I will play my best basketball when I return in January 2018- Parker

[Spurs 4 The Win]

http://www.espn.com/blog/nba/rumors/post/_/id/42964/rumor-central-tony-parker-expects-to-return-better-than-ever-in-2018

Parker already making plans to be the best PG on the team when he gets back in January from his injury. Im skeptical, lets hope he can at least be a net positive player with how much money we are paying him.

:lobt::lobt::lobt::lobt::lobt::lobt2::flag:

[Robz4000]

He's out until late February.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

He's out until late February.

That's a direct quote from Parker about January

[John B]

He smells CP3 coming lol. I hope he comes back and make final tour with Manu. Would be great to have two HOF Spurs same year.

[Robz4000]

That's a direct quote from Parker about January

He says January but the Spurs say late Feb (as does the article). Parker really might sense his time with the Spurs close to an end so he wants to convince them not to move on.

[EIC]

He gonna do big things on that second unit.

[tmtcsc]

Sounds like he'll be wearing BiG Baller Brand shoes too. He's either delusional or wants to let the team know he's not retiring. Too much $$ to leave on table. I think he's done. No one in the NBA to my knowledge has ever come back from this sort of injury. It finished Barkley.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Unlikely at his age, but it puts to bed all rumors and suggestions about being stretched or salary dumped, etc.

[Play Boban]

:lol

[TheRemix]

Ugh i'm not going to like this version of tp when he returns. Gonna be a shell of himself

[dbreiden83080]

You will be coming off the bench..

[TheDoctor]

It's always a good thing for a player to have a work ethic like that. Especially someone not so young. But I very much doubt that he can play his best basketball at this point. Unless he's talking about some 2K's MyCareer shit.

[coachmac87]

He's a competitor so of course he's going to be optimistic about the type of player he will be post injury...but he can't ignore the facts..his body is breaking down and this injury alone proves it. He was on restriction with his minutes during the season and his body still failed him..

[hater]

HOtS

[cd98]

Come on, when has a perennial all star player that is 35 in this era ever thought it was over? And it may not be. But the odds are against him ever getting back to his 2017 form. But everyone's body heals differently and with his pay cuts and team loyalty he deserves a shot to comeback. Plus they have him under contract anyway,so they have to pay him. Let's see what happens. TBH, he won't have the wear and tear of the regular season and if he doesn't revert back to Porker while rehabbing, he will have time to play himself into shape while giving Murray a chance to prove he should be the starter.

[GSH]

Retire him and stretch that damn salary over three years. Best thing for everyone.

[DPG21920]

Retire him and stretch that damn salary over three years. Best thing for everyone.

No way. Eat the salary this year since it's most likely a bridge year anyways. Then next year SA has the ultimate flexibility.

[bic50]

Tp was looking great in the playoffs before he got hurt.

[Brazil]

He says January but the Spurs say late Feb (as does the article). Parker really might sense his time with the Spurs close to an end so he wants to convince them not to move on.

:lol wut?

you think dude needs an interview in a French Newspaper to send messages to PATFO ? :lol tbh...

[Brazil]

I read the whole stuff

Dude is having the good spirit, he is 200% in his recovery to be back as soon as possible... a pro tbh...

[Robz4000]

:lol wut?

you think dude needs an interview in a French Newspaper to send messages to PATFO ? :lol tbh...

I'm gonna miss you Brazil. ST just isn't gonna be the same without you and ElNono; losing y'all is gonna be as rough as losing the Big 3 tbh.

[Brazil]

I'm gonna miss you Brazil. ST just isn't gonna be the same without you and ElNono (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=8054); losing y'all is gonna be as rough as losing the Big 3 tbh.

:lol

will miss u too tbh...

[Nathan89]

:flag:

[cd98]

Retire him and stretch that damn salary over three years. Best thing for everyone.

He has to choose retirement. Spurs can only trade or waive him and waiving him doesn't help the salary cap.

[Jdspur20]

Sounds like he'll be wearing BiG Baller Brand shoes too. He's either delusional or wants to let the team know he's not retiring. Too much $$ to leave on table. I think he's done. No one in the NBA to my knowledge has ever come back from this sort of injury. It finished Barkley.

[Jdspur20]

He's out until late February.

Robz is correct. He can say Jan all he wants but Spurs will ease him back in.
My concern is by late feb/ early march, how effective will he be when there will literally only be 2 1/2 months of basketball left at that point. He will be a shell of himself. No one has successfully come back from this type of injury and be efficient.
I love Tony, but he needs to retire.

[SupremeGuy]

No way. Eat the salary this year since it's most likely a bridge year anyways. Then next year SA has the ultimate flexibility.Yeah, this is probably best, but it sucks cause we're also kind of wasting a year of prime Kawhi.

[mudyez]

I don't remember someone called Tony Parker.

[Play Boban]

I don't remember someone called Tony Parker.
Yes, his name was Tony Porker tbh.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

Yeah, this is probably best, but it sucks cause we're also kind of wasting a year of prime Kawhi.

I wouldnt write us off because of one player who we didnt even have in Game 1 of the WCF when we were sodomizing the Warriors in front of their home crowd

[tholdren]

Ugh i'm not going to like this version of tp when he returns. Gonna be a shell of himself

No. He will be forced to train and take care of his body. Hopefully he looks outside the spurs organization for a trainer. The spurs strength coach is worthless.

[Hoops Czar]

Nothing to see here. GOAT player saying GOAT things. Moving along.

[tmtcsc]

I wouldnt write us off because of one player who we didnt even have in Game 1 of the WCF when we were sodomizing the Warriors in front of their home crowd

Exactly. The team will be just fine without him. He hasn't been Tony Parker in about 4 years now.

[GSH]

He has to choose retirement. Spurs can only trade or waive him and waiving him doesn't help the salary cap.

If they say they don't want him back, he will retire rather than getting waived. If he's not going to be available until January at the earliest, nobody else will be jumping at the chance to pick him up. He would announce that after further consideration, blah, blah, blah.




No way. Eat the salary this year since it's most likely a bridge year anyways. Then next year SA has the ultimate flexibility.


LOL... so NOW you want to take a year to rebuild? :lol

I guess it depends on whether they have a chance to add a serious player this year. They can have all the cap space they want in 2018, but it's hard to add multiple Championship-caliber players in one season. If things don't go right, you wind up "one year out" year after year.

Stretching Parker would clear something like $10M in cap space this season. If that made the difference in being able to swing a deal for someone like CP3? You damn betcha they should do it. I know exactly what you're saying, but it's not a no-brainer by any means.

[tholdren]

Ugh i'm not going to like this version of tp when he returns. Gonna be a shell of himself

No. He will be forced to train and take care of his body. Hopefully he looks outside the spurs organization for a trainer. The spurs strength coach is worthless.

[tmtcsc]

http://img.bleacherreport.net/img/images/photos/003/664/104/hi-res-a56b7b752b22615024de7d23c8311c2f_crop_north.jpg?h= 533&w=800&q=70&crop_x=center&crop_y=top

The only player.... I mean the ONLY player...that could ever take me or my son one-on-one is Tony Parker. But who knows, maybe his ruptured quad would give me a chance. -- Lavar Ball

[dabom]

:lmao

[kaji157]

He was talking to L´Equipe, and the NBA season begins on October not January, so maybe he is showcasing him to some European teams to play there for a year. You never know.
It´s really difficult for the Spurs to land a marquee free agent this season, evendoe there are ways to dream of adding players such as Paul, Hayward or George, the most likely scenario will be for the Spurs to stay put, maybe add a vet or a experienced European PG to play part-time untill Parker is ready to go and be an insurance in case DeJounte doesn´t pan out or gets injured.

For what Pop said, it seems the Spurs will try to bring back most of their Free Agents, if we can resign all of them Minus Patty and Gasol, and find promising replacements for them, then i will be happy.

Always considering Tony has a credible timetable to be at full strenght after the All Star break.

