Stein: Cavs Working on Multiple Trade Scenarios to Acquire Jimmy Butler

[BatManu20]

Would be big and would directly effect PG13 and Lebron's decisions in FA.


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[BatManu20]

Also this though.


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[BatManu20]

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[tonight...you]

Also this though.


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What could the Cavs offer to the Bulls? Love? Teams still want that stiff? Whatevs... Offseason gonna offseason.

[BatManu20]

876909436736065537

[rjv]

What could the Cavs offer to the Bulls? Love? Teams still want that stiff? Whatevs... Offseason gonna offseason. yeah, i can't figure why love is considered such a trade asset any longer if, in fact, he is.

[Chinook]

876908328303112192

Best Spurs-related news of the day. A team like the Suns and to a lesser extent the wolves has no business trying to go win-now. Makes it more possible to get an Aldridge trade for the loser.

[TimDunkem]

Except the Spurs "don't make big trades".

[GSH]

Gilbert is going to spend like a drunken sailor, if he can, to try and keep LeBron in Cleveland. I'm surprised they haven't announced an "interest" in Durant yet.

[szkorhetz]

I call it smokescreen. Paul George is the one they'll get.

[look_at_g_shred]

Gilbert is going to spend like a drunken sailor, if he can, to try and keep LeBron in Cleveland. I'm surprised they haven't announced an "interest" in Durant yet.
Didn't he take the bucks job?

[GSH]

Didn't he take the bucks job?


Not sure if you're making a joke I didn't get. I'll treat it as serious.

Dan Gilbert is the owner of the Cavs. He and LeBron aren't getting along. During the last season, LeBron publicly bitched that Gilbert hadn't surrounded him with enough talent, and needed to buy him some more support players. Gilbert had inked something like $300 Million in salaries, but he also took the bait and fired off some stupid comments. The rumors (whoever "they" are) say that LeBron is going to leave Cleveland, largely because he hates Gilbert. Gilbert, as I said above, is going to try and send the message that he will spend any amount of money to keep LeBron in town. It's as messy as a low budget porn flick.

I wouldn't be surprised to see LeBron allow Gilbert to spend a shitload of cash, and then leave anyway just to fuck with him.

[look_at_g_shred]

Not sure if you're making a joke I didn't get. I'll treat it as serious.

Dan Gilbert is the owner of the Cavs. He and LeBron aren't getting along. During the last season, LeBron publicly bitched that Gilbert hadn't surrounded him with enough talent, and needed to buy him some more support players. Gilbert had inked something like $300 Million in salaries, but he also took the bait and fired off some stupid comments. The rumors (whoever "they" are) say that LeBron is going to leave Cleveland, largely because he hates Gilbert. Gilbert, as I said above, is going to try and send the message that he will spend any amount of money to keep LeBron in town. It's as messy as a low budget porn flick.

I wouldn't be surprised to see LeBron allow Gilbert to spend a shitload of cash, and then leave anyway just to fuck with him.
I must be getting Gilbert confused with their GM.

[DPG21920]

I must be getting Gilbert confused with their GM.

You are - no worries. Gilbert is the owner and David Griffin is the GM.

[baseline bum]

George's agent must have told Cleveland to fuck off if they're after Butler all of a sudden, since George fits their needs much better and will have a lower asking price thanks to his revelation that he's walking next summer.

[tonight...you]

Gilbert is going to spend like a drunken sailor, if he can, to try and keep LeBron in Cleveland. I'm surprised they haven't announced an "interest" in Durant yet.
So true... Be patient, that announcement could come any second. But KD already knows his reputation as "the servant" (no capitals on purpose) and him leaving the Dubs after already establishing himself as their TeamMVP over their 2XNBAMVP is just not going to happen.

And the NBA knows it. Old boy is going to want to start building his legacy, now that he's got the Konami Cheat Code.

[GSH]

I must be getting Gilbert confused with their GM.


Been there. Random neurons fire or something. It happens.

But, yeah, I've been expecting these kinds of announcements from the Cavs. Gilbert is scared shitless of LeBron leaving... again. He can pretend that he's in control, but LeBron has been in charge of every team he's ever been on.

I think LeBron knows what a good thing he has to be paired with Kyrie, so he'll probably stay. If not for that alone, I think he'd be gone. But if he stays, he's gonna make Gilbert bleed.

[baseline bum]

I hope the Spurs are making calls to gauge George's interest in coming here. That would be a hell of a core to build around if they could land him to play the two guard next to Kawhi. They'd definitely have to move Green in that case though.

[DPG21920]

George's agent must have told Cleveland to fuck off if they're after Butler all of a sudden, since George fits their needs much better and will have a lower asking price thanks to his revelation that he's walking next summer.

There is a pretty high level of collusion like I said. I would not be surprised if LA already knows PG is coming no matter what. However, still a mistake on LA part IMO to let another team get PG's bird rights. Sure, you don't give up any assets which is more attractive to PG, but you really hurt your chances at adding another nice FA with PG that way.

Hopefully IND doesn't help LA out by taking a terrible offer. If it's not a good offer where they give up some nice assets, then just hold PG.

[baseline bum]

Been there. Random neurons fire or something. It happens.

