From a N.O. resident and Saints fan

[tgrgrd00]

I will start by saying the people of New Orleans are very grateful to the people of Texas for all they have done following the catastrophe that hit our area about 7 weeks ago. Housing the evacuees and allowing the Saints to temporarily play in your state are just 2 of the many ways you have helped following our tremendous losses.

Unfortunately, due to the comments of your mayor and state lawmakers, the cordiality is going to stop right here.

San Antonio is trying to rob the city of New Orleans of one of its most beloved institutions at a time when the city is at its lowest and most desperate point. The people of Louisiana have supported, cheered, cried, and laughed with this team for 38 years. It doesn’t matter that we have only won 1 playoff game ever. We are still in the top ten in the NFL in attendance every year! Saying that ticket sales for the games in B.R. are low is a poor excuse for stealing our team. We have proven for 38 years that we support this team through thick and thin. 4 games in B.R. is certainly not a valid sample for comparison. You must understand that many people in N.O. cannot even get to their homes yet. The ones that can are gutting their houses, patching their roofs and trying to rebuild their lives. We love our Saints and we love our city. The same as you love your Spurs, your city, and your Alamo. How would you feel if the stadium the Spurs played in got destroyed by a storm, the Alamo got ruined in a flood and floated away and the Spurs had to “temporarily” relocate to Austin? Then Austin kept the Spurs and they never came back to San Antonio?

San Antonio is attempting to steal the New Orleans Saints while the city is in shambles. The city has temporarily lost many businesses, people have no homes. Personally my roof came off of my house and everything was destroyed…. The only normalcy I have in my life right now is knowing that on Sunday I will somehow get to watch my Saints play...And now I have to worry about losing my beloved football team on top of everything else because San Antonio is courting them like the school slut doesn’t have a date for prom.

Most everyone saw the images of people (even police) looting the stores/homes around the city following the storm. Some of these people were taking things of necessity such as baby food, water, canned goods…mostly stuff that will help them sustain human life. When it comes down to it, there is nothing wrong with this as most of the perishables would have been wasted anyway and many people needed these things as help was no where to be found.

However, others were stealing things that were not necessary such as plasma tv’s, alcohol, and stereos. These were greedy, greedy people who have no regard for humanity and are generally the heartless scum or the earth/city. This is the category of looter where the mayor and the city of San Antonio fall. The mayor and people are coming in to our city while we are down and lobbying for one of the only things remaining that the city can be proud of.

San Antonio is trying to loot the New Orleans Saints. I hope you are proud of your city and mayor because you look worse than the cops that were shopping/looting for shoes hours after the storm. Well I guess this is different and/or ok because you had the decency to wait 7 weeks?

New Orleans will be back. Hopefully the Saints will be in that number. However if you do get this team permanently in San Antonio you better not call them the Saints because that is by no means fitting. They should be named the San Antonio Looters…Now that is fitting.

[Marcus Bryant]

You do realize your beloved city tried to loot SA's beloved Spurs a few years back, do you not?

Payback's a...

[tgrgrd00]

Oh really....S.A. got hit by a Cat 4 hurricane? Didn't realize. That wasn't looting. That was courting. Big difference.

Are you comparing apples and oranges?

[Clandestino]

bullshit post... it is mouse or someone else..

the saints were on their way out of new orleans already.. the city was helping them out of town..

[Marcus Bryant]

Oh really....S.A. got hit by a Cat 4 hurricane? Didn't realize.

Are you comparing apples and oranges?


Yeah and now more $ than ever is going to be flowing back into the city (mostly gov't spending) plus now there is the impetus to get a new stadium deal done in NO.

Anyways, NO certainly didn't have any qualms about trying to take away the Spurs from SA and it's not like SA is the richest or largest market around. A lot of poor folks in SA love the Spurs and they would've been crushed.

Tempting fate is not a good thing.

[tgrgrd00]

Bullshit...the Saints weren't going anywhere. I don't know where you get your information.

There was no contract breach and no intentions of moving stated by either side. Show me anywhere that says the Saints were going anywhere at the end of this season or any other season. Benson has an $80 million buyout to move the team at the end of this year and it has not been exercised.

Every year Benson threatens to move the Saints in order to get more money. So in theory you could say every year the Saints were leaving but it never happened.

Oh and I don't know who mouse is but I am legit.

[TheTruth]

I think you need to go ahead and blame your owner. Looks like he was ready to leave town before the storm hit.

[Marcus Bryant]

In addition it's not like the Saints were not seriously considering relocation prior to Katrina. The reasons for getting out of Dodge were there before the storm.

[TheTruth]

I'll never think badly about our mayor for doing what he thinks is best for our city.

[tgrgrd00]

I will say it again. Benson threatens to move the Saints every year! You are listening to the media making excuses as to why it is ok for S.A. to loot the Saints.

Propoganda is what it is. This team was going no where before Katrina I can assure you. I follow the Saints very closely. This year is no different from any other year.

Keep lying to yourselves to make it feel better.

[TheTruth]

Alright, I will.

[Pistons < Spurs]

As an outsider who has no stakes in this at all, I have to strongly agree w/ the origional post.

[Marcus Bryant]

Actually I am calling it as I see it. SA was an attractive market when compared to NO prior to Katrina. It's clear that Benson's patience was running out.

If NO/La state govt get their act together and come up with a new stadium plan, then maybe Benson doesn't permanently relocate.

[TheTruth]

We are just fans. Fans who have been longing for an NFL team to root for for a very very long time. Tom Benson is going to do what he thinks is best for him and HIS franchise. If moving to San Antonio is more financially attractive to him than stayin in New Orleans and losing millions upon millions of dollars waiting for that city to rebuild then who am I to question that.

What happend to your city is beyond sad. Watching the video of your city being destroyed was heart breaking. But its not going to stop me from wanting an NFL team in my city. If that makes me a bad person, than I guess that is what I am.

[Kori Ellis]

bullshit post... it is mouse or someone else..



Weird assumption.

I think that it was a very good post. I'm not saying that I agree with it in its entirety. But it was a very solid post.

(and the poster is actually from N.O.)

[Shiner Bock Girl]

As cruel as this will sound i have had enough....Iam really fed up with all you New Orleans ppl once and for all....I felt sorry for all of you at first and donated what i could myself to help....But after all these comments about San Antonio from you, i've had enough..The Pity for YOU stops here....Seems all you wonderful devoted NO fans out there seem to forget San Antonio's major flood of 98 when YOUR Mayor came down here to lure OUR Spurs away with an offer of a brand new dome right off the bat...And your caring devoted fans were all for that idea right??....Now that is sad, your Mayor didn't come to SA then to offer support or aid, he was here specifically for the Spurs....Well thats really calling the kettle black here....So i have lost all sympathy for you and your whinning about wanting your football team back. Then your talking about what ruins your city is in??? Maybe you should rebuild your city first instead of worrying about your dome, there will be no fans to support YOUR Saints if ppl cannot even afford to rebuild their homes......And talk about selfish, you want your team to play also in an area that does not even want them including their own Mayor??? The ticket sales are a big deal because do you think these players want to play in a stadium not even half full???? And play like that for years till your precious dome is rebuilt??? Also i hear your so called homeless ppl there whine about having no jobs or homes while typing this on their computers, so are your computers set outdoors??? And are you getting free internet service that you can stay on all day writing about SA being looters and thieves???? No, all respect and sympathy stops right here....And the ones who still have homes, why don't you offer a small family to come live with you till their home is rebuilt like San Antonions have been doing here taking strangers in their homes....Also, your ppl here are being placed in homes that were meant for single mothers who have been on the list for years and now are pushed aside for the refugees....Yes, San Anotnio is reallllly heartless.....How dare us....So save your whinning for someone who gives a damn....San Antonio has had enough....And we have had enough of your worthless post all over the internet to whomever will feel sorry for you....If the Saints stay here great, if not then i hope where ever they are the players will be happy, because they are the only ones i feel sorry for right now having to worry about winning games on top of all this mess...Yeah real fans you all are, on your message boards i read you were happy the Saints lost in SA.....Oh yeah, some real 25 yr fans there.....After those comments, you don't deserve a team anymore....

[j-6]

Benson threatens to move the Saints every year!

Hey, the team relocation isn't official or anything. Why don't we wait and see both what Baton Rouge does this weekend with Saban coming back in town and how far SA's mayor can spread his legs for Tommy Boy before acting like the sky is falling, OK?

Jeez, we're only in October, week seven. What's the talk going to be like around that November deadline?

[Marcus Bryant]

The city of New Orleans and the state of Louisiana now have a reason to come up with a new facility for the Saints (and Sugar Bowls, Super Bowls, etc...) and a solid deal as well.

If the state can't provide that, then it doesn't make sense for the Saints to stay. This was Benson's position prior to Katrina.

Man, the irony is palpable.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

The city of New Orleans and the state of Louisiana now have a reason to come up with a new facility for the Saints (and Sugar Bowls, Super Bowls, etc...) and a solid deal as well.

If the state can't provide that, then it doesn't make sense for the Saints to stay. This was Benson's position prior to Katrina.

Man, the irony is palpable.


Exactly, its all about what they will be able to provide for them...So no one is stealing anyone....Its all about money and what Benson will decide whats the most profitable...So why don't these New Olreans ppl get off the fans backs here and send all their comment to Benson...

[samikeyp]

You have every right to be angry at our city and state government. I can see where you are coming from and if I were in your shoes I would be angry as well. Benson was looking for greener pastures way before Katrina hit. At least you seem rational enough to focus your blame where it belongs, on the leadership and not the citizens of San Antonio.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

You have every right to be angry at our city and state government. I can see where you are coming from and if I were in your shoes I would be angry as well. Benson was looking for greener pastures way before Katrina hit. At least you seem rational enough to focus your blame where it belongs, on the leadership and not the citizens of San Antonio.

This person just called SA looters and their focusing on the leaders???? No it was meant for us....If it was focused on the leaders i would not have been that angry at what was written....Why not bomb bard Benson with emails instead of posting on message boards with cruel comment towards us????

[j-6]

We are still in the top ten in the NFL in attendance every year!

23rd out of 32 in 2004, and that 87.9% of capacity places the Saints 29th.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/attendance?year=2004

Ranked in the top half at 15th in '03, 24th in capacity percentage at 94%.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/attendance?year=2003

15th as well in '02, and 26th at capacity with 93%.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/attendance?year=2002

[j-6]

Why not bomb bard Benson with emails instead of posting on message boards with cruel comment towards us????

Everything I've read and heard has told me that they are.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

I wonder if the Saints end up in Los Angeles, will they be called looters as well???? That is probably where they will end up if Tags as the last word...

[mcdunk]

New Orleans will not be able to support an NFL team for many years to come if not ever without the corporate support and infrastructure rebuilding. Benson has said and implied that he would like to move the Saints.

As an NFL fan I would be disappointed if the city government did not entertain Benson and his request. Since the Saints will not be in NO in the near future they will have to relocate somewhere. With Benson finally able to get out of his Superdome contract with the act of nature clause, the odds are he is serious once and for all about relocating.

If he is going to relocate then why not SA. LA will get an expansion team and I dont see any better place to move the Saints only because NO will no longer be able to support the Saints.

As a businessman Benson is looking to gain income and it makes the most sense right here in SA. This issue is past the point of stealing the Saints from NO. It is all about an owner wanting to stay afloat and a city that is willing to take he and his team in as a means of best options.

[Marcus Bryant]

23rd out of 32 in 2004, and that 87.9% of capacity places the Saints 29th.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/attendance?year=2004

Ranked in the top half at 15th in '03, 24th in capacity percentage at 94%.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/attendance?year=2003

15th as well in '02, and 26th at capacity with 93%.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/attendance?year=2002


If you can't support your team, don't count on a 'cane to cover that up.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

Everything I've read and heard has told me that they are.

Then why not lay off of us...We have no contol over our Mayor and Benson's decisions....We're fans just like them...We're only a city that wants and NFL team whether the Saints stay here of we can get our own....We are just proving we can support a team...

[Extra Stout]

San Antonio can keep the Saints, or it can keep its good reputation.

It can't keep both.

[IceColdBrewski]

As cruel as this will sound i have had enough....Iam really fed up with all you New Orleans ppl once and for all....I felt sorry for all of you at first and donated what i could myself to help....But after all these comments about San Antonio from you, i've had enough..The Pity for YOU stops here....Seems all you wonderful devoted NO fans out there seem to forget San Antonio's major flood of 98 when YOUR Mayor came down here to lure OUR Spurs away with an offer of a brand new dome right off the bat...And your caring devoted fans were all for that idea right??....Now that is sad, your Mayor didn't come to SA then to offer support or aid, he was here specifically for the Spurs....Well thats really calling the kettle black here....So i have lost all sympathy for you and your whinning about wanting your football team back. Then your talking about what ruins your city is in??? Maybe you should rebuild your city first instead of worrying about your dome, there will be no fans to support YOUR Saints if ppl cannot even afford to rebuild their homes......And talk about selfish, you want your team to play also in an area that does not even want them including their own Mayor??? The ticket sales are a big deal because do you think these players want to play in a stadium not even half full???? And play like that for years till your precious dome is rebuilt??? Also i hear your so called homeless ppl there whine about having no jobs or homes while typing this on their computers, so are your computers set outdoors??? And are you getting free internet service that you can stay on all day writing about SA being looters and thieves???? No, all respect and sympathy stops right here....And the ones who still have homes, why don't you offer a small family to come live with you till their home is rebuilt like San Antonions have been doing here taking strangers in their homes....Also, your ppl here are being placed in homes that were meant for single mothers who have been on the list for years and now are pushed aside for the refugees....Yes, San Anotnio is reallllly heartless.....How dare us....So save your whinning for someone who gives a damn....San Antonio has had enough....And we have had enough of your worthless post all over the internet to whomever will feel sorry for you....If the Saints stay here great, if not then i hope where ever they are the players will be happy, because they are the only ones i feel sorry for right now having to worry about winning games on top of all this mess...Yeah real fans you all are, on your message boards i read you were happy the Saints lost in SA.....Oh yeah, some real 25 yr fans there.....After those comments, you don't deserve a team anymore....

Thank you. Someone who isn't afraid to tell it like it is. I donated money, towels, toiletries, water, and half the clothes out of my closet. The rest of my family did the same. And all we got for it from Saints fan was, "Ha, ha, ha. You couldn't sell out your first NFL game. Now go away and stop trying to loot our team."

This was actually the first time I've seen a Saints fan offer any kind of thanx. But even then, it was all under the guise of coming in here to trash the people of our city and call us "looters."

If your team ends up here in San Antonio, it's because that's what YOUR team owner wants. Not because we stole them. You want sympathy? Go look in the dictionary between "shit" and "syphilis".

[Marcus Bryant]

San Antonio can keep the Saints, or it can keep its good reputation.

It can't keep both.


What's a "good reputation" worth these days?

[j-6]

Then why not lay off of us...We have no contol over our Mayor and Benson's decisions....We're fans just like them...We're only a city that wants and NFL team whether the Saints stay here of we can get our own....We are just proving we can support a team...


They're frustrated and sick of, among other things:

-- seeing those "SAints" shirts in the Alamodome

--the mayor of San Antonio trying to start relocation talks in the middle of the NFL season (which I think has no precedent in the modern era)

--watching the Meadowlands and the Giants get a Saints home game for some publicity stunt

--seeing the loudest mouthpiece for Louisiana getting any home games in the Saints administration after the Katrina tragedy gets unceremoniously shitcanned Monday morning

--players like Joe Horn saying they wish they could play more games in San Antonio

--uncertain status of the "temporary" Superdome reconstruction and renovation that started this week


I'm sure there's a helluva lot more that I'm leaving out.

[tgrgrd00]

23rd out of 32 in 2004, and that 87.9% of capacity places the Saints 29th.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/attendance?year=2004

Ranked in the top half at 15th in '03, 24th in capacity percentage at 94%.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/attendance?year=2003

15th as well in '02, and 26th at capacity with 93%.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/attendance?year=2002


What is our average over the past 10 years????? I may have been wrong with top 10 (that is what I heard) but I know we are in the top half over the past 10 years. Don't forget that we are considered a small market and we hang with some of the large markets in terms of attendance.

[FromWayDowntown]

The premise here is flawed.

San Antonio's courtship of Benson and the Saints (at least in a public sense) didn't start until Benson's team relocated here and comments attributed to Benson indicated that he desired to move his team here permanently. What I don't understand about the complaints from New Orleans is what they expected San Antonio to do in that situation?

