Why Kawhi Leonard is the 2017 NBA MVP

[baseline bum]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnAL17fUogE

[Blake]

Nice but Westbrook gets my vote

[313]

Nick: "People always call Kawhi a system player, let me tell you why that isn't true..." *spends the next five minutes explaining how the system gets Kawhi easy shots and saying how Kawhi doesn't isolate much or score very well out of it(not true)*

I like Coach, but this video isn't one of his best.

and Harden is MVP

[Brazil]

MVP is kawhi, only one with elite defense and more efficient scorer
Harden is second, his 29 8 11 is quite impressive tbh.
Lebron is third
Stat padder westchimp is 4th, give me 34% usage Harden stat line over 42% and 9 uncontested reb per game westchimp

[UZER]

The enter scheme of OKC this year is to get WB triple doubles. Is he not benefitting from the system?

Harden is having a career year under new coach d'antoni. Is he not benefitting from the system?

[UNT Eagles 2016]

I'd rather see Harden win it than westbrick. There hasn't been a lower half seeded player to win MVP in over 20 years.

[UNT Eagles 2016]

I'm an idiot

I know

[Arcadian]

You can't be an awful defensive player and be MVP. <looks at Harden>

[YGWHI]

Nick: "People always call Kawhi a system player, let me tell you why that isn't true..." *spends the next five minutes explaining how the system gets Kawhi easy shots and saying how Kawhi doesn't isolate much or score very well out of it(not true)*

851824779149451264

I love how people just talk about Spurs system and Kawhi but what's about Rockets, Harden and shooters?

D'Antoni COY? Or Celtics' guy stole it late in the season?

[TheGreatYacht]

Not even close lmfao.

[daslicer]

Russ will get the MVP but a few years from now people will realize his triple doubles are overrated when they see OKC still losing in the first round. Russ is essentially Kobe from '04-'08 which is a great one on one player who will stat pad relentlessly and will consistently lead teams to low seedings around 6-8 every year. Unlike Kobe I don't see him getting a Gasol bail out type of trade.

[EIC]

Westbrook.

[YGWHI]

Gobert for #DPOY

If Bruce never got it because the "dirty" thing, I expect voters remember Dray hitting guys in their nuts.

[daslicer]

Gobert for #DPOY

If Bruce never got it because the "dirty" thing, I expect voters remember Dray hitting guys in their nuts.

These awards are now just media popularity awards. Dray will get it due to being popular with the media despite being dirty. Bruce never got it because he split votes with Duncan and also because he was unpopular with the media.

[YGWHI]

Dray will get it due to being popular with the media despite being dirty.
:depressed

I guess I wont watch this awards' ceremony...

[Mikeanaro]

I'd rather see Harden win it than westbrick. There hasn't been a lower half seeded player to win MVP in over 20 years.
Who was that bastard?

[UNT Eagles 2016]

These awards are now just media popularity awards. Dray will get it due to being popular with the media despite being dirty. Bruce never got it because he split votes with Duncan and also because he was unpopular with the media.

D. Green is a faggot, i'd rather have Gobert win it

[spursparker9]

Nice but Westbrook will win

[BillMc]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnAL17fUogE

Great video.:toast Wish he'd get it, but I think he and Lebron are battling for third. The media has already decided the story line. Westbrook, then Harden

[$pursDynasty]

Zach Lowe just picked the KingSlayer as his MVP and that fella's voice carries a LOT of weight in the Podcast universe at least.

[BillMc]

Zach Lowe just picked the KingSlayer as his MVP and that fella's voice carries a LOT of weight in the Podcast universe at least.
He gave Pop COY too. And Danny and Kawhi first team all Defense. (Would love to see Danny make it, well-deserved).

[NameLess Scrub]

Gobert for #DPOY

If Bruce never got it because the "dirty" thing, I expect voters remember Dray hitting guys in their nuts.

Nice post.