But, yeah, I've been expecting these kinds of announcements from the Cavs. Gilbert is scared shitless of LeBron leaving... again. He can pretend that he's in control, but LeBron has been in charge of every team he's ever been on.

I think LeBron knows what a good thing he has to be paired with Kyrie, so he'll probably stay. If not for that alone, I think he'd be gone. But if he stays, he's gonna make Gilbert bleed.

Oh yeah, LeBron had to be pissed about Arison's cost cutting with Mike Miller, and I still think that's the reason he left Miami. It was like a big fuck you to LeBron after he, Wade, and Bosh together took a paycut so they could sign Miller. Especially seeing how they probably don't beat the Spurs in 2013 without him and how badly he was missed in the 2014 Finals when Chalmers went ice cold. Ever since then you get LeBron and you gotta be going all out, luxury tax be damned, to win a title or he walks. But yeah, Irving is likely enough to keep him there as long as they can get something good for Love.

[HarlemHeat37]

Cleveland doesn't have any assets other than Love, tbh..no young players, no enticing picks, etc..can't see why the Bulls would even want Love, too..

Just an attempt to generate hype IMO..

[HarlemHeat37]

I hope the Spurs are making calls to gauge George's interest in coming here. That would be a hell of a core to build around if they could land him to play the two guard next to Kawhi. They'd definitely have to move Green in that case though.

:lol Hollywood Paul George wanting to play in SA..

[baseline bum]

There is a pretty high level of collusion like I said. I would not be surprised if LA already knows PG is coming no matter what. However, still a mistake on LA part IMO to let another team get PG's bird rights. Sure, you don't give up any assets which is more attractive to PG, but you really hurt your chances at adding another nice FA with PG that way.

Hopefully IND doesn't help LA out by taking a terrible offer. If it's not a good offer where they give up some nice assets, then just hold PG.

Yeah I'm not moving George to LA unless I get the #2 pick. Otherwise if you're Indy you just gotta hold out hope you can move him to a contender who can give you a nice player or two. I don't see anything on the Lakers roster other than that lottery pick that offsets the possibility of what they might be able to get elsewhere. And if they lose him for nothing it's no big deal since they'd be trading a dollar for two dimes if they took two of LA2's young guys.

[baseline bum]

:lol Hollywood Paul George wanting to play in SA..

Still worth asking since the Spurs are a 61 win team with the second best player in the league.

[HarlemHeat37]

Butler, LeBron and Kyrie would be a terrible fit, tbh..

[SAGirl]

What could the Cavs offer to the Bulls? Love? Teams still want that stiff? Whatevs... Offseason gonna offseason.
Sounds like a 3 team trade... I suppose their assets (Cavs) + whatever they can get from other teams in exchange for Love. Something like that.

[baseline bum]

Cleveland doesn't have any assets other than Love, tbh..no young players, no enticing picks, etc..can't see why the Bulls would even want Love, too..

Just an attempt to generate hype IMO..

Yeah Love in Chicago makes no sense. It would have to be a three way deal. Now Love in Indiana works, their fans would show up in droves to see their great white hope bring class back to the organization.

[sasaint]

George's agent must have told Cleveland to fuck off if they're after Butler all of a sudden, since George fits their needs much better and will have a lower asking price thanks to his revelation that he's walking next summer.

Or maybe the Cavs decided they weren't that interested in a one year rental and decided to push for Butler.

[DPG21920]

Butler, LeBron and Kyrie would be a terrible fit, tbh..

I don't know about "terrible" but PG is clearly an easier fit (in the Durant mold) because of his ability to play off the ball.

[HarlemHeat37]

Yeah Love in Chicago makes no sense. It would have to be a three way deal. Now Love in Indiana works, their fans would show up in droves to see their great white hope bring class back to the organization.

True, same with Boston..if Ainge could pull off a Love-Hayward duo, all those white ex-NBA fans that love college ball would be glued to their TVs, tbh..

[tonight...you]

Sounds like a 3 team trade... I suppose their assets (Cavs) + whatever they can get from other teams in exchange for Love. Something like that.
I get that, but my point still stands- what team still thinks Love is anything more than a serviceable player in the right system?
Sure, he gets stats on shit teams... put on a good team and you recognize his true worth, which is not that much.

Whether it's a 2nd team, or 3rd team, or whatever- how is Love valued?
And if it's not Love, who? Thompson? Lol.
Kyrie? Not even happening. Who?

I just don't get it. If a trade for PG goes through to Cleveland, someone is getting fleeced. Whether they know it, or not.

Believe it... or not(with Jack Palance saying it).

[DPG21920]

Love is not some scrub either. I bet GM's rate him higher than LMA. He's an asset. I could see PHX wanting Love for sure and them sending younger talent (Bledsoe, Chriss, etc.) to IND while PG goes to CLE. Same thing for Butler.

Spurs could definitely get in with LMA but I think we have to consider that SA really likes their team (which I understand but many don't). They were step for step with GS and even with TP injured were giving GS the business in GM1 with also some regular season success against them too.

[HarlemHeat37]

I don't know about "terrible" but PG is clearly an easier fit (in the Durant mold) because of his ability to play off the ball.

