Kawhi Leonard “Injury Diagnosis”

[coachmac87]

So what is it? What caused him to miss 73 games? And is it normal to do so?

You can bash PATFO and the Spurs if you want but explain to me the injury diagnosis first and how Spurs are in the wrong because of it?

[KimmyGib]

I raised a similar question in another thread and was offered a couple explanations which make a lot of sense regarding the injury and the part it's played.


I think he was definitely hurt in the off-season and probably to start the season, it seems like everybody agrees with that and there wasn't any real bad blood at the time..they gave him time to figure things out, at least from a mental standpoint..

It's very evident that he sat out the 2nd half of the season for non-basketball reasons, though, that isn't even debatable IMO..everything we have heard these past 2 weeks adds up, it's a money issue, SA is reluctant to supermax him..there's NO WAY that Parker and Ginobili make those public comments(which they wouldn't have made without Pop co-signing) if that wasn't the case, it doesn't make any sense to jeopardize the team's relationship with its franchise cornerstone simply over a dispute over the diagnosis of an injury..the only reason that narrative got any play was because the Isiah Thomas situation(which was very rare, too) was so fresh in everybody's mind..

IMO the only consistent factors here are 1- Supermax/money dispute 2- As Woj reported, Kawhi's team is very disorganized and constantly changing their story

It's not a coincidence that Kawhi's team leaked that they were working things out and a meeting was imminent to discuss money, but then all of a sudden it's leaked that he is going to demand a trade:lol

If the Spurs and Kawhi had agreed on the money, I bet none of this shit would have happened IMO..it's all been leverage game since then..misdiagnosis of injury, doesn't like the roster, mad about the way Pop is approaching things, furious that Parker and Ginobili made comments through the media:lol

All narratives to save face, they are fully aware of how the public reacts to athletes regarding money disputes..I mostly disagree with the way fans view athletes and their money(especially in the NBA and NFL), I find it strange that they generally side with management over the employees, but I understand, I suppose..


I appreciate your insight. Agreed, it doesn't make much sense. But does it make any less sense than for the Spurs to have been so reluctant to supermax him, unless the injury were a major factor? In other words, if it's all a money issue, then I'd think the injury must've played a key role in making it an issue to begin with, and therefore Kawhi may have been legitimately unfit to play all year.


It's $219 million, starting at 35% of cap and if the cap increase doesn't keep pace, could easily rise to over 35% of cap over 5 years...it's not exactly a good contract from the team's perspective unless everything is airtight...but it could be that the money topic never even came up with Kawhi's camp...I think (and this is pure speculation) the Spurs diagnosis of potentially degenerative quad was taken by Kawhi's uncle/agent as an excuse by the Spurs to lowball the supermax, or rather, not offer the supermax...and that's why they went and sought 2nd, and then 3rd opinion--and kept the Spurs at arm's length. The irony here is that the Spurs probably would have offered the supermax had everyone been on the same page since the team's stance has consistently been that the quad needs proper treatment and management...if any team understands managing the long term health of their franchise player, it's the Spurs...Duncan basically played on one leg for years and years...but because of subsequent actions by Kawhi's camp, the Spurs probably grew increasingly uncomfortable with offering the supermax and thus the public posturing.

[Pavlov]

Failing to comeback from an injury and blaming it on the team that can actually pay you the most is a poor negotiating tactic.

[cutewizard]

There is such a thing as professionalism, ethical behavior, and being classy.

Bill Russell is the epitome.

[Chillen]

I watched some highlights of the games he played in when he came back last season. He looked just fine.

[barbacoataco]

I think he's done. It's the type of chronic injury that can't be fixed and will always come back.

[baseline bum]

Didn't that faggot say he felt great when going to China last August? But then all of a sudden he lost faith in team doctors in August and went with his own?

[coachmac87]

The comments are nice but what’s the injury?

[Keepin' it real]

The comments are nice but what’s the injury?

The official medical term is I'm-faking-it-itis.

[PublicOption]

the Lakers should be hit with tampering.

[bdictjames]

i think the hair splitting iirc is if it’s a sick quad affecting the tendon (kawhis docs stance) or a sick tendon affecting the quad (spurs docs)

the treatment protocol and long term outlook is different for each

again, i think, without looking anything up, iirc etc
How could a sick quadriceps muscle affect the quadriceps tendon? That doesn't make much sense to me. How could a muscle be sick at the first place? It could either be myositis (inflammation of the muscle), or a strain (which easily heals up). The first one is usually from a hereditary trait (doubt it in this case as Kawhi has been playing since he was a kid). If that's what Kawhi's docs are saying, I want an explanation on how 1. The muscle got injured and 2. Why hasn't it healed.

I'll go with the Spurs docs on this one.

[exstatic]

The official medical term is vaginitis.

fify

[FkLA]

Didn't that faggot say he felt great when going to China last August? But then all of a sudden he lost faith in team doctors in August and went with his own?

I honestly think it has to do with the lowball Jordan offer he received. If he's marketable despite the small market (like Westbrook), and he gets a signature shoe and other endorsements I think he's still a Spur.

[daslicer]

I watched some highlights of the games he played in when he came back last season. He looked just fine.

Agreed. The last games I watched of him was against Phoenix and Denver and he looked pretty mobile in those games.

[toki9]

The comments are nice but what’s the injury?

Here is the relevant passage from the Ramona Shelburne/Michael Wright article ( http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/23366667/inside-tension-kawhi-leonard-spurs ) :

"In conversations with multiple sources close to Leonard and the Spurs, there is some disagreement about the exact nature of the injury.

Leonard's camp believes his condition is the result of a series of contusions to the quadriceps that began with one very deep bruise in March 2016 that caused him to miss three games. Leonard was again listed with a "quad contusion" on the Feb. 6, 2017, injury report, when he was a late scratch before a game. But it wasn't until the end of last season when the severity of the injury became apparent.

According to multiple sources, Leonard's camp has come to believe the issue has more to do with an ossification, or hardening, in the area where the muscle has been repeatedly bruised, and then an atrophy, which in turn affected the tendons connecting the muscle to the knee.

The Spurs have always called the injury quadriceps tendinopathy, which is a disease of the tendon that has a degenerative effect on the muscle by keeping it in a constant state of exhaustion."

The thing is that if you go with Kawhi's camp's diagnosis, then he has played on that quad since March 2016...so the 2016 playoffs, all of the following season (the season in which he played career high 74 games and then the playoffs), then went to China (and was fine, per his sister) only to realize afterwards that he was hurt.

[lmbebo]

All this past year was crap. Injury was an excuse. Uncle Dennis pulling all this crap. Kwahi trusting his idiot uncle. Spurs played the games with his Uncle/Kwahi. Let him rehab, etc. He sat out. Power play.

And kind of tired of this dynamic between teams and players. Its got the undertones of owners and slaves vibe. Poor players have to be subservient to the rich owners, etc. And the fans who are the the power behind this all are an after thought ... Getting tired of this crap.

[toki9]

All this past year was crap. Injury was an excuse. Uncle Dennis pulling all this crap. Kwahi trusting his idiot uncle. Spurs played the games with his Uncle/Kwahi. Let him rehab, etc. He sat out. Power play.

And kind of tired of this dynamic between teams and players. Its got the undertones of owners and slaves vibe. Poor players have to be subservient to the rich owners, etc. And the fans who are the the power behind this all are an after thought ... Getting tired of this crap.

I think "fans" count less and less in this equation, at least, the "fans" who actually attend the games. Increasingly it's the broadcasting and marketing dollars driving the whole thing. There's just too much money at stake now.

[daslicer]

All this past year was crap. Injury was an excuse. Uncle Dennis pulling all this crap. Kwahi trusting his idiot uncle. Spurs played the games with his Uncle/Kwahi. Let him rehab, etc. He sat out. Power play.

And kind of tired of this dynamic between teams and players. Its got the undertones of owners and slaves vibe. Poor players have to be subservient to the rich owners, etc. And the fans who are the the power behind this all are an after thought ... Getting tired of this crap.

Jalen Rose during the playoffs tried to accuse Pop of being a racist for using the term group. Stuff like this is part of the reason why I would like to see the Spurs trade Kawhi to the Hornets. Let Jordan go at him and his uncle that way they won't be able to pull the race card bs.

[toki9]

Jalen Rose during the playoffs tried to accuse Pop of being a racist for using the term group. Stuff like this is part of the reason why I would like to see the Spurs trade Kawhi to the Hornets. Let Jordan go at him and his uncle that way they won't be able to pull the race card bs.

Really? So we went from Phil Jackson and his "Posse" comment about Lebron to Pop and the word "group"? And Pop is also the guy who's getting torched by some for his "politics"?

[spurraider21]

this is such a shitshow. the raiders better be good this year

[daslicer]

Really? So we went from Phil Jackson and his "Posse" comment about Lebron to Pop and the word "group"? And Pop is also the guy who's getting torched by some for his "politics"?

Yeah it did happen. Jalen Rose during the pre-game show for a playoff game said that using the word group is racially offensive on the same level as posse. Michelle Beadle immediately interrupted him and said that she disagreed with him which ended the conversation.

[Pavlov]

Yeah it did happen. Jalen Rose during the pre-game show for a playoff game said that using the word group is racially offensive on the same level as posse. Michelle Beadle immediately interrupted him and said that she disagreed with him which ended the conversation.lol what should we call them?

The Folks?

The Conglomeration?

The Other Team?

The Gathering?

The Hive?

Those Who Shall Not Be Named?

[boutons_deux]

I watched some highlights of the games he played in when he came back last season. He looked just fine.

several people here said he looked like trash

[tholdren]

There is such a thing as professionalism, ethical behavior, and being classy.

Bill Russell is the epitome.

Not in todays nba. No loyalty no professionalism = no rivalries which even makes lack of talent more evident

[phxspurfan]

Didn't that faggot say he felt great when going to China last August? But then all of a sudden he lost faith in team doctors in August and went with his own?

He did say he felt great. Then his camp floated rumors that he was developing another "super move". Then BSPN and the talking heads put him up as a consensus MVP candidate prior to the season. Then he had a massive panic attack and didn't want the spotlight that comes with carrying a team with high expectations. And he claimed a thigh owie with no tissue damage on an MRI was enough to force him to both miss basically the entire season and the playoffs. All while Parker, who tore the muscle off the bone in the playoffs the previous year, came back by end of November.

[tholdren]

He did say he felt great. Then his camp floated rumors that he was developing another "super move". Then BSPN and the talking heads put him up as a consensus MVP candidate prior to the season. Then he had a massive panic attack and didn't want the spotlight that comes with carrying a team with high expectations. And he claimed a thigh owie with no tissue damage on an MRI was enough to force him to both miss basically the entire season and the playoffs. All while Parker, who tore the muscle off the bone in the playoffs the previous year, came back by end of November.

His metabolism was low

[DMC]

lol what should we call them?

The Folks?

The Conglomeration?

The Other Team?

The Gathering?

The Hive?

Those Who Shall Not Be Named?

