Unemployment

[sickdsm]

17 year lows.

Texas was lowest since 1976. I thought I read that's when they started tracking? Besides disability, health reasons, daycare, is there ANY reason for an able bodied person to be collecting unemployment?

[monosylab1k]

The country is still basking in the afterglow of Obama :toast

[Spurminator]

Besides disability, health reasons, daycare, is there ANY reason for an able bodied person to be collecting unemployment?

Social stability. Unemployment is set up as a temporary means to ensure that people don't have to immediately uproot their lives after losing a job. You can't collect unemployment in perpetuity (although I'm sure there are loopholes).

[Spurtacular]

The country is still basking in the afterglow of Obama :toast

Tell us what Obama policies made this happen, slob.

[sickdsm]

The country is still basking in the afterglow of Obama :toast

Not sure why you ignored the topic and made it about Obama/Trump/Bush.......

[sickdsm]

Social stability. Unemployment is set up as a temporary means to ensure that people don't have to immediately uproot their lives after losing a job. You can't collect unemployment in perpetuity (although I'm sure there are loopholes).

Why would you have to immediately move m

[boutons_deux]

Capital hates Labor, so the Capitalist Tool the Fed will fire many 100Ks or more this year by raising rates

Wages havent really increased, real household incomes still stagnant for 40 years, new jobs are mostly low-paid, low-benefit, quickly disposable, and Ms are precarious, increasingly numerous "gig" jobs.

Non-wealthy incomes still arent back to late 90s level or even to pre-Banksters Great Depression levels

90%+ of increased national wealth goes to top 5%

The all-powerful, unstoppable oligarchy is laffing its ass off as You People fool yourselves that Happy Times Are Here Again.

Sociopathic, oligarchy whore Repugs have kicked 4M+ out of health insurance

[Chris]

Trump

[sickdsm]

Capital hates Labor, so the Capitalist Tool the Fed will fire many 100Ks or more this year by raising rates

Wages havent really increased, real household incomes still stagnant for 40 years, new jobs are mostly low-paid, low-benefit, quickly disposable, and Ms are precarious, increasingly numerous "gig" jobs.

Non-wealthy incomes still arent back to late 90s level or even to pre-Banksters Great Depression levels

90%+ of increased national wealth goes to top 5%

The all-powerful, unstoppable oligarchy is laffing its ass off as You People fool yourselves that Happy Times Are Here Again.

Sociopathic, oligarchy whore Repugs have kicked 4M+ out of health insurance
Still ignored that jobs have been available for anyone able and willing for at least five years..............

[ducks]

Stop the welfare train and just help those that can not work

Those numbers will go down further

[boutons_deux]

Still ignored that jobs have been available for anyone able and willing for at least five years..............

Lou Dobbs, even when he was on CNN, has been whining for years about the loss of good jobs, the hollowing, destruction of the middle class.

40M+ still on public assistance, in or near poverty, most of them are WHITE and have shitty paying job(s).

[AaronY]

Stop the welfare train and just help those that can not work

Those numbers will go down further
Tbh I would disagree with ducks here but if he can hold down a job anyone can

[Chris]

The I would disagree with ducks here but if he can hold down a job anyone can

How many languages do you speak?

[AaronY]

Exactly one more than ducks

[Spurminator]

Why would you have to immediately move m

Believe it or not, some people live paycheck to paycheck.

[sickdsm]

So you’re admitting that it was obama then. Cool now shut the fuck up

Lol. Liberals still slightly more stupid than conservatives. I have no idea who's policies did what. I could care less who gets shit done as long as it gets done. Now you shut the fuck up.

[sickdsm]

Believe it or not, some people live paycheck to paycheck.

Uhhh. Employers are falling all over themselves to get decent employees. You can get canned in the morning and be working before lunch.

[AaronY]

Lol. Liberals still slightly more stupid than conservatives.

Must be why Trump won the high school dropout vote by 39 points and got dominated in the vote among college grads

[spurraider21]

Uhhh. Employers are falling all over themselves to get decent employees. You can get canned in the morning and be working before lunch.
well that's an optimistic view

[sickdsm]

Must be why Trump won the high school dropout vote by 39 points and got dominated in the vote among college grads

I wasn't arguing who caused what. Liberals have a much harder time believing someone can be independent than a republican.

[sickdsm]

Exactly one more than ducks

Lol

[dabom]

The country is still basking in the afterglow of Obama :toast

:tu

[boutons_deux]

The afterglow of Obama was just the natural growth to the economy after the Banksters Great Depression, a growth that was intentionally, of course maliciously crippled by Repugs blocking govt spending, killing many 100Ks of jobs at all govt levels, and of course austerity, like cutting $Bs and 10Ks of jobs from Federal agences, esp IRS.

