Avengers: Endgame

[Neo.]

:wow:wow:wow

[Spurtacular]

Don't honestly care that much if I see it or not. But it's so hot that I bought sixty shares of Disney stock, tbh.

[lefty20]

Going to watch it for a 2nd time tomorrow.

[FrostKing]

Do they kill the big bad monster?

[Blake]

Don't honestly care that much if I see it or not. But it's so hot that I bought sixty shares of Disney stock, tbh.

Yeah I always think dudes like you that go to the movies alone look pervish

[Blake]

This movie was phenomenal. Lol if anyone comes in here nit picking at shit like "how did they breathe on distant planets".

9.9/10

[FrostKing]

This movie was phenomenal. Lol if anyone comes in here nit picking at shit like "how did they breathe on distant planets".

9.9/10
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/media/35360/4/1.jpg

[redzero]

SPOILERS


Can somebody please tell me how Thor with his axe can beat Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet, but Thor with his axe AND hammer can't beat Thanos without the gauntlet? And I guess that Vision, Loki and Gomorrah are permanently dead, along with Iron Man and Black Widow. And are all future movies going to take place in 2023 now, since the past wasn't undone? And why does Banner say that the past can't be changed, but Captain America went back and changed the past?

I loved the movie, but that stuff bugs me.

[Spurtacular]

Yeah I always think dudes like you that go to the movies alone look pervish

But you're still going, right? :lol

[tlongII]

SPOILERS


Can somebody please tell me how Thor with his axe can beat Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet, but Thor with his axe AND hammer can't beat Thanos without the gauntlet? And I guess that Vision, Loki and Gomorrah are permanently dead, along with Iron Man and Black Widow. And are all future movies going to take place in 2023 now, since the past wasn't undone? And why does Banner say that the past can't be changed, but Captain America went back and changed the past?

I loved the movie, but that stuff bugs me.

Just roll with it.

[Blake]

SPOILERS


Can somebody please tell me how Thor with his axe can beat Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet, but Thor with his axe AND hammer can't beat Thanos without the gauntlet? And I guess that Vision, Loki and Gomorrah are permanently dead, along with Iron Man and Black Widow. And are all future movies going to take place in 2023 now, since the past wasn't undone? And why does Banner say that the past can't be changed, but Captain America went back and changed the past?

I loved the movie, but that stuff bugs me.

Eh, fat Thor may have lost his edge. But he didn't beat thanos with the infinity gauntlet. He just caught him off guard.

The past can't be changed. Cap changed nothing. It's a new time line.

[Blake]

But you're still going, right? :lol

I went with a group.

Poor incel derp.

[Spurtacular]

I went with a group.


Cuck support group?

[Blake]

Cuck support group?

Smh derp.

[Spurtacular]

Smh derp.

You're the one trying to brag about your social life.

[redzero]

Also, wouldn't 2014 Thanos bringing his army to 2023 undo every Marvel movie from Guardians of the Galaxy onward? And Nebula killed her past self and no paradox happened. And Tony snapped Thanos's army away unnecessarily maybe? I guess more people would have died, but he did kill himself to end Thanos's assault early, even though he was the most powerful being in the galaxy at that point because he had the gauntlet

Whatever. All I know is that the next Spider-Man better take place in 2023 and that half of Peter Parker's classmates should have graduated by then, or I am calling shenanigans.


Eh, fat Thor may have lost his edge. But he didn't beat thanos with the infinity gauntlet. He just caught him off guard.

Thor didn't "stop" Thanos from doing what he set out to do, but he did beat Thanos physically with Stormbreaker.

[Texas_Ranger]

SPOILERS


Can somebody please tell me how Thor with his axe can beat Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet, but Thor with his axe AND hammer can't beat Thanos without the gauntlet? And I guess that Vision, Loki and Gomorrah are permanently dead, along with Iron Man and Black Widow. And are all future movies going to take place in 2023 now, since the past wasn't undone? And why does Banner say that the past can't be changed, but Captain America went back and changed the past?

I loved the movie, but that stuff bugs me.

