Teams to Watch: Buyers Market

[Immortal Spur]

While I'm typically assured that moves won't be made during the season, it's beginning to be painfully obvious that there is a major defensive deficiency and that the roster is very poorly constructed with the stars we have. It's fair to give PATFO some leeway Imo cause they had no idea what the team would look like after the Leonard situation was taken care of. But now, the roster balance is very off due to injury and as above mentioned lack of defenders. Luckily this year we do have a little wiggle room due to the pick we got in the Leonard trade which looks to be a late first, very expendable. I must admit, that any move we make would likely include Pau or Patty for salary matching abilities and it's unclear if PATFO has any interest in trading them but I think now more than the last few years time has caught up to them. Pau plays good in stretches but we need a better rebounder and rim protector and as for Patty, Bryn's play almost makes him expendable especially when Murray, White, and Walker return. Depending on how White and Walker do this year, I think there is actually a chance he gets moved, albeit very minimal.

Anyways here's some teams to watch as the year progresses and the deadline approaches.

1. Phoenix
Ariza and Chandler are both on one year deals and PHX still has some cap room. Messing around with the trade machine, Pau, Patty, and the Toronto first could probably fetch both. Another scenario is getting Warren instead of Ariza. Warren is on a 4 year deal at about 11 per. I'm not sure where they stand on him but offloading his contract might be attractive. Long story short they are stacked at the forward position and we could desperately use one. Ariza could come in day one and start, really bolstering our front court. Chandler if he has anything left in the tank would be better than Pau and a shot at competing again should help. Why they would take Pau or Patty or both you might ask? Well they have no one to run point and Patty might actually be an upgrade and as for Pau, accepting him for a first and then the 3 mill guaranteed would still allow them to keep flexibility as well as get them what the really want which is stock piling assets. It just depends how much they value a first. A team like this with no attachments to it's veterans may actually do it.

2. Sacramento
Iman Shumpert, Skal, Frank Mason, and Justin Jackson are some names that interest and should be available for a variety of reasons. Iman is on a one year deal at 13 or 11 mill, don't remember and would help with defense and shooting. He's a little injury prone so I'm not sure. Skal is out of the rotation currently, yay or nay?... Frank Mason is someone I would love to have. He's one of the best backup pg's in the game and if you don't agree he will one day. I love his game. He's does a little bit of everything and it doesn't appear the Kings appreciate him cause his minutes fluctuate. Almost like they are doing him like they did Isaiah Thomas. And Justin Jackson may be a stretch but he'd be a perfect fit at three in the future. He's got length, can shoot and has a well rounded game. I'm not sure if they'd have any interest in Patty with all the guards they have but I'm sure they'd take Pau for a first. It's just what would you give up for Pau and a first?

3. Cleveland
They are very likely to be major sellers at the deadline. They are bad. I'm sure anyone but Sexton and Osman could be had... Love, Thompson, Korver, Nwaba, Nance, Clarkson... pupu platter I guess. Would anyone take Love if they took say Pau, Patty, White or Walker, and a couple firsts? I don't think the market will be big at all for Love and should be very easy to win. I'd look for a small move for like a Nwaba, but I don't think anything matches up with numbers and the first pick needed.

All in all, PATFO probably won't make trades, especially to Patty and Pau... It may have to become painfully obvious. It just sucks cause we got a couple really good pieces, they just need some help. It sucks we had to lose our starting PG to start the season and he might of helped a lot but even so there is still a major need for perimeter defenders and a defensive rebounding rim protecting big. Point should be fine when we get White and Walker back, maybe not, but we'll see.

Thoughts.

[SAGirl]

Agreed with the premise in this thread. I hope they are on the lookout for trade opportunities if they don’t want to waste Demar and Lamarcus this year. Trade requests from them aren’t out of the question if the FO appears not to care about making the team better. Demar didn’t choose to come here and Lamarcus called up Lillard 2 seasons ago when he wanted to get traded. They shouldn’t be taken for granted.

Edit: its too early to say where Sacramento and Phoenix stand. Phoenix will be better and they now value the experience their vets provide to develop an interesting young crew. They have looked around at PG help but come out with nothing yet bc they haven’t been willing to squander too much and Paddy has been ghastly bad.

[BWS-1994]

Maybe the apistons, the Nets, the Knicks and the Heat as well?

[ginobilized]

Basically the Eastern Conference except for Toronto, Boston, Philly and Milwaukee could be trade partners. The bottom half of the Western Conference should be viable as well.
More wings available than a family meal from KFC.

[sasaint]

Agreed with the premise in this thread. I hope they are on the lookout for trade opportunities if they don’t want to waste Demar and Lamarcus this year. Trade requests from them aren’t out of the question if the FO appears not to care about making the team better. Demar didn’t choose to come here and Lamarcus called up Lillard 2 seasons ago when he wanted to get traded. They shouldn’t be taken for granted.

Edit: its too early to say where Sacramento and Phoenix stand. Phoenix will be better and they now value the experience their vets provide to develop an interesting young crew. They have looked around at PG help but come out with nothing yet bc they haven’t been willing to squander too much and Paddy has been ghastly bad.

It is a foregone conclusion that we ARE wasting LMA and DeMar this season. But your other point is spot-on: will that compel one or both to request/demand a trade? If so, this franchise could spiral down to a crash landing VERY fast. On top of the previous LMA trade request, the debacle with Number 2 and the poor personnel/contract decisions that PATFO have made, such demands from LMA and DeMar could do damage to the once unassailable Spurs that would put us in Phoenix/Sacto territory.

[Immortal Spur]

It is a foregone conclusion that we ARE wasting LMA and DeMar this season. But your other point is spot-on: will that compel one or both to request/demand a trade? If so, this franchise could spiral down to a crash landing VERY fast. On top of the previous LMA trade request, the debacle with Number 2 and the poor personnel/contract decisions that PATFO have made, such demands from LMA and DeMar could do damage to the once unassailable Spurs that would put us in Phoenix/Sacto territory.
I don't think these are the type of guys to sit around and wait for things to get better. They need help. They are professionals and are gonna give it time, but depending on the amount of help they get offensively and defensively, I believe there could be grumblings at some point in the season. You can't just have guys be leaders who can't play. People respect the best players, not just guys that say the right things. It gets irritating. I suppose it will take losing and losing big for shit to hit the fan, but there definitely needs to be a paradigm shift. LMA and DD have leverage. We are at a critical point in the franchise. It's like the years before we found Tony and Manu. Stuff needs to pan out. One of our young players need to be a star or really close. This DJ injury hurt us in so many ways. He's was suppose to be the vocal leader and take steps to stardom. Honestly I guess having Lonnie and White come back relatively soon gives us some hope. We need some surprises to take place to continue upward. That was shit on early but we'll see if it can take a turn for the better.

[gambit1990]

i’ve always liked ariza. don’t see the suns giving him up. at least not for what the spurs could offer.

[sasaint]

I don't think these are the type of guys to sit around and wait for things to get better. They need help. They are professionals and are gonna give it time, but depending on the amount of help they get offensively and defensively, I believe there could be grumblings at some point in the season. You can't just have guys be leaders who can't play. People respect the best players, not just guys that say the right things. It gets irritating. I suppose it will take losing and losing big for shit to hit the fan, but there definitely needs to be a paradigm shift. LMA and DD have leverage. We are at a critical point in the franchise. It's like the years before we found Tony and Manu. Stuff needs to pan out. One of our young players need to be a star or really close. This DJ injury hurt us in so many ways. He's was suppose to be the vocal leader and take steps to stardom. Honestly I guess having Lonnie and White come back relatively soon gives us some hope. We need some surprises to take place to continue upward. That was shit on early but we'll see if it can take a turn for the better.

When Manu arrived, he was that surprise/spark at that time. You are right; we need a new surprise/spark. But those don't happen often. Much better odds in Vegas... Placing hopes on such an eventuality is pretty scary for Spurs fans.

[Immortal Spur]

i’ve always liked ariza. don’t see the suns giving him up. at least not for what the spurs could offer.
I'd like to get Ariza and Chandler for a 1st, Pau and Patty LOL Depends on how much they value a pick...

White/Forbes/Murray
DeMar/Beli/Walker
Ariza/Gay/Qpon
LMA/Bertans/Dante
Chandler/Poeltl/Metu

And include Pondexter and we'd have an extra roster spot. Also Ariza and Chandler are one year deals so they'd be expiring. We get cap relief, better defense, and be rid of Patty and Pau. Include a second round pick if you have to.