[TheGreatYacht]

Nothing to see here. GOAT player saying GOAT things. Moving along.

[TheGreatYacht]

Buford better go ahead and give him a 3yr/45M extension while his stock is low or else this going to come back and haunt us....

[Hoops Czar]

He was talking to L´Equipe, and the NBA season begins on October not January, so maybe he is showcasing him to some European teams to play there for a year. You never know.
It´s really difficult for the Spurs to land a marquee free agent this season, evendoe there are ways to dream of adding players such as Paul, Hayward or George, the most likely scenario will be for the Spurs to stay put, maybe add a vet or a experienced European PG to play part-time untill Parker is ready to go and be an insurance in case DeJounte doesn´t pan out or gets injured.

For what Pop said, it seems the Spurs will try to bring back most of their Free Agents, if we can resign all of them Minus Patty and Gasol, and find promising replacements for them, then i will be happy.

Always considering Tony has a credible timetable to be at full strenght after the All Star break.

Of course they'll bring back most, if not all their free agents, RC Buford is a dear in headlights when it comes to signing free agents. Pop is a close second.

[DPG21920]

If they say they don't want him back, he will retire rather than getting waived. If he's not going to be available until January at the earliest, nobody else will be jumping at the chance to pick him up. He would announce that after further consideration, blah, blah, blah.






LOL... so NOW you want to take a year to rebuild? :lol

I guess it depends on whether they have a chance to add a serious player this year. They can have all the cap space they want in 2018, but it's hard to add multiple Championship-caliber players in one season. If things don't go right, you wind up "one year out" year after year.

Stretching Parker would clear something like $10M in cap space this season. If that made the difference in being able to swing a deal for someone like CP3? You damn betcha they should do it. I know exactly what you're saying, but it's not a no-brainer by any means.

Well sure, there are caveats to this, but in general, making what I seem to be reasonable assumptions, stretching TP should be the last option only in a dream scenario you can land a star this year that you love long-term

[ElNono]

I'm gonna miss you Brazil. ST just isn't gonna be the same without you and ElNono; losing y'all is gonna be as rough as losing the Big 3 tbh.

:lol

[objective]

2018 versatility is a mirage.

Caproom wrecked if they keep Mills and match Simmons while spending the MLE and BAE. So to get that flexibility they have to dump Green and Aldridge. Such a great plan, lose two starters and replace them with 2018 free agents which are crap.

LMA and Green will be among the best gettable 2018 free agents, that's how bad the class is.

Keeping Parker on the roster when he won't even play until all-star break is perplexing. Then what, work him in with substantial minutes after Murray and presumably Mills have spent all year doing it? Just force feed an old, falling apart Parker into the rotation?

Wasting Kawhi's prime, that's what's going to happen.

[MaNu4Tres]

2018 versatility is a mirage.

Caproom wrecked if they keep Mills and match Simmons while spending the MLE and BAE. So to get that flexibility they have to dump Green and Aldridge. Such a great plan, lose two starters and replace them with 2018 free agents which are crap.

LMA and Green will be among the best gettable 2018 free agents, that's how bad the class is.

Keeping Parker on the roster when he won't even play until all-star break is perplexing. Then what, work him in with substantial minutes after Murray and presumably Mills have spent all year doing it? Just force feed an old, falling apart Parker into the rotation?

Wasting Kawhi's prime, that's what's going to happen.

Agree with most of this, except they should not keep Patty. Let him go.

Id go hard after Hayward if I were SA, not CP3.

Go after Jrue too but only at a certain cost.

Regardless, I really want SA to get creative and get another late 1st or early 2nd. At the end of the day, the draft is where the real progress will be made and getting two young quality role players on cheap 4-5 yr deals would expedite the type of growth this team needs. Free Agency isnt the answer, a lot of FAs are shit and will be overpaid for pedestrian production. Thats why banking on the 2018 Free Agency class, when LA walks, will be a massive mistake. SA needs another pick or two this draft. Id have LA, Kyle, the 2018 1st and cash after a Pau dump as assets to acquire another pick or two.

[Hoops Czar]

2018 versatility is a mirage.

Caproom wrecked if they keep Mills and match Simmons while spending the MLE and BAE. So to get that flexibility they have to dump Green and Aldridge. Such a great plan, lose two starters and replace them with 2018 free agents which are crap.

LMA and Green will be among the best gettable 2018 free agents, that's how bad the class is.

Keeping Parker on the roster when he won't even play until all-star break is perplexing. Then what, work him in with substantial minutes after Murray and presumably Mills have spent all year doing it? Just force feed an old, falling apart Parker into the rotation?

Wasting Kawhi's prime, that's what's going to happen.

Aldridge will either be dumped or he'll opt out. He won't be on the books after next season regardless. Realistically, I'm hoping the Spurs dangle him for a lottery pick like they did George Hill.

[Thomas82]

2018 versatility is a mirage.

Caproom wrecked if they keep Mills and match Simmons while spending the MLE and BAE. So to get that flexibility they have to dump Green and Aldridge. Such a great plan, lose two starters and replace them with 2018 free agents which are crap.

LMA and Green will be among the best gettable 2018 free agents, that's how bad the class is.

Keeping Parker on the roster when he won't even play until all-star break is perplexing. Then what, work him in with substantial minutes after Murray and presumably Mills have spent all year doing it? Just force feed an old, falling apart Parker into the rotation?

Wasting Kawhi's prime, that's what's going to happen.

Good post!!

[Thomas82]

Aldridge will either be dumped or he'll opt out. He won't be on the books after next season regardless. Realistically, I'm hoping the Spurs dangle him for a lottery pick like they did George Hill.

I would not be upset at that move.

[objective]

Agree with most of this, except they should not keep Patty. Let him go.

Id go hard after Hayward if I were SA, not CP3.

Go after Jrue too but only at a certain cost.

Regardless, I really want SA to get creative and get another late 1st or early 2nd. At the end of the day, the draft is where the real progress will be made and getting two young quality role players on cheap 4-5 yr deals would expedite the type of growth this team needs. Free Agency isnt the answer, a lot of FAs are shit and will be overpaid for pedestrian production. Thats why banking on the 2018 Free Agency class, when LA walks, will be a massive mistake. SA needs another pick or two this draft. Id have LA, Kyle, the 2018 1st and cash after a Pau dump as assets to acquire another pick or two.

I don't want Mills back at all, not even at MLE money. But I'm​ putting what i think the Spurs might do, and keeping Mills is a realistic danger.

[testies]

Lol at people getting their hopes up. Porker will suck us out of all of the money he can.

Ginobili will also comeback and get a "thank you" extension, he will also demand us to sign another 2 scrub argentinians.. Our next free agent signings will be Jermaine O'Neal and Vince Carter

we will be GSW's sluts like we were Lakers' sluts in that late 2000s

[TD 21]

2018 versatility is a mirage.

Caproom wrecked if they keep Mills and match Simmons while spending the MLE and BAE. So to get that flexibility they have to dump Green and Aldridge. Such a great plan, lose two starters and replace them with 2018 free agents which are crap.

LMA and Green will be among the best gettable 2018 free agents, that's how bad the class is.

Keeping Parker on the roster when he won't even play until all-star break is perplexing. Then what, work him in with substantial minutes after Murray and presumably Mills have spent all year doing it? Just force feed an old, falling apart Parker into the rotation?

Wasting Kawhi's prime, that's what's going to happen.

I've been saying the same thing recently and it's why they should attempt to do something significant now. Hayward is even more unrealistic than Paul though, because of the Leonard overlap. Spurs' respect level is such that just about anyone would probably give them a token meeting, but it would be waste of time on both sides.

If these were robots and not human beings, keeping Parker would be perplexing. As is, it's understandable; especially if it's not an impediment to a significant move (and it's highly unlikely it will be).

If Mills is re-signed, barring Murray setting the world on fire, expect Parker, when he returns, to start sooner than later because his game isn't compatible with either but theirs is with each other.