Relatively speaking..it would be an awkward fit and unlike in Miami, there wouldn't be the super-human athleticism from LeBron/Wade to negate some of it..

[tonight...you]

Love is not some scrub either. I bet GM's rate him higher than LMA. He's an asset. I could see PHX wanting Love for sure and them sending younger talent (Bledsoe, Chriss, etc.) to IND while PG goes to CLE. Same thing for Butler.

Spurs could definitely get in with LMA but I think we have to consider that SA really likes their team (which I understand but many don't). They were step for step with GS and even with TP injured were giving GS the business in GM1 with also some regular season success against them too.
If GM's rate him higher than LMA... those are wasted checks being sent to men leading their organizations. Not that that's a shock, or anything.

[baseline bum]

Or maybe the Cavs decided they weren't that interested in a one year rental and decided to push for Butler.

Well yeah, if George really is a one year rental that means his agent told the Cavs to fuck off. Because no way they haven't been trying to make moves to land him. He'd be a great fit there and would make them much better against the Warriors.

[Hoops Czar]

Yeah I'm not moving George to LA unless I get the #2 pick. Otherwise if you're Indy you just gotta hold out hope you can move him to a contender who can give you a nice player or two. I don't see anything on the Lakers roster other than that lottery pick that offsets the possibility of what they might be able to get elsewhere. And if they lose him for nothing it's no big deal since they'd be trading a dollar for two dimes if they took two of LA2's young guys.

No contender will give up anything of value unless they get some kind of commitment from PG that he'll re-up or sign an extension. This has all the making of a trade deadline deal where the Pacers end up getting shafted because of the lack of leverage. PG opening up his mouth rather than just walking away when his contract expired is going to be the straw that breaks the Camel's back for the Pacers.

[Mr. Body]

Everyone after Jimmy Butler just shows how lousy and watered down the league has become.

[DPG21920]

Everyone after Jimmy Butler just shows how lousy and watered down the league has become.

Why? He's a damn good player. Also, he's one of the few "stars" available and lots of teams want to improve. You can only go after who's available. Not like teams are calling SA about Kawhi.

[baseline bum]

No contender will give up anything of value unless they get some kind of commitment from PG that he'll re-up or sign an extension. This has all the making of a trade deadline deal where the Pacers end up getting shafted because of the lack of leverage. PG opening up his mouth rather than just walking away when his contract expired is going to be the straw that breaks the Camel's back for the Pacers.

That's what they'd be hoping for: that George would give his blessing. It's a risk worth taking when the alternative is getting Julian Randle or some other crap that the Lakers don't want anyways. I don't think George did anything wrong. He gave the Pacers plenty of advance notice he is leaving. That's much better than stringing them along and having them make trades to try to accommodate him like OKC did for that faggot Durant.

[DPG21920]

No contender will give up anything of value unless they get some kind of commitment from PG that he'll re-up or sign an extension. This has all the making of a trade deadline deal where the Pacers end up getting shafted because of the lack of leverage. PG opening up his mouth rather than just walking away when his contract expired is going to be the straw that breaks the Camel's back for the Pacers.

Define value? I think getting a first rounder + expiring deal (so you aren't taking on more money like w/ PG opting out) + maybe a young cheap player is solid given the circumstances.

They have the leverage against LA in the context of LA knows there is interest from others in PG even at a rental price. If you don't make a solid offer, I am trading him to someone else where they get bird rights and year of winning to convince him.

But it's definitley a game of chance here. Lots of bluffing and lots of risks. IND in a tough, tough spot no doubt.

[GSH]

Yeah I'm not moving George to LA unless I get the #2 pick. Otherwise if you're Indy you just gotta hold out hope you can move him to a contender who can give you a nice player or two. I don't see anything on the Lakers roster other than that lottery pick that offsets the possibility of what they might be able to get elsewhere. And if they lose him for nothing it's no big deal since they'd be trading a dollar for two dimes if they took two of LA2's young guys.



It's been mentioned a few times, but LA really need to secure his Bird rights. If I'm the Pacers' FO, that's the game I'd be playing for sure. Lakers either put up that #2 pick, or wait till next year and lose all the cap benefits of acquiring his Bird rights with him. And there's always the chance that he changes his mind about LA in that year. Don't forget that the Bird rights are an asset to the player, and benefit him because it allows their teams to pay them more money without handcuffing them.

That #2 pick is probably the only thing the Lakers can/will offer that other teams can't. Without that on the table, they can probably get as much or more for PG from several other teams. Damn straight they'll be playing hard ball with the Lakers.

[sasaint]

Why? He's a damn good player. Also, he's one of the few "stars" available and lots of teams want to improve. You can only go after who's available. Not like teams are calling SA about Kawhi.

I wish he'd come water down the Spurs!

[baseline bum]

Define value? I think getting a first rounder + expiring deal (so you aren't taking on more money like w/ PG opting out) + maybe a young cheap player is solid given the circumstances.

They have the leverage against LA in the context of LA knows there is interest from others in PG even at a rental price. If you don't make a solid offer, I am trading him to someone else where they get bird rights and year of winning to convince him.

But it's definitley a game of chance here. Lots of bluffing and lots of risks. IND in a tough, tough spot no doubt.