Faced with a very real offer to have an NFL team in San Antonio, should the city leaders have simply said "You know, we would normally be interested, but given the catastrophe of Katrina, we can't do anything to entice the Saints."

Then again, that's exactly what the City's leaders did -- originally.

Tagliabue upped the stakes and got San Antonio's gander up. By characterizing San Antonio as a small market, City leaders understandably became inflamed and desired to show Tagliabue and the rest of the world that San Antonio has the ability to sell tickets and get fannies in seats for NFL games. Given the disparity between what San Antonio did (on extremely short notice) to get tickets sold, the apparent problems with selling tickets in New Orleans, and Tagliabue's characterization, it makes sense that there was no more reason for San Antonio to play Mr. Nice Guy in this. Mr. Nice Guy, who looks out for the interests of others, tends to get rolled over. Since it appeared that so many didn't respect the efforts of this City and its ability to support a team, why shouldn't the City make a stronger push to court the Saints? It's only in our own best interests -- which nobody else seems terribly concerned with.

The straw that broke the camel's back for me is the remembrance of New Orleans' attempt to lure the Spurs. I have a great deal of sympathy for the people of New Orleans and their plight post-Katrina.

But when it comes to this issue, I've lost any sense of sympathy for bedraggled Saints fans. Your city unabashedly came after the Spurs -- why on Earth should we think twice about courting the Saints? After all, what's good for the goose . . . .

[samikeyp]

Is it stealing if the team wants to move here?

Question.

[ShoogarBear]

I guess I'm in the minority, but I'm embarassed at what San Antonio is doing with regard to the Saints. There are "right" ways and "wrong" ways, and this is wrong.

And if another city was doing this, a lot of folks around here would be way up on their moral high horses on the other side of the fence.

[j-6]

A few interesting reads for anyone who is up for them:

Times-Picayune: Saints loss victory for San Antonio
http://www.nola.com/sports/t-p/index.ssf?/base/sports-20/1129615527205800.xml

Times (Shreveport): Fielkow firing not good for Saints fans
http://www.shreveporttimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051019/SPORTS0401/510190320/1032/SPORTS0302

Advocate (Baton Rouge): State rushes to fix Dome for Saints
http://www.2theadvocate.com/stories/101905/new_dome001.shtml

Sun Herald (Biloxi, MS): Cowardly move shows Benson's truest colors
http://www.sunherald.com/mld/thesunherald/sports/12937757.htm

[samikeyp]

I agree with you Shoog. I think Hardberger has seemed a little too eager. I do also believe however, that Benson has been as well.

[Marcus Bryant]

Is it stealing if the team wants to move here?

Question.


Precisely.

All Louisiana has to do is come up with a new facility. After all, that's what SA did when those thieving bitches from the bayous tried to loot our beloved Spurs.

[Extra Stout]

What's a "good reputation" worth these days?

Beats me.

The city will have to put up with a near-unanimous round of condemnation from media and fans around the country.

And that of course will only get worse when San Antonians write writing profane and defensive letters to God and everyone.

But a tangible loss? I don't know. Do people around the country hate Baltimore for doing to Cleveland what was done to them? Probably not.

Surely S.A. will lose some of that image of friendliness and charm and good old-fashioned values. The city will have somewhat of an edge now. San Antonians will be known as the kind of people who will backstab a neighbor in need to get something they want. And what can you say? That image is accurate. But, it's not necessarily bad for business, and the city is becoming more and more a business center for manufacturing and biotech, and less and less a sleepy tourist haven. And often the business moguls demand that you stab the little guy in the back to get them what they need. For all I know, this behavior may raise S.A.'s standing in their eyes.

Becoming cutthroat is just part of growing up, apparently. Let San Antonians ponder what they have lost, if they still care. The small-town feel is dying.

Anyway, Benson is the true coward and bastard here. He had a chance to show real leadership and spearhead the Gulf Coast recovery with the visibility of his franchise. Instead, he's taking the opportunity to turn tail and run from the challenge.

He is a very small, very cheap, very miserly, evil and bastardly little man. As he nears death, I can only give him advice to pack very light for the hereafter. I imagine he will spend eternity having his flesh continuously gnawed away by nutria rats.

San Antonio is an accomplice here, but Benson is the real motherfucker.

Also -- note from the lesson of Phoenix: when you get the team, you get its owner, too. And the Benson clan are shitty little people, and the way they run the team, and have always run the team, reflects that. The contrast with the Spurs could not be more striking.

[tgrgrd00]

As cruel as this will sound i have had enough....

You do sound cruel.



....Iam really fed up with all you New Orleans ppl once and for all....I felt sorry for all of you at first and donated what i could myself to help....But after all these comments about San Antonio from you, i've had enough..The Pity for YOU stops here....Seems all you wonderful devoted NO fans out there seem to forget San Antonio's major flood of 98 when YOUR Mayor came down here to lure OUR Spurs away with an offer of a brand new dome right off the bat...And your caring devoted fans were all for that idea right??....Now that is sad, your Mayor didn't come to SA then to offer support or aid, he was here specifically for the Spurs....Well thats really calling the kettle black here....
....

Clarify something for me...did this flood make the Spurs dome unusable? Did the Spurs have to relocate because of this flood? Where did the Spurs play while the dome was being repaired? Where there other circumstances surrounding the Spurs that prompted N.O. to court the Spurs franchise?

Honestly I don't know becuase I don't follow the NBA and don't particularly care for professional basketball. I vaugly remember this whole fiasco but do not recall the details.





So i have lost all sympathy for you and your whinning about wanting your football team back. Then your talking about what ruins your city is in??? Maybe you should rebuild your city first instead of worrying about your dome, there will be no fans to support YOUR Saints if ppl cannot even afford to rebuild their homes......And talk about selfish, you want your team to play also in an area that does not even want them including their own Mayor???
....

I never asked for your sympathy. PART OF REBUILDING OUR CITY IS GETTING OUR FOOTBALL TEAM BACK!!!! Rebuilding can be described as putting things back how they were which would include the New Orleans Saints.




The ticket sales are a big deal because do you think these players want to play in a stadium not even half full???? And play like that for years till your precious dome is rebuilt???


We have sustained a losing NFL team for 38 years. There is no need to justify this any further.



Also i hear your so called homeless ppl there whine about having no jobs or homes while typing this on their computers, so are your computers set outdoors??? And are you getting free internet service that you can stay on all day writing about SA being looters and thieves???? No, all respect and sympathy stops right here....And the ones who still have homes, why don't you offer a small family to come live with you till their home is rebuilt like San Antonions have been doing here taking strangers in their homes....



I am living in a home in N.O. that has 9 people in a 2 bedroom house. I am also forutanate that the company I work for sustained minimal damage. I have internet access at home and at work.



Also, your ppl here are being placed in homes that were meant for single mothers who have been on the list for years and now are pushed aside for the refugees....Yes, San Anotnio is reallllly heartless.....How dare us....So save your whinning for someone who gives a damn....


Again I think you for all you have done and continue to do with the people who are displaced from their homes.



San Antonio has had enough....And we have had enough of your worthless post all over the internet to whomever will feel sorry for you....If the Saints stay here great, if not then i hope where ever they are the players will be happy, because they are the only ones i feel sorry for right now having to worry about winning games on top of all this mess...Yeah real fans you all are, on your message boards i read you were happy the Saints lost in SA.....Oh yeah, some real 25 yr fans there.....After those comments, you don't deserve a team anymore
....

I never said a word of that...please don't group me in with someone from another board. I don't care where the Saints play....I want them to win every game.

[Pistons < Spurs]

I guess I'm in the minority, but I'm embarassed at what San Antonio is doing with regard to the Saints. There are "right" ways and "wrong" ways, and this is wrong.

And if another city was doing this, a lot of folks around here would be way up on their moral high horses on the other side of the fence.


Exactly.

[Extra Stout]

Precisely.

All Louisiana has to do is come up with a new facility. After all, that's what SA did when those thieving bitches from the bayous tried to loot our beloved Spurs.
I don't think you're right. Benson isn't even entertaining the idea of a new facility in Louisiana.

He just wants out, yesterday preferrably.

[ChumpDumper]

It all comes down to money, or rather how much money governments here or there decide to give Benson.

In light of all the money to be spent in reconstruction, how many millions do folks from NOLA want to go into Benson's pocket?

[tgrgrd00]

They're frustrated and sick of, among other things:

-- seeing those "SAints" shirts in the Alamodome

--the mayor of San Antonio trying to start relocation talks in the middle of the NFL season (which I think has no precedent in the modern era)

--watching the Meadowlands and the Giants get a Saints home game for some publicity stunt

--seeing the loudest mouthpiece for Louisiana getting any home games in the Saints administration after the Katrina tragedy gets unceremoniously shitcanned Monday morning

--players like Joe Horn saying they wish they could play more games in San Antonio

--uncertain status of the "temporary" Superdome reconstruction and renovation that started this week


I'm sure there's a helluva lot more that I'm leaving out.

Right on j-6

[ChumpDumper]

And if another city was doing this, a lot of folks around here would be way up on their moral high horses on the other side of the fence.Actually, when places like NOLA were doing this with the Spurs, I said SA was going to have to bend over the table to keep them in town.

Eventually they did.

NOLA will have to do the same this time.

[Extra Stout]

It all comes down to money, or rather how much money governments here or there decide to give Benson.

In light of all the money to be spent in reconstruction, how many millions do folks from NOLA want to go into Benson's pocket?That's another red herring.

The Superdome is insured. Insurance will pay the bulk of the cost to refurbish it.

That facility would be a logical anchor for the development projects that will be needed in New Orleans to re-establish the economy there, whether the Saints stick around or not.

[Marcus Bryant]

San Antonio is an accomplice here, but Benson is the real motherfucker.

Also -- note from the lesson of Phoenix: when you get the team, you get its owner, too. And the Benson clan are shitty little people, and the way they run the team, and have always run the team, reflects that. The contrast with the Spurs could not be more striking.


The thing is, he's SA's motherfucker. This is pretty much the only way SA is going to get a team in the next decade. I think the league has reached its limit with franchises. Maybe another relocation opportunity will pop up, but SA would have to stand on its own against other potential destinations (ie Los Angeles).

There were two NFL owners with ties to the area. McCombs was never going to move that team out of a superior market to SA. But Benson's always had the much more appealing proposition...move from a poor market to a better one and one where he had deep ties.

If NO didn't try to capitalize on SA's inability to get a facility deal done back in the late 90s and Benson hadn't been making plenty of noise for years about relocating, I might feel otherwise.

[j-6]

Beats me.

The city will have to put up with a near-unanimous round of condemnation from media and fans around the country.

And that of course will only get worse when San Antonians write writing profane and defensive letters to God and everyone.

But a tangible loss? I don't know. Do people around the country hate Baltimore for doing to Cleveland what was done to them? Probably not.

Surely S.A. will lose some of that image of friendliness and charm and good old-fashioned values. The city will have somewhat of an edge now. San Antonians will be known as the kind of people who will backstab a neighbor in need to get something they want. And what can you say? That image is accurate. But, it's not necessarily bad for business, and the city is becoming more and more a business center for manufacturing and biotech, and less and less a sleepy tourist haven. And often the business moguls demand that you stab the little guy in the back to get them what they need. For all I know, this behavior may raise S.A.'s standing in their eyes.

Becoming cutthroat is just part of growing up, apparently. Let San Antonians ponder what they have lost, if they still care. The small-town feel is dying.

Anyway, Benson is the true coward and bastard here. He had a chance to show real leadership and spearhead the Gulf Coast recovery with the visibility of his franchise. Instead, he's taking the opportunity to turn tail and run from the challenge.

He is a very small, very cheap, very miserly, evil and bastardly little man. As he nears death, I can only give him advice to pack very light for the hereafter. I imagine he will spend eternity having his flesh continuously gnawed away by nutria rats.

San Antonio is an accomplice here, but Benson is the real motherfucker.

Also -- note from the lesson of Phoenix: when you get the team, you get its owner, too. And the Benson clan are shitty little people, and the way they run the team, and have always run the team, reflects that. The contrast with the Spurs could not be more striking.

Great post. :tu

The Baltimore-Cleveland comparison is pretty interesting. I'm lurked on and off on a board called Saintsreport.com since the beginning of the season, and there's a big push to contact Browns fans and see what they did after Modell-gate.

Though I do wonder what the Baltimore fans, especially the ones that shifted their alliance to the Redskins after the Colts left, thought of the Browns/Ravens move to town and the national negativity shed upon their city.

This will be worse, though, because SA will be viewed both as a thieving opportunist in the wake of a natural disaster and a town willing to get into bed with a snake like Benson.

[samikeyp]

Stout...I get your points. Along those same lines, (and this goes out to everyone also...)do you think it is wrong for SA to try and get the team if Benson is offering them? (if indeed that is the case)

[tgrgrd00]

I don't think you're right. Benson isn't even entertaining the idea of a new facility in Louisiana.

He just wants out, yesterday preferrably.


Wrong....wrong....wrong...Quit believing everythign the media out there tells you to make S.A. feel better. He wants a new stadium. There are plans for several different stadiums in different areas of the city.

The agreement has been a remodelling of the superdome until the new stadium can be built by 2010 or something like that.

There is a long term plan for the Saints in N.O. and Benson was a part of it until Katrina...now who knows because he isn't speaking (get used to that).

[ChumpDumper]

The Superdome is insured. Insurance will pay the bulk of the cost to refurbish it.

That facility would be a logical anchor for the development projects that will be needed in New Orleans to re-establish the economy there, whether the Saints stick around or not.So the direct subsidy paid to Benson is a red herring?

How so?

[Marcus Bryant]

I don't think you're right. Benson isn't even entertaining the idea of a new facility in Louisiana.

He just wants out, yesterday preferrably.


Some of that is posturing. If the state came up with plans for a new facility with the Saints getting a large cut of the stadium revenues (ala the SBC Center) I'm sure he'd change his tune.

[j-6]

Wrong....wrong....wrong...Quit believing everythign the media out there tells you to make S.A. feel better. He wants a new stadium. There are plans for several different stadiums in different areas of the city.

The agreement has been a remodelling of the superdome until the new stadium can be built by 2010 or something like that.

There is a long term plan for the Saints in N.O. and Benson was a part of it until Katrina...now who knows because he isn't speaking (get used to that).

Whatever happened to the plans for this thing?

Name: Saints Stadium
Team: New Orleans Saints
Scheduled inauguration: 2009
Cost: $450 million
Capacity: 60,000-70,000 seats
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/jalbre6/saintsnew1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/jalbre6/saintsnew2.jpg

[Extra Stout]

Some of that is posturing. If the state came up with plans for a new facility with the Saints getting a large cut of the stadium revenues (ala the SBC Center) I'm sure he'd change his tune.
Well, the refurbishment of the Superdome is a given. Even without the Saints, it was a profitable facility, and is a central cog in their conventioneering business. You have Mayor Nagin and the rest of TPTB already pushing forth their redevelopment proposals. If Benson truly were interested in what Louisiana had to say, he would be in the middle of those conversations.

Instead, he's firing anybody who even mentions the idea of talking with Louisiana about keeping the Saints there.

This is not about Louisiana dropping the ball. They aren't being given the opportunity to drop it even. Benson simply wants out, and doesn't care how he's perceived.

[j-6]

Ray Nagin had a interesting line I saw somewhere else, maybe on WWL. I'll have to check. When asked about the Saints status with New Orleans, he said he wanted the team back but not the owner.

[tgrgrd00]

Whatever happened to the plans for this thing?

Name: Saints Stadium
Team: New Orleans Saints
Scheduled inauguration: 2009
Cost: $450 million
Capacity: 60,000-70,000 seats
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/jalbre6/saintsnew1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/jalbre6/saintsnew2.jpg


As far as I know it is still in the works....but who knows with what is going on. That was going to be a sweeeeet stadium too. Right on the Mississippi river.

[Marcus Bryant]

Well, the refurbishment of the Superdome is a given. Even without the Saints, it was a profitable facility, and is a central cog in their conventioneering business. You have Mayor Nagin and the rest of TPTB already pushing forth their redevelopment proposals. If Benson truly were interested in what Louisiana had to say, he would be in the middle of those conversations.

Instead, he's firing anybody who even mentions the idea of talking with Louisiana about keeping the Saints there.

