What has been the most surprising thing your learned during this Kawhi saga?

[spursistan]

I was surprised how empty his rapport with Pop has turned out to be, tbh. You would think there would be a mentor-protege angle to the relationship. It was cold and pretty much non-existing throughout the years..

Pop is privately one of most caring individual in the entire league. That he wasn't able to get through to this dude--or wasn't allowed to-- is more of a reflection on Kawhi than anyone else.

Leonard is an anti-social type who really doesn't value human relations much outside the tight circle of family.

[RD2191]

Assburgers tbh

[Spur|n|Austin]

His mental and emotional toughness/issues became very apparent.

[spursistan]

His mental and emotional toughness/issues became very apparent.
"silent assassin" "kingslayer" :lol..

[ducks]

I think he never got the proper help he needed to get over his dad and kepted everything inside


pop seemed yesterday he only cared for players what they did on the community side then on the court

leonard never had camps like green

pop truly thinks basketball is a game kids play and he gets paid for it

he does not understand what other people go thru and die and breath the silver and black and want them to win
their break from life is SPURS

[marinoman]

Fact- he drives a 1997 chevy tahoe

[ducks]

fact
he is building a 3 million dollar house in sa for him
he also is building one for his mom
but he hates sa?

[spursistan]

I think he never got the proper help he needed to get over his dad and kepted everything inside


pop seemed yesterday he only cared for players what they did on the community side then on the court

leonard never had camps like green

pop truly thinks basketball is a game kids play and he gets paid for it

he does not understand what other people go thru and die and breath the silver and black and want them to win
their break from life is SPURS

Aspects of our character get molded by childhood experiences..Yeah, he's a type who could be worth a psychoanalysis through an exhaustive background check....

[Twisted_Dawg]

That he is one real weird mother fucker.

[SuperCam]

how weak the roster besides him PATFO assembled is, tbh. it took a career 2nd team all NBA year from LMAlpha just to drag these bums into the postseason by a margin of one game :lol

[BSfromTX]

What surprised me, was his refusal to address the fans and organization that supported him for so many years. Whether he truly felt he was treated bad or not, he never nutted up and told the world where he stood. That is just a matter of being a stand up guy and up front. Even if PATFO seriously screwed him over, he can't hide behind reporters and his family and not speak up. As a man in this world (IMHO) that is a serious flaw and at best just unprofessional.

[SuperCam]

there's going to be some real shit in the next CBA negotiations, owners will not put up with stars essentially voiding the last year or two of their contracts, or holding teams hostages with the new trendy 1+1 deals the upper echelon stars will take going forward...

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

there's going to be some real shit in the next CBA negotiations, owners will not put up with stars essentially voiding the last year or two of their contracts, or holding teams hostages with the new trendy 1+1 deals the upper echelon stars will take going forward...

Did you forget to switch alts?

Good post.

[DMC]

Not surprising so maybe doesn't qualify but still, just how much narrative gets created when someone doesn't speak to the media. Kawhi and Pop at the same time, that's a perfect quiet storm. Media basically invents the narrative and you can assume about 50% of it is close to accurate.

[SAGirl]

I don't yet really know what was really up with that injury. When I know, it will probably be the most surprising thing.

[DMC]

fact
he is building a 3 million dollar house in sa for him
he also is building one for his mom
but he hates sa?

That explains DeRozan, need more bricks.

[DMC]

I think he never got the proper help he needed to get over his dad and kepted everything inside


pop seemed yesterday he only cared for players what they did on the community side then on the court

leonard never had camps like green

pop truly thinks basketball is a game kids play and he gets paid for it

he does not understand what other people go thru and die and breath the silver and black and want them to win
their break from life is SPURS

Pop's best friend, spouse and partner for 40 years died. He's got a different world view than some.

[Namundy]

It's not necessarily something I learned but more confirmed -- Kawhi is just not a very smart dude. I have never seen someone implode like this and I'm genuinely curious to follow his story in Toronto.

[K...]

fact
he is building a 3 million dollar house in sa for him
he also is building one for his mom
but he hates sa?

Fact: houses can sell, many times at appreciated prices

[coachmac87]

We still don’t know why or how he missed 73 games due to “injury”

Only thing confirmed is how manipulating the media can really be

[daslicer]

I have been on record for years stating that I honestly believe that he was socially retarded and that he probably suffered from some social disorder such as Aspergers,Autism, etc. If you don't believe me you can check my posts on him from several years ago. I can't say really the way he handled the situation really surprised me but I will say Uncle Dennis is the one thing that took me off guard. I went into the assumption last summer that Kawhi was this quiet retarded guy but at least he was low maintenance and that the Spurs really didn't have to deal with any drama when handling him. Then suddenly I hear about this Uncle Dennis character who turns out to be the stereotypical uncle that we all have in our families.

So I would say everything about Uncle Dennis surprised me. This guy was ruthless and determined to use his nephew as a cash cow for his own personal dreams. He waged war on the most successful sports franchise in the last 20 years and destroyed their reputation and foundation. If Kawhi is healthy and goes to the Lakers then unfortunately uncle Dennis won the war and will reap all the benefits. That to me is the toughest pill to swallow that the Spurs lost to this crooked bastard. I'm not a fan of Trump but I wish the Spurs had the Trump mentality when handling this POS and Kawhi and went all out to trash them 24/7.

[koriwhat]

the fact that he didn't pan out to be the franchise player he was supposed to be for the spurs. the successor to duncan which we all saw in kawhi. fools gold is what he is. so damn disappointing to say the least. i don't wish the worst for kawhi but i don't wish the best either. fuck that dude.

[Marcus Bryant]

How much he wanted out of SA after 7 years. This board seems inclined to believe in the 'evil Uncle' narrative, but none of this happens without Leonard being an active and willing participant.

Call it MB's Razor. The most boring explanation is the right one. Leonard wanted out and his uncle and agent in their bumbling way made it happen.

