Leaving Neverland documentary [Archive]

DJR210

03-12-2019, 05:15 AM

Trill Clinton

03-12-2019, 07:36 AM

Will not be watching it.

Spurminator

03-12-2019, 08:40 AM

Will not be watching it.

For me the whole thing sort of illustrates the bullshit that is the concept of paying off accusers so they won't testify against you. If you accept money to help cover up sexual assault against your child, then you should be criminally complicit in any further assaults that occur. Your lack of participation should be something law enforcement can be held accountable by law enforcement.

As for Michael Jackson, it's easy and popular to assume that he was a pedophile because of the decades of rumors, but we have due process for a reason and he was never convicted of anything. If he really did assault a bunch of children, then fuck him... but there are a lot of complicit families who sold out their kids and others' for money.

SpursforSix

03-12-2019, 09:39 AM

I don't know about the choreographer dude.. he seems like he's bullshitting just looking at him, and he's already gone on record previously in court defending MJ. The other guy's account seems credible. The Mom is fucking disgusting laughing and having a good time giving her account of how fucking worthless of a Mother she is

That's where I ended up as well. The choreographer seems like he could be a money chasing douche. Not absolutely saying that. But I can see it. The whole thing about him and his crew of dancers challenging people to a dance off in a club to pick up chicks is cringy. Who knows though.

SpursforSix

03-12-2019, 09:41 AM

For me the whole thing sort of illustrates the bullshit that is the concept of paying off accusers so they won't testify against you. If you accept money to help cover up sexual assault against your child, then you should be criminally complicit in any further assaults that occur. Your lack of participation should be something law enforcement can be held accountable by law enforcement.

As for Michael Jackson, it's easy and popular to assume that he was a pedophile because of the decades of rumors, but we have due process for a reason and he was never convicted of anything. If he really did assault a bunch of children, then fuck him... but there are a lot of complicit families who sold out their kids and others' for money.

Him (the dancer) testifying the second time FOR Jackson was sickening.

CitizenDwayne

03-12-2019, 02:01 PM

I admire him as an entertainer, therefore he can’t be guilty despite bearing all the hallmarks of a pedophile.

CitizenDwayne

03-12-2019, 02:02 PM

I’m not really interested in this film. Doesn’t really seem like it would change anyone’s mind on either side

Nivek_ogre

03-12-2019, 02:25 PM

Doesn't change the opinion I've always had. Micheal Jackson molested kids. And the parents are fucking morons.

DJR210

03-12-2019, 02:33 PM

That's where I ended up as well. The choreographer seems like he could be a money chasing douche. Not absolutely saying that. But I can see it. The whole thing about him and his crew of dancers challenging people to a dance off in a club to pick up chicks is cringy. Who knows though.

Yeah.. this film coincides with his career cooling off.. Just analyzing his mannerisms when speaking, something seemed off.. The other dude was basically like MJ's boyfriend the way they described it..

Avant

03-12-2019, 03:32 PM

Not sure what to even think about any of that. I do know my kids wouldn't be allowed in a world like that one. A lot of freaks in the entertainment world, so, no thanks.

As an entertainer Jackson was first and foremost a fantastic dancer, and was around a lot of talented people. His THRILLER had everything you could want in that genre, a great accomplishment.

Since the guy was never found guilty of anything, that works for me. Will confess not real worried about it.

Capt Bringdown

03-12-2019, 06:32 PM

In this interview, the documentary subjects IMO are believable and convincing as they address the so-called controversial aspects of their accounts:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOrOZL7_NkI

Silver&Black

03-12-2019, 06:37 PM

Will not be watching it.

I watched probably 3 minutes of it. Was unfortunate enough to catch this dude talking about him and Jackson masturbating together when he was a kid.

Had to turn the channel immediately. Shit is too sick to even watch.

Chucho

03-13-2019, 10:28 AM

Watched it last night. It was basically confirmation of what was almost all but unspoken while he was alive. Jackson was a homosexual pedophile the way OJ was a murderer. Privilege in this country is ridiculous.

