A couple of really good documentaries

[SpursforSix]

Took a break from the true crime genre and watched these on Netflix:

Alphago 8/10 - outstanding account of DeepMind (AI developers) trying to create a program that could win the game of Go against the world champion. Sounds sort of boring but it was pretty enthralling. It delved into both the machine and human aspects of the contest.

Blackfish 7/10 - have been meaning to watch this for a while. story of Orcas in captivity and the deaths they've caused. And why.

[Avante]

Took a break from the true crime genre and watched these on Netflix:

Alphago 8/10 - outstanding account of DeepMind (AI developers) trying to create a program that could win the game of Go against the world champion. Sounds sort of boring but it was pretty enthralling. It delved into both the machine and human aspects of the contest.

Blackfish 7/10 - have been meaning to watch this for a while. story of Orcas in captivity and the deaths they've caused. And why.

Ever thought of cooling it with all these TV/Movie whatevers and delve a little deeper into more important things, like what is the meaning of life?

[Pavlov]

Quit following him around with your wimper wahs.

[AaronY]

Ever thought of cooling it with all these TV/Movie whatevers and delve a little deeper into more important things, like what is the meaning of life?
High school track numbers of NFL guys you mean?

[pgardn]

Ever thought of cooling it with all these TV/Movie whatevers and delve a little deeper into more important things, like what is the meaning of life?

My gosh you got no clue.

You just got exposed as a dolt in your own area of "expertise" and now you just wander off like a child whining.
All we know about you is that you can look up or perhaps remember lists. You dis something you have not even watched.

I'm gonna watch the Go documentary. I have played it before and it's a very weird game. I felt like I never knew if I was close to winning or losing until the game was well under way. I play the abbreviated version cause using the entire board can lead to long games for two people in the beginning stages of learning. I have not played for a while, but when I did it, was humbling. It's very easy to learn. You gotta be very good at recognition of very different patterns compared to chess. One move of the opponent completely throws off looking moves ahead unlike chess. Go, on my level, changed very rapidly.

Thanks SF6. A definite watch. Especially since I have a little bit of a feel for computer programming.

[pgardn]

SF6

Bravo on the Alphago. It does not matter how good or bad the documentary was done from a production standpoint, what matters was it was made. And made well enough that I understand enough that I am pissed.

Ask me why I am pissed. It's an envious sort of pissed. This has happened before. So ask me. Then we all can understand why the vast majority of people who watch this might be upset, but might have other avenues to take the sting out. This needs to be said. Some people are very lucky. This documentary illustrated why. I am not among this "blessed" group. And I think most people on the Alphago team are not getting the full charge. They are of course happy. They made a fantastic program. But they too know others are getting the full benefit. Life is not always fair this way. And it could be that some people are going to get too wrapped up as well.

Good stuff.

[SpursforSix]

SF6

Bravo on the Alphago. It does not matter how good or bad the documentary was done from a production standpoint, what matters was it was made. And made well enough that I understand enough that I am pissed.

Ask me why I am pissed. It's an envious sort of pissed. This has happened before. So ask me. Then we all can understand why the vast majority of people who watch this might be upset, but might have other avenues to take the sting out. This needs to be said. Some people are very lucky. This documentary illustrated why. I am not among this "blessed" group. And I think most people on the Alphago team are not getting the full charge. They are of course happy. They made a fantastic program. But they too know others are getting the full benefit. Life is not always fair this way. And it could be that some people are going to get too wrapped up as well.

Good stuff.

Now...to deepen your horizons even more, I recommend, "The King of Kong, Fistful of Quarters".

[The Gemini Method]

I did enjoy the Rotten series on Netflix. The Drug Lords was pretty interesting as well.

[Pavlov]

I did enjoy the Rotten series on Netflix. The Drug Lords was pretty interesting as well.Ditto on Drug Lords. Pretty concise episodes if you don't want to spend so much time on the longer docs.

[The Gemini Method]

Ditto on Drug Lords. Pretty concise episodes if you don't want to spend so much time on the longer docs. Yeah, I liked that they did one on an Australian Drug Lord and one on Frank Lucas. Hopefully they'll do one on the Snialoa Cartel next time.

[pgardn]

Now...to deepen your horizons even more, I recommend, "The King of Kong, Fistful of Quarters".

Think about how satisfying this documentary would be if one was actually good enough to to see the brilliant creativity of the program. Did you see how excited the S. Korean broadcasters of the game were? The Alphago team had to look for their signals to see how good a position they were in for certain cases.