Bitch McC said the Repugs priority was not governing but to make Obama a one term President.

Trash and Repugs have done nothing for economy of the The Common Good,

[monosylab1k]

Exactly one more than ducks

:lmao

[DMC]

17 year lows.

Texas was lowest since 1976. I thought I read that's when they started tracking? Besides disability, health reasons, daycare, is there ANY reason for an able bodied person to be collecting unemployment?

Able bodied people can't get disability because they are able bodied. They also don't have health problems because they are able bodied. So in effect you're saying "besides daycare". There's a difference between employment and gainful employment. You and I could get a job collecting baskets from the parking lot of HEB. That wouldn't pay a mortgage, college tuition, car payment, insurance, medical, food, etc..

The reason some people are unemployed is because they have a price for success, and what's available doesn't pay it.

[CosmicCowboy]

If collecting grocery carts is all they are capable of it sucks to be them but thats life. Kids coming out of blue collar trade schools are starting at 50k-80k depending on skill and work ethic. There are mechanics in SA making 6 figures three years out of trade school.

[CosmicCowboy]

I have three guys in their early 20s making a salary and benefit package of 70k a year with high school degrees with plenty of opportunity to improve on that.

[CosmicCowboy]

I would hire a kid tomorrow at 75k package to start if he had mechanical skills, could pass a 6G welding test and drug test with no Dui's.

[Spurminator]

Uhhh. Employers are falling all over themselves to get decent employees. You can get canned in the morning and be working before lunch.

You ever visited a town with a population of less than 5000?

[sickdsm]

Able bodied people can't get disability because they are able bodied. They also don't have health problems because they are able bodied. So in effect you're saying "besides daycare". There's a difference between employment and gainful employment. You and I could get a job collecting baskets from the parking lot of HEB. That wouldn't pay a mortgage, college tuition, car payment, insurance, medical, food, etc..

The reason some people are unemployed is because they have a price for success, and what's available doesn't pay it.


How much will my unemployment benefits be in Texas?
Amount and Duration of Unemployment Benefits in Texas. As explained above, the Texas Workforce Commission determines your weekly unemployment benefit amount by dividing your earnings for the highest paid quarter of the base period by 25, up to a maximum of $465 per week. Benefits are available for up to 26 weeks.

So $465 x 26 weeks pays college Tuition? The jobs down in Texas pay less than that?

[sickdsm]

You ever visited a town with a population of less than 5000?

Lol. Around here that's the big city. Hello Burger King.

[benefactor]

Exactly one more than ducks
:tu:lol

[spurraider21]

I have three guys in their early 20s making a salary and benefit package of 70k a year with high school degrees with plenty of opportunity to improve on that.


I would hire a kid tomorrow at 75k package to start if he had mechanical skills, could pass a 6G welding test and drug test with no Dui's.
damn. that solves the national problem right there

[DarrinS]

I’m glad there are still lots of opportunity and the economy is strong. Could care less who gets credit.

[DarrinS]

And I think H1B undercuts American workers more than illegals.

[pgardn]

And I think H1B undercuts American workers more than illegals.

I guess this is more computer industry oriented problem.
In the natural sciences we are getting some very good people. They need to be made citizens.

[sickdsm]

damn. that solves the national problem right there

Funny guy. CC's story is a lot more common than the doomsayer's would have you believe.

[DarrinS]

I guess this is more computer industry oriented problem.
In the natural sciences we are getting some very good people. They need to be made citizens.

I just know that I’m on conference calls where I can’t understand any of these people. Wasn’t the case a decade ago.

[DarrinS]

Tech companies are probably saving a fortune with H1B, but it really slows down productivity, IMO.

[CosmicCowboy]

Truck drivers can make 80k a year easy and companies cant get enough drivers. Companies will pay for the training too. Problem is they have to drug test to keep their CDL.

[SnakeBoy]

I would hire a kid tomorrow at 75k package to start if he had mechanical skills, could pass a 6G welding test and drug test with no Dui's.

Yeah but you'd be hiring a dumb guy. Unless he also had a bachelor's in sociology and the debt to go along with it, then he'd be smart.

[DMC]

How much will my unemployment benefits be in Texas?
Amount and Duration of Unemployment Benefits in Texas. As explained above, the Texas Workforce Commission determines your weekly unemployment benefit amount by dividing your earnings for the highest paid quarter of the base period by 25, up to a maximum of $465 per week. Benefits are available for up to 26 weeks.

