Is gutting the team for CP3 worth it?

[tbear280]

Had Kawhi and tony not gotten hurt we had a 50/50 chance of making it to the finals. With that being said, is it worth stripping apart the team to bring in a 32 year old pg? Smh, I just don't think it's worth it. I think there are players we should let go or try to trade, but I don't think the whole team needs to be overhauled with them being so close...

[poop]

Fuck no.

End thread.

[NASpurs]

:lol gutting the team when it's really Kawhi and everyone else (mostly over the hill players and a bunch of D-Leaguers)

[RD2191]

What exactly will we be gutting? The shit that surrounds Kawhi? If so then yes, it's definitely worth it.

[Russ]

Not gutting the team for CP3 is not worth it.

[Spur|n|Austin]

Yes

[Ron Swanson]

We need to gut ST.

[raybies]

We need to gut ST.
not enough people. sometimes you got to buy the cheap bacon cause thats all you can afford. cant trim the fat off it cause if you do theres nothing left tbh

[Mikeanaro]

As long as LMAO is out.

[Dex]

I feel like it's a roll of the dice...but it may be warranted.

Everyone has gotten enamored with the first half of Game 1, but...that still did not guarantee that we would beat the Warriors. What is even more disturbing, though...is how the team just completely fell apart without Kawhi.

That would not have happened with Duncan.

This team needs another leader who is hungry...and Paul fits the narrative.

Otherwise, we reload with what we have and hope for better luck next year.

[elemento]

:lol gutting the team when it's really Kawhi and everyone else (mostly over the hill players and a bunch of D-Leaguers)

this.

[baseline bum]

Um, Kawhi is the team. Everyone else is expendable.

[Darius Bieber]

lmao at posters actually saying they don't want one of the elite PGs in the league on our team. :lol Should be permabanned

[coachmac87]

lmao at posters actually saying they don't want one of the elite PGs in the league on our team. :lol Should be permabanned

You're a fucking troll....but I totally agree with this.

[tmtcsc]

What would it take to free up the space?

The other thing to consider - Is CP3 willing to sign at a discount for a chance to win? If so, what's his number?

Brooklyn (with former Spur Sean Marks at the helm) is willing to take on salary dumps for draft picks or young players. I think they have about 28 Million in space available. Would they / Could they take Parker, Green & Anderson and free up $28 million? The appealing thing for Nets is that it would only be for 1 year for Parker and maybe 1 with Danny (DG would most likely opt out). With Dedmon out, that would leave the Spurs approximately $33 million of space.

This would give Brooklyn all the flexibility in the world to go after Boogie Cousins, Blake Griffin or Paul George in 2018.

Is this a pipe dream? Would Brooklyn even consider this?

[Chinook]

Not for Paul. If CP3 signs with the Spurs, in two years people will be convinced that Kawhi sucks and Paul is the only thing holding the team together. We've seen this shit from him twice already.

There are guys you "blow it up" for. Like if John Wall were on the market and you could get him and Kawhi together for eight years, then you go for it. But an old Paul who dominates the ball, makes guys hate him and can't get out of the second round? Not sure I'm on that train. It's one thing to add him to Kawhi and role-players. It's another to think he's a "get him and figure the rest out later" guy.

[mudyez]

Just No!

Nein, nö, bitte nicht!

[tmtcsc]

Not for Paul. If CP3 signs with the Spurs, in two years people will be convinced that Kawhi sucks and Paul is the only thing holding the team together. We've seen this shit from him twice already.

There are guys you "blow it up" for. Like if John Wall were on the market and you could get him and Kawhi together for eight years, then you go for it. But an old Paul who dominates the ball, makes guys hate him and can't get out of the second round? Not sure I'm on that train. It's one thing to add him to Kawhi and role-players. It's another to think he's a "get him and figure the rest out later" guy.

What players hate Chris Paul? I heard he can be a dick but is it because he's been playing with knuckleheads who don't understand the game? Is it because he's a leader? CP3 made Deandre Jordan an all-star. He almost single-handedly beat the Spurs in the first round 2 years ago. The Spurs need a leader on the court to make up for KL's quietness.

[coachmac87]

Not for Paul. If CP3 signs with the Spurs, in two years people will be convinced that Kawhi sucks and Paul is the only thing holding the team together. We've seen this shit from him twice already.

There are guys you "blow it up" for. Like if John Wall were on the market and you could get him and Kawhi together for eight years, then you go for it. But an old Paul who dominates the ball, makes guys hate him and can't get out of the second round? Not sure I'm on that train. It's one thing to add him to Kawhi and role-players. It's another to think he's a "get him and figure the rest out later" guy.


What point guard doesn't dominate the ball? And who else on the Clippers would you want controlling the rock?!

And stop BSin it's all about Paul's age and $$. Nothing to do with style of play because you mentioned Wall who is also ball dominant or even a Westbrook..and neither can play off the ball or shoot which the Spurs need if Kawhi is going to handle the rock

[Chinook]

What players hate Chris Paul? I heard he can be a dick but is it because he's been playing with knuckleheads who don't understand the game? Is it because he's a leader? CP3 made Deandre Jordan an all-star. He almost single-handedly beat the Spurs in the first round 2 years ago. The Spurs need a leader on the court to make up for KL's quietness.

Do you not see how arrogant that would come off as if it were Paul who said that instead of you? No one on his team has been playing the game for less than 10 years. Hell, some might have been playing for 20 years. They don't need a guy holding the ball until they get into a place where he can get an assist or yelling at them like they're kids if they aren't where he expects them to be. It's just shameful. There's no doubt that Paul is a talented player, but you can watch him, even at his best, and see a guy who's majorly contrary to what the Spurs do.
.

[Chinook]

What point guard doesn't dominate the ball? And who else on the Clippers would you want controlling the rock?!

And stop BSin it's all about Paul's age and $$. Nothing to do with style of play because you mentioned Wall who is also ball dominant or even a Westbrook..and neither can play off the ball or shoot which the Spurs need if Kawhi is going to handle the rock

Blake's actually a very good play-maker for his position. He has the similar game to other forwards like Melo and even Kawhi, though Leonard is more of a willing shooter, and Griffin has more size and athleticism. Paul isn't one of those guys who passes the ball as part of an offense. He just dribbles and points and then runs a PnR. Not even Prime Tony was that bad.

[ducks]

gs gutted their debth and filled in later for Durant
not sure I am on board with cp3
I would get better talent with 2 or 3 people then cp3

[blizz]

If he does come here I bet we get our share of ring chasers on the cheap to fill out the roster. Look it's either join GS, Clev or the Spurs if you want a serious chance of winning.

[cd98]

I love Chris Paul's game, but will I love it in two years when his play dips and everyone comes after him with knives for not passing to Kawhi enough and dribbling too much?

[spursistan]

When 40yo Manu and a career D-Leaguer are creating your offense in a Conference Finals there is really not much to be gutted after Kawhi :lol..

Yeah, let's turn down a Top 3 All-time PG, who even at 33-36 yo, will likely be more impactful player than any of these second/3rd tier PGS in their prime (Jrue, Bledose..etc)..

Stop pretending we are doing it for Larmarsha Aldridge..

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C-w-JnZXkAIpwCZ.jpg

[raybies]

Blake's actually a very good play-maker for his position. He has the similar game to other forwards like Melo and even Kawhi, though Leonard is more of a willing shooter, and Griffin has more size and athleticism. Paul isn't one of those guys who passes the ball as part of an offense. He just dribbles and points and then runs a PnR. Not even Prime Tony was that bad.
I think Doc enabling him a lot has something to do with it. His system is very basic and the pick and roll is as effective an offense as their is. I suspect it's more efficient than say a Blake post up, which isn't as deadly. I think most teams would play him straight and live with the results as opposed to a Paul pick and roll which would open up more options. Paul is probably best in the league at probing a pick and lethal with space. On the other hand Kawhi is as efficient as they come in posts, picks, and isos. That's a much better option than Blake. It's Kawhi's team and I'm sure he knows that. They won more games without him then his current team with him. It's not hard to understand. There's a learning curve and it'll take time to find their spots but he is a player to make a move for imo. You probably losing Mills and Simmons regardless, Manu ought to retire or come back at the minimum, Dedmon opted out, Lee likely opting in, then you lose Pau which is probably not a big deal unless you have to attach a pick, and the final piece is Parker who should absolutely not be traded. The right thing to do is have him waived and stretched and tell him to rehab for a year and then sign him back.

Foundation would look like this:

Paul/Murray
Green/Forbes
Leonard/Anderson
Aldridge/Bertans
Lee

Anderson could even start but ideally you'd want a finishing big like Dedmon. Paul could probably make him an All Star. Not literally.

You'd still have the room exception for Hanga. You'd most likely have to trade this years pick or trade down or draft and stash and Milutinov would have to wait one more year but that's fine.

and if you lose Simmons two way play for CP3's who would you rather have.

i would assume there would be plenty of FA's that would take less and accept the challenge of taking out the Warriors. Heck Dedmon might come back to play with Paul and start.

this is what I gather from what I read correct me if I'm wrong. It's not as bad as it sounds considering. We can keep your boy Danny. He'd probably return to Finals form with all the looks.

Edit: GS was gutted for KD. They got players like Clark, West, McGee and to a lesser extent Mccaw, since he is a rookie, playing important rotation minutes. Paul, Kawhi, and Aldridge in their ideal roles would be good enough to surround with less imo. You'd still have Danny too. How much more would you need than a random dude just hitting an open shot tbh

[tholdren]

Do you not see how arrogant that would come off as if it were Paul who said that instead of you? No one on his team has been playing the game for less than 10 years. Hell, some might have been playing for 20 years. They don't need a guy holding the ball until they get into a place where he can get an assist or yelling at them like they're kids if they aren't where he expects them to be. It's just shameful. There's no doubt that Paul is a talented player, but you can watch him, even at his best, and see a guy who's majorly contrary to what the Spurs do.
.
So because its arrogant/true he shouldnt say it? Id take paul for the right price

[TD 21]

Definitely . . .

- Gutting is overstating it, since the only real difficult move, would be jettisoning either Parker or Green, for different and obvious reasons. Parker would seem the logical one, but they'd have to attach a 1st to salary dump him, whereas with Green, he could actually be turned into a quality asset. The issue would be the lack of replacements. It would likely be either Sefolosha (sub par shooter) or Afflalo (sub par defender).

- More than ever, it's a superstar driven league. The Warriors would obviously still be the favorites, but a Leonard-Paul-Aldridge core, would have a chance.

- Depth issue is being overstated too: Murray and Bertans are two intriguing young pieces, they've got all picks going forward, a history of unearthing gems and veteran ring chasers would inevitably flock to fill the holes.

- Everyone talks about Paul's age and mileage, but he hasn't really shown any significant signs of decline and Stockton, who was similar, never really did in 19 seasons. Maybe he can hold at least close to current form for 4 more seasons and if not, what's the alternative: Wait 2-4 seasons until Aldridge and Green are clearly past prime and hope Murray can become 2/3 or 3/4 as good as Paul?

Still can't imagine it happens, for all the reasons that have been discussed ad nauseam, but I will say, Paul clearly burns deep in his desire to win and he has to realize that the only avenue to even having a chance, is to make this move.

[coachmac87]

Blake's actually a very good play-maker for his position. He has the similar game to other forwards like Melo and even Kawhi, though Leonard is more of a willing shooter, and Griffin has more size and athleticism. Paul isn't one of those guys who passes the ball as part of an offense. He just dribbles and points and then runs a PnR. Not even Prime Tony was that bad.

Stop comparing small forwards to a power forward...

And I'm referring to perimeter players for the Clippers that can make plays or create..there is none. And Paul hasn't played with a wing like Kawhi so there's a reason behind the madness

[BatManu20]

No-brainer imo.

[-21-]

:lol gutting the team when it's really Kawhi and everyone else (mostly over the hill players and a bunch of D-Leaguers)


What exactly will we be gutting? The shit that surrounds Kawhi? If so then yes, it's definitely worth it.


Um, Kawhi is the team. Everyone else is expendable.
:tu

I know CP3 isn't the most likable player, but he's still one of the top PGs in the league. The Warriors didn't think twice about 'gutting' their team for Durant. Granted, Durant > Paul, but Bogut/Barnes/Barbosa = Mills/Gasol/whoever else. Plus, even if you 'gut' the team, the replacements you get will benefit from playing alongside CP3.

[BatManu20]

Chris Paul as the 2nd option on a team with a budding superstar in Kawhi Leonard, dipped in Spurs' culture with LMA as the 3rd option would be so much better than anything we have now, tbh.. 40 year-old Manu and Jonathon Simmons were our go-to guys/offensive creators after Kawhi went down.. Parker is 35 and when he returns from a serious injury, I imagine he'd be nothing more than a backup at this point anyways. I'm thankful for everything Tony has done for this franchise obviously, but it's time to focus on developing Murray, whether CP3 is here or not.

[coachmac87]

Definitely . . .

- Gutting is overstating it, since the only real difficult move, would be jettisoning either Parker or Green, for different and obvious reasons. Parker would seem the logical one, but they'd have to attach a 1st to salary dump him, whereas with Green, he could actually be turned into a quality asset. The issue would be the lack of replacements. It would likely be either Sefolosha (sub par shooter) or Afflalo (sub par defender).

- More than ever, it's a superstar driven league. The Warriors would obviously still be the favorites, but a Leonard-Paul-Aldridge core, would have a chance.

- Depth issue is being overstated too: Murray and Bertans are two intriguing young pieces, they've got all picks going forward, a history of unearthing gems and veteran ring chasers would inevitably flock to fill the holes.

- Everyone talks about Paul's age and mileage, but he hasn't really shown any significant signs of decline and Stockton, who was similar, never really did in 19 seasons. Maybe he can hold at least close to current form for 4 more seasons and if not, what's the alternative: Wait 2-4 seasons until Aldridge and Green are clearly past prime and hope Murray can become 2/3 or 3/4 as good as Paul?

Still can't imagine it happens, for all the reasons that have been discussed ad nauseam, but I will say, Paul clearly burns deep in his desire to win and he has to realize that the only avenue to even having a chance, is to make this move.

Paul and Stockton never relied on their athleticism....their shooting, vision, court awareness, passing and Paul handle won't leave him. Parker never had those qualities and his game solely relied on his quickness and finishing around the basket..so when he declined it's more obvious.

[Chinook]

Stop comparing small forwards to a power forward...

And I'm referring to perimeter players for the Clippers that can make plays or create..there is none. And Paul hasn't played with a wing like Kawhi so there's a reason behind the madness

? I'm sorry, but players can have similar games despite playing different positions. Blake is probably the most guard-like big in the league. I haven't exactly loved the way he's developed, but he certainly needs the ball more than you seem to think.

[-21-]

? I'm sorry, but players can have similar games despite playing different positions. Blake is probably the most guard-like big in the league. I haven't exactly loved the way he's developed, but he certainly needs the ball more than you seem to think.

Chinook, I agree with you that Paul holds the ball too much. But don't you think playing for Pop and alongside Kawhi will fix that?

[Clipper Nation]

Chinook, I agree with you that Paul holds the ball too much. But don't you think playing for Pop and alongside Kawhi will fix that?

That's never stopped Porker from doing his dribble-dribble-dribble heroball routine. Why would Choke Paul ever stop?

[Emperor]

So if they decide to keep Aldridge, and we lose Parker along with Manu and Gasol, should they make it next priority to keep Dedmon if possible? He would probably benefit quite abit having a pg like Paul.

[Chinook]

Chinook, I agree with you that Paul holds the ball too much. But don't you think playing for Pop and alongside Kawhi will fix that?

I don't think Pop will be in a position of power if they sign Paul. If they bring him it, it would be to mold the team around Paul's game, not the other way around.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3LupOkRCco

Again, this is him at his best, and it's just a better version of Rondo. It's even more Tony than Tony ever was.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2Jr0Kc9YHw

[coachmac87]

? I'm sorry, but players can have similar games despite playing different positions. Blake is probably the most guard-like big in the league. I haven't exactly loved the way he's developed, but he certainly needs the ball more than you seem to think.