Obviously, a lot can change in a year, but at this writing, for all the talk of '18, I think the most likely scenario, is the core being similar to now. Aldridge may not be thrilled as a Spur and vice versa, but it's no different than why he signed in the first place: can either side find someone who checks more boxes? Probably not.

[tonight...you]

:lol

will miss u too tbh...
Lol... you me and Kid Capri.
Birds and the Bees and the Coconut Trees.

Context: ate some homemade 'shrooms... and totally digging everything I'm doing right now.

[BillMc]

This seems like a place to put this:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWeUqgK3Hgk

This guy makes a lot of mistakes no matter what side of the argument you're on. Also, even though this was published today, it seems to have been recorded during Rockets series

[objective]

Unlike some others I'm fine keeping Aldridge, i just accept that his game has faded enough that he's more of a third wheel now.

Which would be fine if they had a second banana, either scoring or playmaking. Not necessarily a superstar #2, just someone else that can function dependably at a high level and in matchups like GSW, Houston, Cleveland and probably Boston.

Hayward is that, though i don't bother to entertain him. Chris Paul is that. And i think Hill, Lowry, and Holiday can fill that role. Teague not so much. But I'm sure that Mills isn't that. Bad quad 35/36 year old Parker isn't that. A returning 40 year old Manu isn't that. Old Pau isn't that, and it would cost the team Pau to get one of those guys i listed.

[GSH]

He has to choose retirement. Spurs can only trade or waive him and waiving him doesn't help the salary cap.


Well sure, there are caveats to this, but in general, making what I seem to be reasonable assumptions, stretching TP should be the last option only in a dream scenario you can land a star this year that you love long-term


Right now - at this moment - the Spurs have a PG rotation of Murray and Forbes. And theoretically, TP for the second half of the season. That means they have to have another PG for the first half of the season, or another playmaker (like Simmons or Manu?) to simulate a PG for the first half.

If you start stepping through what has to happen, or at least what is likely to happen, you'll start seeing that they really have to push hard to pick up a serious player this offseason. You say "star", and I wouldn't go that far. But one that is going to cost them a chunk of change to sign.

If they are really going to take a year to rebuild, then they can go find someone like Laprovittola to get them through the first half of the season, so that they will still have "ultimate flexibility" in 2018. And bringing Tony back mid-way through a likely-lottery season. And convincing Kawhi that it's going to get better, so he'll accept an extension. And, and, and...

This, all of this, is why I wanted the Spurs to bite the bullet and rebuild this past season. So Kawhi could actually see the team ascending in 17-18. So that this year's FA's could see the skeleton of a contender.

Personally, I think the Spurs have to make a big push at getting a solid FA this season now. Objective mentioned getting Hayward to sign - that would be my dream scenario. I would LOVE to see him on the court with Kawhi, playing against "today's NBA" teams. And getting guys like that will be almost impossible without stretching Parker's salary. But if they can't pull that off, I have a good feeling about this year's draft. I would love to see them buy a second-rounder for cash, like we've seen teams do the last several years. And if they moved Aldridge and/or Gasol and/or Green to come up with a good first-rounder, even better. That's the one scenario where I don't think they need to stretch Tony.

[GSH]

Context: ate some homemade 'shrooms... and totally digging everything I'm doing right now.

:lol


Just don't look in the mirror.

[BackHome]

I Like Parker I don't understand all the hate it's up to Pop and RC to either keep or get rid of him. So if you want to hate then put it on the right people.

As far as Parker and his injury are concerned I think pretty much this has ended his career he already was having major hamstring issues which leads me to think his tear was a lot worse then is being reported. To rehab and the get into NBA shape to me is just not something he is going to put himself through that is a hell of a lot of painful hours. In the end I will think he will claim medical issue and just collect his disability check.

[GSH]

I Like Parker I don't understand all the hate


It's not hate. He's 35 years old, has more mileage than all but a handful of the PG's in NBA history (including playoffs and summer), he's had a terrible injury and is out until January at minimum. And he's going to be taking $15.5M of the cap next year. I've never been a Parker-hater, but that's not a happy picture for a team.

People have to face the fact that the players we love get old and finally have to retire. If there was another great player (but not a Spurs great) who was Tony's age, had Tony's injury, and was going to cost $15.5M next year? There's no way you would be in favor of it. No way. Zero.

[BackHome]

Right now - at this moment - the Spurs have a PG rotation of Murray and Forbes. And theoretically, TP for the second half of the season. That means they have to have another PG for the first half of the season, or another playmaker (like Simmons or Manu?) to simulate a PG for the first half.

If you start stepping through what has to happen, or at least what is likely to happen, you'll start seeing that they really have to push hard to pick up a serious player this offseason. You say "star", and I wouldn't go that far. But one that is going to cost them a chunk of change to sign.

If they are really going to take a year to rebuild, then they can go find someone like Laprovittola to get them through the first half of the season, so that they will still have "ultimate flexibility" in 2018. And bringing Tony back mid-way through a likely-lottery season. And convincing Kawhi that it's going to get better, so he'll accept an extension. And, and, and...

This, all of this, is why I wanted the Spurs to bite the bullet and rebuild this past season. So Kawhi could actually see the team ascending in 17-18. So that this year's FA's could see the skeleton of a contender.

Personally, I think the Spurs have to make a big push at getting a solid FA this season now. Objective mentioned getting Hayward to sign - that would be my dream scenario. I would LOVE to see him on the court with Kawhi, playing against "today's NBA" teams. And getting guys like that will be almost impossible without stretching Parker's salary. But if they can't pull that off, I have a good feeling about this year's draft. I would love to see them buy a second-rounder for cash, like we've seen teams do the last several years. And if they moved Aldridge and/or Gasol and/or Green to come up with a good first-rounder, even better. That's the one scenario where I don't think they need to stretch Tony.

+10000 = To me for 2017 and 2018 the only big names I would want and that we have a legit chance to get are Gordon Hayward and Kistaps Porzingis who is not a happy camper with New York right now and is making it well none he doesn't like Phil. To get these two players I would open the bank and LMA/Gasl/Green/Parker would be on the trading block.........ONE CAN DREAM..........

IF Pop and RC don't have the balls to do that the they better at least get us do a trade to get a stud in the draft or get 3 draft picks this year

[objective]

Right now - at this moment - the Spurs have a PG rotation of Murray and Forbes. And theoretically, TP for the second half of the season. That means they have to have another PG for the first half of the season, or another playmaker (like Simmons or Manu?) to simulate a PG for the first half. ... .

They'll probably give Mills some absurd deal like 4/60 or 3/45.

Heck, didn't one ESPN writer call $17 million a year for Mills being reasonable?

Have to keep that corporate knowledge, Pop doesn't like to have roster turnover. Too many new players and then they have more work to do coaching.

[tholdren]

It's not hate. He's 35 years old, has more mileage than all but a handful of the PG's in NBA history (including playoffs and summer), he's had a terrible injury and is out until January at minimum. And he's going to be taking $15.5M of the cap next year. I've never been a Parker-hater, but that's not a happy picture for a team.

People have to face the fact that the players we love get old and finally have to retire. If there was another great player (but not a Spurs great) who was Tony's age, had Tony's injury, and was going to cost $15.5M next year? There's no way you would be in favor of it. No way. Zero.

Everyone on here except me wanted gaysol. Your theory is shot

[CGD]

I hope TP gets the chance to go out on his own terms, even if just for a half season. It really sucks if the injury retires him.

[DMC]

Ugh i'm not going to like this version of tp when he returns. Gonna be a shell of himself

Which self? The self that's a shell of prime Parker or a shell of that shell? If it's the latter, he shouldn't even be handing out towels.

[DMC]

They'll probably give Mills some absurd deal like 4/60 or 3/45.

Heck, didn't one ESPN writer call $17 million a year for Mills being reasonable?

Have to keep that corporate knowledge, Pop doesn't like to have roster turnover. Too many new players and then they have more work to do coaching.