Naggers

[kobyz]

it's more a functional condition of the muscle, but still very real injury!

[tmtcsc]

several people here said he looked like trash

He looked out of shape to me & was still favoring his leg. I think he was in pain but some of it was to be expected. He could play, but the injury and rehab needed to be managed. The "shutting it down" for the season and bailing on his team was complete bullshit in my opinion. I sided with him and understood his position at first but then it became clear that he was manipulating things at Uncle Dennis' advice. I wonder if the Spurs have any legal alternatives to pursue the other doctor that works for Philly. I think he works for Philly or some other team. SMH

[dbestpro]

I honestly think it has to do with the lowball Jordan offer he received. If he's marketable despite the small market (like Westbrook), and he gets a signature shoe and other endorsements I think he's still a Spur.

His best selling shoe will most likely be an orthopedic shoe for retired people who can't get on the court anymore. They'll call it Leonard's Taming of the Shoe line.

[SnakeBoy]

How could a sick quadriceps muscle affect the quadriceps tendon? That doesn't make much sense to me. How could a muscle be sick at the first place? It could either be myositis (inflammation of the muscle), or a strain (which easily heals up). The first one is usually from a hereditary trait (doubt it in this case as Kawhi has been playing since he was a kid). If that's what Kawhi's docs are saying, I want an explanation on how 1. The muscle got injured and 2. Why hasn't it healed.

I'll go with the Spurs docs on this one.

From what I read Kawhi's team believes that calcification of the quad muscle occurred when Kawhi suffered a thigh bruise last season and that the failure to diagnose it led to his tendinopathy. This doesn't make much sense considering calcification is easily identified via x-rays or ultrasound imaging. So there isn't any reason for the two medical camps to disagree if there is calcification. The only thing I can think of is if his team is claiming there was calcification which led to tedinopathy but the calcification was reabsorbed without ever being diagnosed. That seems like quite a stretch though and doesn't explain why he still did not respond to their therapy.

The simplest explanation for the way Kawhi has handled this past season is that he knows he has a chronic injury that will affect his career and he doesn't want anyone to know about it until he gets a new contract.

[bdictjames]

From what I read Kawhi's team believes that calcification of the quad muscle occurred when Kawhi suffered a thigh bruise last season and that the failure to diagnose it led to his tendinopathy. This doesn't make much sense considering calcification is easily identified via x-rays or ultrasound imaging. So there isn't any reason for the two medical camps to disagree if there is calcification. The only thing I can think of is if his team is claiming there was calcification which led to tedinopathy but the calcification was reabsorbed without ever being diagnosed. That seems like quite a stretch though and doesn't explain why he still did not respond to their therapy.

The simplest explanation for the way Kawhi has handled this past season is that he knows he has a chronic injury that will affect his career and he doesn't want anyone to know about it until he gets a new contract.
True true.

I would check this article out, I don't hear a lot about muscles calcifying: http://www.sportsinjuryclinic.net/sport-injuries/thigh-pain/myositis-ossificans

"If a bad muscle strain or contusion is neglected then it is possible myositis ossificans can occur. It is usually as a result of impact which causes damage to the sheath that surrounds a bone called the periosteum as well as to the muscle."

"Common myositis ossificans causes include failing to apply cold therapy and compression immediately after the injury or applying heat too soon. Ice will help reduce pain, inflammation, and swelling and encourage the injured muscle to heal. Having intensive physiotherapy or massage too soon after the injury which may increase internal bleeding and prevent healing. Returning too soon to training after exercise is also a cause of myositis ossificans."

If this is what Kawhi has, and the Spurs doctors misdiagnose it, the Spurs are partly to blame and I could see why the rift is there. Hopefully the relationship is still salvageable.. if not, it's bad for both parties, tbh.

Also, if I know, some calcifications can be minute that it won't show on the X-ray for 1-2 weeks, and even then, if it is on the X-ray, it would be a large calcification. Sometimes small ones can affect the player as well. This is an interesting situation for sure.

[dbreiden83080]

Za Za stuck his foot out with us up 23..

And everything went down the shitter after that..

[Mr. Body]

Za Za stuck his foot out with us up 23..

And everything went down the shitter after that..

Then we find out Zaza is Kawhi's uncle.

[Mikeanaro]

Nobody is injured for more than a year, look Paul George his leg flew all over the cuckoo´s nest and he is fine.
If he makes such Ricky Bobby drama it means its a bad deal for Spurs anyway, you give 220 mil to an injury prone player with no personality, is he like Michael Jackson? thats the wrong MJ we wanted him to be like the other one.

[apalisoc_9]

He was clearly misdagnosed.

[coachmac87]

He was clearly misdagnosed.

Then what was the correct diagnosis you twat

[midnightpulp]

He was clearly misdagnosed.

Time to put the semen shield away. But I see you found new troll material, so carry on I guess.

[Dingle Barry]

From what I read Kawhi's team believes that calcification of the quad muscle occurred when Kawhi suffered a thigh bruise last season and that the failure to diagnose it led to his tendinopathy. This doesn't make much sense considering calcification is easily identified via x-rays or ultrasound imaging. So there isn't any reason for the two medical camps to disagree if there is calcification. The only thing I can think of is if his team is claiming there was calcification which led to tedinopathy but the calcification was reabsorbed without ever being diagnosed. That seems like quite a stretch though and doesn't explain why he still did not respond to their therapy.

The simplest explanation for the way Kawhi has handled this past season is that he knows he has a chronic injury that will affect his career and he doesn't want anyone to know about it until he gets a new contract.

http://media3.giphy.com/media/8VrtCswiLDNnO/giphy.gif

[Dingle Barry]

He was clearly misdagnosed.

Based on what, cuck?

[Play Boban]

So what is it? What caused him to miss 73 games? And is it normal to do so?

You can bash PATFO and the Spurs if you want but explain to me the injury diagnosis first and how Spurs are in the wrong because of it?
Cancer. And he’s infected the team with it.

[Dingle Barry]

Yeah it did happen. Jalen Rose during the pre-game show for a playoff game said that using the word group is racially offensive on the same level as posse. Michelle Beadle immediately interrupted him and said that she disagreed with him which ended the conversation.

That's the dumbest race baiting bullshit I've ever heard, and that's saying a lot in 2018.

[Dingle Barry]

Its got the undertones of owners and slaves vibe. Poor players have to be subservient to the rich owners, etc.

:lol :lol :lol

Poor players :lol

That shitty metaphor is just as applicable to any employment relationship. That is to say it's not valid at all, because obviously slaves weren't paid.

Unfuck yourself.

[TDfan2007]

He was clearly misdagnosed.

If he was, then it's understandable, since myositis ossificans is very rare, and the way to detect it earliest (ultrasound) is not an imaging procedure that's usually used to diagnose musculoskeletal problems. It should have shown up later on MRI though...and MRIs are handed out like candy to injured professional athletes.

Regardless, none of the injuries that his camp has mentioned would have caused him to miss an entire season.

Furthermore, his camp leaking that he only wants to go to LA adds fuel to the fire that this "injury mishandling" business is just being used as an excuse to get out of SA while saving face.

I get it. His camp probably saw that Jordan brand offer and thought, "this wouldn't have happened if he played in LA." I just wish he would've been honest and upfront about not wanting to be here sooner...

[cjw]

this is such a shitshow. the raiders better be good this year

Thank god the biggest issue my Eagles have faced (outside of being disinvited from the White House) is turning down an early 2nd round pick for a Super Bowl winning QB because why not? How the tides have turned. Honestly can’t believe it.

At least this small/big market BS isn’t an issue in the NFL. The teams/employers have control like in basically every other job.

[TDfan2007]

From what I read Kawhi's team believes that calcification of the quad muscle occurred when Kawhi suffered a thigh bruise last season and that the failure to diagnose it led to his tendinopathy. This doesn't make much sense considering calcification is easily identified via x-rays or ultrasound imaging. So there isn't any reason for the two medical camps to disagree if there is calcification. The only thing I can think of is if his team is claiming there was calcification which led to tedinopathy but the calcification was reabsorbed without ever being diagnosed. That seems like quite a stretch though and doesn't explain why he still did not respond to their therapy.

The simplest explanation for the way Kawhi has handled this past season is that he knows he has a chronic injury that will affect his career and he doesn't want anyone to know about it until he gets a new contract.

Ding ding ding. Kawhi has had quad tendon issues since 2014, so this is nothing new. If he does have tendinosis, then he's damaged goods and definitely not worth the supermax

[lmbebo]

Ding ding ding. Kawhi has had quad tendon issues since 2014, so this is nothing new. If he does have tendinosis, then he's damaged goods and definitely not worth the supermax

Calcification doesn't happen immediately. It takes a lot of time. Would be evident on xray or CT if significant and only months after the injury. And injury would have to be severe (like car accident severe ...).

Instead of people debating tendinopathy, etc... how about people start diagnosing him with malingering ...

[coachmac87]

If he was, then it's understandable, since myositis ossificans is very rare, and the way to detect it earliest (ultrasound) is not an imaging procedure that's usually used to diagnose musculoskeletal problems. It should have shown up later on MRI though...and MRIs are handed out like candy to injured professional athletes.

Regardless, none of the injuries that his camp has mentioned would have caused him to miss an entire season.

Furthermore, his camp leaking that he only wants to go to LA adds fuel to the fire that this "injury mishandling" business is just being used as an excuse to get out of SA while saving face.

I get it. His camp probably saw that Jordan brand offer and thought, "this wouldn't have happened if he played in LA." I just wish he would've been honest and upfront about not wanting to be here sooner...

[TDfan2007]

Calcification doesn't happen immediately. It takes a lot of time. Would be evident on xray or CT if significant and only months after the injury. And injury would have to be severe (like car accident severe ...).

Instead of people debating tendinopathy, etc... how about people start diagnosing him with malingering ...

It doesn't add up, but it's also a very random problem to fabricate. This whole situation is weird, tby

[rjv]

nephew's knee is acting up again; he's out for tonight's pivotal game 3. (per woj, it's not related to his previous ACL tear)

[BacktoBasics]

Kawhi has a bigger pussy than Koriwhat.

But not ducks. That asshole has the biggest clam in the world.

[rjv]

Kawhi has a bigger pussy than Koriwhat.

But not ducks. That asshole has the biggest clam in the world.

spot on character analysis of all three individuals.

:bobo

[timtonymanu]

:lol Nephew

[Leetonidas]

Lol load management is injured again. Shocker

[cd98]

We mistook his shyness for humility. Dude has a large ego that apparently his knees can't support.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

nephew's knee is acting up again; he's out for tonight's pivotal game 3. (per woj, it's not related to his previous ACL tear)

Steve Ballmer is probably rocking back and forth in a closet by himself somewhere putting on red lipstick and burning marks on his legs with a curling iron.

[Jordan Jackson]

Clippers are cursed. But they’re also stupid. All that tampering and they didn’t at least take the time to look at this guys medical background? Great player but he’s damaged goods. The Spurs were not wrong about that.

[koriwhat]

Kawhi has a bigger pussy than Koriwhat.