Most guard like big in the league??? :lmao

You compared Kawhi/Melo to Blake...

That's a terrible comparison and their games are nothing a like...I respect your opinion but I think you're way off. Both Kawhi/Melo can handle the ball in PNR and can shoot 40% from 3.

Blake is a good passer but that's doesn't mean his game is wing oriented at all...

[coachmac87]

I don't think Pop will be in a position of power if they sign Paul. If they bring him it, it would be to mold the team around Paul's game, not the other way around.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3LupOkRCco

Again, this is him at his best, and it's just a better version of Rondo. It's even more Tony than Tony ever was.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2Jr0Kc9YHw


I don't see anything wrong with that....

[Clipper Nation]

I don't see anything wrong with that....

Just wait until he disappears in the playoffs, then you'll see something wrong with that.

[coachmac87]

Let's seriously cut all the BS and compare the fits on the court of Hill, Jrue, Paul, Rose, Teague or any PG available...

Paul is by far the best option on the court and people are using his age and $$ to justify the others being better fits on the court but they're not

[raybies]

Just wait until he disappears in the playoffs, then you'll see something wrong with that.
We'd have Kawhi tbh. He doesn't have that luxury with clippers. He has the whole team on his back. That's a lot of pressure. Why don't you look at Griffin who's getting the max, or DeAndre who's getting the max. It's just a bad mix of talent. We have Aldridge but as a third option we figure I'd work. He seems to be a better shooter Blake while Blake is better in the post.

[jermaine]

It sounds like we're losing our whole team anyway... meanwmeanwhile GS gets to pay the shit outta their players!?! Why not.... he definitely has heart!!

[marinoman]

Just wait until he disappears in the playoffs, then you'll see something wrong with that.
I doubt he's leaving. I know clip fans shit on him but don't you still want him or would you rather go in another direction

[TD 21]

That's never stopped Porker from doing his dribble-dribble-dribble heroball routine. Why would Choke Paul ever stop?

Because he's never played with another perimeter star, let alone superstar, this is Leonard's team and he's 6 years younger, so I'm pretty sure he'd acquiesce to a certain extent.


People are overthinking this whole thing. The most important question is, what's more likely to give them a chance at another championship in the foreseeable future? The answer is nothing. You don't pass up all-time talent in or near prime. If there's any chance of pulling this off, they need to pursue it.

[Keepin' it real]

We need to gut ST.

"Post of the year" candidate.

So simple, yet so brilliant.

[noles1983]

What exactly will we be gutting? The shit that surrounds Kawhi? If so then yes, it's definitely worth it.

This. Kawhi is surrounded by turds in a punch bowl. Half of our roster is too old or not good enough to play in the NBA.

[spursistan]

Definitely . . .

- Gutting is overstating it, since the only real difficult move, would be jettisoning either Parker or Green, for different and obvious reasons. Parker would seem the logical one, but they'd have to attach a 1st to salary dump him, whereas with Green, he could actually be turned into a quality asset. The issue would be the lack of replacements. It would likely be either Sefolosha (sub par shooter) or Afflalo (sub par defender).

- More than ever, it's a superstar driven league. The Warriors would obviously still be the favorites, but a Leonard-Paul-Aldridge core, would have a chance.

- Depth issue is being overstated too: Murray and Bertans are two intriguing young pieces, they've got all picks going forward, a history of unearthing gems and veteran ring chasers would inevitably flock to fill the holes.

- Everyone talks about Paul's age and mileage, but he hasn't really shown any significant signs of decline and Stockton, who was similar, never really did in 19 seasons. Maybe he can hold at least close to current form for 4 more seasons and if not, what's the alternative: Wait 2-4 seasons until Aldridge and Green are clearly past prime and hope Murray can become 2/3 or 3/4 as good as Paul?

Still can't imagine it happens, for all the reasons that have been discussed ad nauseam, but I will say, Paul clearly burns deep in his desire to win and he has to realize that the only avenue to even having a chance, is to make this move.

All of this..:tu,...Not to mention, why is everyone forgetting, by doing it, we essentially erase another Western Conference "contender" out of the picture-- one that has been a true pain in the ass for us in the in last 3 seasons?

[eDizzle20]

:lol gutting the team when it's really Kawhi and everyone else (mostly over the hill players and a bunch of D-Leaguers)
Exactly. All the guys they should keep (Murray and Bertrans) are on super cheap contracts. Simmons is going get paid and wouldn't be worth it. I would say keep LMA too if they land CP3 because his d is decent and would be a solid 3rd option.

[Clipper Nation]

We'd have Kawhi tbh. He doesn't have that luxury with clippers. He has the whole team on his back. That's a lot of pressure. Why don't you look at Griffin who's getting the max, or DeAndre who's getting the max. It's just a bad mix of talent. We have Aldridge but as a third option we figure I'd work. He seems to be a better shooter Blake while Blake is better in the post.

Choke-P will derail Kawhi's game and make him the scapegoat, just like he did to Blake. He puts the whole team on his back by choice because he's an egomaniac and a control freak, much like Peyton Manning always did. But then he disappears in the big moments and lets his teammates take all the blame. Blake and especially DJ aren't perfect, but neither is CP0. He holds plenty of responsibility for the Clippers' failure, and he's asking for the most money while being the oldest of the Big Three.

Just wait until he starts making ultimatums that make the Spurs worse. You know, like when he ordered the Clippers to bring in Doc. Or when he made us trade Bledsoe away for scraps because he was salty about getting outplayed by him in the playoffs. Maybe once he's trying to boss PATFO around instead of historically poor franchises like the Hornets and Clippers, Media will finally wake up to how toxic Choke Paul truly is.

[TheGreatYacht]

Posters not learning that gutting scrubs to get a superstar is worth it 10/10 times, just look at the finals :lol

Losing depth is overrated. Turning into a superteam will get you a fair amount of ring chasers and players looking to get paid after 1 year in your system. The "depth" we have now is easily replaceable.

This Warriors team is arguably the greatest team ever assembled. You won't beat them with your cute little role players, d-leaguers, and washed vets.

Kawhi needs a Kyrie to his Lebron.

[Chinook]

I don't see anything wrong with that....

Those are his highlights -- him at his best. Of course, when he makes every shot, there doesn't seem to be anything wrong with him hogging the ball. But despite being a great three-point shooter, the dude doesn't play off the ball at all. Blake is one of the best play-making bigs in the league (averaged five dimes a game), and Paul is not one of the guys who gets those dimes. Dude was only assisted on 23 percent of his shots last year. That's just abysmal.

[tmtcsc]

Do you not see how arrogant that would come off as if it were Paul who said that instead of you? No one on his team has been playing the game for less than 10 years. Hell, some might have been playing for 20 years. They don't need a guy holding the ball until they get into a place where he can get an assist or yelling at them like they're kids if they aren't where he expects them to be. It's just shameful. There's no doubt that Paul is a talented player, but you can watch him, even at his best, and see a guy who's majorly contrary to what the Spurs do.
.

Do you know how often Avery Johnson got in DRob's face and ripped him over and over? Called him some pretty unmentionable things. That was straight from Antonio Daniels. We all remember the brawl with Malik too. Type-A personalities can get a little combative. Having some fight wouldn't be a bad thing - especially if it means getting in Lamarcus' face.

[tmtcsc]

Exactly. All the guys they should keep (Murray and Bertrans) are on super cheap contracts. Simmons is going get paid and wouldn't be worth it. I would say keep LMA too if they land CP3 because his d is decent and would be a solid 3rd option.

I really like Simmons' potential and athletic ability but someone is most likely going to OVERPAY him. He's not proven that he can be consistent yet and he needs a lot of work on the offensive end. He's worth about 3 to 4 million per season at this point - for the Spurs anyways.

[Chinook]

Most guard like big in the league??? :lmao

You compared Kawhi/Melo to Blake...

That's a terrible comparison and their games are nothing a like...I respect your opinion but I think you're way off. Both Kawhi/Melo can handle the ball in PNR and can shoot 40% from 3.

Blake is a good passer but that's doesn't mean his game is wing oriented at all...

I think you only see Blake dunks if you think he doesn't have a perimeter-oriented game. Dude's a dribble-driver. And yes, he posts up just like Kawhi and Melo do. But he's a face-up guy at heart. And Blake shot 34 percent last year, so it's not like he doesn't shoot threes.

If anything, that's where most of his criticism lies. Instead of developing post moves like a big, he developed guard moves. With Paul on the floor, he just looks like a more athletic David Lee. But the dude is a completely different player without him.

[TheGreatYacht]

Bowen was dirty, Parker fucked wives, Green goes clubbing every day even with the enemy, SJax was a hot head, Aldridge has a huge ego, Ferry is a racist, Manure is illegal

"CP3 is contrary to what the Spurs do" :lol

[Chinook]

Do you know how often Avery Johnson got in DRob's face and ripped him over and over? Called him some pretty unmentionable things. That was straight from Antonio Daniels. We all remember the brawl with Malik too. Type-A personalities can get a little combative. Having some fight wouldn't be a bad thing - especially if it means getting in Lamarcus' face.

I mean, if we're trying to act like the team needs an Avery, I think we may as well just pack up our TVs and move along. It sounds all well and good for Paul to be a life coach for LMA, but what's going to happen when Paul starts getting in Kawhi's face bitching about got being able to hold the ball for 20 seconds of every shot clock? All that bullshit controversy that people try to start with Parker and Leonard may be real with Paul around.

[-21-]

Those are his highlights -- him at his best. Of course, when he makes every shot, there doesn't seem to be anything wrong with him hogging the ball. But despite being a great three-point shooter, the dude doesn't play off the ball at all. Blake is one of the best play-making bigs in the league (averaged five dimes a game), and Paul is not one of the guys who gets those dimes. Dude was only assisted on 23 percent of his shots last year. That's just abysmal.

Even with his dribble-dribble ways, don't you think the team would be better with him than without? Every player has their flaws...

Anyway, I understand why some are against going for him and I share the same concerns. Looking at the big picture though, the guy is a superstar. You can't just say no to that.

[spursistan]

Bowen was dirty, Parker fucked wives, Green goes clubbing every day even with the enemy, SJax was a hot head, Aldridge has a huge ego, Ferry is a racist, Manure is illegal

"CP3 is contrary to what the Spurs do" :lol

:lmao..

[Chinook]

Bowen was dirty, Parker fucked wives, Green goes clubbing every day even with the enemy, SJax was a hot head, Aldridge has a huge ego, Ferry is a racist, Manure is illegal

"CP3 is contrary to what the Spurs do" :lol

Couldn't name a single on-court thing? And yeah, Jack wasn't a Spurs culturally and got booted on his ass for it.

[raybies]

I mean, if we're trying to act like the team needs an Avery, I think we may as well just pack up our TVs and move along. It sounds all well and good for Paul to be a life coach for LMA, but what's going to happen when Paul starts getting in Kawhi's face bitching about got being able to hold the ball for 20 seconds of every shot clock? All that bullshit controversy that people try to start with Parker and Leonard may be real with Paul around.
you actually believe he would come here and want to be the man? if you have a half a brain, like pop likes to say, and he seems to have one, being a successful business man and apart of the union like he his, you'd think he'd figure that won't be the case. Pop already had this talk with LMA when he came. You don't think Pop would have mentioned anything like this to him in a potential meeting.

and lastly, what on earth would anyone have to say to KL. What does he do wrong? He plays both sides and is quiet. That argument, I'm not buying for a second.

[Chinook]

Even with his dribble-dribble ways, don't you think the team would be better with him than without? Every player has their flaws...

Anyway, I understand why some are against going for him and I share the same concerns. Looking at the big picture though, the guy is a superstar. You can't just say no to that.

If the choice is Paul or no PG, then that's one thing. But there are other options. If Pop is not going to move Parker to make most of the necessary salary to get Paul, I don't think it's worth it.

One of two things is true: Either the Spurs had a horrible core and Kawhi managed to do pretty easily what Paul has never been able to do with his own core, or the Spurs' core doesn't such an managed to do what Paul has never been able to do. Either one should give the team pause when it comes to giving up a lot to get Paul. Kawhi will not be the first All-NBA player Paul's played with. So to think you can just fill in the cracks around him is fallacy.

It's going to take the right guys to make it work.

[coachmac87]

Choke-P will derail Kawhi's game and make him the scapegoat, just like he did to Blake. He puts the whole team on his back by choice because he's an egomaniac and a control freak, much like Peyton Manning always did. But then he disappears in the big moments and lets his teammates take all the blame. Blake and especially DJ aren't perfect, but neither is CP0. He holds plenty of responsibility for the Clippers' failure, and he's asking for the most money while being the oldest of the Big Three.

Just wait until he starts making ultimatums that make the Spurs worse. You know, like when he ordered the Clippers to bring in Doc. Or when he made us trade Bledsoe away for scraps because he was salty about getting outplayed by him in the playoffs. Maybe once he's trying to boss PATFO around instead of historically poor franchises like the Hornets and Clippers, Media will finally wake up to how toxic Choke Paul truly is.

The only thing salty is you...

CP3 made the Clippers relevant again..not Doc, Jordan or Griffin CP3 did..

[SAGirl]

Chinook, I agree with you that Paul holds the ball too much. But don't you think playing for Pop and alongside Kawhi will fix that?

No.
Pop didn't fix Aldridge and his post ups, iso's and lack of passing. He is what he is at this point and so is CP3.
Spurs hope to mold a guy the way they want is Murray who is 20 years old and just learning this game and good habits with Pop. If he's not good enough then he's not good enough, but CP3 won't change for Pop... it will be more likely that Pop has to adapt schemes and things to suit him.. (the way he had to adjust and change the SL offense so that Lamarcus could play his game).

[coachmac87]

Those are his highlights -- him at his best. Of course, when he makes every shot, there doesn't seem to be anything wrong with him hogging the ball. But despite being a great three-point shooter, the dude doesn't play off the ball at all. Blake is one of the best play-making bigs in the league (averaged five dimes a game), and Paul is not one of the guys who gets those dimes. Dude was only assisted on 23 percent of his shots last year. That's just abysmal.


His off ball skills is his shooting ability something that neither Parker, Wall or Westbrook can do

[Chinook]

you actually believe he would come hear and want to be the man?

Yes, and I think Pop will want him to be. He's not going to tell Paul to play completely differently than he's always played. Now does that mean that Paul would be the leading scorer? No. But he would almost certainly have a higher usage than Kawhi.


if you have a half a brain, like pop likes to say, and he seems to have one, being a successful business man and apart of the union like he his, you'd think he'd figure that won't be the case

You say that, but it's just like with LMA not playing as the big, strong guy he is. The Spurs needs him to be more assertive and less with of the jump-shooter he's been for years. The offense would be much better if he rolled and forced the issue inside and ducked in. But nope. Same shit. Wouldn't be any different with Paul. Pop's coming to him trying to add his game to the team. No reason to change.


and lastly, what on earth would anyone have to say to KL. What does he do wrong? He plays both sides and is quiet. That argument, I'm not buying for a second.

This has nothing to do with Kawhi doing something wrong. This has everything to do with Paul wanting the ball and Kawhi needing the ball. If Leonard's shot is back, he'd probably be more efficient with Paul feeding him. But he's not going to do what he did in the playoffs. The Spurs need either a more balanced PG or a PG who moves the ball much faster than Paul does.

[Chinook]

His off ball skills is his shooting ability something that neither Parker, Wall or Westbrook can do

And yet he doesn't use them. Never plays off Blake at all. One of the best mid-range shooters in the league, but he's only assisted on an eighth of his twos. One of the best three-point shooters in the league, but nope, takes 3/5 of his threes without an assist. I was bitching about Jimmer shooting off-dribble threes, and even he has never dropped below 50 percent.