So $465 x 26 weeks pays college Tuition? The jobs down in Texas pay less than that?

I'm guessing you never had a career. You present a resume to a hiring manager, it shows you're a door greeter at Walmart for the past year, but below that you were a senior director of operations for a company that decided India was a better plan. To the hiring manager, you're a door greeter who somehow managed to get a temporary job as a senior director, probably why they went to India, and you regressed to your mean.

Long game, not everything is about unemployment. Most people I know have enough money to withstand a couple years without a job, they are still unemployed though.

[DMC]

If collecting grocery carts is all they are capable of it sucks to be them but thats life. Kids coming out of blue collar trade schools are starting at 50k-80k depending on skill and work ethic. There are mechanics in SA making 6 figures three years out of trade school.
No one gets a starting salary based on a work ethic no one has seen. You might want to quell the bullshit just a few notches. There are PhDs working for state offices making 60K a year. Most blue collar jobs pay hourly. You make 80K on an hourly wage, you're working 60+ hours a week or you're a craftsman.

[DMC]

If collecting grocery carts is all they are capable of it sucks to be them but thats life. Kids coming out of blue collar trade schools are starting at 50k-80k depending on skill and work ethic. There are mechanics in SA making 6 figures three years out of trade school.
No one said shit about capable. If you take a job making minimum wage, you might get your John Wayne grub groove on "man's gotta work", but there's a reason people progress in their career field instead of starting over every time they leave a job.

https://i.imgur.com/PrwnlyN.jpg

This gave you a lot more than you asked for... 10+ years of experience, excellent worker even has people reporting to him. Far fucking cry from 80K.

[sickdsm]

No one gets a starting salary based on a work ethic no one has seen. You might want to quell the bullshit just a few notches. There are PhDs working for state offices making 60K a year. Most blue collar jobs pay hourly. You make 80K on an hourly wage, you're working 60+ hours a week or you're a craftsman.

You can find out in a quick hurry if someone is qualified. No one is is offering 80k without seeing what someone is all about but you better be damn quick about a raise if you like what you see.

There's a lot of denial here about what sort of money is out there.

Drug free, reliable, willing to learn, and common sense will get you a very nice life.

[sickdsm]

No one said shit about capable. If you take a job making minimum wage, you might get your John Wayne grub groove on "man's gotta work", but there's a reason people progress in their career field instead of starting over every time they leave a job.

https://i.imgur.com/PrwnlyN.jpg

This gave you a lot more than you asked for... 10+ years of experience, excellent worker even has people reporting to him. Far fucking cry from 80K.

Shops billing this excellent worker out at $5k/week but after ten years this guy, who has people beneath him hasn't ventured out doing repairs on his own? He already owns his tools. What's the story on him? If CC don't hire him I'll make him an offer...

[DMC]

You can find out in a quick hurry if someone is qualified. No one is is offering 80k without seeing what someone is all about but you better be damn quick about a raise if you like what you see.

There's a lot of denial here about what sort of money is out there.

Drug free, reliable, willing to learn, and common sense will get you a very nice life.

:lol no

CC said 50 - 80 right out of school. You say no but better be there with a raise.

I showed you the range for even 10 - 14 year mechanics (blue collar trade school). HVAC will be higher, not a lot. I can cherry pick hair stylists that make 100K a year. That doesn't mean cosmotology pays 100K a year...

I think the hyperbole is too thick here.

[DMC]

Shops billing this excellent worker out at $5k/week but after ten years this guy, who has people beneath him hasn't ventured out doing repairs on his own? He already owns his tools. What's the story on him? If CC don't hire him I'll make him an offer...

If he's doing repairs on his own, he's not getting a raise. Do you think every mechanic and blue collar professional in SA opens their own business after 10 or so years on the job? Would there even be enough business for everyone?

Stick with one or the other.

[Xevious]

I just think the employment model is fundamentally different than it was in years past. The days of people working for the same company for most of their working lives and retiring with a pention are long gone. A lot of people have to job hop, work extra jobs on the side, or start their own small business to keep pace with inflation. A lot of the blue collar trades have high money making potential, but they have to work for it. Not some 40hr, 9-5 position in other words. Base salaries are not coming close to keeping up with surging real estate costs.

[sickdsm]

:lol no

CC said 50 - 80 right out of school. You say no but better be there with a raise.

I showed you the range for even 10 - 14 year mechanics (blue collar trade school). HVAC will be higher, not a lot. I can cherry pick hair stylists that make 100K a year. That doesn't mean cosmotology pays 100K a year...