The Lakers have enough cap space that Indiana won't need to take an expiring contract from them to make the trade work under the cap. The problem with the scenario you're envisioning is Indiana is waiting until 2019 for the first round pick if it's not the #2 pick this year, since Philly gets the Lakers' pick next year. If I'm Indiana I'm not interested in doing like Boston did with Brooklyn or Denver with New York where it's 3 firsts in the future for my guy now, since the Lakers are going to rise to the upper half of the league with Magic there. So those picks aren't going to be that good 3-8 years from now

[Spurs9]

This is gonna be a good offseason.

[DPG21920]

The Lakers have enough cap space that Indiana won't need to take an expiring contract from them to make the trade work under the cap. The problem with the scenario you're envisioning is Indiana is waiting until 2019 for the first round pick if it's not the #2 pick this year, since Philly gets the Lakers' pick next year. If I'm Indiana I'm not interested in doing like Boston did with Brooklyn or Denver with New York where it's 3 firsts in the future for my guy now, since the Lakers are going to rise to the upper half of the league with Magic there. So those picks aren't going to be that good 3-8 years from now

Sorry - I was referencing a team like SA or CLE trading for PG with regards to sending expiring back. LA can just absorb like you said, but that doesn't change what I was getting at. LA should still have to make a decent offer or IND should trade PG to another team where they get a first round pick + expiring + maybe a 2nd rounder or flier younger player.

[DPG21920]

Lakers are in a decent spot cap wise next year, but getting the bird rights are big. Unless they are going to dump Nance, Russell and/or Randle, they are at 70M as far as the cap goes after next year (options and qualifying offers). So you get PG at ~30M that puts them at 100M

With Deng/Mozgov/Clarkson/PG/Randle/Ingram/Russell/Nance/Zubac - not exactly a contender. Then they will have to go over the cap to sign Randle. Then the following year Russell. Then the following year after that Ingram.

Of course, they could move guys like Deng/Mozgov but at what price will it cost them? They could stretch them too. Point is, the best way is to get PG too

[Snaq O'Meal]

This is gonna be a good offseason.

Hopefully for the Spurs too.

[tonight...you]

Lakers are in a decent spot cap wise next year, but getting the bird rights are big. Unless they are going to dump Nance, Russell and/or Randle, they are at 70M as far as the cap goes after next year (options and qualifying offers). So you get PG at ~30M that puts them at 100M

With Deng/Mozgov/Clarkson/PG/Randle/Ingram/Russell/Nance/Zubac - not exactly a contender. Then they will have to go over the cap to sign Randle. Then the following year Russell. Then the following year after that Ingram.

Of course, they could move guys like Deng/Mozgov but at what price will it cost them? They could stretch them too. Point is, the best way is to get PG too
I am one of the few here that still thinks Russell is going to be a damn good player, if he could be given a less self-destructive environment. That kid has talent. I don't think at PG, but at SG/PG, with the right lineup, he can be special.

[GSH]

Car dealers always want to get you to buy today. That's because they know that their chances go WAY down if they let you "go home and think about it". The Lakers are *this* close to getting PG right now, and he's a bigger talent than anything they have on the team, or are likely to have soon (unless they just get lucky with a pick). They know what it means if they let him get away. They would be dumb to let that happen. I'm not so sure, though, that they aren't that dumb.

[SAGirl]

That's what they'd be hoping for: that George would give his blessing. It's a risk worth taking when the alternative is getting Julian Randle or some other crap that the Lakers don't want anyways. I don't think George did anything wrong. He gave the Pacers plenty of advance notice he is leaving. That's much better than stringing them along and having them make trades to try to accommodate him like OKC did for that faggot Durant.
Good point. (LeBron kind of did that to the Heat his last season too but he didn't owe them anything)... PG did give signs he was leaning this way last season at the trade deadline and he already had a year plus part of the season and postseason to get cozy with a new team. Possibly a full summer to get cozy with a new team star the way Cousins and A.Davis had the same time to see if it works.

Celtics played really hardball but plenty teams were still in hopeful postseason runs. Indiana didn't want to deal him which is different... now they have less leverage a d PG is pushing, not privately telling.

[sasaint]

I get that, but my point still stands- what team still thinks Love is anything more than a serviceable player in the right system?
Sure, he gets stats on shit teams... put on a good team and you recognize his true worth, which is not that much.

Whether it's a 2nd team, or 3rd team, or whatever- how is Love valued?
And if it's not Love, who? Thompson? Lol.
Kyrie? Not even happening. Who?

I just don't get it. If a trade for PG goes through to Cleveland, someone is getting fleeced. Whether they know it, or not.

Believe it... or not(with Jack Palance saying it).

Agree completely, Curly.

[coachmac87]

True, same with Boston..if Ainge could pull off a Love-Hayward duo, all those white ex-NBA fans that love college ball would be glued to their TVs, tbh..

Griffin would fall into that category too right?