Yeah but you are a fucking pussy bro! Oh and RENT MOTHERFUCKING FREE!!!!

[koriwhat]

spot on character analysis of all three individuals.

:bobo

STFU Maricon

[Mr. Body]

Clippers are cursed. But they’re also stupid. All that tampering and they didn’t at least take the time to look at this guys medical background? Great player but he’s damaged goods. The Spurs were not wrong about that.

Screw Ballmer and the Clippers. They managed to bend themselves over a barrel for OKC and traded a package worth two star players just for Paul George.

[Jordan Jackson]

Screw Ballmer and the Clippers. They managed to bend themselves over a barrel for OKC and traded a package worth two star players just for Paul George.

But they did that to land Kawhi. He demanded Paul George. When you’re an historically pathetic franchise like the Clippers you tend to bend like that.

I really do believe the Clippers took delight in screwing over the Spurs. The media did too. But you know how it goes when you start digging graves for others.

[The Truth #6]

Clippers and knee injuries, a classic combination.

[exstatic]

Clippers didn't tamper, Magic and the Lakers did that summer before he faked a year of injury.

[Spurs Homer]

What a vagina

yep

pretty much as big a pussy as koriwhat


:lmao:lmao

[lefty20]

Spurs - Yo this shit chronic af, we gonna need to manage the fuck outta them legs.

Nephew/Uncle Dennis - The 9th Dr. we consulted assures us that you, and the first 8 Drs. don't know wtf you are talking about.



Fuck the media, Clippers and every casual mf who actually bought that shit.

[slick'81]

https://youtu.be/uulEgQyS5D0

[BacktoBasics]

Yeah but you are a fucking pussy bro! Oh and RENT MOTHERFUCKING FREE!!!!

Appreciate you proving my point. Shouldn’t you be out grooming 5 year olds?

[Mr. Body]

But they did that to land Kawhi. He demanded Paul George. When you’re an historically pathetic franchise like the Clippers you tend to bend like that.

I really do believe the Clippers took delight in screwing over the Spurs. The media did too. But you know how it goes when you start digging graves for others.

I think the Clippers happily paid that extortiinate price because they were full of themselves. Where else was Kawhi going to go? They could have brought the price down.

[Mr. Body]

Spurs - Yo this shit chronic af, we gonna need to manage the fuck outta them legs.

Nephew/Uncle Dennis - The 9th Dr. we consulted assures us that you, and the first 8 Drs. don't know wtf you are talking about.



Fuck the media, Clippers and every casual mf who actually bought that shit.

I have nothing but glee to see Balmer and the Leonard family crash and burn. I just don't want those OKC draft picks to be too juicy.

[koriwhat]

Appreciate you proving my point. Shouldn’t you be out grooming 5 year olds?

Keep projecting you fucking weirdo. You ooze of estrogen you fucking loser.

[BacktoBasics]

Keep projecting you fucking weirdo. You ooze of estrogen you fucking loser.

What? No flex? No stories about how awesome you are?

[steak n eggs]

I was pretty annoyed when he and his uncle pulled their little stunt a few years back. But in retrospect, I'm glad it happened. He hasn't been the same player since his Toronto days. At least I'm fully aware the current Spurs suck and won't be winning anything anytime soon as opposed to holding onto some false hope that Kawhi can stay healthy.

[baseline bum]

But they did that to land Kawhi. He demanded Paul George. When you’re an historically pathetic franchise like the Clippers you tend to bend like that.

I really do believe the Clippers took delight in screwing over the Spurs. The media did too. But you know how it goes when you start digging graves for others.

The Spurs were already long screwed over before the Clippers recruited him away from Toronto. I don't blame the Clippers for going all out for a title. You gotta take those kind of chances. If Leonard wasn't being a faggot the whole 2017-18 season I would have wanted the Spurs to offer him the supermax because title shots are so hard to come by and would have absolutely supported trading away Murray and a bunch of draft capital to get George to make a run at another title.

[Dex]

Lol load management is injured again. Shocker


We mistook his shyness for humility. Dude has a large ego that apparently his knees can't support.

All of this is vindication for the Spurs.

Kawhi got pissy because the Spurs doctors properly diagnosed his chronic leg injuries...so he demanded his trade.

Yes, he limped his way to a championship with Toronto, but since then has been a hobbled player. PATFO was right not to give this guy a supermax contract

[daslicer]

This is pretty much why I got over Kawhi leaving the Spurs a few years ago. He's too injury prone and you just never know when he's going to play. It would have been a pain in the ass to deal with this type of uncertainty if he was still with the Spurs. I do still believe the Spurs would have gotten 1 more title out of him if he played out his contract with them. That Raptors' title in '19 would have been the Spurs title if he didn't leave.

[heyheymymy]

pretty crazy that Paul George hasn't played a game since march 21st

man they can't get either of this duo on the court and healthy at the same time

[Mr. Body]

pretty crazy that Paul George hasn't played a game since march 21st

man they can't get either of this duo on the court and healthy at the same time

You can't fail if you don't play.

[spursparker9]

If nephew has healthy knees, could be the 2nd coming of MJ.

[slick'81]

pretty crazy that Paul George hasn't played a game since march 21st

man they can't get either of this duo on the court and healthy at the same time


two guys who would be unstoppable if their knees didnt fall apart

[Seventyniner]

If the Spurs had held on to Number Two and given him the supermax, what would his contract status be right now?

I'm thinking that it's possible he would be making $45M this year and agitating for an extension or a huge new contract.

The most important ability is availability. As great of a player Number Two is, would he be worth an extended supermax given what we know about that availability?

[Mr. Body]

Kawhi Leonard abandons teams. It's what he does.

[ducks]

If the Spurs had held on to Number Two and given him the supermax, what would his contract status be right now?

I'm thinking that it's possible he would be making $45M this year and agitating for an extension or a huge new contract.

The most important ability is availability. As great of a player Number Two is, would he be worth an extended supermax given what we know about that availability?

No he plays 20 games a year
He is a very sissy player
Does not care about basketball just wants $

[baseline bum]

If the Spurs had held on to Number Two and given him the supermax, what would his contract status be right now?

I'm thinking that it's possible he would be making $45M this year and agitating for an extension or a huge new contract.

The most important ability is availability. As great of a player Number Two is, would he be worth an extended supermax given what we know about that availability?

I would have given him supermax in 2019 had he not acted like a faggot in 2018 and taken the chance he could be healthy enough to win a title. Definitely wouldn't give him anything close to a max extension in summer 2024 when he's 32 though knowing how these last four years have gone.

[wildbill2u]

Kwahi averaged playing 49 games per season while he was with the Spurs. Ironic fact, his best two seasons for games played were with the Spurs (72 &74). Since leaving the Spurs he has averaged only 44 games per season. Considering the regular season has 82 games, his participation value to his team has never been of the "iron man" variety. Perhaps his goal each year is simply to play enough to get to the playoffs, but that doesn't seem like the attitude of a Super Star or even a seriously competitive player unless he is playing with injury.

Some of us have experienced knee injuries and know how much effort it takes to rehab or play through pain, so I am giving Kwahi the benefit of the doubt about his injuries. If all he can do is play about 50% of the games, then that's his limit and it affects his career legacy.

[slick'81]

https://youtu.be/nrqC4P4paFo

[koriwhat]

What? No flex? No stories about how awesome you are?

What stories have I ever told here to fluff myself you puto? Do tell... You're so bent out of shape because I'm not in your cult you fucking loser. Go play in traffic already and do us all a favor.

[spurs10]

Why wasn't I surprised Kawhi was out. He probably has vacation plans in early May.

[Mr. Body]

Why wasn't I surprised Kawhi was out. He probably has vacation plans in early May.

Uncle Dennis needed him to mow the lawn.

[JPB]

Did he blame Clips doctors this time around?

[slick'81]

Stephen A called kawhi one of the worst nba superstars ever

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Can't lose if you don't play.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Stephen A called kawhi one of the worst nba superstars ever

Just watched Stephen A's commentary on this, and for once, he's not wrong.

[Mr. Body]

ESPN is annoyed they spent all that effort steering him to a Los Angeles team only for him to pull these stunts.

[rjv]

. . . and yet not one peep from the media that the spurs were right all along.

[slick'81]

. . . and yet not one peep from the media that the spurs were right all along.


Everyone now knows what a dickhead he is

[spurs10]

Uncle Dennis needed him to mow the lawn. :rollin


Stephen A called kawhi one of the worst nba superstars ever Yup


Can't lose if you don't play. He's very good at this 'not playing' concept.

[Jordan Jackson]

That Stephen A rant came from the Clippers front office. He was very specific about behaviour - not necessarily his play or lack there of. They will do him like they did Blake Griffin.

[offset formation]

No he plays 20 games a year
He is a very sissy player
Does not care about basketball just wants $

I detest the guy but this is just stupid. If he was that way he'd be raking in waaaay more money in advertising than he does instead of largely just doing ads for his shoe brand. And as it is, advertising dollars as we all know have the potential to dwarf nba contract dollars. It's why MJ and LeBron are now billionaires.

He's an LA Homer and always has his eyes set on playing at home. He fucked the Spurs in that effort instead of doing it the right way, and I'll never forgive him for it. But he's no money grubber.

[BacktoBasics]

What stories have I ever told here to fluff myself you puto? Do tell... You're so bent out of shape because I'm not in your cult you fucking loser. Go play in traffic already and do us all a favor.

Calm down. You don’t want to sound so unhinged. The deep state might take your guns away if you don’t dial it back a notch or two.

[poopbox]

Mute out for game 4 :rollin

Where is the clip of where he actually hurt his knee :rollin

[timtonymanu]

Officially ruled out for Game 4.

Story of the Clippers. They look like a title team but always fall short cause their star players are injured. And of course the one season when they are healthy, they choke against Denver. :lol

[buttsR4rebounding]

Surely Westbrook can pick up the slack.

[Mr. Body]

His knees will be pudding by the time he's 40.

[tonight...you]

His knees will be pudding by the time he's 40.
He's already got his Rascal scooter modded out.

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/05/02/article-2318098-19925FE5000005DC-756_634x760.jpg

[Ice009]

Wow. Out again for game 4. Is this guy really this soft, or are the injuries legit and it just being bad luck? Is he doing this because Paul George is out too knowing he can't fully be blamed due to George having the same injury and already being out a while?

[slick'81]

Wow. Out again for game 4. Is this guy really this soft, or are the injuries legit and it just being bad luck? Is he doing this because Paul George is out too knowing he can't fully be blamed due to George having the same injury and already being out a while?

they say its a legit sprain unrelated to his acl tear but who knows?

[lefty20]

Nephew legs cannot handle the consistent heavy work that's required from a bona fide Championship caliber #1 option.

His legs were visibly shot at the end of his Chip run with the Raps. They were just fortunate enough to play a team decimated by injuries.

Bro played like shit in games 6 & 7 against the Nuggets, on both ends.

Clips can load-manage him all they want. They can ramp him all they want. His legs will inevitably fail him in the playoffs.