We have way too many celebrity rapists and deviants. Too bad he isn't alive to be in the clink with Cosby. They deserve each other.

CitizenDwayne

03-13-2019, 12:40 PM

Spurminator

03-13-2019, 12:50 PM

Watched it last night. It was basically confirmation of what was almost all but unspoken while he was alive.

Confirmation in what way?

SpursforSix

03-13-2019, 12:55 PM

Confirmation in what way?

Confirmation that Jackson was one weird pervy dude and probably molested some young boys.

Spurminator

03-13-2019, 01:00 PM

Confirmation that Jackson was one weird pervy dude and probably molested some young boys.

Maybe. What details are confirmed in the documentary? Any corroboration by FBI officials or anyone involved in his investigation?

SpursforSix

03-13-2019, 01:03 PM

Maybe. What details are confirmed in the documentary? Any corroboration by FBI officials or anyone involved in his investigation?

Details about him being super weird and pervy. No...I don't think the FBI was involved in the doc.

Chucho

03-13-2019, 01:09 PM

Interesting that O.J. and Cosby are the two other names you mention

Why? No one was in the media as much as Jackson in the same time period for scandals than OJ. No one was convicted in the court of public opinion more than Jackson except maybe OJ during that same time frame.

No larger icon has been convicted of a more awful sexual crime (s) than Cosby. This is almost on par in terms of Jackson's pop culture status and legacy as is with Cosby's.

Spurminator

03-13-2019, 01:16 PM

Details about him being super weird and pervy.

Hardly breaking news.

SpursforSix

03-13-2019, 01:25 PM

Hardly breaking news.

It was never claimed to be. I think the comment made above was "confirming what we already know".

Spurminator

03-13-2019, 01:26 PM

It was never claimed to be. I think the comment made above was "confirming what we already know".

The comment was that the documentary confirmed he was a homosexual pedophile.

SpursforSix

03-13-2019, 01:29 PM

The comment was that the documentary confirmed he was a homosexual pedophile.

I think that's probably true. Where there's smoke..., Occam's Razor...etc.

Chucho

03-13-2019, 01:33 PM

The comment was that the documentary confirmed he was a homosexual pedophile.

Yeah, I see that. Meant more along the lines as confirmation to me. I don't see the advantages of the accusers now doing this. I dont see HBO standing behind this if this was a cash grab. In the court of public opinion, it was more confirmation. I do admit, there is grey area as Jackson isn't here to defend himself nor can he be even convicted in a civil case to "officially" or "legally" convict him.

SpursforSix

03-13-2019, 01:36 PM

Yeah, I see that. Meant more along the lines as confirmation to me. I don't see the advantages of the accusers now doing this. I dont see HBO standing behind this if this was a cash grab. In the court of public opinion, it was more confirmation. I do admit, there is grey area as Jackson isn't here to defend himself nor can he be even convicted in a civil case to "officially" or "legally" convict him.

And I'm sure we can go online and find people "debunking" the doc or providing alternate explanations.

But at the end of the day, this was a super weird dude who slept with little boys in his own bed for weeks at a time. I don't know how anyone can give him the the benefit of the doubt.

CitizenDwayne

03-13-2019, 01:53 PM

And I'm sure we can go online and find people "debunking" the doc or providing alternate explanations.

But at the end of the day, this was a super weird dude who slept with little boys in his own bed for weeks at a time. I don't know how anyone can give him the the benefit of the doubt.
Exactly. There are two choices:

1. He was a pedophile.

2. He just happened to build an amusement park for kids in his backyard, admit to sleeping with boys, set up an alarm system that would alert someone else nearby, have a history of abuse in his childhood, have a myriad of rumors and odd behavior surrounding his sexuality otherwise, and been accused by several boys of molesting them.