People think a 6th seed is great because Durant is no longer in OKC. I have my doubts about it.
And yes, WB has willed his team to victory, especially recently.

But.. would he win the MVP if he averaged 9 rpg? Is he winning the MVP just because his team decided to play for his 10+ rpg?

[cd98]

Basketball wise, I think Kawhi is the MVP. But I don't think the NBA or national writers want him to win necessarily. His problem is his personality is bland and the MVP is the player that becomes the face of the league for the next year. Sure Tim was bland, but not Kawhi bland. Doesn't mean he can't win MVP, I just see it as it isn't his "turn" and the league isn't ready to make him the face.

[bic50]

Westbrook. Would like Kawhi to win it but it'll be Westbrook.

[Ice009]

Basketball wise, I think Kawhi is the MVP. But I don't think the NBA or national writers want him to win necessarily. His problem is his personality is bland and the MVP is the player that becomes the face of the league for the next year. Sure Tim was bland, but not Kawhi bland. Doesn't mean he can't win MVP, I just see it as it isn't his "turn" and the league isn't ready to make him the face.

This is an interesting thing that I was thinking about the other day, Tim was my favourite player ever, and I loved his personality. I thought he was a really cool guy. I think I could enjoy hanging out with him without even talking about Basketball. Just like Robert Horry said, when you get to know Tim behind closed doors, you find out that he's a really cool guy, funny too. I felt that way before Robert even said that without knowing Tim personally. With Kawhi, I don't get that same impression. Maybe he is cool, but if so, he seems like 10x the introvert Tim is/was playing for the Spurs.

[Dex]

Good breakdown by Simmons: https://theringer.com/bill-simmons-2017-nba-mvp-james-harden-russell-westbrook-kawhi-leonard-4f617e8d5df5

He makes some compelling arguments. Spoiler alert: he doesn't pick Kawhi. But there are some good tidbits about him in there:


LeBron’s Cavs limped to a 23–23 record in their last 46 games; that dude hasn’t played for a 30-loss team in nine years. Kawhi would be remembered as our least impactful offensive MVP since Wes Unseld. Westbrook, by every conceivable metric, has been the biggest ball hog in NBA history; he’d also become the first MVP with fewer than 50 wins since 1982, when half the league was downing cocaine like it was vitamin B. Harden offers almost-as-big numbers as Westbrook and an undeniable ability to make teammates better … and yet, Houston won only eight more games than OKC.


San Antonio fares the best because of its Belichickian infrastructure; it’s hard to imagine them dipping below 47 wins even if Aldridge, Gasol, Ginobili, Green, Parker and Pop’s beard were all better three years ago. On my podcast once, Seth Meyers described everything Lorne Michaels built as “The Machine” — stars come and go, writers come and go, trends come and go, but the SNL machine keeps cranking out shows and remaining relevant. Trust the machine, Seth said. He might as well have been discussing the Spurs.

And that’s the best anti-Kawhi case other than his offensive impact (not nearly as profound as we usually expect from an MVP) and his workload (74 games, 33.4 MPG and just 2,474 total minutes). Only three MVPs played less than 2,650 minutes and weren’t sidetracked by a lockout or strike: Curry in 2015 (2,613), Steve Nash in 2005 (2,573), and Bill Walton in the 1978 season (when he broke his foot, played just 1,929 minutes and still won). The Machine doesn’t care; the Machine cares only about the playoffs. The Machine isn’t built to spit out MVP candidates.


Question 2: In a giant pickup game with every NBA player available and two knowledgeable fans forced to pick five-man teams, with their lives depending on the game’s outcome, who would be the first player picked based on how everyone played that season? (Translation: Who’s the alpha dog that season?)

Anyone who doesn’t say “LeBron” is lying. You just are. For one game only, his ceiling is three floors higher than anyone else. We’re all taking LeBron. Kawhi’s defensive prowess makes him my second pick, especially if we’re applying the Bob Ryan Doomsday Scenario — if aliens landed and challenged us to a game of hoops, and we had to pick five guys to save the world. (I’d want Kawhi just in case they had a 6-foot-9 alien with five arms that we needed to lock down.)



