Derozan better than Manu and tony

[skin27]

I think demar will better than manu and tony stats wise...manu and tony won championships because they had Timmy on their side..but I think demar is a better player than the two..

let see what demar can do as the season continues..

[Fireball]

he seems to be a regular season monster, but you could already witness playoff Derozan in the 4th quarter of the last game ... Manu did provide so much in the playoffs in all aspects of the game that I doubt Derozan is able to surpass that with the remaining years he has left

[skin27]

he seems to be a regular season monster, but you could already witness playoff Derozan in the 4th quarter of the last game ... Manu did provide so much in the playoffs in all aspects of the game that I doubt Derozan is able to surpass that with the remaining years he has left

manu have high basketball IQ and a better defender though but derozan is a lot better on offense

[Kurgan]

Hilarious thread. That chokejob in the fourth and OT was no fluke. That's Derozan's entire playoff career in a nutshell. What we saw tonight is just a preview of what to expect from Demar in the playoffs. It's no coincidence that Pop drew up that final play for a holdover player(Patty) from the 2014 championship Spurs in order to win the game tonight. Even Pop knew not to trust Defrozan or Softridge with the last shot.

[Kurgan]

manu have high basketball IQ and a better defender though but derozan is a lot better on offense

Manu is a thousand times more clutch than Derozan will ever be.

[testies]

How can you compare Manu to Defrozen you idiot. Also, Manu had 60 year old Duncan in 2014 and won, so shut the fuck up

[testies]

Hilarious thread. That chokejob in the fourth and OT was no fluke. That's Derozan's entire playoff career in a nutshell. What we saw tonight is just a preview of what to expect from Demar in the playoffs. It's no coincidence that Pop drew up that final play for a holdover player(Patty) from the 2014 championship Spurs in order to win the game tonight. Even Pop knew not to trust Defrozan or Softridge with the last shot.

The worrying part was his decision making. When we were down 8 in OT, he started panicking like all those shitty East teams do when they start going down big, with crowd against them. He literally asked for a pick and went with his head down into a crowd, pump faked and got blocked or a shitty shot. Spurs biggest thing was maintaining composure when opponents start pulling away, in OKC etc, when they start pulling away thats when we passed it even more and found the open man, and this idiot was making us all Raptors-ish

[Kurgan]

The worrying part was his decision making. When we were down 8 in OT, he started panicking like all those shitty East teams do when they start going down big, with crowd against them. He literally asked for a pick and went with his head down into a crowd, pump faked and got blocked or a shitty shot. Spurs biggest thing was maintaining composure when opponents start pulling away, in OKC etc, when they start pulling away thats when we passed it even more and found the open man, and this idiot was making us all Raptors-ish

Yup, we were just fortunate we were playing against a one man Laker team full of no name scrubs and washed up vets . Otherwise, this would have ended up like every other Derozan vs Lebron game. Demar actually had a decent first half but he reverted to Toronto Demar late in the game. You can't teach guys to be clutch. He just doesn't have it in him. He would be a very competent 2nd or 3rd banana on a contender. Unfortunately, neither him or Aldridge have that first option mentality or clutchness that Duncan or Manu had when they would take over games in the playoffs.

[ceperez]

DeRozan is athletically superior than either Manu or Tony.

What DeRozan needs to develop is the clutch mentality and grit of Manu and Tony.

Lakers game as an example, he didn't have the gas in the end of the game to make good plays.

[Dverde]

Yup, we were just fortunate we were playing against a one man Laker team full of no name scrubs and washed up vets . Otherwise, this would have ended up like every other Derozan vs Lebron game. Demar actually had a decent first half but he reverted to Toronto Demar late in the game. You can't teach guys to be clutch. He just doesn't have it in him. He would be a very competent 2nd or 3rd banana on a contender. Unfortunately, neither him or Aldridge have that first option mentality or clutchness that Duncan or Manu had when they would take over games in the playoffs.

I would call Duncan clutch and Manu fearless. Manu would miss game winners all the time and clutch free throws.

[RC_Drunkford]

this thread is retarded. Derozan is not even close to Parker and Ginobili when it comes to Playoff performance and closing games. Ginobili is one of the clutchest players ever. And I'm not even taking defense into consideration.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

In today's NBA even Bryn Forbes averages 15PPG, so sure DeRozan will probably be statistically on a per game basis better but he'll have a long way to go to match Manu and Tony's championship contributions. Likely never given the state of the Spurs as a contender.

[duncan2k5]

wow this is stupid

[hater]

Dechoker still has to produce in the playoffs.

Premature ejac schoolkid thread tbqh

[Figa]

"stats wise"
do you want actual stats?

Manu was top 5 in RAPM during his entire prime (05-11). Per minute he was as good as anybody in the league.

Derozan never sniffed the top 40 in RPM in his life!

[Mirrornick]

DeMar had great clutch performances in the past. But this game he was forcing things and asking the refs for calls that he should have gotten. Lakers got away with so many fouls and no calls. Great game overall, except he was forcing too much. He'll win y'all games in crunch time many times this year, you'll see.

[kaji157]

I concur with the "stay wise" part.

[TheGreatYacht]

He's better than Manu, that's for sure. Don't know about a top 5 PG of all time

[dabom]

DeMar had great clutch performances in the past. But this game he was forcing things and asking the refs for calls that he should have gotten. Lakers got away with so many fouls and no calls. Great game overall, except he was forcing too much. He'll win y'all games in crunch time many times this year, you'll see.

The refs didn't have a bad game. Detrash was garbage the last 10 mins of the game. :lmao

[Spurs Homer]

Irrelevant - Spurs ain't sniffing a ring unless another Timmy falls from the sky.

[rjv]

i was actually thinking that derozan may be a better offensive player than leonard in that his all-around game (ball handling and passing) is more versatile.

[Mirrornick]

The refs didn't have a bad game. Detrash was garbage the last 10 mins of the game. :lmao

In one of the most critical possessions, Kuzma clearly stepped out of bounds and that should have been a turnover, but instead it allowed the Lakers to make a quick run. There were other instances when DD got hit in the arm but didn't get the call. He averaged 8FT attempts last two seasons. One of the best in the business at drawing fouls. But I am not denying that he played bad in those critical moments. On to the next one!

