Building around Kawhi-Manu, tbh...

[ElNono]

Hopefully Kawhi's ankle isn't anything serious, tbh, and Manu probably has 2-3 more seasons in him, but we can't waste his dawn like we did with Tim.

LMA just can't come into camp fat again. Just cannot happen. I don't know if the Spurs want to hire D'Angelo Russell to follow him around over the summer and snitch on his habits or just go ahead and move him.

Patty should get his bucks, since he's a good buddy of Manu, and Tony is a huge question mark right now.

Simms should stick around, same for Bertans.

The question is what to do with Dedmon, Pau, and to a lesser extent Fathead and Forbes?

[DarrinS]

Bait set. Now wait. :lol

[SpurOutofTownFan]

Bait set. Now wait. :lol

No bait - this post has merit. I do believe Manu will come back for at least 1 and maybe 2 - he has a lot of teach and can still play decent 15-20 mins if required and it has kept himself healthy when it mattered which it wasn't always that way.

Not sure about LMA but with the contract he has and the way he's playing the Spurs will most likely stick with him.

Tony is a big unknown as it will depend on the evolution of his injury but I see him staying with the Spurs for a few more years. If Mills doesn't get his due he will leave the Spurs. Is there a chance to bring Chris Paul to the Spurs? yes, there is now specially since it seems Parker could be out for many many months even thru the first part of next season. I can see Paul wanting to win before granpatime takes him over.

I think Gason is washed right now - he just looks distracted out there and the Spurs might want to do something there.

Danny Green will always be Danny Green - I saw a post about a litmus test - there isn't such a thing for him. One day he's a hero and the next he's complete garbage.

So all in all, next year knowing LMA is playing like shit the Spurs can only hope to build around Kwahi and Manu... it sounds crazy but that's what they have now with the addition of Parker out.

[SAGirl]

Manu? Please.
:troll
The guys need to be evaluated regardless with not an eye set on Manu. Spectacular game 5 notwithstanding, he still needs to retire.

[Pocho La Pantera]

:lol:bobo

[spurs10]

:fishing I think he deserves a three year deal after that block!! I'm sure everyone agrees!:lol

[skulls138]

Manu? Please.
:troll
The guys need to be evaluated regardless with not an eye set on Manu. Spectacular game 5 notwithstanding, he still needs to retire.At least you're not changing your views like the wind.

[Blackjack]

Manu will be a great Pop replacement.

Definitely intrigued to see what he and the Klaw do moving forward.

[MultiTroll]

Hopefully
Kwa
Manu for minimum or just above. (Tim Duncan did it, STFU Manu).
Patty try for a San Antonio discount. See above.
Dedman hell yes. A real coach will properly utilize his talents AND passion.
Pau this playoffs is doing what he should. Like the rebounding.

LMA trade.
Pop trade.
Porker no, just no. Retire already or package him with the other two.
Fathead trade for whatever you can get.
Forbes :lol Euro or China.

[SAGirl]

At least you're not changing your views like the wind.
I still think he needs to retire.. but I am happy for him and team that he would retire with a bang and not with a whimp the way he started the Grizz series.

If this wasn't a strict troll thread I would tell you I think he has some game, but he clearly is not the same and can't be relied on. The risk with him is high bc players at 40 and above drop off the map fast and furiously.. and you never know when he's going to hit that curve and he's looking like he's about to turn the curve any time now.

The other thing is that beyond him it's on Pop. Until he retires Pop is unlikely to move on and get some real help. He serves as a security blanket for Pop in many ways.

....
As for the purpose of the thread, they still need to evaluate everyone (Manu included but I bet Pop still wants him back, it's up to Manu what he wants to do, same as every year lately)... he unlikely can't be paid as much bc Spurs have to pay others (Mills, Simmons and/or get some other help)
....

If the thread was genuine... I would say Kawhi doesn't have a true costar in Lamarcus who is playing like a roleplayer and Pau seems overpaid bc of his minutes reductions, role reduction and becoming a situational player. I would not offer him more years at less money tbh.. If he stays he stays one more season, if not he needs to go.

For the rest, it depends on others. Those guys are still young, in cheap contracts and they could either stay or go depending on what moves Spurs want to do in FA. So I love to speculate about it but it's really unknown.

[Hoops Czar]

LMA could come into camp looking anorexic but it won't make him a better basketball player.