Death, taxes & nephew's legs giving out...

[spursparker9]

Toronto is really lucky to squeeze Nephew his last juice in 2019 :lol:lol:lol

Recalled that Nephew was already limping during that ECF series against MIL but somehow he managed to play through it.

[ducks]

Wow. Out again for game 4. Is this guy really this soft, or are the injuries legit and it just being bad luck? Is he doing this because Paul George is out too knowing he can't fully be blamed due to George having the same injury and already being out a while?


I trade him for a Someone that can actually play
Half on the dollar is all he playoffs now

[ducks]

His knees will be pudding by the time he's 40.

Maybe he can get a handout for all the free money in cal and not work for it.
Heard sf wants to give black people 6 million for being black

[Arcadian]

It's weird to me how Kawhi's latest injury is getting him so much hate and vitriol, as if his bad knees are the result of some flaw in his character. Obviously it hurts his value as a player and his legacy, but it's not like he wants this to happen. He's more devastated about it than you are, no doubt. Unless you think he's just being a pussy and his injury isn't bad enough to keep him from playing, I don't see why he should be shitted on quite so much.

[Teamduncan21]

It's weird to me how Kawhi's latest injury is getting him so much hate and vitriol, as if his bad knees are the result of some flaw in his character. Obviously it hurts his value as a player and his legacy, but it's not like he wants this to happen. He's more devastated about it than you are, no doubt. Unless you think he's just being a pussy and his injury isn't bad enough to keep him from playing, I don't see why he should be shitted on quite so much.
Because he refused to accept spurs doctors diagnosis. Which basically says his quad will not hold up in the long run and need to have less playing time.
The whole mess started with that. And in the end spurs doctor is right.
So yes the bad character started after the disagreement with the doctors

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

It's weird to me how Kawhi's latest injury is getting him so much hate and vitriol, as if his bad knees are the result of some flaw in his character. Obviously it hurts his value as a player and his legacy, but it's not like he wants this to happen. He's more devastated about it than you are, no doubt. Unless you think he's just being a pussy and his injury isn't bad enough to keep him from playing, I don't see why he should be shitted on quite so much.

For Spurs fans it's vindication because there's no doubt now that the Spurs diagnosed him correctly years ago. It led him to go seek other doctors, hide from the team and ruin his trade value, which hurt the Spurs leverage.

Now years later we're seeing all of this playing out. He was never someone who'd play even through a minor discomfort, which is why people question his current injury, but the truth is that his knees are shot and it's not his fault. What's his fault is that, allegedly, the CLippers players and even coaches aren't in the loop about when he's playing or missing games, why and so on. They're just told by the snake's camp and if true, this must be frustrating for everyone working with him.

[exstatic]

It's weird to me how Kawhi's latest injury is getting him so much hate and vitriol, as if his bad knees are the result of some flaw in his character. Obviously it hurts his value as a player and his legacy, but it's not like he wants this to happen. He's more devastated about it than you are, no doubt. Unless you think he's just being a pussy and his injury isn't bad enough to keep him from playing, I don't see why he should be shitted on quite so much.

Karma

[vander]

Surely Westbrook can pick up the slack.

I used to hate Westbrook so much
now I think it's sad that Kawhi has 2 rings and Westbrook 0

[baseline bum]

It's weird to me how Kawhi's latest injury is getting him so much hate and vitriol, as if his bad knees are the result of some flaw in his character. Obviously it hurts his value as a player and his legacy, but it's not like he wants this to happen. He's more devastated about it than you are, no doubt. Unless you think he's just being a pussy and his injury isn't bad enough to keep him from playing, I don't see why he should be shitted on quite so much.

The hate and vitriol are because of his character, namely going AWOL on the Spurs. And it's funny he keeps getting these injuries we never even see. Pretty rare in most players but it's a constant with him. For all we know it could just be Uncle Dennis in his ear telling him not to play through any pain, scared to lose his cash cow.

[Dejounte]

It's weird to me how Kawhi's latest injury is getting him so much hate and vitriol, as if his bad knees are the result of some flaw in his character. Obviously it hurts his value as a player and his legacy, but it's not like he wants this to happen. He's more devastated about it than you are, no doubt. Unless you think he's just being a pussy and his injury isn't bad enough to keep him from playing, I don't see why he should be shitted on quite so much.

This goes beyond the injury. If you listen to Stephen A Smith’s rant, the criticism is about Kawhi’s unavailability off the court and lack of leadership is the problem.

[TD 21]

Good thing, because the Clippers were going to win this series, get George back and probably go to the Finals as long as Scumbag mostly played throughout.


For Spurs fans it's vindication because there's no doubt now that the Spurs diagnosed him correctly years ago. It led him to go seek other doctors, hide from the team and ruin his trade value, which hurt the Spurs leverage.

Now years later we're seeing all of this playing out. He was never someone who'd play even through a minor discomfort, which is why people question his current injury, but the truth is that his knees are shot and it's not his fault. What's his fault is that, allegedly, the CLippers players and even coaches aren't in the loop about when he's playing or missing games, why and so on. They're just told by the snake's camp and if true, this must be frustrating for everyone working with him.

Finally something we can agree on. :tu

[lefty20]

1649812436000571394

[Mr. Body]

I used to hate Westbrook so much
now I think it's sad that Kawhi has 2 rings and Westbrook 0

From what I understand and hear about Westbrook, he's a good dude. Like, drops huge tips on servers, that sort of thing. Kawhi Leonard is just an asshole.

[Mr. Body]

This goes beyond the injury. If you listen to Stephen A Smith’s rant, the criticism is about Kawhi’s unavailability off the court and lack of leadership is the problem.

Westbrook has become the leader of the Clippers because George and Leonard are complete non-entities in the actually-talk-to-people and be-a-leader categories.

[koriwhat]

Calm down. You don’t want to sound so unhinged. The deep state might take your guns away if you don’t dial it back a notch or two.

Just like I thought... You can't back up any of your mentally ill aberrations. You're a fucking spineless loon B2B. :lmao

[JPB]

Westbrook has become the leader of the Clippers because George and Leonard are complete non-entities in the actually-talk-to-people and be-a-leader categories.

Westbrook can be critized for a lot of things but he always had the competitiveness for him. He's a warrior on the court and I'm pretty sure only a broken leg could keep him out of a PO game.

[RC_Drunkford]

he wanted to play in LA but has never played 1 playoff game in LA :lmao :lmao

[Degoat]

Must be old news but I don’t remember it lol Kawhi’s sister got life in prison for murder

[JPB]

Just saw one of Kawhi's siters was sentenced to life for the murder an elderly woman in a Southern California casino in 2019.

[Spurs Homer]

It's weird to me how Kawhi's latest injury is getting him so much hate and vitriol, as if his bad knees are the result of some flaw in his character. Obviously it hurts his value as a player and his legacy, but it's not like he wants this to happen. He's more devastated about it than you are, no doubt. Unless you think he's just being a pussy and his injury isn't bad enough to keep him from playing, I don't see why he should be shitted on quite so much.

You must not be a spurs fan then.

He fucking betrayed the spurs.
Spurs medical staff correctly diagnosed him - and he accused them of misdiagnosing him.
He sat out and sat out and sat out and refused to communicate.
Then he - said he had his own doctors.
Then he said he was working out privately in fuckin new york or philly or somewhere = NOT IN SAN ANTONIO
Then he didnt have the decency to SIT ON THE FUCKING SPURS BENCH while the real spurs players who had their own aches and bruises were faithfully supporting their team.
Demands a trade. Tanks his own value so the spurs cannot even get a good star player.
Ends up never fulfilling his contract but took the fucking money while he chilled all over the usa and then ends up in toronto?

Fuck that piece of shit.

[offset formation]

Just saw one of Kawhi's siters was sentenced to life for the murder an elderly woman in a Southern California casino in 2019.

Not sure what happened there but shehadavery lengthy criminal rapsheet full of robbery and theft type ofoffensesbefore she killed that old lady robbing her. Wonder if some of nephew's millions were not available to her. Or of it would have even mattered. Not sure if they are full or half siblings.

[heyheymymy]

Okay who is winning this ring this year?

MIL looks like shit, GSW looks dunzo, PHX maybe but they seem flawed albeit deeper than before, PHI already has Embiid at 50% and it's only the first round, LAC is dunzo, SAC seems too underpowered perhaps?

Maybe BOS beats DEN 4-2 or something? Help me out here, let's hear some calls on the initial vibe as we have the first round slightly underway here.

[Ice009]

Must be old news but I don’t remember it lol Kawhi’s sister got life in prison for murder

How many sisters does he have? I remember one used to run his social media account when he was with the Spurs? Is it a different sister?

[Mr. Body]

Okay who is winning this ring this year?

MIL looks like shit, GSW looks dunzo, PHX maybe but they seem flawed albeit deeper than before, PHI already has Embiid at 50% and it's only the first round, LAC is dunzo, SAC seems too underpowered perhaps?

Maybe BOS beats DEN 4-2 or something? Help me out here, let's hear some calls on the initial vibe as we have the first round slightly underway here.

Boston vs. GSW again with the Warriors winning again.

Boston is one of the most boring teams I've ever tried to watch. Iso, iso, iso. Just garbage to watch.

Warriors had one of the cheapest championships ever last year because the league is so shit right now. Their experience carried them through. Phoenix imploded, etc. The way the sports media rallied around Draymond's thuggery leads me to believe the league really wants them to win it again.

I'd like it to be Denver just to screw them.

[baseline bum]

Must be old news but I don’t remember it lol Kawhi’s sister got life in prison for murder


Just saw one of Kawhi's siters was sentenced to life for the murder an elderly woman in a Southern California casino in 2019.

https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=281085

[heyheymymy]

Agreed Mr Body

GSW comes back to SAC knotted up and the Kings will fold on inexperience

[heyheymymy]

Can't imagine BOS being dealt another Finals loss though. From a media preserving legacy standpoint.

[baseline bum]

Okay who is winning this ring this year?

MIL looks like shit, GSW looks dunzo, PHX maybe but they seem flawed albeit deeper than before, PHI already has Embiid at 50% and it's only the first round, LAC is dunzo, SAC seems too underpowered perhaps?

Maybe BOS beats DEN 4-2 or something? Help me out here, let's hear some calls on the initial vibe as we have the first round slightly underway here.

Not at all impressed with Phoenix, they should be crushing the Clippers. With Giannis such a question mark I really think this could be Denver's year. Can't see the Celtics matching up well with them at all.

[Mr. Body]

Can't imagine BOS being dealt another Finals loss though. From a media preserving legacy standpoint.

Last year they were the least clutch team in the playoffs. They were awful down the stretch. No surprise, given their pathetic offense system. Not sure about the clutch numbers this year.

[Mr. Body]

Not at all impressed with Phoenix, they should be crushing the Clippers. With Giannis such a question mark I really think this could be Denver's year. Can't see the Celtics matching up well with them at all.

Agree about Phoenix. They're still the awful chemistry, no-show team that lost by like 50 in the clenching game last year. Durant is a spineless frontrunner.