[DAF86]

manu have high basketball IQ and a better defender though but derozan is a lot better on offense

DeRozan isn't better than Manu at offense, tbh. He isn't a better finisher, he isn't a better shooter nor a better passer.

Put prime Manu on today's NBA and watch him become James Harden with defense and clutchness.

[DAF86]

With that said, DeRozan is exceeding my expectations. He's a much, much better playmaker than I anticipated.

[HarlemHeat37]

DeRozan isn't a rookie, he's been in the league for an eternity, we've already seen what he can do, it isn't a mystery:lol

He has great RS numbers, but completely fails against playoff defenses that actually have time to game plan..also, the refs are stingier with the whistles..

[RsxPiimp]

lower your expectations spurs fan...derozan is a great regular season player tbh :lol

[JeffDuncan]

To be fair to DDR, he played 45 minutes in that game. That's an insane workload for such an early season game. He was exhausted toward the end. The Spurs don't have the personnel to give him a proper breather during games.

[Mirrornick]

I think it's not fair to compare DeRozan with other HOF spurs players especially this early into the season. DD is arguably a top 5 scorer in the league and a underrated passer, but his biggest challenge will be the playoffs. He had great playoffs series in the last few years like against Bucks and Wizards, but unfortunately he was pretty bad against LeBron. This is the year for DD to break that cycle. LETS GO SPURS

As a certified DeRozan stan, I think this is the year DeRozan finishes top 5 in MVP voting. If he can put up 26/6/6 on 48% and good defense, with Spurs finishing top 3, then he has a legit shot IMO.

POP needs to have one of DD or LMA on the floor at all times. We can't have them both on the bench especially when your best player is Belineli taking difficult shots. Hopefully he sees this and makes the right adjustment. I would have DeRozan play the entire 1st quarter. Have LMA go to the bench at the 4 minute mark. And LMA start the 2nd quarter with DD coming back at the 7:30 minute mark. DeRozan can set the tone early in the 1st quarter.

[RC_Drunkford]

DeRozan isn't better than Manu at offense, tbh. He isn't a better finisher, he isn't a better shooter nor a better passer.

Put prime Manu on today's NBA and watch him become James Harden with defense and clutchness.

that 100%

[John B]

Manu had iron balls. He was the leader of the Olympic Gold team. The guy could easily averaged higher if not for Spurs system which also defined him as the most unselfish champion I know. I love Timmy but Manu was demi-god. Tony was the real flash, not Wade who Shaq dubbed because he’s superman. Tony would zoom pass 2-3 defenders quick in his youth. He led field goal avg in the paint among trees. The guy was fearless and at his size? But Demar is a more smooth scorer than the two. He’s closer to Gervin with how he scores in bunches. He will pick his spots and just score. Again more closer to Gervin than the two if you want the comparison. I think it’s up to Pops to pace his minutes so he has enough in the tank in the 4th quarter. At the end of the day, he will be a beloved Spur because of his loyalty and his jersey will be up there with the greatest along with LMA’s. I can’t wait for Murray, White and Walker to be back, especially LW4. I think he will be a beast. I think Spurs will be in a ring hunt in a year or two, also with Metu and Poeltl developing solid. For now Demar and LMA will both carry this team this year. GSG :flag:

[TDomination]

I think demar will better than manu and tony stats wise...manu and tony won championships because they had Timmy on their side..but I think demar is a better player than the two..

let see what demar can do as the season continues..

he likely will be better than them stat wise. thats about it.

but if the spurs win 1 championship while he's here, than we can at least open a discussion of him being better than them overall. he needs to perform well in the playoffs in big games.

[dabom]

i was actually thinking that derozan may be a better offensive player than leonard in that his all-around game (ball handling and passing) is more versatile.

His ball handling and passing is better but his ability to score is worse. Kawhi cuts off his man with his body and reacts to players. DeRozan seems to think of what he wants to do beforehand and that isn't smart basketball wise.

[skin27]

Look what tony’s Doing in Charlotte...hahaha..

if derozan had young Duncan on his side he can win a ring too..

[duncan2k5]

i was actually thinking that derozan may be a better offensive player than leonard in that his all-around game (ball handling and passing) is more versatile.

He definitely isn't a better offensive player than Kawhi... Knock it off... Being able to look flashier dribbling doesn't make u better... Kawhi is much more efficient with his movements... Just look at what raps fans have to say about Kawhi to see who wins that trade

[Mirrornick]

It would have been great if we had at least one season of prime Manu as the 1st option. Let's pretend Timmy and TP were not playing. How would Manu do as the primary option. Manu sacrificed so much for the team and still managed to become a future HOF.

[duncan2k5]

I think it's not fair to compare DeRozan with other HOF spurs players especially this early into the season. DD is arguably a top 5 scorer in the league and a underrated passer, but his biggest challenge will be the playoffs. He had great playoffs series in the last few years like against Bucks and Wizards, but unfortunately he was pretty bad against LeBron. This is the year for DD to break that cycle. LETS GO SPURS

As a certified DeRozan stan, I think this is the year DeRozan finishes top 5 in MVP voting. If he can put up 26/6/6 on 48% and good defense, with Spurs finishing top 3, then he has a legit shot IMO.

POP needs to have one of DD or LMA on the floor at all times. We can't have them both on the bench especially when your best player is Belineli taking difficult shots. Hopefully he sees this and makes the right adjustment. I would have DeRozan play the entire 1st quarter. Have LMA go to the bench at the 4 minute mark. And LMA start the 2nd quarter with DD coming back at the 7:30 minute mark. DeRozan can set the tone early in the 1st quarter.

How is DD a top 5 scorer when he hasn't finished top 5 in scoring ever?

[skin27]

It would have been great if we had at least one season of prime Manu as the 1st option. Let's pretend Timmy and TP were not playing. How would Manu do as the primary option. Manu sacrificed so much for the team and still managed to become a future HOF.

yup!! I’m thinking about this one too..what if manu played in Toronto or other teams? Can he carry a team on his shoulders?

[Mirrornick]

How is DD a top 5 scorer when he hasn't finished top 5 in scoring ever?

He was #5 in PPG back in 2016-2017. That was without a 3pt shot.