Gashole will be opting in so there's nothing the Spurs can do.

Spurs won't be able to afford handing out two undeserving $14M/y contracts to both Manu and Patty for past accomplishments. Pick one.

Danny Green has a player option after next season and he might want one last big contract before he retires. I wouldn't be surprised if he opts out for more money. I suspect "he'll be back".

Simmons will probably be expecting max money after his game 5 performance. Spurs might lose him if they don't pony up.

[lefty20]

Don't know if Manu has a 3rd yr in him. But he's definitely earned a 48.5 esque deal.

[GSH]

The question is what to do with Dedmon, Pau, and to a lesser extent Fathead and Forbes?


The team needs those guys to take up minutes in the first 90 games of the season. Then Manu can do his thang.

[SpurOutofTownFan]

let me just add that while I think Manu has 1 or 2 years left in no way he should get big money contract like the numbers being tossed in this thread. let's be realistic - so there will be money for Mills, etc

[Spurtacular]

and Manu probably has 2-3 more seasons in him, but we can't waste his dawn like we did with Tim.

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q112/jzorns/Trash%20Talking/Husky_not_sure_if_serious.jpg

[Proxy]

I say resign Manu for vet min as starting PG with Murray leading the second unit and tosb porker retiring, we'll have enough money to sign CP3, and Melo and Rose for the vet minimum

[skulls138]

I still think he needs to retire.. but I am happy for him and team that he would retire with a bang and not with a whimp the way he started the Grizz series.

If this wasn't a strict troll thread I would tell you I think he has some game, but he clearly is not the same and can't be relied on. The risk with him is high bc players at 40 and above drop off the map fast and furiously.. and you never know when he's going to hit that curve and he's looking like he's about to turn the curve any time now.

The other thing is that beyond him it's on Pop. Until he retires Pop is unlikely to move on and get some real help. He serves as a security blanket for Pop in many ways.

....
As for the purpose of the thread, they still need to evaluate everyone (Manu included but I bet Pop still wants him back, it's up to Manu what he wants to do, same as every year lately)... he unlikely can't be paid as much bc Spurs have to pay others (Mills, Simmons and/or get some other help)
....

If the thread was genuine... I would say Kawhi doesn't have a true costar in Lamarcus who is playing like a roleplayer and Pau seems overpaid bc of his minutes reductions, role reduction and becoming a situational player. I would not offer him more years at less money tbh.. If he stays he stays one more season, if not he needs to go.

For the rest, it depends on others. Those guys are still young, in cheap contracts and they could either stay or go depending on what moves Spurs want to do in FA. So I love to speculate about it but it's really unknown.Yes, rebuilding around Manu is ridiculous but to stick up for him, yes hes been stinking but his two big games so far in the PO came when we've needed it the most. As for his retirement, I hope we can find someone who can replace him. I'm not seeing it but then again
I'm spoiled. I'd love for someone like Bertans to reach the potential we've seen in him on the good days. I believe in KA but his passitivity worries me and maybe his talent even. Simmons has been great but not quite on board with him talent wise, hey prove me wrong. Manus a hard one to replace

I agree about Lamarcus who can't seem to have two good games in a row.

[DMC]

Manu is going to be a coach. He's too competitive to walk away but too smart to stay as a player. He'll be a great coach.

[LongtimeSpursFan]

TBH is overused on this forum, tbh

[daslicer]

Manu is one injury away from being finished at his current age. Highly doubt he will be playing at the age of 41. It's possible he could play next year but not beyond that.

[Chris]

:lol

[spurs10]

TBH is overused on this forum, tbh
TBH you're on to something....tbh.

[SAGirl]

Yes, rebuilding around Manu is ridiculous but to stick up for him, yes hes been stinking but his two big games so far in the PO came when we've needed it the most. As for his retirement, I hope we can find someone who can replace him. I'm not seeing it but then again
I'm spoiled. I'd love for someone like Bertans to reach the potential we've seen in him on the good days. I believe in KA but his passitivity worries me and maybe his talent even. Simmons has been great but not quite on board with him talent wise, hey prove me wrong. Manus a hard one to replace

I agree about Lamarcus who can't seem to have two good games in a row.
There will be no replacing Manu. He's a generational player and I think as much as I complain sometimes about Pau or Lamarcus they can never be Timmy. He's a top player of all time at his position for a reason. Just no one will measure up with Tim. It's kind of unfair to compare anyone to him. And Manu is up there too. Simmons' desire to get to the basket makes him the most comparable but they're very far apart in many other areas.