Question 4: Ten years from now, who will be the first player from that season who pops into my head? (Every season belongs to someone to varying degrees.)

The case for Kawhi: wins, efficiency, two-way play at the highest of levels. He’s the NBA’s third-best defensive player AND the league’s sixth-best offensive player AND everyone’s pick if we needed one defender to stop any great scorer in the last minute of any playoff game.

The case against Kawhi: The 2016–17 season belonged to Westbrook’s triple-double chase and the Durant-Russ feud, then the Warriors, then Harden and Moreyball, then the overflowing batch of explosive guards (Curry, Thomas, Wall, Lillard, Kyrie, etc.), then the unicorns (Giannis, Jokic, Porzingis, Embiid, maybe Towns), then LeBron’s bizarre Cavs season, then Tankapalooza 2017 … and maybe THEN you’d remember Kawhi and the Spurs? He would own the NBA season less than any MVP I can ever remember.


I want my MVP to stand out in some uniquely impactful way. It’s not baseball. It’s not the Advanced Metrics Award. There’s a performance art/water cooler/alpha dog wrinkle that Kawhi just never offered, mainly because the Pop Machine would never want him to have it. He’s my third-place MVP pick.

[daslicer]

Bill Simmons reasons for Kawhi not deserving the MVP in a nutshell are
1. The Spurs win a lot of games due to their system and not so much Kawhi
2. Lebron is better than Kawhi.
3. Kawhi has the least interesting story out of all the NBA storyline this season which was Russ Tripple D's, Russ-Durant Feud, Harden-Moreyball, Embid's rookie year, cavs struggles.

All retarded reasons to deny Kawhi the MVP. I'm thankful Duncan never had to deal with this type of new age media bs during his career or he would have never won a MVP.

[cd98]

Bill Simmons reasons for Kawhi not deserving the MVP in a nutshell are
1. The Spurs win a lot of games due to their system and not so much Kawhi
2. Lebron is better than Kawhi.
3. Kawhi has the least interesting story out of all the NBA storyline this season which was Russ Tripple D's, Russ-Durant Feud, Harden-Moreyball, Embid's rookie year, cavs struggles.

All retarded reasons to deny Kawhi the MVP. I'm thankful Duncan never had to deal with this type of new age media bs during his career or he would have never won a MVP.

He did, though. He only won two MVP trophies...same as Nash. Not what you'd expect for a top 5 all timer.

[daslicer]

He did, though. He only won two MVP trophies...same as Nash. Not what you'd expect for a top 5 all timer.

Duncan got robbed in '99. He didn't win MVP in '05 due to the ankle injury that kept him out for 19 games. Duncan had a great season stat wise in '05 but it wasn't on the same level as his MVP seasons. Nash winning in '05 was not robbery. In '06 Duncan had plantar fasciitis for the whole entire year in which it limited his dominance that year. Again Nash winning in '06 wasn't robbery. If the new age media existed back then Kidd would have won in '02 and KG would have won in '03 based on the bs metrics they are giving to Harden and Westbrook. If he did have to deal with the new age media he would have never won an MVP which was my point.

[GSH]

"I disagree with the voting".

Welcome to the human race.

[YGWHI]

Spoiler alert: he doesn't pick Kawhi.

Well, we could expect he wouldnt pick Kawhi after all Simmons' tak about media "sexy" narratives...

But I couldnt have imagined he would pick Austin Rivers in All-Defensive Team and not a guard like Danny...

Picking Hayward and not Jimmy Butler for 3rd All NBA teams, when Hayward has a lot more help in Utah than JB and still putting worse numbers than him.

852921434938589186

Weird. Or just bad choices.