Sure, the accusers may have financial gain in mind; so does the family, who had little involvement with him in those years but now see their cash cow slipping away

Imagine someone in your hometown behaving like him, then being accused; would you really be railing about giving him benefit of the doubt? He shouldn’t get a pass because “oh he’s eccentric” or “he relates well to kids” (a common stance taken by pedophiles).

Spurminator

03-13-2019, 01:57 PM

Yeah, I see that. Meant more along the lines as confirmation to me.

That's fair. There's certainly more than enough evidence for public opinion to come to that assumption. And more than enough where parents should have been wary of ever letting their kids spend time alone with him.

SpursforSix

03-13-2019, 02:00 PM

That's fair. There's certainly more than enough evidence for public opinion to come to that assumption. And more than enough where parents should have been wary of ever letting their kids spend time alone with him.

god...the parents...a whole 'nother story. They're almost as bad as the ones from the recent alien/masturbation/molestation doc.

SpursforSix

03-13-2019, 02:02 PM

That's fair. There's certainly more than enough evidence for public opinion to come to that assumption. And more than enough where parents should have been wary of ever letting their kids spend time alone with him.

and further...maybe Jackson recognized which kids had the blindest parents. Which is why maybe not all boys that stayed with him were molested.

Spurminator

03-13-2019, 02:08 PM

Exactly. There are two choices:

1. He was a pedophile.

2. He just happened to build an amusement park for kids in his backyard, admit to sleeping with boys, set up an alarm system that would alert someone else nearby, have a history of abuse in his childhood, have a myriad of rumors and odd behavior surrounding his sexuality otherwise, and been accused by several boys of molesting them.

Sure, the accusers may have financial gain in mind; so does the family, who had little involvement with him in those years but now see their cash cow slipping away

Imagine someone in your hometown behaving like him, then being accused; would you really be railing about giving him benefit of the doubt? He shouldn’t get a pass because “oh he’s eccentric” or “he relates well to kids” (a common stance taken by pedophiles).

You should also include in #2 that, despite being an enormously public figure that everyone assumed for years was a pedophile, law enforcement was never able to prove it. That seems like a long shot to me too.

Public opinion is a right, and people are certainly entitled to their opinions about MJ. No question he was weird, and highly inappropriate. But pedophile is a serious accusation and in my opinion you need more than rumors and postmortem testimonials to make it.

The Jackson Estate is going to be fine, and MJ's legacy will probably survive this, so in the long run this isn't about how we view him, it's about what standard we apply to these accusations moving forward when they're made against people who aren't dead multimillionaires with a worldwide following of admirers and fans.

Chucho

03-13-2019, 02:14 PM

I think before it his behaviors and eccentricity were known about at his peak in popularity, some parents might have been that naive at first.

Chucho

03-13-2019, 02:15 PM

But pedophile is a serious accusation

Avante's influence is spreading!

Avant

03-13-2019, 02:34 PM

Avante's influence is spreading!

Dude, if we see one of those sick fucks we blow that freaks head right off, that is all I have ever said so why act stupid?

Chucho

03-14-2019, 11:11 AM

Dude, if we see one of those sick fucks we blow that freaks head right off, that is all I have ever said so why act stupid?

You were probably jealous of the numbers he was putting up and not needing to resort to 3rd worlders.

Will Hunting

03-14-2019, 11:12 AM

^:lmao

DJR210

03-15-2019, 01:25 PM

Just saw the 2nd half of the documentary.. what a sick piece of shit

Crazy how he started panicking when the investigators started closing in on him and then he goes into damage control mode trying to spark up "friendships" again calling everyday to try and get the young adults he brainwashed as kids to come to his defense and utilize the coaching he gave them when younger.

CitizenDwayne

03-15-2019, 02:14 PM

SpursforSix

03-15-2019, 03:14 PM

This is not in the doc to my knowledge, but Michael had in his possession 2 books (“The Boy” and “Boys Will Be Boys”). Due to there not actually being sexual contact in them, they’re not legally considered CP. However they are filled with nude pics of underage boys. Defenders should look into it.

