Lebron a product of the east

[dontouchmebwo]

I think this year has made that painfully obvious, and I don't want to hear about injuries because that shit happens every year to all sorts of teams. Replay his career in the West and he most likely never wins a ring. In fact I don't think he'll even get out of the 2nd round the rest of his career here.

[Neo.]

are you retarded

before he got hurt the lakers were among the top 4 teams in the west

[dontouchmebwo]

are you retarded

before he got hurt the lakers were among the top 4 teams in the west

and the Grizz were the 1st seed at one point in this season, it means nothing. Tons of teams have suffered injuries, the Rockets, Spurs, Nuggets, OKC, list goes on.


and I gurantee you lebron would still be a playoff team in the east, even Oladipo had IND 3rd, even without him they're winning games. even brooklyn is the 6th seed despite losing Levert at the start of the year. that tells you all you need to know about the east

[Broly]

Their record with would be equal to a 50 win season. Their record without him would be equal to a 27 win season. And this is the conclusion you’ve drawn?

[Kobe'sAchilles]

2007 was a joke of a team. Cavs got swept by the Spurs and would've gotten swept by the Suns too. Wouldn't have made it past the second round of he played in the west.

2011 was interesting bc they would've had to face 2 of the Lakers, thunder, or the Mavs. Miami was a great team though but Lebron really only choked bc it was the finals. He played great in the conference finals. Hard to say if he chokes as bad against Dallas if they play them in the WCF but I will give Carlise the upper hand and say the Mavs still win.

2012 & 2013 they are champs so no complaints. Lebron dominated.

2014 they got killed by the Spurs in a joke of a finals so obviously he wouldn't have made it to the finals. I'm not sure they even beat the thunder tbh.

2015 is a 100% fact that they wouldn't have made the finals. They would've been the 6th seed in the west that year and play the Clippers, Rockets, and Warriors to make the finals. ALL ON THE ROAD. Just no way to really say Lebron would've made the finals that year if he played in the west.

2016 no complaints. They are the champs and Lebron played godly where nobody was stopping him. He was on a mission and played the best bball I've ever seen.

2017 obviously KD rigged the league but I believe Lebron wouldn't have made the WCF that year. He would lose to either the Spurs or the Warriora in the second round.

2018 was another joke of a team that would've been playoff fodder for either Houston or Golden St. Once again Lebron wouldn't have even made the conference finals.

And this year they aren't even in the playoffs. Lebron is by far a product of the Eastern Conference. By my count Lebron loses in the second round 3 times (arguably 4) in the West while making the WCF only twice (maybe 3 times). His legacy would be far under Kobe and Duncan and Shaq

[Clipper Nation]

LeGOAT's problem isn't the West, it's the Lakers. The new-age Lakers can't do anything right. They lucked into getting the greatest basketball player of all time purely on geography and his Hollywood career, and they've managed to fuck that up.

[Neo.]

Tons of teams have suffered injuries, the Rockets, Spurs, Nuggets, OKC, list goes on.


so lebron himself being injured is not an excuse for the lakers sucking after he got hurt and was unable to play?

then by that logic there is no excuse for cleveland or miami sucking after lebron left

[MultiTroll]

so lebron himself being injured is not an excuse for the lakers sucking after he got hurt and was unable to play?

then by that logic there is no excuse for cleveland or miami sucking after lebron left
Rack it.
Lebrons teams with and without. The difference is staggering.

[Neo.]

Miami was a great team though but Lebron really only choked bc it was the finals. He played great in the conference finals.


that literally makes no sense whatsoever

the mavs had a completely different team and gameplan than chicago

the stage had nothing to do with him choking because aside from that year he pretty much always played as well as he could have in the finals, often far exceeding expectation

dallas had one goal defensively - dont let lebron beat you. they let wade have all he wanted, but didnt want lebron to get involved. they frequently doubled him quickly forcing him to give the ball up immediately, while wade had tunnel vision due to his strange butthurt over 2006

[Neo.]

Lebron is by far a product of the Eastern Conference.

this also is a retarded claim

if hes a product of the east (implying the east has far less talent), then you have to take into account the fact that his supporting cast is less talented too. among the eastern conference teams, he had a very good supporting cast.

so if you wanna plug him into the west, you gotta plug him into a western team with a comparable level supporting cast for western conference teams. he should have one of the 2-3 best supporting casts in the west. so take this year for example, say you replace westbrook with lebron, and hes able to play with PG, shroeder, and Steven Adams. would they not dominate in the west too, aside from maybe GS?

he literally went from kyrie and love (a solid #2 & #3 option) to ingram and kuzma (a young, rather lousy #2 & #3 option)

he went to a tougher conference and has a worse supporting cast than he previously had. do we really expect him to be at the top of the conference in that situation?

[StrengthAndHonor]

LeGOAT's problem isn't the West, it's the Lakers. The new-age Lakers can't do anything right. They lucked into getting the greatest basketball player of all time purely on geography and his Hollywood career, and they've managed to fuck that up.
Le”Goat” problem is father time.

[Will Hunting]

this also is a retarded claim

if hes a product of the east (implying the east has far less talent), then you have to take into account the fact that his supporting cast is less talented too. among the eastern conference teams, he had a very good supporting cast.

so if you wanna plug him into the west, you gotta plug him into a western team with a comparable level supporting cast for western conference teams. he should have one of the 2-3 best supporting casts in the west. so take this year for example, say you replace westbrook with lebron, and hes able to play with PG, shroeder, and Steven Adams. would they not dominate in the west too, aside from maybe GS?

he literally went from kyrie and love (a solid #2 & #3 option) to ingram and kuzma (a young, rather lousy #2 & #3 option)

he went to a tougher conference and has a worse supporting cast than he previously had. do we really expect him to be at the top of the conference in that situation?
Also as shitty as some of those Cleveland teams were, the one thing they always had were shooters who could consistently space the floor and could somewhat compliment Lebron on offense. This Lakers team doesn’t have any 3 point shooters that defenses have to respect.

[HarlemHeat37]

They're 22-16 or something close when he plays, that's pretty impressive considering his #2/3/4 options are all young and inexperienced, while the rest of the team is old scrubs(other than Rondo and maybe McGee)

LeBron's legacy would have been better in the West..he would have the same number of titles, but then people couldn't use the stupid Finals record argument:lol

[Killakobe81]

They're 22-16 or something close when he plays, that's pretty impressive considering his #2/3/4 options are all young and inexperienced, while the rest of the team is old scrubs(other than Rondo and maybe McGee)

LeBron's legacy would have been better in the West..he would have the same number of titles, but then people couldn't use the stupid Finals record argument:lol

OP argument is just dumb.
He would make less finals, sure.
But greatness is transcedant acoross eras and conferences.

[Neo.]

you could also make arguments that most anyone who had an extended level of greatness benefitted from weakness

west was far weaker than east in magics era
east was arguably weaker than west in jordans era
the league as a whole was weak during shaq/kobe era
the league was garbage during wilt & russell era

who cares though, winning is winning. to win it all you gotta beat the best of the best, regardless of conference or era

[Kobe'sAchilles]

that literally makes no sense whatsoever

the mavs had a completely different team and gameplan than chicago

the stage had nothing to do with him choking because aside from that year he pretty much always played as well as he could have in the finals, often far exceeding expectation

dallas had one goal defensively - dont let lebron beat you. they let wade have all he wanted, but didnt want lebron to get involved. they frequently doubled him quickly forcing him to give the ball up immediately, while wade had tunnel vision due to his strange butthurt over 2006

He averaged 4 points a game in the 4th quarter in 2011. He went scoreless one game. GTFOH with this he didn't choke business. Shit if that's your definition of playing as well as he can or exceeding expectations then your standards are lower than bridesmaid at the singles table.

[Kobe'sAchilles]

you could also make arguments that most anyone who had an extended level of greatness benefitted from weakness

west was far weaker than east in magics era
east was arguably weaker than west in jordans era
the league as a whole was weak during shaq/kobe era
the league was garbage during wilt & russell era

who cares though, winning is winning. to win it all you gotta beat the best of the best, regardless of conference or era

I do make that point about Magic. He had an easier path to the finals and played a 40 win team once to make it to the finals.

But nothing else you say is actually factual. Bc even if the east was weaker, not by much, Jordan swept the West everytime he faced them and didn't get blown out in the worst finals loss ever (points wise) for a series. If you don't lose to the west then it doesn't matter how strong they supposedly were.