We can't get the deeper beauty this experience gave for the Go experts, we are out of the loop. We can see how excited they got, but we can't feel that. This is sometimes very frustrating. These guys get the chance to go back and analyze the games to get even further depth. We.... get to see the experts got excited. Not the same.

[IronMexican]

I'll check out Deep mind.


Black fish has been seen from here to Zimbabwe, though, still good

[pgardn]

I'll check out Deep mind.


Black fish has been seen from here to Zimbabwe, though, still good

Do it!

Then tell us about the voice of the best Go player in the world.

[Avante]

My gosh you got no clue.

You just got exposed as a dolt in your own area of "expertise" and now you just wander off like a child whining.
All we know about you is that you can look up or perhaps remember lists. You dis something you have not even watched.

I'm gonna watch the Go documentary. I have played it before and it's a very weird game. I felt like I never knew if I was close to winning or losing until the game was well under way. I play the abbreviated version cause using the entire board can lead to long games for two people in the beginning stages of learning. I have not played for a while, but when I did it, was humbling. It's very easy to learn. You gotta be very good at recognition of very different patterns compared to chess. One move of the opponent completely throws off looking moves ahead unlike chess. Go, on my level, changed very rapidly.

Thanks SF6. A definite watch. Especially since I have a little bit of a feel for computer programming.

Dude, totally clueless as usual. What I told SFS is what he told me about my interests, ok stupid? And, yaking about the silly shit you do has nothing to do with track expertisel ok dummy? And, been to well over 500 track meets in my life, ok dummy?

This thread had....0....replies until I showed up, it was sinking off the page.

[spurraider21]

Wow, just another topic where pgardn outshines Avante...

[pgardn]

Dude, totally clueless as usual. What I told SFS is what he told me about my interests, ok stupid? And, yaking about the silly shit you do has nothing to do with track expertisel ok dummy? And, been to well over 500 track meets in my life, ok dummy?

This thread had....0....replies until I showed up, it was sinking off the page.

its a Fckn movie/ documentary thread on a sports board.

Are you some kind of alien? You make zero difference in the discussion with your comfortable memorization of the alphabet. The alphabet has a song the goes with it also, so it pleases you to no end, broccoli for brains. You know nothing about the really interesting part of track. It's too difficult for a list memorizer. And that in itself, is a realistic grade of your barren efforts to analyze anything. Good thing you stayed in insurance.

[leemajors]

Now...to deepen your horizons even more, I recommend, "The King of Kong, Fistful of Quarters".

Have you seen Surviving Escobar? I've heard great things.

[Avante]

its a Fckn movie/ documentary thread on a sports board.

Are you some kind of alien? You make zero difference in the discussion with your comfortable memorization of the alphabet. The alphabet has a song the goes with it also, so it pleases you to no end, broccoli for brains. You know nothing about the really interesting part of track. It's too difficult for a list memorizer. And that in itself, is a realistic grade of your barren efforts to analyze anything. Good thing you stayed in insurance.


Stupid, the really interesting aspects of the sport are the arthletes involved, the accomplishments. Only some know nothing like you would think other wise. Stupid, it's all common sense ya dumb fuck, ok?

[Avante]

Look at when this thread was started. It went two days with...0...replies, then the minute I show up, ha~~~~~~~~~

[pgardn]

Stupid, the really interesting of the sport are the arthletes involved, the accoplishments. Only some know nothing like you would think other wise. Stupid, it's all common sense ya dumb fuck, ok?

Common sense to you is drowning in a bucket of water.
You are basically stupid.

I have shown the board this and will continue to tear you apart as you wish. You have no clue as to sprinting on turns. You have not a clue about aspects most of us learn in HS. So you retreated to the Navy to peel potatoes and go ashore to terrorize the population.

[pgardn]

Look at when this thread was started. It went two days with...0...replies, then the minute I show up, ha~~~~~~~~~

SF6 put up an excellent documentary.

So because you don't understand it, it's got to be dumb.
Then anything above simple addition is, dumb for you.

[Avante]

Common sense to you is drowning in a bucket of water.
You are basically stupid.

I have shown the board this and will continue to tear you apart as you wish. You have no clue as to sprinting on turns. You have not a clue about aspects most of us learn in HS. So you retreated to the Navy to peel potatoes and go ashore to terrorize the population.