I have the same problems with the movie and some more, but if I start thinking about it too much, the movie just gets worse for me. So, i guess it's better to just switch your brains off.

[johnsmith]

Great movie....lots of plot holes but who gives a shit?

[Trainwreck2100]

Also, wouldn't 2014 Thanos bringing his army to 2023 undo every Marvel movie from Guardians of the Galaxy onward? And Nebula killed her past self and no paradox happened. And Tony snapped Thanos's army away unnecessarily maybe? I guess more people would have died, but he did kill himself to end Thanos's assault early, even though he was the most powerful being in the galaxy at that point because he had the gauntlet

Whatever. All I know is that the next Spider-Man better take place in 2023 and that half of Peter Parker's classmates should have graduated by then, or I am calling shenanigans.



Thor didn't "stop" Thanos from doing what he set out to do, but he did beat Thanos physically with Stormbreaker.
They addressed this when War Machine said to go back in time and strangle baby Thanos, whatever happens has already happened. Removing someone from the timeline changes nothing because by removing them they are already an alternate from the one that came before. Basically 2014 Thanos was an alternate timeline 2014 Thanos. Tony snapped Thanos army away because Strange told him to, and he said there was only 1 way. They couldn't risk Thanos getting all the stones again, which he easily could have

[FrostKing]

Muh stones

[Spurtacular]

Great movie....lots of plot holes but who gives a shit?

:lmao So, cuck Blake was trying to get out in front of it. :lmao

[Spurtacular]

:lmao So, cuck Blake (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=3460) was trying to get out in front of it. :lmao
Pavlov get in here and tell everyone to calm down cos it's just a kids movie.

[redzero]

They addressed this when War Machine said to go back in time and strangle baby Thanos, whatever happens has already happened. Removing someone from the timeline changes nothing because by removing them they are already an alternate from the one that came before. Basically 2014 Thanos was an alternate timeline 2014 Thanos. Tony snapped Thanos army away because Strange told him to, and he said there was only 1 way. They couldn't risk Thanos getting all the stones again, which he easily could have

Then bring back Gamora, Black Widow, Iron Man, Vision and Loki. Who cares that they are alternate timeline versions when there are zero negative side effects regardless? And Thanos could have been stopped by killing him. Tony has the gauntlet at full power, Thor has two ultimate weapons, and Captain Marvel is overpowered as fuck.

I don't know why I'm bashing the movie. I really did enjoy it.

[johnsmith]

:lmao So, cuck Blake was trying to get out in front of it. :lmao

I haven’t really followed as to why everyone dislikes you....but I’m gonna venture a guess it has something to do with making a mediocre joke (at best) and then doing those emoji’s

[Spurtacular]

I haven’t really followed as to why everyone dislikes you....but I’m gonna venture a guess it has something to do with making a mediocre joke (at best) and then doing those emoji’s

Detecting and calling out all the bull shit also tends to trigger snowflakes, too.

[Blake]

You're the one trying to brag about your social life.

Lol "brag".

Do you buy tickets for all of your ST alts

[Spurtacular]

Lol "brag".


My thoughts exactly.

:lmao Bragging about your cuck support group.

[Blake]

Also, wouldn't 2014 Thanos bringing his army to 2023 undo every Marvel movie from Guardians of the Galaxy onward? And Nebula killed her past self and no paradox happened. And Tony snapped Thanos's army away unnecessarily maybe? I guess more people would have died, but he did kill himself to end Thanos's assault early, even though he was the most powerful being in the galaxy at that point because he had the gauntlet

Whatever. All I know is that the next Spider-Man better take place in 2023 and that half of Peter Parker's classmates should have graduated by then, or I am calling shenanigans.



Thor didn't "stop" Thanos from doing what he set out to do, but he did beat Thanos physically with Stormbreaker.

Yeah they explained how you can't change the past.

He put storm breaker through Thanos when he wasn't ready for it.

I'll admit I was a little disappointed though that storm breaker wasn't as badass as it was last movie though.