Shaq played against Jordan so I wouldn't consider that era weak. He also played against Duncan in the west which once again wasn't weak. Like literally the only thing weak about the Kobe/Duncan era was the eastern conference so I don't know what your bitching about.

also it's impossible to compare Lebrons era with Russells. Yes players are more skilled today and faster. But Lebron wouldn't have played nearly the same as he did in the 50s and 60s. He would be wearing inferior footwear. He would be taking buses instead of private planes. He wouldn't have his own chef or nutritionist. He wouldn't be able to spend so much on his body bc the technology wasn't the same (and he'd be making far less). He'd have to handle racism and segregation to a degree he can't even imagine. He's actually be called for traveling and carrying. He would be staying in awful motels instead of 5 star resorts. So say what you want about Russell and his era but nobody today could play back then either.

[Killakobe81]

you could also make arguments that most anyone who had an extended level of greatness benefitted from weakness

west was far weaker than east in magics era
east was arguably weaker than west in jordans era
the league as a whole was weak during shaq/kobe era
the league was garbage during wilt & russell era

who cares though, winning is winning. to win it all you gotta beat the best of the best, regardless of conference or era

great point.

[Neo.]

He averaged 4 points a game in the 4th quarter in 2011. He went scoreless one game. GTFOH with this he didn't choke business. Shit if that's your definition of playing as well as he can or exceeding expectations then your standards are lower than bridesmaid at the singles table.

did i say he didn't choke? did you even read what i posted?

i said the stage isn't why he choked. yes he choked, but not because it was the finals. he (and the heat as a whole) didn't adjust properly to the mavs scheme

[Neo.]

I do make that point about Magic. He had an easier path to the finals and played a 40 win team once to make it to the finals.

But nothing else you say is actually factual. Bc even if the east was weaker, not by much, Jordan swept the West everytime he faced them and didn't get blown out in the worst finals loss ever (points wise) for a series. If you don't lose to the west then it doesn't matter how strong they supposedly were.

Shaq played against Jordan so I wouldn't consider that era weak. He also played against Duncan in the west which once again wasn't weak. Like literally the only thing weak about the Kobe/Duncan era was the eastern conference so I don't know what your bitching about.

also it's impossible to compare Lebrons era with Russells. Yes players are more skilled today and faster. But Lebron wouldn't have played nearly the same as he did in the 50s and 60s. He would be wearing inferior footwear. He would be taking buses instead of private planes. He wouldn't have his own chef or nutritionist. He wouldn't be able to spend so much on his body bc the technology wasn't the same (and he'd be making far less). He'd have to handle racism and segregation to a degree he can't even imagine. He's actually be called for traveling and carrying. He would be staying in awful motels instead of 5 star resorts. So say what you want about Russell and his era but nobody today could play back then either.

:lmao yep you're retarded

[Kobe'sAchilles]

:lmao yep you're retarded

yeah it's retarded to think that a player like KD, who gets his feelings hurt bc teams ask about his upcoming free agency, would thrive in a time with death threats, lynching, segregation, real racism, and overall lack of rights for black people. They didn't even have AC back then. You got to take in even little things like that into account.

[Kobe'sAchilles]

did i say he didn't choke? did you even read what i posted?

i said the stage isn't why he choked. yes he choked, but not because it was the finals. he (and the heat as a whole) didn't adjust properly to the mavs scheme

The stage is why he choked. It became a story that he played bad and he was on the biggest stage with all eyes on him. Of course the Mavs played good defense, but bc he had never won before and so much was expected from that team and it was the NBA finals where he guaranteed 7 rings. These things played a part of his choke job too not just Carlise.

[Neo.]

yeah it's retarded to think that a player like KD, who gets his feelings hurt bc teams ask about his upcoming free agency, would thrive in a time with death threats, lynching, segregation, real racism, and overall lack of rights for black people. They didn't even have AC back then. You got to take in even little things like that into account.

i was with you in that post until you said no one in today's league could play back then. thats just stupid. especially after all the comparisons "oh well the players back then didn't have the equipment and food that todays players have if they did they would be just as good!!!!!!!!!!!"

then you would have to account that plugging todays players back then, they grew up in the same environment and wouldn't be as easily offended by little things. quit picking and choosing


The stage is why he choked. It became a story that he played bad and he was on the biggest stage with all eyes on him. Of course the Mavs played good defense, but bc he had never won before and so much was expected from that team and it was the NBA finals where he guaranteed 7 rings. These things played a part of his choke job too not just Carlise.

I would agree if he had a history of choking, period. but outside of that series, lebron has literally never been a choker at any point. so i have a hard time believing it was the stage that caused him to play so poorly

[HarlemHeat37]

yeah it's retarded to think that a player like KD, who gets his feelings hurt bc teams ask about his upcoming free agency, would thrive in a time with death threats, lynching, segregation, real racism, and overall lack of rights for black people. They didn't even have AC back then. You got to take in even little things like that into account.

They couldn't even dribble a basketball with both hands:lol

[phxspurfan]

LeGOAT's problem isn't the West, it's the Lakers. The new-age Lakers can't do anything right. They lucked into getting the greatest basketball player of all time purely on geography and his Hollywood career, and they've managed to fuck that up.

Eh, he also brought it upon himself this year. He's 34, no longer an 18 year old, and still think he should have the ball at all times. Too bad the Lakers couldn't win before they went to the Cavs gameplan (a LeBron-dominated offense). But that doesn't mean it's right for him at this stage of his career. He got an overuse injury because he was an overused 34 year old athlete with crap surrounding him. One Jimmy Butler/Paul George/Kawhi/KD/hell even Kyrie (a professional ball player with championship DNA) changes his whole story this year on the Lakers. This year is also on Magic Johnson who got him the crappiest supporting cast ever (Lance Stephenson, Javale McGee, Michael Beasley, as a core, really?). Only Rondo is a keeper there atm. Kuzma can be a player but is so young and raw still, and they are like the TWolves culture over there without LeBron propping them up.

[Kobe'sAchilles]

i was with you in that post until you said no one in today's league could play back then. thats just stupid. especially after all the comparisons "oh well the players back then didn't have the equipment and food that todays players have if they did they would be just as good!!!!!!!!!!!"

then you would have to account that plugging todays players back then, they grew up in the same environment and wouldn't be as easily offended by little things.

My comment had nothing to do with talent. I even said they were more skilled. I just don't think they're tough enough today. Like you said well if they grew up in that time they would be tougher. Would they? Like KD is all of a sudden going to be tough bc he was born earlier? Probably not. All these players are coddled today. They eat at 5 star restaurants and stay at 5 star hotels and live in mansions and drive sports cars. They have personal doctors and nutritionist and fly first class or private jets only. Very few handle critics well and they're always clapping back on social media at the people who do insult them.
All I'm saying is that if you put them in an environment where they eat bad food, and stay in run down motels or sleep on the team bus. Travel by bus and don't have personal doctors or people who's job it is watch over their body. Nobody sucks up to them and coddles them. They aren't paid a lot and don't live in mansions or drive sports cars. And when a person insults them, they have to take it. They have to just sit there and take the verbal assault and the racism and the fact that they can't eat in certain places or vote or get properly educated. Players are spoiled today man. You put them in a time of Jim Crow laws, lynchings, segregation, blacks being bombed in churches, real death threats, and a national media that is always killing any of them that speaks up about it while giving them zero rights. I don't think they can survive it man. Bill Russell was a tough dude. He wasn't as skilled or talented as they are today on the basketball court but again he and many other black players weren't allowed to just focus on basketball man. KD just wants to be a basketball player, that's it. He doesn't want any other problems or criticisms. He couldn't handle being in Russells shoes.

[Neo.]

My comment had nothing to do with talent. I even said they were more skilled. I just don't think they're tough enough today. Like you said well if they grew up in that time they would be tougher. Would they? Like KD is all of a sudden going to be tough bc he was born earlier? Probably not. All these players are coddled today. They eat at 5 star restaurants and stay at 5 star hotels and live in mansions and drive sports cars. They have personal doctors and nutritionist and fly first class or private jets only. Very few handle critics well and they're always clapping back on social media at the people who do insult them.
All I'm saying is that if you put them in an environment where they eat bad food, and stay in run down motels or sleep on the team bus. Travel by bus and don't have personal doctors or people who's job it is watch over their body. Nobody sucks up to them and coddles them. They aren't paid a lot and don't live in mansions or drive sports cars. And when a person insults them, they have to take it. They have to just sit there and take the verbal assault and the racism and the fact that they can't eat in certain places or vote or get properly educated. Players are spoiled today man. You put them in a time of Jim Crow laws, lynchings, segregation, blacks being bombed in churches, real death threats, and a national media that is always killing any of them that speaks up about it while giving them zero rights. I don't think they can survive it man. Bill Russell was a tough dude. He wasn't as skilled or talented as they are today on the basketball court but again he and many other black players weren't allowed to just focus on basketball man. KD just wants to be a basketball player, that's it. He doesn't want any other problems or criticisms. He couldn't handle being in Russells shoes.

tbqh youre still not getting it smh fwiw imho :dizzy

[ambchang]

They couldn't even dribble a basketball with both hands:lol

They do it all the time now. And it’s called travelling.

