"Someone need to come to me and explain to me what Jordan is better at than LeBron.."

[313]

:lol NBA section is dead so I thought we might as well spark up the LeBron vs MJ debates again

862404404338544640

[8FOR!3]

Better shooter, better in the clutch, idk what a dumb conversation.

[lefty]

Shannon Sharpe :

"Jordan before Pippen was Russell Westbrook... Just a guy that put up a lot of stats... "


:wow DAMN

[IronMexican]

LeBron is a better shooter. Isn't LeBron also the most clutch shooter in nba history, per last something seconds or something?

[jimbo]

Shannon Sharpe :

"Jordan before Pippen was Russell Westbrook... Just a guy that put up a lot of stats... "


:wow DAMN

It's true though. Westbrook's statpadding this season was the worst we've seen since Jordan had his assistant coaches update him on his stats and then stay in to statpad if he wanted

[benefactor]

LeBron is the best player to ever pick up a basketball.

[lefty]

LeBron is a better shooter. Isn't LeBron also the most clutch shooter in nba history, per last something seconds or something?
Yup.

People have to stop with the " Jordan tougher, mega clutch, will to win" BS narrative

[DAF86]

Mid range shooting?

[HarlemHeat37]

Mid range shooting?

Pretty much this, tbh..everything else is narrative..:(killer instinct:( :(will to win:(

He's also better at making decisions that lead to the death of a loved one..oh, and of course, killing Black youth..

[lilbthebasedgod]

I think Lebron might be better than Jordan, but neither are the best off all time.

[apalisoc_9]

Pippen led the Bulls to 55 wins. The best defender of his era

Meanwhile Lebron is going up against the Best Perimter defender ever, one of the top 3 scoring talent ever, the greatest shooter ever, the most unique defender ever....

Jordan played with the best defender, the best reboubder, the best european, and the best coach

:lmao

[Clipper Nation]

DK was better at getting paraded to the free-throw line by the refs on bogus calls. That's about it, tbh.

[Bynumite]

MJ's game has no weak points, his jumper is light years ahead of LeCoon's.

LeCoon's % goes down significantly when he's like 3 feet and further away from the basket. Spurfans especially should remember how their defense sagged off Lebron in the 2013 Finals, daring him to shoot jumpers and he still bricked a lot of them. Try that shit with MJ and it's game over.


Pretty much this, tbh..everything else is narrative..:(killer instinct:( :(will to win:(

He's also better at making decisions that lead to the death of a loved one..oh, and of course, killing Black youth..

So no black kids ever killed or harmed each other over Lebron's shoes? I seriously doubt that.

[leemajors]

Who is Nick Wright?

[313]

Early career, 04-10 for Bron, 85-90 for Jordan, I'd say Jordan was more dominant. Both had classic playoff moments during these years, MJ 62 in boston, LeBron 25 straight vs the pistons.

Mid career, in their peaks, when they had teams around them and they won rings, their impact was about equal. MJ the better scorer, and ball hawk. LeBron the better passer(but turned the ball over more). On-ball defense, rebounding, and shot blocking a wash. Similar PERs, WS, and BPM during these years. Biggest difference obvs being LeBron lost three finals, and in embarrassing fashion in two out of the three(heavy favorites '11, very slight under dogs '14).

As we progress into LeBron's post prime career he can def make up ground. If he plays four, five more years(could probably play longer) he'll likely break a lot of playoff records. If he wins two more rings, I think the recency bias will cement him as the goat.

Main knock, I think is that LeBron couldn't shoot well deep into his career, and teams were able to sag off him. Cost in him 2007 and 2011. No way MJ loses either of those series.

[TDMVPDPOY]

lebron is the most overrated kent to ever play man

look at the games when he doesn't hit his shots, he plays disinterested continue to defer...

but when he hits his shots, he continues taking them making them look effortlessly, but we all know they are fluke shots from him...his not known to be a shooter anyway...

remember those games when his team is playing from behind and they needed points, yet he continues to defer...so if they lose the game, its on the players cause he got them open looks but couldn't hit anything

[Caltex2]

Jordan never lost in the Finals and he was as close to automatic in the clutch as it got, especially in the early 90's.

[lefty]

So LeBron is penalized for going further in the playoffs than MJ?
If Jordan was 1/1 in the Finals and LeBron 2/3, Jordan would still be bettee because he is unbeaten in the Finals?
What the fuck?