[boutons_deux]

Pop, early on, showed great confidence in K, to go get him from Indiana, handed him the role of franchise player which I think surprised K, then K got a ring and FMVP, which thrilled Pop greatly, and K still felt no desire, no allegiance to stay in SA.

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

i’m surprised how much money kawhi’s family was willing to sacrifice for the hopes of gaining relatively marginally more money

[DMC]

Fact: houses can sell, many times at appreciated prices

This, plus :lol he gave up how many tens of millions just to go to Toronto? Pretty sure a 3m dollar home isn't going to hold him back.

[Spurs da champs]

Uncle Dennis, had no idea who the hell he was till this year.

[TheGreatSantini]

That Leonard is a retard and Pop hates half his fans.

Also that the Trump Curse is real. Unfortunately, only one team can win so when they’re all anti-Trump hate-filled lugnuts the team with the least bad luck sneaks by (Warriors).

#Shutupandplay

[Mikeanaro]

That he truly is a mongoloid mofo, at first I was pretty surprised he had a girlfriend and now my conclusion is he is just a retard and his girlfriend sisters and uncles use him as a condom to get everything they want.
Also I find his mute very annoying like you dont have anything to say at any moment?
Part of basketball is interacting with other people, fans media players you name it even TD gave a few words if he had to.
Too much to think and he is not worthy, lets see how his career goes Im not very optimist.

[spursistan]

That he truly is a mongoloid mofo, at first I was pretty surprised he had a girlfriend and now my conclusion is he is just a retard and his girlfriend sisters and uncles use him as a condom to get everything they want.
Also I find his mute very annoying like you dont have anything to say at any moment?
Part of basketball is interacting with other people, fans media players you name it even TD gave a few words if he had to.
Too much to think and he is not worthy, lets see how his career goes Im not very optimist.

:lol

[jjktkk]

That Leonard STILL has not spoken one word.

[daslicer]

We still don’t know why or how he missed 73 games due to “injury”

Only thing confirmed is how manipulating the media can really be

My best friend and my younger brother are both hardcore Knick fans. I was talking with both of them the other day and they joked with me and basically said "You see this drama with the Spurs in the media well now you know how we have felt the last 20 years when it comes to the media trashing the Knicks." I'm definitely looking forward to the Spurs no longer being in the tabloids. That shit was tiring.

[F7.]

I'm astonished at the amount of control he has presumably given to his advisors. I can't think of another athlete in ANY other sport that has been unable to speak for themselves, especially through an ordeal like this. I'm sure the resident insiders on this forum have the whole story but from the outside looking in, it's so damn strange.

So yeah, I learned absolutely nothing and am left with more questions than answers.

EDIT: I learned that Toronto had a basketball team

[Pavlov]

That Leonard is a retard and Pop hates half his fans.

Also that the Trump Curse is real. Unfortunately, only one team can win so when they’re all anti-Trump hate-filled lugnuts the team with the least bad luck sneaks by (Warriors).

#ShutupandplayI learned that snowflakes actively look for things to get worked up about.

[Marcus Bryant]

That Leonard STILL has not spoken one word.

Pretty much. It says a lot that the Spurs dumped him where he apparently didn't want to go the moment they got a decent (considering the situation) offer.

[coachmac87]

My best friend and my younger brother are both hardcore Knick fans. I was talking with both of them the other day and they joked with me and basically said "You see this drama with the Spurs in the media well now you know how we have felt the last 20 years when it comes to the media trashing the Knicks." I'm definitely looking forward to the Spurs no longer being in the tabloids. That shit was tiring.


Well the Knicks suck and deserved to be treated as such...

The sane media credited the title “best organization in sports” to the Spurs..

Yet they get kicked to the curb once they get word Lakers can possibly become super team. Now that he’s been traded some even can’t hide their feelings being upset Kawhi didn’t get “their” way

[Keepin' it real]

Most surprising things:

The gullibility of spurstalkers to believe Kawhi was really suffering from a mysterious injury. And now spurstalkers claiming that anyone who was calling him out early on was trolling. Kawhi was clearly full of shit... too many spurstalkers had blinders on.

The naivete of spurstalkers regarding national (sports) media. Post after post surprised/shocked/angered by clearly biased unsubstantiated rumors being reported as facts.

I hope you realize this phenomenon is not limited to sports media. It's much worse at the national news level. It's an agenda-filled, for-profit industry. Don't ever forget that.

[rastaspur]

That pinoy maurader had problems in pharmacy school. He comes across as brilliant so i was really suprised by that. Sad.

[Budkin]

Kawhi went from a humble hard-working superstar to a little bitch that is 100% controlled by other people (ie. Uncle Dennis) and was willing to shit on the number one sports franchise in the world, and ruin his reputation at the same time.

[koriwhat]

Most surprising things:

The gullibility of spurstalkers to believe Kawhi was really suffering from a mysterious injury. And now spurstalkers claiming that anyone who was calling him out early on was trolling. Kawhi was clearly full of shit... too many spurstalkers had blinders on.

The naivete of spurstalkers regarding national (sports) media. Post after post surprised/shocked/angered by clearly biased unsubstantiated rumors being reported as facts.

I hope you realize this phenomenon is not limited to sports media. It's much worse at the national news level. It's an agenda-filled, for-profit industry. Don't ever forget that.

that's too real. stop keepin' it so real.

[coachmac87]

Most surprising things:

The gullibility of spurstalkers to believe Kawhi was really suffering from a mysterious injury. And now spurstalkers claiming that anyone who was calling him out early on was trolling. Kawhi was clearly full of shit... too many spurstalkers had blinders on.

The naivete of spurstalkers regarding national (sports) media. Post after post surprised/shocked/angered by clearly biased unsubstantiated rumors being reported as facts.

I hope you realize this phenomenon is not limited to sports media. It's much worse at the national news level. It's an agenda-filled, for-profit industry. Don't ever forget that.