You cannot build a culture by wholesaling the community every other year. 29 other teams have tried it.

[RD2191]

Gotta admire his optimism but he's done, needs to gtfo TBH. We don't need a Kirby/Lakers situation on the Spurs.

[Jdspur20]

It's not hate. He's 35 years old, has more mileage than all but a handful of the PG's in NBA history (including playoffs and summer), he's had a terrible injury and is out until January at minimum. And he's going to be taking $15.5M of the cap next year. I've never been a Parker-hater, but that's not a happy picture for a team.

People have to face the fact that the players we love get old and finally have to retire. If there was another great player (but not a Spurs great) who was Tony's age, had Tony's injury, and was going to cost $15.5M next year? There's no way you would be in favor of it. No way. Zero.

[objective]

You cannot build a culture by wholesaling the community every other year. 29 other teams have tried it.

What culture do they keep by paying Mills a deal like 4/60?

Improving rosters is what teams have to do.

Bogut and Barnes were champs baked into.the Warriors culture. I don't think they are missing them.

[GSH]

Everyone on here except me wanted gaysol. Your theory is shot


Pau had a ruptured quadriceps tendon when the Spurs signed him? I didn't know. My bad.

[therealtruth]

He's got to change the way he plays. Got to be more of a threat from the outside. If he uses the timeoff to work on his shot then it will be worth it.

[DMC]

What culture do they keep by paying Mills a deal like 4/60?

Improving rosters is what teams have to do.

Bogut and Barnes were champs baked into.the Warriors culture. I don't think they are missing them.

Bogut was there 4 years. He was hardly baked into the culture. Patty has 6 with the Spurs and he's still culturally on the fringe. Warriors signed Kevin Durant. Do you think Paul George or Chris Paul are coming to the Spurs? If so I'd be all for releasing Mills. Otherwise, you'll just have a new meh level player trying to fit into the system.

If Manu retires and Tony isn't there most of the season, Patty is the vet on the team, same number of years as Kawhi Leonard. Only Green has been there longer but even then Danny is hardly a floor general. You cannot expect Murray to be a floor general and lead the team. Kawhi is too introverted to rally the troops, just leads by example.

Unless you want wholesale slaughter of the team, you're not improving by moving Patty out for some washed up player from the bottom of the list.

[Russ]

Don't bet against him.

:flag:

[GSH]

Patty has 6 with the Spurs and he's still culturally on the fringe.

Unless you want wholesale slaughter of the team, you're not improving by moving Patty out for some washed up player from the bottom of the list.


I don't know where you got that first part from. But I agree with you in principle about culture and corporate knowledge. The piece you're leaving out is skills. I don't think Patty is suitable as a starting PG, and he's too short to be a 2 guard. Several others here have said the same thing, but that's an opinion and we aren't going to convince each other.

What I don't think is debatable is that CP3 is a lot stronger than Patty. He can fight through contact better, and bounce off of contact and finishes much better. That's a pretty big thing when it comes to the playoffs, where the refs allow a lot more contact. It's also pretty well understood with (unbiased) NBA fans that Paul is a much better defender than Patty. Also a big deal in the playoffs.

I have my doubts about CP3's personality/ego. But if the Spurs are going to take it back to that next level, I think they have to have a stronger starting PG than Patty. And if they have to make that change, this year is by far the best time to do it. Yeah, they would be giving up some corporate knowledge. But the skills upgrade more than makes up for it, IMO. I'm not disagreeing with the idea you're talking about. I just think it's worth the trade-off to upgrade the point, if they get that chance. I sure as hell wouldn't want them to make a lateral move, skills-wise.

[SASdynasty!]

He gonna do big things on that second unit.
Lol this isn't Manu we're talking about. This is a career starter.

[ArtVandelay]

so this means his fat ass is going to finally get in shape?

[TheGreatYacht]

Lol this isn't Manu we're talking about. This is a career starter.
Agreed. Manu wouldn't have been a good starter. Playing against backups padded his stats a little (and they weren't that impressive still) .... just look at Paddy as a starter :lol

[DMC]

I don't know where you got that first part from. But I agree with you in principle about culture and corporate knowledge. The piece you're leaving out is skills. I don't think Patty is suitable as a starting PG, and he's too short to be a 2 guard. Several others here have said the same thing, but that's an opinion and we aren't going to convince each other.

What I don't think is debatable is that CP3 is a lot stronger than Patty. He can fight through contact better, and bounce off of contact and finishes much better. That's a pretty big thing when it comes to the playoffs, where the refs allow a lot more contact. It's also pretty well understood with (unbiased) NBA fans that Paul is a much better defender than Patty. Also a big deal in the playoffs.

I have my doubts about CP3's personality/ego. But if the Spurs are going to take it back to that next level, I think they have to have a stronger starting PG than Patty. And if they have to make that change, this year is by far the best time to do it. Yeah, they would be giving up some corporate knowledge. But the skills upgrade more than makes up for it, IMO. I'm not disagreeing with the idea you're talking about. I just think it's worth the trade-off to upgrade the point, if they get that chance. I sure as hell wouldn't want them to make a lateral move, skills-wise.

6 years with the Spurs. He started in 2011-2012 season. I said if we get a Chris Paul level player I'd be fine with the trade, but not some low level guy. Chris Paul, as good as he is, has a lot of baggage and ego to go along with his inability to stay healthy in the post season.

[DaBears]

Sounds like he'll be wearing BiG Baller Brand shoes too. He's either delusional or wants to let the team know he's not retiring. Too much $$ to leave on table. I think he's done. No one in the NBA to my knowledge has ever come back from this sort of injury. It finished Barkley.

** What is he suppose to say.. " I'm done, and career is over. but as a parting gift let me collect my 14+mil on the way out".. --He knows he cannot come back better than prior to the injury.

[MultiTroll]

Team player.

[coachmac87]

** What is he suppose to say.. " I'm done, and career is over. but as a parting gift let me collect my 14+mil on the way out".. --He knows he cannot come back better than prior to the injury.

This. Let's also not forget there's CP3 speculation swirling and he's a competitor so he's gonna be optimistic.....even if it's still early injury process where Tony really doesn't know the truth going forward

[Atl Spur]

Tony is done and living in the past only clouds your vision. Give him a champions exit but do not let nostalgia govern over the business of the franchise. Time will run out for all of us......... I wish him the best but we must move on.

[Prose]

Sounds like he'll be wearing BiG Baller Brand shoes too. He's either delusional or wants to let the team know he's not retiring. Too much $$ to leave on table. I think he's done. No one in the NBA to my knowledge has ever come back from this sort of injury. It finished Barkley.

i believe barkley tore one of the quad muscle but yes i get your point bad injury

[MultiTroll]

Tony is done and living in the past only clouds your vision. Give him a champions exit but do not let nostalgia govern over the business of the franchise. Time will run out for all of us......... I wish him the best but we must move on.
The attitude of "Player above team." has already cost 'Chips.
Needs to be stopped yesterday.

[tholdren]

Pau had a ruptured quadriceps tendon when the Spurs signed him? I didn't know. My bad.

No but he was terrible.

[Brazil]

:lol I cannot wait to witness dat amount of salt poured on this board when Parker is gonna be back in January just in time to be starter again in the POs...

[objective]

Bogut was there 4 years. He was hardly baked into the culture. Patty has 6 with the Spurs and he's still culturally on the fringe. Warriors signed Kevin Durant. Do you think Paul George or Chris Paul are coming to the Spurs? If so I'd be all for releasing Mills. Otherwise, you'll just have a new meh level player trying to fit into the system.

If Manu retires and Tony isn't there most of the season, Patty is the vet on the team, same number of years as Kawhi Leonard. Only Green has been there longer but even then Danny is hardly a floor general. You cannot expect Murray to be a floor general and lead the team. Kawhi is too introverted to rally the troops, just leads by example.