1.Westbrook - 31ppg
2. Harden - 29 PPG
3.Isiah Thomas 28 PPG
4. Anthony Davis- 28PPG
5. DeRozan - 27 PPG

[SwansonInSibagat]

DeRozan's actually quite clutch. There's a stat somewhere attesting to it. He had his worst games againt LeBron, though, and that tends to be the ones most people remember him by, especially since they typically resulted to playoff exits.

It's pretty unfair to compare him to Manu and Tony, though. Both of the latter have consistently been on very successful teams, helmed by a certain No. 21. Both have had more opportunities to prove themselves in the biggest of stages. Derozan, on the other hand, has only been to 3 or 4 of those, and has had to deal with a Top 5 all - time talent each time.

I'm a fan of this team and I will root for him to succeed. If that means eclipsing two of the most beloved Spurs of all time, hey, is that not a reason to celebrate? For that means nothing less than more championships.

That's why I don't get some of you denigrating his contributions so far. Rooting for him to fail just to keep the legacy or what you think are the hallowed place of our now - gone heroes intact.

Well, Spurstalk.

[Dhbsr555]

Lol if Manu got 37 minutes his stats would be crazy when he was In his prime

[Seventyniner]

Lol if Manu got 37 minutes his stats would be crazy when he was In his prime

If Manu played 37 minutes on any sort of regular basis his foot would fall right off.

[duncan2k5]

He was #5 in PPG back in 2016-2017. That was without a 3pt shot.

1.Westbrook - 31ppg
2. Harden - 29 PPG
3.Isiah Thomas 28 PPG
4. Anthony Davis- 28PPG
5. DeRozan - 27 PPG

ok...so ONE year he was fifth in scoring...and all of a sudden he is a top 5 scorer? fam gtfoh...that same year kawhi took almost 4 less shots per game, whie scoring only 2 points less and having a FG% of dam near 10% higher...and kawhi was barely touching his prime while derozean was in his...lets not even come close to pretending derozean was as good as kawhi on either offense or defense

[Mirrornick]

ok...so ONE year he was fifth in scoring...and all of a sudden he is a top 5 scorer? fam gtfoh...that same year kawhi took almost 4 less shots per game, whie scoring only 2 points less and having a FG% of dam near 10% higher...and kawhi was barely touching his prime while derozean was in his...lets not even come close to pretending derozean was as good as kawhi on either offense or defense

Not sure why you brought up Kawhi vs DeRozan. You said that DeRozan never finished top 5 and I corrected you with the facts. And again you are reaching. Kawhi did NOT have a FG% near 10% higher than DeRozan. In fact in 2016-2017 season, they were both respectively at 47% and 48%.

Cheers

[duncan2k5]

DeRozan's actually quite clutch. There's a stat somewhere attesting to it. He had his worst games againt LeBron, though, and that tends to be the ones most people remember him by, especially since they typically resulted to playoff exits.

It's pretty unfair to compare him to Manu and Tony, though. Both of the latter have consistently been on very successful teams, helmed by a certain No. 21. Both have had more opportunities to prove themselves in the biggest of stages. Derozan, on the other hand, has only been to 3 or 4 of those, and has had to deal with a Top 5 all - time talent each time.

I'm a fan of this team and I will root for him to succeed. If that means eclipsing two of the most beloved Spurs of all time, hey, is that not a reason to celebrate? For that means nothing less than more championships.

That's why I don't get some of you denigrating his contributions so far. Rooting for him to fail just to keep the legacy or what you think are the hallowed place of our now - gone heroes intact.

Well, Spurstalk.

"quite clutch"? my guy...it's ok to acknowledge we got the worse player in the deal...no need to overhype him....we look pathetic...Raps fans are rejoicing right now, as they should...kawhi is a vastly suerior player to derozean, and of he were still a spur, anyone implying otherwise would be laughed out of the forum or possibly banned for being a troll

[hater]

"quite clutch"? my guy...it's ok to acknowledge we got the worse player in the deal...no need to overhype him....we look pathetic...Raps fans are rejoicing right now, as they should...kawhi is a vastly suerior player to derozean, and of he were still a spur, anyone implying otherwise would be laughed out of the forum or possibly banned for being a troll

we look pathetic? speak for yourself clown

I am happy we got rid of Mute Cancer and got a real player tbqh

had we kept Mute Cancer he would still be rehabing in NYC :lmao

[Amuseddaysleeper]

DeRozan's actually quite clutch. There's a stat somewhere attesting to it. He had his worst games againt LeBron, though, and that tends to be the ones most people remember him by, especially since they typically resulted to playoff exits.

It's pretty unfair to compare him to Manu and Tony, though. Both of the latter have consistently been on very successful teams, helmed by a certain No. 21. Both have had more opportunities to prove themselves in the biggest of stages. Derozan, on the other hand, has only been to 3 or 4 of those, and has had to deal with a Top 5 all - time talent each time.

I'm a fan of this team and I will root for him to succeed. If that means eclipsing two of the most beloved Spurs of all time, hey, is that not a reason to celebrate? For that means nothing less than more championships.

That's why I don't get some of you denigrating his contributions so far. Rooting for him to fail just to keep the legacy or what you think are the hallowed place of our now - gone heroes intact.

Well, Spurstalk.


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Chkf7qXWkAEAinJ.jpg:large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CgwoYyqWkAEP1sJ.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CiNnU40WEAAtouy.jpg:large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ChljBrqWsAACsbm.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C9fhgBhUMAE_FtB.jpg

How about **** NO!

He is an absolute train wreck in late game situations and one of the least clutch playoff performers in NBA history. The Spurs ceiling if they get some lucky breaks is to get swept in the second round so DeRozan choking in the playoffs won't matter much since the Spurs don't have the personnel to have any payoff success anyway with how this team is structured.

But make no mistake about it, DeRozan is one of the most anti clutch players of his generation. Wonderful regular season player, but come playoff time he falls off a cliff.

[K...]

Lol if Manu got 37 minutes his stats would be crazy when he was In his prime

Ginobili would be legendary in the no defense, 3pt offense, short shot clock era we're going into. He wasn't tough enough for 90s/00 ball, but if Curry, Durant, and harden can thrive ginobili would be at that level.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

had we kept Mute Cancer he would still be rehabing in NYC :lmao

:rollin

[DAF86]

Ginobili would be legendary in the no defense, 3pt offense, short shot clock era we're going into. He wasn't tough enough for 90s/00 ball, but if Curry, Durant, and harden can thrive ginobili would be at that level.