[sasaint]

i’ve always liked ariza. don’t see the suns giving him up. at least not for what the spurs could offer.

Agree and agree.

[Immortal Spur]

When Manu arrived, he was that surprise/spark at that time. You are right; we need a new surprise/spark. But those don't happen often. Much better odds in Vegas... Placing hopes on such an eventuality is pretty scary for Spurs fans.
Pretty much. We are doing exactly how we though we'd be doing and that' because youth while inexperienced increase ceiling and don't really do anything to the floor in our case. Right now we lost all our hope for increasing the ceiling.

[Immortal Spur]

i’ve always liked ariza. don’t see the suns giving him up. at least not for what the spurs could offer.
We have picks, I believe we could get it done if we really wanted to. PHX has been know to stockpile picks. If and when PHX torpedoes, they really have no use for Ariza or Chandler who are both likely gone after this season. I figure if they can get a pick out of them, and they aren't competitive any way, they'd do it.

This goes into the idea tho, of how valuable a pick is to us. We have a lot of young players right now. We really don't need another guard. I guess we could wait and look for a wing like OG in the draft, but we'll see.

[Mugen]

You should add another team to that list, OP: The Spurs.

There's no realistic trade that I see them pulling the trigger on that moves them to a top 4 seed in the West. Maybe something is out that there that gets them to an 8 seed but I'd be surprised if Pop moves Patty/Pau.

They should absolutely be sellers if they are where I think they'll be come January.

[sasaint]

I'd like to get Ariza and Chandler for a 1st, Pau and Patty LOL Depends on how much they value a pick...

White/Forbes/Murray
DeMar/Beli/Walker
Ariza/Gay/Qpon
LMA/Bertans/Dante
Chandler/Poeltl/Metu

And include Pondexter and we'd have an extra roster spot. Also Ariza and Chandler are one year deals so they'd be expiring. We get cap relief, better defense, and be rid of Patty and Pau. Include a second round pick if you have to.

I suspect the Suns could do better, tbh.

I don't really agree with your depth chart. Frontcourt should be:

Ariza/Gay/?
Dante/Bertans/Metu
LMA/Chandler/Poodle

LMA and Chandler should hardly ever be paired in today's NBA.

[Immortal Spur]

You should add another team to that list, OP: The Spurs.

There's no realistic trade that I see them pulling the trigger on that moves them to a top 4 seed in the West. Maybe something is out that there that gets them to an 8 seed but I'd be surprised if Pop moves Patty/Pau.

They should absolutely be sellers if they are where I think they'll be come January.
Facts, but I am having pure orgasmic bliss just thinking it may be possible...

[Immortal Spur]

I suspect the Suns could do better, tbh.

I don't really agree with your depth chart. Frontcourt should be:

Ariza/Gay/?
Dante/Bertans/Metu
LMA/Chandler/Poodle

LMA and Chandler should hardly ever be paired in today's NBA.
and yet Poodle is playing next to LMA as we speak... smh

[sasaint]

and yet Poodle is playing next to LMA as we speak... smh

"Paired" but "playing"?

[Mugen]

I mean if RC/Pop haven't at least made a call to the Clippers offering a 1st for Beverley, then I highly highly doubt their commitment to doing anything this year...

Pau for Bazemore and his terrible contract....

The moves are out there. If Presti was running the team, these moves would have been made as soon as Dejounte went down .... but instead we get a couple of idiots who didn't learn shit from 2008-2012 and still think that the biggest issue with the team is gelling......

[Immortal Spur]

"Paired" but "playing"?
forgive my wording lol

[sasaint]

forgive my wording lol

joke's on us... :lol

[RC_Drunkford]

if things don't get better they'd probably make a trade. But I fully expect them to trade Poetl, Bertans or Forbes. No way they trade Pau or Patty. I expect Pau to get traded after the season, but I can't see him getting a mid-season trade unless it's to Memphis, T-Wolves or Lakers. Actually, Pau to the Lakers would be genius, but I don't see how they'd match salary.

[DAF86]

if things don't get better they'd probably make a trade. But I fully expect them to trade Poetl, Bertans or Forbes. No way they trade Pau or Patty. I expect Pau to get traded after the season, but I can't see him getting a mid-season trade unless it's to Memphis, T-Wolves or Lakers. Actually, Pau to the Lakers would be genius, but I don't see how they'd match salary.

Gasol for Caldwell-Pope and fillers (like Stephenson or Beasley) would work I think.

Lakers fans with Pope are like Spurs fans with Gasol. They are tired. A change of scenery for both players could work. Plus, the Lakers need centers and the Spurs need wings.

[r0drig0lac]

Gasol for Caldwell-Pope and fillers (like Stephenson or Beasley) would work I think.

Lakers fans with Pope are like Spurs fans with Gasol. They are tired. A chance of scenery for both players could work. Plus, the Lakers need centers and the Spurs need wings.

do it

[RC_Drunkford]

the thing of Pau to LA is, it would make the Spurs better while also making the Lakers worse. You kill 2 birds with 1 stone

[Seventyniner]

Good thread premise.

There are so many players that can't be traded until December 15 that we probably won't see many deals before then. At that point teams will have a much better idea where they stand.

[r0drig0lac]

The Rockets are prepared to offer a package that includes FOUR first-round picks to the Timberwolves for Jimmy Butler, reports ESPN.

[RD2191]

The Rockets are prepared to offer a package that includes FOUR first-round picks to the Timberwolves for Jimmy Butler, reports ESPN.

I don't understand why PATFO isn't doing everything they can to get Butler. They built this team to compete now not the future. They're stuck in this no mans land and I'm not sure what the hell they're doing tbh. I mean either blow it up and go for a full rebuild or go all in for a title.

[RC_Drunkford]

I don't understand why PATFO isn't doing everything they can to get Butler. They built this team to compete now not the future. They're stuck in this no mans land and I'm not sure what the hell they're doing tbh. I mean either blow it up and go for a full rebuild or go all in for a title.

doesn't fit the culture,

Although I actually think he would be the perfect leader this team is missing, cause Jimmy just wants to win. That's why he's mad at Wiggins and KAT. And he's a Texan. But for sure Pop doesn't want a player like him and the Spurs really don't have any assets to get him

[objective]

I don't understand why PATFO isn't doing everything they can to get Butler. They built this team to compete now not the future. They're stuck in this no mans land and I'm not sure what the hell they're doing tbh. I mean either blow it up and go for a full rebuild or go all in for a title.

The reason is they're too damn cheap. These are the same guys who were keeping the Supermax offer for Kawhi in their back pocket.

No way in hell they max out 5 years for Butler who is almost 30 and had real, verifiable injuries and surgeries.

They'd rather give Pau and Fatty $100 million and group hug.

[exstatic]

if things don't get better they'd probably make a trade. But I fully expect them to trade Poetl, Bertans or Forbes. No way they trade Pau or Patty. I expect Pau to get traded after the season, but I can't see him getting a mid-season trade unless it's to Memphis, T-Wolves or Lakers. Actually, Pau to the Lakers would be genius, but I don't see how they'd match salary.

They’ve changed the CBA. In order for both teams to take advantage of Pau’s contract, he must be traded during this season. After this season, even though he is only guaranteed 6M, they’d have to take back his full matching salary. If he isn’t traded by the deadline, he’ll either be waved or stretched in the off-season.

[exstatic]

doesn't fit the culture,

Although I actually think he would be the perfect leader this team is missing, cause Jimmy just wants to win. That's why he's mad at Wiggins and KAT. And he's a Texan. But for sure Pop doesn't want a player like him and the Spurs really don't have any assets to get him
It’s easy to say it’s KAT and Wiggins, but it isn’t so. He had a reputation of being shitty to the youngsters in Chicago, too. Being a bastard doesn’t make you a leader.

[Chinook]

if things don't get better they'd probably make a trade. But I fully expect them to trade Poetl, Bertans or Forbes. No way they trade Pau or Patty. I expect Pau to get traded after the season, but I can't see him getting a mid-season trade unless it's to Memphis, T-Wolves or Lakers. Actually, Pau to the Lakers would be genius, but I don't see how they'd match salary.

Pau's almost certainly not getting traded after the season. His partial guarantee loses all value after the trade deadline under the current CBA. If he is traded, it'll be as a salary dump, likely costing SA value rather than as part of a package for a useful player. Pau's value is mainly that a team could send out worse salary for him now and waive Pau before July to save on the difference. Someone like Kent Bazemore might be a fit under that scenario.