Yup. And people are baffled why Trump won....

[BillMc]

That someone could steal nearly 20 million from you, not take your phone calls, and you would still want him back....for awhile.

[Marcus Bryant]

That someone could steal nearly 20 million from you, not take your phone calls, and you would still want him back....for awhile.

Yeah, pulling off a holdout with pay in the NBA isn't easy.

[Dverde]

Why RC drives drunk.

[marinoman]

He is a grown adult but his Uncle still chaperones him, if not flat out makes decisions for him

[LittleCriminal]

I don't yet really know what was really up with that injury. When I know, it will probably be the most surprising thing.

So what ur really saying is that you know nothing... Typical.

[TXstbobcat]

that a players representation can let ego and emotions control the decision making process with the potential of over $200 million at stake.

[Marcus Bryant]

Kawhi went from a humble hard-working superstar to a little bitch that is 100% controlled by other other people (ie. Uncle Dennis) and was willing to shit on the number one sports franchise in the world, and ruin his reputation at the same time.

The league's most passive-aggressive superstar. Seriously. How long had this been building up?

Ok, you don't want to be here. Instead of hashing it out up front he's hiding in the literal closet while his keystone cop representatives are trying to play hardball.

[K...]

A bit surprised the league didn't step up to push Kawhi to disrupt his group

A little surprised the Lakers could fuck up LeBron falling into their lap, a little surprised LeBron would fuck us over and not do is a solid in getting us Ingram etc, considering we freed him from Miami and welcomed him into the finals with the sweep.

[daslicer]

Well the Knicks suck and deserved to be treated as such...

The sane media credited the title “best organization in sports” to the Spurs..

Yet they get kicked to the curb once they get word Lakers can possibly become super team. Now that he’s been traded some even can’t hide their feelings being upset Kawhi didn’t get “their” way

I agree with everything you said and yes your right the Knicks deserved their treatment but I did feel some kinship towards my brother in the regard of experiencing the media negatively talk about my team 24/7 nonstop. Never knew how annoying that shit can be until it happened with the Spurs.

Also yes it's very obvious the media was going to give Kawhi a pass for this bs when they found out he wanted to be a Laker. No one should be shocked by this. The media has begrudgingly said the Spurs are the best organization in sports for the last several years but it's obvious they have wanted them to fail for a long time. Hell they were filled with joy last year when Zaza broke Kawhi's ankle. They were so many media pundits stating that Kawhi deserved to get hurt because of what Bruce Bowen had done in the past or claiming Zaza didn't intentionally try to hurt Kawhi." Just ask yourself would they have given Durant,Curry,Lebron the same treatment if they were in the same situation as Kawhi was with Zaza incident?

The media is a bunch of corporate whores who will push whatever the company line is which for the NBA tends to be "The Lakers need to be great at all costs and you will push that shit 24/7." Stuff like this was apparent when Demarcus Cousins signed with the Warriors. There was a clip of Stephen A bashing Demarcus for the signing and then the next day on his show praising Demarcus for his move and telling everybody that they need to get over it. I'm sure Stephen A got the memo from his boss which is "The Warriors are our cash cow so don't you even be thinking about bashing them."

[Marcus Bryant]

that a players representation can let ego and emotions control the decision making process with the potential of over $200 million at stake.

Not just that, but that people with the ability (or lack thereof) of his representation were able to get in that position.

[LittleCriminal]

What I've learned is NBA players should keep family away from handling or representing you and ur finances.

[daslicer]

Most surprising things:

The gullibility of spurstalkers to believe Kawhi was really suffering from a mysterious injury. And now spurstalkers claiming that anyone who was calling him out early on was trolling. Kawhi was clearly full of shit... too many spurstalkers had blinders on.

The naivete of spurstalkers regarding national (sports) media. Post after post surprised/shocked/angered by clearly biased unsubstantiated rumors being reported as facts.

I hope you realize this phenomenon is not limited to sports media. It's much worse at the national news level. It's an agenda-filled, for-profit industry. Don't ever forget that.

Agreed I have been saying that for years.

[BillMc]

That Leonard STILL has not spoken one word.

Are we sure English is his first language?

[TDomination]

He is definitely not who I thought he was.

Looking back at videos, behind scene stuff, he looked like the ultimate spur. I mean this really came out of nowhere. I'm curious to find out when he he truly started thinking about wanting to leave. And what's the core reason behind it.

And most importantly, how did things get SO BAD that he couldn't just wait until free agency to leave on his own terms. Some things just don't add up.

[barbacoataco]

there's going to be some real shit in the next CBA negotiations, owners will not put up with stars essentially voiding the last year or two of their contracts, or holding teams hostages with the new trendy 1+1 deals the upper echelon stars will take going forward...

This.

Also, it is impossible to know what was really going on and whether he could have played last year.

Also, Leonard is injury prone.

[Captivus]

Everybody always says how good the Spurs organization is, including the media; but as soon as this Kawhi thing started, for some reason, no one gave SA the benefit of the doubt. Most people and media automatically assumed SA handled the situation the wrong way, without even knowing all the facts.

[Marcus Bryant]

Playing Devi...er, Kawhi's Advocate:

-Pop is nearing retirement, which introduces all kind of uncertainty - what's the continuity plan for coaching staff as well as front office? Why commit long-term when Pop's final season could be the first of a prospective extension? The team's majority owners are divorcing - when's the team up for sale?
-Core members of the rotation themselves are nearing retirement and behind them are unproven kids and various flotsam and jetsam. What's the plan to win today?
-SA's attraction as a championship caliber team appearing on national tv starts to fade and then you are left with having to carry more of the load without a strong supporting cast in an ever more competitive conference, in a small media market.