Anyways obviously a joke by Nono. There's only the big one in the Spurs right now with some guys contributing more than others relative to role. We can only know what the younger guys can accomplish if they are given sufficient run. Next season should be interesting for all of them.
:flag:

[sasaint]

There will be no replacing Manu. He's a generational player and I think as much as I complain sometimes about Pau or Lamarcus they can never be Timmy. He's a top player of all time at his position for a reason. Just no one will measure up with Tim. It's kind of unfair to compare anyone to him. And Manu is up there too. Simmons' desire to get to the basket makes him the most comparable but they're very far apart in many other areas.

Anyways obviously a joke by Nono. There's only the big one in the Spurs right now with some guys contributing more than others relative to role. We can only know what the younger guys can accomplish if they are given sufficient run. Next season should be interesting for all of them.
:flag:

AND for several new guys that we don't even know yet. We will need a couple of new faces to become contributors.

[Splits]

1 good game out of every 10. Deserves max contract.

[Gagnrath]

I know the tread is a joke but.... Honestly offer Manu either 1.4 million and a roster spot or retirement. I don't think he is done, but he is also not an impact player anymore save in terms of leadership on a day to day basis.

[venitian navigator]

I'm not a LMA fan, but I have to say that in the last games he's trying to do his best and growing up his winning mentality...I really like that.
Actually, he's the best (playing, see Deadmon) play off big we have on the court...considering that Gasol plays defense only sporadically.
One thing is for sure: as currently builded, the team has them both like starters...but Pop has realized that play them together is difficult not only with the small ball teams (that can exploit their weaknesses with pick and roll strategy) but also with the remaining "two bigs" team (se what happened with Memphis).
As I wrote at the begining of the season, the real strenght of this team was to have a very big amount of playable players...in fact quite everybody has had a role during the regular season, and our record is the evidence that everybody has given his brick for building the wall of our very good regular season.
Well, as for now, the same is happening in the play offs.
So, speaking of what to do next season our main questions are about what to do with LMA, Mills, Simmons, Manu, Deadmon and the "youth movement"...
See before my opinion on LMA.
Simmons is playing well this series. But was one of the worst players in regular season and has not shined against Memphis.
Mills is playing well but it's obvious that he does not have the ball handling and passing ability to play a play maker role or a point guard role...and needs a passing guard next to him. However, he's definitely a reliable weapon at a title level in a role like shooting guard for instant offense.
Manu has been a God this last game, but he can't be considered our star of the future...if not from the bench (like assistent coach) tahnks to his charisma and knowledge of the team.
The youth movement (Murray, Bertans, K. Anderson, Forbes, possibly Deadmon) has quality but needs time and playing chances to develop adequately.

So, in conclusion:

1) I would not trade LMA if not for a piece (or a draft choice) that could be considered from day one an important part of our future (i mean a Paul George tipe or a 1-5 draft choice);
2)I would try to stay with most of the same group.
Parker, Green, Leonard, LMA, KA, Bertans, Murray are under contract; In the Parker case, it's to be evelued if he can can back next season...and in case of negative answer, if we can have an exception for signing a veteran play maker (my favourite name would be Livingston); Pau has a player option and is probably going to opt in. Lee and Deadmon have player options...considering their limited (Lee) or very limited (Deadmon) play off role, is clear they don't rapresent, yill this very moment, a play off strenght if not for the chance of using them as role players when the right moment came...so I will try to convince them to exercise their option at the current price if they liked to stay in a winning environment (with the chance for Deadon to have a big payday in case he develops on offense next year).
As for the other 5 players, I'll try to offer a decent contract to two of them (Mills and Simmons) considering they've been tested with positive results in play off circumstances...but not a break the bank contract (I mean a 7/10 million contract to Mills; a 3/5 million contract to Simmons. Just to clarify, i think the limit for Mills could be a 6th man of the year award more than a starting play making role in any nba team).
For Manu, I'll try to convince him to take a one/two year minimum contract in perspective to be assistent coach next year or the year after.
For Forbes, I would exercise the team option.
For Anthony, his place is gonna be taken from our draft choice.