And let's not ignore all MJ's playoff losses

[ambchang]

Both are great at punching Steve Kerr, but Kerr is still suffering from Jordan's punch with the spinal injury. I'd say Jordan wins that one.

[AaronY]

Jordan had him on quickness and agility plus shooting. Lebron has straight line speed, length obviously, and strength.

[AaronY]

LeBron is a better shooter. Isn't LeBron also the most clutch shooter in nba history, per last something seconds or something?
Lebron never even shot higher than 77% from the line once in his career while Jordan never shot lower than 80 iirc and hit in the mid to high eighties over and over again

[lefty]

Lol MJ wasn't a great 3 pt shooter

His best 3 pt shooting happened during the shortened 3 pt line era

Another myth shattered

[ambchang]

Comparing 3 pt shooting across eras isn't that accurate, players adapt and in the 80s/early 90s, 3s simply weren't that important back in the day. If they were, Jordan would have adjusted. He went from a so-so mid range shooter to deadly.

[313]

So LeBron is penalized for going further in the playoffs than MJ?
If Jordan was 1/1 in the Finals and LeBron 2/3, Jordan would still be bettee because he is unbeaten in the Finals?
What the fuck?

And let's not ignore all MJ's playoff lossesLebron has more finals appearances but not even the same amount of rings, let alone more, so your example doesn't work. 2007, and 2011 were winnable series where he shrunk on the biggest stage.

A finals win is valued more than a CF win, especially since Bron hasn't played any superstars in the east since 2011 if you count MVP D Rose.

[JoeTait75]

2007, and 2011 were winnable series where he shrunk on the biggest stage.

2007 was in no way, shape or form a winnable series for the Cavaliers. Other than maybe the Lakers-Nets Finals in 2002 there probably wasn't a bigger Finals mismatch in this century than '07.

[IronMexican]

Saying that 2007 series was winnable throws any other argument you have put the window.

Even in 2009, he was penalized for taking an awful team to the 1 seed before losing to the Magic.

They should have gotten swept, if LeBron doesn't hit that 3 at the buzzer.

[lefty]

Lebron has more finals appearances but not even the same amount of rings, let alone more, so your example doesn't work. 2007, and 2011 were winnable series where he shrunk on the biggest stage.

A finals win is valued more than a CF win, especially since Bron hasn't played any superstars in the east since 2011 if you count MVP D Rose.

2007 winnable?

:lmao

Oh and more ringz = betterz!

In this case MJ is not the GOAT since other legends have more ringz

Goals posts always shifted in MJ's favor lmao :
-"MJ GOAT cuz more ringz than Bron"
- "but other legends have more rings'
-" undefeated in the Finals!!!!!! "

SMH

[IronMexican]

And I think it's fair to say that Granger was/is a superstar. There were a couple of years were you legitimately could say that the Pacers had a good chance at beating Miami.

[hitmanyr2k]

Every series is winnable unless a team is so outmatched they're getting beat by double digits every game. In the 2007 Finals 3 out of 4 games came down to the final minute. Those games were VERY "winnable" for the Cavs mainly because of their defense and rebounding. I'm sure if the Heat had lost the '06 Finals everyone would have been saying that series was "unwinnable" for the Heat because the Mavs were the obvious favorite. I suppose if the Mavs lost to the Heat in '11 everyone would be making the same excuse for Dirk and saying his series was "unwinnable" because he was a solo star having to go up against the Lebron, Wade, and Bosh dream team.

[JoeTait75]

Every series is winnable unless a team is so outmatched they're getting beat by double digits every game. In the 2007 Finals 3 out of 4 games came down to the final minute. Those games were VERY "winnable" for the Cavs mainly because of their defense and rebounding.

The first two games of the '07 Finals weren't even close except to a certain extent on the scoreboard. San Antonio dominated both games. The two games in Cleveland were close, but so what? A sweep is a sweep. Has there been a single four-game sweep in the history of professional sports that could have gone the other way? Maybe you could say the Cavaliers should've won a game or two in that series, but can you honestly say they had a chance to win the whole thing?

[313]

The first two games of the '07 Finals weren't even close except to a certain extent on the scoreboard. San Antonio dominated both games. The two games in Cleveland were close, but so what? A sweep is a sweep. Has there been a single four-game sweep in the history of professional sports that could have gone the other way? Maybe you could say the Cavaliers should've won a game or two in that series, but can you honestly say they had a chance to win the whole thing?
My idea of an unwinnable series is 2015, when Kyrie and Love went down and he had to go up against a fully healthy warriors team. It wasn't just that he lost in 2007, it was how poorly he performed. 6 turnovers in 3/4 games, 5 in the other one. shot sub 40% 3/4 games as well. In his defense he was still a young player, but the same thing happened in 2011. Wasnt just that he lost, he played poorly. Correlation?