Ginobili wasn't tough? What now? :lol

[ducks]

tp has mentored walker into a better player

tp was a finals mvp
people are forgetting that
derozan is better then both now but both are past their prime

[Mirrornick]

I think players with different roles should not be compared. Example, Tony Parker or Manu were never legit 1st options. They were always surrounded with HOF talents. Whereas DeRozan never had that luxury.

[in2deep]

I think players with different roles should not be compared. Example, Tony Parker or Manu were never legit 1st options. They were always surrounded with HOF talents. Whereas DeRozan never had that luxury.

Parker was the #1 option in the Spurs for a few years even FMVP and runner up LMVP

New to basketball?

[K...]

Ginobili wasn't tough? What now? :lol

As in durability. Now days every small hit is a foul and the days of enforcers (save golden State) is over.

[Mirrornick]

Parker was the #1 option in the Spurs for a few years even FMVP and runner up LMVP

New to basketball?

No I watched the Spurs play back in 2007. They had multiple HOF players. That was my point really.

[DAF86]

I think players with different roles should not be compared. Example, Tony Parker or Manu were never legit 1st options. They were always surrounded with HOF talents. Whereas DeRozan never had that luxury.

That works both ways, tbh. Not having to share touches with HoF teammates means more raw stats for you.

[RC_Drunkford]

I think players with different roles should not be compared. Example, Tony Parker or Manu were legit 1st options. They were always HOF talents. Whereas DeRozan never had that luxury.

fixed it for you

[Mirrornick]

fixed it for you

thanks I guess

[Mirrornick]

That works both ways, tbh. Not having to share touches with HoF teammates means more raw stats for you.

Yes but in the end I think it also comes down to team records. Derozan played on a team who won 50+ games for multiple seasons and he was the primary option and go to scorer. All in all, TP and Manu are spurs legends and I would rather if we never compared DeRozan with them this early on. We might be setting ourselves up for disappointment. Best approach is to lower our expectations! cheers

[MannyIsGod]

Tony Parker was absolutely a first option for the Spurs. Not sure how thats deniable. He was the first option on the Spurs in 2012 and 2013 for sure.

[in2deep]

No I watched the Spurs play back in 2007. They had multiple HOF players. That was my point really.

Doubt you really watched

parker was our centerpiece and go to guy for a few years

[Mirrornick]

Doubt you really watched

parker was our centerpiece and go to guy for a few years

So Tim Duncan was the 2nd option? I always thought the "better" player was the 1st option.

[HarlemHeat37]

So Tim Duncan was the 2nd option? I always thought the "better" player was the 1st option.

Parker was an elite system player from 2011-2013, legit MVP candidate due to Pop..

[in2deep]

So Tim Duncan was the 2nd option? I always thought the "better" player was the 1st option.

Of course Duncan was the 2nd option when Parker was the 1st.

Duncan was also the 3d or 4th option when Kawhi emerged.

your ignorance of Spurs basketball is glaring

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

DeRozan playing 25-30 minutes would probably look pretty great. 45 minutes was too much run for him and he was worn out at the end of the game and in the OT. The Lakers end of the bench scrubs looked good in OT because all the other guys on the floor were worn out.

[callo1]

Dude is having to run the point due to injuries. He played mega minutes last night, and visably lost his legs down the stretch.

Derozan is a stud on offense, and will improve dramatically on defense by the end of the year.

I am just glad that LA and DeMar can be seen next to one another on the bench chatting it up, both laughing and smiling, something we would have never seen out of the guy he replaced.

Derozan has never played for a great coach until now.

[paperboy77]

Probably better in a “who gives a shit if they ring” kinda way. But as for impact to a franchise? There is zero comparison yet. Probably will never get to Timmy-Tony-Manu status.

[Mirrornick]

Of course Duncan was the 2nd option when Parker was the 1st.

Duncan was also the 3d or 4th option when Kawhi emerged.

your ignorance of Spurs basketball is glaring

I wasn't talking about older Duncan. I was specifically talking about 2006-2007 season.

[gambit1990]

not better than manu.

[in2deep]

I wasn't talking about older Duncan. I was specifically talking about 2006-2007 season.

No you werent. You literally said aparker was never a 1st option :lol

this is what you said:


I think players with different roles should not be compared. Example, Tony Parker or Manu were never legit 1st options. They were always surrounded with HOF talents. Whereas DeRozan never had that luxury.

as me and other have told you that is simply not true. Parker was a 1st option a few years.

[cd98]

DeRozan is fun to watch. He has a little Manu to his game. If he had Manu’s effort on defense and will to win, he would be a better player. I think Manu also didn’t rely on one on one moves to create for others. That’s not a rip on DeRozen. He hasn’t looked selfish, but he creates more like Tony except Tony creating happened on the 2nd pass after he created, but DeRozen gets his on the first pass...hence a bunch of assists.

[Mirrornick]

No you werent. You literally said aparker was never a 1st option :lol

this is what you said:




as me and other have told you that is simply not true. Parker was a 1st option a few years.

I certainly meant that he was never a true first option during Tim Duncan's prime. Moving on :)

[Mirrornick]

DeRozan is fun to watch. He has a little Manu to his game. If he had Manu’s effort on defense and will to win, he would be a better player. I think Manu also didn’t rely on one on one moves to create for others. That’s not a rip on DeRozen. He hasn’t looked selfish, but he creates more like Tony except Tony creating happened on the 2nd pass after he created, but DeRozen gets his on the first pass...hence a bunch of assists.

Last year in Toronto, DeRozan had many hockey assists because of the offense they ran. The offense was always 1) DeRozan drives and kicks to the open player on the perimeter and then they proceed to move the ball to an even more open man. This year what I am liking so far is DD playing in the post. This is where Dwane Casey was an idiot for misusing DeRozan. DD killed the defense in the post especially when they switch and a smaller defender guards DeRozan. I never understood why Casey loved running 3 point guards at the same time when you have a DeRozan who can do pretty much all the facilitating. So far I am liking DD playing more in the post and running screen and rolls with LMA. LMA is getting wide open looks a lot of the time.

[FrankC]

So Tim Duncan was the 2nd option? I always thought the "better" player was the 1st option.
So then Lowry was the 1st option for the Raptors the last 5+ years?