[Blake]

Then bring back Gamora, Black Widow, Iron Man, Vision and Loki. Who cares that they are alternate timeline versions when there are zero negative side effects regardless? And Thanos could have been stopped by killing him. Tony has the gauntlet at full power, Thor has two ultimate weapons, and Captain Marvel is overpowered as fuck.

I don't know why I'm bashing the movie. I really did enjoy it.

Yeah they never explained what happened to 9 years ago still alive Gamora. I'm only guessing they got her back to her timeline

[Avant]

I was disappointed but not too much. It did get off to a sluggist start and I didn't care for how they handled Banner/Hulk. Probably my least fav of the Avenger flicks. I don't get too wrapped up in the story more into the visuals and the ZAP, POW, WHAM!!!! that! these kind of movies bring in abundance.

On a scale of 10, 10 being The Godfather....this one a 6.

I'm assuming that was the last one, that's cool with me.

Major bummer was dropping my bag of Sugar Babies I;d smuggled in, Mason....Ike & Mike.

[cd021]

Whatever. All I know is that the next Spider-Man better take place in 2023 and that half of Peter Parker's classmates should have graduated by then, or I am calling shenanigans.

Supposed to pick up right after Endgame. Apparently MJ, Pete and his side kick all died during the snap so they are still in whatever grade they were in but the non snapped kids graduated- at least hopefully or that would be a big mistake.

[cd021]

So the main timeline Cap goes back to the 40's and wifey's Peggy while the Rodgers from that time gets thawed out and resumes being Cap?

If that's the case, then how would would old Cap have his shield wouldn't it have been still destroyed? or if he stole it from the cap from the timeline he went back to then young Cap would've been killed a dozen times over.

Also Cap's shield is supposed to be invincible unless the weapon is also vibranium , does that mean the Thanos' weapon was also vibranium and if it wasn't then how did he break it?

Other than that, pretty damn good.

[Blake]

Vibranium is an Earth metal. There are surely other metals out there in the universe

[redzero]

I was expecting Ronan the Accuser to show up with the rest of Thanos's army, but that might be due to the fact that I watched Captain Marvel (which was basically a $150+ million SyFy channel movie) and Avengers: Endgame back-to-back. Captain Marvel retroactively made Guardians of The Galaxy worse, because I thought Ronan was a well-intentioned extremist, but nah. He, and the rest of the Kree, are trying to exterminate all the Skrulls for no reason. I know that the movie is supposed to be a thinly veiled political allegory, but what the fuck?

Anyway, it would have been cool to have seen Captain Marvel fight Ronan with the Power Stone, although I understand why it couldn't happen from a plot perspective.

[Neo.]

Don't forget Thanos was completely armored and had a massive weapon. In infinity war, he removed all that once he got the power stone. His armor and weapon was also probably made by the same dude that made the mjolnir and stormbreaker, which is why he could handle those weapons better than he did in infinity war, where he was caught off guard when Thor threw the stormbreaker at him.

[Neo.]

Major bummer was dropping my bag of Sugar Babies I;d smuggled in, Mason....Ike & Mike.

do you think that makes you cool or something?

[Trainwreck2100]

Major bummer was dropping my bag of Sugar Babies I;d smuggled in, Mason....Ike & Mike.

Too.........Fucking..................Easy

[Trainwreck2100]

Yeah they never explained what happened to 9 years ago still alive Gamora. I'm only guessing they got her back to her timeline

She left to go find herself in guardians of the galaxy 3, or she got dusted by accident. Our Gamora is gone because they established that sould stone dead is dead as fuckDepends on her contract.

[Spurtacular]

Why people worried about plot? Aren't these superhero movies notorious for being light on plot?

[Avant]

Too.........Fucking..................Easy

My God what an idiot. Poor little retard.

[Avant]

Why people worried about plot? Aren't these superhero movies notorious for being light on plot?

I'm with you, fuck that. These movies are shock and awe, all about the visual effects, the action.

[buenavides1]

The money I have paid to see this film on the big screen is worth it. :flag:

[cd021]

Vibranium is an Earth metal. There are surely other metals out there in the universe

I thought Vibranium came from a metor that crashed down?