[coachmac87]

And yet he doesn't use them. Never plays off Blake at all. One of the best mid-range shooters in the league, but he's only assisted on an eighth of his twos. One of the best three-point shooters in the league, but nope, takes 3/5 of his threes without an assist. I was bitching about Jimmer shooting off-dribble threes, and even he has never dropped below 50 percent.

Oh but you're gonna ignore the players I listed? Just admit you don't want Paul cause of his age and $$.. not his style of play

[DesignatedT]

Yes, I say it's worth it. Especially if the Spurs can swing it by losing Green and Gasol. The other FA's are liable to leave anyway and I'm not sure I'd want to keep them at their rumored price tags at the end of the day. Paul-Leonard-Aldridge is a nice combo for a couple years - hopefully with the emergence of Murray as well, that can legitimately compete. Spurs can fill out the roster with former players, veteran ring chasers, and by way of the draft. CP3 and Kawhi will learn to play together, they both want to win.

If the Spurs run it back with minor changes, might as well throw in the towel for next year. Maybe they can build something better in 2018 but maybe not.

[RD2191]

Oh but you're gonna ignore the players I listed? Just admit you don't want Paul cause of his age and $$.. not his style of play

He doesn't want Paul because it probably means losing Danny Green. :lol

[raybies]

No.
Pop didn't fix Aldridge and his post ups, iso's and lack of passing. He is what he is at this point and so is CP3.
Spurs hope to mold a guy the way they want is Murray who is 20 years old and just learning this game and good habits with Pop. If he's not good enough then he's not good enough, but CP3 won't change for Pop... it will be more likely that Pop has to adapt schemes and things to suit him.. (the way he had to adjust and change the SL offense so that Lamarcus could play his game).
There was some effect though. He plays better defense now overall and he drives more to the basket or goes for more hook shots then he did in Portland where it was just mostly fade aways. Teams just double him now so he doesn't get those more quality looks and that's that. It is what it is with the passing and character wise he doesn't seem like a Spur and has his moments where he says things that are not Spurs-like. But there was definitely an effect the Spurs have had on him. Now the Spurs can't fix what a player never had, and i mean old vets like Paul, Aldridge, and Pau, but there are adjustments that can be made. I seriously doubt that Paul if wanting to come here wouldn't make the adjustment and do the "dribble dribble" less. Same thing with Parker. He still did it time to time but Pop got on him and and it happened less and less. It wouldn't disappear completely but an adjustment could definitely be made.

If y'all think Pop won't chew Paul out at this stage of his coaching career y'all are mistaken. Why would he care. Also I'm sure Paul will understand what to expect if he did came. Y'all act, and not you SAGirl specifically, like Paul is not all there mentally and can't grasp the Spurs system and that he's gonna control everything if he comes. He's leaving where he's at. Understand a little basic psychology. Even Lebron deferred to Wade when he first came to Miami, cause he knew it was Wade's team and Wade had already won a ship. The lost the title that year and Wade told Lebron it was his team. That's not happening here but the point is he's leaving his team as number one. He's coming here to fit into what we do because he believes we are closing to winning. In essence we are yoking him. The audacity one would have to come in and think your gonna run things like some of you suggest. He's not a little kid.

I just find it extremely hard to believe that he's not gonna buy in especially if he decides to leave all that money, all those relationships. If he leaves he's pretty much all in, don't you think. Anyways I'm not buying that argument whatsoever.

[Chinook]

Oh but you're gonna ignore the players I listed? Just admit you don't want Paul cause of his age and $$.. not his style of play

No, it's for his style of play. I ignored the players you listed, because we aren't talking about them. He has a better "outside game" than Parker, but Tony uses what he has more than Paul does. Westbrook is a chucker. Wall is almost as bad, but he's also much less differentiated, and he takes fewer (but still too many) unassisted threes.

[SAGirl]

I think you only see Blake dunks if you think he doesn't have a perimeter-oriented game. Dude's a dribble-driver. And yes, he posts up just like Kawhi and Melo do. But he's a face-up guy at heart. And Blake shot 34 percent last year, so it's not like he doesn't shoot threes.

If anything, that's where most of his criticism lies. Instead of developing post moves like a big, he developed guard moves. With Paul on the floor, he just looks like a more athletic David Lee. But the dude is a completely different player without him.

I personally prefer Blake to CP3 if we are honest and dislike Lamarcus offensive game a whole lot. I would switch those up and be happier.
If only Blake wasn't as injury prone and have rage issues.... but he's my favorite player in the Clippers... he's quite unique.

[yavozerb]

Yes, you need all-stars to compete with all stars. Surround him with 3 pt shooting and an athletic big. Kawhi works more down low instead of outside (where he was this year since he had to handle the ball so much),do it

[TheGreatYacht]

He doesn't want Paul because it probably means losing Danny Green. :lol

[coachmac87]

No, it's for his style of play. I ignored the players you listed, because we aren't talking about them. He has a better "outside game" than Parker, but Tony uses what he has more than Paul does. Westbrook is a chucker. Wall is almost as bad, but he's also much less differentiated, and he takes fewer (but still too many) unassisted threes.

Ok well what about the alternatives?? Hill, Holiday, Rose, Teague or any other Point you'd like to add to that list. With age and $$ aside you'd take one of those guys over Paul on the Spurs? If so...who?


And it's ok to admit it and pick Paul so we can move on and maybe talk about how Rasual Butler and Kevin Martin are enjoying retirement :toast

[Chinook]

Blake is an interesting player. He and Kawhi would have a Melo/STAT or Lebron/Wade situation. At least the offense would be them taking turns creating rather than Kawhi being the only one who can do anything. Those two plus a savvy PG might be better. But I don't know if such a savvy PG is available. It would probably be someone with the best parts of Mills and Darren Collison.

[DMC]

If you gutted out Manu, Tony, Simmons, Green, Patty Mills and David Lee, you'd not have lost anything if you think you otherwise don't have enough to compete for a ring. So I would gut the Spurs for Chris Paul because you aren't going to have a prime Kawhi for but a few years. If you lose those years, like Pop put shit players around Tim for years, then you're just fools gold again until someone comes a calling for Kawhi or he gets some crazy hand injury.

[DMC]

Blake is an interesting player. He and Kawhi would have a Melo/STAT or Lebron/Wade situation. At least the offense would be them taking turns creating rather than Kawhi being the only one who can do anything. Those two plus a savvy PG might be better. But I don't know if such a savvy PG is available. It would probably be someone with the best parts of Mills and Darren Collison.

Blake has poor form and is overly reliant on his athleticism. Without a dominant big eating up paint he's just another jumping bean on the floor getting highlight dunks now and then, and shooting long 2's.

[Chinook]

Ok well what about the alternatives?? Hill, Holiday, Rose, Teague or any other Point you'd like to add to that list. With age and $$ aside you'd take one of those guys over Paul on the Spurs? If so...who?


And it's ok to admit it and pick Paul so we can move on and maybe talk about how Rasual Butler and Kevin Martin are enjoying retirement :toast

It's hard to separate the money and age in a thread where we are talking about breaking up the roster to bring him in. Paul coming in with pretty much the same roster the team has now no Tony is one thing. I don't think he fits well with Kawhi and LMA, but I wouldn't complain. But people are saying you have to get Paul because he and Kawhi would make a dominant pairing, and that's just not true. They don't fit together.

That said, I don't think you clear the same decks for anyone else besides Wall or Curry. Part of being able to fit with Kawhi is NOT being a max-level star PG. You want a second option who knows how to be a second option and is paid as a second option.

[dabom]

Why is this even a fucking thread? :lol

You win with superstars. End story.

[DMC]

Yes, and I think Pop will want him to be. He's not going to tell Paul to play completely differently than he's always played. Now does that mean that Paul would be the leading scorer? No. But he would almost certainly have a higher usage than Kawhi.



You say that, but it's just like with LMA not playing as the big, strong guy he is. The Spurs needs him to be more assertive and less with of the jump-shooter he's been for years. The offense would be much better if he rolled and forced the issue inside and ducked in. But nope. Same shit. Wouldn't be any different with Paul. Pop's coming to him trying to add his game to the team. No reason to change.



This has nothing to do with Kawhi doing something wrong. This has everything to do with Paul wanting the ball and Kawhi needing the ball. If Leonard's shot is back, he'd probably be more efficient with Paul feeding him. But he's not going to do what he did in the playoffs. The Spurs need either a more balanced PG or a PG who moves the ball much faster than Paul does.

You're not going to find a more balanced PG than Chris Paul. He moves the ball just fine, but he doesn't have a lot to move it to. His court vision is top notch, and his awareness is really good outside of his hero antics in tight situations that often makes him look stupid. If you have CP3 and KL on the floor together with their level of defense, you'd have a problem scoring without dumping into the post. It would be fun to watch, but it's not going to happen.

KL doesn't need to be an isocentric player even though he's good at it. The Spurs won't win a ring until KL learns how to move without the ball better and be a part of the offense instead of just an isolation player. It's great to be able to do both, and he'll get it figured out but he needs a real PG to get him there. Tony isn't going to do it and Murray is too young. CP3 would elevate KL's game even more.

I think some here are afraid of KL losing some of the limelight, especially considering the situation in GS where Durant has usurped much of Curry's power.

[dabom]

Pop told Murray to watch tape of CP3. Obviously Pop knows his PGs. :lol

[DMC]

It's hard to separate the money and age in a thread where we are talking about breaking up the roster to bring him in. Paul coming in with pretty much the same roster the team has now no Tony is one thing. I don't think he fits well with Kawhi and LMA, but I wouldn't complain. But people are saying you have to get Paul because he and Kawhi would make a dominant pairing, and that's just not true. They don't fit together.

That said, I don't think you clear the same decks for anyone else besides Wall or Curry. Part of being able to fit with Kawhi is NOT being a max-level star PG. You want a second option who knows how to be a second option and is paid as a second option.

Would you have thought Curry and Durant would fit together? Both ball dominant players, but they seem to do just fine.

[raybies]

Yes, and I think Pop will want him to be. He's not going to tell Paul to play completely differently than he's always played. Now does that mean that Paul would be the leading scorer? No. But he would almost certainly have a higher usage than Kawhi.

raybies: well yeah not completely differently but definitely differently to some degree with the proper adjustments and no Pop wouldn't want him to be the man, Kawhi is the man. I'm not buying that. LMA came from what a top 3 team in Portland similar to Paul, who hasn't been to a conference final, and had a rough first year and now look where he is at. Kawhi is just too good now and I think it's safe to say he is established as a top 3 player in the world. While you may be right about usage, I would imagine the margin would be very slim.

You say that, but it's just like with LMA not playing as the big, strong guy he is. The Spurs needs him to be more assertive and less with of the jump-shooter he's been for years. The offense would be much better if he rolled and forced the issue inside and ducked in. But nope. Same shit. Wouldn't be any different with Paul. Pop's coming to him trying to add his game to the team. No reason to change.



This has nothing to do with Kawhi doing something wrong. This has everything to do with Paul wanting the ball and Kawhi needing the ball. If Leonard's shot is back, he'd probably be more efficient with Paul feeding him. But he's not going to do what he did in the playoffs. The Spurs need either a more balanced PG or a PG who moves the ball much faster than Paul does.

raybies: There are no other options available that are worth it and please don't say Jrue or George who are gonna demand the max or near it. Paul would actually be fine. We don't want to outgun teams, cause that's the Warriors strength and not ours. Sure in spurts but nothing like games 3 and 4 when we had no option to. He fits because against a team like the Warriors and Cavs you can control the pace and out execute the Warriors and limit their possessions. He would make our halfcourt offense better imo. Other PG options aren't elite offensively and Lowry if you go there, comes up smaller than what CP3 gets called out for.

But as for Paul wanting the ball, LMA did too. Sometimes great players defer to greater players man. Durant was iso heavy in OKC and then bought in with GS culture and game. It works. I have no doubt that Paul can adjust to win, especially if he's will to move, sacrifice tons of money, and leave longstanding relationships...

[Clipper Nation]

Blake has poor form and is overly reliant on his athleticism. Without a dominant big eating up paint he's just another jumping bean on the floor getting highlight dunks now and then, and shooting long 2's.

Fat Hands with another atrocious take, per par. It's clear you haven't watched Blake play since, like, 2012 at the latest. The knock on him nowadays is that he doesn't use his athleticism enough anymore. He'd rather "save himself for the playoffs" by shooting lots of soft jumpers instead. Those highlight dunks used to be a nightly occurrence for Blake, now we're lucky to see a handful of them in an entire season.

Blake has a full offensive repertoire; he even started making threes down the stretch of this season. This is despite the fact that he's not playing next to a "dominant big." DJ is one of the most overrated players in the NBA. He is a non-factor on offense and there are much better defensive centers in the league.

[raybies]

Fat Hands with another atrocious take, per par. It's clear you haven't watched Blake play since, like, 2012 at the latest. The knock on him nowadays is that he doesn't use his athleticism enough anymore. He'd rather "save himself for the playoffs" by shooting lots of soft jumpers instead. Those highlight dunks used to be a nightly occurrence for Blake, now we're lucky to see a handful of them in an entire season.

Blake has a full offensive repertoire; he even started making threes down the stretch of this season. This is despite the fact that he's not playing next to a "dominant big." DJ is one of the most overrated players in the NBA. He is a non-factor on offense and there are much better defensive centers in the league.
Agree wholeheartedly here. You can get the same stuff from a player like Dedmon at a fraction of the cost. Have no idea why he got maxed. Doc scared of losing players imo.

Dallas gonna do the same thing with Nerlens Noel... dang

[TD 21]

If the choice is Paul or no PG, then that's one thing. But there are other options. If Pop is not going to move Parker to make most of the necessary salary to get Paul, I don't think it's worth it.

One of two things is true: Either the Spurs had a horrible core and Kawhi managed to do pretty easily what Paul has never been able to do with his own core, or the Spurs' core doesn't such an managed to do what Paul has never been able to do. Either one should give the team pause when it comes to giving up a lot to get Paul. Kawhi will not be the first All-NBA player Paul's played with. So to think you can just fill in the cracks around him is fallacy.

It's going to take the right guys to make it work.

- He's never played on top 2 team in conference and only in '15, when fatigue/injury limited Spurs, injury eliminated Thunder and Clippers squandered 3-1 lead to inferior Rockets, should he have made Conference Finals.

- In history of league, small guard led teams generally don't win deep in playoffs.

- Leonard doesn't "need ball" because he's elite shooter, who'd get more catch-and-shoot spot ups playing with elite play maker.

- Other options would require at least somewhat significant movement, are significantly worse and wouldn't move needle.

- Can't have everything. Most important is star studded big three (he'd make things so much easier for Aldridge on offense).

[HarlemHeat37]

Gutting the team wouldn't be an issue, tbh..many posters here thought the Warriors were stupid for letting go their role players in favor of Durant(a faaaaarrrrr better player than Chris Paul) :lol Spurs only have 1 irreplaceable player on the roster, everybody else is expendable..

The problem with getting Paul is that he's somewhat of a cancer, on the court..not just stylistically, but his teammates don't enjoy playing with him(Blake, Jordan, Big Baby Davis, etc)..he's completely incapable of playing off the ball..you'd be handing the keys to a 6-foot tall, aging PG who needs the ball in his hands and would turn Kawhi into a secondary player..many Paul defenders keep spewing the garbage that Paul could accept a supporting role, but his style of play would make it impossible, as anybody who has watched him play should know..

I was surprised that Kenyon Martin stated the same thing a few weeks ago, maybe the mainstream media outlets are finally discussing and accepting Paul's major flaws, as a player, rather than shielding him like they have done his entire career..

Oh, and of course, the Warriors absolutely own him..

[cd98]

Here's my issues:

1. Gut team for CP3 and whatever roster is still not good enough to beat the Warriors.

2. We will have a ton of cap space next year without taking on an aging Paul to make a strong push for free agents and be more selective on who we keep vs. dump.But we sign Chris, and bye cap space to 33 year old PG.

[SAGirl]

Blake has poor form and is overly reliant on his athleticism. Without a dominant big eating up paint he's just another jumping bean on the floor getting highlight dunks now and then, and shooting long 2's.