[BillMc]

Playing Devi...er, Kawhi's Advocate:

-Pop is nearing retirement, which introduces all kind of uncertainty - what's the continuity plan for coaching staff as well as front office? Why commit long-term when Pop's final season could be the first of a prospective extension? The team's majority owners are divorcing - when's the team up for sale?
-Core members of the rotation themselves are nearing retirement and behind them are unproven kids and various flotsam and jetsam. What's the plan to win today?
-SA's attraction as a championship caliber team appearing on national tv starts to fade and then you are left with having to carry more of the load without a strong supporting cast in an ever more competitive conference, in a small media market.

Or its worth 80 million and burning every bridge in sight for a shorter drive to Pacific Palisades.

[exstatic]

how weak the roster besides him PATFO assembled is, tbh. it took a career 2nd team all NBA year from LMAlpha just to drag these bums into the postseason by a margin of one game :lol

Not really. He's been All NBA 5 times, second team twice, and his year was comparable to his last year in Portland. It was not any kind of statistical or award winning outlier.

[OldMan88]

What I've learned is NBA players should keep family away from handling or representing you and ur finances.
This applies to any business or money dealings with family.

[ceperez]

I have been on record for years stating that I honestly believe that he was socially retarded and that he probably suffered from some social disorder such as Aspergers,Autism, etc. If you don't believe me you can check my posts on him from several years ago. I can't say really the way he handled the situation really surprised me but I will say Uncle Dennis is the one thing that took me off guard. I went into the assumption last summer that Kawhi was this quiet retarded guy but at least he was low maintenance and that the Spurs really didn't have to deal with any drama when handling him. Then suddenly I hear about this Uncle Dennis character who turns out to be the stereotypical uncle that we all have in our families.

So I would say everything about Uncle Dennis surprised me. This guy was ruthless and determined to use his nephew as a cash cow for his own personal dreams. He waged war on the most successful sports franchise in the last 20 years and destroyed their reputation and foundation. If Kawhi is healthy and goes to the Lakers then unfortunately uncle Dennis won the war and will reap all the benefits. That to me is the toughest pill to swallow that the Spurs lost to this crooked bastard. I'm not a fan of Trump but I wish the Spurs had the Trump mentality when handling this POS and Kawhi and went all out to trash them 24/7.

I'll go with this take. Surprised to find this Uncle that hijacked his career.

[r0drig0lac]

That he is one real weird mother fucker.

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/images/smilies/smilol.gif

[DJR210]

I think this just reinforced the truth about body language and mannerisms being the majority of communication between people. What little came out denied a rift and said otherwise, but looking back at Kawhi's behavior while in the public eye said the real truth.

[ceperez]

He is definitely not who I thought he was.

Looking back at videos, behind scene stuff, he looked like the ultimate spur. I mean this really came out of nowhere. I'm curious to find out when he he truly started thinking about wanting to leave. And what's the core reason behind it.

And most importantly, how did things get SO BAD that he couldn't just wait until free agency to leave on his own terms. Some things just don't add up.

Started with his trip to China in the previous Summer. That's probably when Uncle Dennis had ideas on marketing his nephew.

Leonard has never played uninjured his entire career. Considering how much work his been putting in, who knows if he's another Derrick Rose in the making. Rose was gone by his fifth year. Leonard's injury is the 7th year. We'll see if he's healthy!

[TheGreatSantini]

Kawhi went from a humble hard-working superstar to a little bitch that is 100% controlled by other other people (ie. Uncle Dennis) and was willing to shit on the number one sports franchise in the world, and ruin his reputation at the same time.

[TDomination]

Without Kawhi talking, all we can do is speculate and wonder what his real reasons were for wanting to leave so badly. Here are my pointless rebuttals to your thoughts.


Playing Devi...er, Kawhi's Advocate:

-Pop is nearing retirement, which introduces all kind of uncertainty - what's the continuity plan for coaching staff as well as front office? Why commit long-term when Pop's final season could be the first of a prospective extension? The team's majority owners are divorcing - when's the team up for sale?
-Kawhi knew Pop would probably at least coach next year, why not wait until your a free agent and leave on your own terms without creating all this drama and tarnishing your brand.


-Core members of the rotation themselves are nearing retirement and behind them are unproven kids and various flotsam and jetsam. What's the plan to win today? It doesn't seem like winning is that huge of an importance for Kawhi because he wanted to go to Los Angeles (before Lebron went over there). Both Clippers and Lakers were worse off than SA. He could've requested to go to Boston, Philly, even Houston to a lesser extent.


-SA's attraction as a championship caliber team appearing on national tv starts to fade and then you are left with having to carry more of the load without a strong supporting cast in an ever more competitive conference, in a small media market. He would have to carry most of the load in either LA team anyways (again before Lebron went to LA). We will always be a smaller media market than LA, no way around that one. But why not just tell the Spurs that you need help if you feel that you don't want to carry the load. Please do whatever you can to get another all star. Maybe finding a way to get Kyrie last summer would've helped if this was one of the reasons why he wanted to leave?

Overall, this is a very perplexing situation because based on what we have heard, money and winning don't seem to be a key factor in his wanting to leave.

[Budkin]

Most surprising things:

The gullibility of spurstalkers to believe Kawhi was really suffering from a mysterious injury. And now spurstalkers claiming that anyone who was calling him out early on was trolling. Kawhi was clearly full of shit... too many spurstalkers had blinders on.


I'll happily call myself out on this point. I had the blinders on because I liked Kawhi so much and was in denial that this could suddenly happen. I just didn't want to believe it.

[ceperez]

Kawhi went from a humble hard-working superstar to a little bitch that is 100% controlled by other people (ie. Uncle Dennis) and was willing to shit on the number one sports franchise in the world, and ruin his reputation at the same time.

Kawhi only cares about winning basketball games.

Moving to LA was his family's idea.
The China tour was his family's idea.
Shopping for a Doctor to clear his fake injury was his family's idea.

Now he has to play in Toronto (without his family). That could actually be good for him!

Pop did him a big favor! He doesn't care about the money! The $81m loss. The shoe deal loss. The only people who cared about that was his toxic family.