You live in a fantasy world little guy, and it's comical. Thinking ...one size fits all...in sprinting, hahaha~~~ So no thoughts at all about the individual....really?

Dude, all I see is some idiot who can't talk the sport Googling a bunch of stuff us sprinters take for granted.

We never see you talk about the athletes, why......yep, ya don't know the sport at all.

[Avante]

SF6 put up an excellent documentary.

So because you don't understand it, it's got to be dumb.
Then anything above simple addition is, dumb for you.

Dude, if I weren't here you wouldn't be either and we both know this. This thread was here for two days sinking to the bottom, where were you?

[Pavlov]

Everyone is better than Avante.

[Avante]

Everyone is better than Avante.

So talk to me about them old Georgia blues, ok?

[Pavlov]

So talk to me about them old Georgia blues, ok?In a documentary thread?

This is why you are worse than anyone.

[Avante]

In a documentary thread?

This is why you are worse than anyone.

Stupid, show me a thread here that doesn't go every which way, and you know this, so why like a fucking moron?

[Pavlov]

Stupid, show me a thread here that doesn't go every which way, and you know this, so why like a fucking moron?This thread didn't go your way.

[Avante]

This thread didn't go your way.

Dude, I asked you a question, so answer it. Show me a thread that stuck to the topic, where is it?

[Pavlov]

Dude, I asked you a question, so answer it. Show me a thread that stuck to the topic, where is it?This one if you shut up.

[Avante]

This one if you shut up.

You didn't stay on topic bitch.

[SpursforSix]

Think about how satisfying this documentary would be if one was actually good enough to to see the brilliant creativity of the program. Did you see how excited the S. Korean broadcasters of the game were? The Alphago team had to look for their signals to see how good a position they were in for certain cases.

We can't get the deeper beauty this experience gave for the Go experts, we are out of the loop. We can see how excited they got, but we can't feel that. This is sometimes very frustrating. These guys get the chance to go back and analyze the games to get even further depth. We.... get to see the experts got excited. Not the same.

You hit the nail on the head. There's a whole layer that's completely missed by not understanding Go. But I assume that Go experts were already more than aware of the events documented. For them, my guess is that they know those played games almost move by move. And that the documentary would just be a weak synopsis for them.

Maybe they could have done a more detailed segment on some of the intricacies of Go. But it still wouldn't have been enough for a viewer to be able to look at the moves and instantly know the mistakes and "God" moves. In fact, it would have probably been a distraction. Easier to accept that I have no clue about Go and that I can take the experts at face value.

So imo, the documentary is just about as good as it could have been.

[SpursforSix]

Have you seen Surviving Escobar? I've heard great things.

No. I've passed over it but there are so many shows on Escobar and the cartels now.

But now that I look at SE, it looks great (from the reviews at least). I'll have to check it out.

Cartel Land is pretty good as well.

[pgardn]

You hit the nail on the head. There's a whole layer that's completely missed by not understanding Go. But I assume that Go experts were already more than aware of the events documented. For them, my guess is that they know those played games almost move by move. And that the documentary would just be a weak synopsis for them.

Maybe they could have done a more detailed segment on some of the intricacies of Go. But it still wouldn't have been enough for a viewer to be able to look at the moves and instantly know the mistakes and "God" moves. In fact, it would have probably been a distraction. Easier to accept that I have no clue about Go and that I can take the experts at face value.

So imo, the documentary is just about as good as it could have been.

Agreed.

I think capturing the scenes of the experts various states of wonder at the moves the machine made were excellent. But I still can be hacked off I don't fully get it because I don't really understand the game well enough. And Imo it would be a waste of time trying to explain it. You just have to play it at a very high level. The majority of the guys on the team did not fully understand. Even the chess champion who headed the group did not grasp it and was asking around. And he can play the game, he just said he was not good at it.

It was very good IMO. Thanks for putting it up.

I'm sure there is a full analysis of all the games and the "wonder" moves. I just won't understand it. I remember playing games and finding myself in trouble and attempting to start a new region on another part of the board just to get some territory. The machine did this as well but somehow had it linked to the part of the board where it was "losing". I played the smaller version and still could not possibly see this.

Also interesting, the analysis that the machine was merely playing to win, not necessarily to crush the opponent. They said that during one game they thought the machine was playing very neutral moves while it could have been smashing him. And, the machine lost! What exactly happened? Apparently this goes into some code that helps it learn. Full of good stuff. Good find. I may try reading up on what the machine was telling the programmers as the game progressed if I can find a simple version.