What do you call Lamarcus... bc that is my scenario. I would switch him up with Lamarcus.

[dabom]

CP3 is all heart. What i saw game 7. Tore something. Contemplating the season ending on the bench. Came out injured and tore up the Spurs a new one. Any one questioning his commitment is a faggot per par.

[dabom]

CP3 is my favorite non-Spur after that series. :hat

[TD 21]

Gutting the team wouldn't be an issue, tbh..many posters here thought the Warriors were stupid for letting go their role players in favor of Durant(a faaaaarrrrr better player than Chris Paul) :lol Spurs only have 1 irreplaceable player on the roster, everybody else is expendable..

The problem with getting Paul is that he's somewhat of a cancer, on the court..not just stylistically, but his teammates don't enjoy playing with him(Blake, Jordan, Big Baby Davis, etc)..he's completely incapable of playing off the ball..you'd be handing the keys to a 6-foot tall, aging PG who needs the ball in his hands and would turn Kawhi into a secondary player..many Paul defenders keep spewing the garbage that Paul could accept a supporting role, but his style of play would make it impossible, as anybody who has watched him play should know..

I was surprised that Kenyon Martin stated the same thing a few weeks ago, maybe the mainstream media outlets are finally discussing and accepting Paul's major flaws, as a player, rather than shielding him like they have done his entire career..

Oh, and of course, the Warriors absolutely own him..

Again, it's not without potential issues and they'd still be underdogs obviously, but the question I keep coming back to is this: What's the alternative that gives them a better chance at a championship in the foreseeable future? No one has an answer because there isn't one.

:lmao At "Warriors own him". James supposedly "owned" Durant until context changed. Paul would have a lot of things with Spurs he never has with Clippers. Maybe he'd still never ring, but I have no doubt he'd acquit himself fine against them in this situation.

[DMC]

What do you call Lamarcus... bc that is my scenario. I would switch him up with Lamarcus.

You won't go far with either. I'd take a couple guys half that price who hustle and can learn to shoot. You aren't getting out of the West with Blake as your big.

[HarlemHeat37]

Again, it's not without potential issues and they'd still be underdogs obviously, but the question I keep coming back to is this: What's the alternative that gives them a better chance at a championship in the foreseeable future? No one has an answer because there isn't one.

:lmao At "Warriors own him". James supposedly "owned" Durant until context changed. Paul would have a lot of things with Spurs he never has with Clippers. Maybe he'd still never ring, but I have no doubt he'd acquit himself fine against them in this situation.

Such as? Kawhi? Maybe, but I have no reason to believe that he would be as effective with "dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble" at PG..

Are we going to pretend like the Clippers weren't considered West favorites or at least co-favorites by a large % of pundits from 2013 to 2016? Because they absolutely were and it wouldn't be difficult to prove it..he's not Cavs' Lebron, he's had loaded teams..

[dabom]

I fail to remember if he's ever had an allstar wing or guard. Isn't that what "today's league" is about? :lol

[TD 21]

Such as?

- Someone better than him
- Superstar wing
- If Green retained over Parker, multiple 3 and D wings
- Young talent, replete with all picks (1 would be dumped if Parker moved though) and front office with track record of unearthing gems
- Starting big adept at pick-and-pop and playing beyond elbows (though Griffin just started to get to this point last season)
- No drama or soap opera, at least publicly

Clippers were never considered favorites by anyone knowledgeable and were never loaded. They've always been 4th-5th best team, which makes them fringe contenders.

Stop evading my question about alternative that gives Spurs better championship chance in foreseeable future . . .

[HarlemHeat37]

Another one of Chris Paul's former teammates that hated playing with him:lol

HuYfkp3nr2o

Starts at 6:10..

[dabom]

And by the way, who are these stupid fucking pundits? :lol

I've never had Clips as favorite to come out the west. :lol

[dabom]

Another one of Chris Paul's former teammates that hated playing with him:lol

HuYfkp3nr2o

Starts at 6:10..

Acting like we give a shit what a bum says? Isn't that what bums do? :lol

[coachmac87]

Such as? Kawhi? Maybe, but I have no reason to believe that he would be as effective with "dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble" at PG..

Are we going to pretend like the Clippers weren't considered West favorites or at least co-favorites by a large % of pundits from 2013 to 2016? Because they absolutely were and it wouldn't be difficult to prove it..he's not Cavs' Lebron, he's had loaded teams..

What PG other than maybe Curry isn't ball dominant? And like TD21 said what's the alternative?

[HarlemHeat37]

Acting like we give a shit what a bum says? Isn't that what bums do? :lol

He's a former All-Star, bro:lol he also played with Jason Kidd, one of the greatest PGs of all-time and Chauncey Billups, another very good PG..have never heard him say a single negative thing about either of those players..

[coachmac87]

Another one of Chris Paul's former teammates that hated playing with him:lol

HuYfkp3nr2o

Starts at 6:10..


Big Baby and K-Mart dictating what's best for the Spurs or quality of a player??:lmao

[dabom]

He's a former All-Star, bro:lol he also played with Jason Kidd, one of the greatest PGs of all-time and Chauncey Billups, another very good PG..have never heard him say a single negative thing about either of those players..

He's still a bum right now. :lol

I'm pretty sure 99% of the people that work with CP3 would say otherwise. :lol

[dabom]

I have yet to meet someone that wasn't hated by someone. It happens. It doesn't define you though. :lol

[coachmac87]

He's still a bum right now. :lol

I'm pretty sure 99% of the people that work with CP3 would say otherwise. :lol

He also gave reason why he's ball dominant...Nobody on the Clippers can create for themselves

[dabom]

He also gave reason why he's ball dominant...Nobody on the Clippers can create for themselves

Same people saying Kawhi is a ball dominant player. :lol

Like guys, he is doing that because of circumstance. :lol

[coachmac87]

Same people saying Kawhi is a ball dominant player. :lol

Like guys, he is doing that because of circumstance. :lol


+1

[Mikeanaro]

3 more pages in 2 hours? what happened?

[HarlemHeat37]

He also gave reason why he's ball dominant...Nobody on the Clippers can create for themselves

That's part of the point..his teams are built that way, he can't effectively play with other stars..

He's played for 2 different franchises in the NBA, with a bunch of different teammates and many different coaches, yet he has never altered his style of play..what a coincidence:lol

At the end of the day, you're always going to be forced to rely on him to make the big plays with the ball in his hands, and he will always fail vs. the better teams, due to his size..not necessarily his fault, but it's the reality..

[tbdog]

3 more pages in 2 hours? what happened?

More rumours leaked. Rumour has it the CP will meet with the Spurs. Rumours have it that Clippers have legit concerns that Spurs will prior him away. These rumours are accurate imo because no other team has been linked to CP.

[dabom]

That's part of the point..his teams are built that way, he can't effectively play with other stars..

He's played for 2 different franchises in the NBA, with a bunch of different teammates and many different coaches, yet he has never altered his style of play..what a coincidence:lol

What guard can take his duties away from him?

[coachmac87]

That's part of the point..his teams are built that way, he can't effectively play with other stars..

He's played for 2 different franchises in the NBA, with a bunch of different teammates and many different coaches, yet he has never altered his style of play..what a coincidence:lol


Yeah and his best players on the wings have been Peja, and Reddick...

And again what elite PG other than Steph isn't ball dominant? And Hill, Holiday, Rose, Teague aren't better fits either..you still haven't answered the question of what's the alternative

[Chinook]

Would you have thought Curry and Durant would fit together? Both ball dominant players, but they seem to do just fine.

I know you have this shtick of Curry being this ball-hog/chucker, but he's not.

[buttsR4rebounding]

The salaries of LMA, KL, TP, Green, Murray, Bertans, Forbes, opt-in Lee, plus stretch Duncan and waived LJC come to $62,600,000. That leaves roughly $38,400,000. Bring over Mulitunov for $1.2 million and Hanga for $1 million and you are at 36.4. That's 10 players. Add the 29th pick (Bell?) for $1.2 million and you are down to about 35.2. Sign Simmons for $7.5 and you are down to $27.7 million. Take off $2 million for 2 more cap holds and that leaves about $25 million for Paul. Paul signs a 2 year contract starting at $25 million with a player option for the 2nd year. He opts out next year and the Spurs sign him to a 4 year deal starting at $35 million. With the raises is a total 5 year income of roughly $183 million vs. the Clips $205 million. However, Paul will pay an additional $13.6 million in taxes on his Clip contract that he won't with the Spurs making the Clips contract worth $192 million. Really a $9,000,000 difference over 5 years. That could leave us with the following team:


Paul/Murray/Forbes/Post-Op Tony
Green/Simmons/Ginobili with a vet min/
KL/Hanga/Kyle
Lee/Bertans/29 pick?
Aldridge/Mulitunov/

Ginobili could play 3rd string PG if needed. Kyle can play the 4. Simmons the 2.

I'm not saying that I would be thrilled with the last 2 years of the contract, but Murray would be ready to go by then for sure. I'm just saying that the arguments that he leaves so much money on the table or we have to gut the team is bunk. We lose Pau, Mills and maybe some draft choices getting rid of Pau (but maybe not).

[Chinook]

- He's never played on top 2 team in conference and only in '15, when fatigue/injury limited Spurs, injury eliminated Thunder and Clippers squandered 3-1 lead to inferior Rockets, should he have made Conference Finals

This is very much just an excuse. He's been "the best player" on a team with multiple All-Stars more than once. I don't care if each individual year there's some rationale for him not making it. He should have made it one of those years. That's all on him.


- In history of league, small guard led teams generally don't win deep in playoffs.

Again, this is an excuse. If he's not good enough to be a first option, why are people trying to say he is? Those stats that make him seem like a top-five post-season player and this thread in general paint him out to be some no-brainer superstar for whom the team should bend over backwards. Those types of players get to the third round.


- Leonard doesn't "need ball" because he's elite shooter, who'd get more catch-and-shoot spot ups playing with elite play maker.

He already does that now. But instead of him going off like he did against Memphis, you'll get him being a taller version of Redick. Would be great for Kawhi's TS%, but I doubt anyone but maybe me would be okay with him not going Kawhiso/Kawhichel.


- Other options would require at least somewhat significant movement, are significantly worse and wouldn't move needle.

Aldridge not being a vagina (and Pop not enabling that) in the WCF would move the needle. You don't need a max PG for that. You need guys who can get buckets against good defense and guys who can defend players much better than them.


- Can't have everything. Most important is star studded big three (he'd make things so much easier for Aldridge on offense).

Most important is a healthy team where everyone is playing better. LMA's game was not hampered by a lack of a PG; it was hampered by piss-poor offense. Pop had one job to do as it pertained to getting LMA to play his best, and he couldn't fucking do it. That only underscores why thinking Paul is going to be different is wrong-headed. Pop's going to end up with an offense that is 60-percent Paul dribbling, 30 percent Kawhiso and 10 percent LMA fadeaways. Long gone is the coach that actually leveraged his players' talents.

[dabom]

Blaming Pop for LMA being a hurt ****. :lmao

[Clipper Nation]

Agree wholeheartedly here. You can get the same stuff from a player like Dedmon at a fraction of the cost. Have no idea why he got maxed. Doc scared of losing players imo.

Dallas gonna do the same thing with Nerlens Noel... dang

I've been saying it for years now, but it took DJ getting an All-Star appearance and an All-NBA team in a season where he regressed for all the mainstream vanilla fans to finally see how overrated he is :lol

Next year is going to be DJ's tenth season in the NBA. I'm not expecting him to become prime Hakeem, but is adding one fucking post move to his game really too much to ask after a decade in the league?

[tmtcsc]

CP3 has been known to go too far with his criticism of teammates. I think most people know that. However, he has done it because no one has put him in his place. I'd argue that CP3's behavior on a Pop coached team will not be an issue. Kind of like Rodman on the Bulls. You come here, its our way, not yours and you will fall in line. The biggest issue with Paul is his health. He's had some fluke injuries with his hand and has also suffered some hamstring issues.

Pop won't be here much longer (2 or 3 years maybe) and its about maximizing their chances at winning. To get CP3, Danny is going to be the most likely candidate to get moved. As much as people think the Spurs won't move TP, think again. Moving TP & Danny can get you the $25 or $26 Million you need to get Chris Paul. If you are able to get him for those two, it's a no-brainer as far as I'm concerned. It won't be easy for some fans to swallow but TP's days as a Spur are most likely over. The Spurs will not sacrifice what is best for the team to placate some fans' nostalgic wishes.

If you bring CP3 in, Manu would probably come back too - which is a huge win for culture purposes. Paul's basketball IQ & competitiveness would go far in helping the Spurs win another Championship. If they can make the #'s work and Paul is serious about joining them, it will get done.

[Clipper Nation]

He also gave reason why he's ball dominant...Nobody on the Clippers can create for themselves

Blake can, he's just not allowed to when Choke-P is out there hogging the ball. Don't you wonder why nobody likes playing with him?

[Chinook]

The salaries of LMA, KL, TP, Green, Murray, Bertans, Forbes, opt-in Lee, plus stretch Duncan and waived LJC come to $62,600,000. That leaves roughly $38,400,000. Bring over Mulitunov for $1.2 million and Hanga for $1 million and you are at 36.4. Sign That's 10 players. Add the 29th pick (Bell?) for $1.2 million and you are down to about 35.2. Sign Simmons for $7.5 and you are down to $27.7 million. Take off $2 million for 2 more cap holds and that leaves about $25 million for Paul. Paul signs a 2 year contract starting at $25 million with a player option for the 2nd year. He opts out next year and the Spurs sign him to a 4 year deal starting at $35 million. With the raises is a total 5 year income of roughly $183 million vs. the Clips $205 million. However, Paul will pay an additional $13.6 million in taxes on his Clip contract that he won't with the Spurs making the Clips contract worth $192 million. Really a $9,000,000 difference over 5 years. That could leave us with the following team:


Paul/Murray/Forbes/Post-Op Tony
Green/Simmons/Ginobili with a vet min/
KL/Hanga/Kyle
Lee/Bertans/29 pick?
Aldridge/Mulitunov/

Ginobili could play 3rd string PG if needed. Kyle can play the 4. Simmons the 2.

I'm not saying that I would be thrilled with the last 2 years of the contract, but Murray would be ready to go by then for sure. I'm just saying that the arguments that he leaves so much money on the table or we have to gut the team is bunk. We lose Pau, Mills and maybe some draft choices getting rid of Pau (but maybe not).

I detailed in a long post about how to bring Paul over somewhere. SAGirl (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=49524) may remember where it is. But things to consider are:

Most of the small exceptions and salary slots have increased, which retroactively increases the salaries of most of the cheap guys. My salary thread in TT has those increased salaries. While I'll never claim to be perfect, those numbers are more accurate than most ones from this season, because they factor in the new rules.

Lee should opt out. It makes no difference to him monetarily, but it would save the Spurs millions on the cap if they re-sign him after using cap space.

Simmons should not count in this scenario beyond his cap hold, which is less than $2 Million. So that's more space you save.

This is what I am getting from a glance:



Name
2017-18


LaMarcus Aldridge
$21,461,010


Kawhi Leonard
$18,868,625


Tony Parker
$15,453,126


Danny Green
$10,000,000


Tim Duncan (stretched)
$1,881,250


Kyle Anderson
$2,151,704


Dejounte Murray
$1,312,611


Livio Jean-Charles (waived)
$1,035,200


Jonathan Simmons (QO)
$1,671,382


Davis Bertans
$1,312,611


Bryn Forbes
$1,312,611


First-Rounder
$1,697,225


Roster Charge (Hanga)
$815,615


Roster Charge
$815,615






Calculated Total
$79,788,585










Projected Cap
$101,000,000


Projected Cap Space
$21,211,415



Dumping Parker would give the Spurs the team enough to sign Paul to the max, but ideally, you'd want to save some money for a starting big. You almost certainly could get a ring-chaser for that.