Obviously, this strategy means that that the best way to win next season, imho, is staying pat and develop our young players...I see star potential in Murray, and good potential (from starters to at least 7/8 man) in both three of KA, Bertans, Simmons (I was extremely skeptical on Simmons, before his play offs performances against Houston).
I see a big potential in Deadmon too, if he accepts another learning year.
For Forbes, I really think he just needs playing time and confidence; his main (maybe only, not he has shown flashes of a player better than Mills as a play maker) skill is nowadays the more appreciated as a nba playing style. And his mechanic is very, very good.

So this is my thoughts...but they can change by the moment for any reason (injuries, player's decisions, anavoidable market opportunities...and, obviously, listen or read a better wiew than the one I have written above).

[cd021]

Simmons will probably be expecting max money after his game 5 performance. Spurs might lose him if they don't pony up.

Ugh. I was hoping for $3 years, $25 million but he's probably going to get north of $10 million after this series. I highly doubt he'd get max, whatever that is for his situation. 3 years, $30 million would probably be fine anything more would be an overpay in my opinion.

[Spurs4#5]

It doesn't matter what we offer Manu In the off-season it wont hurt us in signing free agents. Just like his 14mil this year didn't hurt us as far as signing people. The money we give him at this point is all loyalty money

[SpurOutofTownFan]

To me if Manu wants to continue is a no-brainer for the Spurs he will probably sign for vet min or something like that to make room for other players. I have to say though that the Spurs need another big FA player to somewhat complete this roster, whether it's Chris Paul (now with Parker's injury) or someone else. There's always been some kind of a rule that you need at least 3 top players to really compete in the playoffs and the Spurs had 3 (Parker, Manu, and KL) until Parker went down and despite their age.

The Spurs have no one to replace Manu regardless of his overall contribution - we can discuss this point to death but he shows up when he's most needed so there's value in there. It shouldn't matter if he plays like shit during regular season because that's covered with other players.

The big ??? continues to be LMA's production and lack of confidence to own the paint for a guy his skills, talent, and size - I don't think people realistically ever dreamed that he would replace Tim because that's absolutely impossible but I'm certain no one was expecting he would be this soft. If LMA can somehow find his other nut then the Spurs could be something else.

[tbdog]

It doesn't matter what we offer Manu In the off-season it wont hurt us in signing free agents. Just like his 14mil this year didn't hurt us as far as signing people. The money we give him at this point is all loyalty money

That will actually hurt us this off season, because his cap hold will be high. And if we renounce him, we then have to use cap space? Can someone clarify this?

[kaji157]

Jokes apart i would.

.keep LA unless a no brainer trade is offered
.shop Gasol expiring if he opts in
.trade Parker contract if he won't be able to play next year (then resign him back the next season)
.shop Anderson, he had not been worth it and his style is difficult to adapt.
.i would target a serviceable pg with the trades or another big.
.use free space to bring mills and Simmons back

[SAGirl]

I'm not a LMA fan, but I have to say that in the last games he's trying to do his best and growing up his winning mentality...I really like that.
Actually, he's the best (playing, see Deadmon) play off big we have on the court...considering that Gasol plays defense only sporadically.
One thing is for sure: as currently builded, the team has them both like starters...but Pop has realized that play them together is difficult not only with the small ball teams (that can exploit their weaknesses with pick and roll strategy) but also with the remaining "two bigs" team (se what happened with Memphis).
As I wrote at the begining of the season, the real strenght of this team was to have a very big amount of playable players...in fact quite everybody has had a role during the regular season, and our record is the evidence that everybody has given his brick for building the wall of our very good regular season.
Well, as for now, the same is happening in the play offs.
So, speaking of what to do next season our main questions are about what to do with LMA, Mills, Simmons, Manu, Deadmon and the "youth movement"...
See before my opinion on LMA.
Simmons is playing well this series. But was one of the worst players in regular season and has not shined against Memphis.
Mills is playing well but it's obvious that he does not have the ball handling and passing ability to play a play maker role or a point guard role...and needs a passing guard next to him. However, he's definitely a reliable weapon at a title level in a role like shooting guard for instant offense.
Manu has been a God this last game, but he can't be considered our star of the future...if not from the bench (like assistent coach) tahnks to his charisma and knowledge of the team.
The youth movement (Murray, Bertans, K. Anderson, Forbes, possibly Deadmon) has quality but needs time and playing chances to develop adequately.