[picnroll]

That's what they'd be hoping for: that George would give his blessing. It's a risk worth taking when the alternative is getting Julian Randle or some other crap that the Lakers don't want anyways. I don't think George did anything wrong. He gave the Pacers plenty of advance notice he is leaving. That's much better than stringing them along and having them make trades to try to accommodate him like OKC did for that faggot Durant.
George is doing what's good for George. He's sent out a clear cut signal that any team that trades for him besides the Lakers is getting a one year rental. Why did he do that? So that any trade value the Lakers have to pay for him is driven down and makes it more likely he goes to the Lakers this year as cheaply as possible shafting the Pacers. Business as usual.

[TD 21]

I don't blame Cavaliers for trying. Butler would be a somewhat awkward fit, but would still be worth a shot for something like Love, Osman and maybe some far off 1st (though they really shouldn't give up any more picks).

I can't imagine it actually happens though. Celtics and Timberwolves have been trying for a year and should be able to easily trump whatever Love can return.

[baseline bum]

George is doing what's good for George. He's sent out a clear cut signal that any team that trades for him besides the Lakers is getting a one year rental. Why did he do that? So that any trade value the Lakers have to pay for him is driven down and makes it more likely he goes to the Lakers this year as cheaply as possible shafting the Pacers. Business as usual.

Is it clear cut? From Woj's report it sounds like his first choice is LA, but the only absolute is he wants out of Indy. I remember hearing the same thing with Dwight Howard and Brooklyn but he happily agreed to that trade to the Lakers when the Nets couldn't close a deal.

[SAGirl]

I am one of the few here that still thinks Russell is going to be a damn good player, if he could be given a less self-destructive environment. That kid has talent. I don't think at PG, but at SG/PG, with the right lineup, he can be special.
I still see talent too. Spurs scouted him heavily. Pop likes shooters and passers and he still has size he's not using all that well. Athleticism hasn't concerned the Spurs as much as the other things.
(Shooting, passing bbiq, competitive spirit, etc).

Anyway, I read at the time b4 that draft RC was doing their due diligence and watched him play in person. THere was definitely interest.... but off he went and all his promise wasn't really cultivated. He's got a nice shooting touch. Unfortunately hasn't been developing right and has developed lazy habits on defense and for a guy who is not that athletic he can't slack off. Do you remember how tough Pop was with Anderson last season? It was one mistake and to the bench. He'd get burned if he's not aware of what's going on, anticipating and being in the right spot. That guy needs a coach that's tough.... and he's had the bad kind of tough coach and mentor in Kobe. He's going to have to put in a lot of work now to right his shop bc his foundation isn't right.

[DPG21920]

George is doing what's good for George. He's sent out a clear cut signal that any team that trades for him besides the Lakers is getting a one year rental. Why did he do that? So that any trade value the Lakers have to pay for him is driven down and makes it more likely he goes to the Lakers this year as cheaply as possible shafting the Pacers. Business as usual.

I agree with this. It was bs by PG and really hurts IND. He's forcing his way to LA basically.

[DPG21920]

Is it clear cut? From Woj's report it sounds like his first choice is LA, but the only absolute is he wants out of Indy. I remember hearing the same thing with Dwight Howard and Brooklyn but he happily agreed to that trade to the Lakers when the Nets couldn't close a deal.

Dwight was pissed when traded to LA IIRC. The fact that it's being reported that he's only committing to LA tells you what you need to know.

[noles1983]

Don't worry we will have a 78 year Manu return next year. We got this.

[baseline bum]

Dwight was pissed when traded to LA IIRC. The fact that it's being reported that he's only committing to LA tells you what you need to know.

I remember Howard looking really happy when it happened. It wasn't until he played with Kobe that he started souring on LA.

[DPG21920]

Seems like poor timing. Especially right before draft and FA when you are supposedly trying to make moves.

Also, I wonder how much of this is race related? I think people have mentioned Bron is big on empowering minorities (which is fine) but this would be another thing that alludes to that: bring in a black coach after letting go of Blatt. Bring in a black gm after letting go of Griffin. Etc.


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[GSH]

Is it clear cut? From Woj's report it sounds like his first choice is LA, but the only absolute is he wants out of Indy. I remember hearing the same thing with Dwight Howard and Brooklyn but he happily agreed to that trade to the Lakers when the Nets couldn't close a deal.


Someone posted a tweet in one of the other threads saying that PGs agent is letting people know that he's a rental this year, to anyone other than the Lakers. If true, that's pretty clear cut. But that didn't come straight from PG or his agent, from what I saw.

[baseline bum]

I agree with this. It was bs by PG and really hurts IND. He's forcing his way to LA basically.

I think it was fair. He is free to go where he wants and he's not stringing his franchise on for a year like Durant did. It hurts the Pacers but at least they're not making pointless moves to appease him in the hope he stays when he has already made up mind on leaving.

[DPG21920]

Someone posted a tweet in one of the other threads saying that PGs agent is letting people know that he's a rental this year, to anyone other than the Lakers. If true, that's pretty clear cut. But that didn't come straight from PG or his agent, from what I saw.

Plus Woj is reporting it without "reporting" it by saying stuff like" just how much will a team offer INDY knowing PG is a one-year rental?" Or "this signifantly hurts INDY's position in trading PG"

[DPG21920]

I think it was fair. He is free to go where he wants and he's not stringing his franchise on for a year like Durant did. It hurts the Pacers but at least they're not making pointless moves to appease him in the hope he stays when he has already made up mind on leaving.