Unless you want wholesale slaughter of the team, you're not improving by moving Patty out for some washed up player from the bottom of the list.

Bogut absolutely was a huge part of the culture and with Green made them a tougher, dirtier team. He was the starter, not some backup scrub for his first two years like Mills. He was a much bigger part of their team than Mills. You ignored Barnes. They weren't the only champs dropped, they dumped Speights and Barbosa too.

Hell, look at all the new faces they have playing in the playoffs: Durant, West, McGee, McCaw are all new. They might lose Livingston this summer too, doesn't really matter.

The Spurs culture was Duncan. That's it. Maybe Manu, maybe some Parker thrown in. But they didn't lose their culture when Avery left. Or when Robinson retired. Or when Malik Rose was traded. It was Duncan. And it is and will be Kawhi.

Mills doesn't matter any more than Avery or Malik or Finley. Refusing to upgrade team talent for 'culture' is what sabotaged the team after 07, they just had to bring back their culture guys like Vaughn, Oberto and Finley.

[dabom]

:lol I cannot wait to witness dat amount of salt poured on this board when Parker is gonna be back in January just in time to be starter again in the POs...

Brah...

[Brazil]

Brah...

:lol

gonna be glorious

[objective]

Another thing about culture and winning:

Very little culture continuity on the 03 title team. Only guys with more than 3 years were Duncan, Robinson, and Rose.

3/5ths of the starters and 6th man wing had 1 year or less experience in the system, and ditto for the some other key back ups

Bowen, 1 year going into 02/03
Parker, 1 year
Jackson, 1 year where he almost never played and was inactive most of the time
Manu, 0 years
Willis, 0 years primary back up center
Speedy, 0 years, primary back up point guard
Kerr, 3* years, wasn't on team the prior season
Smith, 1 year
Ferry, 2 years
Bateer, 0 years

[tonight...you]

:lol

gonna be glorious
My bruddah and I'm not even a Parker-stan. You are da shiz-nice.

[SASdynasty!]

In b4 Parker averages 16 PPG on 53% in the playoffs again against the best 2 PG defenders in the league.

[tonight...you]

In b4 Parker averages 16 PPG on 53% in the playoffs again against the best 2 PG defenders in the league.
Don't think it will happen... but I wouldn't be upset by that at all.
#Proviso: That Murray has improved exponentially (which I hope for, but don't count on).

[DMC]

Bogut absolutely was a huge part of the culture and with Green made them a tougher, dirtier team. He was the starter, not some backup scrub for his first two years like Mills. He was a much bigger part of their team than Mills. You ignored Barnes. They weren't the only champs dropped, they dumped Speights and Barbosa too.

Hell, look at all the new faces they have playing in the playoffs: Durant, West, McGee, McCaw are all new. They might lose Livingston this summer too, doesn't really matter.

The Spurs culture was Duncan. That's it. Maybe Manu, maybe some Parker thrown in. But they didn't lose their culture when Avery left. Or when Robinson retired. Or when Malik Rose was traded. It was Duncan. And it is and will be Kawhi.

Mills doesn't matter any more than Avery or Malik or Finley. Refusing to upgrade team talent for 'culture' is what sabotaged the team after 07, they just had to bring back their culture guys like Vaughn, Oberto and Finley.

You don't get a culture from basically 4 years of playing. You get a system. Warriors have a system, they don't have a culture, not yet. Regardless, Bogut's 6pts and 7rbs a game are hardly "culture" material. His moving screens and defense was part of their scheme, but they haven't had a head coach or consistent team long enough to have a culture.

So explain the Warriors culture. I can explain the Spurs culture. It wasn't Duncan. Robinson allowed Tim to be the man, that was part of the culture there, to play unselfish ball and for the coach to be able to run the team without needing approval from a player.

[objective]

So Mills is the Spurs culture, huh? Yeah, makes total sense. Mills is just like Robinson not demanding more touches.

And if the 76ers offer Mills 4/55, the Spurs need to offer 4/60?

Or 4/70?

[duncan2k5]

Parker needs to retire...He was one of the worst start I point guards this year...He was even inconsistent in the playoffs...He had some great games, but he also had absolutely trash games

[therealtruth]

I'll take for him to just play as good as Speedy Claxton.

[TheDoctor]

I'll take for him to just play as good as Speedy Claxton.

:lobt2:

[FuzzyLumpkins]

He says January but the Spurs say late Feb (as does the article). Parker really might sense his time with the Spurs close to an end so he wants to convince them not to move on.

More likely it's that prognosis this far out come in ranges and whereas the Spur's brass are conservative and give the far end of the range, Parker is pushing for the front end of the range.

[Chillen]

The Parker injury ruined any NBA title hopes the Spurs had this season and it also brought on an injury bug (Leonard, Lee). It was the first domino to fall, now a healthy Spurs team could have really given the Warriors fits but it wasn't to be.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

The Parker injury ruined any NBA title hopes the Spurs had this season and it also brought on an injury bug (Leonard, Lee). It was the first domino to fall, now a healthy Spurs team could have really given the Warriors fits but it wasn't to be.

I disagree, Spurs looked just fine without Parker and were decimating the Warriors in front of their home crowd. Parker is a role player, role player injuries dont end your title hopes.

[DaBears]

Agree'd, Parkers absence would have felt the same had it been Danny Greens instead. Up 23 on the downward slope of the 3rd quarter & your top O & D man goes down, that is the killer... What hurt the most after the glass ankle shattered was we no longer had a guy who could break down the defense and cause the D to collapse free'in up someone.

[spursfan09]

Oh I believe!!!

[MultiTroll]

The Parker injury ruined any NBA title hopes the Spurs had this season and it also brought on an injury bug (Leonard, Lee). It was the first domino to fall, now a healthy Spurs team could have really given the Warriors fits but it wasn't to be.
:lol

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

I think this is wishful thinking on Tony's part. I hope he's right. This playoffs was the most intense I've seen Tony play in years. If he's determined and if his body cooperates he might come back and contribute. I can't see him being the old Tony Parker...he'll just be an old Tony Parker.

[DeRozan m8]

This is what pisses me off about this guy...

It's always about him....

He knows that's not true....we all do

[MaNu4Tres]

Objective killed DMC in this thread.

[gilmor]

This is what pisses me off about this guy...

It's always about him....

He knows that's not true....we all do

All french thinks like that

[Brazil]

All french thinks like that

:lmao

I'd be curious to know how many French you know tbh...

:lol Philippines

[TheGreatYacht]

:lmao

I'd be curious to know how many French you know tbh...

:lol Philippines
:lol

[DMC]

Objective killed DMC in this thread.

Yeah he did a bang up job. The old "no quote" response so hopefully I go away...

Spurs culture is on full display now. Stand pat, use what you have, wait for opportunities. They buy when the time is right. Sometimes they fuck it up, but usually not. Their championship window is basically closed, but they can still be competitive.

Their culture isn't from any player. It's from the ownership that allows the management to manage, and the management that allows the coaches to coach. They all do their jobs, and that filters down to the team who carries out the coaches' plans, unlike most other team. SA is one of the very few modern NBA teams with a coach who actually runs the team instead of being just a cheerleader who speaks to media with a different albeit submissive message than their players, that is until it's time for some cute quip.

[cutewizard]

Yeah he did a bang up job. The old "no quote" response so hopefully I go away...

Spurs culture is on full display now. Stand pat, use what you have, wait for opportunities. They buy when the time is right. Sometimes they fuck it up, but usually not. Their championship window is basically closed, but they can still be competitive.

Their culture isn't from any player. It's from the ownership that allows the management to manage, and the management that allows the coaches to coach. They all do their jobs, and that filters down to the team who carries out the coaches' plans, unlike most other team. SA is one of the very few modern NBA teams with a coach who actually runs the team instead of being just a cheerleader who speaks to media with a different albeit submissive message than their players, that is until it's time for some cute quip.