I'd love to see Denver slaughter the Warriors, who have barely played any teams with dominant centers. But Draymond will jam his fingers into Jokic's eye sockets once again and the media will adore him for it.

[baseline bum]

Boston vs. GSW again with the Warriors winning again.

Boston is one of the most boring teams I've ever tried to watch. Iso, iso, iso. Just garbage to watch.

Warriors had one of the cheapest championships ever last year because the league is so shit right now. Their experience carried them through. Phoenix imploded, etc. The way the sports media rallied around Draymond's thuggery leads me to believe the league really wants them to win it again.

I'd like it to be Denver just to screw them.

Golden State's road record was only 3 games better than the tanking Spurs'. Doesn't seem to bode well for them winning four series where they'd likely have homecourt in none of them.

[Mr. Body]

Golden State's road record was only 3 games better than the tanking Spurs'. Doesn't seem to bode well for them winning four series where they'd likely have homecourt in none of them.

It just takes the NBArefs to gift them one away game, and they're facing a weak lot of Western Conference losers. Only Denver looks somewhat formidable but they're completely untested and thin at all positions. Hell, the West is so bad even the Lakers could make it through. And the reaction to Draymond implies the league offices have greenlit pushing everything in the Warriors' direction.

[KobesAchilles]

I’m glad I was right about not wanting to suoermax Kawhi way back in the day. I was the only idiot saying we shouldn’t give it to him bc he wouldn’t be worth it and BAM looks like everything worked out for us.

Also it’s hilarious watching mainstream media turn on Kawhi. I was watching The Herd and Colin had a 8 minute monologue on literally everything Spurs fans and Pop were saying 5 years ago. Kawhi isn’t vocal, he’s not a leader in the locker room, he ghosts management, he won’t play through any pain, his knees are shot, and the juice isn’t worth the squeeze with him. 5 years ago Colin blasted the Spurs for saying the exact same things he is saying today. Same with Stephen A.

[baseline bum]

I’m glad I was right about not wanting to suoermax Kawhi way back in the day. I was the only idiot saying we shouldn’t give it to him bc he wouldn’t be worth it and BAM looks like everything worked out for us.

Also it’s hilarious watching mainstream media turn on Kawhi. I was watching The Herd and Colin had a 8 minute monologue on literally everything Spurs fans and Pop were saying 5 years ago. Kawhi isn’t vocal, he’s not a leader in the locker room, he ghosts management, he won’t play through any pain, his knees are shot, and the juice isn’t worth the squeeze with him. 5 years ago Colin blasted the Spurs for saying the exact same things he is saying today. Same with Stephen A.

Because he's doing it to LA now and LA matters to the national media. San Antonio doesn't mean shit to them.

[Mr. Body]

Lol, Memphis down 35-9 in the first quarter. They were supposed to be a menacing team. What a lot of frontrunning pansies.

[baseline bum]

It just takes the NBArefs to gift them one away game, and they're facing a weak lot of Western Conference losers. Only Denver looks somewhat formidable but they're completely untested and thin at all positions. Hell, the West is so bad even the Lakers could make it through. And the reaction to Draymond implies the league offices have greenlit pushing everything in the Warriors' direction.

I just don't see that team flipping the switch like the 95 Rockets or 01 Lakers. I have such a hard time seeing a team that only managed 11 road wins winning a title. Though with Memphis shitting the bed their second round matchup certainly looks a lot easier should they get through Sacramento.

[heyheymymy]

lol now that Kawhi's camp has packed him in and shelved him before he damages his brand marketability cred we should see LAL suddenly powerhouse up since ESPN needs at least one Los Angeles market team doing well to push units. Might be Lebrons last jersey selling efforts as well.

[TD 21]

Okay who is winning this ring this year?

MIL looks like shit, GSW looks dunzo, PHX maybe but they seem flawed albeit deeper than before, PHI already has Embiid at 50% and it's only the first round, LAC is dunzo, SAC seems too underpowered perhaps?

Maybe BOS beats DEN 4-2 or something? Help me out here, let's hear some calls on the initial vibe as we have the first round slightly underway here.

The Suns are paper thin. Given current health statuses, Celtics vs Nuggets is the safest bet.

Yet I don't feel confident in them or any team (Celtics lack an MVP caliber player/go-to playmaker, are heavily reliant on 3's and R. Williams' durability or lack thereof; Nuggets have no second star, a mediocre defense and go about 6.5 deep).

[Barfunk]

Spurs in the right like I knew from the jump. ESPN and the mainstream sports media tried their damndest to make the Spurs look like the bad guy when all this Uncle Fucker stuff started back in 2018.

[Mr. Body]

The Suns are paper thin. Given current health statuses, Celtics vs Nuggets is the safest bet.

Yet I don't feel confident in them or any team (Celtics lack an MVP caliber player/go-to playmaker, are heavily reliant on 3's and R. Williams' durability or lack thereof; Nuggets have no second star, a mediocre defense and go about 6.5 deep).

Every single team in the NBA right now would get wrecked in a real era.

[daslicer]

I’m glad I was right about not wanting to suoermax Kawhi way back in the day. I was the only idiot saying we shouldn’t give it to him bc he wouldn’t be worth it and BAM looks like everything worked out for us.

Also it’s hilarious watching mainstream media turn on Kawhi. I was watching The Herd and Colin had a 8 minute monologue on literally everything Spurs fans and Pop were saying 5 years ago. Kawhi isn’t vocal, he’s not a leader in the locker room, he ghosts management, he won’t play through any pain, his knees are shot, and the juice isn’t worth the squeeze with him. 5 years ago Colin blasted the Spurs for saying the exact same things he is saying today. Same with Stephen A.

I also said he didn't deserve the super max back then. I felt I got lambasted the most for saying that in here back then if you look at the old Kawhi thread that was a thousand pages long during the '17-'18 season.

The media supporting him was predictable. They all wanted him to go to the Lakers and were desperate for the Lakers to be relevant. Granted he went to the Clippers but originally the Lakers were Kawhi's target up until Lebron went there in summer of '18. Them turning against him is predictable like others have said since he's not succeeding in LA they are pissed off at him about it considering they derive a lot of pleasure and money off of LA teams doing well.

[daslicer]

Spurs in the right like I knew from the jump. ESPN and the mainstream sports media tried their damndest to make the Spurs look like the bad guy when all this Uncle Fucker stuff started back in 2018.

ESPN and national media jumped to new lows in my eyes in 2018. They were always biased but they jumped the shark with their gaslighting of that situation when they would go ham on the Spurs by making up a bunch of nonsense to discredit them. The money has to be pretty good for these guys to constantly kiss LA's ass and even lie outrageously to get players to come there.

[daslicer]

I just don't see that team flipping the switch like the 95 Rockets or 01 Lakers. I have such a hard time seeing a team that only managed 11 road wins winning a title. Though with Memphis shitting the bed their second round matchup certainly looks a lot easier should they get through Sacramento.

They have a chance of fluking their way to the WCF if they somehow end up playing the Lakers in round 2. Just like you said I don't think they are as good as the '95 Rockets that were in the same position as them seeding wise. Hakeem went on God mode during that run and that was also the last run where Clyde was a legit superstar.

[daslicer]

Toronto is really lucky to squeeze Nephew his last juice in 2019 :lol:lol:lol

Recalled that Nephew was already limping during that ECF series against MIL but somehow he managed to play through it.

It still pissed me off the Spurs didn't trade Kawhi to the Hornets for Kemba. I had no interest in Kemba, but I knew Kawhi would have failed in Charlotte in the sense he would not have had talent around him to lead them to a title like he did with the Raptors. Imagine how Kawhi's legacy looks if he plays a failed year in Charlotte instead of winning a title in 2019. When he reflects on his career, he should be thankful to the Spurs for doing his legacy a solid by sending him to a place to win a second title that enabled him to be a 75 greatest player and HOFer.

[Barfunk]

ESPN and national media jumped to new lows in my eyes in 2018. They were always biased but they jumped the shark with their gaslighting of that situation when they would go ham on the Spurs by making up a bunch of nonsense to discredit them. The money has to be pretty good for these guys to constantly kiss LA's ass and even lie outrageously to get players to come there.

That's what they were doing for sure. I mean ESPN hates the Spurs and San Antonio as it is, but it was a golden opportunity for them to slander the organization and help eventually pry Kawhi outta SA and get him on an LA team.

[daslicer]

That's what they were doing for sure. I mean ESPN hates the Spurs and San Antonio as it is, but it was a golden opportunity for them to slander the organization and help eventually pry Kawhi outta SA and into an LA team.

I always wonder why these media guys live and die with LA being great. It's like their happiness depends on it especially a clown like Stephen A. He acts like a young 20-year-old college kid ready to go on spring break every time a LA or Miami team is in the finals. You just don't see this type of nonsense in the NFL. For example, you can have a Superbowl such as Green Bay vs Buffalo and nobody would have a panic attack about it even though those 2 markets are small and are not desirable places to go to.

I would love to see a Denver vs Milwaukee finals just to see him and ESPN have a meltdown.

[baseline bum]

I always wonder why these media guys live and die with LA being great. It's like their happiness depends on it especially a clown like Stephen A. He acts like a young 20-year-old college kid ready to go on spring break every time a LA or Miami team is in the finals. You just don't see this type of nonsense in the NFL. For example, you can have a Superbowl such as Green Bay vs Buffalo and nobody would have a panic attack about it even though those 2 markets are small and are not desirable places to go to.

I would love to see a Denver vs Milwaukee finals just to see him and ESPN have a meltdown.

Stephen A was one of the few in the media calling out Leonard and his piece of shit uncle in 2018.

[baseline bum]

Every single team in the NBA right now would get wrecked in a real era.

Milwaukee would be pretty legit if Giannis wasn't injured IMO. Thought they were runaway title favorites until the injury.

[daslicer]

Stephen A was one of the few in the media calling out Leonard and his piece of shit uncle in 2018.

He may have questioned Kawhi's injury at the start, but he definitely sided with him towards the end of the 2018. He comes across as a dumbass citing Stephen Jackson as a legit credible source on the Spurs situation regarding Kawhi in this clip.

utx1Op_2kXA

[baseline bum]

They have a chance of fluking their way to the WCF if they somehow end up playing the Lakers in round 2. Just like you said I don't think they are as good as the '95 Rockets that were in the same position as them seeding wise. Hakeem went on God mode during that run and that was also the last run where Clyde was a legit superstar.

They definitely do if they can survive Sacramento, but they don't look anything like last year's team who was elite defensively while this one is a little below average statistically. I think they'd probably beat the Lakers but even getting a gift like that I wouldn't consider a WCF a given conditioning on them actually beating the Kings first.

[daslicer]

They definitely do if they can survive Sacramento, but they don't look anything like last year's team who was elite defensively while this one is a little below average statistically. I think they'd probably beat the Lakers but even getting a gift like that I wouldn't consider a WCF a given conditioning on them actually beating the Kings first.