This is not about Louisiana dropping the ball. They aren't being given the opportunity to drop it even. Benson simply wants out, and doesn't care how he's perceived.



Well, he's wanted a new facility. That's where the posturing comes into effect. If he makes it clear that a refurbished Superdome won't do it for him, then he is applying pressure on the state to come up with a new facility.

This is where SA is the bargaining chip. SA can become the destination if someone comes up with a viable new long-term stadium plan.

[ChumpDumper]

Benson was scheduled to receive a total of $186 million in state subsidies over the remaining life of the current lease.

How much should Louisianna pay him in a new lease?

[Marcus Bryant]

I don't know what Saints fans are so worried about. In order for SA to end up with the Saints the city would have to come up with a $400 million facility on its own. Given how much San Antonians bitched about funding a new $180 mil arena for a NBA champion that was funded with a hotel tax and a contribution from the team, you don't have much to fear.

[TheTruth]

Ray Nagin had a interesting line I saw somewhere else, maybe on WWL. I'll have to check. When asked about the Saints status with New Orleans, he said he wanted the team back but not the owner.
he said it during a radio interview...its in a thread over at saintsreport.com

[Marcus Bryant]

Benson was scheduled to receive a total of $186 million in state subsidies over the remaining life of the current lease.

How much should Louisianna pay him in a new lease?


Yep, looking like a lot more.

[Extra Stout]

Wrong....wrong....wrong...Quit believing everythign the media out there tells you to make S.A. feel better. He wants a new stadium. There are plans for several different stadiums in different areas of the city.

The agreement has been a remodelling of the superdome until the new stadium can be built by 2010 or something like that.

There is a long term plan for the Saints in N.O. and Benson was a part of it until Katrina...now who knows because he isn't speaking (get used to that).OK, buddy, no offense... but try reading comprehension.

I'm not trying to rationalize S.A. brazen act of looting here.

Marcus was doing that. He was saying, well if New Orleans wants to keep the Saints, then let's see their stadium deal.

My point was that the damage to the Superdome, and the insurance check that will be coming in, present an opportunity to do a more substantial renovation to the facility than what otherwise would be done.

And, the federal and private money that will be pouring in to redevelop the economy would present an opportunity to further expand the revenue-generating capability of the Saints franchise. Even without the Saints, upgrading the Superdome complex seems like a no-brainer.

So if all Benson were doing is playing S.A. off New Orleans in order to get a better stadium deal, then it would make sense for him to be involved in the conversations already in progress about how to rebuild New Orleans.

He's not doing that. He wants no part of it.

Now, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe the attitude in New Orleans is that the Saints need to take a back seat. Maybe you have the same petty corrupt little politicians who don't want a big grand master plan to encourage development downtown because that means less money for graft to funnel to their little cronies. Maybe all the plans for a new facility are off the table and the Saints were just expected to sit there and swallow huge losses in a patched-together Superdome for the forseeable future, because it was supposedly their civic duty in light of the catastrophe.

So, maybe you can let me know. Am I right, and is Benson walking away from an agreement that was still in place in principle? Or am I wrong, and is he walking away from a city that dropped him to the bottom of the priority list?

[gameFACE]

tgrgrd00,

I’m very sorry for your losses as well as every one else in New Orleans, Louisiana and Mississippi who are struggling to put pieces back together again.

Your comparison of San Antonio losing the Spurs to New Orleans losing the Saints is a valid one in terms of loss and sentiment and what people turn to in times of tragedy to feel better if just for a moment. I’m a native San Antonian and been a Spurs fan since junior high in the mid-seventies. The Spurs may be champions now but that has not always been the case and anyone who went through thick and thin with them in the 80’s knows what I’m talking about. But if a natural disaster struck SA to the magnitude of Katrina destruction I would not place a very high priority on the Spurs. I’m sure I would be hurt if Austin took them but my real focus is elsewhere as perhaps yours really is. I’ve suffered through some serious personal losses before and while I may have enjoyed watching a game to break away for a bit it was just that – a temporary break. If my city was re-building I would definitely not put a priority on funding for rebuilding the SBC Center in any way shape or form while people are homeless and have no work. I would support the rebuilding of infrastructure and luring of businesses back to the area as well as providing stable school systems. Maybe it’s me but re-establishing the presence of professional sports would be a fairly low priority if any in the context of things.

As we in other cities understand the situation in New Orleans, and as you mention, businesses have relocated both permanently and temporarily, unemployment claims are thirteen times higher this month than they were last year (per the Times-Picayune). Many neighborhoods are unlivable and many people have just decided to relocate altogether. This is the picture that is presented outside NO. With this situation I ask you honestly, where is the financial support for the Saints going to be generated from in the near future? I understand the emotional response but I’m asking for a practical response. I’d like to see the Saints back in NO as much as anyone but I don't see it happening.

I agree that our Mayor is not the most politically tactical individual on the face of the Earth. He lacks political couth in his public statements especially the Baton Rouge comments. That aside, would it have been easier if he waited until the lease deadline next month or after the season? And if they are moved to LA is it any more hurtful if Paul Tagliabue has his way instead of Tom Benson?

SHinerBockGirl, the flood in SA has absolutely no relation to La luring the Spurs nor can it be compared to the devastation in NO.

[MannyIsGod]

Give me a fucking break. When someone compares your courting of the Spurs you call it apples and oranges? Only because you were on the other side of the fence.

I'm sick of this shit from NO fans. I sweat my ass off in warehouses to help you people and I worked when tired as hell at shelters to help people out. And because of a private business franchise's actions, fans like you have be shitting on San Antonio all over Saintsreport.com and now here as well.

I'm just flat out sick of it. You need to pull your head out of your ass and get some damn perspective. When your city is a virtual wasteland with no viable stadium and your people have real problems you need to get over the fact that you may lose your franchise. San Antonio's leadership is in place to look after San Antonio's interests, not New Orleans. We didn't elect them so that they could take actions that give YOU the warm fuzzies, we put them in office to do the best they could for San Antonio.

And with that in mind, they HAVE done things that are in the best interests of residents from NOLA. They are footing the bill for housing a good deal of them when there isn't much money to go around. That mayor of ours that is being portrayed as a villian by fans like yourself and the media that cators to them was a fucking saint when the disaster struck.

So, quite frankly, you and the rest of the so called Saints nation can go fuck yourselves. I'm sick of you assholes who act as though we're stealing your wife. I hope we get the team and I hope they broadcast every fucking game in NOLA so you can see us cheering them on.

[tgrgrd00]

OK, buddy, no offense... but try reading comprehension.

I'm not trying to rationalize S.A. brazen act of looting here.

Marcus was doing that. He was saying, well if New Orleans wants to keep the Saints, then let's see their stadium deal.

My point was that the damage to the Superdome, and the insurance check that will be coming in, present an opportunity to do a more substantial renovation to the facility than what otherwise would be done.

And, the federal and private money that will be pouring in to redevelop the economy would present an opportunity to further expand the revenue-generating capability of the Saints franchise. Even without the Saints, upgrading the Superdome complex seems like a no-brainer.

So if all Benson were doing is playing S.A. off New Orleans in order to get a better stadium deal, then it would make sense for him to be involved in the conversations already in progress about how to rebuild New Orleans.

He's not doing that. He wants no part of it.

Now, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe the attitude in New Orleans is that the Saints need to take a back seat. Maybe you have the same petty corrupt little politicians who don't want a big grand master plan to encourage development downtown because that means less money for graft to funnel to their little cronies. Maybe all the plans for a new facility are off the table and the Saints were just expected to sit there and swallow huge losses in a patched-together Superdome for the forseeable future, because it was supposedly their civic duty in light of the catastrophe.

So, maybe you can let me know. Am I right, and is Benson walking away from an agreement that was still in place in principle? Or am I wrong, and is he walking away from a city that dropped him to the bottom of the priority list?

I don't think the attitude in N.O. is that the Saints take a back seat. Everyone in N.O. knows that the Saints are our most recognizable corporation. We only have one fortune 500 company and they are filing bankruptcy. They are working on bids from contractors to repair the dome as I type.

Benson...after all the money we have made for him through the Saints and direct payments has dropped us to the bottom of HIS priority list. We have many problems and we always....always put him right at the top because we love the Saints...not him.

Benson has an agreement in written contract with the city not principle.

[blaze89]

Ray Nagin had a interesting line I saw somewhere else, maybe on WWL. I'll have to check. When asked about the Saints status with New Orleans, he said he wanted the team back but not the owner.

You could say that about alot of owners in every sports league in this country.

[Marcus Bryant]

Look, we are talking about entertainment. What's more important to NO residents right now? A team or finding a place to live and a way to survive?

Yes, everyone feels sorry for your plight. But there's no human right to a NFL franchise.

[ChumpDumper]

Benson has an agreement in written contract with the city not principle.But that's probably about to end because of the very language of the contract.

What then?

[Shiner Bock Girl]

What's a "good reputation" worth these days?

I think the 65,556 ppl who were at the Saints game could have cared less about reputation...Where was SA's reputation taking in 20,000 refugees and still placing them in homes??? All down the drain because we want an NFL team that is homeless maybe for years???? I guess i'll take the bad reputation...
:elephant Iam a Texans fan, but while the Saints are here, i will continue to support them. If and when they leave, I wish them all the best....Like i said earlier, i think they will end up in Los Angeles anyways..

[MannyIsGod]

And for the next asshole who says San Antonio is stealing anything, they may want to realize New Orleans doesn't own the fucking Saints.

[tgrgrd00]

Give me a fucking break. When someone compares your courting of the Spurs you call it apples and oranges? Only because you were on the other side of the fence.

It is not the same situation...if you think it is you are warped. Several of your own posters on this board agree.



I'm sick of this shit from NO fans. I sweat my ass off in warehouses to help you people and I worked when tired as hell at shelters to help people out. And because of a private business franchise's actions, fans like you have be shitting on San Antonio all over Saintsreport.com and now here as well.

I thank you from the bottom of my heart for all you have done to help us in our time of need.

It is because of your mayor and city leaders you are getting shit on. What do you expect?



I'm just flat out sick of it. You need to pull your head out of your ass and get some damn perspective. When your city is a virtual wasteland with no viable stadium and your people have real problems you need to get over the fact that you may lose your franchise. San Antonio's leadership is in place to look after San Antonio's interests, not New Orleans. We didn't elect them so that they could take actions that give YOU the warm fuzzies, we put them in office to do the best they could for San Antonio.


We have viable stadium options. Both in Baton Rouge and N.O. The superdome has insurance and can be repaired fairly quickly.

I hope your leaders are doing what is best for S.A. I would expect nothing less.

You know what...I am sick of it too. I am sick on S.A. trying to take our team away from us when we have so much more to do. I am sick of pulling up carpet and tearing out sheet rock...I am sick of that fucking smell coming from refrigerators with rotton food...I am sick of getting shit on by the federal government when we provide so much for this nation. My head is not in my ass. I know what is going on...S.A. is trying to take advantage of a disadvantaged city...and I am sick of it just like you are sick of it too.



And with that in mind, they HAVE done things that are in the best interests of residents from NOLA. They are footing the bill for housing a good deal of them when there isn't much money to go around. That mayor of ours that is being portrayed as a villian by fans like yourself and the media that cators to them was a fucking saint when the disaster struck.


Again thank you for your assistance and I assure you when we are capable and God forbid it necessary we will do the same for you. Your mayor was quite Saintly after the storm.



So, quite frankly, you and the rest of the so called Saints nation can go fuck yourselves. I'm sick of you assholes who act as though we're stealing your wife. I hope we get the team and I hope they broadcast every fucking game in NOLA so you can see us cheering them on.

You are stealing our wife you fuck!!!!!!!

[Shiner Bock Girl]

They're frustrated and sick of, among other things:

-- seeing those "SAints" shirts in the Alamodome

--the mayor of San Antonio trying to start relocation talks in the middle of the NFL season (which I think has no precedent in the modern era)

--watching the Meadowlands and the Giants get a Saints home game for some publicity stunt

--seeing the loudest mouthpiece for Louisiana getting any home games in the Saints administration after the Katrina tragedy gets unceremoniously shitcanned Monday morning

--players like Joe Horn saying they wish they could play more games in San Antonio

--uncertain status of the "temporary" Superdome reconstruction and renovation that started this week


I'm sure there's a helluva lot more that I'm leaving out.


Well again, they are voicing their opinions to the WRONG ppl....I didn't like the shirts either and that was wrong. SA is just as tired of them as they are of us...Nothing more to say....

[Marcus Bryant]

I don't think the attitude in N.O. is that the Saints take a back seat. Everyone in N.O. knows that the Saints are our most recognizable corporation. We only have one fortune 500 company and they are filing bankruptcy. They are working on bids from contractors to repair the dome as I type.

Benson...after all the money we have made for him through the Saints and direct payments has dropped us to the bottom of HIS priority list. We have many problems and we always....always put him right at the top because we love the Saints...not him.

Benson has an agreement in written contract with the city not principle.


Yes, it was that bad of a market before Katrina that the team could command a public subsidy.

Benson kept that team in New Orleans for a long time when it would've been worth much more elsewhere. Yeah, maybe's he's a dick at the moment for not giving more to New Orleans.

There's no right to a NFL franchise for a city or its residents. I don't see what's so important about having a NFL team now in a city that has considerably more pressing concerns at the moment.

Saints fans want to act as those SA doesn't have its priorities in order, well, your city's been wiped out, your neighbors spread all over the place or dead, and you are worried about a damn football team?

[tgrgrd00]

Look, we are talking about entertainment. What's more important to NO residents right now? A team or finding a place to live and a way to survive?

Yes, everyone feels sorry for your plight. But there's no human right to a NFL franchise.

Exactly....a team isn't that important at the moment. So you are going to come in and take that away while we are doing do many other things? Come in and take the franchise while we are away tending to more important matters? That is awfly neighborly of you...don't turn your back we are coming after the Alamo the next time you have a flood.

There is no human right to the Alamo is there?

[Shiner Bock Girl]

A few interesting reads for anyone who is up for them:

Times-Picayune: Saints loss victory for San Antonio
http://www.nola.com/sports/t-p/index.ssf?/base/sports-20/1129615527205800.xml

Times (Shreveport): Fielkow firing not good for Saints fans
http://www.shreveporttimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051019/SPORTS0401/510190320/1032/SPORTS0302

Advocate (Baton Rouge): State rushes to fix Dome for Saints
http://www.2theadvocate.com/stories/101905/new_dome001.shtml

Sun Herald (Biloxi, MS): Cowardly move shows Benson's truest colors
http://www.sunherald.com/mld/thesunherald/sports/12937757.htm

Do you really think LA's news is going to say anything good about Benson right now???? lol....Understandable, but i take what they say with a grain of salt, the same as i take anything here seriously yet....

[Pistons < Spurs]

Look, we are talking about entertainment. What's more important to NO residents right now? A team or finding a place to live and a way to survive?


Right after 9/11 everyone wanted to be sure that the start of the NFL season was not postponed. It was a sign of hope. It was part of a process of healing. Football is very important to its community. Especially during trying times. It may just be entertainment...but it also so much more.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

I guess I'm in the minority, but I'm embarassed at what San Antonio is doing with regard to the Saints. There are "right" ways and "wrong" ways, and this is wrong.

And if another city was doing this, a lot of folks around here would be way up on their moral high horses on the other side of the fence.


We were on the other side of the fense in 98....They had no problem with courting the spurs....Sad their Mayor was only down here to offer the spurs a new stadium, but no financial support for the ppl of san antonio who lost homes in the flood...

[ChumpDumper]

Football is very important to its community. Especially during trying times. It may just be entertainment...but it also so much more. How important?

You will need to put a dollar figure on it.

It was $186 million from the state directly into Benson's pocket.

What will it be now?

[tgrgrd00]

Yes, it was that bad of a market before Katrina that the team could command a public subsidy.

Benson kept that team in New Orleans for a long time when it would've been worth much more elsewhere. Yeah, maybe's he's a dick at the moment for not giving more to New Orleans.

There's no right to a NFL franchise for a city or its residents. I don't see what's so important about having a NFL team now in a city that has considerably more pressing concerns at the moment.

Saints fans want to act as those SA doesn't have its priorities in order, well, your city's been wiped out, your neighbors spread all over the place or dead, and you are worried about a damn football team?


HAHAHAHAHA...Exactly my point. You said it yourself. OUR CITY HAS BEEN WIPED OUT, NEIGHBORS SPREAD ALL OVER OR DEAD!!!!!!