He could have kept that in house if he was doing them a favor. They could have moved him to plenty of teams. But now everyone knows he wants LAL and they are making sure everyone knows that so that LA can get him with as little assets as possible.

He's not a villain or anything, but this is some serious collusion between him and LA :lol

[DPG21920]

Seems like poor timing. Especially right before draft and FA when you are supposedly trying to make moves.

Also, I wonder how much of this is race related? I think people have mentioned Bron is big on empowering minorities (which is fine) but this would be another thing that alludes to that: bring in a black coach after letting go of Blatt. Bring in a black gm after letting go of Griffin. Etc.


876943990637162496

876948459584200704

[baseline bum]

He could have kept that in house if he was doing them a favor. They could have moved him to plenty of teams. But now everyone knows he wants LAL and they are making sure everyone knows that so that LA can get him with as little assets as possible.

He's not a villain or anything, but this is some serious collusion between him and LA :lol

I don't know, if the Pacers would have started shopping him then everyone would know he told them he's walking next year anyways. If the rental aspect of the story is true he'd come out like the asshole for hiding it and screwing over whatever team traded for him. I gotta respect that he's being honest.

[baseline bum]

Plus Woj is reporting it without "reporting" it by saying stuff like" just how much will a team offer INDY knowing PG is a one-year rental?" Or "this signifantly hurts INDY's position in trading PG"

Yeah reading that article by Woj a second time it definitely sounds that way. Sucks, I would have loved to see the Spurs swoop in and steal him from Magic.

[TheDoctor]

Still worth asking since the Spurs are a 61 win team with the second best player in the league.

Forget about empty numbers. The League's watered down. #1 priority/goal should be how to beat the Worriers nothing else.

[GSH]

He could have kept that in house if he was doing them a favor. They could have moved him to plenty of teams. But now everyone knows he wants LAL and they are making sure everyone knows that so that LA can get him with as little assets as possible.

He's not a villain or anything, but this is some serious collusion between him and LA :lol


Yeah, I don't see how this can be okay with the league. He's still under contract. A few years ago, CP3's agent was encouraging teams to try and acquire him, and the league went public with a warning memo. This is at least that bad - probably worse.

I don't see how the league can fail to step up on this, and soon. If it was a team responsible, the penalty would probably be pretty unpleasant. What's happening here is clearly contrary to the intent of the tampering rules.

[DPG21920]

Yeah reading that article by Woj a second time it definitely sounds that way. Sucks, I would have loved to see the Spurs swoop in and steal him from Magic.

I think they would have a good shot at it - but I have no idea how SA feels about PG or what the best offer ends up being at this point :lol

I just hope they don't appease LA. Make them earn PG by using that cap space.

[DPG21920]

Yeah, I don't see how this can be okay with the league. He's still under contract. A few years ago, CP3's agent was encouraging teams to try and acquire him, and the league went public with a warning memo. This is at least that bad - probably worse.

I don't see how the league can fail to step up on this, and soon. If it was a team responsible, the penalty would probably be pretty unpleasant. What's happening here is clearly contrary to the intent of the tampering rules.

I've never seen anything like it tbh :lol. I mean, I've seen guys demand to be traded, but nothing like this with such specific teams and so public in the courtship.

Magic was on tv winking saying he can't talk to PG but would say "come play for us" :lol

[baseline bum]

Yeah, I don't see how this can be okay with the league. He's still under contract. A few years ago, CP3's agent was encouraging teams to try and acquire him, and the league went public with a warning memo. This is at least that bad - probably worse.

I don't see how the league can fail to step up on this, and soon. If it was a team responsible, the penalty would probably be pretty unpleasant. What's happening here is clearly contrary to the intent of the tampering rules.

I don't see the problem myself. If George keeps it in house I don't think it matters, since any team trading for him would want him to sign an extension as part of the deal and then the cat would be out of the bag when he refused.

[DPG21920]

I don't see the problem myself. If George keeps it in house I don't think it matters, since any team trading for him would want him to sign an extension as part of the deal and then the cat would be out of the bag when he refused.

For sure - but it's how it looks. PG is on tv saying he wants to play for LA. "Working out" with Kobe. Magic is on tv winking and laughing talking about Paul George even though he's under contract for another team. Then you have PG camp saying they only want to go to LA and dissuading other teams from offering up deals for him.

I mean, there are always grey areas, but this is absurd lol

[baseline bum]

For sure - but it's how it looks. PG is on tv saying he wants to play for LA. "Working out" with Kobe. Magic is on tv winking and laughing talking about Paul George even though he's under contract for another team. Then you have PG camp saying they only want to go to LA and dissuading other teams from offering up deals for him.

I mean, there are always grey areas, but this is absurd lol

I'm just kind of stunned anyone would want to go to that trainwreck. I mean Los Angeles is a great city but if I'm Paul George I tell my agent to get me to Cleveland so I can compete for a title. Then I'd go live in LA in the offseason.

[TheDoctor]

For sure - but it's how it looks. PG is on tv saying he wants to play for LA. "Working out" with Kobe. Magic is on tv winking and laughing talking about Paul George even though he's under contract for another team. Then you have PG camp saying they only want to go to LA and dissuading other teams from offering up deals for him.