*This isn’t some conspiracy nonsense btw; the books were acquired by police in 1993

Plus...iirc...they confiscated a bunch of porn videos. Which isn't damning in itself. But it does someone corroborate the kids' testimony that he watched porn with them.

spurraider21

03-15-2019, 03:16 PM

Plus...iirc...they confiscated a bunch of porn videos. Which isn't damning in itself. But it does someone corroborate the kids' testimony that he watched porn with them.
doesnt corroborate the bolded

SpursforSix

03-15-2019, 03:22 PM

doesnt corroborate the bolded

That's why I said "somewhat".

spurraider21

03-15-2019, 03:23 PM

That's why I said "somewhat".
to be fair you said "someone"

SpursforSix

03-15-2019, 03:37 PM

to be fair you said "someone"

ah...my bad.

CitizenDwayne

03-15-2019, 03:50 PM

Jackson’s and Gavin Arvizo’s (the ‘05 accuser) fingerprints were found on porn magazines at Neverland. It’s not a huge leap to think they looked at them together

Avant

03-17-2019, 01:41 AM

You were probably jealous of the numbers he was putting up and not needing to resort to 3rd worlders.

Dummy, I was over there in 69-71, now how old was Jackson?

Do you think at all?

LaMarcus Bryant

03-18-2019, 10:37 AM

Why do close friends of him keep defending him? Why didn't MacCauley or Webster come forward and throw him under the bus at some point

SpursforSix

03-18-2019, 11:09 AM

Why do close friends of him keep defending him? Why didn't MacCauley or Webster come forward and throw him under the bus at some point

It's possible that he didn't do this with every kid. Maybe the parents of those other kids were more vigilant. He may have only gone after the ones he thought he could get away with it. Or that had the most gullible parents.

johnsmith

03-18-2019, 11:32 AM

I watched some of this but like many others, couldn’t stomach the entire thing so turned it off in the middle of the first episode. The part that astonished me and makes me even question the validity of the accusers (sort of), is that when I was ten years old, you can be damn sure I would have recognized jerking off with a grown up as abnormal. I find it a little hard to believe that the kid was so naive he didn’t think anything of it at ten years old. Having said that, I’m probably being the naive one here.

Also, no question svante has seen this shit twice by now right?

LaMarcus Bryant

03-18-2019, 11:34 AM

It's possible that he didn't do this with every kid. Maybe the parents of those other kids were more vigilant. He may have only gone after the ones he thought he could get away with it. Or that had the most gullible parents.

Yeah I'm just throwing it out there.

The way that kid Wade defended MJ his entire life until he was broke and got denied a big dancing gig via MJ estate...then he starts claiming these things in his 30s after defending MJ over and over as an adult

It's just fishy.

SpursforSix

03-18-2019, 11:36 AM

SpursforSix

03-18-2019, 11:59 AM

Yeah I'm just throwing it out there.

The way that kid Wade defended MJ his entire life until he was broke and got denied a big dancing gig via MJ estate...then he starts claiming these things in his 30s after defending MJ over and over as an adult

It's just fishy.

I'd also add that being molested and going after the money aren't mutually exclusive. It's possible that while Wade was successful, he didn't want to deal with coming forward and admitting he was molested and hurting the guy that made his career. And now that Jackson's dead and he needs the money, he's deciding to come out.

LaMarcus Bryant

03-18-2019, 12:08 PM

I'd also add that being molested and going after the money aren't mutually exclusive. It's possible that while Wade was successful, he didn't want to deal with coming forward and admitting he was molested and hurting the guy that made his career. And now that Jackson's dead and he needs the money, he's deciding to come out.

Of course of course
I was just looking around the web and seems like both individuals from the documentary were in dire financial straits prior to coming forward.
I didn't know the feds had raided MJs crib twice too. What a cluster fuck.

SpursforSix

03-18-2019, 12:15 PM

Of course of course
I was just looking around the web and seems like both individuals from the documentary were in dire financial straits prior to coming forward.
I didn't know the feds had raided MJs crib twice too. What a cluster fuck.