SO YOU ARE GOING TO TAKE OUR FOOTBALL TEAM ON TOP OF EVERYTHING ELSE?!?!?!

Thanks a bunch...next time at least give us a reach around!!!

[Marcus Bryant]

Exactly....a team isn't that important at the moment. So you are going to come in and take that away while we are doing do many other things? Come in and take the franchise while we are away tending to more important matters? That is awfly neighborly of you...don't turn your back we are coming after the Alamo the next time you have a flood.


The franchise came to SA. It's looking for a home.




There is no human right to the Alamo is there?

No, but it's not a NFL franchise.

[Marcus Bryant]

HAHAHAHAHA...Exactly my point. You said it yourself. OUR CITY HAS BEEN WIPED OUT, NEIGHBORS SPREAD ALL OVER OR DEAD!!!!!!

SO YOU ARE GOING TO TAKE OUR FOOTBALL TEAM ON TOP OF EVERYTHING ELSE?!?!?!

Thanks a bunch...next time at least give us a reach around!!!


No, I'm saying maybe you should be thinking about them instead of losing a business that was forced to relocate.

[MannyIsGod]

Exactly....a team isn't that important at the moment. So you are going to come in and take that away while we are doing do many other things? Come in and take the franchise while we are away tending to more important matters? That is awfly neighborly of you...don't turn your back we are coming after the Alamo the next time you have a flood.

There is no human right to the Alamo is there?
Feel free. Its the Alamo, its ugly and boring. :lol

[Marcus Bryant]

Football is a game. It's not vital to someone's life (if you want to lead a healthy one, I suppose).

OMFG, how do people live in a city where there is no NFL team?!

New Orleans was lucky to have a NFL franchise for all those years. The luck was running out way before Katrina hit.

[tgrgrd00]

Feel free. Its the Alamo, its ugly and boring. :lol

So are the Saints!!!!!!!

[Shiner Bock Girl]

As far as I know it is still in the works....but who knows with what is going on. That was going to be a sweeeeet stadium too. Right on the Mississippi river.

That would be a sweet stadium...Maybe the Saints need to go back to LSU to play and see if they can make it there financially till the smoke blows over and decides what their future will be,.....Then maybe if they come back to SA, we're not to blame anymore.

[tgrgrd00]

Football is a game. It's not vital to someone's life (if you want to lead a healthy one, I suppose).

OMFG, how do people live in a city where there is no NFL team?!

New Orleans was lucky to have a NFL franchise for all those years. The luck was running out way before Katrina hit.


Show me one piece of evidence that the Saints were leaving before Katrina! Until I see this I will not respond to this argument again.

I have shown evidence that there is/was a long term plan with N.O. for the Saints nobody has shown me anything that says the Saints were leaving before Katrina. Your media has told you this but it is untrue.

Better to be lucky than good.

[MannyIsGod]

San Antonio did not go looking for the Saints, the Saints came to us. I'm not going to look down on my mayor and city for not turning them away to make people like you happy.

[MannyIsGod]

What was going to happen before Katrina is irrelevent considering Katrina did hit and there is no way to erase that. Show me once piece of proof you should have any say so in the running of a private franchise.

[MannyIsGod]

I think the residents of New Orleans should look to South Carolina for sympathy.

[j-6]

And for the next asshole who says San Antonio is stealing anything, they may want to realize New Orleans doesn't own the fucking Saints.

Stop being an asshole, Manny. You're better than that.

New Orleans is a smaller market than SA is and has supported an absolute dogshit franchise for damn near forty years. The team is woven into the fabric of their community, much like the Spurs in San Antonio, and the owner of the team hasn't said one fucking word about their return - not next year, not when the city recovers, not when the Superdome is rebuilt, nothing.

Really, the only thing the fans of the Saints are hearing is the mayor of San Antonio's open courting of Tom Benson in the aftermath of a gigantic natural disaster, and team officials getting fired over their objections to Benson's actions.

Saints fans feel betrayed and so far, they have every reason to believe that they were. All of us fans lusting over the prospect of the Saints staying in SA are fair game. Hardberger and the city aren't exactly showing any dignity in their actions (like waiting until the offseason) because they know that this is the best chance the city might ever have and they're grabbing it with both hands. I guess I can't blame them becuase they're looking out for number one and all, but I would have preferred this situation handled in a classier manner.

Maybe this is the true sign of the city really growing up, then. When TPTB stopped caring about public perception and looked for national prominence through any means possible. I'm sure that Buddy Holly thinks this is a great idea, but to me it's one more way that SA is selling out.

Dignity is one of those things that once you lose, you never fully get back. Whoring out for someone else's football team after the enormous hit the city took from Katrina certainly qualifies.

[tgrgrd00]

That would be a sweet stadium...Maybe the Saints need to go back to LSU to play and see if they can make it there financially till the smoke blows over and decides what their future will be,.....Then maybe if they come back to SA, we're not to blame anymore.

I think that is a viable option. The Superdome will be ready before too long. If N.O. proves they cannot support the Saints then whatever city should have the chance to sustain a team.

If there was poor attendence prior to Katrina or Benson was actually talking with a city before all of this then there would not be a problem.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

"SHinerBockGirl, the flood in SA has absolutely no relation to La luring the Spurs nor can it be compared to the devastation in NO."

Your missing my point, i was not comparing the 2, only that the opportunity was there for their Mayor to come to SA and offer a new stadium deal knowing the Quarry deal fell through and it was during the big flood and considered a DISASTER in SA....It was an opportunity for them and they took it....

[samikeyp]

Show me one piece of evidence that the Saints were leaving before Katrina! Until I see this I will not respond to this argument again.

No one said they were leaving. All that has been said is that Benson was been looking to leave before Katrina. You admitted as much in this thread.

Comparing the Alamo to the Superdome is apples to oranges. The Alamo has historical significance, the Superdome does not.

[tgrgrd00]

What was going to happen before Katrina is irrelevent considering Katrina did hit and there is no way to erase that. Show me once piece of proof you should have any say so in the running of a private franchise.


How about paying my tax dollars to the tune of $180 million to the team to keep them in the state.

The state gives large sums of money to the team every year because Benson is a fucking prick. Our money and our contract gives us a say so.

[MannyIsGod]

You know, prior to reading the way New Orleans fans were handling this, I had no bone in the Saints to SA arguement. I didn't care one way or another as long as public tax dollars weren't used.

I'm still against public tax dollars being used, but I'm not going to feel very bad at all if they move. Not a single bit.

[samikeyp]

Does anyone think it is wrong for SA to try and get the team if Benson is offering them? (if indeed that is the case)

[MannyIsGod]

How about paying my tax dollars to the tune of $180 million to the team to keep them in the state.

The state gives large sums of money to the team every year because Benson is a fucking prick. Our money and our contract gives us a say so.
Then it won't be so easy for the Saints to move will it? I don't know what is in the contract (and I'd be more pissed off at my government giving that kind of money away when it could be used in a much smarter way but thats your issue to deal with. Apparently the Saints are that important to you which I see a lunacy) and I don't really care, but if you have a legal right to keep the Saints, I suspect you will.

However, I doubt that is the case.

[tgrgrd00]

No one said they were leaving. All that has been said is that Benson was been looking to leave before Katrina. You admitted as much in this thread..

Every team is looking to leave...given the opportunity of enough money anyone is looking to leave any city!!!! Benson looks to leave every year...so do many other owners in other cities. It is called leverage and milking cities for more money.


Comparing the Alamo to the Superdome is apples to oranges. The Alamo has historical significance, the Superdome does not.

Take your San Antonio glasses off. The Superdome is as historically significant to NOLA as the Alamo is to Texas.

[MannyIsGod]

Does anyone think it is wrong for SA to try and get the team if Benson is offering them? (if indeed that is the case)
No. We're talking about entertainment. If New Orleans feels dicked over because they've been lining Benson's pockets then I suggest they look at their elected officials and ask them how they could have gotten them into such a stupid situation to begin with. Government has no place in paying for an NFL franchise in that manner. Why? Because private business will fuck you the first chance and every chance after that.

New Orleans, if nothing else learn a valuable lesson from this and stop whoring yourself to sports franchises.

[MannyIsGod]

And once again, go cry on the shoulders of the people from the Carolinas. I'm sure they'll be very sympathetic.

[Marcus Bryant]

Sure, it would suck to see a team leave after decades in a city. But I'd imagine it would also suck to see your neighborhood wiped out by 15 feet of water and your family now stuck in beautiful Omaha or whatever.

There's no guarantees in life. If Holt Cat et al opt to sell the Spurs and then the new owners decide to move the team to St. Louis there isn't much the city of SA can do (other than collect a nice check for the Spurs leaving before year 25 of the lease, if I am not mistaken).

[Shiner Bock Girl]

Right after 9/11 everyone wanted to be sure that the start of the NFL season was not postponed. It was a sign of hope. It was part of a process of healing. Football is very important to its community. Especially during trying times. It may just be entertainment...but it also so much more.

I agree very much to a certain point...Their Football stadium was not almost destroyed, if it was, i hardly think NY would have been fixing their stadium as top priority...Economy, support, rebuilding vital human life areas would have come first.....If Saints stadium was untouched, none of us would even be having this discussion because they would still be there.....

[Marcus Bryant]

Every team is looking to leave...given the opportunity of enough money anyone is looking to leave any city!!!! Benson looks to leave every year...so do many other owners in other cities. It is called leverage and milking cities for more money.

Problem is, there is good reason why a NFL owner would have left NO during all of those years.




Take your San Antonio glasses off. The Superdome is as historically significant to NOLA as the Alamo is to Texas.

Whoa.

[ShoogarBear]

The Baltimore-Cleveland comparison is pretty interesting. I'm lurked on and off on a board called Saintsreport.com since the beginning of the season, and there's a big push to contact Browns fans and see what they did after Modell-gate.

Though I do wonder what the Baltimore fans, especially the ones that shifted their alliance to the Redskins after the Colts left, thought of the Browns/Ravens move to town and the national negativity shed upon their city.

There is one big difference between what happened with the Browns/Ravens and San Antonio: Baltimore had already lost THEIR original football team, the Colts, due to a backstabbing owner.

Believe me, no NFL team in history, including Green Bay, was more beloved than the Colts were by the city of Baltimore. They were like the Spurs, Cowboys, Yankees, and US Hockey team all rolled into one. To this day, I think the Baltimore Colts Marching Band still exists.

So when Baltimore got the Browns, there were some mixed feelings. One one hand, a lot of people in Baltimore sympathized with Cleveland. On the other hand, Cleveland got rid of an owner they hated, to keep their name and a promise that a replacement team was on the way, so some of the sting was lost.

What should have happened is that Indianapolis should have given the Colts name back to Baltimore, but oh, well.

[ChumpDumper]

How about paying my tax dollars to the tune of $180 million to the team to keep them in the state.

The state gives large sums of money to the team every year because Benson is a fucking prick. Our money and our contract gives us a say so.This year's subsidies were prorated -- you didn't pay for NY/SA games -- and the contract will probably be cancelled before the end of next month.

So those obligations won't exist anymore.

Do you want them again?

Do you want to pay more?

[j-6]

Does anyone think it is wrong for SA to try and get the team if Benson is offering them? (if indeed that is the case)

When was the last time a team in any major league sport (discarding the Katrina part, obviously) was this publically wooed and the large support base in its original city was just left to watch?

It wasn't this way in Montreal and DC.

It wasn't this way in Charlotte and New Orleans.

It wasn't this way in Cleveland and Baltimore.

It wasn't this way in LA and St Louis.

Maybe Houston and Nashville/Memphis?

I guess it's OK, somewhat, but I really dislike the way that this whole scenario is being handled.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

So are the Saints!!!!!!!


LOL, i have to admit that was a good one. :lmao :lmao

[Ishta]

Give me a fucking break. When someone compares your courting of the Spurs you call it apples and oranges? Only because you were on the other side of the fence.

I'm sick of this shit from NO fans. I sweat my ass off in warehouses to help you people and I worked when tired as hell at shelters to help people out. And because of a private business franchise's actions, fans like you have be shitting on San Antonio all over Saintsreport.com and now here as well.

I'm just flat out sick of it. You need to pull your head out of your ass and get some damn perspective. When your city is a virtual wasteland with no viable stadium and your people have real problems you need to get over the fact that you may lose your franchise. San Antonio's leadership is in place to look after San Antonio's interests, not New Orleans. We didn't elect them so that they could take actions that give YOU the warm fuzzies, we put them in office to do the best they could for San Antonio.

And with that in mind, they HAVE done things that are in the best interests of residents from NOLA. They are footing the bill for housing a good deal of them when there isn't much money to go around. That mayor of ours that is being portrayed as a villian by fans like yourself and the media that cators to them was a fucking saint when the disaster struck.

So, quite frankly, you and the rest of the so called Saints nation can go fuck yourselves. I'm sick of you assholes who act as though we're stealing your wife. I hope we get the team and I hope they broadcast every fucking game in NOLA so you can see us cheering them on.Thank you for putting it so eloquently. I agree with you 100%

[tgrgrd00]

And once again, go cry on the shoulders of the people from the Carolinas. I'm sure they'll be very sympathetic.

Carolina was promised another team and got it.


Hell if the NFL said today that we would be guaranteed another team and we could keep our logo and name. I wouldn't be here.

You can have Benson and his bullshit.

Oh and we are in the position of paying public money for the team because of our FORMER Governor...who was not re-elected. We know it is not the best situation...but we are stuck with it.

[MannyIsGod]

Carolina was promised another team and got it.


Hell if the NFL said today that we would be guaranteed another team and we could keep our logo and name. I wouldn't be here.

You can have Benson and his bullshit.

Oh and we are in the position of paying public money for the team because of our FORMER Governor...who was not re-elected. We know it is not the best situation...but we are stuck with it. Then go cry to the NFL. Learn from your past mistakes. I still fail to see how San Antonio is doing you harm. We're supposed to ignore potential business relocation because:

a) You've had bad luck with Katrina
b) You made stupid decisions, put idiots in office, and are now paying the price. After watching governor Blanco I'd say you have a history of doing this
c)You like them a lot

Do I have it right?

Funny, because I doubt your city cared about anything but itself when it was courting the Spurs and when it took the Hornets.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

I think that is a viable option. The Superdome will be ready before too long. If N.O. proves they cannot support the Saints then whatever city should have the chance to sustain a team.

If there was poor attendence prior to Katrina or Benson was actually talking with a city before all of this then there would not be a problem.

And that is what was agreed with Tags, but the Saints said they did not want to move again because all the hotels were filled in BR and there was no place to once again move their families, much less stay themselves, so they agreed with Benson's decision.....So SA is not to blame for them electing to stay here...Would you all rather us not go to any games and scream we hate them so they will be forced to leave??? What really are you expecting from us when it was their decision to stay....We weren't holding them at gunpoint :makemyday We're also not responsible for Benson or our Mayor's actions.....

[ChumpDumper]

Oh and we are in the position of paying public money for the team because of our FORMER Governor...who was not re-elected. We know it is not the best situation...but we are stuck with it.You won't be after next month, but you'll be in a worse situation when it comes to supporting an NFL franchise without heavy subsidies.

Would you be prepared to pay more than the $20 million a year that was laid out for the last three years of the lease?

What rebuilding efforts should the state nix because the money needs to go into Benson's pocket -- or indeed any NFL owner's pocket?

[tgrgrd00]

This year's subsidies were prorated -- you didn't pay for NY/SA games -- and the contract will probably be cancelled before the end of next month.

So those obligations won't exist anymore.

Do you want them again?

Do you want to pay more?

Probably be cancelled or will it....this is all conjecture. I can't answer this at this time.

[Extra Stout]

Carolina was promised another team and got it.


Hell if the NFL said today that we would be guaranteed another team and we could keep our logo and name. I wouldn't be here.

You can have Benson and his bullshit.

That may be how Tagliabue solves the problem, if he can't stop Benson.

[ChumpDumper]

Probably be cancelled or will it....this is all conjecture. I can't answer this at this time. It almost certainly will be.

You can't bring yourself to assume Benson will void the contract which will allow him to move to San Antonio?

Then why are you here in the first place? If he's not voiding the deal he's not leaving and you have no reason to complain.

[samikeyp]

I guess it's OK, somewhat, but I really dislike the way that this whole scenario is being handled.

I would agree with that. I think more tact should have been employed.