[in2deep]

I certainly meant that he was never a true first option during Tim Duncan's prime. Moving on :)

No you didnt. You were comparing Manu and Parker never being 1st option as opposed to Derozan

read your post again.

As proven Parker was a 1st option for a few years so your theory has been proven wrong. Moving on :lol

[skin27]

Parker was never been a first option he was just a side kick of Timmy.

[dabom]

Detrash vs Manu. :lmao

[K...]

Parker was never been a first option he was just a side kick of Timmy.

we're talking offense only here. Parker was def a first option during his peak and duncan's post peak.

[skin27]

we're talking offense only here. Parker was def a first option during his peak and duncan's post peak.

Nope..he was just a good system player..look at him now in Charlotte and last year..lol

[MannyIsGod]

So Tim Duncan was the 2nd option? I always thought the "better" player was the 1st option.

Um, yes.

I've had it with you new Spurs fans. Its ok if you don't know shit but don't act like you do.

[DAF86]

Um, yes.

I've had it with you new Spurs fans. Its ok if you don't know shit but don't act like you do.

He's not a Spurs fan, tbh. He's a DeRozan fan. He even said it himself.

[Arcadian]

Better than 2017-18 Manu and Parker? Obviously.

[skin27]

Better than 2017-18 Manu and Parker? Obviously.


Even better in their primes..Tony and manu have Timmy in their primes that’s why they won championships as a sidekicks of Duncan..

think of this..what if you put 2008 manu in Toronto, can Toronto win a championship with manu or tony as their 1 option?

[TheGreatYacht]

Nope..he was just a good system player..look at him now in Charlotte and last year..lol
He's about to turn 37 and is on his 18th season you pinoy trannie.

[skin27]

He's about to turn 37 and is on his 18th season you pinoy trannie.

37 year old duncan got into all nba first team.. don’t bing the age excuse faggot

[SpurOutofTownFan]

I think demar will better than manu and tony stats wise...manu and tony won championships because they had Timmy on their side..but I think demar is a better player than the two..

let see what demar can do as the season continues..

It doesn't look like you've been around for long -

Tony and Many were never asked to drop big numbers. The Spurs didn't play super-star basketball, but team basketball so it was very common to get 4-5 players on double digit every night. But make no mistake, Tony and Manu could have easily drop 30 pts a game had they been asked to do so. They had such quality in them.

I also take issue to your comment that they won because Timmy was there. I could say the opposite was true as well

So, no - you are blinded by the new lights but time will put people in their rightful place.

I'm mesmerized by those who want to rewrite history or haven't watched the Spurs in the last 20 years and just come and make up stuff

[skin27]

It doesn't look like you've been around for long -

Tony and Many were never asked to drop big numbers. The Spurs didn't play super-star basketball, but team basketball so it was very common to get 4-5 players on double digit every night. But make no mistake, Tony and Manu could have easily drop 30 pts a game had they been asked to do so. They had such quality in them.

I also take issue to your comment that they won because Timmy was there. I could say the opposite was true as well

So, no - you are blinded by the new lights but time will put people in their rightful place.

I'm mesmerized by those who want to rewrite history or haven't watched the Spurs in the last 20 years and just come and make up stuff

FYI I followed the spurs since 2003.. parker and manu benefited on duncan’s Presence.. they are both Duncan’s sidekick..

manu had the chance to score and carry the team in 2010-2011 season but he failed to average 20pts a game and loss to the 8 seed grizzlies in the playoffs..

[John B]

yup!! I’m thinking about this one too..what if manu played in Toronto or other teams? Can he carry a team on his shoulders?
umm yup. Manu led the Argetinia to Olympic Gold much more than Raptors in the weaker east.

[skin27]

umm yup. Manu led the Argetinia to Olympic Gold much more than Raptors in the weaker east.


Nah..olympics is different in nba.. mills also carried australia to olympic gold medal match,so it means mills can also carry the spurs to the nba finals?

[in2deep]

FYI I followed the spurs since 2003.. parker and manu benefited on duncan’s Presence.. they are both Duncan’s sidekick..

manu had the chance to score and carry the team in 2010-2011 season but he failed to average 20pts a game and loss to the 8 seed grizzlies in the playoffs..

You mean the series vs Grizz when Manu played with a broken arm? :lmao

even if you are trying to troll you are not very good at this newbie

[skin27]

You mean the series vs Grizz when Manu played with a broken arm? :lmao

even if you are trying to troll you are not very good at this newbie

but he still played in that series except game 1 ..

dont bring up injury excuse..

[in2deep]

but he still played in that series except game ..

dont bring up injury excuse..

“Dont bring up the fact the player had a broken arm” :cry

lol disappointing troll

[skin27]

“Dont bring up the fact the player had a broken arm” :cry

lol disappointing troll


No no excuse my friend..manu can’t carry an nba team as the go to guy..

[in2deep]

No no excuse my friend..manu can’t carry an nba team as the go to guy..

Not fully disagreeing with you but your reasons are pathetic

lol listing a series where he had a broken arm and the rest of the team was trash

a prime Manu with the stacked Toronto rosted in the east easily makes the East Finals

a prime Parker has a good chance at NBA finals

:rolleyes But go ahead and list more horrible reasons to back up your claim

[skin27]

Not fully disagreeing with you but your reasons are pathetic

lol listing a series where he had a broken arm and the rest of the team was trash

a prime Manu with the stacked Toronto rosted in the east easily makes the East Finals

a prime Parker has a good chance at NBA finals

:rolleyes

i brought up that series because that was the year pop started to limit Duncan’s minutes and gave manu the green light to carry the team as the primary option..

manu was the primary option that season..

but what happen? First round exit..

[John B]

Nah..olympics is different in nba.. mills also carried australia to olympic gold medal match,so it means mills can also carry the spurs to the nba finals?
When did Australia Basketball Team play olympic gold? Their basketball team best showing is Quarterfinals and has zero olympic medals. Now you’re just trolling. :lmao:lmao

[skin27]

When did Australia Basketball Team play olympic gold? Their basketball team best showing is Quarterfinals and has zero olympic medals. Now you’re just trolling. :lmao:lmao


NBA is different from olympics though..