Paul, Murray, Ring-Chaser, two-way d-leaguer
Green, Simmons, Hanga
Leonard, Anderson, Ring-Chaser
Lee, Bertans, First-rounder
Aldridge, Room Exception Big, Ring-Chaser, two-way d-leaguer

Bringing in Nikola would be possible, but it would count as an extra million bucks against the cap.

[Chillen]

A big 3 of Leonard, CP3 and Aldridge can definitely challenge the Warriors, Cavs but what concerns me is the pieces left on the roster. If Spurs can sign CP3 I think Manu gives it another year, Lee seems to like it in San Antonio. So Spurs would have to make some brilliant moves with this roster. Not sure what will happen with Parker, but Derrick Rose might take less and could sub in for CP3 if Spurs have to unload Parker's contract for cap space (if Rose's ego can accept it, but if he wants to win I say yes). I hope Pau restructures his contract instead of opting in, in which Spurs would probably trade him. Spurs probably lose Green and Parker is CP3 decides to be a Spur.

[BatManu20]

Captain Jack thinks it's a no-brainer for CP3.

youtu.be/W1392-uKAdw

[tmtcsc]

Captain Jack thinks it's a no-brainer for CP3.

youtu.be/W1392-uKAdw

Here you go: http://news4sanantonio.com/sports/spurs-zone/ex-spur-stephen-jackson-is-liking-the-possibility-of-chris-paul-joining-san-antonio

[tmtcsc]

On another note: Doc Rivers is a dead coach walking. He lost the team and should be fired.

[Clipper Nation]

On another note: Doc Rivers is a dead coach walking. He lost the team and should be fired.

He should have been fired after the Houston meltdown two years ago. The only reason he's still around is that Choke Paul is still loyal to him.

[coachmac87]

I detailed in a long post about how to bring Paul over somewhere. SAGirl (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=49524) may remember where it is. But things to consider are:

Most of the small exceptions and salary slots have increased, which retroactively increases the salaries of most of the cheap guys. My salary thread in TT has those increased salaries. While I'll never claim to be perfect, those numbers are more accurate than most ones from this season, because they factor in the new rules.

Lee should opt out. It makes no difference to him monetarily, but it would save the Spurs millions on the cap if they re-sign him after using cap space.

Simmons should not count in this scenario beyond his cap hold, which is less than $2 Million. So that's more space you save.

This is what I am getting from a glance:



Name
2017-18


LaMarcus Aldridge
$21,461,010


Kawhi Leonard
$18,868,625


Tony Parker
$15,453,126


Danny Green
$10,000,000


Tim Duncan (stretched)
$1,881,250


Kyle Anderson
$2,151,704


Dejounte Murray
$1,312,611


Livio Jean-Charles (waived)
$1,035,200


Jonathan Simmons (QO)
$1,671,382


Davis Bertans
$1,312,611


Bryn Forbes
$1,312,611


First-Rounder
$1,697,225


Roster Charge (Hanga)
$815,615


Roster Charge
$815,615






Calculated Total
$79,788,585










Projected Cap
$101,000,000


Projected Cap Space
$21,211,415



Dumping Parker would give the Spurs the team enough to sign Paul to the max, but ideally, you'd want to save some money for a starting big. You almost certainly could get a ring-chaser for that.

Paul, Murray, Ring-Chaser, two-way d-leaguer
Green, Simmons, Hanga
Leonard, Anderson, Ring-Chaser
Lee, Bertans, First-rounder
Aldridge, Room Exception Big, Ring-Chaser, two-way d-leaguer

Bringing in Nikola would be possible, but it would count as an extra million bucks against the cap.


Why won't the Spurs just pay the luxury tax just once lol?

[Spurs 4 The Win]

He should have been fired after the Houston meltdown two years ago. The only reason he's still around is that Choke Paul is still loyal to him.

Chris Paul is about to leave his ass and that garbage franchise to burn.

[Clipper Nation]

Chris Paul is about to leave his ass and that garbage franchise to burn.

Enjoy the first- and second-round exits! Make sure to practice blaming Kawhi for all of Choke-P's playoff meltdowns. From the sound of things, you'll be doing it a lot.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

Enjoy the first- and second-round exits! Make sure to practice blaming Kawhi for all of Choke-P's playoff meltdowns. From the sound of things, you'll be doing it a lot.

:lol thinking that the Spurs wouldnt make it to the WCF

LOL Clippers
LOL never been to the WCF
LOL Game 5 vs OKC 2014
LOL Game 6 vs Houston 2015
LOL Austin Rivers
LOL Laker's bitch
:lol

[daslicer]

I live in NC so I have followed CP3 since he was at Wake Forest. Never been a fan of his. He's always been a choker and a loser going back to his Wake Forest day. Also he's a very toxic leader.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

I live in NC so I have followed CP3 since he was at Wake Forest. Never been a fan of his. He's always been a choker and a loser going back to his Wake Forest day. Also he's a very toxic leader.

He has played with low IQ losers like DeAndre and Griffin :lol

[Mikeanaro]

More rumours leaked. Rumour has it the CP will meet with the Spurs. Rumours have it that Clippers have legit concerns that Spurs will prior him away. These rumours are accurate imo because no other team has been linked to CP.
Well thats interesting, I´ve heard that money wise he could earn the same money in SA because there are no state taxes for pro athlete contracts, lets see.

[tbdog]

If CP wants to win, he will need to give us a discount. Here is a thing, he will probably drop 50mil before tax by signing with the spurs for max. I wonder if he will take even less cause, well, he already is giving up a lot.

[Clipper Nation]

He has played with low IQ losers like DeAndre and Griffin :lol
Choke-P IS a loser. Everyone likes to blame Blake and DJ for his chokejobs, but it wasn't that long ago that his Hornets teammates were getting all the blame. Funny how Chandler and Peja were able to get a ring together once a certain egomaniac point guard wasn't around to choke it all away (and then blame them for it).

[Russ]

Choke-P IS a loser. Everyone likes to blame Blake and DJ for his chokejobs, but it wasn't that long ago that his Hornets teammates were getting all the blame. Funny how Chandler and Peja were able to get a ring together once a certain egomaniac point guard wasn't around to choke it all away (and then blame them for it).

That game CP3 had against OKC in 2014 was possibly the worst end-game choke in NBA playoff history. You literally had to wonder if he had money on the game.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

Choke-P IS a loser. Everyone likes to blame Blake and DJ for his chokejobs, but it wasn't that long ago that his Hornets teammates were getting all the blame. Funny how Chandler and Peja were able to get a ring together once a certain egomaniac point guard wasn't around to choke it all away (and then blame them for it).

Nobody is saying Choke Paul is infallible, but CP3 would be in the best situation possible to succeed in SA. The Clippers :lol is not the place players go to become champions :lol

[Spurs 4 The Win]

That game CP3 had against OKC in 2014 was possibly the worst end-game choke in NBA playoff history. You literally had to wonder if he had money on the game.

How quickly we forget that the refs of refKC helped steal that game too. That was highway robbery from them and the Clippers choking made it possible.

[gambit1990]

without a doubt.

[DMC]

I know you have this shtick of Curry being this ball-hog/chucker, but he's not.

Didn't answer my question. Did you think Durant and Curry would gel in the 1st season?

[Chinook]

Didn't answer my question. Did you think Durant and Curry would gel in the 1st season?

Yes. Curry was never going to be a problem. They don't conflict. Steph is not ball-dominant.

[Clipper Nation]

How quickly we forget that the refs of refKC helped steal that game too. That was highway robbery from them and the Clippers choking made it possible.

"The Clippers" didn't turn it over twice in the last 17 seconds, Choke Paul did that all on his own. "The Clippers" didn't start trying to dribble out the clock up 13 with four minutes to go, that was also just Choke Paul.

Choke-P can change uniforms and supporting casts as many times as he wants, but the results aren't going to change until he stops being afraid of the playoffs.

[gambit1990]

if you don't want cp3 on your team, you don't know basketball.

[gambit1990]

just PART 1 of highlights from that season:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3LupOkRCco

[gambit1990]

idk how true the parker for paul rumors were when he was with the hornets.

wanted him then, nothing has changed. spursfan aren't ready for cp3 tbh.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

"The Clippers" didn't turn it over twice in the last 17 seconds, Choke Paul did that all on his own. "The Clippers" didn't start trying to dribble out the clock up 13 with four minutes to go, that was also just Choke Paul.

Choke-P can change uniforms and supporting casts as many times as he wants, but the results aren't going to change until he stops being afraid of the playoffs.

Thats the great thing about the Spurs, we can show him how to win, he isnt surrounded by losers. He has winners like Manu, Kawhi, Tony, and Pop around him to teach him with their championship experience. Winning is a culture. If you dont know how to win, its hard to establish that culture, that is why the Clippers were always destined for failure.

[gambit1990]

you can't have green and parker and cp3.

parker is the one that should go. keep danny over him, for defense.

[Clipper Nation]

He has winners like... Tony... around him to teach him

:lol

[Spurs 4 The Win]

you can't have green and parker and cp3.

parker is the one that should go. keep danny over him, for defense.

Parker will be here, Danny is gone. Parker will not be jettisoned from the team.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

:lol

Oh, so Tony isnt a 4 time champion and Finals MVP? Just checking

[gambit1990]

Parker will be here, Danny is gone. Parker will not be jettisoned from the team.
i too think the spurs move green before/instead of parker. definitely hope i'm wrong though.

[Uriel]

I detailed in a long post about how to bring Paul over somewhere. SAGirl (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=49524) may remember where it is. But things to consider are:

Most of the small exceptions and salary slots have increased, which retroactively increases the salaries of most of the cheap guys. My salary thread in TT has those increased salaries. While I'll never claim to be perfect, those numbers are more accurate than most ones from this season, because they factor in the new rules.

Lee should opt out. It makes no difference to him monetarily, but it would save the Spurs millions on the cap if they re-sign him after using cap space.

Simmons should not count in this scenario beyond his cap hold, which is less than $2 Million. So that's more space you save.

This is what I am getting from a glance:



Name
2017-18


LaMarcus Aldridge
$21,461,010


Kawhi Leonard
$18,868,625


Tony Parker
$15,453,126


Danny Green
$10,000,000


Tim Duncan (stretched)
$1,881,250


Kyle Anderson
$2,151,704


Dejounte Murray
$1,312,611


Livio Jean-Charles (waived)
$1,035,200


Jonathan Simmons (QO)
$1,671,382


Davis Bertans
$1,312,611


Bryn Forbes
$1,312,611


First-Rounder
$1,697,225


Roster Charge (Hanga)
$815,615


Roster Charge
$815,615






Calculated Total
$79,788,585










Projected Cap
$101,000,000


Projected Cap Space
$21,211,415



Dumping Parker would give the Spurs the team enough to sign Paul to the max, but ideally, you'd want to save some money for a starting big. You almost certainly could get a ring-chaser for that.

Paul, Murray, Ring-Chaser, two-way d-leaguer
Green, Simmons, Hanga
Leonard, Anderson, Ring-Chaser
Lee, Bertans, First-rounder
Aldridge, Room Exception Big, Ring-Chaser, two-way d-leaguer

Bringing in Nikola would be possible, but it would count as an extra million bucks against the cap.
Can't we bring back Manu for the veteran minimum after renouncing his cap hold? And would bringing in Nikola prevent us from being able to sign Paul to a max contact? Also, from what I've read, the Spurs are considering waiving and stretching Parker as opposed to outright dumping him.

[Clipper Nation]

Oh, so Tony isnt a 4 time champion and Finals MVP? Just checking

So Porker didn't get outplayed by his own backups and dragged to rings by Duncan, Manu and Kawhi? Just checking.


Love TD and Manu. There were the heart and soul of the team in the 2000s. The only two players you could always count on to step it up in the playoffs.

Spurs won three titles in five years from 2003-2007. Here's the playoff stats for all the Spurs rotation players in that time period:

http://s5.postimg.org/om3v3tvdj/Spurs_03_07.png

Tim and Manu are the only two players with:

20+ PER
6+ BPM
10+ win shares
.200+ WS/48(DRob also qualifies for this but he only played in 2003)

These two guys were dominant - by far the two best players on the team. They were pretty much the Shaq/Kobe of the Spurs. Everybody else was a role player. No idea where the big three nonsense came from. Duncan and Manu were a big TWO back then.

[gambit1990]

Name
2017-18


LaMarcus Aldridge
$21,461,010


Kawhi Leonard
$18,868,625


Tony Parker
$15,453,126


Danny Green
$10,000,000


Tim Duncan (stretched)
$1,881,250


Kyle Anderson
$2,151,704


Dejounte Murray
$1,312,611


Livio Jean-Charles (waived)
$1,035,200


Jonathan Simmons (QO)
$1,671,382


Davis Bertans
$1,312,611


Bryn Forbes
$1,312,611


First-Rounder
$1,697,225


Roster Charge (Hanga)
$815,615


Roster Charge
$815,615






Calculated Total
$79,788,585










Projected Cap
$101,000,000


Projected Cap Space
$21,211,415



Dumping Parker would give the Spurs the team enough to sign Paul to the max, but ideally, you'd want to save some money for a starting big. You almost certainly could get a ring-chaser for that.
bolded what people need to realize.


Also, from what I've read, the Spurs are considering waiving and stretching Parker as opposed to outright dumping him.
i have not kept up with reports since kawhi's injury. if the spurs are really considering doing that... it's great news.

[gambit1990]

paul + tony is retarded. we have murray. makes no sense.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

paul + tony is retarded. we have murray. makes no sense.

Yeah but we arent trading Tony nor are we forcing him to retire. He can run with the second unit for 10 minutes a game.

[gambit1990]

we arent trading Tony
only one way to find out :toast

He can run with the second unit for 10 minutes a game.
not improving the roster so the spurs can pay tp $15 million so he can play 10 minutes a game towards the last third of the season :lol

[Spurs 4 The Win]

only one way to find out :toast

not improving the roster so the spurs can pay tp $15 million so he can play 10 minutes a game towards the last third of the season :lol

What do you suppose the front office does then? Because I dont think you really understand how on the hook we are for his salary, there isnt really much we can do. What is your move GM gambit?

[DMC]

:pop: Paul will have to come off the bench. If Manu can do it so can he. Tony is starting.

[Uriel]

All-Star point guard Chris Paul (http://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/2779/chris-paul) intends to give the San Antonio Spurs (http://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/sa/san-antonio-spurs) serious consideration in free agency this summer in the event he decides to leave the LA Clippers (http://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/lac/la-clippers), according to league sources.

Sources told ESPN that Paul, for all of his undeniable fondness for Los Angeles, is intrigued by the idea of teaming up with the likes of Spurs coach Gregg Popovich and MVP top-three finalist Kawhi Leonard (http://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/6450/kawhi-leonard) in his quest to achieve the deep playoff success that has eluded Paul to this point in his career.

Free agency is still a month away, but sources say the Clippers already have begun contemplating roster and organizational changes aimed at convincing Paul ‎to re-sign after he declines to exercise his player option, as expected.

Sources say the Clippers' pursuit of NBA legend Jerry West (http://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/4151/jerry-west) to join their front office, as ESPN reported earlier this week (http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19501765/los-angeles-clippers-interested-hiring-jerry-west-away-golden-state-warriors), is an example of a potential addition aimed at swaying Paul to stay.

The Spurs, sources say, are increasingly considered a lock to at least secure a face-to-face meeting with Paul when free agency begins July 1, despite the fact San Antonio would almost certainly have to sacrifice considerable roster depth to make him a representative contract offer.

As daunting as some of the moves are that San Antonio would have to consider to create the requisite salary-cap space to aggressively pursue Paul, one source said of the Spurs' interest in the veteran floor leader: "They love him."
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19521062/chris-paul-give-strong-consideration-san-antonio-spurs-free-agency-sources

[gambit1990]

What do you suppose the front office does then? Because I dont think you really understand how on the hook we are for his salary, there isnt really much we can do. What is your move GM gambit?
thank you for asking.

moving parker's contract this offseason should be priority #1, thought that last summer too.

it is not immovable by a long shot. parker fans kept saying how no one would take him... but that he was invaluable to us :lol

gilbert arenas got moved, so did joe johnson.

if i'm GM, tp is gone and we go from there.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

thank you for asking.

moving parker's contract this offseason should be priority #1, thought that last summer too.

it is not immovable by a long shot. parker fans kept saying how no one would take him... but that he was invaluable to us :lol

gilbert arenas got moved, so did joe johnson.

if i'm GM, tp is gone and we go from there.