[vy65]

https://i.redd.it/ed12hbyvz2x01.jpg

[8FOR!3]

I think he never got the proper help he needed to get over his dad and kepted everything inside


pop seemed yesterday he only cared for players what they did on the community side then on the court

leonard never had camps like green

pop truly thinks basketball is a game kids play and he gets paid for it

he does not understand what other people go thru and die and breath the silver and black and want them to win
their break from life is SPURS

Starting to think the same thing. And if it's true I do feel for him, but at some point you have to grow up and be a man and speak for yourself. That's part of life. I do think there's a chance he doesn't like what's going on with his new camp and he's either too intimidated of his uncle to do anything about it (not saying that's likely) or he just doesn't know how to tell him and feels like he will cause more harm than good to his family. At which that point it's up to his uncle himself to say hey what I'm doing isn't helping my family maybe I should take a step back. Because if he actually cared that's what he would do I would think.

[DJR210]

Most surprising things:

The gullibility of spurstalkers to believe Kawhi was really suffering from a mysterious injury. And now spurstalkers claiming that anyone who was calling him out early on was trolling. Kawhi was clearly full of shit... too many spurstalkers had blinders on.

The naivete of spurstalkers regarding national (sports) media. Post after post surprised/shocked/angered by clearly biased unsubstantiated rumors being reported as facts.

I hope you realize this phenomenon is not limited to sports media. It's much worse at the national news level. It's an agenda-filled, for-profit industry. Don't ever forget that.

When this bullshit all started, tbh I just though Pop was holding him out to screw with the league. I figured Pop wasn't happy with Silver's handling of the Zaza incident. I thought Jalen Rose was just being the meh analyst he is, but here we are months later and he was 100% sharing legit insider info..

[vander]

That Leonard STILL has not spoken one word.

I still want to hear what Leonard has to say about all this. He's got to speak up eventually right? or is he saving it all for the memoir?

[Marcus Bryant]

Leonard's group likely made a trade demand before the trade deadline last February. By that time Leonard's group was controlling the rehabilitation process. Spurs were caught off guard and thought that they needed to handle him with kid gloves, though they obviously wanted to know what was going on with his health. Spurs likely told Leonard and his group that you need to be out on the court for us to find a trade we'll do, other teams are going to have the same questions we do, so then began the stupid cat and mouse game with when he was going to return, and the Spurs' desire to just declare him out for the season and give him the time to recover without the pressure to return that season.

[gospursgojas]

The LEAST surprising thing I learned is that the Spurs as an organization don’t fuck around and don’t get strong armed by amateur groups (impact) or even legendary franchise (AIDS).

[Twisted_Dawg]

That pinoy maurader had problems in pharmacy school. He comes across as brilliant so i was really suprised by that. Sad.

POD :toast

[Wu36]

Pinoy maurader was fantasizing about uncle Dennis wife. I think appo is kawitter. And it cost him a ton of money

[99 Problems]

That he showed up for the team photo. Just why?

[paperboy77]

i’m surprised how much money kawhi’s family was willing to sacrifice for the hopes of gaining relatively marginally more money


Glad that dude is outa here! What a dumbass.

[paperboy77]

I can’t believe anyone could top Durant going to a 73 win team as the shittiest thing someone could shamelessly do.

[spursistan]

I can’t believe anyone could top Durant going to a 73 win team as the shittiest thing someone could shamelessly do.
That's child play compared to what this coward did. Kawhi's act is a bush league move for the ages..I do think it will trigger something written in the next CBA.

As for Spursfans they will never forget or forgive..

[offset formation]

How much he wanted out of SA after 7 years. This board seems inclined to believe in the 'evil Uncle' narrative, but none of this happens without Leonard being an active and willing participant.

Call it MB's Razor. The most boring explanation is the right one. Leonard wanted out and his uncle and agent in their bumbling way made it happen.

I think he wanted out because he wasn't going to be offered the supermax. He wasn't being offered the supermax because his representation issues have caused problems for years...see the all star game stuff and reported attempts by uncle to force his way into the Spurs front office. The Spurs likely wanted changes in that representation before offering it.

Kawhi is extremely prone to suggestion I'm guessing and probably had birds in his ear about disrespect, larger markets, bigger contracts, and the like.

Combined, that chatter along with the perception of familial disrespect coming from the Spurs, finally pushed him into a corner where he felt he couldn't be happy/respected here.

Sadly, I have little doubt he would have been a Spurs lifer had he never been introduced to Impact Sports or let business mix with family.

[barbacoataco]

Reading through all this I see a lot of informed opinions from people who have good ideas. But at the end of the day no one really knows. My personal opinion is that Leonard is done and has a career ending, degenerative injury. Otherwise I think he would have come back at some point before the playoffs to prove himself, even if he wanted to leave the Spurs. But like I say, no one really knows.

Personally I am happy to have DeRozan and Poeltl going forward.

[kobyz]

I can’t believe anyone could top Durant going to a 73 win team as the shittiest thing someone could shamelessly do.

Boogie just offered himself to the warriors for little money, he surpass kd...

[ElNono]

that kobyz is a faggot, tbh

[FkLA]

How much he wanted out of SA after 7 years. This board seems inclined to believe in the 'evil Uncle' narrative, but none of this happens without Leonard being an active and willing participant.

Call it MB's Razor. The most boring explanation is the right one. Leonard wanted out and his uncle and agent in their bumbling way made it happen.

IDK man. He put in all that work to become the player he is just so he could be in LA? The focus was always getting there, everything else like winning or forming a superteam was an afterthought. It just doesn't make sense for a player that put in the work he has, that has expressed a strong desire to win and go down as a legend...to all of a sudden just want to be in LA so badly. So much so that he's willing to possibly throw away 2 years of his prime.

Everything points to the Unc and Impact Sports, imo. Kawhi is probably submissive to Unc.