[Blake]

I thought Vibranium came from a metor that crashed down?

The point is that there are probably stronger metals in the universe than vibranium

[spurraider21]

Yeah vibranium is the strongest on earth. Nothing on earth can break it. Tho surprising that mjolnir couldn’t break it

[spurraider21]

I still don’t get why they can’t revive people who didn’t die via snap. If you have all 6 stones shouldn’t you be able to do whatever you want?

[TDMVPDPOY]

how come vision wasnt in this in regards to his stone?

then u have his cuck partner, shes the most powerful mutant on earth... they gave her too much screen t ime when her character was a wanker in all the marvel movies since introduction...

as captain rogers, too much bullshit regarding this character, he did more with shield and hammer then thor did with whatever weapon at his disposal in fight against thanos....

the time travel bs.... what happen to loki when he disappeared with the tesseract? he never appeared again....wouldnt they have affected his time line events

[Blake]

I still don’t get why they can’t revive people who didn’t die via snap. If you have all 6 stones shouldn’t you be able to do whatever you want?

If nothing else, if they time traveled past Gomorra to the future, Hulk/Tony could do the same with anyone else.

[Trainwreck2100]

If nothing else, if they time traveled past Gomorra to the future, Hulk/Tony could do the same with anyone else.

If they ripped Black Widow from the past, they'd be creating another timeline where that black widow was gone. And like Gammora she wouldn't be the same one anyway

[spurraider21]

If nothing else, if they time traveled past Gomorra to the future, Hulk/Tony could do the same with anyone else.
Eh. That would rip them out of their own continuity and all the good guys in that timeline would be heartbroken. Gamora didn’t have anybody so no harm no foul.

[Blake]

Eh. That would rip them out of their own continuity and all the good guys in that timeline would be heartbroken. Gamora didn’t have anybody so no harm no foul.

Bring back vision and Wanda is the opposite of heartbroken.

[Blake]

the time travel bs.... what happen to loki when he disappeared with the tesseract? he never appeared again....wouldnt they have affected his time line events

Yeah I wanted to know where Loki went too

[redzero]

It's funny how Thanos and his army were brought back from 2014 and snapped into non-existence, but bringing back a handful of heroes would fuck with the timelines too much. Why? Because the writers said so.

[Trainwreck2100]

It's funny how Thanos and his army were brought back from 2014 and snapped into non-existence, but bringing back a handful of heroes would fuck with the timelines too much. Why? Because the writers said so.

The timeline that army left with is kinda fucked, the guardians won't form so Ego can kill everyone like he wanted

[redzero]

The timeline that army left with is kinda fucked, the guardians won't form so Ego can kill everyone like he wanted

:lol I didn't even think of that. If Ego gets his hands on Star-Lord, he is going to kill everybody in the universe in that timeline.

There's also the timeline where Thor stole Mjolnir from himself, which will be a problem unless Cap returned it at the end. And there's the timeline where they let Loki steal the Tesseract, so how is that supposed to work? Is Cap going to return the scepter that has the Mind Stone and return the Time Stone to The Ancient One, and then stop Loki from stealing the Tesseract? If he can do all that, why the hell did they even need the other Avengers to tag along the first place?

[spurraider21]

Bring back vision and Wanda is the opposite of heartbroken.
lets say you go get 2014 vision and bring him to present.

what happens to 2014 wanda? she just lives in a reality where vision is gone

[redzero]

lets say you go get 2014 vision and bring him to present.

what happens to 2014 wanda? she just lives in a reality where vision is gone

Or bring back 2018 Vision right before Thanos kills him. Vision lives and Thanos doesn't get his Mind Stone in that timeline. Win-win.

[spurraider21]

Or bring back 2018 Vision right before Thanos kills him. Vision lives and Thanos doesn't get his Mind Stone in that timeline. Win-win.
even then, the wanda from THAT time then goes and lives without vision because you've dragged him into our timeline. any scenario where you're bringing a past version of a character has that issue. unless your content with fucking over alternate realities.

im just puzzled why they cant straight up resurrect people.... they had no problem undoing all snap related deaths but for some reason even with the infinity stones cant revive other deaths?

[redzero]

even then, the wanda from THAT time then goes and lives without vision because you've dragged him into our timeline.

...so? Go to Wakanda in 2018, tell Wanda that Vision will die if he stays there, and bring Vision to the present. Wanda will get upset? Who cares? If Vision stays, he will be dead soon. Either way, Wanda is not going to see him again. I'd rather him disappear than let Thanos get the Mind Stone and kill trillions.

There's no logical reason not to just pluck Vision from the past, just like there is no logical reason not to take Quicksilver, Gamora, Loki, Iron Man, and Black Widow from the past, too. There is only one timeline where trillions of deaths aren't reversed, so all the other ones are don't matter anyway.

[djohn2oo8]

As far as reviving everyone else who didn’t die in the snap, just remember Tony said the past always fights back or something to that effect.

[cd021]

The time travel thing definitely has some weird issues with it i.e. how does old cap have an intact shield?

Also if our cap went back to the past how did he return the soul stone? Red Skull doesn't still have beef with him?

Also Peggy was married and may have had kids in the main time line, so Cap goes back before that and wifeys her up and start a new time line?

[cd021]

Also there is apparently a Namor the Submariner reference

Okoye mentions that there was an underwater earthquake and that they (the Wakondan's) handle it by not handling it. Suggesting that it's either happened before and/or they know why/who is causing it.

Namor has been rumored to be the villian in Black Panther 2, which would make sense because the Submariner can't have a solo film because his film rights are similar to the Hulk.

[Pelicans78]

lets say you go get 2014 vision and bring him to present.

what happens to 2014 wanda? she just lives in a reality where vision is gone

There wasn’t a vision until 2015.

[Blake]

lets say you go get 2014 vision and bring him to present.

what happens to 2014 wanda? she just lives in a reality where vision is gone

Well 2019 Wanda has him though.

Either way there will be a sad lonely Wanda

[LaMarcus Bryant]

Yeah I wanted to know where Loki went too

Thought it was clear they did that on purpose so he's back and no longer dead.

[LaMarcus Bryant]

I agree with all the above criticism, time travel opens up so many cans of worms. But it still worked.
Hemsworth and Brolin fucking killed it in this movie. Such great acting.

[cd021]

Anyone else confused by Cap Marvel's role? Either they over hyped her or did that as a misdirection cause she really didn't do much.

She did save Stark, put Thanos in a head lock, get a horrible haircut, and blow up Thanos' ship. But Scarlett Witch looked like she could've possibly beaten Thanos given more time. Wanda is the far more interesting character, tbh.

[Blake]

Thought it was clear they did that on purpose so he's back and no longer dead.

Yeah I just want to know where he went

[spurraider21]

There wasn’t a vision until 2015.
:lol thats the takeaway?

[leemajors]

Vibranium is an Earth metal. There are surely other metals out there in the universe

Nah, it was in a meteorite in Wakanda.

[Trainwreck2100]

Yeah I just want to know where he went

Straight to Disney+

[Blake]

Nah, it was in a meteorite in Wakanda.

Sure. I'm thinking there are plenty of metals in meteors we have no idea about out there

[spurraider21]

i dont think they ever established vibranium as indestructable. may be the strongest material known to man, if even that. in The First Avenger, howard stark just said its stronger than steel, a third of the weight, and vibration absorbent.

but then it makes you wonder if mjolnir should have smashed it as well

[spurraider21]

Well 2019 Wanda has him though.