However, after the deadline, Pau's outgoing salary drops to $6.7 Million, making him unable to garner an expensive matching deal. The other team also has to be able to take the full $16.8 Million to complete the deal, even though they are only able to send out $10 Million or so. That imbalance makes finding a deal much harder.

[objective]

Teodosic is healthy and getting DNP-CDS for the Clippers. He's well behind in the rotation.

He might be a buyout candidate at the deadline. Can't see him being a legit trade target as he isn't playing, frequently gets hurt, and has a 15% trade kicker. But I could see a buyout and the Spurs being interested.

Better defender than Mills in my opinion, even though he's a bad defender.

[RC_Drunkford]

Pau's almost certainly not getting traded after the season. His partial guarantee loses all value after the trade deadline under the current CBA. If he is traded, it'll be as a salary dump, likely costing SA value rather than as part of a package for a useful player. Pau's value is mainly that a team could send out worse salary for him now and waive Pau before July to save on the difference. Someone like Kent Bazemore might be a fit under that scenario.

However, after the deadline, Pau's outgoing salary drops to $6.7 Million, making him unable to garner an expensive matching deal. The other team also has to be able to take the full $16.8 Million to complete the deal, even though they are only able to send out $10 Million or so. That imbalance makes finding a deal much harder.

Won't it be easier to aquire some type of asset with the Gasol partial guaranteed contract? I mean it wouldn't make a lot of sense to do that, but if you take one of those bad contracts that were signed due to the cap jump, shouldn't that at least get us some nice draft picks? I think that partial guaranteed deal makes it pretty easy to move to a team that wants to shred some salary for cap space, since they could stretch Pau's 6.7 million

[Chinook]

Won't it be easier to aquire some type of asset with the Gasol partial guaranteed contract?

No. The new CBA makes it to where only the guaranteed portion of a player's contract for the current year (before the trade deadline) or following year (after the deadline) counts when factoring in trades. So a team can't trade a $16-Million player for Pau then waive Gasol to save money. Gasol would only count as a $6.7-Million player (his guarantee for next year) going out, which can match up to $8.4 Million or $11.7 Million, depending on where the Spurs are in relation to the tax threshold. A team doesn't really save any money by trading for him at that low of a rate. If they do the trade by the deadline, the other team can send back $20.9 Million or so, with presumably a similar salary on the books for next year. It gives them much more incentive to do so.

[Immortal Spur]

No. The new CBA makes it to where only the guaranteed portion of a player's contract for the current year (before the trade deadline) or following year (after the deadline) counts when factoring in trades. So a team can't trade a $16-Million player for Pau then waive Gasol to save money. Gasol would only count as a $6.7-Million player (his guarantee for next year) going out, which can match up to $8.4 Million or $11.7 Million, depending on where the Spurs are in relation to the tax threshold. A team doesn't really save any money by trading for him at that low of a rate. If they do the trade by the deadline, the other team can send back $20.9 Million or so, with presumably a similar salary on the books for next year. It gives them much more incentive to do so.
So if Pau gets traded it will be this year. Sounds good. What options do we have with that price range and who would be worth it? Bazemore was mentioned as one...

But I guess if we got creative we could send Pau out using him as cap relief for a worse contract.. might be the only way to send him out and get something without attaching an asset.

[Immortal Spur]

Here is a list of players that may be options for a Pau salary dump. Each of the following players has 2+ years left on their contracts and make more than 16+ million per year. I tried to leave out stars like Mike Conley and options that would probably require more than just salary. Batum is a stretch but he's making 24 million per right now so yeah. There really isn't much out there.

Atlanta - Kent Bazemore
Charlotte - Batum, Biyombo
Cleveland - George Hill
Miami - Tyler Johnson
Orlando - Timofey Mozgov ...
Memphis - Chandler Parsons ...
Minnesota - Dieng
Phoenix - Ryan Anderson

[Fusternino]

I still think Mills+Bertans+both picks for Butler and Bates-Diop is a fleece that could be had.

[Immortal Spur]

I still think Mills+Bertans+both picks for Butler and Bates-Diop is a fleece that could be had.
Would NBA 2k even accept that trade lol

[RC_Drunkford]

No. The new CBA makes it to where only the guaranteed portion of a player's contract for the current year (before the trade deadline) or following year (after the deadline) counts when factoring in trades. So a team can't trade a $16-Million player for Pau then waive Gasol to save money. Gasol would only count as a $6.7-Million player (his guarantee for next year) going out, which can match up to $8.4 Million or $11.7 Million, depending on where the Spurs are in relation to the tax threshold. A team doesn't really save any money by trading for him at that low of a rate. If they do the trade by the deadline, the other team can send back $20.9 Million or so, with presumably a similar salary on the books for next year. It gives them much more incentive to do so.

Interesting. I'm not sure if PATFO would send Gasol to a franchise he doesn't really want to play for. Besides it would really stop us from signing free agents in the future. It would only make sense if it's a larger package to bring a 3rd star player in or get a lottery pick

[Immortal Spur]

Interesting. I'm not sure if PATFO would send Gasol to a franchise he doesn't really want to play for. Besides it would really stop us from signing free agents in the future. It would only make sense if it's a larger package to bring a 3rd star player in or get a lottery pick
The reality of this made me feel really sad... Then again they just sent Kawhi and Green to Toronto.

[Immortal Spur]

I'm actually talking myself into George Hill for Pau and Pondexter. I love how he plays in Spursy systems. He'd help the defense and is familiar with a lot that we do and with the ball movement he should be very effective offensively. He could also play next to Murray so it doesn't hurt is short term or long term. And the space he takes next year is not gonna really effect much in the grand scheme of things. He'd be a much better option on defense than now. Preferably I'd like a 3 and keep DeMar a 2 but at this point beggars can't be choosers. I also think PATFO will give it time for the best option available should they actually do intend to trade Pau but George Hill should be relatively easy to get and his market should be hella dry.

Forbes/Mills/Murray
Hill/White/Walker
DeRozan/Belinelli/
Cunningham/Gay/Bertans
LMA/Poeltl/Metu

Edit: Cleveland also has decent filler players like Channing Frye, Nwaba, and maybe Dekker. Hill and Frye would be a good get IMO in a PATFO kind of way...

[TimDunkem]

If the Spurs keep Gasol, can we ALL - looking at you PATFO slurpers - agree that his contract was a boneheaded move? The only silver lining slurpers continued to refer to was the so-called "tradeability" of the contract.

[TimDunkem]

Here is a list of players that may be options for a Pau salary dump. Each of the following players has 2+ years left on their contracts and make more than 16+ million per year. I tried to leave out stars like Mike Conley and options that would probably require more than just salary. Batum is a stretch but he's making 24 million per right now so yeah. There really isn't much out there.

Atlanta - Kent Bazemore
Charlotte - Batum, Biyombo
Cleveland - George Hill
Miami - Tyler Johnson
Orlando - Timofey Mozgov ...
Memphis - Chandler Parsons ...
Minnesota - Dieng
Phoenix - Ryan Anderson

3 years and 48 mill for Kent Bazemore at best. :lmao Today's Spurs.

[Immortal Spur]

3 years and 48 mill for Kent Bazemore at best. :lmao Today's Spurs.
trade him for Mills str8 up lol

[RC_Drunkford]

If the Spurs keep Gasol, can we ALL - looking at you PATFO slurpers - agree that his contract was a boneheaded move? The only silver lining slurpers continued to refer to was the so-called "tradeability" of the contract.

we can agree that it's boneheaded ever since they gave him the deal

[TheGreatYacht]

Rockets willing to trade 4 first round picks for Jimmy. Chinook is that allowed? Every time I propose a trade where we give up multiple firsts you rulebook experts tell me it's not allowed because the NBA will stop teams from Brooklyn'ing themselves

[TimDunkem]

we can agree that it's boneheaded ever since they gave him the deal

Well, yeah, those of us with a brain did, but there were always the loyal PATFO apologists looking to polish this turd.

[RD2191]

Rockets willing to trade 4 first round picks for Jimmy. Chinook is that allowed? Every time I propose a trade where we give up multiple firsts you rulebook experts tell me it's not allowed because the NBA will stop teams from Brooklyn'ing themselves

:lol

[sasaint]

Gasol for Caldwell-Pope and fillers (like Stephenson or Beasley) would work I think.