[FkLA]

And there is something off about him, obviously. I don't know if he's dumb...he actually was really well spoken during interviews towards the end. Im not saying he's Einstein but there's a lot of NBA players that are dumber, imo. He clearly doesn't have social anxiety, but he also doesn't really know how to conduct himself in social situations. Doesn't have feelings like the average human, not like in a he's a cold asshole kind of way, just geniunely doesn't feel much.

/armchair psychologist

edit: so I guess basically he's an Autist :lol

[paperboy77]

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by paperboy77 (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9485000#post9485000)

I can’t believe anyone could top Durant going to a 73 win team as the shittiest thing someone could shamelessly do.




Boogie just offered himself to the warriors for little money, he surpass kd...


Yeah but Boogie is kinda a joke right? He's not a serious player... hell he's proly a subtraction to that team. KD and his gay ass actually is a SA threat. That dude makes shit almost impossible to beat!

Shittiest things to go down in the NBA:
1. Leonard betrays the hand that made him
2. KD screws OKC and the NBA over
3. LBJ abandons the Land for south beach
4. Mailman joins the Fakers
5. NBA favors more scoring in lieu of physicality. Remember when every one used to make fun of the "soft" Euros? Finesse.. big men that shoot 3s.. lack of toughness.. Well that's the NBA today ain't it? Bring back the hand-check and force these fools to limit all this damn resting BS.

I know... i'm stuck on the 90's. SO?!!!

[valleybeyond]

Most surprising things:

The gullibility of spurstalkers to believe Kawhi was really suffering from a mysterious injury. And now spurstalkers claiming that anyone who was calling him out early on was trolling. Kawhi was clearly full of shit... too many spurstalkers had blinders on.

The naivete of spurstalkers regarding national (sports) media. Post after post surprised/shocked/angered by clearly biased unsubstantiated rumors being reported as facts.

I hope you realize this phenomenon is not limited to sports media. It's much worse at the national news level. It's an agenda-filled, for-profit industry. Don't ever forget that.

amen

[spursistan]

Kawhi went from a humble hard-working superstar to a little bitch that is 100% controlled by other people (ie. Uncle Dennis) and was willing to shit on the number one sports franchise in the world, and ruin his reputation at the same time.
Maybe he's always had it deep inside, but this is by far the most astonishing heel turn I can recall in all professorial sports.. Zach Lowe in his recent podcast said people in the Spurs organization still can't figure out when they did exactly lose him.

[gambit1990]

most surprising was how much the story changed... he's recovering from last year's injury/it's a different injury/he's back/he has to sit out/he's almost 100%, playing 3 on 3/he said "for sure" about staying a spur/he wants to go to the lakers/he doesn't want to go to the lakers now that lebron's there/he would be okay going to the lakers to play with lebron...

[kobyz]

LOL all here blaming kawhi, hypocrites Americans...

[LCM]

That there are already reporters stating that KL is reaching out to other NBA players to gauge where they would like to team up with Kawhi in 2019-20 when he is an UFA. Playing on the Lakers isn't the only option. One option may surprise ... the Brooklyn Nets! But thanks to Spurs trained Sean Marks, Nets GM, Brooklyn is looking at a sick amount of cap space, especially if they do a sign and trade with Allen Crabb's contract and his player option next offseason. Uncle Dennis and Kyrie Irving's Dad are tight from what I've read on this forum. And, it's been widely reported that Jimmy Butler and Kyrie Irving are looking to team up as well. This guy hasn't played a minute in Toronto yet!

[spurs10]

That there are already reporters stating that KL is reaching out to other NBA players to gauge where they would like to team up with Kawhi in 2019-20 when he is an UFA. Playing on the Lakers isn't the only option. One option may surprise ... the Brooklyn Nets! But thanks to Spurs trained Sean Marks, Nets GM, Brooklyn is looking at a sick amount of cap space, especially if they do a sign and trade with Allen Crabb's contract and his player option next offseason. Uncle Dennis and Kyrie Irving's Dad are tight from what I've read on this forum. And, it's been widely reported that Jimmy Butler and Kyrie Irving are looking to team up as well. This guy hasn't played a minute in Toronto yet!This looks like he is not exactly concerned about that horrible quad issue. That lasted long.

[Biggems]

I learned that apparently the discord started when the Spurs delayed the extension in order to help the cap situation. Leonard and his camp took it as a slight that the Spurs waited. So instead of being a team player like Tim, Manu, or Green, Leonard didn't care about the cap or the team, just his money. Now, because of his angst, he has lost tens of millions. What a selfish, gutless idiot.

[spurs10]

He lost a bundle... deservingly. So that's good!

[SpursDynasty85]

Nothing. Somebody do some real investigative reporting!

[apalisoc_9]

Not really surprising but the spurs giving leonard the role player treatment according to Jeff Mcdonald..

Glad kawhi is going to a team ready to embrace his superstardom

[picnroll]

That apalisoc is a Phillipino transvestite who flunked out of cosmatology school

[cjw]

I learned that apparently the discord started when the Spurs delyed the extension in order to help the cap situation. Leonard and his camp took it as a slight that the Spurs waited. So instead of being a team player like Tim, Manu, or Green, Leonard didn't care about the cap or the team, just his money. Now, because of his angst, he has lost tens of millions. What a selfish, gutless idiot.


:toast

[cutewizard]

What i learned thru this saga?

That personality wise, Rodman >>>>>> kawhi

In addition to the thematic insight,

SKILL WISE, Rodman >>>>>>>> kawhi

Rodman was the greatest defensive forward the game has ever seen....

And is light years beyond kawhi

[Old School 44]

Honestly, I haven’t learned anything definitive about this saga. Both sides are very tight lipped. I doubt if we’ll every know the full story.

Both sides are to blame for this foolishness...both sides. A lot of people want to blame Uncle Dennis, and I don’t see any reason why it wouldn’t be.

[21209]

How thin-skinned he apparently is and how he can't think for himself.

[MaNu4Tres]

That he said ugly things to a few teammates last year.