I think the hyperbole is too thick here.

One of the worst guys I had working was a guy that was over in Iraq. "I drive truck all the time over in Iraq”. Good right? It was a Hummer that he called a truck. He didn't know what air brakes were, never had a trailer on, etc.

Last year I gave a guy a $3 raise after the first week. I'm giving a guy a little time to see if he shows up, etc. Not speaking for CC but I'm pretty sure he's making sure that the guy is doing the things he asked first. That's still right out of school in my book.

My point being about the mechanic is that he probably isn't very good.

[boutons_deux]

What is full employment? An economist explains the latest jobs data

Essentially, the idea of full employment is that so few workers are available that companies need to begin raising wages to attract help.

the Congressional Budget Office puts NAIRU (https://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/recurringdata/51135-2018-04-economicprojections_1.xlsx) at 4.6 percent, a little above the 3.9 percent unemployment rate.

That means the U.S. is at full employment – and that wages should be going up.

But until recently, they haven’t gained much (https://www.epi.org/nominal-wage-tracker/), which has puzzled (https://hbr.org/2017/10/why-wages-arent-growing-in-america) many economists.

In other words, full employment isn’t when everyone has a job. Instead, it is when

inflation (https://businessmacroeconomics.com/) starts to rise because businesses cannot find enough workers.

https://counter.theconversation.com/content/95908/count.gif?distributor=republish-lightbox-basic
While the U.S. may be technically at full employment, according to the definition,

I won’t be convinced until paychecks start increasing.

https://www.rawstory.com/2018/05/full-employment-economist-explains-latest-jobs-data/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story% 29 (https://www.rawstory.com/2018/05/full-employment-economist-explains-latest-jobs-data/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story% 29)

And if workers getting paid more means there is "cost push" inflation,

then the Fed will suppress wages by increasing the Fed rate to increase unemployment, aka, kill jobs.

And Capitalists put pressure on the Fed to raise rates so Capitalists' interest incomes rise, as well as increasing Capitalists' profits by suppressing Labor's wages.

iow, The Rigged House Always Wins

[Winehole23]

U-6, the broadest measure that covers U-3 plus people who are “marginally attached to the labor force” plus those employed part time who want to have full-time employment, edged down to 7.8% in April, from 8.0% in March.

https://wolfstreet.com/2018/05/04/jobs-gained-lost-by-sector-retail-jobs-by-store-type/

[Winehole23]

https://wolfstreet.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/US-jobs-payrolls-yoy-change_2018-04.png

[Winehole23]

https://wolfstreet.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/US-jobs-by-sector-2018-04.png

[Winehole23]

https://wolfstreet.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/US-jobs-by-sector-changes-2018-04.png

[Winehole23]

https://wolfstreet.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/US-jobs-by-sector-retail-changes-2018-04.png

[Winehole23]

But the brick-and-mortar meltdown sectors (marked in red) – the heroes in my articles (https://wolfstreet.com/category/all/brick-and-mortar/) about store closings, bankruptcies, and liquidations – have shed a net of 60,000 jobs over the past 12 months, and they’re not done shedding, far from it, no matter how good the overall economy is.

[Winehole23]

The online-resistant sectors and online-related “nonstore retailers” are adding jobs: “Food and beverage stores” (with 3.1 million jobs), “Motor vehicle and parts dealers” (with 2.0 million jobs), “General merchandise stores & supercenters,” (with nearly 2 million jobs, including at Walmart, Costco, etc.), and gasoline stations (with nearly 1 million jobs).

[Winehole23]

It might be surprising that “information technology,” a category with 2.77 million workers in April, has been shedding jobs over the past 12 months. While up on a monthly basis, the sector is down 25,000 jobs from a year ago. Many of these tech jobs are at companies that are not tech companies. And they routinely offshore their tech jobs or eliminate them as part of cost-cutting. Also, many actual tech companies go through job cuts after their numerous small and large acquisitions.

[Winehole23]

we could talk about labor force participation. after all the unemployment rate doesn't count people who have been unemployed longer than (x) and are no longer looking for work.

did the panic of 2008 turn millions of able bodied people into worthless slugabeds?

https://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS11300000

[Winehole23]

https://d3fy651gv2fhd3.cloudfront.net/charts/historical.png?s=UNITEDSTALABFORPARRA&v=20180504123000&d1=19180101&d2=20181231

[boutons_deux]

https://wolfstreet.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/US-jobs-by-sector-retail-changes-2018-04.png

the "housing boom" must include the "DIY / remodeling / house expansion" activities, and not just new house construction.