But you know we cant do that. You can do an all time franchise great that way.

[gambit1990]

didn't phil jackson say porzingis wasn't untradable?

if i'm GM i'm trying to package tony + lma for porzingis. melo to the clippers. cp3 to the spurs.

[gambit1990]

i'm throwing in davis and two picks to make porzingis and cp3 happen.

knicks would take tony because they'd rather have him over rose imo (and tony's contract is expiring).

[gambit1990]

But you know we cant do that. You can do an all time franchise great that way.
i understand your argument as to the plausibility... but this is a business. if i'm GM, i'm making moves. i'm not standing still so tony could come back and be even slower defensively than he was before. especially not for $15 mill.

[therealtruth]

Stop comparing small forwards to a power forward...

And I'm referring to perimeter players for the Clippers that can make plays or create..there is none. And Paul hasn't played with a wing like Kawhi so there's a reason behind the madness

So Jamal Crawford can't create his own shot? The guy who has won 6th man of the year for a record 3 times.

[tmtcsc]

Yeah but we arent trading Tony nor are we forcing him to retire. He can run with the second unit for 10 minutes a game.

No, he can't. Spurs can't force him to retire but they can certainly tell him he's being traded in an effort to salary dump his contract. HE IS DONE. He was a marginal player who had a handful of good games this year before suffering his devastating injury That's it. He will no longer be NBA caliber once he tries to return. He is done and whoever takes him in the salary dump will waive him right away. Its a sad reality for him that he hasn't faced yet. The team is moving on from him and has no fantasies about him coming back and making any contribution - certainly not at 15 million per season and not when there is a chance to upgrade at the position.

[Spurs 4 The Win]

No, he can't. Spurs can't force him to retire but they can certainly tell him he's being traded in an effort to salary dump his contract. HE IS DONE. He was a marginal player who had a handful of good games this year before suffering his devastating injury That's it. He will no longer be NBA caliber once he tries to return. He is done and whoever takes him in the salary dump will waive him right away. Its a sad reality for him that he hasn't faced yet. The team is moving on from him and has no fantasies about him coming back and making any contribution - certainly not at 15 million per season and not when there is a chance to upgrade at the position.

Lol, sure, but you are forgetting the part where we are loyal to the players who helped build our franchise. We wont dump him, he has been a legend for us and we will not do him like that.

[100%duncan]

What are we exactly gutting? Hello? Depth is overrated in the playoffs, and the main players outside Kawhi has been really underwhelming the whole fucking season.

[TheGreatYacht]

What are we exactly gutting? Hello? Depth is overrated in the playoffs, and the main players outside Kawhi has been really underwhelming the whole fucking season.
Pretty much this. Everyone outside of Kawhi and HOTS is replaceable.

[Chillen]

Bottom line is Spurs need to shake things up to compete with the Warriors. Start with Leonard, see if CP3 wants to be a Spur and if he does put together a roster that can contend next season. Standing pat will only have the same results, Spurs might have won 1 game vs the Warriors if Leonard didn't get hurt. Spurs have to see what moves they can make to compete with the Warriors if they want to try and bring an NBA title back to San Antonio. A big 3 of Leonard, CP3 and Aldridge is a start, after that worry about the other pieces and how they fit. If CP3 stays with Clips, try to get Rose or Rubio and trade for Melo.

[sasaint]

No, he can't. Spurs can't force him to retire but they can certainly tell him he's being traded in an effort to salary dump his contract. HE IS DONE. He was a marginal player who had a handful of good games this year before suffering his devastating injury That's it. He will no longer be NBA caliber once he tries to return. He is done and whoever takes him in the salary dump will waive him right away. Its a sad reality for him that he hasn't faced yet. The team is moving on from him and has no fantasies about him coming back and making any contribution - certainly not at 15 million per season and not when there is a chance to upgrade at the position.

That is exactly how 29 teams in the NBA operate and how they would handle Tony. But I am not so sure about that 30th team. I hope something happens to make Tony go away with relative ease and as little angst as possible. But just make him go away.

We will learn quite a bit about PATFO in the next few weeks and months. I really hope for an uncharacteristicly bold off-season by the Spurs, but I suspect when all is said and done, some of us will be at least as disappointed as usual.

[raybies]

imo even Tony thinks he might get traded or waived. "I'll play my best basketball come January." Why would he feel the need to say that. And he's always been the member of the Big 3 that has been been dangled. The right deal never came so we kept him. If Parker thinks he would get waived or traded, we shouldn't be too surprised and this is pure speculation. I think the right thing to do would be to waive and stretch him and let him know in a year they can sign him back to finish his career. He's earned that much and it'd probably save a pick.

[BatManu20]

I don't see any scenario where the Spurs trade Tony. They're too loyal (to a fault). Danny or someone else would get the axe, sadly.

[tbdog]

Danny for Covington or Homes. Will Philly take it?

[Ice009]

imo even Tony thinks he might get traded or waived. "I'll play my best basketball come January." Why would he feel the need to say that. And he's always been the member of the Big 3 that has been been dangled. The right deal never came so we kept him. If Parker thinks he would get waived or traded, we shouldn't be too surprised and this is pure speculation. I think the right thing to do would be to waive and stretch him and let him know in a year they can sign him back to finish his career. He's earned that much and it'd probably save a pick.

The Spurs could have went the loyalty route if Kawhi didn't become the player he is today. He worked his ass off and turned himself into a Superstar - one of the best players on the planet. So now, IMO, I think the Spurs owe it to Kawhi to not waste his prime years by trying to build the best possible roster around him that can legitimately compete for Championships. He deserves to be on that stage playing for Championships with all the work he's put in to get here, and all the work he will continue to put in to stay here.

The Spurs can't be idiots and keep Parker around for nostalgic reasons if he can't perform on the court anymore, especially at his current salary. I would still take him in a role off the bench as a reserve with a low salary, but if they have to trade or waive and stretch him to help get a better roster around Kawhi, then that is what they should do. He's already won 4 Championships here - that's more than most players could dream of, the Spurs don't owe him anything more than that IMO.

[tbdog]

No, he can't. Spurs can't force him to retire but they can certainly tell him he's being traded in an effort to salary dump his contract. HE IS DONE. He was a marginal player who had a handful of good games this year before suffering his devastating injury That's it. He will no longer be NBA caliber once he tries to return. He is done and whoever takes him in the salary dump will waive him right away. Its a sad reality for him that he hasn't faced yet. The team is moving on from him and has no fantasies about him coming back and making any contribution - certainly not at 15 million per season and not when there is a chance to upgrade at the position.

I don't know why you would discredit Tony. All he has ever done is won with this team. Played his heart out. Won a finals MVP. Did what Pop told him to. Lead behind the scenes. Don't you think the Spurs owe it to him to let him give it a shot? To keep him, and to pay and rehabilitate him through his treatment? It is one more year until his contract is up.

[coachmac87]

Bottom line is Spurs need to shake things up to compete with the Warriors. Start with Leonard, see if CP3 wants to be a Spur and if he does put together a roster that can contend next season. Standing pat will only have the same results, Spurs might have won 1 game vs the Warriors if Leonard didn't get hurt. Spurs have to see what moves they can make to compete with the Warriors if they want to try and bring an NBA title back to San Antonio. A big 3 of Leonard, CP3 and Aldridge is a start, after that worry about the other pieces and how they fit. If CP3 stays with Clips, try to get Rose or Rubio and trade for Melo.

So the Spurs win the first game? Then lose 4 straight? How do? And what did you see this season prior to think the Warriors would dominate?

[Mnky]

Easy choice is yes. Seriously, how "deep" was the team when kawhi went down? Thats the depth that cp3 cost? I'll gladly pay that. Kawhi needs help. This depth doesn't exist, he just made everyone's job way easier as he will do with whoever joins. Cp3 is worth losing parker and Gasol for sure as they were both no shows. Patty always plays bad against gs, and Danny is a great asset on D, but i havr no doubt that can be replaced with someone who can dribble.

Spurs did not have as much depth as people make it out to be. Had a bunch of role players that Pop helped make look great. It is what it is. You dont pass on a top 10 player in this day. Team will have way more options next year with cp3 and kawhi the bargaining chips. That's a hell of a sale for anyone wanting to win. Gsw only have so kany open roster spots tbh.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

:lol Spurs aren't dumping or stretching Parker.

If they want to create the $35.4 mil or so needed for Paul they'd have to do more than trading Pau and Green and renouncing every upcoming FA.

[tmtcsc]

Lol, sure, but you are forgetting the part where we are loyal to the players who helped build our franchise. We wont dump him, he has been a legend for us and we will not do him like that.

Name one player the Spurs kept for the sake of "not doing him like that". A player past their usefulness?

George Gervin - traded (Age 33)
Alvin Robertson - traded (Age 26)
Avery Johnson - Not re-signed (Age 34)
Sean Elliott - Traded (Age 25)
Malik Rose - traded
Bruce Bowen - traded (Age 38)
David Robinson - retired (Age 37)
George Hill - traded (Age 24)
Brent Barry - Traded to Seattle /Re-signed with Spurs after 30 days / Left via Free Agency
Willie Anderson - Left unprotected to Expansion draft (Age 28)
Rod Strickland - not re-signed
Matt Bonner - not re-signed
Manu Ginobili - still playing, still welcomed back, still useful
Tim Duncan - Retired a Spur / kept until the wheels fell off and still played at a high level (Age 40)
Vinny Del Negro - Not re-signed
Jaren Jackson - Not re-signed
Steve Smith - Not re-signed
Stephen Jackson - Not re-signed
Steve Kerr - Traded by Spurs / Re-signed by Spurs / Retired a Spur (Age 37)
Robert Horry - Not re-signed (wanted to come back) (Age 37)
Fabricio Oberto - traded (Age 34)
Tiago Splitter - Traded
Danny Ferry - Retired a Spur
Terry Cummings - Not re-signed

[tmtcsc]

I don't know why you would discredit Tony. All he has ever done is won with this team. Played his heart out. Won a finals MVP. Did what Pop told him to. Lead behind the scenes. Don't you think the Spurs owe it to him to let him give it a shot? To keep him, and to pay and rehabilitate him through his treatment? It is one more year until his contract is up.

Owe it to him? Absolutely not. He was paid handsomely for his services. That is the literal pay back. Its hard-core but the NBA is a business. How do you tell the other guys in the locker room that you are potentially passing on a Championship run for the sake of one player who is a long shot to ever play again? How do you justify it to Kawhi Leonard? A guy who desperately wants to be the best and win championships that "We as an organization value being good-hearted over winning" ? Its not realistic. I'm sure the team will honor Tony for his career by retiring his number. But beyond that, there is nothing else to do. He's going to get paid for his final year.

He sent a message to the Spurs through the French newspaper, that he wasn't going to retire. Ok, fine. Then he will end up playing out his final year on another team (his choice) or will get waived by another team in a salary dump before he can ever suit up again. Shit man, even Emmitt Smith was let go by the Cowboys. I'm sure they wanted him to retire but he felt he could still play. Adios.

[MaNu4Tres]

Spurs will get exploited on D when it matters if they keep TP over Green.

[tmtcsc]

:lol Spurs aren't dumping or stretching Parker.

If they want to create the $35.4 mil or so needed for Paul they'd have to do more than trading Pau and Green and renouncing every upcoming FA.

If they can improve the roster by ridding themselves of TP's contract, they will absolutely do it. Will it be for CP3? I don't know because there are legitimate injury concerns with him. Not sure what is up with all his hand injuries and hamstring pulls.

Why do you think the Spurs would need 35.4 mil to sign CP3? That seems excessive. He won't get the max from the Spurs. If he wants to come here to win and play with Leonard / Aldridge, he will need to take less money. Even if the SPurs pay him $25 Mill per season, he would be the highest paid player on the team. Forget what you read on various sites about needing to flush the roster, Salary dumping TP and trading Green will most likely get it done.

Mills & Dedmon will probably leave somewhere else but that was expected. Hopefully the Spurs can keep Simmons.

So if gutting means saying bye to:

Patty Mills
Dedmon
Tony Parker
Danny Green

Then yeah, the team is being gutted. If Pau opts in to his contract, I doubt he gets traded. I bet Manu comes back to play another year and a chance to play with CP3 would help in the decision.

[tmtcsc]

Spurs will get exploited on D when it matters if they keep TP over Green.

They will both need to go. Danny was a terrific defensive player but his offense was woeful. If he wasn't making 3's, he probably wasn't scoring. Sucked at the FT line too. The Spurs need someone more versatile at the 2 guard.

[TheGreatYacht]

Danny for Covington or Homes. Will Philly take it?
Absolutely. Their starting SG is white American scrub Stauskas and they're poised to take Josh Jackson, SF, in the draft. If they sign hometown guy Lowry or bring back Holiday, they can make the playoffs with a starting 5 of Lowry, Green, Jackson, Simmons, Embiid

I want Richaun Holmes though. Spurs need to get him at all costs. Been praising him for 2 years now that he produces when given playing time. Averaged 14 & 7 as a starter this season. Knows how to get open in the paint and can even stretch the floor a little.

[MaNu4Tres]

They will both need to go. Danny was a terrific defensive player but his offense was woeful. If he wasn't making 3's, he probably wasn't scoring. Sucked at the FT line too. The Spurs need someone more versatile at the 2 guard.

No i disagree.

Pau needs to go, not Danny.

Spurs need as many good perimeter defenders as possible vs the only two teams that matter.

[MaNu4Tres]

They will both need to go. Danny was a terrific defensive player but his offense was woeful. If he wasn't making 3's, he probably wasn't scoring. Sucked at the FT line too. The Spurs need someone more versatile at the 2 guard.

No i disagree.

Pau needs to go, not Danny.

Spurs need as many good perimeter defenders as possible in todays NBA.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Why won't the Spurs just pay the luxury tax just once lol?

Their willingness to pay the tax doesn't factor at all with regards to getting Paul or anyone else this summer. In fact, potentially going after Paul shows they're very willing to pay the tax for the Kawhi-Paul-Aldridge trio after 2018.

Can't create a great team by staying under the cap for 3-4 seasons in a row.

[Cloud786]

Any plausible sign and trade scenarios?

[Chillen]

I bet Spurs front office is gonna try and restructure Pau Gasol's contract, and resign David Lee. That means the fall guys for possibly signing CP3 will probably be Green and Parker, etc. There might be other trades possibly I know Gasol didn't have a good season but he is a good team player.

[cutewizard]

:toast

[tbdog]

Owe it to him? Absolutely not. He was paid handsomely for his services. That is the literal pay back. Its hard-core but the NBA is a business. How do you tell the other guys in the locker room that you are potentially passing on a Championship run for the sake of one player who is a long shot to ever play again? How do you justify it to Kawhi Leonard? A guy who desperately wants to be the best and win championships that "We as an organization value being good-hearted over winning" ? Its not realistic. I'm sure the team will honor Tony for his career by retiring his number. But beyond that, there is nothing else to do. He's going to get paid for his final year.

He sent a message to the Spurs through the French newspaper, that he wasn't going to retire. Ok, fine. Then he will end up playing out his final year on another team (his choice) or will get waived by another team in a salary dump before he can ever suit up again. Shit man, even Emmitt Smith was let go by the Cowboys. I'm sure they wanted him to retire but he felt he could still play. Adios.

If it was for a sure thing like CP, then yeah, sure, business comes first I suppose. But for Crabbe? No. You trust your champion point guard he has something left.

[Clipper Nation]

But you know we cant do that. You can do an all time franchise great that way.
They're not doing Manu that way. He's referring to Porker's contract, though.