I think the Kings will also lose game 4 to them. They don't have the experience and poise yet to beat them in a hostile environment as Chase. It's going to come down to game 5. If kings win game 5 they will in the series in 7 if they don't then it's over.

I agree I think they are worse than last year. If the Kings don't beat them, I do think they will eventually lose to either the Nuggets or Suns. I think they would beat the Lakers since I don't think the Lakers are a good team, they just look good due to the Grizzlies recent injuries. Lakers still are a true 7th seed in my eyes.

[baseline bum]

I think the Kings will also lose game 4 to them. They don't have the experience and poise yet to beat them in a hostile environment as Chase. It's going to come down to game 5. If kings win game 5 they will in the series in 7 if they don't then it's over.

I agree I think they are worse than last year. If the Kings don't beat them, I do think they will eventually lose to either the Nuggets or Suns. I think they would beat the Lakers since I don't think the Lakers are a good team, they just look good due to the Grizzlies recent injuries. Lakers still are a true 7th seed in my eyes.

I think the Warriors are like a true 7th or 8th seed in my eyes tbh, Lakers more like a true 8th or 9th. Just a shit year for the west where 44 wins can get you the 5-6 seed.

[spursparker9]

It still pissed me off the Spurs didn't trade Kawhi to the Hornets for Kemba. I had no interest in Kemba, but I knew Kawhi would have failed in Charlotte in the sense he would not have had talent around him to lead them to a title like he did with the Raptors. Imagine how Kawhi's legacy looks if he plays a failed year in Charlotte instead of winning a title in 2019. When he reflects on his career, he should be thankful to the Spurs for doing his legacy a solid by sending him to a place to win a second title that enabled him to be a 75 greatest player and HOFer.


Yea....that 2019 title with Toronto gave Nephew a lot of benefit of doubts.

If he didn't win that title and as the FMVP, many teams would have shunned him already.

His 2019 title is keeping him in the league tbh.

Similar to Kyrie Irving hitting that 3 over Steph in that Game 7 in 2016 that keep people still kinda "believing in him"

[KobesAchilles]

The WC is so weak now it’s ridiculous. Imagine if we had the prime big 3 in this era. We would 5peat. Instead back in 07 the 8th seed won 49 fucking games.

[TD 21]

It still pissed me off the Spurs didn't trade Kawhi to the Hornets for Kemba. I had no interest in Kemba, but I knew Kawhi would have failed in Charlotte in the sense he would not have had talent around him to lead them to a title like he did with the Raptors. Imagine how Kawhi's legacy looks if he plays a failed year in Charlotte instead of winning a title in 2019. When he reflects on his career, he should be thankful to the Spurs for doing his legacy a solid by sending him to a place to win a second title that enabled him to be a 75 greatest player and HOFer.

Either something like that or not traded him at all after he intentionally tanked his value while his sleazebag uncle publicly slandered the organization.

Not to relitigate it for the umpteenth time, but even given the context, I'll never understand how one of the following didn't occur if it was going to be the Craptors: 1) Gasol's albatross instead of Green or 2) Green, with Anunoby coming back. Still discount prices, but more palatable.

[offset formation]

Stephen A was one of the few in the media calling out Leonard and his piece of shit uncle in 2018.

Nick Wright did too for a little bit. Actually don't recall SAS being critical but if you do I guess he was. Other than that it was very one sided in support of letting neph fuck the Spurs

[Harry Callahan]

A lose lose situation in retrospect with KL. Nephew tanks his value so the recipient of his services is not gutted. Let's be honest, the sports media (esp ESPN) gaslights by way of ESPN all the time. Clicks and eyeballs baby.

Leonard would probably never sign a supermax with the Spurs and he literally stole $20MM in the 2017 season with the nine appearances.

He truly averaged about 60-65 games per year when the 2017 season (a farce anyway) is removed. A wonderful player when healthy - just like Bill Walton. "Dollar Bill" took the San Diego Clippers for a ride too.

[Maddog]

two guys who would be unstoppable if their knees didnt fall apart

Despite Paul George's horrific injury- I'm n

[Maddog]

Yea....that 2019 title with Toronto gave Nephew a lot of benefit of doubts.

If he didn't win that title and as the FMVP, many teams would have shunned him already.

His 2019 title is keeping him in the league tbh.

Similar to Kyrie Irving hitting that 3 over Steph in that Game 7 in 2016 that keep people still kinda "believing in him"

And how flukey was that title?
All title teams have some luck on their side and nephew played great, but they really caught a lot of breaks
Win in 7 versus the Sixers when Embiid was playing through illness
Won a double OT game against the Bucks that if lost would have put them down 3-0
Met an injury riddled GSW in finals

[spursparker9]

And how flukey was that title?
All title teams have some luck on their side and nephew played great, but they really caught a lot of breaks
Win in 7 versus the Sixers when Embiid was playing through illness
Won a double OT game against the Bucks that if lost would have put them down 3-0
Met an injury riddled GSW in finals

Excluding the Finals which KD and Klay was out, it was a tough series against 76s and Bucks.

Nephew was showing signs of limping throughout Bucks series but still managed to play through. He looked relatively okay against GSW and was no one from GSW could guard him.

[Arcadian]

You must not be a spurs fan then.

He fucking betrayed the spurs.
Spurs medical staff correctly diagnosed him - and he accused them of misdiagnosing him.
He sat out and sat out and sat out and refused to communicate.
Then he - said he had his own doctors.
Then he said he was working out privately in fuckin new york or philly or somewhere = NOT IN SAN ANTONIO
Then he didnt have the decency to SIT ON THE FUCKING SPURS BENCH while the real spurs players who had their own aches and bruises were faithfully supporting their team.
Demands a trade. Tanks his own value so the spurs cannot even get a good star player.
Ends up never fulfilling his contract but took the fucking money while he chilled all over the usa and then ends up in toronto?

Fuck that piece of shit.
Oh I completely get it from a Spurs fan perspective :lol (Spurs fan since the mid-90s here)

I was talking specifically about this new injury, and was more surprised that the hate started leaking out into mainstream media and non-Spursfan.

For people who already hated him, this is just another opportunity to shit on the guy. It's just funny how this latest injury was apparently the last straw for a bunch of people that finally made them turn on him :lol (when ironically, his current injury is likely genuine, and he's actually showing up to the games unlike 2018...so this is a weird time to start hating him).

[baseline bum]

Oh I completely get it from a Spurs fan perspective :lol (Spurs fan since the mid-90s here)

I was talking specifically about this new injury, and was more surprised that the hate started leaking out into mainstream media and non-Spursfan.

For people who already hated him, this is just another opportunity to shit on the guy. It's just funny how this latest injury was apparently the last straw for a bunch of people that finally made them turn on him :lol (when ironically, his current injury is likely genuine, and he's actually showing up to the games unlike 2018...so this is a weird time to start hating him).

Doesn't matter if what he was doing to the Spurs was way worse, he's doing it to LA now. Whole different ballgame after that same sports media beat the drum trying to get him to LA for two years.

[Spurs Homer]

Oh I completely get it from a Spurs fan perspective :lol (Spurs fan since the mid-90s here)

I was talking specifically about this new injury, and was more surprised that the hate started leaking out into mainstream media and non-Spursfan.

For people who already hated him, this is just another opportunity to shit on the guy. It's just funny how this latest injury was apparently the last straw for a bunch of people that finally made them turn on him :lol (when ironically, his current injury is likely genuine, and he's actually showing up to the games unlike 2018...so this is a weird time to start hating him).

yes- but the thing you might be missing is that this injury

is EXACTLY what spurs medical team diagnosed and are BEING PROVEN CORRECT for the world to see..

the spurs told him that this injury would HAVE TO BE MANAGED and was likely long term-
but the media, kawhitter, his team of morons and his fellators all called the spurs as

somehow being wrong or worse- dirty

so this in NOT a new injury

this is the result of kawhitter playing NORMAL minutes FOR ONCE

and just like before- ANYTIME HE GOES BEYOND 25- 28 mins in two games in a row he is going to feel this same injury

apparently when he went over 30-35 mins in game 1 and 2 - i knew it wouldnt be long before he cried and sat again

someone like kobe - whom i hated- would be playing thru this pain as he often did
but kawhi is a gigantic vagina

[spurs1990]

The WC is so weak now it’s ridiculous. Imagine if we had the prime big 3 in this era. We would 5peat. Instead back in 07 the 8th seed won 49 fucking games.

Derek Fisher and the Nowitski and-1 foul all that kept them from 5 peating for real

[KobesAchilles]

Derek Fisher and the Nowitski and-1 foul all that kept them from 5 peating for real
I honestly think we lose to the Pistons in 04. We just didn’t have the horses for it. Our role players shrank like little bitches. But I agree 06 we were one foul away from 3peating. Or if Horry could just hit a fucking open 3.

[Seventyniner]

The "what if" train goes both directions.

Horry missed a 3 at the end of game 5 in 2003 that would have won it for the Lakers. The Spurs had a 25 point lead late in the 3rd, and they might not have recovered from that collapse. That shot rattled around the rim and iirc Horry later said he was shocked it didn't go in.

Horry also hit that huge 3 in game 5 of the 2005 Finals.

Change those two shots around and the Spurs might not have had any titles between 1999 and 2007.

[Gagnrath]

Yea....that 2019 title with Toronto gave Nephew a lot of benefit of doubts.

If he didn't win that title and as the FMVP, many teams would have shunned him already.

His 2019 title is keeping him in the league tbh.

Similar to Kyrie Irving hitting that 3 over Steph in that Game 7 in 2016 that keep people still kinda "believing in him"

Big difference between out of the league, (which he wouldn't be) and a bench guy who is paid about mid level exception and averages about 10 minutes per game.

[DeRozan m8]

Nephew still copping that sweet basketball karma

Rot on the bench, cunt

[KobesAchilles]

I love Lue defending Kawhi. “It has to be a serious injury for him not to play. We’ve seen him play through injuries in the playoffs.” Lol when? Toronto? I wish someone pushed back at him.

[spursparker9]

I love Lue defending Kawhi. “It has to be a serious injury for him not to play. We’ve seen him play through injuries in the playoffs.” Lol when? Toronto? I wish someone pushed back at him.

Nephew was desperate during that lone year in Toronto as he had to prove that he wasn't "damaged good" after the fallout with Spurs and everyone doubting his long term health.

Now, Nephew can afford to simply refuse to play as he fully understand that he had proven his value by winning that FMVP and title in 2019. Teams will still offer him big money despite his request for load managements and stuff.

[The Truth #6]

As far as extracting money, he’s playing it beautifully. He probably should have retired already if he actually had to play games. So glad he’s not our headache anymore. But also can’t stand the guy for what he did to the small market Spurs.

[rjv]

I love Lue defending Kawhi. “It has to be a serious injury for him not to play. We’ve seen him play through injuries in the playoffs.” Lol when? Toronto? I wish someone pushed back at him.

or even follow up with "and why is this knee so injury prone? Were the Spurs right in saying he has a degenerative condition?"