[tgrgrd00]

And that is what was agreed with Tags, but the Saints said they did not want to move again because all the hotels were filled in BR and there was no place to once again move their families, much less stay themselves, so they agreed with Benson's decision.....So SA is not to blame for them electing to stay here...Would you all rather us not go to any games and scream we hate them so they will be forced to leave??? What really are you expecting from us when it was their decision to stay....We weren't holding them at gunpoint :makemyday We're also not responsible for Benson or our Mayor's actions.....

You elected you Mayor so therefore he represents you and all of his constituents. You are responsible for your Mayors actions.

I said in my original post that I appreciate S.A. temporarily hosting the Saints. The push for the permanent home is what I have a problem with.

[MannyIsGod]

You elected you Mayor so therefore he represents you and all of his constituents. You are responsible for your Mayors actions.

I said in my original post that I appreciate S.A. temporarily hosting the Saints. The push for the permanent home is what I have a problem with.
Well continue to have a problem with it. My mayor rightfully doesn't give a shit.

[samikeyp]

You can't tag the whole city as being of one mindset based solely on the actions of one individual. The people of San Antonio have been great hosts and given your team great support, that would have happened regardless, IMO.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

You elected you Mayor so therefore he represents you and all of his constituents. You are responsible for your Mayors actions.

I said in my original post that I appreciate S.A. temporarily hosting the Saints. The push for the permanent home is what I have a problem with.

If that being the case. Then obviously the Mayor of BR hates the Saints and voiced his opinions how he does not want them playing at LSU, so that would mean all of BR hates a team that has been through such a tragedy, since of course the Mayor represents them and they elected him???....So why would the SAINTS want to play in a place that does not want them as opposed to a place that does??? No wonder they want to stay here....

[tgrgrd00]

It almost certainly will be.

You can't bring yourself to assume Benson will void the contract which will allow him to move to San Antonio?

Then why are you here in the first place? If he's not voiding the deal he's not leaving and you have no reason to complain.

I don't know the details regarding voiding of the contract and such. I just hear your mayor saying he wants the Saints permanently. I don't know how that is to happen legally and such.

[ChumpDumper]

I don't know the details regarding voiding of the contract and such. I just hear your mayor saying he wants the Saints permanently. I don't know how that is to happen legally and such.I suggest you investigate the actual costs of keeping the Saints before you shit all over San Antonio.

[blaze89]

From what I've read, paraphrasing here:

Nov. 29 the Saints can terminate the contract with no penalty using an "Act of God" stipulation.

I'm sure someone will post better informed post on the matter.

[Marcus Bryant]

The contract has a force majeure clause which the Saints can use to nullify the contract.

[samikeyp]

I think the Saints can claim "Force Majure" (not sure if I spelled that right) basically "Act of God" to void their lease.

[Marcus Bryant]

It almost certainly will be.

You can't bring yourself to assume Benson will void the contract which will allow him to move to San Antonio?

Then why are you here in the first place? If he's not voiding the deal he's not leaving and you have no reason to complain.

:lol

[tgrgrd00]

If that being the case. Then obviously the Mayor of BR hates the Saints and voiced his opinions how he does not want them playing at LSU, so that would mean all of BR hates a team that has been through such a tragedy, since of course the Mayor represents them and they elected him???....So why would the SAINTS want to play in a place that does not want them as opposed to a place that does??? No wonder they want to stay here....

What? Show me one quote where the mayor of B.R. has said anything of the sort. You are assuming that BR hates the Saints? Where do you get that from? I know plenty of people in BR that love the Saints. Don't assume.

As a matter of fact the mayor of BR has zero say in who plays at LSU and who doesn't. The atheletic director and board of supervisors at LSU decides what happens at Tiger Stadium. LSU owns Tiger Stadium (not BR) and they are trying to work on a deal to play all the Saints games there next season. There are slight problems with concession workers, police/crowd control, ticketing, etc that have hindered the process.

Your comments are way off base and completely incorrect. Stop assuming to make yourself feel better.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

What? Show me one quote where the mayor of B.R. has said anything of the sort. You are assuming that BR hates the Saints? Where do you get that from? I know plenty of people in BR that love the Saints. Don't assume.

As a matter of fact the mayor of BR has zero say in who plays at LSU and who doesn't. The atheletic director and board of supervisors at LSU decides what happens at Tiger Stadium. LSU owns Tiger Stadium (not BR) and they are trying to work on a deal to play all the Saints games there next season. There are slight problems with concession workers, police/crowd control, ticketing, etc that have hindered the process.

Your comments are way off base and completely incorrect. Stop assuming to make yourself feel better.

I'll find the articles i read .....

[clooneyschick04]

I live in Louisiana but I am from San Antonio so I can see both sides of this story. I have to admit--I'm with San Antonio on this one. I don't think the Saints have ever felt more appreciated than they do when they play in the AlamoDome. I've been to Saints games in the SuperDome and the spirit there doesn't even compare to the spirit in the AlamoDome when the Saints play. It's like a totally different team when they play in the AlamoDome.

[tgrgrd00]

The contract has a force majeure clause which the Saints can use to nullify the contract.

It would not surprise me in the least to see Benson do this....he is as cowardly as they come. Instead of helping he would rather shit on the people that have bent over backwards for him and make the situation worse.

[j-6]

What? Show me one quote where the mayor of B.R. has said anything of the sort. You are assuming that BR hates the Saints? Where do you get that from? I know plenty of people in BR that love the Saints. Don't assume.

As a matter of fact the mayor of BR has zero say in who plays at LSU and who doesn't. The atheletic director and board of supervisors at LSU decides what happens at Tiger Stadium. LSU owns Tiger Stadium (not BR) and they are trying to work on a deal to play all the Saints games there next season. There are slight problems with concession workers, police/crowd control, ticketing, etc that have hindered the process.

Your comments are way off base and completely incorrect. Stop assuming to make yourself feel better.

Isn't there a problem with Sunday alcohol sales as well in that particular parish?

[tgrgrd00]

I live in Louisiana but I am from San Antonio so I can see both sides of this story. I have to admit--I'm with San Antonio on this one. I don't think the Saints have ever felt more appreciated than they do when they play in the AlamoDome. I've been to Saints games in the SuperDome and the spirit there doesn't even compare to the spirit in the AlamoDome when the Saints play. It's like a totally different team when they play in the AlamoDome.

I call Bullshit....the Superdome is full of "Spirit" when they play there. I have been to many games and I don't see how S.A. could have soooo much more Spirit.

Like a different team? WTF...they lost didn't they?

[baseline bum]

I don't give a crap about the city of New Orleans whining about SA taking their team. I remember we had a huge flood in 1998 that dropped 7 feet of water in parts of my neighborhood and half of the rest of the city. Of course the Quarry arena vote failed miserably, since it came up less than a month later, and then right after that here comes Marc Morial, then mayor of NO, lusting after the team and pimping his arena in a new soundbite seemingly every day until the referendum for the SBC Center passed. New Orleans should check itself because it pulled the same crap on San Antonio from 1998-2000. Marc Morial came after the Spurs in the same way Hardberger is going after the Saints. Get off your high horses, New Orleans, and recognize you put us through that hell before, so I don't care about your city.

[tgrgrd00]

Isn't there a problem with Sunday alcohol sales as well in that particular parish?

Yes, this is true too. I believe that is why they can't sell alcohol agains Miami.

[clooneyschick04]

[QUOTE=tgrgrd00]I call Bullshit....the Superdome is full of "Spirit" when they play there. I have been to many games and I don't see how S.A. could have soooo much more Spirit. QUOTE]

It's called not taking a team for granted. New Orleans took the Saints for granted and now that they are enjoying playing somewhere else--people from New Orleans are the ones calling "bullshit."

[samikeyp]

It would not surprise me in the least to see Benson do this....he is as cowardly as they come. Instead of helping he would rather shit on the people that have bent over backwards for him and make the situation worse.

Wouldn't a hurricane count as an act of God?

[tgrgrd00]

I don't give a crap about the city of New Orleans whining about SA taking their team. I remember we had a huge flood in 1998 that dropped 7 feet of water in parts of my neighborhood and half of the rest of the city. Of course the Quarry arena vote failed miserably, since it came up less than a month later, and then right after that here comes Marc Morial, then mayor of NO, lusting after the team and pimping his arena in a new soundbite seemingly every day until the referendum for the SBC Center passed. New Orleans should check itself because it pulled the same crap on San Antonio from 1998-2000. Marc Morial came after the Spurs in the same way Hardberger is going after the Saints. Get off your high horses, New Orleans, and recognize you put us through that hell before, so I don't care about your city.

Then you should have passed your vote on the arena. That isn't our fault. The Spurs put themselves on the market unless they got a new arena. The used N.O. as a bargaining chip. N.O. was never going to get the Spurs...we helped you get your stadium. Now you are trying to loot our NFL team.

I guarantee you if there was a vote for a new stadium for the Saints it would pass. This is a totally different situation. Your stadium was usable after the flood...Ours is not. The Spurs did not have to "temporarily" play in any other city.

Do you see the differnces?

[samikeyp]

I call Bullshit....the Superdome is full of "Spirit" when they play there. I have been to many games and I don't see how S.A. could have soooo much more Spirit.

unless you are there...how can you know?

[Marcus Bryant]

I don't give a crap about the city of New Orleans whining about SA taking their team. I remember we had a huge flood in 1998 that dropped 7 feet of water in parts of my neighborhood and half of the rest of the city. Of course the Quarry arena vote failed miserably, since it came up less than a month later, and then right after that here comes Marc Morial, then mayor of NO, lusting after the team and pimping his arena in a new soundbite seemingly every day until the referendum for the SBC Center passed. New Orleans should check itself because it pulled the same crap on San Antonio from 1998-2000. Marc Morial came after the Spurs in the same way Hardberger is going after the Saints. Get off your high horses, New Orleans, and recognize you put us through that hell before, so I don't care about your city.

:makemyday

Exactly. Payback's a....

[tgrgrd00]

[QUOTE=tgrgrd00]I call Bullshit....the Superdome is full of "Spirit" when they play there. I have been to many games and I don't see how S.A. could have soooo much more Spirit. QUOTE]

It's called not taking a team for granted. New Orleans took the Saints for granted and now that they are enjoying playing somewhere else--people from New Orleans are the ones calling "bullshit."

That is the biggest load of crap and you know it. N.O. has never taken the Saints for granted we care too much about them and pay too much money for the to do that.

[clooneyschick04]

unless you are there...how can you know?

My point exactly! Thank you!

[samikeyp]

Then you should have passed your vote on the arena.

oh so then its ok for a N.O. exec to do it but not our Mayor.

[j-6]

Like a different team? WTF...they lost didn't they?

:lol

A lot of us got a taste of what it's like to be a Saints fan on Sunday. DeAngelo Hall returning that fumble for a TD, that blocked FG right before the half that was also returned for six, and of course the end-of-game shenanigans. The worst part was that Atlanta couldn't have had more than 250 yards of total offense the entire game!

Anyway, back on subject. It was pretty loud in the Alamodome, but I don't know about it being louder than Saints crowds at the Superdome. I saw UT play Virginia Tech in the Superdome about ten years ago and it was really noisy - IMO noisier than the crowd on Sunday. But on the other hand I thought it was just as loud if not louder than Texas Stadium during a Cowboys game, and I've been to some of those a lot more recently. A lot of it might have had to do with all the Ron Mexico jerseys in the 'Dome, and there were plenty.

[tgrgrd00]

unless you are there...how can you know?

Ok S.A. loves the Saints more than N.O. who has supported the team for 38 years. They have more "Spirit" for the Saints than N.O. who founded the team and stuck with them through more losing seasons than you can imagine.

Sure. :rolleyes

[Marcus Bryant]

Then you should have passed your vote on the arena. That isn't our fault. The Spurs put themselves on the market unless they got a new arena. The used N.O. as a bargaining chip. N.O. was never going to get the Spurs...we helped you get your stadium. Now you are trying to loot our NFL team.


If SA didn't come up the best deal then the Spurs would have headed to NO.

What part of this is difficult to understand?




I guarantee you if there was a vote for a new stadium for the Saints it would pass. This is a totally different situation. Your stadium was usable after the flood...Ours is not. The Spurs did not have to "temporarily" play in any other city.

Do you see the differnces?


Sure, it's ok for New Orleans to try to loot another city of its sports franchise but not the other way around.

Turn off the modem and go help some of your neighbors.

[baseline bum]

Call it looting... I don't care. It's the exact same thing Morial tried to do to us. Revenge is a motherfucker, and I hope San Antonio extracts it in full.

[samikeyp]

Ok S.A. loves the Saints more than N.O. who has supported the team for 38 years. They have more "Spirit" for the Saints than N.O. who founded the team and stuck with them through more losing seasons than you can imagine

I didn't say they did...nice to see you make things up for your arguments.....I said you don't know unless you are there. Maybe there was more spirit, maybe less, maybe just as much. Unless you have been to both, you cannot accurately tell.

[tgrgrd00]

Call it looting... I don't care. It's the exact same thing Morial tried to do to us. Revenge is a motherfucker, and I hope San Antonio extracts it in full.

It is no where near the same thing...I am not going to explain it again.

Even several posters on your board have agreed in this thread.

You can try and make the whole situation ok by telling yourself it is the same thing but it is not.

[Marcus Bryant]

The point is that a natural disaster put the city in jeopardy of losing its NBA franchise.

[baseline bum]

It's nowhere near the same thing because it's happening to you and not us. I don't care if a few Cowboys fans swing from your nuts in this thread.

[MannyIsGod]

Seriously, I'm really sick of Saints fans right about now. I'm hoping we land the team just to piss them off.

[tgrgrd00]

I didn't say they did...nice to see you make things up for your arguments.....I said you don't know unless you are there. Maybe there was more spirit, maybe less, maybe just as much. Unless you have been to both, you cannot accurately tell.

Sorry I should have replied to clooneyschick04

She mentioned how much more Spirit S.A. had for the Saints. I don't make stuff up for my arguments.

[tgrgrd00]

The point is that a natural disaster put the city in jeopardy of losing its NBA franchise.

And you would have been pissed as hell had you lost the Spurs because of it wouldn't you?

[Marcus Bryant]

Perhaps, but it was your wonderful city that was trying to pull it off.

Payback's a....

[tgrgrd00]

Seriously, I'm really sick of Saints fans right about now. I'm hoping we land the team just to piss them off.

You know...I didn't really like the NBA back then or now for that matter. But I wish we would have got the Spurs back then just to piss you off.

Pot meet kettle.

If we would have got your team you would still be red faced about it. I don't see how you can't put yourself in our shoes. Especially since you have been through with the Spurs what we are going through now with the Saints.

We didn't steal your team...in fact you got a new arena out of it. Be thankfull not grudgefull.

[Marcus Bryant]

Then maybe you'll get a new stadium out of this. So don't come in here and tell us how San Antonio is looting your precious city.

[samikeyp]

Isn't stealing still stealing? Is it ok for someone to try and woo a team away from a another city?

[j-6]

It is no where near the same thing...I am not going to explain it again.

Even several posters on your board have agreed in this thread.

You can try and make the whole situation ok by telling yourself it is the same thing but it is not.

This situation sucks, and I feel bad for you folks losing yet another part of your city to Hurricane Katrina in the Saints. But all of my brethren here calling this payback for the 1998 wooing of the Spurs are out of your minds. Nobody in Louisiana voted for a natural disaster to hit, but San Antonians shot down the Longhorn Quarry project in the voting booth for the most part becuase they just finished paying for the Alamodome not even five years prior.

San Antonio's leadership is taking advantage of a reeling New Orleans in a distasteful fashion with the consent of the teams slimy-ass owner. Those of you that are proud of it, that's your business. I personally think it's a little classless.

[samikeyp]

So then J-6, you feel it was just as wrong for N.O. to try and get the Spurs back then as well.

[MannyIsGod]

J6, we're talking about businesses!! How would it be different to woo a corporation from any other city? This is what happens when people try to lump sports and their owners into different catagories as other for profit ventures but thats simply not the case.

San Antonio has done its share - way more than its share - helping out the people of NOLA. If they and the people of America or anyone else for that matter have trouble understanding that and choose to paint this town as villanous, so be it.

[Marcus Bryant]

Taking the argument a bit further, shouldn't it be decreed that no company shall relocate its operations from NO?

[tgrgrd00]

Then maybe you'll get a new stadium out of this. So don't come in here and tell us how San Antonio is looting your precious city.