--------------------------------

:bobo

[objective]

:lol

Now I guess the only way to have discussion is non-stop quoting and notification checking

Or we could just read ...

Editing quotes down and sectioning them on mobile is a hassle, and once a subject is broached, I often don't quote something if it's not a direct follow up or very short. I also don't bother with those bolded mentions on mobile, or a lot of features.

I also have never had an avatar, and haven't regularly used my signature in many years, even though it's just text

Nobody wants me to direct quote and tear apart line by line, the people on this forum can't handle that hot fire

[dabom]

You are not a high IQ poster. :lol

[DenialTwist]

Parker isn't coming back. January is just wishful thinking. Coming off an injury as devastating as a ruptured quad tendon will be extremely hard at age 35. He was already struggling with speed and quickness, that's gone now.

[DMC]

:lol

Now I guess the only way to have discussion is non-stop quoting and notification checking

Or we could just read ...

Editing quotes down and sectioning them on mobile is a hassle, and once a subject is broached, I often don't quote something if it's not a direct follow up or very short. I also don't bother with those bolded mentions on mobile, or a lot of features.

I also have never had an avatar, and haven't regularly used my signature in many years, even though it's just text

Nobody wants me to direct quote and tear apart line by line, the people on this forum can't handle that hot fire

You're obviously going to respond, and the "reply with quote" is just one more push of the button. You seem to find the emojis just fine.

So now you see the Spurs felt they needed to pay Patty to stay. A 4 year deal for 50 million. It's not going to make them contenders for the title, but it will help salve the hole at the PG position, and though Murray will see some minutes, Pop isn't paying Patty that much to relieve him.

[Snaq O'Meal]

You're obviously going to respond, and the "reply with quote" is just one more push of the button. You seem to find the emojis just fine.

So now you see the Spurs felt they needed to pay Patty to stay. A 4 year deal for 50 million. It's not going to make them contenders for the title, but it will help salve the hole at the PG position, and though Murray will see some minutes, Pop isn't paying Patty that much to relieve him.

But the Pork's contract is still on the books. By paying Fatty that shitload of money, resources are now tied up in underperforming assets.

Poop should get over himself and implement Phil's triangle offence that maximizes the output of his star wing without heavy involvement of midget guards.

[objective]

You're obviously going to respond, and the "reply with quote" is just one more push of the button. You seem to find the emojis just fine.

So now you see the Spurs felt they needed to pay Patty to stay. A 4 year deal for 50 million. It's not going to make them contenders for the title, but it will help salve the hole at the PG position, and though Murray will see some minutes, Pop isn't paying Patty that much to relieve him.

With Emojis, I type the code. It's easy to add a colon to the front of lol and make ... :lol

When I have discussions in a thread, a very easy indication for me to check a thread to see if discussion is ongoing, is to see the 'last post by' part from the main page. What happens is, if I see that I'm not the last poster .... That's how I know that I didn't shut the thread down and that it might be something worth reading.

It's sad to attack me with some imaginary motive and invented reasons like me somehow hiding a post from you. My last post was immediately after yours. You could see you weren't the last to post just by looking at the main page ... How is my posting directly after you in any way a tactic to get you to go away?

I didn't boast or claim victory after, that was someone else. Why would I give a damn? If you want me to quote you an even earlier post i made you didn't address I can do that, but what's the point?

And funny that you acknowledge that this makes them non contenders, which was my point all along. We now agree on something.

[ceperez]

Parker isn't coming back. January is just wishful thinking. Coming off an injury as devastating as a ruptured quad tendon will be extremely hard at age 35. He was already struggling with speed and quickness, that's gone now.

It will take a miracle for him to come back. Spurs are just being generous by not having him retire.

With the Patty signing, Manu may likely come back. Spurs are really short now with veteran leadership. We can't expect much from Aldridge or Green in that department.

[BackHome]

Yeah I Had a friend with the same injury happened during soccer game he never came back to what he was and it took him two years just be be semi completative on the field.

[Atl Spur]

Yeah he did a bang up job. The old "no quote" response so hopefully I go away...

Spurs culture is on full display now. Stand pat, use what you have, wait for opportunities. They buy when the time is right. Sometimes they fuck it up, but usually not. Their championship window is basically closed, but they can still be competitive.

Their culture isn't from any player. It's from the ownership that allows the management to manage, and the management that allows the coaches to coach. They all do their jobs, and that filters down to the team who carries out the coaches' plans, unlike most other team. SA is one of the very few modern NBA teams with a coach who actually runs the team instead of being just a cheerleader who speaks to media with a different albeit submissive message than their players, that is until it's time for some cute quip.

There will be changes in the next few days I'm thinking and I'm thinking multiple😉

[DMC]

With Emojis, I type the code. It's easy to add a colon to the front of lol and make ... :lol

When I have discussions in a thread, a very easy indication for me to check a thread to see if discussion is ongoing, is to see the 'last post by' part from the main page. What happens is, if I see that I'm not the last poster .... That's how I know that I didn't shut the thread down and that it might be something worth reading.

It's sad to attack me with some imaginary motive and invented reasons like me somehow hiding a post from you. My last post was immediately after yours. You could see you weren't the last to post just by looking at the main page ... How is my posting directly after you in any way a tactic to get you to go away?

I didn't boast or claim victory after, that was someone else. Why would I give a damn? If you want me to quote you an even earlier post i made you didn't address I can do that, but what's the point?

And funny that you acknowledge that this makes them non contenders, which was my point all along. We now agree on something.

I didn't acknowledge that "this" makes them non-contenders. I have said plenty of times that they are non-contenders regardless. CP3 wouldn't have changed that. He couldn't make any team he's been on a legit contender. He's not a system guy, he's a CP3 guy. He's effective because of how he plays, not because of how they play.

There wasn't a legit free agent this year who could have leveled the Spurs with the Warriors, and I am in the "fool's gold" camp regarding the early point differential in game 1 of the WCF. Spurs had no chance to beat Golden State. They were struggling with Memphis and Houston until James Harden basically quit.

[DMC]

There will be changes in the next few days I'm thinking and I'm thinking multiple��

I wouldn't doubt it, but if you're part of the Tim Duncan jersey retirement ceremony, you probably won't get waived or traded the following season.

[objective]

I wouldn't doubt it, but if you're part of the Tim Duncan jersey retirement ceremony, you probably won't get waived or traded the following season.

Malik Rose was host of the Robinson jersey retirement if I recall correctly and he was traded the next year

[DMC]

Malik Rose was host of the Robinson jersey retirement if I recall correctly and he was traded the next year

Pop wasn't David's mentor.

[objective]

Pop wasn't David's mentor.

Ahh, a new qualifier.

It doesn't make any sense, but I guess ...?

[noles1983]

Fuck you Parker, retire you selfish ****.

[gambit1990]

his lateral quickness defensively was already pretty bad.

[MultiTroll]

Where does this rank on the All Time Rip Offs of Spurs salary?

[gambit1990]

Where does this rank on the All Time Rip Offs of Spurs salary?
maybe all the parker fans who were against moving him can answer that one.

[therealtruth]

If he uses his time off to work on his range it could be a benefit. It will also help him mitigate his lost speed.

[FkLA]

I wouldn't doubt it, but if you're part of the Tim Duncan jersey retirement ceremony, you probably won't get waived or traded the following season.


Malik Rose was host of the Robinson jersey retirement if I recall correctly and he was traded the next year


Pop wasn't David's mentor.


Ahh, a new qualifier.

It doesn't make any sense, but I guess ...?

:lol

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Are people still debating whether Parker will be traded or stretched? :lmao

[BackHome]

If we can trade Sean ****** and tried trading David Robinson then we can trade an injured Parker.

[cd98]

I think if the right deal came, they would trade Parker but they aren't dumping him to win a bidding war for Rudy Gay.

[DMC]

Ahh, a new qualifier.

It doesn't make any sense, but I guess ...?

Why?