[szkorhetz]

Absolutely. Their starting SG is white American scrub Stauskas and they're poised to take Josh Jackson, SF, in the draft. If they sign hometown guy Lowry or bring back Holiday, they can make the playoffs with a starting 5 of Lowry, Green, Jackson, Simmons, Embiid

I want Richaun Holmes though. Spurs need to get him at all costs. Been praising him for 2 years now that he produces when given playing time. Averaged 14 & 7 as a starter this season. Knows how to get open in the paint and can even stretch the floor a little.
i would love to get Chris McCullough, TBH.

[SASdynasty!]

I'd take Cliff Paul over Chris Paul tbh. At least he doesn't have a hisory of losing.

[szkorhetz]

I seriously think that this CP3 to us is just a smokescreen and they already agreed to bring back George Hill.

[sasaint]

Owe it to him? Absolutely not. He was paid handsomely for his services. That is the literal pay back. Its hard-core but the NBA is a business. How do you tell the other guys in the locker room that you are potentially passing on a Championship run for the sake of one player who is a long shot to ever play again? How do you justify it to Kawhi Leonard? A guy who desperately wants to be the best and win championships that "We as an organization value being good-hearted over winning" ? Its not realistic. I'm sure the team will honor Tony for his career by retiring his number. But beyond that, there is nothing else to do. He's going to get paid for his final year.

He sent a message to the Spurs through the French newspaper, that he wasn't going to retire. Ok, fine. Then he will end up playing out his final year on another team (his choice) or will get waived by another team in a salary dump before he can ever suit up again. Shit man, even Emmitt Smith was let go by the Cowboys. I'm sure they wanted him to retire but he felt he could still play. Adios.

:tu Excellent, rational perspective. I sure hope PATFO realizes this stuff. But I am just not sure.

[peacemaker885]

Spurs owe the big 3 everything. Parker isn't going anywhere, just as it should be.

[DD]

I feel like it's a roll of the dice...but it may be warranted.

Everyone has gotten enamored with the first half of Game 1, but...that still did not guarantee that we would beat the Warriors. What is even more disturbing, though...is how the team just completely fell apart without Kawhi.

That would not have happened with Duncan.

This team needs another leader who is hungry...and Paul fits the narrative.

Otherwise, we reload with what we have and hope for better luck next year.

Smartest thing anyone has said on this forum in a few months. Just look at a couple of the Spurs-Thunder playoff matchups. In the later rounds the more talented team will almost always win, despite an egg here and there. They are Kawhi and a bunch of scrubs vs a stacked team.

Hell yes you go after Paul...other than Kawhi and Murray that whole team is expendable.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

No i disagree.

Pau needs to go, not Danny.

Spurs need as many good perimeter defenders as possible vs the only two teams that matter.

This!

[tmtcsc]

This!

Danny is the most realistic, cap-friendly, trade-able asset on the roster. Would like to keep him but I think he would be the one to go.

[tmtcsc]

I feel like it's a roll of the dice...but it may be warranted.

Everyone has gotten enamored with the first half of Game 1, but...that still did not guarantee that we would beat the Warriors. What is even more disturbing, though...is how the team just completely fell apart without Kawhi.

That would not have happened with Duncan.

This team needs another leader who is hungry...and Paul fits the narrative.

Otherwise, we reload with what we have and hope for better luck next year.

You're absolutely right about 2 things:

1. There is no guarantee that the Spurs would have won the series, BUT - Kawhi showed that he could guard KD better than anyone else in the playoffs so far. The Spurs took a couple of GS' punches and kept their cool. We all know that the last time KL was on the court, the lead was 23 points with 20 minutes left in the game.

I've maintained for a while that our roster was built to beat the Warriors - including having Pau. We weren't the fastest, best shooting team out there but we had the right game plan. As for Duncan and the outcome, go back & look at Game 3 of the 2001 WCF. Spurs lost by 39 points (72-111) in Los Angeles with a healthy TD & David Robinson. That was a young, prime Duncan, not what we saw against OKC last year. Fluke you say? Look at Game 4 of that same series. 29 point loss (111-82) with Tim scoring only 15 points.

2. Spurs need another leader who is hungry. I like that Paul is a vocal, high IQ player that is hungry to win a championship. I'd take a chance on him and hope he stays away from the strange injuries. He would have made Aldridge's life much easier with the Pick & Pop shots. We learned all too well that L can't post up or handle double teams.

[tmtcsc]

Spurs owe the big 3 everything. Parker isn't going anywhere, just as it should be.

What? Why? Did they not get paid? Didn't the FO surround them with the right complimentary pieces to compete for a chip every year? Did Pop help each one of them extend their careers by limiting their minutes? You have 2 of the big 3 playing until they were at least 39 years old. That is amazing. TP just suffered a horrible injury that will rob him of whatever speed he had left. He was a very old 34 year old player with lots of miles on his body. The organization didn't give him too much heat when he wanted to play with his national team either.

It's time for TP to realize that its over. It would be great for him to retire without ever wearing another team's jersey but he seems to want to come back & play. Maybe he'll figure out soon that he just can't compete at an NBA level anymore.

[buttsR4rebounding]

If Paul wants to play with the Spurs and maximize his chances of getting a ring or two, he signs a 2 year deal around 25million to start. Opts out next year when Tony comes off. Spurs can then sign him to a max or near max 4 year deal with cap space. That would start somewhere around $35 million. It would give a five year total of $180 to 185 million vs $205 million for LAC. He would pay an additional $13.6 million in taxes by signing with LA so the total 5 year difference is $10 million give or take.

If he does this the Spurs can keep Parker (renounce him next year), keep Green, possibly resign Simmons.

Paul/Murray/Forbes/Post-op Parker
Green/Simmons/5 minute-a-game Ginobili re-signed on a vet min
KL/KA/Hanga
Aldridge/Mulitunov
David Lee/29 pick?/Splitter?

The fallacy of Paul having to leave $40 million on the table is only due to comparing a 5 year deal to a possible 4 year deal. If anything, the Clippers start off in the hole thanks to California's ridiculous 13.3% top state income tax rate. Allowing the Spurs to delay the max contract until next year when Tony would come off the books is better for everyone. It also allows the Spurs to treat Tony like they would want to. The only risk Paul would take is if there were a career ending injury this year which could be insured for, at least partially.

[Russ]

People have made some good points in CP3's favor and some good points against him.

Here are two facts that seem to have been forgotten: CP3 is both undersized and unathletic, a tough combination.

I realize those two deficiencies are less problematic for a lead guard than for other positions.

Still he might be tough to hide on the court against Golden State.

[buttsR4rebounding]

People have made some good points in CP3's favor and some good points against him.

Here are two facts that seem to have been forgotten: CP3 is both undersized and unathletic, a tough combination.

I realize those two deficiencies are less problematic for a lead guard than for other positions.

Still he might be tough to hide on the court against Golden State.

Not any moreso that Parker would have been. Also, he does have good instincts as he is always among the league leaders in steals. And don't forget about his uncanny flopping ability! (Crap, I think he just read this and fell over.)

[SPURt]

What if Chris Paul tells the Spurs he will sign with them, they gut the team to make room then he still goes back to LAC? Seems like a Clipper thing to do.

[RD2191]

What if Chris Paul tells the Spurs he will sign with them, they gut the team to make room then he still goes back to LAC? Seems like a Clipper thing to do.

We'll take a fukin bat to his knees TBH.

[buttsR4rebounding]

What if Chris Paul tells the Spurs he will sign with them, they gut the team to make room then he still goes back to LAC? Seems like a Clipper thing to do.

The primary moves the Spurs have to make are renounce Patty, renounce Manu, dump Pau for no salary back. Not exactly gutting the team...

[tmtcsc]

What if Chris Paul tells the Spurs he will sign with them, they gut the team to make room then he still goes back to LAC? Seems like a Clipper thing to do.

Low risk, imo. Secondly, I think its pretty safe to assume the Spurs will not overpay Patty or Dedmon. IF Manu comes back for another season, it will not be for 14 Mill. The Spurs need to tweak the roster to better themselves for next year. The complete collapse against GS without Kawhi Leonard on the floor was alarming. The one player I am not sure about is Simmons. How much does the coaching staff value him? Forget what the talking heads said about Simmons "About to get paid"...the coaching staff knows his true worth. A few good games does not make this guy irreplaceable. I remember the highlight reel plays but I also remember all the slip-ups. He was "Ok" and worth a raise but if you are the Spurs, you don't over-pay him. He's not worth it. His perimeter game is still suspect and he often plays out of control. Otherwise, he would have gotten more minutes throughout the year.

[buttsR4rebounding]

Low risk, imo. Secondly, I think its pretty safe to assume the Spurs will not overpay Patty or Dedmon. IF Manu comes back for another season, it will not be for 14 Mill. The Spurs need to tweak the roster to better themselves for next year. The complete collapse against GS without Kawhi Leonard on the floor was alarming. The one player I am not sure about is Simmons. How much does the coaching staff value him? Forget what the talking heads said about Simmons "About to get paid"...the coaching staff knows his true worth. A few good games does not make this guy irreplaceable. I remember the highlight reel plays but I also remember all the slip-ups. He was "Ok" and worth a raise but if your Spurs, you don't over-pay him. He's not worth it. His perimeter game is still suspect and he often plays out of control. Otherwise, he would have gotten more minutes throughout the year.

I think Simmons value is likely as a back-up at the 2 and the 3. You can't pay him starter money.

[sasaint]

Low risk, imo. Secondly, I think its pretty safe to assume the Spurs will not overpay Patty or Dedmon. IF Manu comes back for another season, it will not be for 14 Mill. The Spurs need to tweak the roster to better themselves for next year. The complete collapse against GS without Kawhi Leonard on the floor was alarming. The one player I am not sure about is Simmons. How much does the coaching staff value him? Forget what the talking heads said about Simmons "About to get paid"...the coaching staff knows his true worth. A few good games does not make this guy irreplaceable. I remember the highlight reel plays but I also remember all the slip-ups. He was "Ok" and worth a raise but if you are the Spurs, you don't over-pay him. He's not worth it. His perimeter game is still suspect and he often plays out of control. Otherwise, he would have gotten more minutes throughout the year.

I have been in Simmons' corner since his first SL game. I love the flashes he has shown and the potential they promise. But he really seems to me like Lance Stephenson without the emotional baggage. Whether he could become a reliable, consistent player is a question that will be answered by another team at a high price. I would like to have him back at the right price, but some team will likely overpay him.

[TheGreatYacht]

What if Chris Paul tells the Spurs he will sign with them, they gut the team to make room then he still goes back to LAC? Seems like a Clipper thing to do.
So the Spurs will dump Manure, Gasol, Pity Mills, Deadman</3, Lee, and D-League?

Spurs fans should thank CP3 if he's the reason we avoid those terrible contracts....

[TD 21]

This is very much just an excuse. He's been "the best player" on a team with multiple All-Stars more than once. I don't care if each individual year there's some rationale for him not making it. He should have made it one of those years. That's all on him.

What you call excuses, I call reasons. Griffin is the only elite player he's ever played with. Considering that, the lack of a top 2 team and the difficulty of the conference, I wouldn't say he "should have made it"; more like he could have made it.


Again, this is an excuse. If he's not good enough to be a first option, why are people trying to say he is? Those stats that make him seem like a top-five post-season player and this thread in general paint him out to be some no-brainer superstar for whom the team should bend over backwards. Those types of players get to the third round.

Reality is, in the NBA, there's usually less than a handful of players at a given time capable of being the go to scorer on a championship team and it's almost impossible for a small guard to be it. Like Garnett, Paul can be the best all around player, but not the go to scorer. He's still a clear top 10 player though.


He already does that now. But instead of him going off like he did against Memphis, you'll get him being a taller version of Redick. Would be great for Kawhi's TS%, but I doubt anyone but maybe me would be okay with him not going Kawhiso/Kawhichel.

He'd get more with an elite play maker though and there's no chance he'd turn into Redick. There would be more of a balance. Irving, for example, had a .8 edge on James in usage rate this season. I'd expect something similar, but Paul having it a lot is a good thing.


Aldridge not being a vagina (and Pop not enabling that) in the WCF would move the needle. You don't need a max PG for that. You need guys who can get buckets against good defense and guys who can defend players much better than them.

No, it wouldn't. The team isn't talented enough and getting Paul would allow Aldridge to slide into his rightful place on a championships team: Heat Bosh or Cavs Love. Of course, he'd need to lose about 15 pounds and turn more mid rangers into 3's, too.


Most important is a healthy team where everyone is playing better. LMA's game was not hampered by a lack of a PG; it was hampered by piss-poor offense. Pop had one job to do as it pertained to getting LMA to play his best, and he couldn't fucking do it. That only underscores why thinking Paul is going to be different is wrong-headed. Pop's going to end up with an offense that is 60-percent Paul dribbling, 30 percent Kawhiso and 10 percent LMA fadeaways. Long gone is the coach that actually leveraged his players' talents.

Wrong. They didn't utilize him correctly. They tried to force feed him into being prime Duncan. For whatever reason(s), he clearly had trouble creating his own shot this season and would be better off spacing the floor, picking-and-popping and only posting up when there's a perceived mismatch.


Again, the detractors can nitpick this to death, but the salient question you all refuse to answer is: What's more likely to bring another championship in the foreseeable future?

[cool cat]

Problem is this team might be gutted without getting CP3.

Mills might leave.
Deadmon most likely gone.
Simmons might get poison pill contract.
Manu retire.
Who knows when Parker will be ready.
Lee leaves for bigger contract.
Unlikely, but Pau could opt out.

[TheGreatYacht]

Problem is this team might be gutted without getting CP3.

Mills might leave.
Deadmon most likely gone.
Simmons might get poison pill contract.
Manu retire.
Who knows when Parker will be ready.
Lee leaves for bigger contract.
Unlikely, but Pau could opt out.
Some other team paying Pity Mills instead of us is a blessing
Deadmon is easily replaceable
Simmons will get Solomon Hill/Allen Crabbe money
Manure retires? About time
Parker will be better than ever in Feb
Another ringchaser will take Lee's spot
Pau will get traded.

[tmtcsc]

Simmons will get Solomon Hill/Allen Crabbe money
Parker will be better than ever in Feb


https://media.giphy.com/media/KpAPQVW9lWnWU/giphy.gif

[SPURt]

So the Spurs will dump Manure, Gasol, Pity Mills, Deadman</3, Lee, and D-League?

Spurs fans should thank CP3 if he's the reason we avoid those terrible contracts....
If CP3 did do this nefarious deed you may find there is more putrid options out there than the names you mentioned.

[xtremesteven33]

Spurs getting Chris Paul while mainting Green, and Aldridge would be a huge win. CP3 is the type of point guard Pop has always secretly wanted Parker to be IMO. Pop tried to mold Tony in the Avery Johnson mold but that was never who Parker was at first. It took him years to develop floor general skills while it seems Chris Paul came into the league with that mentality.

Chris Paul is a very ball dominant PG because he plays old school PG ball. Paul is Pops wet dream of what a PG should be in basketball. Tough, vocal, clutch and a never say die attitude. Im sure Tim Duncan thinks the world of Chris Paul as well. The Spurs have been successful despite of Parkers traditional PG skillset. Don't get me wrong Parker is a fantastic player and champion but I think Pop really would prefer him to still play like CP3.

I hope the Spurs land Chris Paul but the only risk would be how much he would want and for how long? If the Spurs can manage to strike a fair deal, the Spurs are right back in the title picture.

[Chinook]

I think Parker became exactly who Pop wanted him to be. Pop was able to build his best offense ever around Tony's gravity forcing mismatches. CP3 can do a lot of things better than Parker, but he'll likely never be able to leverage a "Loop" level system -- especially without holding the ball.

[dabom]

CP3 is a fucking superstar that porker could never achieve. He's just better skilled than porker at everything. :lmao

[dabom]

"loop" level system. :lol

Is that supposed to be some dig? :lmao

Manu and CP3 are maestros. Nothing like porker. :lol

[SASdynasty!]