Lakers fans with Pope are like Spurs fans with Gasol. They are tired. A change of scenery for both players could work. Plus, the Lakers need centers and the Spurs need wings.

Neither Stephenson nor Beasley will ever play for Pop.

[Chinook]

Rockets willing to trade 4 first round picks for Jimmy. Chinook (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=37557) is that allowed? Every time I propose a trade where we give up multiple firsts you rulebook experts tell me it's not allowed because the NBA will stop teams from Brooklyn'ing themselves

Yes, Houston can give up 2019, 2021, 2023 and 2025 if they wanted. They can't give up consecutive picks unless there are swaps involved. Brooklyn made their trade under the current rules. They gave up swaps in 2015 and 2017.

It's unclear what the report means, and there's no information on protections or other conditions. I can't imagine they are willing to offer four unprotected picks given Paul's age and Butler's risk of leaving.

[Kobe'sAchilles]

By 2025 both Harden and Butler will be 35 and Paul will be gone. It doesn't make sense for the Rockets to give away that pick unprotected. But at the same time, I don't see Minnesota trading Butler unless those picks are unprotected. That would be a hell of a long term move for Minnesota

[gambit1990]

rockets should definitely go all in for butler.

if cp3 doesn’t get hurt last year then the rockets are last year’s champs.

[SAGirl]

Neither Stephenson nor Beasley will ever play for Pop.
Thinking about it, Caldwell Pope was convicted. He also doesn't fit in Pop's culture.

the only guy in that list above that makes sense is Batum. I am sure Pop would rather just keep Pau.

[Immortal Spur]

Thinking about it, Caldwell Pope was convicted. He also doesn't fit in Pop's culture.

the only guy in that list above that makes sense is Batum. I am sure Pop would rather just keep Pau.
As sorry as that sounds you may be right.

[DAF86]

Neither Stephenson nor Beasley will ever play for Pop.

I could imagine you some years ago saying "Rudy Gay will never play for Pop".

[RC_Drunkford]

RC will have to make one of his genius drunk moves. Sadly coach Bud ain't there anymore to tell him and Pop what they have to do

[sasaint]

I could imagine you some years ago saying "Rudy Gay will never play for Pop".

You have a wild imagination.

[TheGreatYacht]

Yes, Houston can give up 2019, 2021, 2023 and 2025 if they wanted. They can't give up consecutive picks unless there are swaps involved. Brooklyn made their trade under the current rules. They gave up swaps in 2015 and 2017.

It's unclear what the report means, and there's no information on protections or other conditions. I can't imagine they are willing to offer four unprotected picks given Paul's age and Butler's risk of leaving.
Thanks :tu

[TheGreatYacht]

The Clippers have so many good pieces. Would give a pick for either Tobias Harris or Montrezl Harrell....

Harrell went for 30 & 6 off the bench tonight against the Rockets, his former team. Had 17/10/3 this past weekend against them as well. Houston wouldn't know what to do with him and Aldridge together

[SouthTexasRancher]

Get the best athletic SF who is a decent scorer and plays good 'D', available for either Gasol or Mills or both for Otto Porter, Jr. who would make us so much better. Gives Washington 2 guys with Championship experience. Do it PATFO. Throw in a couple of crappy draft picks if needed. Throw Jabari Young in as the kicker. Give the Express News a free seat on the top row at the AT&T center. :ihit

[objective]

The Clippers have so many good pieces. Would give a pick for either Tobias Harris or Montrezl Harrell....

Harrell went for 30 & 6 off the bench tonight against the Rockets, his former team. Had 17/10/3 this past weekend against them as well. Houston wouldn't know what to do with him and Aldridge together

Pop wouldn't play Harrell, he dunks too much and shows emotion.

But Teodosic could be a buyout candidate. He was getting DNP-CDs before tonight. Clippers clearly like Gilgeous-Alexander and so far have held on to Beverley who will have a reasonable caphold that might be worth keeping on the books. Teodosic also has a 15% trade kicker.

Teodosic would be much better than Mills and can actually run an offense.

[Immortal Spur]

I'm actually talking myself into George Hill for Pau and Pondexter. I love how he plays in Spursy systems. He'd help the defense and is familiar with a lot that we do and with the ball movement he should be very effective offensively. He could also play next to Murray so it doesn't hurt is short term or long term. And the space he takes next year is not gonna really effect much in the grand scheme of things. He'd be a much better option on defense than now. Preferably I'd like a 3 and keep DeMar a 2 but at this point beggars can't be choosers. I also think PATFO will give it time for the best option available should they actually do intend to trade Pau but George Hill should be relatively easy to get and his market should be hella dry.

Forbes/Mills/Murray
Hill/White/Walker
DeRozan/Belinelli/
Cunningham/Gay/Bertans
LMA/Poeltl/Metu

Edit: Cleveland also has decent filler players like Channing Frye, Nwaba, and maybe Dekker. Hill and Frye would be a good get IMO in a PATFO kind of way... RC_Drunkford Here’s some of my thoughts about a Hill for Pau trade. Pau and Pondexter for Hill and Frye would be decent.

[RC_Drunkford]

RC_Drunkford (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=53010) Here’s some of my thoughts about a Hill for Pau trade. Pau and Pondexter for Hill and Frye would be decent.

That would indeed improve the team a bit. But it wouldn't affect our salary cap in the offseason. It's really about getting rid of the Mills contract and receiving bird rights on a 3-and-D wing. Pau's contract can be waived at the end of the season

[RC_Drunkford]

RC_Drunkford (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=53010) Here’s some of my thoughts about a Hill for Pau trade. Pau and Pondexter for Hill and Frye would be decent.

That would indeed improve the team a bit. But it wouldn't affect our salary cap in the offseason. It's really about getting rid of the Mills contract and receiving bird rights on a 3-and-D wing. Pau's contract can be waived at the end of the season

[RC_Drunkford]

Would have to wait til december, but I think this is a good one that makes sense for both teams and we wouldn't have to move any picks

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7124293

[MannyIsGod]

I mean if RC/Pop haven't at least made a call to the Clippers offering a 1st for Beverley, then I highly highly doubt their commitment to doing anything this year...

Pau for Bazemore and his terrible contract....

The moves are out there. If Presti was running the team, these moves would have been made as soon as Dejounte went down .... but instead we get a couple of idiots who didn't learn shit from 2008-2012 and still think that the biggest issue with the team is gelling......

Yeah becasue the Presti model is just what I want. How many rings does Presti have comapred with Pop and RC since he left? How many Finals has he been to? How many MVPs has he traded away?

[K...]

Y'all duckers who say "trade Mills and Gasol" for anything other than an equally toxic contract are tripping. You can't trade under performing veterans for mid career players! Try Pau/ Mills plus both firsts and you takes would be realistic. Pau sucks, but he can play positive minutes and the best replacement for him is poetl your small ball. Mills sucks but has moral value and the best replacement is to throw him to the deep bench. You don't need trades to improve the team.


Now whether there iis an SF prospect worth one or two first round picks is relevant, Pau and Mills are salary filler only

[RC_Drunkford]

"The Suns brought Ariza and his former Houston Rockets teammate Ryan Anderson to Phoenix to add their big-game experience and positive presence to a young locker room. The franchise also expected complementary on-court production in the form of outside shooting and, in Ariza’s case, perimeter defense, in order to help this team after posting an NBA-worst 21 victories last season. But Ariza and Anderson have sputtered, most recently shooting a combined 4-of-16 from the floor (2-of-11 from 3-point distance) Saturday night to contribute to Phoenix’s fourth consecutive lopsided loss.Those performances prompt this question: Five games in, should Kokoskov already consider turning to a full-blown youth movement? (https://theathletic.com/617818/2018/10/28/time-for-youth-movement-suns-veterans-trevor-ariza-ryan-anderson-continue-struggles/) "


Here's the trade we need. Wait til december 15th, then trade Mills & Pondexter for Ariza who's expiring. I don't think Phoenix would ask for a pick. They need an offball player next to Booker and don't have a starter level PG either. Mills would give them that leadership and championship experience. Pondexter is perfect to be the end of the bench wing and teach the young guys. Ariza is about to be out of the rotation and would help our defense immediately. And we would get an additional 12 million of cap space in the offseason.

Now due to the Murray injury we are a little thin at PG. If that's critical they can move Gasol and Bertans for Hill and Frye. A 2nd rounder should be enough to get that done. It would improve this years team and we'd have some cap space to make a run at Middleton/Millsap/Carroll/Harris. If we need some more we could still try to move Poetl and the pick to move up in the draft or trade Beli. I think this is the most reasonable way of going about things without turning the roster over too much.