[Maddog]

I love Lue defending Kawhi. “It has to be a serious injury for him not to play. We’ve seen him play through injuries in the playoffs.” Lol when? Toronto? I wish someone pushed back at him.

How come Lue doesn't know for certain if it's a serious injury?

[heyheymymy]

It has to be a serious injury for him not to play."

Reads more like veiled criticism

[Mr. Body]

How come Lue doesn't know for certain if it's a serious injury?

Because he doesn't talk to anyone, literally. He doesn't talk to the team doctors. He makes his own diagnoses. He doesn't talk to his teammates. He doesn't talk to his coach. I don't even get how he knows the plays.

[Ariel]

Kawhi is done and the Clippers are on the hook for 2 more years @ 88 M. Co-star Paul George will be 33 and a half by the time next season starts, and he's injured more often than not. The new CBA and its increased restriction on adding talent when over the 2nd tax apron hurts them further. They're f*cked beyond repair, and they owe their picks through '26 to either Houston or OKC. They should wake up and pull the plug.

For that you should unload Kawhi onto whichever desperate team out there is willing to take him on the delusional notion he'll get them over the hump, even a single, far out 2nd rounder is better than what they've got going right how. Then field offers for Paul George and recoup what you can, selling for picks won't do since they don't hold control over their picks, but he might get you back a couple interesting young players or picks you can further flip, call Atlanta, NY, Brooklyn, Philly, Toronto, Chicago, Charlotte, Sacramento, Golden State, Minnesota... take the best offer and move on. You can't bottom out, but you can try and follow in Brooklyn's footsteps and set back the clock.

[Mr. Body]

It just burns me that Presti is thought of as some genius when Jerry West made this colossal error in making that trade, essentially giving OKC enough for two great players when the Thunder were giving them only one.

[tonight...you]

Now it's being reported Kawhi has a torn meniscus.

[Mr. Body]

Diagnosed by Uncle Dennis and the rest of the fam.

[Leetonidas]

check out this thread: https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2285080

:lmao the stuff going on in LAC is hilarious. Lol at Kawhi ghosting his team mid game multiple times. what a cancerous situation. glad we moved on from this guy, fr

[barakz21]

check out this thread: https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2285080

:lmao the stuff going on in LAC is hilarious. Lol at Kawhi ghosting his team mid game multiple times. what a cancerous situation. glad we moved on from this guy, fr

Hilarious. Truly grateful we don’t have to deal with that headache anymore.

[Ariel]

It just burns me that Presti is thought of as some genius when Jerry West made this colossal error in making that trade, essentially giving OKC enough for two great players when the Thunder were giving them only one.
Presti's genius resides in smelling blood in the water and milking every ounce out of a favorable situation. Same goes for Ainge in the KG & Pierce to Brooklyn, and Gobert to Minnesota trades. The other party being desperate and idiotic is a necessary condition, but not sufficient for a rip off. You have to be shrewd and ruthless, and they are. Hats off to both Presti and Ainge for their trading skills, the best in the business.

[Mr. Body]

Presti's genius resides in smelling blood in the water and milking every ounce out of a favorable situation. Same goes for Ainge in the KG & Pierce to Brooklyn, and Gobert to Minnesota trades. The other party being desperate and idiotic is a necessary condition, but not sufficient for a rip off. You have to be shrewd and ruthless, and they are. Hats off to both Presti and Ainge for their trading skills, the best in the business.

Presti has done better with his non-lottery picks lately, but his career is littered with massive mistakes -- he's traded away some real winners on draft day. Sengun was a recent one. He gets a lot of swings of the bat coming up.

Ainge should get railed for trading away Conley to Minnesota and two good, very needed role-players to the Lakers for one single first round pick years from now. Just a massive failure there. He also killed Brooklyn and failed to win a championship with that haul. But what he got for Gobert and Mitchell is filthy. Those teams should be good for a while, though.

That trade from the Clippers to Thunder was just gross.

[spursparker9]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YE1IwKolRss

[RC_Drunkford]

check out this thread: https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2285080

:lmao the stuff going on in LAC is hilarious. Lol at Kawhi ghosting his team mid game multiple times. what a cancerous situation. glad we moved on from this guy, fr

straight comedy :lmao

[Ariel]

Presti has done better with his non-lottery picks lately, but his career is littered with massive mistakes -- he's traded away some real winners on draft day. Sengun was a recent one. He gets a lot of swings of the bat coming up.

Ainge should get railed for trading away Conley to Minnesota and two good, very needed role-players to the Lakers for one single first round pick years from now. Just a massive failure there. He also killed Brooklyn and failed to win a championship with that haul. But what he got for Gobert and Mitchell is filthy. Those teams should be good for a while, though.

That trade from the Clippers to Thunder was just gross.
Those are 2 separate things: I love Presti when it comes to making trades, but I also think he's massively overrated when it comes to drafting.
As for Ainge, I also didn't love the trade with Minnesota & the Lakers, that pick likely ends up underwhelming or not conveying. But his trading record overall is just ridiculous, he's several times in the "best trades ever" list.

[baseline bum]

Still think we should have been chanting "Kimesha Williams" when that faggot came to town

[Mr. Body]

Those are 2 separate things: I love Presti when it comes to making trades, but I also think he's massively overrated when it comes to drafting.
As for Ainge, I also didn't love the trade with Minnesota & the Lakers, that pick likely ends up underwhelming or not conveying. But his trading record overall is just ridiculous, he's several times in the "best trades ever" list.

Agree. Just saying after putting the Nets over a barrel with a ridiculous trade, he didn't get anything out of it. Again shows how shredding teams in trades is not the same as doing something with the assets.

[Texas_Ranger]

Hope the injury is career ending. He should focus on family anyway, so they dont all become murderers like his sister or murdered like his father.... at least uncle is still here.

[lefty]

1651102071096221696

[Brazil]

It's weird to me how Kawhi's latest injury is getting him so much hate and vitriol, as if his bad knees are the result of some flaw in his character. Obviously it hurts his value as a player and his legacy, but it's not like he wants this to happen. He's more devastated about it than you are, no doubt. Unless you think he's just being a pussy and his injury isn't bad enough to keep him from playing, I don't see why he should be shitted on quite so much.

" Unless you think he's just being a pussy and his injury isn't bad enough to keep him from playing" you have it here

[Mr. Body]

I don't believe anything that Twitter guy says about Tyron Lue. He has some stupid bone to pick and none of that stuff smells right.

Also super annoying he calls Marcus Morris 'Mook' for some unbelievably stupid reason.

[exstatic]

I don't believe anything that Twitter guy says about Tyron Lue. He has some stupid bone to pick and none of that stuff smells right.

Also super annoying he calls Marcus Morris 'Mook' for some unbelievably stupid reason.

Maybe that's his nickname? I personally prefer Dick for what he did to the Spurs. Classic case of the karma wheel ultimately turning. That whole NYK shit went down so that he COULD get to the Clippers, and now he hates it. As for Lue, I've always just considered him a players puppet kind of coach who won't give stars a hard time. First LeBron, then Kawhi/PG13.

[Mr. Body]

Maybe that's his nickname? I personally prefer Dick for what he did to the Spurs. Classic case of the karma wheel ultimately turning. That whole NYK shit went down so that he COULD get to the Clippers, and now he hates it. As for Lue, I've always just considered him a players puppet kind of coach who won't give stars a hard time. First LeBron, then Kawhi/PG13.

I mean, yeah, it's his nickname or whatever. But this guy talks like he's found his parents' stash and was already brain damaged. If he wants anyone to take this seriously, this ain't the way to go.

[Arcadian]

" Unless you think he's just being a pussy and his injury isn't bad enough to keep him from playing" you have it here

At least this time he has an actual torn meniscus, as opposed to "thigh soreness" or whatever it was in 2018 :lol

[koriwhat]

Fuck him!

[cd98]

Like someone said earlier, whoa did the Spurs dodge a bullet in not giving him the supermax. Highly unlikely the Spurs win a title with him the year he went to Toronto.

[KobesAchilles]

He would’ve sat out for us that year Toronto won. The only reason he played was for the contract. The dude is done as a premier player. He will be a Grant Hill except with titles. I mean the dude couldn’t even play 3 straight games without tearing a mcl.

That being said, as a Spurs fan it’s nice being vindicated. Now everybody knows what we already knew 5 years ago. He’s damaged goods

[Biggems]

I think the accurate diagnosis is torn vagina.....

[Brazil]

At least this time he has an actual torn meniscus, as opposed to "thigh soreness" or whatever it was in 2018 :lol

:lol

Parker called dat bitch out ugly

[rjv]

:lol

Parker called dat bitch out ugly

parker called him out and leonard and his uncle pouted publicly, then used parker as a scapegoat for why he was upset with the team. manu and TP just got sick of his shit and that was that. the dude lacks any social skills (although his social skills are significantly better than his sister's).

[John B]

Kawhi could’ve likely eclipsed Jordan if healthy, but that’s a big IF. I have come to terms that the Spurs had dodged a bullet not signing him a supermax and the big frustration he would’ve been, not knowing when he is going to be available. It’s the manner of how he did it his exit, sabotaging any chance of getting a good haul and making the Spurs look bad, is why we still talk about this jerk

[daslicer]

Kawhi could’ve likely eclipsed Jordan if healthy, but that’s a big IF. I have come to terms that the Spurs had dodged a bullet not signing him a supermax and the big frustration he would’ve been, not knowing when he is going to be available. It’s the manner of how he did it his exit, sabotaging any chance of getting a good haul and making the Spurs look bad, is why we still talk about this jerk

I wouldn't say eclipse Jordan, but he could have ended up winning 4-5 rings if he was healthy and decided he actually wanted to win.

[exstatic]

Kawhi could’ve likely eclipsed Jordan if healthy, but that’s a big IF. I have come to terms that the Spurs had dodged a bullet not signing him a supermax and the big frustration he would’ve been, not knowing when he is going to be available. It’s the manner of how he did it his exit, sabotaging any chance of getting a good haul and making the Spurs look bad, is why we still talk about this jerk

Kawhi was a copy of Kobe who was a copy of Jordan. Ever make too many copies of copies? They degrade.

[daslicer]

Kawhi was a copy of Kobe who was a copy of Jordan. Ever make too many copies of copies? They degrade.

In my eyes Kawhi when healthy was better than Kobe. The only thing Kobe could do better than Kawhi was being a playmaker. Kawhi had a better fadeaway, better post up moves, and was physically stronger than Kobe. Kobe was more athletic than Kawhi but that's the only thing physically he has on Kawhi.

[John B]

Kawhi was a copy of Kobe who was a copy of Jordan. Ever make too many copies of copies? They degrade.

Except in basketball skills progress, with science, better conditioning, load management, etc.

[exstatic]

Except in basketball skills progress, with science, better conditioning, load management, etc.

Kobe had all of that, and wasn't as good as MJ.

[John B]

Kobe had all of that, and wasn't as good as MJ.

MJ Bulls didn’t go up against Timmy, Kobe did :lol

[exstatic]

MJ Bulls didn’t go up against Timmy, Kobe did :lol

I'm not talking championships, I'm talking game. MJ had more.