[Winehole23]

what do you think "building material & garden supply" means?

[Winehole23]

“A 3.9 percent rate today doesn’t suggest as tight a labor market as 3.9 percent in 2000 or 3.9 percent in the late 1960s,” said Ellen Zentner, Morgan Stanley’s chief United States economist.

A lot has changed since the turn of the century. The share of working-age women in the labor force began to fall in 2000, after increasing for decades. Men have been dropping out for much longer. The upshot is that a smaller share of people are participating in the labor market, and it’s easier to get low levels of unemployment when fewer people are vying for jobs.

In fact, a shrinking labor force in April is part of why the unemployment rate fell to 3.9 percent from 4.1 percent even as payrolls grew by a fairly routine 164,000 jobs.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/04/business/economy/unemployment-jobs.html

[Winehole23]

The population is also older than they used to be, on balance. The baby-boom generation has moved steadily toward retirement over the last two decades. And those still working have not helped push wages up. Generally, workers climb the economic ladder fastest when they are young, and so an older work force may weigh on average wages, economists say.


In 2000, wages for rank-and-file workers rose at an annual rate of around 4 percent. Part of the problem now is that some 60 percent of the jobs added since 2010 have been in low-wage, service-sector jobs, according to Morgan Stanley.


Fifty years ago, there were plenty of factory jobs paying a decent wage, and unions held much greater sway. Manufacturing accounted for one in four jobs; today it’s not even one in 10.


The tech explosion of the late 1990s gave rise to lucrative roles in companies based on new business models. The share of the economic pie going to workers rose steadily for the first time since the 1970s — a feat not repeated since.

[Winehole23]

Where did the idea of a “natural” rate of unemployment come from? The more technical term is “non-accelerating inflation rate of unemployment,” often rendered in shorthand as NAIRU. It’s described to undergraduates — in Blanchard’s popular macroeconomics textbook (https://www.pearson.com/us/higher-education/program/Blanchard-Macroeconomics-7th-Edition/PGM333935.html), for instance — as “the rate of unemployment required to keep the inflation rate constant.” The term was coined in Milton Friedman’s famous 1968 presidential address (https://www.fep.up.pt/docentes/pcosme/CIF_1Ec101_2014/Freedman1968.pdf) to the American Economics Association, “The Role of Monetary Policy.”https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2018/5/4/17320188/jobs-report-natural-rate-unemployment-inflation-economics-april

[boutons_deux]

WHETHER AMERICA CAN AFFORD A JOB GUARANTEE PROGRAM IS NOT UP FOR DEBATE (https://theintercept.com/2018/04/30/federal-job-guarantee-program-cost/)

the one critique that cannot really be put on the federal job guarantee is that it costs too much.

Or at least, you cannot say this without ignoring the mountain of taxpayer money we already employ for that intended purpose.

That existing money could be channeled into direct job creation pretty quickly.

It’s entirely reasonable to differ on how to accomplish the ultimate goal of ending poverty and the crushing burdens, both psychological and material, of unemployment.

But there’s no real debate on whether America can afford it.

We’re already picking up the tab.

https://theintercept.com/2018/04/30/federal-job-guarantee-program-cost/

[Winehole23]

The ability of unemployment to predict changes in inflation is essentially zero (http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/important-new-findings-on-inflation-and-unemployment-from-the-new-erp/) over the past 20 years, they found. As a result, there’s no ability to predict a range, much less a rate, of natural unemployment. They conclude that the “50-percent confidence band in 2014 ranges from 4.3 to 6.1” for the natural rate of unemployment.
That estimate range is so vast it simply can’t guide policy.

[Winehole23]

Even better, lower unemployment doesn’t just help workers: It can spur overall growth. As the economist J.W. Mason argues (http://rooseveltinstitute.org/what-recovery/), as we approach full employment incentives emerge for greater investment in labor-saving productivity, as companies seek to keep labor costs in check as workers demand more. This productivity increase stimulates yet more growth.

[boutons_deux]

"investment in labor-saving productivity"

but not available in the areas of major job creation, like health care, junk food, construction, etc

[CosmicCowboy]

"investment in labor-saving productivity"

but not available in the areas of major job creation, like health care, junk food, construction, etc




Wrong again. Robot fry cooks just hitting the market. Computerized order stations already out there. Robotic bricklayers hitting the construction industry. Its coming boo.

[ElNono]

To be fair, whenever this was pointed out during Obummer's last year, there were a lot of 'but, but' and asterisks about the participation rate, how they were shitty jobs, part time jobs, etc, from some of the same posters praising right now (not you, OP).