[TDMVPDPOY]

that year the spurs loss to the grizzlies in a sweep

if you watch them 4 games, especially 1st half performance duncan was getting his anytime he touch the ball, then 2nd halves all his touches dried up due to hero ball enrique

[diego]

I dont know which is more stupid.. comparing a 29 year old to a retired player and a 36 year old who plays a different position, basing your argument on a 3 game sample size, or pretending that tim was the same player throughout his 19 year career....

Oh and btw, the 2011 Spurs had the best record in the west, one win less than the bulls, more than any raptors team ever, and would have beat the grizzlies with a healthy manu, he could have, should have, and wanted to play that game 1, that loss is on pop

[therealtruth]

that year the spurs loss to the grizzlies in a sweep

if you watch them 4 games, especially 1st half performance duncan was getting his anytime he touch the ball, then 2nd halves all his touches dried up due to hero ball enrique

One of TP's many playoff failures.

[TDMVPDPOY]

One of TP's many playoff failures.

hero ball enrique is the worse thing to ever happen to the spurs... imo they shouldve looked for a pass first pg or get that cunt to be a facilitator more then trying to look for his own points hero ball...

in the event had the spurs had a jumping jack center something like jordan/capela who loves to catch lobs or deep in the key for easy 2pt dunks...enrique would never fully utilized them...oh wait, the spurs had dedmon and they failed with him

[skin27]

hero ball enrique is the worse thing to ever happen to the spurs... imo they shouldve looked for a pass first pg or get that cunt to be a facilitator more then trying to look for his own points hero ball...

in the event had the spurs had a jumping jack center something like jordan/capela who loves to catch lobs or deep in the key for easy 2pt dunks...enrique would never fully utilized them...oh wait, the spurs had dedmon and they failed with him

Can you enumerate the seasons parker hero balled?

[TDMVPDPOY]

Can you enumerate the seasons parker hero balled?

the day the pos was drafted to the day he left the team

he had the green light when he became starter
from 08-12 he was given the keys to the car, he redline it but got team nowhere.....patfo basically wasted tims prime years by giving this pos the keys to the team
getting a big head thinking he win mvp in a year all the good players were riddle with injuries, then the pos was exposed in the playoffs

[skin27]

the day the pos was drafted to the day he left the team

he had the green light when he became starter
from 08-12 he was given the keys to the car, he redline it but got team nowhere.....patfo basically wasted tims prime years by giving this pos the keys to the team
getting a big head thinking he win mvp in a year all the good players were riddle with injuries, then the pos was exposed in the playoffs

you mean 2008-2009 to 2011-2012?

[RC_Drunkford]

No no excuse my friend..manu can’t carry an nba team as the go to guy..

you should rewatch the 2005 Spurs-Pistons series. 2011 Manu wasn't prime Manu. 2005 Manu was.

The problem with you Ginobili haters is, you remember 35-40 year old Manu and say, oh he's not that good. Not understanding that that's Manu at an age where Kobe Bryant isn't even in the league anymore and Manu still goes and blocks the MVP of the league on a game winning shot in a Playoff game or drops 18 points in 20 minutes on the most stacked NBA Team ever. None of y'all remember 2005 Manu Ginobili who the Detroit Pistons couldn't even stop. He would destroy defenses on the regular. Prime Manu is James Harden with clutchness, incredible defense, even better passing, more mental toughness and even more athleticism

[skin27]

you should rewatch the 2005 Spurs-Pistons series. 2011 Manu wasn't prime Manu. 2005 Manu was.

The problem with you Ginobili haters is, you remember 35-40 year old Manu and say, oh he's not that good. Not understanding that that's Manu at an age where Kobe Bryant isn't even in the league anymore and Manu still goes and blocks the MVP of the league on a game winning shot in a Playoff game or drops 18 points in 20 minutes on the most stacked NBA Team ever. None of y'all remember 2005 Manu Ginobili who the Detroit Pistons couldn't even stop. He would destroy defenses on the regular. Prime Manu is James Harden with clutchness, incredible defense, even better passing, more mental toughness and even more athleticism


Duncan was the man from 1998 to 2010..so in 2005 duncan was the one who carry the spurs..manu played the sidekick role..

harden won the mvp award..manu never finished in top 5 for mvp or even get to all nba first team..

anyway manu’s best season was 2007-2008 and 2010-2011.. he doesn’t even get to all nba first team those years..

[dabom]

Weak trolls. Even Derozans kids would say Manu. :lol

[in2deep]

Weak trolls. Even Derozans kids would say Manu. :lol

:lol todays trolls

[SpursDynasty85]

He could be but it's hard to tell right now. TP and Manu would've lit up this no D league too.

[DAF86]

Even better in their primes..Tony and manu have Timmy in their primes that’s why they won championships as a sidekicks of Duncan..

think of this..what if you put 2008 manu in Toronto, can Toronto win a championship with manu or tony as their 1 option?

Could DeRozan win a championship with Toronto in 2008 or any other year?

[Arcadian]

think of this..what if you put 2008 manu in Toronto, can Toronto win a championship with manu or tony as their 1 option?

Toronto didn't win a championship with Derozan, either, so that's a pointless thought exercise.

[DAF86]

but he still played in that series except game 1 ..

dont bring up injury excuse..

They only reason the Spurs lost that series is because the Spurs lost HCA in game 1, where Manu couldn't play. :lmao

[Glen]

DeMar is easily a better player than either Manu or parker both of whom benefited from playing with a prime Duncan and elite coaching... it's only been 3 games so far but already it's obvious his game eclipses theirs just wait until he's fully integrated in the system, spurstalk gonna forget all about kawitter

[DAF86]

DeMar is easily a better player than either Manu or parker both of whom benefited from playing with a prime Duncan and elite coaching... it's only been 3 games so far but already it's obvious his game eclipses theirs just wait until he's fully integrated in the system, spurstalk gonna forget all about kawitter

Fucking new accounts. :lol

[dontouchmebwo]

you gotta be stupid or willfully ignorant to not see DD is way better than Parker and Manu, he'd have a couple rings too if he played next to Duncan

[in2deep]

Lol way better

dissapointing troll

[DMC]

I think demar will better than manu and tony stats wise...manu and tony won championships because they had Timmy on their side..but I think demar is a better player than the two..

let see what demar can do as the season continues..

You fucked up now. Get ready for the collective fury of the two churches.