Hopefully we will...

I said San Antonio is attempting to loot or trying to steal the Saints. I never said they were.

Oh and don't think the same thing wasn't said about N.O. back then either. I know it was.

[MannyIsGod]

You know...I didn't really like the NBA back then or now for that matter. But I wish we would have got the Spurs back then just to piss you off.

Pot meet kettle.

If we would have got your team you would still be red faced about it. I don't see how you can't put yourself in our shoes. Especially since you have been through with the Spurs what we are going through now with the Saints.

We didn't steal your team...in fact you got a new arena out of it. Be thankfull not grudgefull.
I was never mad at New Orleans.

[tgrgrd00]

J6, we're talking about businesses!! How would it be different to woo a corporation from any other city? This is what happens when people try to lump sports and their owners into different catagories as other for profit ventures but thats simply not the case.

San Antonio has done its share - way more than its share - helping out the people of NOLA. If they and the people of America or anyone else for that matter have trouble understanding that and choose to paint this town as villanous, so be it.

Most people in N.O. would rather you stay out of it completely if you are going to steal our Saints.

We don't need your help if the end result is going to be the New Orleans Saints in San Antonio.

[MannyIsGod]

Taking the argument a bit further, shouldn't it be decreed that no company shall relocate its operations from NO?
Of course, because NOLA supported those businesses they must now take a loss and not attempt any relocation regardless of how much it may benefit said business lest the reciving city be classified as a looter.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

What? Show me one quote where the mayor of B.R. has said anything of the sort. You are assuming that BR hates the Saints? Where do you get that from? I know plenty of people in BR that love the Saints. Don't assume.

As a matter of fact the mayor of BR has zero say in who plays at LSU and who doesn't. The atheletic director and board of supervisors at LSU decides what happens at Tiger Stadium. LSU owns Tiger Stadium (not BR) and they are trying to work on a deal to play all the Saints games there next season. There are slight problems with concession workers, police/crowd control, ticketing, etc that have hindered the process.

Your comments are way off base and completely incorrect. Stop assuming to make yourself feel better.

Heres one of the articles, and i need to find the rest....Theres is also another one where the MAYOR of BR said you'd have to be drunk to watch the Saints when they were talking about not opening the Bars for the Saints game....In this article it was Chancellor Sean O'Keefe who voiced his opinions...Sounds like they are more concerned at getting money out of the Saints..By the way, i don't need to make myself feel better because i have no remorse for any of you anymore:

http://www.lsureveille.com/vnews/di...8/43548264649d3

"O’Keefe unhappy with Saints in Tiger Stadium
LSU to ask Saints for compensation
By Parker Wishik
Sports Contributor

October 18, 2005

It seems the marriage between LSU and the New Orleans Saints is not as harmonious as previously thought.

Chancellor Sean O’Keefe expressed at an Oct. 11 Faculty Staff Senate meeting his displeasure with the Saints’ deal with the University to play four home games at Tiger Stadium.

“We’d rather not have the games here at all,” he said at the meeting. “This is going to be a real problem and we are not excited about this prospect.”

O’Keefe called the situation a “huge logistical nightmare” and worried about the field conditions of Tiger Stadium.

“This will not be a windfall for the University,” he said. “There is not to my knowledge any instance where there was a good experience for a university that had a professional football team play on its campus.”

O’Keefe seemed to alter from his earlier stance on the Saints’ situation. On Sept. 13, he told The Advocate the University was “delighted to have the circumstances, as well as the venue, to do that.”

“What we intend to convey from the University’s perspective is that we were happy to be able to help the state and the Saints find a venue so that we could continue professional football in the state of Louisiana, as opposed to continuing football in the state of Texas,” said Michael Ruffner, Vice Chancellor for communications and media relations.

Greg Aiello, Vice President of Public Relations for the National Football League, said “it was not possible” for all games to be played at LSU.

“But the other side of it was that there was a great desire on everyone’s part to play some games in Louisiana, and LSU was the best alternative,” Aiello said. “It’s not a situation anyone wants to be in.”

The NFL’s decision is not unprecedented.

When Soldier Field in Chicago was renovated in 2002, the Chicago Bears played a full eight-game home schedule at the University of Illinois Urbana-Champaign’s Memorial Stadium.

“I think it worked out for us,” said University of Illinois Chancellor Richard Herman. “We did have some worries in the beginning, but I think it brought more business into town and really didn’t alter life on campus or for the community.”

The NFL’s Arizona Cardinals have also played their home games at Arizona State University’s Sun Devil Stadium since 1988. Sun Devil Stadium also hosted an impromptu NFL game between the San Diego Chargers and Miami Dolphins on Oct. 27, 2003 after California wildfires made conditions unfavorable for a game in San Diego.

“We have climactic situations here such that it’s very wet and humid; the field gets dug up very quickly,” Ruffner said. “That may not be the case up in Illinois. We have in fact discussed and have an agreement that I believe [the Saints] are going to refurbish the field at least twice.”

Herman also said Memorial Stadium was in good condition after the Bears’ games.

Herman said the University of Illinois did receive extra profit, which was used for locker room and scoreboard maintenance.

“It is in fact true that the University will not be profitized on this game,” Ruffner said. “All we’re going to do is ask the Saints and the NFL to compensate the University for expenditures that we incurred in staging the game at Tiger Stadium.”

LSU Associate Athletic Director Herb Vincent said the NFL took the wildfire situation into account when giving four Saints games to Tiger Stadium.

“There are some logistical issues that are very obvious especially with a game like that,” he said. “It’s accurate that it’s not going to be a windfall, but there will be some additional revenues coming our way.”

The Saints open their Baton Rouge schedule on Oct. 30 against the Miami Dolphins and former LSU head football coach Nick Saban."




They do no even want 8 games there and you ppl want the Saints to maybe play a season there till your stadium is built????

[MannyIsGod]

Most people in N.O. would rather you stay out of it completely if you are going to steal our Saints.

We don't need your help if the end result is going to be the New Orleans Saints in San Antonio.
See, now your pride and righteousness is really making you look stupid. You would rather have an NFL team than have emergency shelter care?

You've lost any shred of credibility you ever had.

[j-6]

So then J-6, you feel it was just as wrong for N.O. to try and get the Spurs back then as well.


No, not really. It took three tries for the city (and Bexar County) to get an arena deal for the Spurs and they dallied all the way until November of 1999, when the team was beginning its inaugural defense of the NBA title. Remember when they wanted to build next door to the Alamodome after the Quarry idea got shot down before that as well?

San Antonio couldn't get their shit together due to bureaucracy and wishy-washy public opinion for a new arena. Eventually they did, the team was happy, and we're happy because of it. New Orleans and the Saints' Superdome got hit with a Category Five Act of God and San Antonio is taking their team while the city is face down in the water. There's a bit of a difference, at least in my eyes.

[samikeyp]

So then you would have been ok with the Spurs leaving back then.

[MannyIsGod]

So then j6 you are of the opinion no business should relocate regardless of business considerations due to Katrina?

[tgrgrd00]

See, now your pride and righteousness is really making you look stupid. You would rather have an NFL team than have emergency shelter care?

You've lost any shred of credibility you ever had.

No, I would rather have our NFL team and emergency shelter care.

My comments are trying to express to you how important the Saints are to the community that is affected.

So you are so righteous that you think just because you provide assistance for the storm that you have a right to court our NFL team?

[j-6]

J6, we're talking about businesses!! How would it be different to woo a corporation from any other city? This is what happens when people try to lump sports and their owners into different catagories as other for profit ventures but thats simply not the case.

San Antonio has done its share - way more than its share - helping out the people of NOLA. If they and the people of America or anyone else for that matter have trouble understanding that and choose to paint this town as villanous, so be it.

(You're making me sound like TheWriter, NOLA edition or something :lol )

I do see your point.

Wooing any sort of corporation from present-day New Orleans shouldn't be a difficult task, as we all know how many have moved to Baton Rouge, Houston, or elsewhere, but that doesn't make it right. Entergy is the only New Orleans based Fortune 500-class company I can think of, and they are the utility provider for that entire region. So it's not like they are going anywhere. Still, New Orleans needs every bit of positive economic impact she can get her hands on.

There are only 32 teams in the National Football League, and Louisiana has had one since 1967, only seven years less than Dallas has had the Cowboys. There's some civic pride involved, and I know that doesn't do shit for disaster relief or whatnot. But it is a positive beacon for the community, something for them to look forward to, and they've gone through what must seem like hell on earth.

Taking the Saints away without ever giving Orleanians the chance to do anything about it in the aftermath of Katrina is harsh, but I guess SA feels it is necessary if they ever want a team.

[MannyIsGod]

No, I would rather have our NFL team and emergency shelter care.

My comments are trying to express to you how important the Saints are to the community that is affected.

So you are so righteous that you think just because you provide assistance for the storm that you have a right to court our NFL team?
No, I think we have that right regardless because we live under capitalism. It has nothing to with helping you or not helping you.

[j-6]

So then you would have been ok with the Spurs leaving back then.


So then j6 you are of the opinion no business should relocate regardless of business considerations due to Katrina?

No, and no.

The Spurs and Bexar County took care of their stadium situation well before serious discussions with McDermott/Holt (I forget who was in charge) and the New Orleans city leadership. I would have been severely pissed if they were taken out of town over a failed stadium vote. Now SA is lusting over the Saints without even giving NO a chance to respond, and the worst part is that the owner is in on it, and he's treating the Gulf Coast like an old fuck buddy that put on sixty pounds and had a masectomy.

A sports franchise is different than just some other generic business entity. Like I said earlier, I see your point, but I just think differently. I don't have a Valero Energy or a American Airlines flag hanging off my front porch like I would a Spurs or a Longhorn banner. People identify with your town with your team. When I used to go to New York people had never heard of San Antonio. Now when I bring up my hometown they know exactly what I mean. It's Benson's money and his team. He can do whatever the fuck he wants with it. I just think he could do a lot of good for a lot of miserable people by sacking up and openly discussing matters rather than not commenting on New Orleans and her plight, and holding hands with the mayor of San Antonio.

[tgrgrd00]

No, I think we have that right regardless because we live under capitalism. It has nothing to with helping you or not helping you.

Capitalism at what costs?

Be careful what you wish for, it may just happen to you.

Don't for one minute think that the same thing could not happen to your Spurs.

[samikeyp]

New Orleans officials made it clear they were targeting the Spurs much like Hardberger is now. BOTH are wrong.

[Marcus Bryant]

If NO was a great market for the team prior to Katrina then I would think Benson would be doing what he could to make things work in NO.

I don't believe there is a good way for a franchise to leave a city.

[MannyIsGod]

Capitalism at what costs?

Be careful what you wish for, it may just happen to you.

Don't for one minute think that the same thing could not happen to your Spurs.
At what costs? There you go being overdramatic again.

[tgrgrd00]

If NO was a great market for the team prior to Katrina then I would think Benson would be doing what he could to make things work in NO.

I don't believe there is a good way for a franchise to leave a city.

Benson is a whore in the truest sense of the word. He is a selfish and greedy man who has no appreciation for the people who got him to where he is today.

[tgrgrd00]

At what costs? There you go being overdramatic again.

Overdramatic?

At what cost do you beleive in capitalism? Should a city be destroyed by natural disaster in order for another city to benefit?

Is this the type of capitalism that the country was founded on or is this the type of capitalism you believe in?

I don't think I am being overdramatic in the least. This is an honest question.

[MannyIsGod]

Overdramatic?

At what cost do you beleive in capitalism? Should a city be destroyed by natural disaster in order for another city to benefit?

Is this the type of capitalism that the country was founded on or is this the type of capitalism you believe in?

I don't think I am being overdramatic in the least. This is an honest question. Oh, so now you're saying San Antonio wished Katrina on New Orleans in order to get the Saints? You're out of your mind.

The situation is what it is. If Benson can move his team in order to make a profit, why shouldn't he? Capitalism is run off of greed. It doesn't work because of warm fuzzies.

[TheWriter]

tgrgrd00 is a...

http://easycarts.net/ecarts/TShirtsNTexas/images/Dramaqueen.jpg

[MannyIsGod]

Just so you know, every San Antonio resident who is sane would rather Katrina never struck NOLA. But the situation is what it is. Don't direct your anger at mother nature at us.

[tgrgrd00]

Oh, so now you're saying San Antonio wished Katrina on New Orleans in order to get the Saints? You're out of your mind.

The situation is what it is. If Benson can move his team in order to make a profit, why shouldn't he? Capitalism is run off of greed. It doesn't work because of warm fuzzies.

I never said that B.S. Don't put those kind of words in to my mouth. S.A. is trying to capitalize off of the disaster after the fact. This is a form of capatilism and apparently the type of capatilism you favor.

Benson can move "his" team if he wants and the law and league allow. If that happens they will always be known as the San Antonio Looters to me.

[tgrgrd00]

tgrgrd00 is a...

http://easycarts.net/ecarts/TShirtsNTexas/images/Dramaqueen.jpg

LMAO...thanks. :lol

Drama is all we know around here these days...it is only fitting.

[MannyIsGod]

I never said that B.S. Don't put those kind of words in to my mouth. S.A. is trying to capitalize off of the disaster after the fact. This is a form of capatilism and apparently the type of capatilism you favor.

Benson can move "his" team if he wants and the law and league allow. If that happens they will always be known as the San Antonio Looters to me. Once again, when does capitalism involve the warm fuzzies? When do corporations move or stay out of niceness? Why should Benson lose money just to make you happy?

Show me the situations where this is commonplace.

[samikeyp]

Benson can move "his" team if he wants and the law and league allow. If that happens they will always be known as the San Antonio Looters to me.

so then if Benson chooses to move his team here...its still San Antonio's fault.

[j-6]

I never said that B.S. Don't put those kind of words in to my mouth. S.A. is trying to capitalize off of the disaster after the fact. This is a form of capatilism and apparently the type of capatilism you favor.

Benson can move "his" team if he wants and the law and league allow. If that happens they will always be known as the San Antonio Looters to me.

You can't blame the residents, or the people that went to watch the Saints play the Bills and the Falcons, or even the media types that got the town excited over supporting the NFL for three games. Start with the spineless owner and the tactless SA mayor and work your way down.

[samikeyp]

Start with the spineless owner and the tactless SA mayor and work your way down.

actually it should stop there...those two are the ones pushing this.

[tgrgrd00]

so then if Benson chooses to move his team here...its still San Antonio's fault.

Partially it is, yes. Especially the mayor and other politicians lobbying for this move.

Particularly if you build a stadium (which you will have to) and provide other incentives to lure them away from a devasted city.

[hussker]

As cruel as this will sound i have had enough....Iam really fed up with all you New Orleans ppl once and for all....I felt sorry for all of you at first and donated what i could myself to help....But after all these comments about San Antonio from you, i've had enough..The Pity for YOU stops here....Seems all you wonderful devoted NO fans out there seem to forget San Antonio's major flood of 98 when YOUR Mayor came down here to lure OUR Spurs away with an offer of a brand new dome right off the bat...And your caring devoted fans were all for that idea right??....Now that is sad, your Mayor didn't come to SA then to offer support or aid, he was here specifically for the Spurs....Well thats really calling the kettle black here....So i have lost all sympathy for you and your whinning about wanting your football team back. Then your talking about what ruins your city is in??? Maybe you should rebuild your city first instead of worrying about your dome, there will be no fans to support YOUR Saints if ppl cannot even afford to rebuild their homes......And talk about selfish, you want your team to play also in an area that does not even want them including their own Mayor??? The ticket sales are a big deal because do you think these players want to play in a stadium not even half full???? And play like that for years till your precious dome is rebuilt??? Also i hear your so called homeless ppl there whine about having no jobs or homes while typing this on their computers, so are your computers set outdoors??? And are you getting free internet service that you can stay on all day writing about SA being looters and thieves???? No, all respect and sympathy stops right here....And the ones who still have homes, why don't you offer a small family to come live with you till their home is rebuilt like San Antonions have been doing here taking strangers in their homes....Also, your ppl here are being placed in homes that were meant for single mothers who have been on the list for years and now are pushed aside for the refugees....Yes, San Anotnio is reallllly heartless.....How dare us....So save your whinning for someone who gives a damn....San Antonio has had enough....And we have had enough of your worthless post all over the internet to whomever will feel sorry for you....If the Saints stay here great, if not then i hope where ever they are the players will be happy, because they are the only ones i feel sorry for right now having to worry about winning games on top of all this mess...Yeah real fans you all are, on your message boards i read you were happy the Saints lost in SA.....Oh yeah, some real 25 yr fans there.....After those comments, you don't deserve a team anymore....