[Spurtacular]

Their record with would be equal to a 50 win season. Their record without him would be equal to a 27 win season. And this is the conclusion you’ve drawn?

Last I checked; 50-win teams don't win many rings.

[JoeTait75]

Are a number of LeBron's Finals berths a product of being in the East? Of course. You could obviously say that all five of his Finals losses came on teams that wouldn't have gotten out of the West, although I personally think the 2015 Cavaliers when healthy were as good as anyone in the West, including Golden State. The titles he won in 2013 and 2016 came against without question the best teams in the West, and OKC probably was the best team in the West in 2012. I agree with Harlem that he'd have fewer Finals appearances had he spent his entire career in the West but as many titles.

On the other hand, it's fair to factor in that he was drafted by and spent the first seven seasons of his career with a flat-out bad organization in Cleveland. The East was by far the weaker conference in the years prior to when LeBron came in to the league- if anything it was worse than after LeBron arrived- and the Cavaliers lost a ton of games despite being in the weaker conference. So maybe LeBron gets to the Finals fewer times in the West, but maybe he's also with a better organization than Cleveland.

[Kobe'sAchilles]

tbqh youre still not getting it smh fwiw imho :dizzy

I got it but you're the one that doesn't understand that being black was really hard in those days and the players wouldn't get the same opportunity as they do today. I have no idea why you said if todays players grew up in the same environment they wouldn't be offended by little things. There's nothing little about lynching or bombing churches, or getting beaten up by a mob or jailed for no reason. Any player could've offended a white man and gotten beat up by a mob or charged with a false crime and jailed his entire life. These things happened all the time and just bc Russell was lucky enough to survive and overcome doesn't mean that literally every other player in the NBA would do the same. You should read up on Russell and find out about his upbringings and his life before you make the assumption that any black player today could do the same thing he did in his day and age simply bc they would be born around the same time.

[Neo.]

I got it but you're the one that doesn't understand that being black was really hard in those days and the players wouldn't get the same opportunity as they do today. I have no idea why you said if todays players grew up in the same environment they wouldn't be offended by little things. There's nothing little about lynching or bombing churches, or getting beaten up by a mob or jailed for no reason. Any player could've offended a white man and gotten beat up by a mob or charged with a false crime and jailed his entire life. These things happened all the time and just bc Russell was lucky enough to survive and overcome doesn't mean that literally every other player in the NBA would do the same. You should read up on Russell and find out about his upbringings and his life before you make the assumption that any black player today could do the same thing he did in his day and age simply bc they would be born around the same time.

still incapable of reading/comprehension :lmao

[sook]

He’s not getting out of the 1st rd

[Chucho]

are you retarded

before he got hurt the lakers were among the top 4 teams in the west

And the Clippers were #1 in the West. The 2 thru 8 seed were only 2 to 3 games apart most of the time.

[Neo.]

And the Clippers were #1 in the West. The 2 thru 8 seed were only 2 to 3 games apart most of the time.

so a 20-14 record = 7-13 record

got it. cool math bro :tu

[Kobe'sAchilles]

then you would have to account that plugging todays players back then, they grew up in the same environment and wouldn't be as easily offended by little things.



but yeah my reading comprehension sucks. Honestly yours does. You've made no argument or really any case to prove your point other than saying that line. All you've done is look like a moron and post random emojis. You said to stop nitpicking, but these aren't nitpicks. They were the reality of the times. Bad shit happened to black people. You've made zero case as for why Durant would be able to handle it other than oh he would've grown up in the same environment and the little things wouldn't have bothered him. Also you just called all that shit I listed as little things which shows how bad your reading comprehension is. Segregation, it's a little thing. No right to vote. Little thing. Extreme violence and racism. Little thing. My AC comment was admittedly a little thing but that was more of a throw away afterthought than the whole premise of my point.

Either way Lebron having 3 titles and like 5 finals appearances (That would be his best case scenario for him if he played in the West his whole career) would diminish his all time great status. Most people have him #2 all time, but if he was 3 for 5 in the finals then he would be on equal footing with Bird. Kobe and Shaq would have more rings (less MVPs) but Shaq has equal Finals MVPs while Kobe having 2 more rings and 2 more finals appearances would make the debate fun. Duncan would be ahead of him He would be behind Magic and Kareem and there wouldn't even be a debate about Jordan like there is today. He is still a top 10 player all time (never claimed he wasn't, the guy is great) but he would be like #7 or 8 in most people's eyes. I guess I can reprhase it as his Mt. Rushmore status is a product of the Leastern Conference

[djohn2oo8]

LeGOAT's problem isn't the West, it's the Lakers. The new-age Lakers can't do anything right. They lucked into getting the greatest basketball player of all time purely on geography and his Hollywood career, and they've managed to fuck that up.
Funny how’s there’s ALWAYS drama on every team he is on...always someone else’s fault.

[Neo.]

but yeah my reading comprehension sucks. Honestly yours does. You've made no argument or really any case to prove your point other than saying that line. All you've done is look like a moron and post random emojis. You said to stop nitpicking, but these aren't nitpicks. They were the reality of the times. Bad shit happened to black people. You've made zero case as for why Durant would be able to handle it other than oh he would've grown up in the same environment and the little things wouldn't have bothered him. Also you just called all that shit I listed as little things which shows how bad your reading comprehension is. Segregation, it's a little thing. No right to vote. Little thing. Extreme violence and racism. Little thing. My AC comment was admittedly a little thing but that was more of a throw away afterthought than the whole premise of my point.

Either way Lebron having 3 titles and like 5 finals appearances (That would be his best case scenario for him if he played in the West his whole career) would diminish his all time great status. Most people have him #2 all time, but if he was 3 for 5 in the finals then he would be on equal footing with Bird. Kobe and Shaq would have more rings (less MVPs) but Shaq has equal Finals MVPs while Kobe having 2 more rings and 2 more finals appearances would make the debate fun. Duncan would be ahead of him He would be behind Magic and Kareem and there wouldn't even be a debate about Jordan like there is today. He is still a top 10 player all time (never claimed he wasn't, the guy is great) but he would be like #7 or 8 in most people's eyes. I guess I can reprhase it as his Mt. Rushmore status is a product of the Leastern Conference

I could sit here and clarify your misunderstandings, but not sure it's worth it to clarify it to a guy who's sitting here complaining that I "don't understand" the complexities of what a black man dealtwith in the 60s, yet who's very username and avatar is poking fun at the misfortunes of a legendary black player. Not sure Bill Russell would approve of that after all he endured for guys like Kobe, Tim Duncan and others to enjoy success in the NBA.

[Broly]

Last I checked; 50-win teams don't win many rings.
That’s not what I said.

[ambchang]

I could sit here and clarify your misunderstandings, but not sure it's worth it to clarify it to a guy who's sitting here complaining that I "don't understand" the complexities of what a black man dealtwith in the 60s, yet who's very username and avatar is poking fun at the misfortunes of a legendary black player. Not sure Bill Russell would approve of that after all he endured for guys like Kobe, Tim Duncan and others to enjoy success in the NBA.

Don’t know russell and can’t speak for him but pretty sure he don’t two shits about some self-aggrandizing asshole who never did anything for civil rights.

[Neo.]

Don’t know russell and can’t speak for him but pretty sure he don’t two shits about some self-aggrandizing asshole who never did anything for civil rights.

did kobe rape your mother or sister or something? still don't understand your butthurt towards him

[FrostKing]

I'd set the line at 1 Championship, not like he exactly tore it up in the East with 3 rings in 15 seasons

His legacy would be very similiar to Durant's

[Spurtacular]

That’s not what I said.

For what it's worth; Lebron was meant to win a ring or two in any conference. NBA wasn't gonna let that not happen. He ain't GOAT though. GOATs don't need all the welfare. He's embarrassed himself time and time again by crying for calls on non fouls and faking injuries that didn't occur.