[in2deep]

You fucked up now. Get ready for the collective fury of the two churches.

The 2 churches are abandoned and have begome museums

ship has sailed but trills will troll

[John B]

I like Demar so far in the first 3 games he played. And I hope for ST sanity he carries the team and deliver in the playoffs. But till then, come on you’re comparing him to iron-balls Manu and Tony who torched LBJ (Demar couldn’t touch) in 2007. Come on rest the case. This is ST and either you like Manu or get the fuck out of here :nope:ban::blah:lol

[dontouchmebwo]

I like Demar so far in the first 3 games he played. And I hope for ST sanity he carries the team and deliver in the playoffs. But till then, come on you’re comparing him to iron-balls Manu and Tony who torched LBJ (Demar couldn’t touch) in 2007. Come on rest the case. This is ST and either you like Manu or get the fuck out of here :nope:ban::blah:lol

Cavs put up 76, 92, 72, 82 ppg, that ain't Parker or Manu's doing, that's all Duncan, Bowen, Pop, their defense won championships not their offense.

[John B]

Cavs put up 76, 92, 72, 82 ppg, that ain't Parker or Manu's doing, that's all Duncan, Bowen, Pop, their defense won championships not their offense.
Have you seriously watched the 2007 Finals. Parker spinning, outrunning, shooting over trees, against 4 defenders. I loved Timmy and Manu and I’m not discrediting them, but I said Tony toarched LBJ team and he did averaging 25 points. I like Demar, but he has yet to do that.

[daledondale]

People still underrating Parker and Manu in 2018. Only in Spurstalk.

[dontouchmebwo]

Have you seriously watched the 2007 Finals. Parker spinning, outrunning, shooting over trees, against 4 defenders. I loved Timmy and Manu and I’m not discrediting them, but I said Tony toarched LBJ team and he did averaging 25 points. I like Demar, but he has yet to do that.

Outside Lebron that team was trash, Parker had the easiest match up on the court, they were starting Gibson at PG who was the 42nd pick in the draft a year earlier. I go with player match ups and it was Duncan by far that had the hardest match up on the court.

When have the Spurs ever been known for their offense? Defense won them championships.

[in2deep]

People still underrating Parker and Manu in 2018. Only in Spurstalk.

Just curious. Why do you have a gif of fat mexicans doing mating calls in your sig?

[daledondale]

Just curious. Why do you have a gif of fat mexicans doing mating calls in your sig?
Meh, i don't know. I found that gif searching other stuff and i just put it.

[phxspurfan]

premature thread. DeMar as good as he is as hood as he is will burn out bc Sperms have no talent

[dabom]

Fucking new accounts. :lol

18-23 year olds. :lol

[SpurOutofTownFan]

FYI I followed the spurs since 2003.. parker and manu benefited on duncan’s Presence.. they are both Duncan’s sidekick..

manu had the chance to score and carry the team in 2010-2011 season but he failed to average 20pts a game and loss to the 8 seed grizzlies in the playoffs..

You are incorrect in many levels - let me rephrase:

Manu and Tony both could have carried any team being the main guy scoring 30+ pts each night during their prime years. It just happened that they played the Spurs' system which simply doesn't play that way.

I can also mention we will never know whether Duncan in all his greatness could have won any rings without another star next to him. Every championship team usually has 2-3 top star players.

I cannot take you seriously at all - you clearly haven't followed the Spurs all of these years so please don't tell us you've been following them since 2003. It's not believable

Now that all of these players are gone it's normal that some people would try to rewrite history, after they are all gone - but we all watched what happened and it's not what you are saying

[therealtruth]

Demar needs be measured by what he does in the playoffs. The same as Manu/TP. They could have had much better regular season stats if Pop had played them more minutes.

[testies]

You can't judge him right now, he must be depressed to the point that it's crippling. He was already depressed but was the face of a rising franchise, in a great cosmopolitan city and loved, going to a franchise which is essentially the same as the Hornets right now, and don't start on SA vs Toronto city comparison

[ThaBigFundamental21]

Did you watch those 2 in their prime? It's easy to become a prisoner of the moment, especially with Demar's current offensive output.
We got accustomed to seeing Tony and Manu as players in their mid/late 30's with their primes well gone and passed. Obviously, Manu is retired. Tony not far behind.
Also, in some metrics the Spurs are currently last in the NBA in defense. And actually the worst of all time, albeit a small sample size as well as scoring going through the roof. Do you apply zero of that blame to Demar simply because he is scoring and assisting at a high rate and it is exciting to watch? Demar has always been a shall we say, a below average defender. We are seeing that right now.
Remember everyone for their prime and do not become a prisoner of the moment.

[DAF86]

For those with poor memory or a glaring ignorance of the type of player Manu was, this is a scout review from a slighlty past prime Manu in 2008:

Overview: A left-handed shooting guard who is deceptively athletic and tremendously skilled. One of the best all-around players in the league at his position. Easily the biggest steal of all-time in the draft considering where he was selected—57th! Decent build for his position. Really gets the most out of his athleticism. Has a nice first step, superb fluidity and surprising leaping ability. Possesses a great offensive skill set. Can score in a number of different ways thanks to his terrific body control, but does so efficiently. Plays good defense too. One of the craftiest players in the League. Honed his craft in Argentina in his youth, but became what he is playing in Italy before coming to the NBA. Used his experience to his advantage and became a very good player early in his tenure with the Spurs. One time All-Star. Comes off the bench despite his status as a star player. Very effective when used in that way. Per-minute one of the best players in the NBA. Doesn’t get nearly enough credit for how good he is. Keeps getting better and better too. Took time to develop the trust of his coaching staff, but is arguably San Antonio’s most important player now. A phenomenal teammate, has no ego--intangibles are off the charts. Won NBA Championships with the Spurs in 2003, 2005, and 2007.