[Arcadian]

All I know is, as a Spurs fan, I never feared Lebron. We'd be 3-0 against him in the finals without the stupidest collapse of all time. The other two meetings, he was humiliated.

There was always a clear strategy against Lebron: "Make him a jump shooter." He could never dominate with his shooting, but he could be coaxed into trying.

[HarlemHeat37]

The 2007 Cavs were +350 underdogs:lol

2001 76ers +1000
2002 Nets +550
2004 Pistons +400
2007 Cavs +350

[313]

2007 winnable?

:lmao

Oh and more ringz = betterz!

2007 could've been more competitive at least. I know regular season doesn't mean much but the Cavs swept the RS series.

Bron had 4/6 of his turnovers in the second half of game one where the game got out of hand. Game 2 was a blowout. game 3 was really close and Bron went 2-8 and a turnover in the 4th Q. Game 4 they lost by one point, but it actually wasn't that close. With 5 minutes left, the cavs have a one point lead. LeBron proceeds to go 1/2 from the FT line, 1/4 from the field, and two turnovers. With a minute left the cavs were down seven and it was over.

He could've at least served home court.

And more rings is the tie breaker when the players are similarly dominant imo. You want to give LeBron credit for going to more finals, but he's only come away with half the amount of rings :lol

If Lebron was 5/7 at least with his losses being 2014 and 2015, he would probably be considered the goat.

[JoeTait75]

My idea of an unwinnable series is 2015, when Kyrie and Love went down and he had to go up against a fully healthy warriors team. It wasn't just that he lost in 2007, it was how poorly he performed. 6 turnovers in 3/4 games, 5 in the other one. shot sub 40% 3/4 games as well. In his defense he was still a young player, but the same thing happened in 2011. Wasnt just that he lost, he played poorly. Correlation?

LeBron didn't play well in the series, no. On the other hand he was 22 years old, playing in his first Finals, was surrounded by maybe the worst roster to ever play in a Finals and was going up against a great team with eons of experience in big games. Had he played better the Cavaliers would've maybe pulled out a game or two, but so what? They still would've lost. He did a phenomenal job just to get them there.

[Silver&Black]

.oh, and of course, killing Black youth..Fake news fam.

[LkrFan]

Please. There is no debate. 6 > 5 > 3PERIOD

[lefty]

LeBron didn't play well in the series, no. On the other hand he was 22 years old, playing in his first Finals, was surrounded by maybe the worst roster to ever play in a Finals and was going up against a great team with eons of experience in big games. Had he played better the Cavaliers would've maybe pulled out a game or two, but so what? They still would've lost. He did a phenomenal job just to get them there.

[Clipper Nation]

Please. There is no debate. 6 > 5 > 3PERIOD
Boiled down:::Bill Russell's the GOAT because of ring count.

What kind of self-respecting "LkrFan" roots for the Warriors and has a Celtics player as the GOAT? :downspin:

[jsandiego]

Jordan never had a 2011 collapse like LeBron did. The GOAT conversation ended then.

[jeebus]

lol trying to revive this shit forum. just wait for the nfl season to start, nigs.

[LkrFan]

Boiled down:::Bill Russell's the GOAT because of ring count.

What kind of self-respecting "LkrFan" roots for the Warriors and has a Celtics player as the GOAT? :downspin:

Not this again! :lol

Russell played in the non-free agency era. Sam Jones, Cousy, and Havlicek couldn't be poached. Couple that with, what a 9 or 10 team league? Of course he won.

Besides, KAJ is the true GOATPERIOD.

[Clipper Nation]

Not this again! :lol

Russell played in the non-free agency era. Sam Jones, Cousy, and Havlicek couldn't be poached. Couple that with, what a 9 or 10 team league? Of course he won.

Besides, KAJ is the true GOATPERIOD.
:lol Russell probably still had it tougher in his era than Magic and Kareem did in the '80s Worstern Conference, tbh.

[lefty20]

So no black kids ever killed or harmed each other over Lebron's shoes? I seriously doubt that.