That he let the departure of Simmons get under his skin.

What Spurs did with the some of the roster did have something to do with it.

What happened in Brooklyn pre game that made Pop sit him indefinitely.

Dedmon and Simmons weren't the brightest and they caused Kawhi to second guess things going on. Cliques will be cliques.

[james evans]

Nothing has been surprising to me. Kawhi hasn't said anything and the media creating stories. That's why I don't watch much tv . I haven't watched any of this shit on espn, nbatv, or fox becasue I know that no one in the media knows what the fuck they're talking about. All of them are speculating and lying that they have "sources".

[rjv]

that cris carter is more of a douche than stephen a. is.

[exstatic]

that cris carter is more of a douche than stephen a. is.

[look_at_g_shred]

That apalisoc is a Phillipino transvestite who flunked out of cosmatology school

[daslicer]

That he said ugly things to a few teammates last year.

That he let the departure of Simmons get under his skin.

What Spurs did with the some of the roster did have something to do with it.

What happened in Brooklyn pre game that made Pop sit him indefinitely.

Dedmon and Simmons weren't the brightest and they caused Kawhi to second guess things going on. Cliques will be cliques.

Do you know which teammates he said the ugly things to and did he actually tell them they were garbage?

[ceperez]

Same thing that Masai Ujiri (Raptors GM) found out.

http://www.nba.com/article/2018/07/2...-derozan-trade

"“That’s my job. That’s why I am in this seat. To try to figure that part out. I’ve had conversations with Kawhi, his agent and his uncle and everything has gone well. I’m looking forward to meeting them.”

[spursistan]

Nothing has been surprising to me. Kawhi hasn't said anything and the media creating stories. That's why I don't watch much tv . I haven't watched any of this shit on espn, nbatv, or fox becasue I know that no one in the media knows what the fuck they're talking about. All of them are speculating and lying that they have "sources".
Except his actions spoke louder..

[Frank Dux]

What I learned, or rather, what I was reminded is that...

...not everybody can be Tim Duncan.

[HarlemHeat37]

I didn't learn this now, but it just confirmed that Duncan was responsible for all the success of this franchise, not some magical system that Pop created, nor RC Buford's drafting ability or Chip Engelland's shot rehab..you would think it was a given, but not if you talk basketball with non-Spurs fans:lol

[TVI]

Call it MB's Razor. The most boring explanation is the right one. Leonard wanted out and his uncle and agent in their bumbling way made it happen. awesomeness, right here. :bobo

[SAGirl]

I learned that apparently the discord started when the Spurs delayed the extension in order to help the cap situation. Leonard and his camp took it as a slight that the Spurs waited. So instead of being a team player like Tim, Manu, or Green, Leonard didn't care about the cap or the team, just his money. Now, because of his angst, he has lost tens of millions. What a selfish, gutless idiot.
I wouldn’t be surprised if that’s how it started. Kawhis agent, the old agent had also complained when he didn’t sign an extension as soon as he was eligible coming out if his rook contract. If that was how it started the Spurs should have known better. Unfortunately, Kawhi then getting hurt complicated it bc if RC had second thoughts and wanted to backpedal on their offer, new questions arising out if his injury and how the entire thing was managed by the Uncle made things worse. Once Uncle got on his mind about LA, there was no turning back either.

[SAGirl]

I didn't learn this now, but it just confirmed that Duncan was responsible for all the success of this franchise, not some magical system that Pop created, nor RC Buford's drafting ability or Chip Engelland's shot rehab..you would think it was a given, but not if you talk basketball with non-Spurs fans:lol
:tu
+1. It made me appreciate him more. Specially bc I wasn’t a fan when he was MVP and in his prime. But Timmy was it until the day he retired.

[ducks]

Robinson was the glue
He even convinced Duncan to stay

[itzsoweezee]

That a millionaire grown man, a father, even, can be so incredibly cowardly.

I'm also surprised how far the front office has fallen this year. They seem to be three steps behind every other front office. I'm glad the Spurs got rid of him (the dude is an absolute weirdo), I just wish the front office had been more competent throughout the process.

[RD2191]

That a millionaire grown man, a father, even, can be so incredibly cowardly.

I'm also surprised how far the front office has fallen this year. They seem to be three steps behind every other front office. I'm glad the Spurs got rid of him (the dude is an absolute weirdo), I just wish the front office had been more competent throughout the process.

After the Kawhi drama I don't blame them for staying with the Spurs way. I'd rather have a bunch of slow bums that actually want to be in S.A. than a diva like Kawhi.

[J_Paco]

I didn't learn this now, but it just confirmed that Duncan was responsible for all the success of this franchise, not some magical system that Pop created, nor RC Buford's drafting ability or Chip Engelland's shot rehab..you would think it was a given, but not if you talk basketball with non-Spurs fans:lol

Exactly, he held it to together and set the tone. Once he was gone people let their discontent and disagreements with Pop/the FO foster (or leaked them to the media) leading to the last two offseasons.

Anyone that says Duncan isn't the greatest leader since Bill Russell or that he's a top 5 player all - time should be laughed at.

Also, this "saga" proved Leonard doesn't have the fortitude or leadership skills to carry a (small - market) franchise like a Duncan, Robinson or Gervin. Gullible, easily manipulated and apparently was more of a malcontent than he ever led on.

Last point, Pop and RC need to also do a better job of keeping the lines of communication open with all players. Allowing the situation to build for so much time (allegedly) and turn so "ugly" is on them.

[TVI]

I didn't learn this now, but it just confirmed that Duncan was responsible for all the success of this franchise, not some magical system that Pop created, nor RC Buford's drafting ability or Chip Engelland's shot rehab..you would think it was a given, but not if you talk basketball with non-Spurs fans:lol
Bullshit HH. It doesn't happen without Duncan, because...Tim Effin Duncan...but all of those other factors were a part of the Spurs greatness. It's silly to pretend that they weren't crucial to the overall team success. The beautiful game simply doesn't happen without Pop, et. al.