[Mr. Body]

Parker didn't even call Nephew out that bad. He just said that everyone else plays through being hurt. That's it.

[Spurs Homer]

I wouldn't say eclipse Jordan, but he could have ended up winning 4-5 rings if he was healthy and decided he actually wanted to win.

yeah, uh huh, sure…

and my aunt would have been my uncle if she had had a penis…

[John B]

I'm not talking championships, I'm talking game. MJ had more.

Back to Kawhi. It’s a big IF healthy, and had he stayed under the watchful eyes of Pop. Kawhi is much stronger, better lockdown defender (just ask LeBron and KD), much efficient scorer without a lot of wasted energy. But most of all, Pop would’ve shielded him from any drama, and Pop is a genius in getting the most out of his players, not to mention a genius in adapting his plays to his personnel. Who did MJ have? Tex’s alter ego, Jackson? Pop >>> Jackson

We can agree to disagree.

[daslicer]

yeah, uh huh, sure…

and my aunt would have been my uncle if she had had a penis…

I don't even like Kawhi but if he never had health problems and was serious about winning then he would have won a few more championships. Very few guys are as good as him or even better than him in the current league talent wise.

[exstatic]

Back to Kawhi. It’s a big IF healthy, and had he stayed under the watchful eyes of Pop. Kawhi is much stronger, better lockdown defender (just ask LeBron and KD), much efficient scorer without a lot of wasted energy. But most of all, Pop would’ve shielded him from any drama, and Pop is a genius in getting the most out of his players, not to mention a genius in adapting his plays to his personnel. Who did MJ have? Tex’s alter ego, Jackson? Pop >>> Jackson

We can agree to disagree.

MJ and Pip were two of the fiercest defender in the league…until they weren’t. LeBron could lock down tiny guards at one time. All wing players lose that ability, and frankly the desire once they cross their athletic peak at 27-28. Even if he had never been injured, Kawhi would have fallen from elite back into the pack of good defenders about the time the Clippers got him.

[Spurs Homer]

I don't even like Kawhi but if he never had health problems and was serious about winning then he would have won a few more championships. Very few guys are as good as him or even better than him in the current league talent wise.


sure

but you can say that about anybody

its just not reality

what if this had happened - then this would have been the result

But it did NOT happen.

[daslicer]

sure

but you can say that about anybody

its just not reality

what if this had happened - then this would have been the result

But it did NOT happen.

The original post I applied to was about speculation of Kawhi being better than MJ if he stayed healthy. I was just replying with my own speculation of what I think Kawhi would have been had he been healthy. Hence the post was not about reality to begin with.

[Spurs Homer]

The original post I applied to was about speculation of Kawhi being better than MJ if he stayed healthy. I was just replying with my own speculation of what I think Kawhi would have been had he been healthy. Hence the post was not about reality to begin with.

pretty simple -

In a fantasy world - Kawhi (or any other nba star) - would be better than MJ - if x, y and z had happened instead of a, b and c!

In reality - kawhi - was never and never will be as good as MJ - it did not happen - he has a degenerative injury -

so it is most def about reality.

[daslicer]

pretty simple -

In a fantasy world - Kawhi (or any other nba star) - would be better than MJ - if x, y and z had happened instead of a, b and c!

In reality - kawhi - was never and never will be as good as MJ - it did not happen - he has a degenerative injury -

so it is most def about reality.

I'm going to keep it simple the posts I replied to was all about speculation then you got bent out shape about it. Now you are playing the deflection game by bringing up "reality". If you have a problem about speculation which sports deals a lot of with what if scenarios and situations, then don't be a dumbass and respond to those post.

I also never said in my speculation post that Kawhi could have been better than MJ if he was healthy. I said he could have had 4-5 rings total if he was healthy and took the game seriously.

[poopbox]

Imagine we had super maxed this guy and we were in year 3 of him missing the playoffs / missing around half the season :grim:

[diego]

Fuck kawhi and his what ifs

What if lebron started his career with 3 hofers and the goat coach

What if Durant didn't waste half his career playing next to Westbrook and Roberson

What if..

End of the day, just about any all NBA level wing in history could have won with the 2014 spurs or 2019 raps, for all the bad luck kawhi had with health he had maybe the best luck in terms of draft situation / team strength. Never, not once in his career, did his teams depend on him to carry them. And people compare with MJ? Play style wise ok, career wise not even close

[Dex]

Obviously we'll never know, but I find it interesting how Kawhi was known as being such a "gym rat" and constantly working on his body and game. I wonder if he overdid it which led to him burning out his legs early.

That said, adding this injury to his extended list, I doubt he will ever be the same player again. Yes, a meniscus isn't as bad as it used to be but all of these things compound each other. He may be great for games at a time, but that's it.

[Ocotillo]

Jimmy Butler was drafted the same year as Nephew, I would offer Butler has had a better career than number 2.

[Drom John]

Jimmy Butler was drafted the same year as Nephew, I would offer Butler has had a better career than number 2.

BR-Ref NBA & ABA Career Combined (Regular Season + Playoffs) Leaders and Records for Win Shares

69) 120.58 Zelmo Beaty
70) 120.45 Jimmy Butler
71) 120.36 Jack Sikma

84) 113.74 Elton Brand
85) 113.22 Kawhi Leonard
86) 112.33 Andre Iguodala

[MultiTroll]

Jimmy Butler was drafted the same year as Nephew, I would offer Butler has had a better career than number 2.
Overall perhaps.

Peak no way.

[buttsR4rebounding]

The Clippers should do what I thought the Spurs should have done with DRob once his back problems got worse. Hold him out until the all-star game. Then give him the last 25 games to round into playoff shape. Save his body for when games count.

[MultiTroll]

Obviously we'll never know, but I find it interesting how Kawhi was known as being such a "gym rat" and constantly working on his body and game. I wonder if he overdid it which led to him burning out his legs early.
Not just Kwa but...

The gym rat and "stays in gym til midnight" gets glorified by storytellers but i wonder if its a cumulative downer in the long run for ALL.
Certainly think playing on concrete is horrible long term.

Johny Wooden and UCLA spent big bucks on some kind of soft sand beneath the hardwood at old UCLA.
After the flooding tho, not sure if new floor also had this bouncey foundation.

Greedy NBA and players certainly won't do anything about it. Would think a better floor could help with injuries.

[koriwhat]

Fuck him! Couldn't happen to a better man.

[barakz21]

Man, that “leak” by that Clippers media guy is gold. Hopefully we get more of that. Also, pretty sure it hasn’t been said enough and it never will, but fuck nephew.

[exstatic]

The Clippers should do what I thought the Spurs should have done with DRob once his back problems got worse. Hold him out until the all-star game. Then give him the last 25 games to round into playoff shape. Save his body for when games count.

It doesn’t matter how much he rests. He missed 90% of a season with us, and 100% of last season in LA. He just can’t plan a bunch of games in a row.

[Ocotillo]

Nephew probably did have a better peak but I am speaking of complete player; talent, contribution, attitude, injury-prone, team player. Nephew is incomplete because of his inability to stay healthy and I would add he is a lousy teammate.

[exstatic]

Nephew probably did have a better peak but I am speaking of complete player; talent, contribution, attitude, injury-prone, team player. Nephew is incomplete because of his inability to stay healthy and I would add he is a lousy teammate.

Please tell me you’re not talking about MJ…

[SupremeGuy]

The fact that modern medicine/treatments/PEDs haven't been able to give him more stability in his knee is astounding. Curry's ankles were weaker than shit. I don't remember the last time Curry had ankle problems. I wonder when Lebron's body will finally start giving out.

[heyheymymy]

Hate to admit it but just watching this LAL MEM series you can see how successfully Lebron has maintained his fitness.

He is jacked and seems to have impressive stamina/endurance. He's 38.

I say he should pay his trainers and nutritionists whatever they ask. And hats off to him for no doubt the exhausting consistency to keep up.

Of course he took some considerable load management the past few seasons but still he has looked ready when it matters most.

We will see how long that holds up but I saw one game this series lebron was the first laker since Shaq to post a 20/20 playoff game

[Racspur1]

F**K leonard I'm tired of hearing about his wimpy ass !!!

[Ocotillo]

Please tell me you’re not talking about MJ…
Oh God no, my earlier comparison with Jimmy Butler.

[baseline bum]

Overall perhaps.

Peak no way.

Would be interesting to have seen Jimmy Butler on a team with Duncan, Parker, Pop, Green, Diaw, Splitter, Mills, and Ginobili tbh.

[Mr. Body]

Hate to admit it but just watching this LAL MEM series you can see how successfully Lebron has maintained his fitness.

He is jacked and seems to have impressive stamina/endurance. He's 38.

I say he should pay his trainers and nutritionists whatever they ask. And hats off to him for no doubt the exhausting consistency to keep up.

Of course he took some considerable load management the past few seasons but still he has looked ready when it matters most.

We will see how long that holds up but I saw one game this series lebron was the first laker since Shaq to post a 20/20 playoff game

Yeah, Human Growth Hormones are really effective.

[spursparker9]

Jimmy Butler > Nephew

[heyheymymy]

Yeah, Human Growth Hormones are really effective.

LeBiogenesis James

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biogenesis_scandal

Bosh < Bosch

[barakz21]

Hate to admit it but just watching this LAL MEM series you can see how successfully Lebron has maintained his fitness.

He is jacked and seems to have impressive stamina/endurance. He's 38.

I say he should pay his trainers and nutritionists whatever they ask. And hats off to him for no doubt the exhausting consistency to keep up.

Of course he took some considerable load management the past few seasons but still he has looked ready when it matters most.

We will see how long that holds up but I saw one game this series was the first laker since Shaq to post a 20/20 playoff game

I hate to admit that LA-MEM was the best series for me, and that I was rooting for LA. Best for me because they’ll either embarrass the Grizz or they lose in the first round, it’s a win-win for me.

The Grizzlies sure talk too much for a team who hasn’t even done anything yet.

[The Truth #6]

I suppose the Debbie Downer/armchair psychiatrist interpretation of Kawhi is that he felt abandoned by his father and now he abandons everyone else. And then throw in Uncle who has his own agenda and this is what we get. A totally isolated individual who only exists through basketball and has been manipulated and enabled year after year since he came to San Antonio and has almost no connection to anyone.

[Twisted_Dawg]

I suppose the Debbie Downer/armchair psychiatrist interpretation of Kawhi is that he felt abandoned by his father and now he abandons everyone else. And then throw in Uncle who has his own agenda and this is what we get. A totally isolated individual who only exists through basketball and has been manipulated and enabled year after year since he came to San Antonio and has almost no connection to anyone.

Didn't Spurs Talk diagnose long ago he has Asperger syndrome?

[Mr. Body]

Didn't Spurs Talk diagnose long ago he has Asperger syndrome?

That diagnosis no longer exists. It's just part of autism now.

And he might. But being autistic is not the same as being an asshole. Elon Musk claims he has Aspergers but he's just an asshole.