I'm sure they have, but the number won't be nearly as high as Jordan's. What's worse is when the more civilized races get victimized because a hoodlum had to have the newest shoe that came out.

[LkrFan]

:lol Russell probably still had it tougher in his era than Magic and Kareem did in the '80s Worstern Conference, tbh.

Wait, wasn't your Spurs in det conference? :lmao They still beat the '80s Celdicks twice. ;)

That '86 Celdick team is second only to the '87 Lakers as the greatest team in NBA history ('96 Bulls are 3rd best).

[Clipper Nation]

Wait, wasn't your Spurs in det conference? :lmao They still beat the '80s Celdicks twice. ;)

That '86 Celdick team is second only to the '87 Lakers as the greatest team in NBA history ('96 Bulls are 3rd best).
:lol Not "my" Spurs, Paco. And those Celdicks didn't get the luxury of facing under-.500 creampuffs in the conference finals. Can Magic and Kareem say the same? :downspin:

[lefty]

:lol Not "my" Spurs, Paco. And those Celdicks didn't get the luxury of facing under-.500 creampuffs in the conference finals. Can Magic and Kareem say the same? :downspin:

[Killakobe81]

Better shooter, better in the clutch, idk what a dumb conversation.

Better at winning Finals, three peating, better at selling shoes not scared of dunk contests etc.:lol

Lebron is the better passer by far, more durable and has improved his range to be tjw better deep shooter.

FTS MID RANGE AND FADE AWAY JORDAN

TRANSITION AND LEFT HAND LEBRON

STRENGTH LEBRON

SPEED LEBRON

CLUTCH JORDAN

[Down Under]

LeBron's jumper was really really bad the first 5 years in the league to the point the Spurs played him straight up with a 36 year old Bowen and he still couldn't do anything in the finals. His next 5 years his jumper improved to average. Jordan's was above average by his second year in the league.

[Down Under]

LeBron's jumper was really really bad the first 5 years in the league to the point the Spurs played him straight up with a 36 year old Bowen and he still couldn't do anything in the finals. His next 5 years his jumper improved to average. Jordan's was above average by his second year in the league. You can't compare 3 point shooting because it wasn't really apart of the game in the 90s. Jordan never had any season where he was horrific on D like LeBron has the past few, granted he doesn't try because he just walks to the finals through the East.

[jag]

He's also better at making decisions that lead to the death of a loved one..oh, and of course, killing Black youth..

:lol:

I tell people all the time (for the past 3-4 years) that LeBron is better than Jordan was (and I don't even like Lefag), and people look at me like I just said Muhammad > Jesus.

Straight up, lebron is better at basketball. The problem is that lebron is a front running pussy and quitter.

[dfens]

tbh it's quite easy, dad killer was much better at:
- footwork and all that benefits from it (feints, acrobatic finishes, etc)
- fundamentals (positioning, timing, defensive awareness, offensive awareness, shooting mechanics)
- post play
- slashing
- scoring in general
- off-ball play and running plays
- free throws
- ruthless leadership
- selling the league and getting the benefits of it (lucky he was the first to do it properly, but it's what happened) like fts, protection, etc
- clutch play
- no 2011/2010 pussying outs.

His game was also more aesthetically pleasing so that makes a lasting image.

I really like lebron's game btw, he plays with the grace of a bulldozer but his impact is absolutely goat level. For me he is in the 2nd goat spot in a tie with KAJ and magic. If lebron had the '15-'16 mindset from the get-go he would've been the goat imo (no big chokes, no mental lapses, he'd improve his fts, he'd improve his footwork, etc). MJ was just something else tbh, no shame in acknowledging it.

[lefty]

Let's not pretend MJ never choked

[LkrFan]

:lol Not "my" Spurs, Paco. And those Celdicks didn't get the luxury of facing under-.500 creampuffs in the conference finals. Can Magic and Kareem say the same? :downspin:

:lol

mid, when did you stop rooting for the Spurs? I see you posting about them upstairs all the time. :downspin:

[LkrFan]

Let's not pretend MJ never choked

MJ's teammates totaled 11 all star appearances. LBJ? 44.

MJ 6-0
LBJ 3-4

Verdict: MJ won more with lesser teammates in a tougher era.

/end thread

[Killakobe81]

I love how some Spur fans love this nerds take but ignore that he follows it with Kiwi is only 5th-7th best player in the NBA ...:rollin
That alone makes this dude full of shit ...