[DAF86]

"The Suns brought Ariza and his former Houston Rockets teammate Ryan Anderson to Phoenix to add their big-game experience and positive presence to a young locker room. The franchise also expected complementary on-court production in the form of outside shooting and, in Ariza’s case, perimeter defense, in order to help this team after posting an NBA-worst 21 victories last season. But Ariza and Anderson have sputtered, most recently shooting a combined 4-of-16 from the floor (2-of-11 from 3-point distance) Saturday night to contribute to Phoenix’s fourth consecutive lopsided loss.Those performances prompt this question: Five games in, should Kokoskov already consider turning to a full-blown youth movement? (https://theathletic.com/617818/2018/10/28/time-for-youth-movement-suns-veterans-trevor-ariza-ryan-anderson-continue-struggles/) "


Here's the trade we need. Wait til december 15th, then trade Mills & Pondexter for Ariza who's expiring. I don't think Phoenix would ask for a pick. They need an offball player next to Booker and don't have a starter level PG either. Mills would give them that leadership and championship experience. Pondexter is perfect to be the end of the bench wing and teach the young guys. Ariza is about to be out of the rotation and would help our defense immediately. And we would get an additional 12 million of cap space in the offseason.

Now due to the Murray injury we are a little thin at PG. If that's critical they can move Gasol and Bertans for Hill and Frye. A 2nd rounder should be enough to get that done. It would improve this years team and we'd have some cap space to make a run at Middleton/Millsap/Carroll/Harris. If we need some more we could still try to move Poetl and the pick to move up in the draft or trade Beli. I think this is the most reasonable way of going about things without turning the roster over too much.

It makes no sense for the Suns to take on Mills' contract. The only way to acquire Ariza is by trading a pick or a guy with some kind of future like Murray, White or Bertans.

[SpursRussia]

I really think we should look into Spencer DVD from Brooklyn. A long PG, shoots the 3 well, good defender. He is expiring, can definitely be obtained with a 1st. Maybe we even should target him and DeMare Carroll in some bigger trade. He would also fit really great and Brooklyn would be ok with trading him, as they have a logjam at SF.

However they hey will not take any salary back, so we have to think expirings only or ship Gasol to a 3rd team

[RC_Drunkford]

It makes no sense for the Suns to take on Mills' contract. The only way to acquire Ariza is by trading a pick or a guy with some kind of future like Murray, White or Bertans.

I'd give them Bertans in a heart beat.

[sasaint]

I'd give them Bertans in a heart beat.

But you shifted gears with the Ariza deal. With Ariza it isn’t about his Bird rights but his expiring contract for cap relief purposes.

[sasaint]

I'd give them Bertans in a heart beat.

Yes. And maybe his 3-point shooting alone would entice the Suns to take him. Ultimately, however, I think we are playing games on fantasy trades; PATFO not gonna do anything except possibly replace Q-Pon with a buy-out.

[r0drig0lac]

I really think we should look into Spencer DVD from Brooklyn. A long PG, shoots the 3 well, good defender. He is expiring, can definitely be obtained with a 1st. Maybe we even should target him and DeMare Carroll in some bigger trade. He would also fit really great and Brooklyn would be ok with trading him, as they have a logjam at SF.

However they hey will not take any salary back, so we have to think expirings only or ship Gasol to a 3rd team

Spencer and Carroll would be excellent

[Immortal Spur]

Yes. And maybe his 3-point shooting alone would entice the Suns to take him. Ultimately, however, I think we are playing games on fantasy trades; PATFO not gonna do anything except possibly replace Q-Pon with a buy-out.

this, except I think it could be Huestis or Brandon Paul.

[sasaint]

this, except I think it could be Huestis or Brandon Paul.

Yep. Guest is is my bet.

[Fusternino]

Wizards fans are high on Poeltl, apparently. Mills/Bertans/Poetl might get it done for OPJ.

[RC_Drunkford]

Wizards fans are high on Poeltl, apparently. Mills/Bertans/Poetl might get it done for OPJ.

would have to attach Gasol to it to make the numbers work. That would make our roster super thin

[szkorhetz]

would have to attach Gasol to it to make the numbers work. That would make our roster super thin
Actually, the number are good in the proposed deal. Wizz would never do that, OFC.

[Chinook]

Actually, the number are good in the proposed deal. Wizz would never do that, OFC.

It's legal, but it would require the Spurs to go into the tax. I agree it would not work.

[Fusternino]

Grunfeld is an awful GM and the Wiz need shooters and depth at other positions. Maybe if we attach Forbes in the offseason. Wizards are really far over the cap and have no other way to get players outside of trades.

[Immortal Spur]

Grunfeld is an awful GM and the Wiz need shooters and depth at other positions. Maybe if we attach Forbes in the offseason. Wizards are really far over the cap and have no other way to get players outside of trades.
How would you assess the risk reward on that trade you proposed?

[Fusternino]

How would you assess the risk reward on that trade you proposed?

Bertans/Mills/Forbes/Poetl for OPJ? Honestly, a lot depends on if Milutinov is actually decent and can be brought over for cheap. Gay, Cunningham, and Q-Pon are our free agents next season. So we would need to replace 6 players (net loss of 3 from the trade). I suppose these would be Milutinov, Blossomgame, both picks. We can bring back Gay with Early Bird rights but not entirely sure how that would work. Assuming Milutinov eats part of the MLE then we can use the remainder of it to sign one more player. Our roster would be:

White/DDR/OPJ/LMA/Gasol
Murray/Walker/Gay/Metu/Milutinov
MLE or pick/Marco/Blossomgame/MLE or pick/MLE or pick

I really think our MLE would be best spent on the 4/5 positions. That roster should be a huge defensive upgrade but I would worry about our front court depth.

[Immortal Spur]

Bertans/Mills/Forbes/Poetl for OPJ? Honestly, a lot depends on if Milutinov is actually decent and can be brought over for cheap. Gay, Cunningham, and Q-Pon are our free agents next season. So we would need to replace 6 players (net loss of 3 from the trade). I suppose these would be Milutinov, Blossomgame, both picks. We can bring back Gay with Early Bird rights but not entirely sure how that would work. Assuming Milutinov eats part of the MLE then we can use the remainder of it to sign one more player. Our roster would be:

White/DDR/OPJ/LMA/Gasol
Murray/Walker/Gay/Metu/Milutinov
MLE or pick/Marco/Blossomgame/MLE or pick/MLE or pick

I really think our MLE would be best spent on the 4/5 positions. That roster should be a huge defensive upgrade but I would worry about our front court depth.
High Risk and losing a pick. One thing PATFO does that not very many people realize is that they minimize risk and set people up to succeed. It's no accident with the amount of success stories they have. Pressure is almost never talked about when you make trades. What are the circumstances and environment do you put people in by the decisions you make and how you make them. I believe the term is metaphysical if I'm not mistaken. But anyways, that's a high risk trade with not a high reward. I don't think either team would do it.

[RC_Drunkford]

something like this would put us about 3 million under the luxury tax. We'd have to move Beli and waive and stretch Pau. Big man depth would be suspect though

http://www.shamsports.com/capulator?id=3785849395bd72f0032317142662467

LA/Tyson Chandler/Milutinov
Gay/Cunningham/Metu
Otto Porter/Stanley Johnson/Rookie SF
DeRozan/Walker/Forbes
Murray/White/Calderon

[Fusternino]

High Risk and losing a pick. One thing PATFO does that not very many people realize is that they minimize risk and set people up to succeed. It's no accident with the amount of success stories they have. Pressure is almost never talked about when you make trades. What are the circumstances and environment do you put people in by the decisions you make and how you make them. I believe the term is metaphysical if I'm not mistaken. But anyways, that's a high risk trade with not a high reward. I don't think either team would do it.

I didn't include a pick, just players. If re-signing Gay is actually super easy then we only need 5 players to pick up next season, 2 of which will come from picks. Blossomgame with surely take a 2 year minimum deal and we still have the entire MLE. Maybe we can get Pat Beverly for real as our third-string PG.

The upside is that OPJ is being given the Durant treatment by Wall/Beal/and even Scott Brooks. Wizards are very eager to get rid of him due to his deflated stats in comparison to his salary. Maybe we can even demand a second round pick.