I mean, there are always grey areas, but this is absurd lol

It's called charcoal grey :lol

[baseline bum]

Then again, maybe George has the Juan Gonzalez attitude of you get paid for the regular season. And going on vacation every April doesn't sound too bad I guess. :lol

[DPG21920]

I'm just kind of stunned anyone would want to go to that trainwreck. I mean Los Angeles is a great city but if I'm Paul George I tell my agent to get me to Cleveland so I can compete for a title. Then I'd go live in LA in the offseason.

Without knowing jack squat my take is he has Melo-itis. He's a damn good player and see's himself as part of the "in" crowd with Bron/Wade/etc..

He cares about his brand more than winning. He would like to win, but doesn't value that more than building his brand in LA or wherever.

He doesn't want the pressure and there will be none with LA already in shambles and GS/SA still looming large. He is a guy that idiolzies being "cool" and is obsessed with Kobe.

[BatManu20]

Cavs completely cleaning house.. Three days before the draft, and after 3 straight years to the Finals... this is nuts.

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[BatManu20]

Lebron has his reason to leave now. Crazy.

[AaronY]

Butler, LeBron and Kyrie would be a terrible fit, tbh..
I think he'd be a perfect fit. Butler is a good three point shooter so he could space the floor plus he's awesome on defense when focused. Gives them a third creator which they didn't have.

[DPG21920]

I think he'd be a perfect fit. Butler is a good three point shooter so he could space the floor plus he's awesome on defense when focused. Gives them a third creator which they didn't have.

They are all ISO heavy players and there is one ball.

[DPG21920]

Lebron has his reason to leave now. Crazy.

We will see. CLE could still pull off some moves and things work out. This alone won't do it. But it certainly does not help. Unless Lebron speaking out for Griffin was just a way to shield Lebron from wanting him gone and getting someone else in there.

[tonight...you]

I still see talent too. Spurs scouted him heavily. Pop likes shooters and passers and he still has size he's not using all that well. Athleticism hasn't concerned the Spurs as much as the other things.
(Shooting, passing bbiq, competitive spirit, etc).

Anyway, I read at the time b4 that draft RC was doing their due diligence and watched him play in person. THere was definitely interest.... but off he went and all his promise wasn't really cultivated. He's got a nice shooting touch. Unfortunately hasn't been developing right and has developed lazy habits on defense and for a guy who is not that athletic he can't slack off. Do you remember how tough Pop was with Anderson last season? It was one mistake and to the bench. He'd get burned if he's not aware of what's going on, anticipating and being in the right spot. That guy needs a coach that's tough.... and he's had the bad kind of tough coach and mentor in Kobe. He's going to have to put in a lot of work now to right his shop bc his foundation isn't right.
Him getting traded to a good team, like the Spurs, would be like a kid getting sent to military school after being spoiled.
It would be what is ultimately best and he might even embrace it, but he may not like the concept of it all, at first.

I, for 1, hope he gets traded to a serious franchise. Not that clown show that gets by on reputation and location.

[SAGirl]

For sure - but it's how it looks. PG is on tv saying he wants to play for LA. "Working out" with Kobe. Magic is on tv winking and laughing talking about Paul George even though he's under contract for another team. Then you have PG camp saying they only want to go to LA and dissuading other teams from offering up deals for him.

I mean, there are always grey areas, but this is absurd lol
Thinking about this he wants Magic to use the pick and or other assets to get him a good team, better help. He's helping his new team acquire him with a position of strength.... smart, savvy... Kind if shady too.

[Mr. Body]

Why? He's a damn good player. Also, he's one of the few "stars" available and lots of teams want to improve. You can only go after who's available. Not like teams are calling SA about Kawhi.

He's good. He's no superstar. There are practically no superstars in the league at this point in time. We're in a trough similar to when the Robinson/Barkley/Olajuwon/Malone/Jordan/Drexler years were over and the next generation hadn't fully appeared yet.

This isn't talked about much, but the Warriors are feasting on a crappy league right now. There's very little elite talent. A bidding war on a player like Jimmy Butler would never happen six or eight years ago.

[GSH]

I don't see the problem myself. If George keeps it in house I don't think it matters, since any team trading for him would want him to sign an extension as part of the deal and then the cat would be out of the bag when he refused.


I'll try and dredge up an article about the CP3 issue, for starters.

The biggest thing is, it hasn't stayed in house. And if these stories are true that his agent is "communicating" with other teams, without the express permission of the Pacers? It's something the league has taken a stand on in the past. It also looks like PG himself has been effectively communicating with other teams with some of these public statements. Bottom line, he's under contract to the Pacers.

Now - I don't really know who said what, or to whom. The internet is so full of made up bullshit and rumors. But I do know that if either he or his agent have been "reaching out", even through clever little media leaks, they're over the line. The league was pretty pissed about CP3's agent, but they went the route of a public warning memo. It sure seems like PG and his agent have gone far enough to force the league to get involved. Think about how unfair this is to the Pacers' organization, and this year's team. The idea is to keep a relatively level playing field across the entire league.

[GSH]

Lebron has his reason to leave now. Crazy.

Unless LeBron was the one who demanded it.