[313]

2016 no complaints. They are the champs and Lebron played godly where nobody was stopping him. He was on a mission and played the best bball I've ever seen.

he definitely wasnt beating the warriors or thunder in 2016

[Spurtacular]

Faking injuries? Dude is one of the most durable players in NBA history. I rarely use the term "hater", but that definitely applies here.

He has enjoyed above the mean health. But durability doesn't make one above faking. If you haven't figured out that he didn't have cramps in the finals yet, then you don't know how cramps work or you aren't paying attention (among other events).

[JohnnyMax]

https://i.redd.it/efptzwyrip401.jpg

[BD24]

this also is a retarded claim

if hes a product of the east (implying the east has far less talent), then you have to take into account the fact that his supporting cast is less talented too. among the eastern conference teams, he had a very good supporting cast.

so if you wanna plug him into the west, you gotta plug him into a western team with a comparable level supporting cast for western conference teams. he should have one of the 2-3 best supporting casts in the west. so take this year for example, say you replace westbrook with lebron, and hes able to play with PG, shroeder, and Steven Adams. would they not dominate in the west too, aside from maybe GS?

he literally went from kyrie and love (a solid #2 & #3 option) to ingram and kuzma (a young, rather lousy #2 & #3 option)

he went to a tougher conference and has a worse supporting cast than he previously had. do we really expect him to be at the top of the conference in that situation?
Alot of truth right here tbh

[Spurtacular]

Faking cramps in the finals? ROFL Please, elaborate.


edit: You aren't a Kobe fan, by any chance, are you? I notice Kobe stans have an insatiable urge for trying to project the shortcomings of Bryant onto James.

Bruh, I ain't on any nigga's nuts.

You do realize that one has cramp, one stretches, not squats, right? You probably never played soccer growing up to not know that....

Now that you've been taught that he faked the injury, do you want to know why he did it?

[Spurtacular]

Where's he squatting at? I don't even know what you're talking about. And no, I didn't play soccer; soccer was viewed as a sport only fags play in the US. I did get cramps playing basketball though.

Bruh, I cannot help it if you weren't paying attention. Go back and look at the clip. Repeatedly, he tried to squat to alleviate the pain. That's not how cramps work--not at all!

[Spurtacular]

Man, I just watched it over again. Dude isn't squatting, he's bending over slightly. I've done the same before I eventually get on the ground and stretch it. You can see his calf get huge/pulsating just like how a calf looks with a cramp. Not sure what your agenda is against LeBron but this is just hating.

You didn't watch it, liar.

[Neo.]

For what it's worth; Lebron was meant to win a ring or two in any conference. NBA wasn't gonna let that not happen. He ain't GOAT though. GOATs don't need all the welfare. He's embarrassed himself time and time again by crying for calls on non fouls and faking injuries that didn't occur.


He has enjoyed above the mean health. But durability doesn't make one above faking. If you haven't figured out that he didn't have cramps in the finals yet, then you don't know how cramps work or you aren't paying attention (among other events).


Bruh, I ain't on any nigga's nuts.

You do realize that one has cramp, one stretches, not squats, right? You probably never played soccer growing up to not know that....

Now that you've been taught that he faked the injury, do you want to know why he did it?


Bruh, I cannot help it if you weren't paying attention. Go back and look at the clip. Repeatedly, he tried to squat to alleviate the pain. That's not how cramps work--not at all!


You didn't watch it, liar.

ive seen many posters come and go on here

you are quite possibly the worst ever

[ambchang]

did kobe rape your mother or sister or something? still don't understand your butthurt towards him

Did I rape your mother and sister or something? still don't understand your butthurt towards me.

[Spurtacular]

ive seen many posters come and go on here

you are quite possibly the worst ever

Rent free

[lefty]

Magic > Jordan

[Neo.]

yes

ah well that makes sense :tu

[dontouchmebwo]

so lebron himself being injured is not an excuse for the lakers sucking after he got hurt and was unable to play?

then by that logic there is no excuse for cleveland or miami sucking after lebron left

There was only like a 4 game difference between their 4th and the 8th seed, it's not like LA was playing lights out, it took Houston/San Antonio/Utah months to start playing like a playoff teams and GS barely got Cousins back. Injuries happen to every team and they fall behind in the rankings all the time.

Lebron's team would still be in the playoffs in the east where guys like DD-Lowry can win 60 games. Indiana still maintaining their 3 seed without Oladipo tells you all you need to know about the East just like BK holding the 6th seed without Levert.

edit-and in regards to CLE they lost both Lebron and Love this year, the year before Oladipo and a bunch of nobodies barely won 2 games less than them in the season and almost bounced them in the 1st round. Miami was rapidly breaking down too which is why Lebron bolted. Only took them 1 year to get back into the playoffs

[dontouchmebwo]

They're 22-16 or something close when he plays, that's pretty impressive considering his #2/3/4 options are all young and inexperienced, while the rest of the team is old scrubs(other than Rondo and maybe McGee)

LeBron's legacy would have been better in the West..he would have the same number of titles, but then people couldn't use the stupid Finals record argument:lol

They were a 35 win team last year and their big 3 were all a lot worse than they are now, that's not that impressive. Lebron's finals record is what like 3-6? He'd be playing these finals caliber teams as early as the 1st or 2nd round.

The past couple years he's had basically free passes to the finals with Lowry-DD's raptor's, these guys aren't even top 20 players and were winning 60 in the East. Not to mention all the loaded teams he's been on, not many guys have played next to 2 all stars.

replay lebron's career in the west and his body would breakdown faster too, he's had to go all in this year, he was just cruising in the east, well rested while western teams were all beat tf up

[dontouchmebwo]

Obviously you're trolling. Every career has different circumstances. For example, Kobe, without elite big men, would have struggled to even make the playoffs his entire career. Which was proven by actual factual evidence when Shaq left town and he missed the playoffs entirely, in his prime.

kobe was way worse than lebron though, no argument there

[FrostKing]

kobe was way worse than lebron though, no argument there
I am big time Kobe hater. My most hated player

Kobe vs James
- Bryant more leader and sharp shooter
- James more enjoyable NBA product


BOTTOMLINE:
James much easier to partner up with another great. Kobe is difficult in that regard. But Big + Kobe is more successful than LBJ.


FINAL VERDICT:
Kobe over James. I feel Bryant would attempt to fix the weaknesses in his game.

[Neo.]

But Big + Kobe is more successful than LBJ.

Oh wait, you mean to tell me two star players is better than one?

https://media.tenor.com/images/2220d4651ff9cccee3ac0c663ef82bbd/tenor.gif

mind blown

[Will Hunting]

Oh wait, you mean to tell me two star players is better than one?

https://media.tenor.com/images/2220d4651ff9cccee3ac0c663ef82bbd/tenor.gif

mind blown
:lmao

Just imagine if Lebron was drafted by a team that had one of the best NBA executives ever (Jerry West) and 24 year old Shaq in probably the most attractive free agent market :lol

That team wins 5+ titles in dominant fashion and it doesn’t have the chemistry issues the Kobe/Shaq Lakers always had. It certainly doesn’t give up the one NBA finals victory in the past 30 years to a team that doesn’t have a top 10 player on it.

In 2006 Lebron forced a game 7 against and the same Pistons team that beat Kobe’s Lakers in 5 games despite the fact Lebrons supporting cast in 2006 was Zyndrunas Ilgauskas and Larry Hughes while Kobe’s was Shaq (who was unguardable in that series but had a teammate who refused to pass him the ball) and Gary Payton :lmao

[Othyus Lalanne]

:lmao

Just imagine if Lebron was drafted by a team that had one of the best NBA executives ever (Jerry West) and 24 year old Shaq in probably the most attractive free agent market :lol

That team wins 5+ titles in dominant fashion and it doesn’t have the chemistry issues the Kobe/Shaq Lakers always had. It certainly doesn’t give up the one NBA finals victory in the past 30 years to a team that doesn’t have a top 10 player on it.

In 2006 Lebron forced a game 7 against and the same Pistons team that beat Kobe’s Lakers in 5 games despite the fact Lebrons supporting cast in 2006 was Zyndrunas Ilgauskas and Larry Hughes while Kobe’s was Shaq (who was unguardable in that series but had a teammate who refused to pass him the ball) and Gary Payton :lmao

No chemistry issues on a Bron team?

https://i.imgur.com/i4DMDew.jpg

[Clipper Nation]

No chemistry issues on a Bron team?

https://i.imgur.com/i4DMDew.jpg
LeBron's teams usually either have fake "chemistry issues" created by the media, or drama that LeBron has nothing to do with but still gets blamed for (like Isaiah and Love's beef last year, or GM M:lolgic alienating every player on the team with public trade negotiations and tampering).