MEEE---YOWWWW! (hiss,hiss) :tu

[MannyIsGod]

You can't call Hardberger spineless. He hasn't been slimy at all with this. He's been very upfront, and he's handled it well. He hasn't lied one bit. He's led the charge to help out the evacuees.

Don't call him out for looking out for HIS constituants just because the elected officials of NOLA aren't up to that task. Fuck that.

[MannyIsGod]

Partially it is, yes. Especially the mayor and other politicians lobbying for this move.

Particularly if you build a stadium (which you will have to) and provide other incentives to lure them away from a devasted city.
In otherwords this is what your complaining about:

San Antonio is a bad city because its looking out for ITSELF and not for you. You want everyone to accomadate YOU because of Katrina.

Sorry, not going to happen.

[TheWriter]

You can't call Hardberger spineless. He hasn't been slimy at all with this. He's been very upfront, and he's handled it well. He hasn't lied one bit. He's led the charge to help out the evacuees.

Don't call him out for looking out for HIS constituants just because the elected officials of NOLA aren't up to that task. Fuck that.

http://www.muslimwakeup.com/archives/images/worthy300.jpg

[tgrgrd00]

Once again, when does capitalism involve the warm fuzzies? When do corporations move or stay out of niceness? Why should Benson lose money just to make you happy?

Show me the situations where this is commonplace.

There are hundreds of companies in NOLA right now that could have abandoned ship and went somewhere else. They didn't because they have civic pride and roots in the city. I am proud to say I work for one of them and I will say that part of the reason they stayed was out of niceness.

As a matter of fact these companies are doing all they can to help get the city back on its feet. Instead of helping Benson starts dropping bombs on us and firing our supporters.

If you think that Benson ever lost money in N.O. you are on crack. He could take a pay cut for a season if he had any remorse or respect for the people and city and state that supported him for 38 years.

[TheWriter]

There are hundreds of companies in NOLA right now that could have abandoned ship and went somewhere else. They didn't because they have civic pride and roots in the city. I am proud to say I work for one of them and I will say that part of the reason they stayed was out of niceness.

As a matter of fact these companies are doing all they can to help get the city back on its feet. Instead of helping Benson starts dropping bombs on us and firing our supporters.

If you think that Benson ever lost money in N.O. you are on crack. He could take a pay cut for a season if he had any remorse or respect for the people and city and state that supported him for 38 years.

Did these hundreds of mom and pop companies depend on millions of people or just the thousands that lived or worked downtown?

[MannyIsGod]

The bottom line is that you want Benson to do your bidding regardless of any monetary considerations. You want to run his franchise.

[tgrgrd00]

In otherwords this is what your complaining about:

San Antonio is a bad city because its looking out for ITSELF and not for you. You want everyone to accomadate YOU because of Katrina.

Sorry, not going to happen.

No I want the vultures to temporarily lay off and stop swarming over our heads while we at least get back to our fucking homes. Trying to steal the Saints when we are trying to just clean up the city is heartless.

Our leaders have more to worry about right now than this shit and S.A. and Benson are just making it harder to get things back to normal.

You want to fucking help us....lay off till at least the end of the season then try and steal our most famous insitution you spinelss mother fuckers...


Hows that?

[samikeyp]

Partially it is, yes. Especially the mayor and other politicians lobbying for this move.

Particularly if you build a stadium (which you will have to) and provide other incentives to lure them away from a devasted city.

Fair points but if the offer from Benson came first....you cannot blame the city for trying. No one knows for sure. But you can't blame SA if Benson said, "I want to move here".

[TheWriter]

No I want the vultures to temporarily lay off and stop swarming over our heads while we at least get back to our fucking homes.


Then get back to your fucking house and take care of the important shit first. An NFL team is at the bottom of your "to do" list right now.

Fucking dumbasses man.

[Marcus Bryant]

Guys, I have a proposal that should please everyone...



San Antonio receives:

Saints


New Orleans receives:

Buddy Holly/TheWriter


San Antonio has a functioning stadium and is a more attractive location for a NFL franchise than South Louisiana. Buddy Holly has a mammoth hardon for city planning and has years of experience as a dogged promoter of municipal development on the internets. He could jump start the redevelopment of New Orleans as it emerges from the Katrina catastrophe with the power of his modem.

[j-6]

You can't call Hardberger spineless. He hasn't been slimy at all with this.

Who called him spineless? I certainly didn't.

[MannyIsGod]

:lol

I'm done trying to rationalize with someone so emtional. I truly feel for your situation but San Antonio has done no wrong. Continue to feel we have. If you truly feel we have, maybe you'll pick up the bill for the shelters we've run here.

Peace.

[j-6]

Guys, I have a proposal that should please everyone...



San Antonio has a functioning stadium and is a more attractive location for a NFL franchise than South Louisiana. Buddy Holly has a mammoth hardon for city planning and has years of experience as a dogged promoter of municipal development on the internets. He could jump start the redevelopment of New Orleans as it emerges from the Katrina catastrophe with the power of his modem.

:lmao

I'm pissed I didn't think of that.

[MannyIsGod]

Guys, I have a proposal that should please everyone...



San Antonio has a functioning stadium and is a more attractive location for a NFL franchise than South Louisiana. Buddy Holly has a mammoth hardon for city planning and has years of experience as a dogged promoter of municipal development on the internets. He could jump start the redevelopment of New Orleans as it emerges from the Katrina catastrophe with the power of his modem.
:lmao !!!!!

[tgrgrd00]

Then get back to your fucking house and take care of the important shit first. An NFL team is at the bottom of your "to do" list right now.

Fucking dumbasses man.

That is what we are trying to do....but we got S.A. trying to take our Saints...when we get back to normal the Saints will be in S.A.

Oh but OUR NFL team is at the top of your "to do" list apparently. It's ok if everything is normal...but since we had a disaster we should just shut up and let you steal our team. F dat.

[Marcus Bryant]

No I want the vultures to temporarily lay off and stop swarming over our heads while we at least get back to our fucking homes. Trying to steal the Saints when we are trying to just clean up the city is heartless.

Our leaders have more to worry about right now than this shit and S.A. and Benson are just making it harder to get things back to normal.

You want to fucking help us....lay off till at least the end of the season then try and steal our most famous insitution you spinelss mother fuckers...


Hows that?



Then get back to your fucking house and take care of the important shit first. An NFL team is at the bottom of your "to do" list right now.

Fucking dumbasses man.


Great. We have the battle between he who thinks San Antonio can do no wrong and he who thinks San Antonio can do no right.

[samikeyp]

That is what we are trying to do....but we got S.A. trying to take our Saints...when we get back to normal the Saints will be in S.A.

No you have the Mayor of S.A. doing that.

[TheWriter]

Guys, I have a proposal that should please everyone...



San Antonio has a functioning stadium and is a more attractive location for a NFL franchise than South Louisiana. Buddy Holly has a mammoth hardon for city planning and has years of experience as a dogged promoter of municipal development on the internets. He could jump start the redevelopment of New Orleans as it emerges from the Katrina catastrophe with the power of his modem.

Haha, the stalker is back.

Dude, I'm in your psyche so bad it's scary.

You seem to be very infatuated with me.

I think Kori needs to ban you just for that alone.

[Kori Ellis]

No you have the Mayor of S.A. doing that.

The Mayor is the rep of S.A. So the Mayor doing it = S.A. doing it.

By the way, The Writer and tgrgrd, you are obviously both very passionate on this subject but I can do without the "fucking dumbasses" and "mother fucker" comments. I allow cussing on this forum because sometimes it's necessary to say something like "Damn, Ray Allen is such a pussy" but that doesn't mean it's a personal attack free-for-all.

[j-6]

You want to fucking help us....lay off till at least the end of the season then try and steal our most famous insitution you spinelss mother fuckers...

San Antonio's stealing all the bare-tittied college girls? Damn, I left on Monday too.

[Marcus Bryant]

Haha, the stalker is back.

Dude, I'm in your mind so bad it's scary.

You seem to be very infatuated with me.

I think Kori needs to ban you just for that alone.


Keep telling yourself that. You know, a little self-deprecating humor isn't a bad thing.

[TheWriter]

Keep telling yourself that. You know, a little self-deprecating humor isn't a bad thing.

I can't shit without you handing me some toilet paper.

[Lonestar]

Wow, this is a hot thread but I've got to agree with Kori. I may not agree with everything but tgrgrd00 submitted a pretty solid post. Good job also from mcdunk on the reply.

[Marcus Bryant]

I can't shit without you handing me some toilet paper.

Actually, you can't post without trying to sound hard. No one's perception of you is changed here in here with such empty statements.

[samikeyp]

The Mayor is the rep of S.A. So the Mayor doing it = S.A. doing it.

Fair enough.

[samikeyp]

I allow cussing on this forum because sometimes it's necessary to say something like "Damn, Ray Allen is such a pussy"

:lmao always a good thing!

[TheWriter]

Actually, you can't post without trying to sound hard. No one's perception of you is changed here in here with such empty statements.

Damn, I cough and you're there with the nyquil.

[Lonestar]

I'm living in the wilds of Washington State so I don't get to hear much about the courtship of the Saints but I always wondered why San Antonio couldn't lease the Saints like they leased the Dallas Chapparals all those years ago. Of course the deal for an NFL franchise would be much more complex but the idea would be similar. It could be a 3 year lease with the option to sell left up to Benson/NFL and San Antonio. Perhaps the city of New Orleans would have to agree to have the stadium repaired/rebuilt and certain percentage of season tickets sold prior to the end of the lease. I know it would be much more complicated than what I've posted to this point but it is just a thought.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

I can't shit without you handing me some toilet paper.

Would you 2 like to be alone?? :makeout :makeout :makeout :makeout :makeout

[j-6]

tgrgrd00, thank you for dropping by and putting up some solid points in your impassioned argument for the Saints.

BuddyHolly, thank you for butting in and causing the demise of yet another good thread like you only can.

[TheWriter]

tgrgrd00, thank you for dropping by and putting up some solid points in your impassioned argument for the Saints.

BuddyHolly, thank you for butting in and causing the demise of yet another good thread like you only can.

I have to file a second restraining order. :pctoss

[John T]

First, tgrgrd00, while many people you talk here don't agree with your opinion on this subject know that EVERYONE feels for what you and your city/state are going through. While we can't possibly truly understand it you do have our sympathy, and obviously our help and support.

I want to do more research before I form any baseless opinions (NOT saying that anyone here is doing that, you'll find this can be a pretty well informed bunch), but I have a few questions for anyone that can answer them.

I've heard things about the " 'aints'" and fans wearing bags over their heads and haven't been able to find tons of information on this. How prevelant is it? And the booing that is being talked about, do people really boo their own team?

How do NFL owners make their money? I know that certain percentages of profits from different divisions (merchandising, ticket sales, marketing revenue) go to each team. Anybody have the breakdown? I'm under the impression that this is a business decision on Benson's part. How much money is he looking at losing over the next several years before LA can get back on their feet?

And after reading everyone's opinions, I still don't understand the argument that this is different than when LA went after the Spurs. Just because they weren't successful, doesn't mean they didn't try. What everybody is mad at SA for right now is that they are trying.

Carie

[Marcus Bryant]

Read the following today at the office. Thought it gave a good idea of where New Orleans stands currently, at least in the residential and commercial markets. Not much on the cost and timetable for infrastructure repair and replacement. In any event, it looks like the money will be there, but it will take a while and the city will shrink somewhat. One estimate was from a 1.5 mil population to 1.1 mil. Also of note are the number of companies that have left the city altogether. One can understand why Benson would be balking at returning to a market that he was seriously considering leaving before Katrina hit.



http://nreionline.com/mag/real_estate_rebuilding_katrina/

Rebuilding After Katrina

By Margaret Leonard

National Real Estate Investor
Oct 1, 2005 12:00 PM

Hurricane Katrina left in its wake thousands of displaced residents and a staggering loss of life and property — the full extent of which is still not known. Like most industries affected by the powerful Category 4 storm, commercial real estate professionals along the Gulf Coast emerged from their shelters to face the daunting task of restoring order to a ravaged landscape. Within hours of the storm's passing, brokers were already scrambling to provide replacement space for their client companies and housing for employees.

On Sunday, Aug. 28, almost everybody with a car in New Orleans — nearly a half-million people — left. Almost everybody without a car — maybe 50,000 people — waited for a ride out of town, some at the Superdome (24,000) or the convention center (15,000) and some in, on or near their sinking homes.

On Monday, the storm struck. Initial effects were deceptively typical of the storms that ravage the coast each year. Trees came down, roofs blew away, the lights went out. A few of the large hotels had generators, fresh water and ballrooms where emergency workers, tourists and hotel employees took refuge.

But on Tuesday, the flooding intensified. The bars, even on Bourbon Street, fell silent and dark. Floating trash and broken fragments of buildings swept the narrow streets. The greatest damage was only beginning as waters laden with fuel, debris and the dead inundated homes and commercial properties alike. Three weeks later, the Crescent City resembled a war zone.


Assessing the damage

Lewis Stirling, executive vice president and partner of Stirling Properties based in Covington, La., has been in and out of the city several times since the storm. He witnessed firsthand the looting, the institution of martial law and the spectacle of thousands of National Guardsmen entering the city. “The nights I've stayed there, it's strange,” explains Stirling. “It's pitch black, with no sounds other than crickets. It's real spooky and real scary. Everybody's got pistols on their hips and machine guns. When the sun comes up, the military is marching down the street.”

With 16 offices throughout Louisiana and Mississippi, Stirling Properties tasted a broad sampling of Katrina's wrath. The storm's tidal surge swept away Stirling's Gulf Port office completely. Surprisingly, the company's offices in downtown New Orleans and in nearby Metairie and Mandeville escaped with only minor wind damage.

Of its commercial properties in New Orleans, Stirling counts only one complete loss — a 50,000 sq. ft. retail service center that was destroyed by 6 feet of floodwater. And though the firm's three Metro New Orleans offices had lights and running water shortly after the storm, there was no housing for employees.

Initial damage estimates are staggering. New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin said at least half the city's 160,000 homes will have to be torn down. In addition, about 70,000 primarily small businesses in southern Louisiana were destroyed or severely damaged, according to Michael Olivier, Louisiana's secretary for economic development.

The French Quarter, Garden District and Uptown mansions, known to draw tourists to the 300-year-old city appear to have suffered minimal damage. In spite of that small victory, the storm did take away a number of essentials: port docks, which form the largest port complex in the United States; the oil and gas industry around the Gulf of Mexico, which supplies more than one-third of U.S. domestic oil production; and the tourists, who support the French Quarter, the hotels, and an estimated 25,000 jobs in the arts, entertainment, recreation, hotel and food industries.

In a worst-case scenario, New Orleans' 38,000 hotel rooms and the Mississippi's 18,000 rooms would be taken offline in 2006, cutting projected growth in the U.S. hotel supply by 1.9% to increase the nation's total hotel units by only 0.6% for the year, according to projections by Lodging Econometrics. In mid-September, the group reported that 70% of the rooms in New Orleans and 65% of the rooms in Mississippi remained closed.

When Katrina struck, New Orleans had 15 hotel projects in the development pipeline. Those that had just begun or that were in the early planning stages at the end of August could be cancelled or indefinitely postponed, according to Lodging Econometrics. Despite this depressing news, the overall U.S. lodging market is expected to benefit slightly over the next few months as a result of emergency-related travel. Accordingly, Hendersonville, Tenn.-based Smith Travel Research has revised its projections for the industry to an 8.2% increase in revenue per available room for 2005, up from a previously projected 7.6% increase for the year.

While it appears that the flood-prone, working-class sections of the city's eastern districts sustained the most storm-related damage, many of the hotels, office buildings and other commercial real estate outside of the flood zone suffered great losses from looting, Stirling says.

Of the more than 21 million sq. ft. of office space in the New Orleans metropolitan area, just 2% were inside the flood zone, according to Reis Inc., a New York-based research firm. In the retail sector, 20% of the total 22 million sq. ft. lay in the major flooding area. As of late September, the National Association of Office and Industrial Properties (NAIOP) was still gathering information on the extent of industrial property damage.