I truly believe OPJ can be a 16/8 guy for us and provide some much needed defense.

Wizards cap situation is nightmare and they need bodies. Our front line does get quite a bit younger but I would also LMA is playing the 5 a lot.

[Fusternino]

something like this would put us about 3 million under the luxury tax. We'd have to move Beli and waive and stretch Pau. Big man depth would be suspect though

http://www.shamsports.com/capulator?id=3785849395bd72f0032317142662467

LA/Tyson Chandler/Milutinov
Gay/Cunningham/Metu
Otto Porter/Stanley Johnson/Rookie SF
DeRozan/Walker/Forbes
Murray/White/Calderon

Big no from me on Calderon. Pop would be too tempted to actually play him.

[RC_Drunkford]

Big no from me on Calderon. Pop would be too tempted to actually play him.

you can change Cunningham/Chandler/Calderon with 3 other players available for the minimum. Actually we got the Bi-Annual exception to sign one 3rd stringer for 3.4 million, 2 would have to be vet. min. guys

[Chinook]

Should be noted that it's really hard to do three-for-one or four-for-one types of trades during the season. Teams won't have more than a roster spot or two open, and you can't temporarily go over the 15-man limit to make a deal work. The Spurs have essentially 14 guys on the roster. That'd help if they end up being sellers. It's not a great thing when they're buyers though, because they're so close to the tax that getting back even two min deals in addition to their main catch could push them over the threshold.

[RC_Drunkford]

I'd view this as a trade in the offseason. Would be stupid to do it at the deadline

[mo7888]

I wonder what it would take to get a guy like T Prince from Atl? Any guy with upside on a rookie scale deal? Would something like the Toronto pick + next years 1st + Milutinov get it done? Or maybe put Poetl and Mills in the deal and take back Plumlee?

My thought process isn't really focused on Prince, it's just that it is really hard to make the numbers work going after a OPJ or other SF's on a large contract. We might have a better shot going after someone with a year or two of experience on a rookie deal and paying with future picks to get it done.

[sananspursfan21]

Labissiere would be intriguing. He’s all I’d really care for the Spurs to have that Sac would realistically be willing to part with. Actually, they might not want to anyway

[DAF86]

Realistic trades the Spurs could make to acquire a wing:

-With the Lakers: Gasol for Caldwell-Pope and Beasley.

-With the Hawks: Gasol and a pick (or Bertans, Murray or White) for Kent Bazemore.

-With the Suns: Gasol and a pick (or Bertans, Murray or White) for Trevor Ariza.

-With the Nets: Gasol and a pick (or Bertans, Murray or White) for DeMarre Carroll or Allen Crabbe or Jared Dudley.

[Immortal Spur]

none of those players are worth it

[r0drig0lac]

I wonder what it would take to get a guy like T Prince from Atl? Any guy with upside on a rookie scale deal? Would something like the Toronto pick + next years 1st + Milutinov get it done? Or maybe put Poetl and Mills in the deal and take back Plumlee?

My thought process isn't really focused on Prince, it's just that it is really hard to make the numbers work going after a OPJ or other SF's on a large contract. We might have a better shot going after someone with a year or two of experience on a rookie deal and paying with future picks to get it done.

impossible
his evolution is incredible and he will probably get the max in atlanta, spurs have absolutely nothing that would make the hawks even think about it

[DAF86]

none of those players are worth it

Well, Spurs better stand pat then because there aren't other options out there.

[Immortal Spur]

Well, Spurs better stand pat then because there aren't other options out there.
that's what I've come to realize already. save the picks.. I can wait. gonna be a fun draft this year. twice on the board in the first.

[BackHome]

That’s what I am talking about it’s great Drozzz is balling and LMA and Gay Playing hard. Get a high 9 to 15 pick and we got our SF. Then just need to get rid of most of our bench and we loaded up for another run.

[Immortal Spur]

or we could even package the picks for someone like Josh Jackson, Justin Jackson, or Mikal Bridges for example... Teams get hella desperate at draft time. Everyone thinks they got the next MJ or something

[exstatic]

Those two picks we will likely have will both be in the 20s, and won't even net a late lottery pick, let alone some pick that will entice those teams to part with those players.

[Immortal Spur]

Those two picks we will likely have will both be in the 20s, and won't even net a late lottery pick, let alone some pick that will entice those teams to part with those players.
logically speaking you never know... if they are early 20's you can conceivably get into the mid to late teens. Gobert was picked right before we picked late in the first. Jimmy, Jokic, etc... Teams get desperate it's fair to say and the players I mentioned are on teams stacked with wings. Mikal I don't even think has played this year and Justin is on the Kings, nuff said.

[Chinook]

Bridges isn't for sale. He might be part of a package for them to buy someone else, but they aren't looking to turn him into pieces this soon after trading two picks to get him. The Kings need Justin Jackson too much to move him without getting a better SF back. They do have Bjelica though, and I think he's significantly more gettable.

Josh Jackson is interesting. The Suns seem to be ready to move on, but I don't know if they'd be willing to trade him for parts. Like in next year's draft, I could see him going for teens pick. The Spurs could have such a pick then. But I doubt they can convince Phoenix that their pick is worth that now. MAYBE they'd be willing to go Anderson and Jackson for Mills, Gasol and the pick. But with them having Chandler on the roster already, I'm not too confident. Chandler and Jackson for Pau and picks? Maybe. It's at least salary-neutral. It's not even a little bad from the Spurs' perspective, because Jackson is a good prospect at a position of need, and the team avoids having to pay Gasol's guarantee and gets a chance at having another legit defensive center to mentor Poeltl. Just a hard-sell for a Phoenix team that already has an extra pick coming and prospects out the wahzoo.

[Bballplaya]

This season with current injuries:
47-49 wins


With Walker and White back:
50-52 wins

with Murray:
55-58 wins

[Immortal Spur]

Bridges isn't for sale. He might be part of a package for them to buy someone else, but they aren't looking to turn him into pieces this soon after trading two picks to get him. The Kings need Justin Jackson too much to move him without getting a better SF back. They do have Bjelica though, and I think he's significantly more gettable.

Josh Jackson is interesting. The Suns seem to be ready to move on, but I don't know if they'd be willing to trade him for parts. Like in next year's draft, I could see him going for teens pick. The Spurs could have such a pick then. But I doubt they can convince Phoenix that their pick is worth that now. MAYBE they'd be willing to go Anderson and Jackson for Mills, Gasol and the pick. But with them having Chandler on the roster already, I'm not too confident. Chandler and Jackson for Pau and picks? Maybe. It's at least salary-neutral. It's not even a little bad from the Spurs' perspective, because Jackson is a good prospect at a position of need, and the team avoids having to pay Gasol's guarantee and gets a chance at having another legit defensive center to mentor Poeltl. Just a hard-sell for a Phoenix team that already has an extra pick coming and prospects out the wahzoo.
My point about Josh Jackson and Mikal was that they have a plethora of wings, so in that sense I imagine someone is available. As for Justin, I figured it's the Kings... But all this trade for player would be strictly draft time scenarios.

[Dingle Barry]

Would much rather move Patty than Pau. Patty is a shittier version of Forbes and redundant when White returns. Pau is still useful off the bench and a credible replacement for LMA when he sits misses games.

Is there a market for Patty and a pick?

[Dingle Barry]

Y'all duckers who say "trade Mills and Gasol" for anything other than an equally toxic contract are tripping. You can't trade under performing veterans for mid career players! Try Pau/ Mills plus both firsts and you takes would be realistic. Pau sucks, but he can play positive minutes and the best replacement for him is poetl your small ball. Mills sucks but has moral value and the best replacement is to throw him to the deep bench. You don't need trades to improve the team.


Now whether there iis an SF prospect worth one or two first round picks is relevant, Pau and Mills are salary filler only

Da fuq is moral value?

[RC_Drunkford]

Marquese Chris and Dragan Bender about to be free agents next season. Houston and Phoenix decided not to pick up their option. I think both are intriguing prospects with potential. They could strive here

[K...]

Da fuq is moral value?

Towel waving

[Chinook]

I don't hate Bender. Spurs have no need for him, though. He's a stretch-five with some perimeter skill, but I'd rather just play a stretch-four. Almost every highlight you see of him is a three, but he only shoots 34 percent there.

[Hoops Czar]

Would much rather move Patty than Pau. Patty is a shittier version of Forbes and redundant when White returns. Pau is still useful off the bench and a credible replacement for LMA when he sits misses games.