I think these last two administrations deserve credit on this, the first one for actually revitalizing an economy overall that was incredibly busted when they took power, and the current administration for not only not fucking it up, but building on it.

One thing to keep an eye on is that when dubya did his tax cuts in his first term, the economy also grew for a while, but after a couple of year, the bottom fell off. Something to track down here too.

[boutons_deux]

Wrong again. Robot fry cooks just hitting the market. Computerized order stations already out there. Robotic bricklayers hitting the construction industry. Its coming boo.

yeah, yeah, I've seen the vids, too.

so what is society going to do with the 10Ms workers who can't find jobs, because the jobs aren't there?

I'm sure the oligarchy doesn't GAF, so America, run by/for the oligarchy, will be unprepared to respond.

[CosmicCowboy]

Not much you can do if someone lives to adulthood without learning any marketable skills. Maybe you think I'm a dick, but I don't feel like its my responsibility to support them.

[AaronY]

Wrong again. Robot fry cooks just hitting the market. Computerized order stations already out there. Robotic bricklayers hitting the construction industry. Its coming boo.
And it will come a hell of a lot faster if you make unskilled workers minimum wage $15 an hour. Or even boutard's minimum wage of $52k

[Winehole23]

what about automation putting people out of work faster than the economy can replace their jobs? will you care then, CC?

[CosmicCowboy]

what about automation putting people out of work faster than the economy can replace their jobs? will you care then, CC?

And exactly what will you do about it? I try not to angst about things I cant change.

[Winehole23]

a jobs guarantee might not be a bad policy if the country had too many people out of work. full employment is a live topic in economics.

[CosmicCowboy]

Guess we could go back to the CCC with work camps.

[Winehole23]

sure, why not?

[Winehole23]

might look like the New Deal, might look like something else.

what forms it would take might be formulated at a local level -- by cities and counties setting public priorities and putting people to work to execute them locally.

[sickdsm]

Wonder how many people DM'd CC on that job? Either ST is so far elitist that $80k is beneath them or there not a quality person looking for a good wage with a little work. Either way, it's an opportunity to either make bank or see if he's full of it.

There's outfits that claim to train you to pass that weld level within a few months.

[DMC]

One of the worst guys I had working was a guy that was over in Iraq. "I drive truck all the time over in Iraq”. Good right? It was a Hummer that he called a truck. He didn't know what air brakes were, never had a trailer on, etc.

Last year I gave a guy a $3 raise after the first week. I'm giving a guy a little time to see if he shows up, etc. Not speaking for CC but I'm pretty sure he's making sure that the guy is doing the things he asked first. That's still right out of school in my book.

My point being about the mechanic is that he probably isn't very good.
"Right out of school" means entry level. 3 dollars an hour = 6200.00 a year for a 40 hour work week, hardly justifies the difference between the mean I showed you and the hyperbole being claimed in this thread.

If you've ever done hourly work for someone else, you know that the pay difference between a slouch and the best guy on the team is not commensurate with ability. The strong keep the week afloat and the employers only look at the net. Low level managers are supposed to weed out the chaff but they often don't, opting instead to focus their efforts where it will have the most immediate impact: pressure on performers to do more.

This is how it goes when you work for someone else. You cannot expect to get contractor level money with the comfort of nesting inside a corporate payroll.

[DMC]

Wonder how many people DM'd CC on that job? Either ST is so far elitist that $80k is beneath them or there not a quality person looking for a good wage with a little work. Either way, it's an opportunity to either make bank or see if he's full of it.

There's outfits that claim to train you to pass that weld level within a few months.

Or option 3: No one here wants to be a welder. Gee I cannot imagine not wanting to glue shit together for a living.

[sickdsm]

Or option 3: No one here wants to be a welder. Gee I cannot imagine not wanting to glue shit together for a living.
That was option two.

good wage with a little work

[sickdsm]

"Right out of school" means entry level. 3 dollars an hour = 6200.00 a year for a 40 hour work week, hardly justifies the difference between the mean I showed you and the hyperbole being claimed in this thread.

If you've ever done hourly work for someone else, you know that the pay difference between a slouch and the best guy on the team is not commensurate with ability. The strong keep the week afloat and the employers only look at the net. Low level managers are supposed to weed out the chaff but they often don't, opting instead to focus their efforts where it will have the most immediate impact: pressure on performers to do more.

This is how it goes when you work for someone else. You cannot expect to get contractor level money with the comfort of nesting inside a corporate payroll.