Kobe snitched on Shaq to try to deflect attention away from his rape scandal. He sabotaged his own team in the Finals on purpose so he could run prime Shaq and Phil out of town. When he found out the hard way that being the first option and team leader isn't as easy as he thought it was, he quit on his team and demanded a trade.

There is no comparison.

[Othyus Lalanne]

LeBron's teams usually either have fake "chemistry issues" created by the media, or drama that LeBron has nothing to do with but still gets blamed for (like Isaiah and Love's beef last year, or GM M:lolgic alienating every player on the team with public trade negotiations and tampering).

Kobe snitched on Shaq to try to deflect attention away from his rape scandal. He sabotaged his own team in the Finals on purpose so he could run prime Shaq and Phil out of town. When he found out the hard way that being the first option and team leader isn't as easy as he thought it was, he quit on his team and demanded a trade.

There is no comparison.

So the media that worships this cocksucker comes up with fake chemistry issues?:blah

Sure...:fro

[ambchang]

ah well that makes sense :tu

Oh wow! Changing quotes? I have never seen that before. This is so creative. Did you came up with this all on your own?

Amazing. New found respect.

[Neo.]

Oh wow! Changing quotes? I have never seen that before. This is so creative. Did you came up with this all on your own?

Amazing. New found respect.

almost as creative as answering a question with an identical question to avoid actually answering it :toast

[ambchang]

almost as creative as answering a question with an identical question to avoid actually answering it :toast

That one was a new one. Glad you noted that.

[dontouchmebwo]

YIKES losing to the Hawks, Lebron was getting WORKED out there without Ball to defend lol no defense. I thought he'd at least make the 8th seed but it's looking like that may not even happen, this will be very damaging to his legacy. He goes from cruising in the East his entire career, cake walk after cake walk to the Finals, to not even being able to make the playoffs in the West? He's going hard too, he wants to make the playoffs.

[FrostKing]

YIKES losing to the Hawks, Lebron was getting WORKED out there without Ball to defend lol no defense. I thought he'd at least make the 8th seed but it's looking like that may not even happen, this will be very damaging to his legacy. He goes from cruising in the East his entire career, cake walk after cake walk to the Finals, to not even being able to make the playoffs in the West? He's going hard too, he wants to make the playoffs.
Meh. They'll ship out the roster and use them as scapegoat

"Bron needs help" is his legacy

[Clipper Nation]

The real story here is that :lol today's Lakers are such a shitshow of an organization that they've managed to be under .500 in February with the GOAT on their team.

[djohn2oo8]

The real story here is that :lol today's Lakers are such a shitshow of an organization that they've managed to be under .500 in February with the GOAT on their team.
Yet he still chose to go there.

[Clipper Nation]

Yet he still chose to go there.

Yes, for his retirement tour. But even with LeBron in retirement mode, it takes an especially shitty organization to still be an under .500 team fighting for the 8th seed with him on their roster.

[Ghazi]

^ they're under .500 because LeFinished is injured/washed up/not winning any more rings.

[Rosewood]

:lmao

Just imagine if Lebron was drafted by a team that had one of the best NBA executives ever (Jerry West) and 24 year old Shaq in probably the most attractive free agent market :lol

That team wins 5+ titles in dominant fashion and it doesn’t have the chemistry issues the Kobe/Shaq Lakers always had. It certainly doesn’t give up the one NBA finals victory in the past 30 years to a team that doesn’t have a top 10 player on it.

In 2006 Lebron forced a game 7 against and the same Pistons team that beat Kobe’s Lakers in 5 games despite the fact Lebrons supporting cast in 2006 was Zyndrunas Ilgauskas and Larry Hughes while Kobe’s was Shaq (who was unguardable in that series but had a teammate who refused to pass him the ball) and Gary Payton :lmao

You make some good points, all trolling aside.

Fuck Kobe.

[JoeTait75]

Yet he still chose to go there.

Pretty clear he went to LA mostly for non-basketball reasons. If he was serious about winning another ring he would have tried to go to Philadelphia or Houston.

IMO LeBron thinks 2016 set his legacy and he doesn't feel the need to chase rings anymore.

[ambchang]

Lakers is Lebrons wizards.

[FrostKing]

No one wants this scrub

https://i.ibb.co/Fm8xMLh/Screenshot-2019-02-13-17-04-19-1.png

[Clipper Nation]

No one wants this scrub

https://i.ibb.co/Fm8xMLh/Screenshot-2019-02-13-17-04-19-1.png

:lol Citing Lakersground's takes
:lol Literally Kobetard central

[Othyus Lalanne]

:lol Citing Lakersground's takes
:lol Literally Kobetard central

Pretty sure Lakers fandom is Kobetard central...

So i say it's valid.

[TDMVPDPOY]

young lebron with prime shaq like young kirby and prime shaq wont work

just look at the shaq and wade experiment...or shaq and penny

everytime a younger player overshadows him, he starts making demands, same thing will happen to lebron like those b4 him who played with snaq

[FrostKing]

Lebum

https://i.ibb.co/GHJqx4k/Screenshot-2019-02-16-17-08-49-1.png

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

LeBron's Miami super-team would have probably gotten out of the West...once.

[gambit1990]

lebron is the best player to play the game.

[FrostKing]

https://i.ibb.co/0qNG4Gg/61321-1.jpg

Bird would have humiliated this 34 year old man child

[spursistan]

Can't blame Lebron haters for rubbing it in, tbh.

The 8 straight Finals trips is perhaps now the most overrated/meaningless personal record in NBA.

[Mr. Body]

Jordan was a product of the east, too.

[Chris]

Bird would have humiliated this 34 year old man child

Definitely! Bird talked a lot of trash and Lebron in the hand check era would be an above average player.

[Kobe'sAchilles]

Is there a bigger fraud than LeFraud James? But but 8 straight finals appearances on a crappy conference means more than winning rings :cry Jordan has only has 6 finals appearances compared to Lebrons 9 :cry
He's the goat (who constantly needs better teammates, coaches, GMs, and Owners) and the only reason why he has ever lost a game is bc of the aforementioned :cry

[Kobe'sAchilles]

Jordan was a product of the east, too.
Except he beat every western conference team he played. Going undefeated against the Western Conference kinda kills that argument. Easier to say he was a product of Magic/Bird getting old and expansion teams arriving to dilute the league.

[Mr. Body]

Except he beat every western conference team he played. Going undefeated against the Western Conference kinda kills that argument. Easier to say he was a product of Magic/Bird getting old and expansion teams arriving to dilute the league.

He was lucky as fuck not to match up with Olajuwon in the Finals. His record would be way worse if he had to face Malone and Barkley and Robinson and the Sonics, etc., all the time instead of the crap the Eastern Conference had.

C'mon, fuckhead, think a little.

[Rosewood]

He was lucky as fuck not to match up with Olajuwon in the Finals. His record would be way worse if he had to face Malone and Barkley and Robinson and the Sonics, etc., all the time instead of the crap the Eastern Conference had.

C'mon, fuckhead, think a little. See you had a good argument going, then your autism kicked in. Sad to see. :(

[Mr. Body]

See you had a good argument going, then your autism kicked in. Sad to see. :(

You think calling a Laker fan a fuckwad is autism? Go crawl into a sewer and die, festering dickweed.

[DejountesACL]

L3-6ron's trash ass cant even take the Lakers to the playoffs, this walking trash can isnt even top 15 all time ����

[Kobe'sAchilles]

You think calling a Laker fan a fuckwad is autism? Go crawl into a sewer and die, festering dickweed.
Obviously you do have autism. My pic is of Kobe injuring himself dumbass. How does that make me a Laker fan? It's an obvious troll name too. What month is yall's awareness again? maybe I should make a donation...

[Dirks_Finale]

https://i.ibb.co/0qNG4Gg/61321-1.jpg

Bird would have humiliated this 34 year old man child

Facts

[Mr. Body]

Obviously you do have autism. My pic is of Kobe injuring himself dumbass. How does that make me a Laker fan? It's an obvious troll name too. What month is yall's awareness again? maybe I should make a donation...

Fine. You're still fucking wrong.