At least this year there are not 5-6 better players than Leonard
But you guys only agree with this retarded take cuz its similar to some of your own ...

[lefty]

MJ's teammates totaled 11 all star appearances. LBJ? 44.

MJ 6-0
LBJ 3-4

Verdict: MJ won more with lesser teammates in a tougher era.

/end thread

- so LeBron is penalized for going further in the playoffs than MJ? How does that work? Russell is 11-1 in the Finals, so MJ has a better Finals record because he is unbeaten in the Finals?

- LeBron has never lost in the 1st round. Jordan did 3 TIMES.

- MJ waited 7 years to get to the Finals while LeBron dragged a bunch of scrubs to the Finals. In his 4th season

- LeBron makes his teams better. Just look at his teams records when he joins/leaves.

- the teams LeBron faced in the Finals are better than the ones MJ faced, at least in his 1st 3peat : Lakers had injuries to key players and Magic was on his way out. Drexler didn't have a Pippen. Suns had one of the shittiest defenses I've ever seen and KJ was playing injured, and Ceballos missed the Finals.

- MJ played in a tougher NBA?
MJ couldn't win shit until Stern listened to his complaining and changed the rules to make it easier for MJ.
MJ could not beat Detroit pre-rules change, what a tough guy :lmao :lmao :lmao
LeBron would have been a PF in the 90s,he would have obliterated that era, especially with no zone D :wow


Not only did they change the rules for him, but he was allowed to get away with everything on both ends of the court.
And don't get me started on his final season, Jordan struggled physically so they bailed him out with free throws :lmao

[Clipper Nation]

:lol

mid, when did you stop rooting for the Spurs? I see you posting about them upstairs all the time. :downspin:
:lol I know English is your second language, Mauricio, but I'm not Mid.

[Spurtacular]

Perimeter shooting; post play; defense; Jordan better at all of them.

:lmao Today's LBJ dick sucker.

[DMC]

Lebron is the most effective player. He's not the best. He's not a good FT shooter. He's not a good 3pt shooter. He doesn't have great handles. What he has is animal like twitch muscle speed, burst, fairly high basketball IQ, experience, PF size with PG capabilities, and enough of all of the things I mentioned to be deadly as a combination. He can get to the rim, around or over you. He does it a lot. He doesn't seem to have long lapses in give a shit. He's not a mental case. He has focus. He's a willing passer and trusts his teammates. He's not a ball hog. He doesn't stat pad (that I've seen). He's a good teammate and folks like playing with him.

Jordan wanted the ball, had a hard time trusting his teammates, didn't get along with them, had superior confidence in his ability to win, could not be intimidated, didn't seem to shrink in the moment. Jordan was 100% all the time, like Manu with Lebron's abilities.

[LkrFan]

:lol I know English is your second language, Mauricio, but I'm not Mid.

:lol

[hitmanyr2k]

- so LeBron is penalized for going further in the playoffs than MJ? How does that work? Russell is 11-1 in the Finals, so MJ has a better Finals record because he is unbeaten in the Finals?

- LeBron has never lost in the 1st round. Jordan did 3 TIMES.

- MJ waited 7 years to get to the Finals while LeBron dragged a bunch of scrubs to the Finals. In his 4th season

- LeBron makes his teams better. Just look at his teams records when he joins/leaves.

- the teams LeBron faced in the Finals are better than the ones MJ faced, at least in his 1st 3peat : Lakers had injuries to key players and Magic was on his way out. Drexler didn't have a Pippen. Suns had one of the shittiest defenses I've ever seen and KJ was playing injured, and Ceballos missed the Finals.

- MJ played in a tougher NBA?
MJ couldn't win shit until Stern listened to his complaining and changed the rules to make it easier for MJ.
MJ could not beat Detroit pre-rules change, what a tough guy :lmao :lmao :lmao
LeBron would have been a PF in the 90s,he would have obliterated that era, especially with no zone D :wow


Not only did they change the rules for him, but he was allowed to get away with everything on both ends of the court.
And don't get me started on his final season, Jordan struggled physically so they bailed him out with free throws :lmao


That's a myth :lol Lebron didn't drag anything. The Cavs got there by committee. Lebron was inefficient and his shot was erratic. He had a damn good defensive/rebounding team with players that chipped in at timely moments to get the Cavs to the Finals. And never mind the East was at its lowest point since...ever :lol The Cavs were also fortunate playing injured teams in the first round (an already shitty Wizards team that was even more shitty with no Arenas and no Caron Butler :lol) while Jordan's Bulls were playing all-time great teams like the Celtics in the first round.