[Arcadian]

Without Kawhi, this team would struggle with the Grizzlies :lol

[cutewizard]

Kawhi Leonard ----------------------------- Jon Snow!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nA_aOCU47Ss



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZoMCFMvvl0

[SPURt]

Kawhi Leonard ----------------------------- Jon Snow!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nA_aOCU47Ss



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZoMCFMvvl0
Not according to Bleacher Report lol


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSnELUCxV0w

[Spurtacular]

Nice but Westbrook gets my vote


Harden is MVP

You guys desperate to show you're not homers? Kawhi is easily the MVP.

[Joseph Kony]

some hilarious takes from realgm members on leonard:


I the problem with Kawhi is that he isn't a great shot creator: he's elite at pretty much everything else, but he's not KD/Harden/Westbrook who can carry a team by themselves.


Leonard is great and he is the clear better defender but those guys (Russ/Harden) IMPACT on offense will always give them the slight edge. Spurs go to Kawhi when they need a basket but OKC/Hou offense THROUGH Russ/Harden


Absolutely I bought a kawhi jersey after that. Was amazing to watch hated that Miami team. But currently doesn't really matter because all 3 now are the lead dogs. Leonard was like Igondala level mvp. Great defense and efficient scoring. 2nd round series will determine alot


imply, both Harden and Westbrook are superior to Leonard on a team where there pretty much everyone is a scrub and one person has to carry that team. I don't see Leonard fairing well in these types of situations :lmao


Kawhi is a great player but hes a system player.

He doesent have elite offensive ability. He has to be on a team and system which is built for him to have success with.

The only reason people even consider him top 5 is because his defense.

And before anyone says "but look at the spurs record!"

The spurs would win 50+ games a year with ANYONE on their roster.


Andre iguodala
16/5/4 52% shooting 40% from 3

Kawhi Leonard

18/6/2 61% 57% from 3

Kawhi was closer to Andre than he was to lebron, wade, Dirk, shaq type finals mvp's

So if kawhi never wins a ring again and harden or Westbrook go to contender in 30s and be the 3rd option in the regular season and playoffs. Then beast in finals. Does that make him them automatically better kawhi?

Playing amazing in finals is hard but being the lead dog to get there is even harder


As good as Kawhi is, the Rockets will beat him in the second round rather easily.


For those that have Kawhi above KD? Why?

KD is better in offense, shot blocking, team wins, and this year hes been better then him in defense also.

KD is an elite defender this year. As well as scoring just as much as Kawhi on a team where hes the #3 option.


He either needs to improve his teammates and enhance their capabilities which I don't see him ever doing, or further improve his offensive output in the next few seasons.

:lol retards still not realizing Kawhi is dragging a team full of corpses/inconsistent players/limited players to 60+ wins in the west

[dabom]

some hilarious takes from realgm members on leonard:



















:lol retards still not realizing Kawhi is dragging a team full of corpses/inconsistent players/limited players to 60+ wins in the west

Kawhi probably lost us one game the whole fucking year. :lmao

[99 Problems]

Tbh, being a RealGM reader as well it's super obvious that many many posters have not watched Kiwi at all. The hard nosed fan over there know exactly where Whi is at, but there's still homers who have Butler ranked higher etc...

[Benoit]

hahahaha dont ever mention this guys name in the MVP race ever again

Hes a product of Pops system

You cant be an MVP if a team can win in the semi finals without you on the road

[jimbo]

^ agreed

just another area where he's similar to kobe tbh

[bic50]

hahahaha dont ever mention this guys name in the MVP race ever again

Hes a product of Pops system

You cant be an MVP if a team can win in the semi finals without you on the road
Stfu

[bic50]

^ agreed

just another area where he's similar to kobe tbh
Agreeing with an idiot troll.

[HarlemHeat37]

Dad Killer's team won 55 or 56 and was minutes away from the ECFs, tbh..

[UZER]

In typical fashion for the Spurs, Kawhi is catching the backlash because Harden is the biggest quitting "superstar" pussy in the league. :lol