Is there a market for Patty and a pick?

I don't know. Is there a market for those untoughable scrubs in philly.... Saric, Fultz and Covington.?

[Russo21]

Looks like the Cavs are exploring options for Kyle Korver. He is old as fuck but fills a glaring hole with the lack of three point shooting on the roster.

[NASpurs]

Looks like the Cavs are exploring options for Kyle Korver. He is old as fuck but fills a glaring hole with the lack of three point shooting on the roster.

That would be like adding another pylon to the defensive turnstile. Spurs need a legit 3 and D player instead of just "3".

[RC_Drunkford]

the real problem is that this team won't move Mills before the deadline, especially now that Dejounte is out for the season. If they decide to move Mills in the offseason they most likely would need to take some salary back which fucks us big time in free agency. The smartest move would be to trade him for an expiring, so we can sign some free agents. Spurs basically can't sign anybody with Mills on the roster.

[venitian navigator]

The Phoenix potential trade partnership is interesting, expecially if, like it seems, they're valueing Ariza, Bridges and Warren more than Jackson. They already gave up on Bender and Chandler is not going to be re-signed.
Mills and Pau for the three of them works on nba trade machine...

[Immortal Spur]

the real problem is that this team won't move Mills before the deadline, especially now that Dejounte is out for the season. If they decide to move Mills in the offseason they most likely would need to take some salary back which fucks us big time in free agency. The smartest move would be to trade him for an expiring, so we can sign some free agents. Spurs basically can't sign anybody with Mills on the roster.
I'm pretty sure PATFO considers Mills untouchable in any trade talks LMAO

[SAGirl]

Y'all duckers who say "trade Mills and Gasol" for anything other than an equally toxic contract are tripping. You can't trade under performing veterans for mid career players! Try Pau/ Mills plus both firsts and you takes would be realistic. Pau sucks, but he can play positive minutes and the best replacement for him is poetl your small ball. Mills sucks but has moral value and the best replacement is to throw him to the deep bench. You don't need trades to improve the team.


Now whether there iis an SF prospect worth one or two first round picks is relevant, Pau and Mills are salary filler only

You are being too rational for this forum. ;)


But you are right... part of the reason why these threads turn into the ridiculous.

[exstatic]

Marquese Chris and Dragan Bender about to be free agents next season. Houston and Phoenix decided not to pick up their option. I think both are intriguing prospects with potential. They could strive here

Bender's PER last years was 7.1, and that was playing all 82 games, 25 minutes per game. That's like d-league bad. Criss will never play here, because he's a fucking idiot. I was reading a blurb on why their GM got fired before the season, and both of these misses with high draft picks were listed as likely reasons. There's a reason that year 4 options sometimes don't get picked up, and that reason isn't that the player or players "are intriguing prospects with potential". The options don't get picked up because after two seasons, they are determined by their drafting team(s) to be top 10 pick busts.

[vander]

there aren't really any good SF free agents next summer are there?
It'd never happen since Pop loves these guys, but I'd trade Pau/Mills for Batum once White comes back. Batum's deal is pretty bad, could Spurs even get a draft pick out of it?

[Gagnrath]

Yes. And maybe his 3-point shooting alone would entice the Suns to take him. Ultimately, however, I think we are playing games on fantasy trades; PATFO not gonna do anything except possibly replace Q-Pon with a buy-out.

I could see Pop making a deal for his favorite player in Hill he just loved the guy you have to remember that.

[cd021]

-With the Lakers: Gasol for Caldwell-Pope and Beasley.

Gasol has money owed after this season, while Beasley and KCP are UFA's. The Lakers have no incentive to take on Gasol when they could sign a big around the buyout deadline (i.e. Tyson Chandler)


-With the Hawks: Gasol and a pick (or Bertans, Murray or White) for Kent Bazemore. While Gasol and a pick make since for Bazemore, in theory, Bazemore is a small SG who can really only defend guards. He is also owed $19 million next season. That's a lot for a player that doesn't address our biggest issue on the wing, a defensive SF. After this season Murray is extension eligible, Gay needs to be re-signed that team could easily hit $140,000,000- way deep into the tax.



-With the Suns: Gasol and a pick (or Bertans, Murray or White) for Trevor Ariza.

Why trade an asset(s) for a player that is probable to get waived in February? Especially a pick, or two of our last the 1st rounders or Bertans.




-With the Nets: Gasol and a pick (or Bertans, Murray or White) for DeMarre Carroll or Allen Crabbe or Jared Dudley.

Carroll is a player I want on the Spurs but trading for him probably doesn't make since unless it's Gasol and two 2nd's (2019 and 2020) for Carroll.

It gives the Spurs his bird rights, so they can re-sign him without touching the MLE, addresses their wing situation, gets them out of paying Gasol $6.7 million next year or $2.3 million for the next three seasons (if stretched and waived)

The likely rotation in that scenario would be:

Forbes, DDR, Carrol, Bertans, LMA
Mills, White, Beli, Gay, Poeltl

closing unit: Forbes/Mills, DDR, Carroll, Gay, LMA


Carroll may be brought out and possibly signed but it makes more since to trade for him if the Spurs are interested in getting help on the wing.

[cd021]

I could see Pop making a deal for his favorite player in Hill he just loved the guy you have to remember that.
Hill could be a buy-out candidate. No one is picking up that $18,000,000 team option for next season

Not sure how he would fit into the guard rotation though.

[Chinook]

Gasol for Bazemore straight-up makes sense. Spurs adding a pick would be insane. Pau's a better player on a better contract. Bazemore has a chance to be a better fit. Only way I add a pick is if Mills for Dedmon is part of the deal. I actually like the player, but he makes a f'ton while not being better than I hope Lonnie is by next year. He can defend threes, though. He has good length and good enough instincts.

[ceperez]

Rose scores 50.... damn it... weren't the Spurs trying to pick him up last year???

https://news4sanantonio.com/sports/spurs-zone/report-derrick-rose-tried-to-join-spurs-but-spurs-passed

[cd021]

Gasol for Bazemore straight-up makes sense. Spurs adding a pick would be insane. Pau's a better player on a better contract. Bazemore has a chance to be a better fit. Only way I add a pick is if Mills for Dedmon is part of the deal. I actually like the player, but he makes a f'ton while not being better than I hope Lonnie is by next year. He can defend threes, though. He has good length and good enough instincts.

Can Bazemore actually defend SFs? Admittedly, I have hardly watched him but based on what i've heard, he doesn't have the size to defend 3's .

[RC_Drunkford]

Rose scores 50.... damn it... weren't the Spurs trying to pick him up last year???

https://news4sanantonio.com/sports/spurs-zone/report-derrick-rose-tried-to-join-spurs-but-spurs-passed

He wanted to play for the Spurs for the vet minimum when Parker got injured. Luckily the Spurs signed Mills for 50 million instead

[exstatic]

I could see Pop making a deal for his favorite player in Hill he just loved the guy you have to remember that.
There is buzz that after their awful start, Dan the Man may finally be ready to burn it down. Korver IS being shopped, and probably Hill, too.

[RC_Drunkford]

There is buzz that after their awful start, Dan the Man may finally be ready to burn it down. Korver IS being shopped, and probably Hill, too.

Mills and Bertans for Hill and Korver would just be too good of a trade. Just for next years cap space alone. Highly unrealistic though

[Chillen]

Rose scores 50.... damn it... weren't the Spurs trying to pick him up last year???

https://news4sanantonio.com/sports/spurs-zone/report-derrick-rose-tried-to-join-spurs-but-spurs-passed

I always wanted Rose to be a Spur. Washed up players don't score 50 in an NBA game period. I think with him it's been more mental than physical. I think his confidence in his game is going up and it's starting to show on the court. Hope he can stay healthy and help Minny make the playoffs. Spurs made a mistake by not signing Rose.

[sasaint]

I could see Pop making a deal for his favorite player in Hill he just loved the guy you have to remember that.

Actually I did, too. But in order to acquire George we would need to move Patty, and I do not see that happening.

[sasaint]

Mills and Bertans for Hill and Korver would just be too good of a trade. Just for next years cap space alone. Highly unrealistic though

Yeah, if PATFO could pull off that trade - :wow

[Immortal Spur]

Hill and Korver would be perfect additions to this team. Can't wait for White and Walker to get back though. I would love to see what we got.

[kaji157]

Is demarre Carroll injuried or he is just not good enough to play for the nets??