[Rosewood]

Fine. You're still fucking wrong. Not about you having autism, tbh...

[Kobe'sAchilles]

I'm wrong about Jordan being undefeated in Finals? Stockton and Malone lost in the first round NINE TIMES! Real world beaters there. Hakeem got swept in the 1st round when Jordan won in 1991 and then missed the playoffs all together when Jordan repeated. Barkley didn't show up to Phoenix til 92-93 and Jordan beat him in the finals so once again you're bitching about nothing. He still would've 3peated

If you're argument is that he wouldn't have 4peated then yes I agree. He probably would've lost to the Knicks in the conference finals in 94 just due to fatigue.

95 he got beat by the Shaq and Penny Magic team which were just as good as the Spurs, Suns, and Jazz (who once again lost in the first round) that year and obviously worse than the Rockets. So he wasn't lucky not to face Hakeem that year, he wasn't good enough to.

96 I guess he was lucky he didn't face Utah that year? Even though he beat them the next 2 years. And he beat the Sonics in the finals. Phoenix sucked by then and San Antonio choked constantly in the playoffs at that point and I don't see Jordan being lucky to avoid playing a Bob Hill coached team.

97 Spurs didn't make the playoffs. Phoenix once again sucked. Houston was filled with tosb that year in the "big 3" and probably wouldn't have faced Chicago anyways. Chicago that year would've faced the Clippers in round 1 in the west and Nick van excel laker team to make the WCF (since they would be the 1 seed after winning 69 games) and since they beat the Jazz anyways that year I think they still make the finals and win it.

98 is the year you can argue they lose. They were injured and Pippen was a tosb at that point along with Rodman. But who do they lose to exactly? It's not the Jazz obviously. Hakeem was done. Barkley was done. The Sonics choked (like all George Karl teams do) and the Lakers wouldn't have matched up well with the Bulls. Maybe the Spurs? That's your best bet, but who can really say since our backcourt really really sucked and Duncan and Robinson weren't in total sync together that year.

So at worst Jordan won 5 out of 6 while at beat he stayed the same.

[Mr. Body]

Not about you having autism, tbh...

Why don't you shove your mom's dick down your throat until you rupture everything and die? Mmm?

[HarlemHeat37]

LeBron playing in the East has hurt him much more than it has helped, tbh..none of his 3 titles were affected by playing in the East, and dumb fans and media wouldn't use the silly "finals record" argument against him..more importantly, he would have been able to rest and extend his career had he been eliminated earlier in the playoffs in years where his team never stood a chance(2007, 2017, 2018)..

[R. DeMurre]

In some ways, I'd say LeBron was given a bad hand. The Cleveland team that drafted him was beyond awful, and in the seven years he played there (the first time around), they were never able to get him another truly impactful star/sidekick. Magic joined the league and had Kareem and Jamaal Wilkes. Three years later, he got James Worthy! Duncan had Robinson, MJ got Pippen in his 4th season. This is the main reason I never had an issue with LeBron going to Miami. LeBron was essentially beating loaded Boston and Detroit teams with very little help-- why on earth should he have stayed in Cleveland?

[Thebesteva]

The real story here is that :lol today's Lakers are such a shitshow of an organization that they've managed to be under .500 in February with the GOAT on their team.

That's pretty accurate tbh except for the GOAT stuff. Stop already...Lebron has always been a mental midget. I have him on my top 4 GOAT list and all that but he needs someone with killer instinct because he lacks it. He seems way too fucking calm in the 4th quarter no matter the score and plays with 0 urgency and 0 defense.

He's also hell bent on not having a good coach or GM because he's under the delusion that his mongol IQ can handle these things while being a superstar for the team. Every one is terrified to tell him but he's an awful GM and an even more awful head coach. Even Peyton Manning who was a WR coach on the field actually deferred to the OC for more complex moments.

I still think they can turn this ship around but as of now its not looking too good with these youngsters and Lebron's delusional ego. The real test will be this off season

[Othyus Lalanne]

That's pretty accurate tbh except for the GOAT stuff. Stop already...Lebron has always been a mental midget. I have him on my top 4 GOAT list and all that but he needs someone with killer instinct because he lacks it. He seems way too fucking calm in the 4th quarter no matter the score and plays with 0 urgency and 0 defense.

He's also hell bent on not having a good coach or GM because he's under the delusion that his mongol IQ can handle these things while being a superstar for the team. Every one is terrified to tell him but he's an awful GM and an even more awful head coach. Even Peyton Manning who was a WR coach on the field actually deferred to the OC for more complex moments.

I still think they can turn this ship around but as of now its not looking too good with these youngsters and Lebron's delusional ego. The real test will be this off season

Trade the Brono to some team desperate to sell tickets. In theory the Lakers should have more juice with the media than LeBron.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Luck FaBron!

[dontouchmebwo]

*PLAYOFF MODE ACTIVATED*

Misses playoffs entirely


As far as I'm concerned this dude's whole career has been a lie.

[MultiTroll]

*PLAYOFF MODE ACTIVATED*

Misses playoffs entirely


As far as I'm concerned this dude's whole career has been a lie.
along with all the other players who's teams missed the playoffs.

Kream Jabbar

[dontouchmebwo]

LeBron playing in the East has hurt him much more than it has helped, tbh..none of his 3 titles were affected by playing in the East, and dumb fans and media wouldn't use the silly "finals record" argument against him..more importantly, he would have been able to rest and extend his career had he been eliminated earlier in the playoffs in years where his team never stood a chance(2007, 2017, 2018)..

It took him 8 tries to get the finals and win just 3 times, he's not winning 3, he'd be lucky to win 1 at that rate.

His last title took GS exhausting themselves, chasing 73 wins, a Curry injury, a Bogut injury, Green suspension, and them only having 3 days rest in between a 7 game series with OKC and the finals where they ultimately collapsed from exhaustion. Meanwhile Lebron had his usual regular season cakewalk, and eastern conference cakewalk against the Lowry-DD Raptors & a week off before playing GS.

His last championship in 2013 was the result of an exhausted Parker's hamstring giving out as well, so already 2/3 championships were the result of him playing in the East.


You talk about rest but there is no rest in the West, you need way more wins to reach the playoffs (Lebron's Lakers this year would be 8th in the East), each loss means more, each loss creates drama in the locker room, each loss puts more pressure on you and Lebron can't handle that. He's been on super teams the past decade, surrounded by really good cores and even role players/vets that took pay cuts to play with him and was still underwhelming.

[dontouchmebwo]

along with all the other players who's teams missed the playoffs.

Kream Jabbar

8 straight Finals appearance in the East

1 season in the West-Misses playoffs

[baseline bum]

98 is the year you can argue they lose. They were injured and Pippen was a tosb at that point along with Rodman. But who do they lose to exactly? It's not the Jazz obviously. Hakeem was done. Barkley was done. The Sonics choked (like all George Karl teams do) and the Lakers wouldn't have matched up well with the Bulls. Maybe the Spurs? That's your best bet, but who can really say since our backcourt really really sucked and Duncan and Robinson weren't in total sync together that year.

So at worst Jordan won 5 out of 6 while at beat he stayed the same.

98 Spurs would have had no chance against the Bulls with Sean Elliott out and Vinny Del Negro in the starting lineup. Del Negro guarding Jordan and Duncan guarding Pippen would have been ugly.

[DPG21920]

This is what Lebron opened himself up to by coming to the West. Right or Wrong, one of the biggest arguments against him in all time GOAT status was that there were suspicions he could not cut it in the West.

He makes the jump and what happens? Can’t even make the playoffs.

[Kobe'sAchilles]

98 Spurs would have had no chance against the Bulls with Sean Elliott out and Vinny Del Negro in the starting lineup. Del Negro guarding Jordan and Duncan guarding Pippen would have been ugly.

I agree with you 100%. I just don't see this mythical team that beats Jordan during his championship years. I mean they went 72-10 and 69-13 in 96 & 97. Nobody beat those guys which is why the premise that Jordan benefited from playing in the East was a dumb one to begin with.

I just thought I should give a little history lesson to the idiots who think otherwise tbh.

[Clipper Nation]

8 straight Finals appearance in the East

1 season in the West-Misses playoffs

He could have joined literally any other team in the West and made the playoffs easily. Even the fucking Suns. Only :lol today's Lakers are a pathetic enough franchise to pull this off.