[Cane]

Pop and all coaches need a Little General to keep the locker room in line. Spurs went from Duncan to nothing - Parker and Manu are awkward foreigners, they can't charm Team USA snakes

[J_Paco]

Bullshit HH. It doesn't happen without Duncan, because...Tim Effin Duncan...but all of those other factors were a part of the Spurs greatness. It's silly to pretend that they weren't crucial to the overall team success. The beautiful game simply doesn't happen without Pop, et. al.

Duncan was the constant and most important variable. Not Pop's coaching, R.C.'s drafting/signing or even Tony, Manu or Robinson.

He was a franchise transitioning piece and the last two summers (since his retirement) prove his importance. I hate speaking in hypotheticals, but I seriously doubt LaMarcus and Kawhi pull this shit with Timmy still in the fold.

Also, Pop and R.C. knew they also had Duncan preaching the company line and setting the example.

They thought they had that with Leonard, but clearly he's easily influenced by internal (Simmons & Dedmon?) and external forces.

Fuck, Timmy was able to block out his ex - wife cheating on him, a financial advisor swindling him and a divorce while still leading the team!

He also played with a box of rocks for brains like Stephen Jackson (ala Simmons/Dedmon) and that didn't sour his relationship with Pop/R.C.

[barbacoataco]

Duncan was the constant and most important variable. Not Pop's coaching, R.C.'s drafting/signing or even Tony, Manu or Robinson.

He was a franchise transitioning piece and the last two summers (since his retirement) prove his importance. I hate speaking in hypotheticals, but I seriously doubt LaMarcus and Kawhi pull this shit with Timmy still in the fold.

Also, Pop and R.C. knee they also had Duncan preaching the company line and setting the example.

They thought they had that with Leonard, but clearly he's easily influenced by internal (Simmons & Dedmon?) and external forces.

Fuck, Timmy was able to block out his ex - wife cheating on him, a financial advisor swindling him and a divorce while still leading the team!

He also played with a box of rocks for brains like Stephen Jackson (ala Simmons/Dedmon) and that didn't sour his relationship with Pop/R.C.

Agree for the most part. I think it was not only his locker room leadership, but mostly he was a great player on both sides of the court and a leader on the court. He had a knack for being in the right place and just a super high by BB IQ. ,

At the same time I'm not going to write off PATFO's accomplishments and call them overrated just because of the whole Leonard thing. And the Spurs did keep winning without Duncan. Not a championship, but making the playoffs and being competitive.

[J_Paco]

Agree for the most part. I think it was not only his locker room leadership, but mostly he was a great player on both sides of the court and a leader on the court. He had a knack for being in the right place and just a super high by BB IQ. ,

At the same time I'm not going to write off PATFO's accomplishments and call them overrated just because of the whole Leonard thing. And the Spurs did keep winning without Duncan. Not a championship, but making the playoffs and being competitive.

Everyone was important and played their position/role, but recently the media has attempted to give most, if not all, the credit for the team's success to Pop and his vaunted "system" (to a lesser extent also to R.C.).

This "saga" helps to put the team's success in better context and that Duncan was the most important piece (on and off the court).

[r0drig0lac]

I didn't learn this now, but it just confirmed that Duncan was responsible for all the success of this franchise, not some magical system that Pop created, nor RC Buford's drafting ability or Chip Engelland's shot rehab..you would think it was a given, but not if you talk basketball with non-Spurs fans:lol

true
this was something most of us already knew, it was always all about Duncan (and Pop certainly knows it better than everyone else)

[Strategic]

That Pop and the Spurs players had no connect with KL. It’s like there was no avenue for communications between the two these last several months. Outside of, or maybe because of, Kawhi’s injuries he must of developed a real dislike and distrust for Pop and the Spurs organization, including his teammates. He ran, not walked away from sure money and likely success on many levels. If I didn’t know better it appears that he was hiding from servitude or communism. Paranoia added to bad council. I wish him the best and just glad the team can finally move on.

[TD 21]

That he said ugly things to a few teammates last year.


That he let the departure of Simmons get under his skin.

What Spurs did with the some of the roster did have something to do with it.

What happened in Brooklyn pre game that made Pop sit him indefinitely.

Dedmon and Simmons weren't the brightest and they caused Kawhi to second guess things going on. Cliques will be cliques.

What a shocker that he befriended Dedmon and Simmons. Guess it was a coincidence.

I'm not blaming the front office for that scumbag being brainwashed, but they had to be arrogant, naïve or a combination thereof, if they thought having a roster or at least core devoid of people that looked, sounded and were of a similar age to him, wasn't a problem.



Bullshit HH. It doesn't happen without Duncan, because...Tim Effin Duncan...but all of those other factors were a part of the Spurs greatness. It's silly to pretend that they weren't crucial to the overall team success. The beautiful game simply doesn't happen without Pop, et. al.

Lesser factors that receive far too much of the credit. It was because Duncan was the antithesis (look, sound, style, etc.) of the typical superstar.

[John B]

Conspiracy is so deep that it would be a long time before the fans learn what actually happened. I hope there’s an ongoing investigation and, if anyone done illegal, should be heavily penalized. Just a shame that a respectable organization like the Spurs, a bar of excellence to other teams, be dragged down by these clowns

[cutewizard]

Spurs should make the following changes soon.........

Tim Duncan, new President of Basketball Ops

Manu, new GM

Becky, new Head Coach

Do it Holt family.......

[cutewizard]

:bobo

Awesomeness change right there.....

[BackHome]

You know Manu would do a Pop and fire Becky and take over head coaching duties..........:lol

[lmbebo]

http://hoopscritic.com/where-the-spurs-went-wrong/

Not sure if posted already ...

[r0drig0lac]

http://hoopscritic.com/where-the-spurs-went-wrong/

Not sure if posted already ...

funny