Yeah...lots of blame to go around for everybody. Just saw where Jackson's kid tried to commit suicide partially due to the doc. But now she's saying it's not true.

LaMarcus Bryant

03-18-2019, 12:16 PM

The audacity MJ has in bringing Wade as his first witness in his defense while on trial....I mean it could have blown up so hard core in his face, such a huge huge risk

That's like movie drama level stuff there. It's hard to come to grips that he had the balls to do that.

DJR210

03-18-2019, 04:43 PM

Why do close friends of him keep defending him? Why didn't MacCauley or Webster come forward and throw him under the bus at some point

Macaulay Culkin still hasn't come out of the closet, I'd assume he doesn't want to confirm Jackson fucked him up his ass yet either

SpursforSix

03-18-2019, 04:47 PM

Macaulay Culkin still hasn't come out of the closet, I'd assume he doesn't want to confirm Jackson fucked him up his ass yet either

someone needs to do some photoshop on this

https://is5-ssl.mzstatic.com/image/thumb/Video2/v4/dc/7f/44/dc7f4481-80b8-71d1-7b26-b34f176b9910/pr_source.lsr/268x0w.png

DJR210

03-18-2019, 04:48 PM

It's possible that he didn't do this with every kid. Maybe the parents of those other kids were more vigilant. He may have only gone after the ones he thought he could get away with it. Or that had the most gullible parents.

The two Mom's in this doc pissed me off bad.. So fucking retarded..

The 60 year old with colored hair said "I should take some of the blame" - no bitch you should take 100% of the blame and also pat yourself on the back for driving your husband to hang himself. The other stupid bitch was laughing and shit the whole doc, and said she did a dance when MJ died because "Michael couldn't hurt anymore kids" - so she's saying she did know, whereas I believe this hole films narrative was they "didn't know" until their adult sons just came forward with the documentary.. Both need bullets in their brains tbh

DJR210

03-18-2019, 04:50 PM

someone needs to do some photoshop on this

https://is5-ssl.mzstatic.com/image/thumb/Video2/v4/dc/7f/44/dc7f4481-80b8-71d1-7b26-b34f176b9910/pr_source.lsr/268x0w.png

:lol i got you

Capt Bringdown

03-18-2019, 10:12 PM

Some UK documentaries about Jackson, which are more hard-hitting than US, IMO.
This one includes his former manager, who I haven't seen before.
"Self-proclaimed "King of Pop"s pedophilia explained!
After the 2005 trial, writer and fan Jacques Peretti tracks down the people inside the Jackson story who have never agreed to talk on camera before, including Bob Jones, his manager and right-hand man of 17 years; and Victor Guttierez, the investigative reporter who first uncovered allegations of child abuse and subsequently fled the US.
They talk frankly about the details of the darkest moments in Jackson's life. What emerges is a story radically different from the one the public know: a picture both darker, more complex and more morally ambiguous than anyone could have imagined."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyMKdS29Lbw

Capt Bringdown

03-18-2019, 10:15 PM

(2)Some UK documentaries about Jackson, which are more hard-hitting than US, IMO.
Jackson and the Boy He Paid Off

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQ90tNeBrE0

Capt Bringdown

03-18-2019, 10:16 PM

(3) Some UK documentaries about Jackson, which are more hard-hitting than US, IMO.
Michael Jackson's Boys

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1AxjAFn3D6s

Chucho

03-19-2019, 11:37 AM

^^^ Good lord. Seems the bigger the icon you are, the more audacious you get with your deviancy. Avante couldn't out pace Jackson if he spent two decades in Olangapo with Jackson's bank account.

Avant

03-19-2019, 11:49 AM

^^^ Good lord. Seems the bigger the icon you are, the more audacious you get with your deviancy. Avante couldn't out pace Jackson if he spent two decades in Olangapo with Jackson's bank account.

Chucho, work with me here son.