[MultiTroll]

8 straight Finals appearance in the East

1 season in the West-Misses playoffs

Kream Alcindor Jabbar

70 Lost Division Finals (Rookie of the Year legit)
71 NBA Finals won
72 Conf Finals lost
73 1st round lost
74 Finals lost 4-3
75 missed playoffs

Using your logic Kream sucked and coat tailed his way to the playoffs til he joined the LA Flamers. Where they missed the playoffs in 75-76.

[spurraider21]

lebron was asking for this narrative by coming to a garbage team in the west :lol

[FrostKing]

Kream Alcindor Jabbar

70 Lost Division Finals (Rookie of the Year legit)
71 NBA Finals won
72 Conf Finals lost
73 1st round lost
74 Finals lost 4-3
75 missed playoffs

Using your logic Kream sucked and coat tailed his way to the playoffs til he joined the LA Flamers. Where they missed the playoffs in 75-76.


I googled

Lakers had 4th best record in Conference but division priority left them out. Lakers were 4 games better than last playoff spot (Pistons in the West lol)

Lakers had a better record than the #2 seed Bucks. What a mess the playoff system was

[baseline bum]

lebron was asking for this narrative by coming to a garbage team in the west :lol

https://i.ibb.co/ZmqtbVd/mynigga.png

[HarlemHeat37]

It took him 8 tries to get the finals and win just 3 times, he's not winning 3, he'd be lucky to win 1 at that rate.

His last title took GS exhausting themselves, chasing 73 wins, a Curry injury, a Bogut injury, Green suspension, and them only having 3 days rest in between a 7 game series with OKC and the finals where they ultimately collapsed from exhaustion. Meanwhile Lebron had his usual regular season cakewalk, and eastern conference cakewalk against the Lowry-DD Raptors & a week off before playing GS.

His last championship in 2013 was the result of an exhausted Parker's hamstring giving out as well, so already 2/3 championships were the result of him playing in the East.


You talk about rest but there is no rest in the West, you need way more wins to reach the playoffs (Lebron's Lakers this year would be 8th in the East), each loss means more, each loss creates drama in the locker room, each loss puts more pressure on you and Lebron can't handle that. He's been on super teams the past decade, surrounded by really good cores and even role players/vets that took pay cuts to play with him and was still underwhelming.

- There's 0 correlation between path to the Finals to Finals result, this has been proven throughout history..no team has ever lost because of their road to the Finals, the better team virtually always wins..

- Who would have defeated the 2012 Heat or 2013 Heat prior to the Finals?

- So, you believe that just getting to the Finals gives you a real chance to win the title? That's what you're implying, which is not true at all, look at the history of the NBA:lol how many times has an undeserving team won a title?

[FrostKing]

- There's 0 correlation between path to the Finals to Finals result, this has been proven throughout history..no team has ever lost because of their road to the Finals, the better team virtually always wins..

- Who would have defeated the 2012 Heat or 2013 Heat prior to the Finals?

- So, you believe that just getting to the Finals gives you a real chance to win the title? That's what you're implying, which is not true at all, look at the history of the NBA:lol how many times has an undeserving team won a title?
2012: Spurs vs Heat comes to mind

2016 Thunder over Cavs


I'd say -
1991 Lakers because of injury
1994 Knicks having to play 3 straight Game 7 series

[JoeTait75]

2016 Thunder over Cavs

Cavaliers would've won that in six, maybe five.

[AlexJones]

- There's 0 correlation between path to the Finals to Finals result, this has been proven throughout history..no team has ever lost because of their road to the Finals, the better team virtually always wins..

- Who would have defeated the 2012 Heat or 2013 Heat prior to the Finals?

- So, you believe that just getting to the Finals gives you a real chance to win the title? That's what you're implying, which is not true at all, look at the history of the NBA:lol how many times has an undeserving team won a title?

2015 Spurs losing the final game to the Pels might've cost them a title.

[phxspurfan]

As true as this was when the East was really really terrible, this year there are at least 4 teams who would be bukkakeing LeRoids if he stayed with the Cavs:

Toronto with Kawhi
Philly with Embiid, Simmons, Butler and Tobias
Boston with Kyrie
Bucks with Giannis

Granted he would be making the playoffs (as a low seed) and the referee advantage would be much more effective against the lesser bottom rung East teams. But right now if he stayed East, he would be scrapping with teams like the Pacers, Pistons and Nets for 6-8 seed right now.

[FkLA]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=90&v=UYYTssOZmi4

:cry :cry

[dontouchmebwo]

- There's 0 correlation between path to the Finals to Finals result, this has been proven throughout history..no team has ever lost because of their road to the Finals, the better team virtually always wins..

- Who would have defeated the 2012 Heat or 2013 Heat prior to the Finals?

- So, you believe that just getting to the Finals gives you a real chance to win the title? That's what you're implying, which is not true at all, look at the history of the NBA:lol how many times has an undeserving team won a title?


What do you mean? There are plenty of finals caliber teams that lose in the early rounds out West, and plenty of teams that went all out trying to get good seeding in the regular season that burned themselves out. The Cavs last won because GS burned themselves out in the regular season followed by a 7 game series against OKC, they had 3 days rest, Lebron 7 days after an easy series.

All it takes is 1 bad match up, an injured or fatigued squad, 1 series where a team catches fire like the 8th seed Grizz upsetting the Spurs or the 8th seed Dubs upsetting Dallas. The odds of that happening in the West are increased x8.

The 2012 Heat wouldn't have even beaten a healthy Celtics squad (Ray Allen was injured) I really doubt they get past the Spurs if they were playing in the West as Pop has Lebron's number, even the old Grizzlies teams could've taken them out especially because they had nobody to guard guys like Randolph or Gasol.

[dontouchmebwo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lk1KJ3LXu-0

lebron partying already lol

[lefty]

- There's 0 correlation between path to the Finals to Finals result, this has been proven throughout history..no team has ever lost because of their road to the Finals, the better team virtually always wins..

- Who would have defeated the 2012 Heat or 2013 Heat prior to the Finals?

- So, you believe that just getting to the Finals gives you a real chance to win the title? That's what you're implying, which is not true at all, look at the history of the NBA:lol how many times has an undeserving team won a title?

The 1987 Celtics had tough physical series against competitive teams in the East

The Lakers best a .500 team in the WCF

By the time the Finals began the Celtics were injured and tired

Riley knew it and the strategy was run run run

So there is a correlation

[JoeTait75]

The 1987 Celtics had tough physical series against competitive teams in the East

The Lakers best a .500 team in the WCF

By the time the Finals began the Celtics were injured and tired

Riley knew it and the strategy was run run run

So there is a correlation

That Celtics team had zero depth. KC Jones ran his starters into the ground all season. The grind of the EC playoffs didn't help their cause once they went up against the Lake Show, but they had those problems all season, especially after Bill Walton got hurt. The reasons they couldn't handle LA are the same reasons they had such a difficult time with the Bucks and Pistons to begin with.

[HarlemHeat37]

The 1987 Celtics had tough physical series against competitive teams in the East

The Lakers best a .500 team in the WCF

By the time the Finals began the Celtics were injured and tired

Riley knew it and the strategy was run run run

So there is a correlation

No, that's just 1 year..you can find examples on both sides, there's little correlation, the best team in the NBA virtually always wins..

Past 10 years, excluding paths that were the same amount of games or only separated by 1 game:

2016 Cavs 14 games vs. Warriors 17 games(more tiring road lost)
2014 Heat 15 games vs. Spurs 18 games(tired team won)
2013 Heat 16 games vs. 2013 Spurs 14 games(tired team won)
2012 Heat 18 games vs. Thunder 15 games(tired team won)
2008 Celtics 20 games vs. Lakers 15 games(much more tired team won easily)

Really doesn't make a difference, the better team almost always wins in the NBA..

[lefty]

That Celtics team had zero depth. KC Jones ran his starters into the ground all season. The grind of the EC playoffs didn't help their cause once they went up against the Lake Show, but they had those problems all season, especially after Bill Walton got hurt. The reasons they couldn't handle LA are the same reasons they had such a difficult time with the Bucks and Pistons to begin with.

Yup I forgot to mention the lack of depth and I agree with you it was a big factor
But a 7game series against the upstart Pistons was tougher than any series the Lakers played that year.
The West was weak

[ambchang]

No, that's just 1 year..you can find examples on both sides, there's little correlation, the best team in the NBA virtually always wins..