CP3 is a fucking superstar that porker could never achieve. He's just better skilled than porker at everything. :lmao
Hahaha comparing a 4x champion FMVP to a loser that couldn't make the WCF his whole career with a stacked team and good coach. Not to mention how Parker humiliated him in his prime.

This guy lost to the Jazz in the first round this year. Are you kidding me?

[SASdynasty!]

I think Parker became exactly who Pop wanted him to be. Pop was able to build his best offense ever around Tony's gravity forcing mismatches. CP3 can do a lot of things better than Parker, but he'll likely never be able to leverage a "Loop" level system -- especially without holding the ball.
Yah no kidding. This statpadder will drive the Spurs back to early playoff exits...but he'll get his numbers!

[jimbo]

team is already garbage, might as well

i want to see pop work with some new meat, not these TOSB & holdovers from the last championship

[DMC]

Manu could do one year in Philly with Bret for 14m or so just to finish out his career, and to get Philly some vet presence on the floor. From there he could move to coaching.

Tony is coming back and he's starting. I cannot see Pop seriously pursuing the CP3 deal without talking to Tony first and making it known that CP3 is starting. It won't get the Spurs over the hump either way. They'd need another big name like Paul George or Gordon Hayward to come along, two people who can create off the dribble (some) but neither of those guys are going to take a pay hit to play in SA. They are going to go for money, and I think George will end up with the Clippers while Blake will likely end up in either OKC or Denver.

[tmtcsc]

Tony is coming back and he's starting. I cannot see Pop seriously pursuing the CP3 deal without talking to Tony first and making it known that CP3 is starting.

C'mon man, You don't believe that. You're goofing right? You think Pop would make sure TP was ok with the team pursuing CP3 as the starter? You think that's how Pop operates? That shit doesn't fly with the Spurs. There is 1 Alpha in the organization and its Pop. If players don't like the way he and his 5 x Champion pedigree does things, you can get the fuck out. He's made that very clear and is one of the reasons CP3 would want to come here. I'm sure Pop would tell CP3 his on-court demeaning or public bitching-out of others aint gonna fly. CP3 is a nobody compared to Coach Popovich and TP is even less.

[tmtcsc]

Why do people keep thinking Tp is coming back, much less starting? Did you not see him play the last few years? BEFORE his injury, it was clear he lost his speed, quickness and lift. Add to all that, the dude is 35 years old. He just suffered a very rare injury that athletes don't come back from. He's a proud dude, believes he can do it, but that doesn't mean you all have to. He's entering the last year of his contract and will get paid 15 Million dollars no matter what. I don't think the organization had any interest letting him ride out in to the sunset with another contract. He's 100% done and I doubt he ever makes it back on the court. It would be a miracle.

[dbreiden83080]

If he can stay healthy paired with Leonard and LA, we can win a title in the next 3 years..

[DMC]

C'mon man, You don't believe that. You're goofing right? You think Pop would make sure TP was ok with the team pursuing CP3 as the starter? You think that's how Pop operates? That shit doesn't fly with the Spurs. There is 1 Alpha in the organization and its Pop. If players don't like the way he and his 5 x Champion pedigree does things, you can get the fuck out. He's made that very clear and is one of the reasons CP3 would want to come here. I'm sure Pop would tell CP3 his on-court demeaning or public bitching-out of others aint gonna fly. CP3 is a nobody compared to Coach Popovich and TP is even less.

I don't think Pop would need Tony's approval but he'd talk with him first to get him interested in the project, and Tony and Chris are friends so Pop would rely on Tony to coax Paul into wanting to come to SA. In order for that to happen, Tony would have to let Chris know that he's ok with it. Pop would need to know Tony is indeed OK with it. I never mentioned getting his approval. No need to read into it things I didn't say.

Pop stuck with Bonner until Bonner retired. He won't trade or waive Tony unless Tony makes that decision. If you don't realize that you've not really paid attention.

[dbreiden83080]

Why do people keep thinking Tp is coming back, much less starting? Did you not see him play the last few years? BEFORE his injury, it was clear he lost his speed, quickness and lift. Add to all that, the dude is 35 years old. He just suffered a very rare injury that athletes don't come back from. He's a proud dude, believes he can do it, but that doesn't mean you all have to. He's entering the last year of his contract and will get paid 15 Million dollars no matter what. I don't think the organization had any interest letting him ride out in to the sunset with another contract. He's 100% done and I doubt he ever makes it back on the court. It would be a miracle.

Agreed. Tony is 35 and that is a devastating career ending injury.. His legs were bad before this.. Truth be told considering how hard Tim was pushing at the end of his career and the state of that knee, it's a miracle he did not suffer something similar.

[Chillen]

Agreed. Tony is 35 and that is a devastating career ending injury.. His legs were bad before this.. Truth be told considering how hard Tim was pushing at the end of his career and the state of that knee, it's a miracle he did not suffer something similar.

Yes, thankfully Tim ended his career in a Timmy like way just walking off the court in OKC looking at no one and puts his hand in the air bye. I feel bad for Tony on that play as he was a great Spur and if Spurs can't sign CP3 pretty sure they will wait to see what he has left in the tank once he heals. If they can sign CP3 odds are that was Parker's last game as a Spur to.

[tmtcsc]

Pop stuck with Bonner until Bonner retired. He won't trade or waive Tony unless Tony makes that decision. If you don't realize that you've not really paid attention.

Lol, I haven't paid attention? Bonner was unceremoniously shown the door when his contract expired. He retired when Pop said it was time.:

Read here -> http://news4sanantonio.com/sports/spurs-zone/matt-bonner-im-probably-not-going-to-be-with-the-spurs

This isn't 2007 Tony Parker we are talking about. TP got his Finals MVP 10 years ago. Let that sink in for a minute. He's old AND injured. He's done. He's never been what Manu and Tim were to the organization. I don't think people realize that. The guy messed around with another player's wife. Whether it was sexting or a physical affair doesn't matter. Its amazing he lasted this long on the team. When you think of the team's culture and selflessness, you think of Manu, not TP.

[tmtcsc]

Yes, thankfully Tim ended his career in a Timmy like way just walking off the court in OKC looking at no one and puts his hand in the air bye. I feel bad for Tony on that play as he was a great Spur and if Spurs can't sign CP3 pretty sure they will wait to see what he has left in the tank once he heals. If they can sign CP3 odds are that was Parker's last game as a Spur to.

Some people remember Tim getting his shot blocked at the end of the game. I remember him playing his ass off the entire night and going out with everything he had. - Including 5 rings. Dude was a Champion until the end.

[tmtcsc]

Agreed. Tony is 35 and that is a devastating career ending injury.. His legs were bad before this.. Truth be told considering how hard Tim was pushing at the end of his career and the state of that knee, it's a miracle he did not suffer something similar.

It was actually both knees at the end. What he was able to accomplish with all the mileage was unreal. He was still playing at a high-level, his knees just didn't cooperate.

[DMC]

Lol, I haven't paid attention? Bonner was unceremoniously shown the door when his contract expired. He retired when Pop said it was time.:

:lol Bonner was done years ago. His contract was up. Pop didn't show him the door.


Read here -> http://news4sanantonio.com/sports/spurs-zone/matt-bonner-im-probably-not-going-to-be-with-the-spurs

Of course, his contract expired. Tony's hasn't.


This isn't 2007 Tony Parker we are talking about. TP got his Finals MVP 10 years ago. Let that sink in for a minute. He's old AND injured. He's done. He's never been what Manu and Tim were to the organization. I don't think people realize that. The guy messed around with another player's wife. Whether it was sexting or a physical affair doesn't matter. Its amazing he lasted this long on the team. When you think of the team's culture and selflessness, you think of Manu, not TP.
It wasn't 2007 Tony since 2007. He's been almost pure shit in the post season for the last 3 post seasons, even during the 2014 Finals he sucked. He still gets his starting role though. Don't be naive. I don't think of any of them. Manu took 14m to play very limited minutes last year because Philly would have paid him more. It's a business. Tony is coming back.

[tmtcsc]

:lol Bonner was done years ago. His contract was up. Pop didn't show him the door.

Of course, his contract expired. Tony's hasn't.

It wasn't 2007 Tony since 2007. He's been almost pure shit in the post season for the last 3 post seasons, even during the 2014 Finals he sucked. He still gets his starting role though. Don't be naive. I don't think of any of them. Manu took 14m to play very limited minutes last year because Philly would have paid him more. It's a business. Tony is coming back.

Robert Horry and Matt Bonner wanted to continue playing after their last contracts expired. The Spurs didn't want them back - that's showing them the door. You said Pop let Bonner play until he retired as if it was on Matt's terms. That's not what happened. Once the team decided to move on, they moved on. I listed many players earlier in this thread - alot of them beloved by the fans - that the Spurs traded toward the end of their careers. I'm not the one being naive here. It's a business and TP costs a lot of money for someone who won't be playing. If the Spurs F.O. can find a place to dump his salary, they will. He doesn't have a no-trade clause.

Patty Mills was not the answer at PG and neither is Murray at this stage. The Spurs need to find another PG & if CP3 wants to be here, they will likely do what is necessary to make it happen. IMO, you move the dead weight of TP's 15 Million per season and DG's 10 Million. CP3 has about 3 or 4 solid years left if he can stay healthy.

As for Manu, I'm sure Pop would love to have him back for another season but it won't be for 14 Mill. per season. That was an unexpected punch in the nuts courtesy of Philly.

[Chillen]

As for Manu, I'm sure Pop would love to have him back for another season but it won't be for 14 Mill. per season. That was an unexpected punch in the nuts courtesy of Philly.

Manu didn't look done in the playoffs, he played alright, some good scoring, passes and that block on Harden was amazing. I think he has another season left in the tank if he wants to do it.

[szkorhetz]

If he can stay healthy paired with Leonard and LA, we can win a title in the next 3 years..
No one is beating gsw in the west.

[Chillen]

No one is beating gsw in the west.

The Warriors have made it to three straight NBA finals, eventually they will have an off year due to all the grind of all these long seasons, it happens to all teams that get that far. More than likely Durant is gonna have to carry them all next season to even win near 60 games again. Curry isn't LeBron, he is a skilled smart player but his body will need rest.

[DPG21920]

On the surface losing Mills/Dedmon/Pau/TP for CP is no big deal. Like someone said Dedmon / Pau / TP either due to matchup or injury didn't play basically after RD1.

Plus it allows you to take fliers (more forces you to) on different players that may be younger and more niche / custom built.

The issue becomes, like many of us questioned early, the fit. Any superstar would have fit concerns and not just on Spurs. People questioned Bron Wade Bosh fit even though we all knew the insane talent level.

But ball dominant players are EASILY the most difficult players to fit in. It's legit concern even though the talent level would go up.

I'm torn. It's not a bad plan because the players Sa would be losing aren't a huge deal. But age and money and more importantly fit are concerns. I'm not too worried about money because if CP3 is an awful fit he's still immensely tradable.

[coachmac87]

On the surface losing Mills/Dedmon/Pau/TP for CP is no big deal. Like someone said Dedmon / Pau / TP either due to matchup or injury didn't play basically after RD1.

Plus it allows you to take fliers (more forces you to) on different players that may be younger and more niche / custom built.

The issue becomes, like many of us questioned early, the fit. Any superstar would have fit concerns and not just on Spurs. People questioned Bron Wade Bosh fit even though we all knew the insane talent level.

But ball dominant players are EASILY the most difficult players to fit in. It's legit concern even though the talent level would go up.

I'm torn. It's not a bad plan because the players Sa would be losing aren't a huge deal. But age and money and more importantly fit are concerns. I'm not too worried about money because if CP3 is an awful fit he's still immensely tradable.


The ball dominant things is a little overblown imo..there aren't many elite PG's that aren't except Curry. But Paul is an extremely efficient player and runs one of the best offenses past couple of years. Westbrook who's considered the best PG in the league is extremely ball dominant..but Paul is a better shooter, ball handler and passer..only thing Westbrook is better at is attacking the rim or paint...

So it's not as much as Paul style of play that isn't appealing to others..it's that he's 32 and could demand a max..Clippers had an elite offense and that's because of Paul...add a floor general like that to the Spurs? A team with another superstar and one of the better defenses??! It's a no brainier if you can create the proper cap space

[TheGreatYacht]

The usual suspects slamming Paul because he, a point guard, has the ball as often as he does. Vanilla nostalgia fans. This is a PG era. This isn't the 90s when you had white point guards that dribbled with one hand and fed their post player ala Patty Mills.

Clippers with Paul: 43-18
Clippers without Paul: 8-13

:cry but mah point guard holds the ball too much :cry

Also lmfao @ posters pinning his team's shortcomings on him. He literally elevates his game in the playoffs and was a Top 3 player these playoffs. Not his fault some max player on his team can't play thru toe injuries.

Chris Paul career reg season stats:
18.7ppg, 4.4rpg, 9.9apg, 47.3FG%, 37 3P%, 2.4TO

Chris Paul career playoffs stats:
21.4ppg, 4.7rpg, 9.4apg, 48.4FG%, 38.1 3P%, 2.7TO

:wow those shooting percentages. Only Parker and Curry have been that efficient as point guards iirc

[coachmac87]

The usual suspects slamming Paul because he, a point guard, has the ball as often as he does. Vanilla nostalgia fans. This is a PG era. This isn't the 90s when you had white point guards that dribbled with one hand and fed their post player ala Patty Mills.

Clippers with Paul: 43-18
Clippers without Paul: 8-13

:cry but mah point guard holds the ball too much :cry

Also lmfao @ posters pinning his team's shortcomings on him. He literally elevates his game in the playoffs and was a Top 3 player these playoffs. Not his fault some max player on his team can't play thru toe injuries.

Chris Paul career reg season stats:
18.7ppg, 4.4rpg, 9.9apg, 47.3FG%, 37 3P%, 2.4TO

Chris Paul career playoffs stats:
21.4ppg, 4.7rpg, 9.4apg, 48.4FG%, 38.1 3P%, 2.7TO

:wow those shooting percentages. Only Parker and Curry have been that efficient as point guards iirc


Great post...

[tim_duncan_fan]

I'm hesitant about him for age/injury/salary reasons but if Paul is a tough asshole that's a major plus in my opinion.

This team is too soft.

[TheGreatYacht]

http://a.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=/i/headshots/nba/players/full/3988.png&w=350&h=254
2016-2017 playoffs stats:
7.8ppg, 3.6rpg, 1.4apg, 0.6spg, 0.9bpg, 34.2 3P%

http://a.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=/i/headshots/nba/players/full/996.png&w=350&h=254
2016-2017 playoffs stats:
7.7ppg, 7.1rpg, 1.9apg, 0.4spg, 0.9bpg, 43.9FG%

Or

http://a.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=/i/headshots/nba/players/full/2779.png&w=350&h=254
2016-2017 playoffs stats:
25.3ppg, 5.0rpg, 9.9apg, 49.6FG%, 28.1PER, 24.9 WS/48, 12.2BPM




Not going to count Mills, Simmons, and Dedmon because they're about to get paid. So it's unrealistic keeping them. Only Simmons is worth the money. Ginobili? He can come back for the vets min or gtfo

[DPG21920]

The ball dominant things is a little overblown imo..there aren't many elite PG's that aren't except Curry. But Paul is an extremely efficient player and runs one of the best offenses past couple of years. Westbrook who's considered the best PG in the league is extremely ball dominant..but Paul is a better shooter, ball handler and passer..only thing Westbrook is better at is attacking the rim or paint...

So it's not as much as Paul style of play that isn't appealing to others..it's that he's 32 and could demand a max..Clippers had an elite offense and that's because of Paul...add a floor general like that to the Spurs? A team with another superstar and one of the better defenses??! It's a no brainier if you can create the proper cap space

I think what you said is accurate but also the point. All those guys you mentioned have offenses that have to be built around them. They have insane usage rates and in many cases like WB it looks like it torpedoed the team when it mattered.