[Chinook]

Can Bazemore actually defend SFs? Admittedly, I have hardly watched him but based on what i've heard, he doesn't have the size to defend 3's .

He has a seven-foot wingspan and is very strong. He's not checking James, but he'd likely be the best Kawhi or PG defender on the team.

[marinoman]

Is demarre Carroll injuried or he is just not good enough to play for the nets??
Injury, wrist I believe

[objective]

Is demarre Carroll injuried or he is just not good enough to play for the nets??


Injury, wrist I believe

He had surgery on his right ankle two weeks ago, no official timetable for return

[sasaint]

He has a seven-foot wingspan and is very strong. He's not checking James, but he'd likely be the best Kawhi or PG defender on the team.

Bazemore was a nice, unexpected success story in LA, but since his move east on a big contract, he hasn’t lived up to expectations. The question is simply, could Bazemore reach those expectations playing for Pop?

[John B]

I like Bazemore but we need a long SF 3-and-D to guard a Lebron, Durant, Kawhi. Dante can guard and rebound but we need a reliable outside shot from him and 12 ppg.

[Spurtacular]

Ariza and Chandler are both on one year deals and PHX still has some cap room.

We should've trade Kawhi for Ariza when we had the chance.

[tbdog]

I don't see a trade this season. It's a learning year and they will look at the pieces in the offseason. We got to stop comparing spurs to warriors and rockets. Warriors are in a different league and rockets are going all in and not looking good. Spurs don't have trade assets until near the deadline anyway. One team to look at is wizzards. They been on the treadmill for years and started the season 1-6.

[cd021]

Mills and Bertans for Hill and Korver would just be too good of a trade. Just for next years cap space alone. Highly unrealistic though

Mills and the Raps pick for Hill would probably be a better deal but I doubt that PATFO would move Mills and I would be worried that the Spurs would do something stupid and guarantee Hill's $18,000,000 player option for next season.

I am still high on Bertans and think he still has a ways to go before he reaches his ceiling.

[Philthemage]

Andrew Harrison? He was a pretty decent regular for the grizz last year I think.

[Immortal Spur]

Only move I conceivably see the Spurs doing is cutting Pondexter for Huestis. That is all.

[Immortal Spur]

I was just thinking... couldn't George Hill get bought out this year. If I'm not mistaken, he has a small guarantee for next year. If they can't trade him, wouldn't the Cavs just buy him out. When does the the money become guaranteed for next year. Maybe they just cut him next year. I just think Hill would work with them to get out this year if he could. Chinook

[exstatic]

I like Bazemore but we need a long SF 3-and-D to guard a Lebron, Durant, Kawhi. Dante can guard and rebound but we need a reliable outside shot from him and 12 ppg.

I don't think you need double digits. In his overall stay in SA, DG averaged about 9. You just need someone to keep defenses honest with the 3 pointer.

[Chinook]

I was just thinking... couldn't George Hill get bought out this year. If I'm not mistaken, he has a small guarantee for next year. If they can't trade him, wouldn't the Cavs just buy him out. When does the the money become guaranteed for next year. Maybe they just cut him next year. I just think Hill would work with them to get out this year if he could. Chinook (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=37557)

Sportac has the guarantee date as 07/02. I highly doubt Cleveland has interest in buying out Hill at this time. His biggest value by far is his contract's ability to get the Cavs a decent asset. If they get no takers at the deadline, then they likely do go that route, with Hill likely being able to get out of his deal with only giving up that million next year. Of course, he could be bought out even if he's traded. He's not a bad player, but he's definitely past his prime now. It's amazing that guys like Georgie and Garret Temple are already 32. Remember when they were just kids trying to make it.

[SAGirl]

Only move I conceivably see the Spurs doing is cutting Pondexter for Huestis. That is all.
Yup... As Chinook pointed out, a number of players can't be traded until late December or January anyways and by late December, provided there's no setbacks, they will start to get a look at Huestis in the gleague at least.

If there's any move they will make it will be that late. By then, they will also have a better grasp of where the season is heading for them. If they are relatively fine, they stand pat and do nothing but perhaps get Huestis from the gleague if he looks good.

[John B]

Yup... As Chinook pointed out, a number of players can't be traded until late December or January anyways and by late December, provided there's no setbacks, they will start to get a look at Huestis in the gleague at least.

If there's any move they will make it will be that late. By then, they will also have a better grasp of where the season is heading for them. If they are relatively fine, they stand pat and do nothing but perhaps get Huestis from the gleague if he looks good.
I really like Huestis to work out. Hopefully he’s spending time with Chips

[exstatic]

Yup... As Chinook pointed out, a number of players can't be traded until late December or January anyways and by late December, provided there's no setbacks, they will start to get a look at Huestis in the gleague at least.

If there's any move they will make it will be that late. By then, they will also have a better grasp of where the season is heading for them. If they are relatively fine, they stand pat and do nothing but perhaps get Huestis from the gleague if he looks good.

I think Huestis needs to stay in Austin until at least some time in December to trigger his 50K bonus he got for signing that weird contract. My guess is that if he's healthy then, he'll collect his bonus, and they'll convert him to a two-way contract, since they have one left. I can't think of any other reason that they're holding that one back.

[Mugen]

Bazemore makes sense and I'd do it straight up for Pau in a heartbeat. But knowing RC, he'll probably throw in a couple of first rounders just for the hell of it tbh.

[Payote75]

I wouldn't trade any assets for hill at all. However I'd check in on Rubio perfect fit for pop and this team. I have always wanted Otto porter I have posted plenty on that in the past.

[objective]

Sportac has the guarantee date as 07/02. I highly doubt Cleveland has interest in buying out Hill at this time. His biggest value by far is his contract's ability to get the Cavs a decent asset. If they get no takers at the deadline, then they likely do go that route, with Hill likely being able to get out of his deal with only giving up that million next year. Of course, he could be bought out even if he's traded. He's not a bad player, but he's definitely past his prime now. It's amazing that guys like Georgie and Garret Temple are already 32. Remember when they were just kids trying to make it.

If he was bought out/cut after the trade deadline, do the Spurs still have mle or bae to give him more than the pro-rated minimum? Capulator seems to suggest yes, but it's been wrong before

[Chillen]

I wouldn't trade any assets for hill at all. However I'd check in on Rubio perfect fit for pop and this team. I have always wanted Otto porter I have posted plenty on that in the past.

Why would Utah trade Rubio? I agree with DeMar and Aldridge he would be perfect.

[Chinook]

If he was bought out/cut after the trade deadline, do the Spurs still have mle or bae to give him more than the pro-rated minimum? Capulator seems to suggest yes, but it's been wrong before

They would have at least one of those, depending on if Cunningham was signed with the MLE, LLE or min exception. Eric Pincus I think said Dante got the LLE, so the team would have the MLE minus Beli and Metu offer, with proration starting in January, I think. They'd also have a bit of the LLE left in that scenario, but the leftover is so small, it may as well just be a min contract.

[Immortal Spur]

They would have at least one of those, depending on if Cunningham was signed with the MLE, LLE or min exception. Eric Pincus I think said Dante got the LLE, so the team would have the MLE minus Beli and Metu offer, with proration starting in January, I think. They'd also have a bit of the LLE left in that scenario, but the leftover is so small, it may as well just be a min contract.
Also, I was under the impression that we were very close to the tax

[Chinook]

Also, I was under the impression that we were very close to the tax

The Spurs are very close to the tax, but that wasn't part of the question. Plus, the team could do a trade to fall away from the tax a bit and give themselves some room.

[Payote75]

Why would Utah trade Rubio? I agree with DeMar and Aldridge he would be perfect.

im not sure. I just been throwing it out there since all our point guards went down. I've actually wanted him when Minny basically just dumped him. I haven't checked in on Utah to see where they at or if they really need him but they could use a shooter and a big that is one place where gasol and mills would actually fit. But I would do some sort of combo even if it was only one of them and a pick but I love his fit. As I love Otto porter jr lol

[Payote75]

Why would Utah trade Rubio? I agree with DeMar and Aldridge he would be perfect.


i just took a look Utah is play ehhh 500 ball even though it's early but they have exum and mills would be perfect back up and gasol would be as well. Some people may actually think we giving up to much lol .....on trade machine mills gasol for crowder and Rubio work that would never happen but I'd be ok with Rubio and whatever or however else they want to structure it.

[Payote75]

Sorry trade machine works if we take on sefalosha in that deal as well...sign me up:hungry: