't have assets to trade, their guys are young and in small salaries.

They are paying guys, just that those guys are way past their prime. When they have a bad game tough luck.

But I do agree with Nono in one point, if Kawhi and Lamarcus are this off on the same night it's tough to win like that. Spurs also didn't execute their defensive plan well I bet.

Especially if Pop won't rely on some of the young guys on cheap contracts who have been winning games, but instead goes with Manu, Tony and Patty, even if they are stinking it up. Smh!

[SAGirl]

Especially if Pop won't rely on some of the young guys on cheap contracts who have been winning games, but instead goes with Manu, Tony and Patty, even if they are stinking it up. Smh!
Disappointing. Does it look to you like Pop is going to go down like he did against OKC without making adjustments?

[sasaint]

Disappointing. Does it look to you like Pop is going to go down like he did against OKC without making adjustments?

Yep. Tonight was a real reality check for me. If he didn't play Murray important minutes tonight, Pop isn't going to this season - unless injuries force his hand. I replied to another poster that tonight really burst my bubble about Pop and the direction he was taking.

[313]

Most elite teams are top heavy(sans the warriors of the last two years that were ridiculously balanced). It's about the quality of the top which i think we'll see play out in the playoffs.

[SAGirl]

Most elite teams are top heavy(sans the warriors of the last two years that were ridiculously balanced). It's about the quality of the top which i think we'll see play out in the playoffs.
One would say the depth is for the regular season, so you don't go on a free fall if you have an injured player here or there (Spurs depth has been solid there), and so that you don't need to play your stars 44 mins per game like Lebron was complaining about (and the Spurs need that bc they have old players that need rest games and minutes managed... again Spurs depth has been solid there).

The quality of the top is an issue... that is where the overpaid/aged guys are anyways other than Kawhi.. and Lamarcus with his inconsistent play.

Pau still to be seen when he comes back from his injury... he had the "empty calories" syndrome.

[Old School 44]

Like I mentioned in the game thread Murray getting the Mahinmi treatment. Pop teaching him a lesson. "Win or lose I'm in charge, be ready to play when I call on you. And if you don't get called, sit there and don't complain about it." Pop still not over himself. Also, who benches their hottest player (Bertans) when you still have a chance to win? :bang

[SAGirl]

Like I mentioned in the game thread Murray getting the Mahinmi treatment. Pop teaching him a lesson. "Win or lose I'm in charge, be ready to play when I call on you. And if you don't get called, sit there and don't complain about it." Pop still not over himself. Also, who benches their hottest player (Bertans) when you still have a chance to win? :bang
I
think that is another example of how he sticks to the plan... Bertans was likely slated for just the 20 minutes he got (or less, if you take into account he played garbage time that was less minutes he would have played if the regular rotation had closed out the game)...
I think this is another sign of what sasaint said: Pop sticking to his regular rotation when it counts. The others don't matter.

[Old School 44]

I'm not saying Murray would have won the game. I just think his recent play would have warranted him some meaningful minutes.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

The team came out flat on both ends of the floor. Watching them "fight" over screens was a disgrace.

Murray was pulled because he came in and started chucking without running any offense. People trying to make it into a power play by Pop are clueless. Pop doesn't think like you do so stop inserting yourself into his brain.

[Proxy]

Pop and his thank you contracts strike again.

as if it wasn't worth it

[ElNono]

Has nothing to do with depth, third wheel, etc... if you subtract the 5 shots from Murray/Forbes/Anthony in garbage time (and you should probably subtract a few more since Pop waved the white flag with like 4 mins to go), the stars took 36 shots and the entire rest of the team took 44. That's how we run our offense. If those guys are off, especially if both are off, we're going to struggle.

Actually, outside of Tony and Patty, who took a combined 13 shots, the rest of the team shot pretty well. We scored over 100 points.

The thing is, our stars also carry a heavy burden on defense. They are, arguably, our most important defenders inside and on the perimeter, considering the run they get.

It'll be interesting to see how Pop allocates rest for these two guys as the season unfolds. We're not going to change the way we play, IMO, we're relying on these two guys to take us to the promised land.

[DeRozan m8]

How good is cliff jumping

[ElNono]

Where's the cliff jumping? This isn't a new realization either, something we've been discussing for a while, tbh.

Just pointing out the obvious, before somebody pulls the 'role players didn't do well' card.

As Fuzzy said, if we come out 'flat' on both ends, especially our stars (considering how the team is built and the offensive/defensive roles allocated), we're just not going to do very well.

I'm trying to gauge what other people think about this going forward. Will it be enough/good to put so many eggs in just a few baskets? I mean, I don't think that's changing this season.

[BillMc]

The team came out flat on both ends of the floor. Watching them "fight" over screens was a disgrace.

Murray was pulled because he came in and started chucking without running any offense. People trying to make it into a power play by Pop are clueless. Pop doesn't think like you do so stop inserting yourself into his brain.
This

[SAGirl]

Has nothing to do with depth, third wheel, etc... if you subtract the 5 shots from Murray/Forbes/Anthony in garbage time (and you should probably subtract a few more since Pop waved the white flag with like 4 mins to go), the stars took 36 shots and the entire rest of the team took 44. That's how we run our offense. If those guys are off, especially if both are off, we're going to struggle.

Actually, outside of Tony and Patty, who took a combined 13 shots, the rest of the team shot pretty well. We scored over 100 points.

The thing is, our stars also carry a heavy burden on defense. They are, arguably, our most important defenders inside and on the perimeter, considering the run they get.

It'll be interesting to see how Pop allocates rest for these two guys as the season unfolds. We're not going to change the way we play, IMO, we're relying on these two guys to take us to the promised land.
I understand now what you say Nono. :tu
The rest of the team makes plays for Lamarcus pretty much. He is always passed the ball to if he's open. He's passed the ball to when he's covered so he can go one on one if he wants to or he can make a play for someone else. Sometimes he passes to someone else, that perimeter player tries to get a shot for himself and draws help leaving lamarcus again open for a jumpshot and he gets the ball back. It is how it is. Kawhi has become ball dominant and that is a different step for him. He's passing the ball much better but he still takes a lot of shots. If he's off tough luck. If he's on, he can carry you far like he did against the Cavs.

In that sense you are absolutely right. When the stars were injured we actually saw much more varied and spread out scoring and still won games (and scored without any problem even with Danny's recent shooting slump). I don't want to go there in that discussion bc I don't care about the player ego and the player fan. Heck I guy I like barely scores and mostly enjoys making plays for other ppl... but I really see what you mean.

Heck this is a very interesting and controversial subject in and of itself.

[dbestpro]

Parker and Manu have not over stayed their time, Pop just plays them too many minutes. Both will give you an offensive burst, but both are huge defensive liabilities. We will not win it all this year as Pop is committed to the old guard. Next year, may be our year, with Manu retired, TP on the bench, Murray and Dedmon starting. We may struggle at times, but the defensive boost would be outstanding. Gasol, Manu, and TP as great as they were are slipping into the liability category. It is time to move on. It will take a year to complete that journey.

[TampaDude]

60 points in the paint for NO. That's all that needs to be said, folks.

[Seventyniner]

It has to be top heavy bc Tony and Manu are overpaid. The Spurs are actually getting more than decent production from rookies and guys in minimum contracts like Lee, etc.

Overpaid only matters if it costs cap room, which wasn't the case with Manu. He could be getting the max right now and not have cost the Spurs any cap room.

[Spurs9]

Wish we had Gobert

[DarrinS]

Other than David Lee and Bertans, no one played particularly well in that game. Off nights happen.

[Strategic]

Elephant was Pels cramming 119 points down the Spurs throat. No need to analyze TP and MG. It's not like all doesn't know what we're getting from them.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Other than David Lee and Bertans, no one played particularly well in that game. Off nights happen.

Bertans gets pushed around on defense and the boards. He is as big a reason as any for the big fail on the defensive end for all of his offensive skills. He absolutely needs to work on his core and lower body strength.

[Spurtacular]

Kinda hard to get space with a known cancer on offense and defense...

Would that space be safe?

[DarrinS]

Bertans gets pushed around on defense and the boards. He is as big a reason as any for the big fail on the defensive end for all of his offensive skills. He absolutely needs to work on his core and lower body strength.

Yeah, I don't think Pop puts Bertans in for his defense. :lol

I'm was talking about the offense of Lee and Bertans.

[Play Boban]

We're an extremely top heavy team... when your two stars shoot 12-36 combined, we're likely to lose... at least Kawhi got to the line.

The defense in the 2nd half was also extremely lackluster...
Yes, Porker was born in Belgium.

[tonight...you]

Yes, Porker was born in Belgium.
Lol...
You awesome fucker.

[ElNono]

Yes, Porker was born in Belgium.

crofl

[SAGirl]

Bertans gets pushed around on defense and the boards. He is as big a reason as any for the big fail on the defensive end for all of his offensive skills. He absolutely needs to work on his core and lower body strength.
I agree. Hate to say it but Davis reminds me of Marco, absolutely a talented ballsy shooter but as much as he shoots he gives more back. His defense was terrible and not for lack of trying. He's too light and gets pushed around. He posses no resistance. He needs to add some strength for sure.