So, in conclusion:

1) I would not trade LMA if not for a piece (or a draft choice) that could be considered from day one an important part of our future (i mean a Paul George tipe or a 1-5 draft choice);
2)I would try to stay with most of the same group.
Parker, Green, Leonard, LMA, KA, Bertans, Murray are under contract; In the Parker case, it's to be evelued if he can can back next season...and in case of negative answer, if we can have an exception for signing a veteran play maker (my favourite name would be Livingston); Pau has a player option and is probably going to opt in. Lee and Deadmon have player options...considering their limited (Lee) or very limited (Deadmon) play off role, is clear they don't rapresent, yill this very moment, a play off strenght if not for the chance of using them as role players when the right moment came...so I will try to convince them to exercise their option at the current price if they liked to stay in a winning environment (with the chance for Deadon to have a big payday in case he develops on offense next year).
As for the other 5 players, I'll try to offer a decent contract to two of them (Mills and Simmons) considering they've been tested with positive results in play off circumstances...but not a break the bank contract (I mean a 7/10 million contract to Mills; a 3/5 million contract to Simmons. Just to clarify, i think the limit for Mills could be a 6th man of the year award more than a starting play making role in any nba team).
For Manu, I'll try to convince him to take a one/two year minimum contract in perspective to be assistent coach next year or the year after.
For Forbes, I would exercise the team option.
For Anthony, his place is gonna be taken from our draft choice.

Obviously, this strategy means that that the best way to win next season, imho, is staying pat and develop our young players...I see star potential in Murray, and good potential (from starters to at least 7/8 man) in both three of KA, Bertans, Simmons (I was extremely skeptical on Simmons, before his play offs performances against Houston).
I see a big potential in Deadmon too, if he accepts another learning year.
For Forbes, I really think he just needs playing time and confidence; his main (maybe only, not he has shown flashes of a player better than Mills as a play maker) skill is nowadays the more appreciated as a nba playing style. And his mechanic is very, very good.

So this is my thoughts...but they can change by the moment for any reason (injuries, player's decisions, anavoidable market opportunities...and, obviously, listen or read a better wiew than the one I have written above).
This is a good well thought out post.
I like your suggestions and some of the ideas. I also agreed with you that you only trade Lamarcus for someone that can be a key part of the team right away or a top draft pick. I will assume Spurs think the same and thus he's still in the team (no other team has offered the only trade pieces that Spurs would trade him for).
It's a lengthy post and I won't add to it, but just wanted to let you know I appreciate well thought out posts like this.
Cheers

[venitian navigator]

This is a good well thought out post.
I like your suggestions and some of the ideas. I also agreed with you that you only trade Lamarcus for someone that can be a key part of the team right away or a top draft pick. I will assume Spurs think the same and thus he's still in the team (no other team has offered the only trade pieces that Spurs would trade him for).
It's a lengthy post and I won't add to it, but just wanted to let you know I appreciate well thought out posts like this.
Cheers

Thanks!!!

[Spurs4#5]

If he signs for 30 mil or 1 mil it won't matter. It will be the same situation as this off season. His contract will be the last one signed because we hold his rights and we can go over the cap because of that. It's just like LeBron James being the last one to sign. The formula is get all the FA signed then resign your guys

[Spurs4#5]

You're right it will count against our cap hold.

[spurs1990]

Game 5 turned me 180 on Manu Ginibili.

I now contend that as long as he wants to play, the Spurs should have an open spot for him on the roster.

OTOH his playing time will be strictly related to his contributions.
Don't force feed him crucial minutes based on history. If he's feeling it keep him in, but with a strong eye towards any potential setback in play.

I honestly think his value on remaining on the roster has lots of benefits. He's too good of a 'locker room' figure to abandon just to open a roster spot for the 14/15th guys anyway.

I don't know much about salary implications but he should get a fair contract without it affecting the Spurs' mobility in signing key pieces.

[hater]

Only thing we could build around Manu is a casket. So we can send that mummy back to San Salvador, El Salvador

[Seventyniner]

Only thing we could build around Manu is a casket.

:lol
You've said some messed up shit before but this might be the best one.

[SpurOutofTownFan]

Only thing we could build around Manu is a casket. So we can send that mummy back to San Salvador, El Salvador

jesus christ you are the manu-hater but i have to give it to you this was fucking hilarious: "san salvador, el salvador" lol