Did you see Pop standing on the stage when David was inducted into the HOF? It's not a new qualifier. It's an existing one you didn't consider. I didn't say "Pop won't trade Tony if Pop is Tony's mentor". I said Pop won't trade Tony. If you were on the floor with Tim during the jersey retirement, you are not going to be traded. That would be Manu and Tony. They aren't going to be traded. I cannot speak for RC though.

Pop will not trade Tony Parker. If he was going to, he wouldn't have waited until he injured himself in a playoff game to do so. That's about as far from Gregg Popovich as anything.

[DMC]

:lol

What's funny?

I said "Tim Duncan" and objective said "David Robinson". That's moving the goalpost. I just explained why Pop wasn't as personally committed to David as he is to the big 3.

[tmtcsc]

Why?

Did you see Pop standing on the stage when David was inducted into the HOF? It's not a new qualifier. It's an existing one you didn't consider. I didn't say "Pop won't trade Tony if Pop is Tony's mentor". I said Pop won't trade Tony. If you were on the floor with Tim during the jersey retirement, you are not going to be traded. That would be Manu and Tony. They aren't going to be traded. I cannot speak for RC though.

Pop will not trade Tony Parker. If he was going to, he wouldn't have waited until he injured himself in a playoff game to do so. That's about as far from Gregg Popovich as anything.

I still hold out hope that the Spurs will send Parker's contract packing. Unfortunately, it may not happen. However, him not getting moved has nothing to do with loyalty. That's all fan bullshit. He's family, he's legacy...c'mon man, this is a business. The Spurs front office and coaching staff are committed to WINNING and committed to the players & ownership to give them the best chance to succeed. I've said it before, if you have a Kawhi Leonard on your team, a guy who will be a Free Agent in the next couple of years, you sure as shit better do everything you can to show him you are committed to winning. The Spurs aren't some retirement community for washed up players.

If the F.O. doesn't move Parker, it will be because there wasn't a good enough reason to. Had a player they targeted wanted to come to San Antonio, and that player was a difference maker, the Spurs would have done whatever it took to get rid of Parker's contract. Let's face it, no matter what TP says about coming back stronger than ever, no matter what local TV Sports hack (eh hem - Don Harris) says about owing TP more appreciation, he's done as an NBA player. I'm sure it be a sad day for those that respect and care about TP - the person (IDGAF because I don't know the guy), but he'd be moved in a heart beat to better the team.

** By the way, you are correct about Manu. He isn't going to be traded and will have a spot on the team as long as the price is right and he wants to play. He does more for the locker room and culture of the team than most people realize. That's not the case with Tony Parker. Just ask Brent Barry about what sort of teammate TP was.

[objective]

Why?

Did you see Pop standing on the stage when David was inducted into the HOF? It's not a new qualifier. It's an existing one you didn't consider. I didn't say "Pop won't trade Tony if Pop is Tony's mentor". I said Pop won't trade Tony. If you were on the floor with Tim during the jersey retirement, you are not going to be traded. That would be Manu and Tony. They aren't going to be traded. I cannot speak for RC though.

Pop will not trade Tony Parker. If he was going to, he wouldn't have waited until he injured himself in a playoff game to do so. That's about as far from Gregg Popovich as anything.

Here I am quoting a giant block of text when posting an hour later because you can't read any posts that don't give you a notification, as a courtesy. You still haven't apologized or acknowledged your mistake in asserting that I somehow hid a public post from you, and doubled down thinking you had somehow 'caught' me because I can type Emojis. But seeing how you post, maybe you aren't capable of doing so. Prove me wrong.

You flat out post a condition, which I'll post in quotation marks because using the forum tool is a hassle for me in mobile,

------ " if you're part of the Tim Duncan jersey retirement ceremony, you probably won't get waived or traded the following season." --------

I directly refute that with a direct comparison to another Spurs legend and his retirement ceremony. It's not a big deal, but worth noting if that's what your basing your 'probably' on. It might just change a probably to a maybe, or something else. But if we're being historically accurate, a presenter at the retirement of a Spurs legend is fact, though only if my memory is right about Rose. And if I was proven wrong, I would admit it and not come up with some excuse.

So then your response, which doesn't make sense. I'll explain:

What does Pop being a mentor have to do with anything in your first post?

I'm not being argumentative, it's just not clear to me. You write that it's an existing thing that I just didn't consider. So ...

Whose mentor was he? Are you talking about Parker? I could see that being their relationship as Parker was so young ... But you can't be, because you bring up Robinson and your follow up says it's not Parker. David​ is the Duncan equivalent in that he was the one retiring.

So if David did have Pop as a mentor ... Rose wouldn't have been traded?

Is that it?

First, the use of mentor between 2 separate vocations, coach and player, is a little odd. When you type mentor and Spurs in Google, all the initial results I see tie mentorship to job: coaches as mentor to coaches, players as mentors to players. Try it yourself. Pop as mentor to Kerr, to Brett Brown, to Bud, Larry Brown to Pop, and Robinson to Duncan, Duncan to Kawhi, etc. But if we set aside that oddity ...

David didn't have Pop as a mentor?

He was a coach of Robinson his rookie year, in fact his first three years in that important time for a young player. Especially as another veteran and military man.

Hell, Pop coached Robinson 10 of his 14 years, and was a part of his life as either coach or GM for 12 of Robinson's 14 years. Pop might have never been brought back without Robinson's approval. But Larry was his first coach and he asked him to be on stage at the speech. Maybe he asked Pop first? Maybe Pop wanted to sit and enjoy from the audience? Don't know.

Ohh, but Pop wasn't by his side on a stage 4.5 years AFTER his jersey retirement means that, wait, Rose isn't, uhh, Parker IS his mentor. Duncan's mentor? Parker is Duncan's mentor.

So because 5 years from now Pop COULD be at Duncan's Hall of Fame induction, ON STAGE OF COURSE BECAUSE IT DOESN'T COUNT OTHERWISE OBVIOUSLY BECAUSE POP WAS IN THE DAMN AUDIENCE CLAPPING AND GRINNING FOR DAVID AND THAT DOESN'T COUNT, that makes it so clear that somehow Parker, who may or may not be Malik Rose's mentor won't be traded.

I think I get it now.

It couldn't have been a new qualifier to get out of certain facts that make your previous condition look shaky.

Everyone on this forum except me clearly understood the point you were making because of the natural implication. Everyone except me know that when someone posts,

---" if you're part of the Tim Duncan jersey retirement ceremony, you probably won't get waived or traded the following season."---

that what people should obviously take away and read into the clearly implied qualifier is this:

" if you're part of the Tim Duncan jersey retirement ceremony, you probably won't get waived or traded the following season. (This does not apply to players whose coaches 5 years later are in the audience of the Hall of Fame speech but not on on stage, if that coach is the mentor of a player who had his number retired but not in the hall of fame, because RC Buford is influenced by the events of the future ... But also if coach isn't on stage in the future that doesn't count either?)

My mistake.

Now do I think the Spurs will trade Parker? No. And it's not because 5 years from now Pop might or might not be on stage with Duncan, who isn't even the player we're talking about.

That's why it didn't make sense.

If other people chime in and post that they understood it and it made perfect sense, then I was wrong and I apologize.

[objective]

Bogut was there 4 years. He was hardly baked into the culture. Patty has 6 with the Spurs and he's still culturally on the fringe. Warriors signed Kevin Durant. Do you think Paul George or Chris Paul are coming to the Spurs? If so I'd be all for releasing Mills. Otherwise, you'll just have a new meh level player trying to fit into the system.

If Manu retires and Tony isn't there most of the season, Patty is the vet on the team, same number of years as Kawhi Leonard. Only Green has been there longer but even then Danny is hardly a floor general. You cannot expect Murray to be a floor general and lead the team. Kawhi is too introverted to rally the troops, just leads by example.

Unless you want wholesale slaughter of the team, you're not improving by moving Patty out for some washed up player from the bottom of the list.