[BatManu20]

Unless LeBron was the one who demanded it.

Theyre reporting he didn't, and that his camp is actually "disappointed" it happened.

[BatManu20]

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[GSH]

Theyre reporting he didn't, and that his camp is actually "disappointed" it happened.


Yeah, I just saw that other thread. That's not good. I could actually see LeBron leaving now.

[Down Under]

Love is not some scrub either. I bet GM's rate him higher than LMA. He's an asset. I could see PHX wanting Love for sure and them sending younger talent (Bledsoe, Chriss, etc.) to IND while PG goes to CLE. Same thing for Butler.

Spurs could definitely get in with LMA but I think we have to consider that SA really likes their team (which I understand but many don't). They were step for step with GS and even with TP injured were giving GS the business in GM1 with also some regular season success against them too.
Surely this is the worst time to trade LMA unless someone's really keen to get him. His stock would be low because of how he played in playoffs and he looked like he had a leg issue, so I'd expect to start next season he starts looking a whole lot better.

[cd98]

Theyre reporting he didn't, and that his camp is actually "disappointed" it happened.

Yeah, but they're just protecting LeBron, who criticized him in public earlier this year for not getting him enough help.

[baseline bum]

876969410904424449

876971332088549376

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876983628558995456

Contender without LeBron :lmao

More like 30 win team without LeBron

[BatManu20]

Contender without LeBron :lmao

More like 30 win team without LeBron

:lol

If/when Lebron ever leaves CLE, that franchise turns back into the biggest shithole in the league, tbh.

[BatManu20]

He gone.

877000668384563201

[Ron Swanson]

That city will burn to the ground when it happens.

[BatManu20]

The Cavs want to hire Chauncey Billups... the same guy who said the Cavs should trade Kevin Love for Carmelo Anthony a couple days ago :lol

[tholdren]

He gone.

877000668384563201

James leaving cleveland would solidify him as a total loser

[GSH]

James leaving cleveland would solidify him as a total loser

A total loser. With three rings. :rolleyes

[tholdren]

A total loser. With three rings. :rolleyes

You can gay emoji the shit out of the thread, but the fact remains he won without integrity, so in the grand scheme of life it doesnt mean anything. He paid for it, didnt win it.

[DPG21920]

Oi boi

[BatManu20]

Shade at Dan Gilbert. Straight from the horse's mouth.


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[GSH]

You can gay emoji the shit out of the thread, but the fact remains he won without integrity, so in the grand scheme of life it doesnt mean anything. He paid for it, didnt win it.


Oh, you're one of those.

Never mind.

[BatManu20]

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[21209]

Remember when the Spurs could have had Jimmy Butler in the 2011 draft and took Corey Joseph one pick before the Bulls landed him at #30?

[daslicer]

Remember when the Spurs could have had Jimmy Butler in the 2011 draft and took Corey Joseph one pick before the Bulls landed him at #30?

I don't blame the Spurs for passing up on him. Jimmy is one of those guys that no one could have predicted that he would be an all-star caliber player. Even his college coach never foresaw him being an all-star. This clip shows how unique his trajectory was.

GFDMIoeWjcM

[cd98]

Remember when the Spurs could have had Jimmy Butler in the 2011 draft and took Corey Joseph one pick before the Bulls landed him at #30?

Yes and if the Spurs had drafted him they probably don't draft Kawhi.

[BatManu20]

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[HarlemHeat37]

I think he'd be a perfect fit. Butler is a good three point shooter so he could space the floor plus he's awesome on defense when focused. Gives them a third creator which they didn't have.

In addition to being iso-heavy, Butler is a career 33% 3-point shooter who goes through stretches where he can't make anything from outside..teams would be begging for a Lebron/Butler wing duo to shoot from outside, tbh..

Wade and Lebron had issues with shooting and redundancy, but they were still in their primes, 2 of the most athletic players we have ever seen..

I'd still take the risk if I was Cleveland, but I wouldn't expect anything special IMO..

[ace3g]

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[TimDunkem]

I don't blame the Spurs for passing up on him. Jimmy is one of those guys that no one could have predicted that he would be an all-star caliber player. Even his college coach never foresaw him being an all-star. This clip shows how unique his trajectory was.

GFDMIoeWjcMI didn't think he'd be an all star but I was calling him the perfect role-player/backup at the SF/SG positions before that draft. TD 21, I remember vividly, was saying he'd be a scrub. :lmao

[coachmac87]

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Because it's becoming known LeBron is out of Cleveland....

[BatManu20]

Yep Jimmy Buckets knows that Lebron is likely gone after next season.

[Hoops Czar]

877324850653667329

2009 all over again. Nobody wanted to be traded to Cleveland because they Didn't have assurance from LeBron that he was staying. Bad sign for Cleveland.

[TimDunkem]

:lmao Cavs

[Ron Swanson]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysmLA5TqbIY

[spursistan]

2009 all over again. Nobody wanted to be traded to Cleveland because they Didn't have assurance from LeBron that he was staying. Bad sign for Cleveland.
And Butler knows what's really up-- probably through Wade who just opted in in CHI..Lebron to LA/LAC in 2018 is more than just mere scuttlebutt at this point..