Past 10 years, excluding paths that were the same amount of games or only separated by 1 game:

2016 Cavs 14 games vs. Warriors 17 games(more tiring road lost)
2014 Heat 15 games vs. Spurs 18 games(tired team won)
2013 Heat 16 games vs. 2013 Spurs 14 games(tired team won)
2012 Heat 18 games vs. Thunder 15 games(tired team won)
2008 Celtics 20 games vs. Lakers 15 games(much more tired team won easily)

Really doesn't make a difference, the better team almost always wins in the NBA..

How do you define the better team?

[JoeTait75]

Yup I forgot to mention the lack of depth and I agree with you it was a big factor
But a 7game series against the upstart Pistons was tougher than any series the Lakers played that year.
The West was weak

The West was horrible. But '87 is an outlier. How often is it that two legitimately great teams play in one conference final while a 39-win team plays in another? That type of disparity is rare, even in eras when one conference is decidedly better than another.

Here's a counter-example: 2008. The Celtics played six more games in the East playoffs than the Lake Show played in the West- virtually an entire series worth. Yet Boston still beat LA handily in the Finals.

To your point, it certainly doesn't hurt a team to have more rest going into the Finals. But I agree with Harlem that the better team usually wins. Actually, I would say that the best team wins the title in the NBA more than in any other major sport.

[R. DeMurre]

The year LeBron went #1 in the draft to Cleveland, Detroit had the #2 pick. That was the Piston team with Chauncy Billups, Rip Hamilton, Ben Wallace, Rasheed Wallace, etc... They won the NBA championship the next season. If LeBron had gone to them instead of a hapless Cleveland team, he probably would've won two or three rings right out of the gate.

[ambchang]

The West was horrible. But '87 is an outlier. How often is it that two legitimately great teams play in one conference final while a 39-win team plays in another? That type of disparity is rare, even in eras when one conference is decidedly better than another.

Here's a counter-example: 2008. The Celtics played six more games in the East playoffs than the Lake Show played in the West- virtually an entire series worth. Yet Boston still beat LA handily in the Finals.

To your point, it certainly doesn't hurt a team to have more rest going into the Finals. But I agree with Harlem that the better team usually wins. Actually, I would say that the best team wins the title in the NBA more than in any other major sport.

I know I’d be offensive if I say this but the cavs actually comes to mind it’s doubtful they could have beaten all the western teams to even make the finals in the first place. The warriors were far and away the supposedly better team in that series but lost in 7.

The 07 spurs got lucky in avoiding the Mavs in 07. Though they are in the same conference but matchups do make a difference. If the Mavs were in the east they may have won it all that year.

Point is that a team is the better team because they won the series, but HH is trying to argue that Lebron would’ve won the same number of rings if he was in the west all these years because he had the better team, proven by the fact that they won th title.
1) circular logic
2) ignored matchups and view team quality strictly as a mathematical equation of if a>b and b>c then a> c. But we know that matchups do matter.

[R. DeMurre]

But imagine if LeBron, like Magic Johnson, had been drafted by a team that already had talent-- what would've happened then? Cleveland was a really bad team, and LeBron spent seven seasons there, getting them to the finals once against much superior competition like the Celtics and the Pistons. He never got a Kareem, a Pippen, a Robinson, or a Shaq as a teammate.

[FrostKing]

But imagine if LeBron, like Magic Johnson, had been drafted by a team that already had talent-- what would've happened then? Cleveland was a really bad team, and LeBron spent seven seasons there, getting them to the finals once against much superior competition like the Celtics and the Pistons. He never got a Kareem, a Pippen, a Robinson, or a Shaq as a teammate.
He's more judged by what he accomplished while at Miami and it was meh.

[JoeTait75]

I know I’d be offensive if I say this but the cavs actually comes to mind it’s doubtful they could have beaten all the western teams to even make the finals in the first place. The warriors were far and away the supposedly better team in that series but lost in 7.

I wouldn't argue with anyone who thinks Golden State was better than the Cavaliers in 2016. Having said that, outside of OKC I don't think Golden State's road to the 2016 Finals was all that impressive. They beat a Houston team that was in disarray and a 44-win Portland team that was only in the second round because Chris Paul and Blake Griffin both went down for the Clippers. There are a number of West champions since 2000 that had it considerably tougher than the Warriors did in '16.

[MultiTroll]

HH, Joe and all,
you think WarriorRef had no significant part in Golden Phaggots beating Rockets in last years pivitol game?

Nevermind the screw ups by the Rockets, I'm talking that game that rivaled 2002 Laker Kings.

[lefty]

The West was horrible. But '87 is an outlier. How often is it that two legitimately great teams play in one conference final while a 39-win team plays in another? That type of disparity is rare, even in eras when one conference is decidedly better than another.

Here's a counter-example: 2008. The Celtics played six more games in the East playoffs than the Lake Show played in the West- virtually an entire series worth. Yet Boston still beat LA handily in the Finals.

To your point, it certainly doesn't hurt a team to have more rest going into the Finals. But I agree with Harlem that the better team usually wins. Actually, I would say that the best team wins the title in the NBA more than in any other major sport.
Good post tbh

[lefty]

HH, Joe and all,
you think WarriorRef had no significant part in Golden Phaggots beating Rockets in last years pivitol game?

Nevermind the screw ups by the Rockets, I'm talking that game that rivaled 2002 Laker Kings.

Even in the ref didn’t help GS, Rockets still lose game 7

They beat themselves in a rather spectacular fashion

[DAF86]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lk1KJ3LXu-0

lebron partying already lol

Unlike current Lebron, this one seems to play the D.

[MultiTroll]

Even in the ref didn’t help GS, Rockets still lose game 7

They beat themselves in a rather spectacular fashion
:rollin Thanks, 2002 Laker Phan.
Rockets had just won Game 4 and 5 to go up 3-2.
Game 6. Rockets ahead 39-22 after 1st qtr and are owning WarriorPhaggots. Well on their way to reaming the Warrior Bois out of the playoffs 4-2.
There would not have been a Game 7.
Que WarriorRef big time.

[RD2191]

Been saying it for years. No one here wanted to believe me. Top 10 my ass. LeBum played teams with losing records in the 1st round for years. The east is garbage. Its almost like a lower level NBA, college tier if you will. And lol @anyone taking any east team seriously. They'd all get wrecked in the Finals, easily.

[JohnnyMax]

Kobe lost 2 finals, that's a fact.

He also won 5, so that's 5/7.

I'm no mathematician but I'm pretty sure that averages out to better than 3/9.

And when you dig a little deeper and realized Lebron had 2 franchise players, giving him a minimum of a 1 franchise player advantage over every team, it makes it even more pathetic.

Then when you look at the 9 finals appearances you say "damn, that's a lot".

Then you dig just a little bit deeper and realize Lebron played his whole career in the eastern conference which has been much weaker than the west for some time.

That makes his 9 appearances look much less impressive.

But still, 3 rings.

Then you realize Lebron had to depend on his other franchise player teammates to close out the opponents for him, even though he's been billed as the best player in the NBA since Kobe began declining.

But hey at least Lebron does have the statistics.

Then you start to think about how advantageous it would be to have 2 franchise players as teammates clearing up crazy space for Lebron to drive and shoot layups all game long.

Those are all what are the logical though processes of people who aren't obsessed with Lebron, and gullible enough to eat up media narratives.

Pretty much Lebron's supposed greatness is manufactured on every single level, which is why him getting further exposed in LA is so satisfying.

[FrostKing]

Best player in a weak Era. Curry, Durant, Harden. None of these guys are GOATs

[FrostKing]

https://i.ibb.co/LNhkWKc/67797.jpg

[JohnnyMax]

http://i63.tinypic.com/20qyjvm.jpg

[Laker_1995]

http://i63.tinypic.com/20qyjvm.jpg


cmon man leave my mans alone lmfao

[Othyus Lalanne]

cmon man leave my mans alone lmfao

If there were no 2 conferences he would be just a dude among many who might have won a championship...

[Kobe'sAchilles]

Where's that Neo faggot at now? He's not a product of the East at all :cry bbbut he would dominate any conference :cry
Lakers were the 4th seed when he was healthy :cry

never mind the fact that the Clippers were like the 2 seed, Houston the 14th seed and Memphis was in the playoffs. Along with OKC actually being good. Even Utah wasn't in the playoffs at the time. Shit changes as the season goes on so saying that they were a playoff team at Christmas doesn't mean shit :lol

[HarlemHeat37]

Lakers were significantly worse against the East this season IIRC..

[RC_Drunkford]

the Lakers have the same exact record with LeBron that they had without him last year :lmao