Another thing about culture and winning:

Very little culture continuity on the 03 title team. Only guys with more than 3 years were Duncan, Robinson, and Rose.

3/5ths of the starters and 6th man wing had 1 year or less experience in the system, and ditto for the some other key back ups

Bowen, 1 year going into 02/03
Parker, 1 year
Jackson, 1 year where he almost never played and was inactive most of the time
Manu, 0 years
Willis, 0 years primary back up center
Speedy, 0 years, primary back up point guard
Kerr, 3* years, wasn't on team the prior season
Smith, 1 year
Ferry, 2 years
Bateer, 0 years

You clearly never saw this one either because it didn't have a direct quote in it, so for your benefit I'll resurrect it.

I establish that the 03 team had very little culture continuity yet still won the title.

Am I wrong?

[DMC]

Here I am quoting a giant block of text when posting an hour later because you can't read any posts that don't give you a notification, as a courtesy. You still haven't apologized or acknowledged your mistake in asserting that I somehow hid a public post from you, and doubled down thinking you had somehow 'caught' me because I can type Emojis. But seeing how you post, maybe you aren't capable of doing so. Prove me wrong.

You flat out post a condition, which I'll post in quotation marks because using the forum tool is a hassle for me in mobile,

------ " if you're part of the Tim Duncan jersey retirement ceremony, you probably won't get waived or traded the following season." --------

I directly refute that with a direct comparison to another Spurs legend and his retirement ceremony. It's not a big deal, but worth noting if that's what your basing your 'probably' on. It might just change a probably to a maybe, or something else. But if we're being historically accurate, a presenter at the retirement of a Spurs legend is fact, though only if my memory is right about Rose. And if I was proven wrong, I would admit it and not come up with some excuse.

So then your response, which doesn't make sense. I'll explain:

What does Pop being a mentor have to do with anything in your first post?

I'm not being argumentative, it's just not clear to me. You write that it's an existing thing that I just didn't consider. So ...

Whose mentor was he? Are you talking about Parker? I could see that being their relationship as Parker was so young ... But you can't be, because you bring up Robinson and your follow up says it's not Parker. David​ is the Duncan equivalent in that he was the one retiring.

So if David did have Pop as a mentor ... Rose wouldn't have been traded?

Is that it?

First, the use of mentor between 2 separate vocations, coach and player, is a little odd. When you type mentor and Spurs in Google, all the initial results I see tie mentorship to job: coaches as mentor to coaches, players as mentors to players. Try it yourself. Pop as mentor to Kerr, to Brett Brown, to Bud, Larry Brown to Pop, and Robinson to Duncan, Duncan to Kawhi, etc. But if we set aside that oddity ...

David didn't have Pop as a mentor?

He was a coach of Robinson his rookie year, in fact his first three years in that important time for a young player. Especially as another veteran and military man.

Hell, Pop coached Robinson 10 of his 14 years, and was a part of his life as either coach or GM for 12 of Robinson's 14 years. Pop might have never been brought back without Robinson's approval. But Larry was his first coach and he asked him to be on stage at the speech. Maybe he asked Pop first? Maybe Pop wanted to sit and enjoy from the audience? Don't know.

Ohh, but Pop wasn't by his side on a stage 4.5 years AFTER his jersey retirement means that, wait, Rose isn't, uhh, Parker IS his mentor. Duncan's mentor? Parker is Duncan's mentor.

So because 5 years from now Pop COULD be at Duncan's Hall of Fame induction, ON STAGE OF COURSE BECAUSE IT DOESN'T COUNT OTHERWISE OBVIOUSLY BECAUSE POP WAS IN THE DAMN AUDIENCE CLAPPING AND GRINNING FOR DAVID AND THAT DOESN'T COUNT, that makes it so clear that somehow Parker, who may or may not be Malik Rose's mentor won't be traded.

I think I get it now.

It couldn't have been a new qualifier to get out of certain facts that make your previous condition look shaky.

Everyone on this forum except me clearly understood the point you were making because of the natural implication. Everyone except me know that when someone posts,

---" if you're part of the Tim Duncan jersey retirement ceremony, you probably won't get waived or traded the following season."---

that what people should obviously take away and read into the clearly implied qualifier is this:

" if you're part of the Tim Duncan jersey retirement ceremony, you probably won't get waived or traded the following season. (This does not apply to players whose coaches 5 years later are in the audience of the Hall of Fame speech but not on on stage, if that coach is the mentor of a player who had his number retired but not in the hall of fame, because RC Buford is influenced by the events of the future ... But also if coach isn't on stage in the future that doesn't count either?)

My mistake.

Now do I think the Spurs will trade Parker? No. And it's not because 5 years from now Pop might or might not be on stage with Duncan, who isn't even the player we're talking about.

That's why it didn't make sense.

If other people chime in and post that they understood it and it made perfect sense, then I was wrong and I apologize.

This is a huge wall of text.

What does Tim Duncan's jersey retirement have to do with David's jersey retirement?

You're using a fallacy called "affirming the consequent"

Premise: Anyone on the floor with Tim Duncan during his jersey retirement won't be waived or traded
Premise: Tim Duncan is a Spurs legend
Premise: David Robinson is a Spurs legend
Conclusion: Anyone on the floor with David Robinson during his jersey retirement won't be waived or traded.

[DMC]

You clearly never saw this one either because it didn't have a direct quote in it, so for your benefit I'll resurrect it.

I establish that the 03 team had very little culture continuity yet still won the title.

Am I wrong?

You seem to move the goalposts a lot.

The culture argument /= the winning argument.

There have been many teams who won it all who were recently put together. Ever hear the culture argument for the Heatles? How about the 2009 Celtics? Of course not.

Teams with overwhelming talent don't need to rely on team chemistry/culture to be successful. Typically teams have culture, players have to be there a while to become part of it. Teams that move coaches, GMs and players every few years don't ever have a chance to develop a culture.

This one you quoted above, why should I have responded to it? It wasn't addressed to me. If you don't quote someone, they really have no reason to assume you're responding to them, especially in a thread with many responses.

[TheDoctor]

You guys drunk or nah?

[objective]

This is a huge wall of text.

What does Tim Duncan's jersey retirement have to do with David's jersey retirement?

You're using a fallacy called "affirming the consequent"

Premise: Anyone on the floor with Tim Duncan during his jersey retirement won't be waived or traded
Premise: Tim Duncan is a Spurs legend
Premise: David Robinson is a Spurs legend
Conclusion: Anyone on the floor with David Robinson during his jersey retirement won't be waived or traded.


You seem to move the goalposts a lot.

The culture argument /= the winning argument.

There have been many teams who won it all who were recently put together. Ever hear the culture argument for the Heatles? How about the 2009 Celtics? Of course not.

Teams with overwhelming talent don't need to rely on team chemistry/culture to be successful. Typically teams have culture, players have to be there a while to become part of it. Teams that move coaches, GMs and players every few years don't ever have a chance to develop a culture.

This one you quoted above, why should I have responded to it? It wasn't addressed to me. If you don't quote someone, they really have no reason to assume you're responding to them, especially in a thread with many responses.

I'll just leave it all here for everyone else to see for themselves, no one else cares though probably.

First, you are so bothered by a month old Post that didn't quote you that you felt compelled to resurrect this thread and accuse me if hiding public posts in a discussion no one cared about for 4 weeks

Then when I direct quote them for you to read these supposed inflammatory secret posts, you shrug off like you did read them and didn't care. But you were still bent enough to resurrect and falsely accuse me.

I'll just leave this discussion behind, everyone who can read posts, including ones they're not tagged in, can make up their own minds.

[tonight...you]

You guys drunk or nah?
We should be drunk, my bruddah.
Right about now? We should be starting a shitface night and using the 4th to recover.

Thankfully I am here to shepherd the lost, in the desert.

Wait... no I'm not, I'm about to head out in a second!

[gambit1990]

He gonna do big things on that second unit.
:lol