Your claiming false victories. I only have one full time guy and some seasonal. Where have I said that I am looking for another full time employee? The guy was good so I made sure I kept him for the remainder of harvest.


Not sure why you continue to use the corporate scenario. It works different. Your chaff wouldn't last two weeks in a small business scenario.

I've worked hourly before.

[AaronY]

what about automation putting people out of work faster than the economy can replace their jobs? will you care then, CC?

Unemployment is less than 4% this robot crises is a little absurd given that technology also creates jobs no one imagined 15-20 years ago. best thing to do is not doing any unskilled laborerers any favors by pricing them out of the labor pool. Minimum wage should go up some but $15 an hour is absurd. Heck raising it to $8.75 or $9 an hour would be a big boost to millions and millions of people but insulting to the far left boutons bernie bro retard crowd. Plus 15 would murder small businessin the country especially in rural areas

[DMC]

That was option two.

good wage with a little work

Bullshit. There are plenty of jobs that require work other than welding.

[DMC]

Your claiming false victories. I only have one full time guy and some seasonal. Where have I said that I am looking for another full time employee? The guy was good so I made sure I kept him for the remainder of harvest.


Not sure why you continue to use the corporate scenario. It works different. Your chaff wouldn't last two weeks in a small business scenario.

I've worked hourly before.

Last I checked migrant farm workers don't get unemployment.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

The narrative of the tax break was that we would see increased wages. It was horseshit. Income inequality still grows.

[sickdsm]

Last I checked migrant farm workers don't get unemployment.
I have no idea about migrant workers. All local guys. Ironically, the guy I'm talking about is collecting unemployment. And he's working for another farmer. Helluva worker with a great head on his shoulder, but I'm not playing the pay in cash game. Local cement guy collects unemployment all winter also. Ice fishes all winter, does it every year.


HSA? workers from South Africa are becoming popular here. I think you need to provide housing and the Govt pays half their wages. They speak English, hard working, and they're all been pretty decent. I think that's an Ag only deal which is fortunate since they'd replace a lot more shitty Americans.

[Winehole23]

Unemployment is less than 4% this robot crises is a little absurd given that technology also creates jobs no one imagined 15-20 years ago. best thing to do is not doing any unskilled laborerers any favors by pricing them out of the labor pool. Minimum wage should go up some but $15 an hour is absurd. Heck raising it to $8.75 or $9 an hour would be a big boost to millions and millions of people but insulting to the far left boutons bernie bro retard crowd. Plus 15 would murder small businessin the country especially in rural areasperhaps a one-size fits all minimum wage -- i.e., the kind we've always had -- won't work as well in the country as the city. perhaps automation will create as many jobs as it kills. both reasonable prognostications.

it's also reasonable to guess that things might turn out otherwise -- automation leading to mass unemployment, full employment policies leading to greater prosperity generally:

“
The single most encouraging study on the idea of a job guarantee comes from India, whose National Rural Employment Guarantee Scheme is meant to offer a permanent, guaranteed source of income for rural farmers during the dry season. A group of economists — UC San Diego’s Karthik Muralidharan and Paul Niehaus and the University of Virginia’s Sandip Sukhtankar — conducted a randomized experiment (http://econweb.ucsd.edu/~kamurali/papers/Working%20Papers/NREGS_GE%20(Current%20WP).pdf) and found that the program raises earnings for low-income households by 13.3 percent, mostly because it bid up wages in the private sector. It also increased employment in the private sector, amazingly.”https://www.vox.com/2018/4/27/17281676/job-guarantee-design-bad-jobs-labor-market-federal-reserve

[Winehole23]

the preeminently respectable hypothesis that the minimum wage kills jobs, is not conclusively supported by the data.

[boutons_deux]

the preeminently respectable hypothesis that the minimum wage kills jobs, is not conclusively supported by the data.

that hypothesis is BigCorp/Capitalist propaganda to keep money flowing to businesses and not to employees. It's FUCKING transparent bullshit.

[boutons_deux]

America's putrid wage growth


People are getting jobs.

But are the jobs everyone's getting any good?

Do they pay well?

Thus far the answer is largely no.

And grappling with that fact requires an unpleasant review of economic policymaking over the last few decades.

http://api.theweek.com/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/fredgraph%20%285%29_2.png?itok=57WYV1K2

http://api.theweek.com/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/fredgraph%20%284%29_0.png?itok=OcMsPLJ4

Not surprisingly, in the 1970s, an organized business lobby first really emerged (https://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/02/opinion/02herbert.html) on a national scale, pushing for deregulation and a rollback of worker power.