I think anyone who messes with kids is the scum of the earth, if you find one of these sick fucks you chop that fuckers head clean off then chop the body into little pieces what about that don't you understand? I have always said that never wavering. So where in the fuck do you get this stupid pedo shit from, where is that at? Come on guy, show all of us where you are getting anything that could be.....you pedo? Dude, you don't go around accusing people of being a fag like you do Spur or a pedo like you do me, didn't your parents teach you anything slugger?

Do we need to start calling you a pedo, a queer? Fuck any prove, you don't have any.

Dude, my take on that sick shit. which you have read long ago.

How could anyone mistreat or sexually abuse a child, that has gotta be the pinnacle of sickness. These freaks need to be shot by the parents or some relative who would love blowing the bastard away. Yep, a bullet right into the freaks diseased brain...yippee!!!!!!

Chris

03-22-2019, 10:16 PM

https://twitter.com/NYDailyNews/status/1109269351927111680

Yikes.

Spurtacular

03-23-2019, 12:11 AM

You should also include in #2 that, despite being an enormously public figure that everyone assumed for years was a pedophile, law enforcement was never able to prove it. That seems like a long shot to me too.

Public opinion is a right, and people are certainly entitled to their opinions about MJ. No question he was weird, and highly inappropriate. But pedophile is a serious accusation and in my opinion you need more than rumors and postmortem testimonials to make it.

The Jackson Estate is going to be fine, and MJ's legacy will probably survive this, so in the long run this isn't about how we view him, it's about what standard we apply to these accusations moving forward when they're made against people who aren't dead multimillionaires with a worldwide following of admirers and fans.

Part of that was that the law had to be changed after MJ was effectively able to bribe a witness in the initial case against him. Honestly, you can hide behind 'he was never convicted' in perfect chumpian style (:lol Pavlov); but the writing is on the wall.

Spurtacular

03-23-2019, 12:13 AM

You should also include in #2 that, despite being an enormously public figure that everyone assumed for years was a pedophile, law enforcement was never able to prove it. That seems like a long shot to me too.

Public opinion is a right, and people are certainly entitled to their opinions about MJ. No question he was weird, and highly inappropriate. But pedophile is a serious accusation and in my opinion you need more than rumors and postmortem testimonials to make it.

The Jackson Estate is going to be fine, and MJ's legacy will probably survive this, so in the long run this isn't about how we view him, it's about what standard we apply to these accusations moving forward when they're made against people who aren't dead multimillionaires with a worldwide following of admirers and fans.

With most of the world coming to terms with the fact that he's a pedophile? Maybe; but then again it may be because people are fine with a separate set of rules for elites and not because the facts aren't clear to see.

Spurtacular

03-23-2019, 12:15 AM

https://twitter.com/NYDailyNews/status/1109269351927111680

Yikes.

She can survive this. Liberals are okay with certain people doing pedophilia. Then they'll be outraged the next time a conservative gets caught in the same mire.

Spurtacular

03-23-2019, 12:15 AM

Trill Clinton

04-02-2019, 11:25 AM

Welp this was a huge fail. Oprah has removed all videos, tweets of the documentary, the director came out today and admits the accusers stories aren't adding up.

SpursforSix

04-02-2019, 11:39 AM

Welp this was a huge fail. Oprah has removed all videos, tweets of the documentary, the director came out today and admits the accusers stories aren't adding up.

Sounds like the director should have done some more research. Would have been very easy to fact check a couple of the statements.

Pro-Jackson people will see this as proof that Jackson did nothing wrong. Which it isn't.

Avant

04-02-2019, 12:28 PM

Just take my situation here.

I posted about my hatred for anyone messing with kids, I made it very clear, ya see a sick ass pedo ya blow that sick fuck away. Ok ok, I know that's BS but I really would...."get away from me ya sicko". How could anyone not get how I feel about that sick shit? But......you pedo...??????

This is no different with Jackson, people are pretty fucked as we see right here. He never did shit just like myself, but being everyone is so damn fucked up....you pedo.

People are mean, and being he's a massive success if they can bring him down..........do it.