As for the team Lebron was "dragging", when he had off shooting nights (which were plenty) the Cavs were still winning games. Why? Because he still had teammates producing.


Game 2 against the Wiz Lebron shot 8/22 but no worries because he had Drew Gooden putting in 24 points (10/13 shooting) with 14 rebounds. Big Z with 16 points (7/14 shooting) with 9 boards, and 3 blocks. Larry Hughes with 19 points (5/11 shooting) and the bench contributed as well.

Game 4 in the same series Lebron goes 8/22 again but no worries....

Big Z is stepping up with 20 points on 9/16 shooting and a gargantuan 19 boards. Drew Gooden is chipping in with 16 (on 6/11 shooting and 8 boards). Larry Hughes is putting in 20 on 5/13 shooting. The Cavs complete the sweep

Game 1 against the Nets Bron continues with the cold shooting and goes 8/21 (in fact he shot like garbage the entire series really) and just about everyone on the team joins him in the cold shooting department except Gooden who puts up 14 points (on 7-15 shooting) and adds 14 boards. But the Cavs still get the "W". Maybe their defense should have been getting more credit.

Game 6 against the Nets Lebron goes 8/20 scores 23 points but Drew Gooden is there with a steady 16 (on 8/11 shooting) and 7 boards. Donyell Marshall blows up from 3 point range shooting 6/10 from deep. Ugly game from an ugly series.

ECF - Lebron basically has 2 great games against the Pistons in this entire series (Game 3 and 5). He couldn't throw it in the ocean in Games 1 and 2.

Game 4 he shoots 8/19 scoring 25 points. Drew Gooden is there once again with 19 points (on 8/14 shooting) with 8 boards. Boobie Gibson comes off the bench to provide 21 on only 4/7 shooting and 12/12 from the stripe.

Game 6 - an important closeout game because no one wanted to go back to Detroit for a Game 7. Lebron shoots 3-11 and scored 20 mainly from 19 free throw attempts (also had a nice all-around game working). Didn't have to worry about his off-shooting game though because this was Gibson's game. He scores 31 (on 7-9 shooting, 5/5 from 3pt, 12/15 at the line and 19 of those points came in the fucking 4th qtr). Ilgauskas chips in 11 (5-9 shooting) and 12 boards.


So even though Lebron had horrible shooting nights in every series during the '07 playoffs the Cavs still found ways to win and got contributions from other players (and their defense) until they ran into a superior team in the Spurs and even then that series was competitive.

[lefty]

^

Lol skipping the big games where LeBron showed up. :lol

And MJ also had his no shows in the playoffs :lol

[lefty]

Oh and DK also got bailed out by teammates and refs :lol

[Koolaid_Man]

Listen OP.....if you're white, have a 36+ inch waistline, a cuck, a Spursfan, and / or a couch potato, and never played organized sports, there's really no need to even attempt to answer such a retarded question. If you're black and asking such a retarded question then just go to hell already fucking moron

[Phenomanul]

Different defenses... Bron Bron never played in the handcheck era... Of course his offense would appear to be more efficient...

[jimbo]

Different defenses... Bron Bron never played in the handcheck era... Of course his offense would appear to be more efficient...

technically bron did play w/ handchecking. or even worse, legal zone + handchecking. 03-05?

[dfens]

Different defenses... Bron Bron never played in the handcheck era... Of course his offense would appear to be more efficient...

I agree, on the other hand it goes both ways, if allowed to handcheck, peak lebron would be the GOAT defender, hands down. Just crazy to think about it tbh, it'd be unprecedented.

Also lebron is getting calls but he isn't getting jordan calls. For me tbh it's easy to take jordan over lebron careerwise but peak for peak both 100% in the game lebron is more valuable, as he can switch anything, guard bigs, trap guards, play all 5 positions reliably for a couple of minutes (it's all it takes) and just give his coach an unfair defensive advantage. What he did last year defensively to golden state is still underrated, people see just stats not the rotations ... still, too bad lebron is inconsistent (jumper, mentally, personality), otherwise he'd be the GOAT easily.

[dfens]

technically bron did play w/ handchecking. or even worse, legal zone + handchecking. 03-05?

too young and on a too weak team to matter, you can handcheck all you want, on a team with ilgauskas, boozer and drew gooden as your bigs it will be pointless :lol