( IOW, the VRWC/Capital got organized to suppress, to devastate Labor )

Unionization levels began to decline (https://www.jacobinmag.com/2018/01/labor-unions-job-report-density-job-report) in earnest,

as businesses got serious about beating back labor.

The turn toward right-wing economic policy began, culminating in the Reagan revolution.

Fed Chair Paul Volcker crushed inflation by hiking interest rates into the stratosphere.

This set off a massive recession in 1981 (http://theweek.com/articles/618964/forgotten-recession-that-irrevocably-damaged-american-economy) — rivaling the 2008 collapse in some ways.

Millions of working-class Americans were thrown out of jobs for years, and already-struggling unions went into a tailspin.

This devastation wasn't an unfortunate side effect. It was kind of the point.

Business lobbying, bipartisan drives for less public investment (http://theweek.com/articles/625515/hillary-clinton-loves-trumpet-bills-budget-surplus-shouldnt), Federal Reserve policy:

All of it is built on the implicit assumption that

properly managing the economy requires breaking workers' bargaining power and

continuously swatting down their demands for better compensation.

http://theweek.com/articles/771456/americas-putrid-wage-growth

Real wages aren't going ever to reach that of the '45-'75 boom years. The Captial-ist oligarchy runs the country, which means fucking over Labor in every orifice.

I read a comment where the "gig economy" is Capital's total victory over Labor.

[Winehole23]

https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/employment.png

[boutons_deux]

The strange thing about America’s historically low unemployment rate

A natural mystery

Although no one knows what the NAIRU really is at any given moment,

there are ways to estimate it (https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/NROU) with varying levels of precision.

A lot rides on this number, however imprecise it is.

At the moment, amid low unemployment, the Fed has been steadily raising interest rates.

If it has over-estimated the NAIRU, it risks needlessly crimping economic growth, subjecting people to unnecessary unemployment and depressed wages.

Anyway, it seems like the whole idea of a natural rate might be bunk (https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/06/opinion/unnatural-economics-wonkish.html?rref=collection%2Fbyline%2Fpaul-krugman&action=click&contentCollection=undefined&region=stream&module=stream_unit&version=latest&contentPlacement=2&pgtype=collection).

Unemployment in the US is low, at 3.9%, which is presumably below the natural rate.

At the same time, inflation isn’t much above 2%, which the Fed considers its long-run target.

If there is no natural rate, why should the Fed continue to hike interest rates?

Maybe it can let the unemployment rate drift down to 2%, or even lower, without the risk of runaway inflation.

https://qz.com/1272656/nairu-and-the-phillips-curve-the-strange-thing-about-the-low-us-unemployment-rate/ (https://qz.com/1272656/nairu-and-the-phillips-curve-the-strange-thing-about-the-low-us-unemployment-rate/)

[Winehole23]

According to Warren Mosler "we haven’t yet to recover from the last recession...due to an ongoing lack of demand"

http://moslereconomics.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/61403.png

[boutons_deux]

Why Aren’t More Men Working?


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/15/business/men-unemployment-jobs.html

[Winehole23]

one upside of this is, if wages do rise, there could be a consumer led recovery, which some people say we're only a year and a half into.

big, if true.

[boutons_deux]

one upside of this is, if wages do rise, there could be a consumer led recovery, which some people say we're only a year and a half into.

big, if true.

nope, when wages rise, Capital's whore, its control knob, the Fed raises rates to create Ms of unemployed,

because Capital requires an excess (unemployed) Labor to keep wages low.

The economy looks a little better for some, job security and wages rise a tad, so consumers get confident and get suckered into buying the main product of Capital: D E B T

Total US household debt soars to record above $13 trillion



Total household debt rose to an all-time high of $13.15 trillion at year-end 2017, according to the Federal Reserve Bank of New York's Center for Microeconomic Data.
The report said it was fifth consecutive year of annual household debt growth with increases in the mortgage, student, auto and credit card categories.


https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/13/total-us-household-debt-soars-to-record-above-13-trillion.html

So just like the Federal govt, housefinance/spending is debt-based, not income based.

[CosmicCowboy]

I know that workers in the service trades, ac, electricians, welders, carpenters etc. are getting raises like crazy for retention. Competition for good skilled workers is fierce.

[boutons_deux]

I know that workers in the service trades, ac, electricians, welders, carpenters etc. are getting raises like crazy for retention. Competition for good skilled workers is fierce.

imagine if the Feds were collecting/spending taxes on infrastructure projects like dams, water systems, highways, electrical grid, renewable energy research and deployment rather than wasting "tax spending" on the oligarchy.