Offense: A dynamic offensive player who makes a huge impact off the bench. Gets a third of his shots running the pick and roll and another quarter as a spot up shooter. Displays a very consistent lefty jumper with impressive consistency from three point range. Wasn’t always as great of a shooter, but has worked extremely hard to become one. Takes a lot of threes. Great catch and shoot player. Takes more shots off the dribble than from a stand still. Connects at a respectable pace. Great ball handler and a tremendous passer. Can get minutes at the point and run the offense. Displays deceptive quickness, and even more deceptive leaping ability. Turns the corner on the pick and roll consistently, and gets in the lane at a very impressive rate. Slithery player who is as unorthodox as they come. Simply outsmarts his competition. Will dunk the ball at the rim, hard, and even in traffic when he gets a running start. Very creative when he can’t get above the rim. Displays tremendous touch on his finger roll. Will go right into the defense to draw contact. Goes to the line at a superb rate. Shoots a very good percentage from the foul line. Extremely efficient player in general.

Defense: An extremely intelligent defender who reads the game and makes plays because of it. Plays aggressive on ball defensive. Gets in a low stance and slides his feet. Will get called for some blocking fouls, but will also draw a ton of charges. Largely considered a flopper, but he certainly knows how to make an impact with that skill. Reads passing lanes extremely well. Gets a lot of strips and deflections. Will block shots in transition too. Surprisingly explosive when he comes over from the weak side. Very good rebounder for his position. Not afraid to get physical

- Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Manu-Ginobili-2562/ ©DraftExpress

You won't find a scout report like that for DeRozan at any point in history, tbh.

[JeffDuncan]

...
Also, in some metrics the Spurs are currently last in the NBA in defense. And actually the worst of all time, albeit a small sample size as well as scoring going through the roof. Do you apply zero of that blame to Demar ...

No way does DDR get any blame for the 2018 Spurs dumpster fire that he got dropped into. His history is absolutely the last thing the Spurs should worry about.

[therealtruth]

Demar Depression

[RC_Drunkford]

For those with poor memory or a glaring ignorance of the type of player Manu was, this is a scout review from a slighlty past prime Manu in 2008:

Overview: A left-handed shooting guard who is deceptively athletic and tremendously skilled. One of the best all-around players in the league at his position. Easily the biggest steal of all-time in the draft considering where he was selected—57th! Decent build for his position. Really gets the most out of his athleticism. Has a nice first step, superb fluidity and surprising leaping ability. Possesses a great offensive skill set. Can score in a number of different ways thanks to his terrific body control, but does so efficiently. Plays good defense too. One of the craftiest players in the League. Honed his craft in Argentina in his youth, but became what he is playing in Italy before coming to the NBA. Used his experience to his advantage and became a very good player early in his tenure with the Spurs. One time All-Star. Comes off the bench despite his status as a star player. Very effective when used in that way. Per-minute one of the best players in the NBA. Doesn’t get nearly enough credit for how good he is. Keeps getting better and better too. Took time to develop the trust of his coaching staff, but is arguably San Antonio’s most important player now. A phenomenal teammate, has no ego--intangibles are off the charts. Won NBA Championships with the Spurs in 2003, 2005, and 2007.

Offense: A dynamic offensive player who makes a huge impact off the bench. Gets a third of his shots running the pick and roll and another quarter as a spot up shooter. Displays a very consistent lefty jumper with impressive consistency from three point range. Wasn’t always as great of a shooter, but has worked extremely hard to become one. Takes a lot of threes. Great catch and shoot player. Takes more shots off the dribble than from a stand still. Connects at a respectable pace. Great ball handler and a tremendous passer. Can get minutes at the point and run the offense. Displays deceptive quickness, and even more deceptive leaping ability. Turns the corner on the pick and roll consistently, and gets in the lane at a very impressive rate. Slithery player who is as unorthodox as they come. Simply outsmarts his competition. Will dunk the ball at the rim, hard, and even in traffic when he gets a running start. Very creative when he can’t get above the rim. Displays tremendous touch on his finger roll. Will go right into the defense to draw contact. Goes to the line at a superb rate. Shoots a very good percentage from the foul line. Extremely efficient player in general.

Defense: An extremely intelligent defender who reads the game and makes plays because of it. Plays aggressive on ball defensive. Gets in a low stance and slides his feet. Will get called for some blocking fouls, but will also draw a ton of charges. Largely considered a flopper, but he certainly knows how to make an impact with that skill. Reads passing lanes extremely well. Gets a lot of strips and deflections. Will block shots in transition too. Surprisingly explosive when he comes over from the weak side. Very good rebounder for his position. Not afraid to get physical

- Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Manu-Ginobili-2562/ ©DraftExpress

You won't find a scout report like that for DeRozan at any point in history, tbh.

this deserves a truth nuke gif

[JeffDuncan]

Ah, Manu was marvelous. Good times.

[hitmantb]

Manu/Parker's peak for any one game is easily as good if not better than Derozan's.

But their durability is nowhere near, due to the lack of raw physical talent. Derozan is easily one of the most durable players. People also greatly underestimate on the impact of prime Tim Duncan as a teammate, he is the modern Bill Russell and will make you better. Having Duncan/Leonard to clean up on defense is a huge luxury as well in later years.

There is a gigantic difference between exploding for a 25 point game and average that night in/night out being the #1 option. There is a reason Harden won MVP and Manu's ceiling was third team. The one year he played heavy minutes and carried, he was injured by playoff time (2011).

[tonight...you]

this thread is retarded. Derozan is not even close to Parker and Ginobili when it comes to Playoff performance and closing games. Ginobili is one of the clutchest players ever. And I'm not even taking defense into consideration.
Derozan couldn't sniff their jock-straps.
That being said...
Go Dreozan! Learn to play like a champion!
Those guys learned from the same mentor... So can you.

[Kawhitstorm]

Imagine DeFrozen against the '05 Pistons:lmao

[TheGreatYacht]

OP is a major faggot

[DAF86]

I think demar will better than manu and tony stats wise...manu and tony won championships because they had Timmy on their side..but I think demar is a better player than the two..

let see what demar can do as the season continues..

You should feel ashamed of yourself.

[timtonymanu]

*Looks at who started thread

I'm not surprised at all. The fact that this was even submitted to "Post New Thread" should be an automatic ban for OP.

[ZeusWillJudge]

There is a reason Harden won MVP and Manu's ceiling was third team.


We've got a little pool going here on Olympus over who is going to say the stupidest thing on ST in 2019. You just catapulted into the lead. I suspect Loki of putting you up to this. Nobody is that stupid on their own.

[duncan2k5]

This is worthy of a ban, tbh

[skin27]

Derozan still has the better stats than manu and tony in a spurs uniform..lol