Refuge in neighboring markets

While cleanup and damage tallies continue, and all levels of government debate the future of New Orleans' levee system, cities within close proximity are soaking up displaced businesses and residents.

In Baton Rouge, 80 miles northwest of New Orleans, the population doubled within a few days of Katrina's arrival in Louisiana. In one week alone, housing prices rose 20% to 30%, reports the Greater Baton Rouge Association of Realtors. “Commercial business has seen an unbelievable boom,” Stirling said of Baton Rouge and other surrounding markets that include Covington, Lafayette and Hammond, where he said the warehouse and office space has been completely absorbed. “People are moving in and occupying anything available.”

Some landlords saw their overall occupancy improve in Louisiana after Katrina. Chicago-based HSA Commercial Real Estate leased its only Baton Rouge property within days of the storm. The 253,000 sq. ft. industrial building had been unoccupied for the previous 18 months.

HSA leased another building to the U.S. Postal Service to process New Orleans mail. The company could have landed a more lucrative deal, but CEO Bob Smietana said going with the postal service was “the right thing to do.”

Energy companies had already beaten a well-worn path from New Orleans to Houston in the two years before Katrina. “Most of the major oil companies are de-emphasizing non-essential employment in favor of Houston anyway,” says Bruce Rutherford, director of real estate company Jones Lang LaSalle's emergency response team.

Hence, as evacuees poured into Houston's Astrodome, real estate property managers began working around the clock to secure temporary space for displaced New Orleans firms.

“The leases are anywhere from month-to-month or six months to a year,” says Jim Arket, senior vice president for Grubb & Ellis' Houston office. Many firms have been placed in shadow spaces of existing buildings and complexes where they already had offices, he says. While absorption increased in a relatively short time, no figures are yet available.

There has been a need not only for space, but for space that is immediately functional and wired for computers and phones. “We were doing documents late in the evening the night before and they were moving furniture and equipment in next day,” says Arket. “And in some cases, (moving in) while we negotiated.”

Lee Arnold, CEO of Colliers Arnold in Tampa, Fla., established a Web site — www.KatrinaSolutions.com — on Aug. 29 as a clearing house both for his company and for competitors to post notices of available space. Businesses can also use the site to post space requirements. With phone systems down, the Web site quickly took on a life of its own. “We encouraged everyone, including the competition, to post space,” Arnold says.


Changes forecast

A rebuilt New Orleans will be a smaller city, many analysts agree, and what's left — or what is added — will cost more than it did before Katrina.

“If we lose a large minority community in New Orleans, if it becomes more upscale, more gentrified, then there's a real danger that it will not be the New Orleans it was,” says Walter Peacock, director of the Hazard Reduction & Recovery Center at Texas A&M University. “There could be that attempt to make it almost like a Disney World place, where its [character] is recaptured artificially.”

Not everyone has such a bleak outlook, however. The people who will not have to sell cheap, Rutherford believes, are the owners of Class-A buildings who were relatively unscathed by the storm. “It will be a flight to quality,” he says.

Stirling agrees. “We think New Orleans will be a smaller, better place when it's done,” he says. “The metro area is 1.5 million — maybe it'll be 1.1 million.”

And while the short term may reveal a weak employment forecast, aid dollars are flooding in to assist with community and economic recovery. Less than two weeks after the storm, Congress appropriated $60 billion for recovery and the final total of federal, Katrina-related spending is expected to go as high as $200 billion.

Investors and operators of more than 10,000 businesses in New Orleans have lost uncounted millions, however, insured losses, experts said in mid-September, would be about $25 billion with uninsured losses several times that number. The same storm also brought opportunities worth billions in redevelopment and restoration of a city. FEMA and other U.S. agencies have already signed temporary and short-term housing contracts that include separate $100 million deals with Bechtel National Inc. and Fluor Corp. to supply temporary housing for displaced residents. Kellogg Brown and Root secured a $29.8 billion contract to rebuild Navy bases in Louisiana and Mississippi.


Good deeds

Katrina also presented an opportunity for those in the real estate community to help their fellow man. In fact, not all commercial space has been taken up by businesses. An old Kmart in Baton Rouge, for example, located on Airline Highway blocks away from the Earl K. Long Medical Center, was turned into a triage center. Colliers Arnold of Clearwater, Fla., and Louisiana developer Herbert Brown donated the 77,000 sq. ft. store to the Louisiana State University Medical School to conduct triage for New Orleans evacuees a week after the storm.

LSU officials had approached Brown with $675,000 to spend on the approximately $3 million property, and Brown had agreed to the sale. Circumstances pushed the deal forward. “I am from Louisiana,” Brown says. “I love Louisiana and I love LSU and I was interested in trying to help.”

For the first few weeks following Katrina, rooms in the former retail space were petitioned off and babies were delivered, hot food was served and cots were set up for the weary. Now the building is being used as storage for clothing, medical supplies and food.

Margaret Leonard is a Tallassee, Fla.-based writer.

[tgrgrd00]

By the way, The Writer and tgrgrd, you are obviously both very passionate on this subject but I can do without the "fucking dumbasses" and "mother fucker" comments. I allow cussing on this forum because sometimes it's necessary to say something like "Damn, Ray Allen is such a pussy" but that doesn't mean it's a personal attack free-for-all.

Sorry about that Kori...I am new here and should not have encroached on the rules.

I am passionate about this subject and I got excited there for moment...after being called a few choice words.

I appologize.

[tgrgrd00]

San Antonio's stealing all the bare-tittied college girls? Damn, I left on Monday too.

No if they were stealing those I would be threatening to nuke the Alamo!!!! :lol

[Clandestino]

mb and nsync fan are too fucking funny in this thread!!! great show guys!

[TheWriter]

mb and nsync fan are too fucking funny in this thread!!! great show guys!

:rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes

[Mr Dio]

Bullshit...the Saints weren't going anywhere. I don't know where you get your information.

There was no contract breach and no intentions of moving stated by either side. Show me anywhere that says the Saints were going anywhere at the end of this season or any other season. Benson has an $80 million buyout to move the team at the end of this year and it has not been exercised.

Every year Benson threatens to move the Saints in order to get more money. So in theory you could say every year the Saints were leaving but it never happened.

Oh and I don't know who mouse is but I am legit.


Benson? Who is Benson?
Oh yeah, the OWNER of the Saints. NO doesn't own them.

[ChumpDumper]

Benson is a whore in the truest sense of the word. He is a selfish and greedy man who has no appreciation for the people who got him to where he is today.Um, the people who got him where he is today are San Antonians.

Do you even know how he got his money?

[MannyIsGod]

:lol So classic.

I guess Minnesota also was the place McCombs owes the most thanks. :lol

[tgrgrd00]

Um, the people who got him where he is today are San Antonians.

Do you even know how he got his money?

He is a (used) car salesman...You think the only place he has car lots is San Antonio?

[Shelly]

Guys, I have a proposal that should please everyone...



San Antonio has a functioning stadium and is a more attractive location for a NFL franchise than South Louisiana. Buddy Holly has a mammoth hardon for city planning and has years of experience as a dogged promoter of municipal development on the internets. He could jump start the redevelopment of New Orleans as it emerges from the Katrina catastrophe with the power of his modem.


Damn, I'm not even a Saints fan and couldn't care less if they end up here, but I'd have to back that proposal! :lmao

[tgrgrd00]

First, tgrgrd00, while many people you talk here don't agree with your opinion on this subject know that EVERYONE feels for what you and your city/state are going through. While we can't possibly truly understand it you do have our sympathy, and obviously our help and support.


Thank you very much....your help and support are very much appreciated by everone...the people all around the U.S. have made everyone around here proud to be an American. I can tell you there is an American flag hanging just about everywhere in this area right now.


I want to do more research before I form any baseless opinions (NOT saying that anyone here is doing that, you'll find this can be a pretty well informed bunch), but I have a few questions for anyone that can answer them.


I've heard things about the " 'aints'" and fans wearing bags over their heads and haven't been able to find tons of information on this. How prevelant is it? And the booing that is being talked about, do people really boo their own team?

I can explain a little about the Saints and the history behind your questions. First you must know that the Saints overal recored is something like Wins-235 Losses-344 with 5 ties. So you can see the Saints since 1967 have lost over a hundred more games than they have won. This record equates to a lot of losing seasons over 38 years. In 1980 the Saints only won 1 game, their record was 1-15 on the season. About this time some of the fans understandably started to become frustrated. In pretty much a jokingly manner some fans started cutting eyeholes out of paper grocery bags and painting Fleur-De-Lis symbols on them and wearing them to games. The legend being that they loved the Saints so much they could not miss the game (by chance they win) but on the other hand they didn't want to risk embarassment by being seen by any friends at a Saints game. It was mostly just a running joke that is now part of the old lore of the Saints and the city.

Nobody wears bags on their heads anymore (haven't in probably 20 years)...we fill the stadium every week and support the team to our fullest every year...good and bad.

Basically the aints part is easy. With so many losing seasons whenever they lose some refer to them as the (S)aints.

I think the saints have been to the playoffs 5 times and they have won one playoff game ever in 38 years.

Despite the propensity for losing througout the years the people of the area have never given up on this team. Every year we rank in the top half of the league in attendence despite being considered a small market team. If the team wins 2 games in a row you can't find a ticket anywhere. Every year the marketing dept. of the Saints has a new slogan such as "I believe", "I still believe", and this year "Faith". Every year the Saints fans post these slogans all over their cars and lawns and we continue to hope this will be the year we make a Superbowl (or heck at least make it past the 2nd round of the playoffs).



And after reading everyone's opinions, I still don't understand the argument that this is different than when LA went after the Spurs. Just because they weren't successful, doesn't mean they didn't try. What everybody is mad at SA for right now is that they are trying.

Carie

This is from an earlier post by j-6 but I think it kind of sums up the situation.

San Antonio couldn't get their shit together due to bureaucracy and wishy-washy public opinion for a new arena. Eventually they did, the team was happy, and we're happy because of it. New Orleans and the Saints' Superdome got hit with a Category Five Act of God and San Antonio is taking their team while the city is face down in the water. There's a bit of a difference, at least in my eyes.

[rr2418]

I live in Louisiana but I am from San Antonio so I can see both sides of this story. I have to admit--I'm with San Antonio on this one. I don't think the Saints have ever felt more appreciated than they do when they play in the AlamoDome. I've been to Saints games in the SuperDome and the spirit there doesn't even compare to the spirit in the AlamoDome when the Saints play. It's like a totally different team when they play in the AlamoDome.

Maybe it's b/c the SA fans are "auditioning" for the NFL and Tom Benson. I mean, SA has to show that they will support and cheer an NFL team.

[goliath]

The situation in 98 with the Spurs and now with the Saints were different.

In 98 we still had a working city. We still had a place for the team to play. We still had a corporation base. We still had an established fan base. We still knew what our city was going to look like for the foreseeable future.

New Orleans has none of this.

Katrina actually makes this alot easier for me to take all of this.

Tony Kornheiser on PTI summed it up best. New Orleans isnt even a city right now. How can you expect the Saints to stay.

This baclash against SA is pathetic. Its a good thing our mayor and city werent the scum we are now being potrayed as in the days after Katrina when we took in thousands of refugees, many of whom we still support.

[tgrgrd00]

Tony Kornheiser on PTI summed it up best. New Orleans isnt even a city right now. How can you expect the Saints to stay.

New Orleans is a city...is Kornheiser here? Does he know what is going on? The city will be able to support the team as early as next season. I don't expect them to stay this season or even next. But I would expect them to stay long term.



This baclash against SA is pathetic. Its a good thing our mayor and city werent the scum we are now being potrayed as in the days after Katrina when we took in thousands of refugees, many of whom we still support.

What do you expect? I think the backlash is justified....Try and look at the situation from the outside and see how it looks to the casual observer. S.A. is vying for a team who's city was just destroyed by a hurricane.

Oh yea it is a good thing they waited 7 weeks to turn in to scum...that makes it better. They did the right thing 7 weeks ago but they are doing the wrong thing now.

[MannyIsGod]

Exactly.

[MannyIsGod]

The fact that you don't seem to realize that helping people in a time of need is WAY more important than an NFL franchise is what upsets me the most. You're the example of what is horrible with sports fans today. Congrats.

[spurschick]

I allow cussing on this forum because sometimes it's necessary to say something like "Damn, Ray Allen is such a pussy"

NOW THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!!! :lol

[tgrgrd00]

The fact that you don't seem to realize that helping people in a time of need is WAY more important than an NFL franchise is what upsets me the most. You're the example of what is horrible with sports fans today. Congrats.

Are you talking to me?

If you are I will have you know that I have helped more people in this area the last 7 weeks than you can count buddy. Don't come on here with a holier than thou attitude like you have done something.

I spent the last few hours helping out and old lady at her roofless condo. So you can KMA.

What upsets me the most is that the people of S.A. keep bragging about how much they helped after Katrina....yet they don't realize how much they are hurting by the comments and gesturing they are making with the Saints. This is an example of what is horrible with sports fans today, not a fan on a message board trying to save his home team. They are so greedy they can't see through their own eyes how their actions are preventing a struggling city get back to normalcy. Now that our politicians etc have to deal with the courting from your city they have less time to take care of the really important issues.

[ChumpDumper]

We're doing NOLA a favor. Use the $185 million on something worthwhile.

[goliath]

If Tags does block the move and the Superdome is rebuilt or repaired over the next year its going to be funny reading all the articles bashing the local gov't about rebuilding the dome for an football team instead of concentrating on the homes, businesses or infrastructure.

[Shiner Bock Girl]

[QUOTE=goliath]If Tags does block the move and the Superdome is rebuilt or repaired over the next year its going to be funny reading all the articles bashing the local gov't about rebuilding the dome for an football team instead of concentrating on the homes, businesses or infrastructure.[/QUO

Nothing funny about it...I wish the best for the Saints because they are a great bunch of guys who deserve this to be over so they can concentrate on winning football games, not politics....May the best man win, whether SA, LA or CA.....
:elephant :elephant

[exstatic]

Don't bash on us. Tagliabue is furiously working behind the scenes to move the team to LA. We're just throwing our hats into the ring.

It's a tough go, but ultimately, it's a business. I've heard estimates of post-Katrina New Orleans having a population of 250,000. The team was originally awarded in 1967 to New Orleans. The previous census (1960) had placed them at 640,000 population. The 2000 census had them at 490,000. That's obviously not growth. The Saints were having a tough go of fielding a competitive team with their existing revenue streams, which is why they negotiated the state subsidy. I don't believe they could survive without it, and that money could be put to MUCH better uses by the state in terms of rebuilding. Louisiana and New Orleans worrying about what the Saints are doing strikes me somewhat like a cancer patient worrying about a zit: there should be higher priorities.

[goliath]

The Saints were a boarderline NFL-caliber town before Katrina.

The reality is it will be years, if ever, before they become one again.

[Guru of Nothing]

A picture is worth a thousand posts.

http://www.los-angeles-attractions.net/images_files/tour/orignal/hollywood.jpg

[Murphy]

tgrgrd00 you are a complete idiot, do you really think the City of New Orleans any time soon can financially supporrt NFL football ENTERTAINMENT? The City and its economy are a complete 180 degrees from what it was pre-Katrina. People are BARELY creeping back to their home which most of them are going to be bull dozed, do you really think the shitty assed already old and now old and heavily damaged Superdome by Katrina can get fully packed with fans every home game? Let alone, afford 10 dollar beers, 5 dollar Sodas, 6 dollar hot dogs, and 20 dollar parking??? given that people can barely afford to buy a loaf of bread and a gallon of gas? Wake up boy, your Saints are marching out west to SA. Bye the way...(they're already here)

[Sense]

If the Saints are going anywhere, you better be fucking happy they are coming to SA rather than LA.

[tgrgrd00]

[QUOTE=goliath]If Tags does block the move and the Superdome is rebuilt or repaired over the next year its going to be funny reading all the articles bashing the local gov't about rebuilding the dome for an football team instead of concentrating on the homes, businesses or infrastructure.[/QUOTE

The Superdome is part of the infrastructure of the city. The dome will not be rebuilt just for the Saints or football. There are hundreds of other functions that are held at the dome every year. They have boat shows, home and garden shows, truck and tractor pulls, Sugar Bowls etc. Nobody is going to complain that the Superdome is being rebuilt. They let out the contracts yesterday. Everything else is being worked on why should they not work on the superdome. The city or superdome commission is not responsible for people homes. The people are responsible for their homes if they are going to bitch they need to get over it.