Either way there will be a sad lonely Wanda
thats still going to be uncomfortable:

2019 Wanda: I'm here to take vision, he dies in this timeline
Past Wanda: NO. i'll fight for him and protect him. give me that chance.
2019 Wanda: no. trust me, he dies
Past Wanda: now that we know, we can take extra measure to prevent that from happening. \\

etc etc

can you imagine somebody from the future telling captain america "you guys fail, so i'm going to take your shit"... you think cap would just shrug and say "oh ok we're gonna lose anyway, no biggie then"

unless you abandon the philosophy of giving a shit about the other timelines (in which case no need returning the stones). also, if you dont return the stones, you actually save all those timelines from the snap happening. whatever, there's going to be all kinds of goofiness when time travel enters the equation, sorta just have to let it go i guess

[Blake]

Where does adamantium rank on the indestructible scale

[Blake]

thats still going to be uncomfortable:

2019 Wanda: I'm here to take vision, he dies in this timeline
Past Wanda: NO. i'll fight for him and protect him. give me that chance.
2019 Wanda: no. trust me, he dies
Past Wanda: now that we know, we can take extra measure to prevent that from happening. \\

etc etc

can you imagine somebody from the future telling captain america "you guys fail, so i'm going to take your shit"... you think cap would just shrug and say "oh ok we're gonna lose anyway, no biggie then"

unless you abandon the philosophy of giving a shit about the other timelines (in which case no need returning the stones). also, if you dont return the stones, you actually save all those timelines from the snap happening. whatever, there's going to be all kinds of goofiness when time travel enters the equation, sorta just have to let it go i guess

:lol

Actually since pre-gauntlet Thanos dieded, wouldn't Vision still have the stone

[spurraider21]

:lol

Actually since pre-gauntlet Thanos dieded, wouldn't Vision still have the stone
well that was just one iteration of pre-gauntlet thanos... only necessarily affected the timeline where they grabbed the power stone. i dont think that they all went back to exactly the same time. did quill discover the power stone at the same time as invasion of NY?

[Darth_Pelican]

Professor Hulk kind of sucked. We didn't get a single Hulk rage fight scene where he goes HAM.

[LaMarcus Bryant]

I thought Thor was fucking hilarious but it also sucked to see him reduced to a total joke, with his belly all sticking out in his battle armor, smh

[spurraider21]

Professor Hulk kind of sucked. We didn't get a single Hulk rage fight scene where he goes HAM.
yeah thought he'd get some revenge against thanos for the fight at the begging of infinity war. though after using the gauntlet he was out of commission... so that wasn't really his lack of rage. they decided to focus on the main 3 guys, which i have no problem with. hulk is one of the "originals" but only has 1 solo movie, so i can see them not giving him the same role


I thought Thor was fucking hilarious but it also sucked to see him reduced to a total joke, with his belly all sticking out in his battle armor, smh
yeah, but after fit thor + stormbreaker was even able to overpower thanos with the gauntlet, they had to nerf him imo.

[Darth_Pelican]

Final MCU Rankings:

1. Iron Man
2. Guardians Of The Galaxy
3. Avengers: Infinity War
4. Captain America: The Winter Soldier
5. Black Panther
6. Avengers: Endgame
7. Captain America: Civil War
8. Thor: Ragnarok
9. Captain America: The First Avenger
10. Avengers
11. Thor
12. Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol. 2
13. Doctor Strange
14. Iron Man 2
15. Avengers: Age Of Ultron
16. The Incredible Hulk
17. Ant-Man
18. Captain Marvel
19. Ant-Man and the Wasp
20. Spiderman
21. Iron Man 3
22. Thor: The Dark World

[Darth_Pelican]

yeah thought he'd get some revenge against thanos for the fight at the begging of infinity war. though after using the gauntlet he was out of commission... so that wasn't really his lack of rage. they decided to focus on the main 3 guys, which i have no problem with. hulk is one of the "originals" but only has 1 solo movie, so i can see them not giving him the same role


yeah, but after fit thor + stormbreaker was even able to overpower thanos with the gauntlet, they had to nerf him imo.

He should have at least raged out harder than he did when he found out that BW died.

[cd021]

Final MCU Rankings:

1. Iron Man
2. Guardians Of The Galaxy
3. Avengers: Infinity War
4. Captain America: The Winter Soldier
5. Black Panther
6. Avengers: Endgame
7. Captain America: Civil War
8. Thor: Ragnarok
9. Captain America: The First Avenger
10. Avengers
11. Thor
12. Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol. 2
13. Doctor Strange
14. Iron Man 2
15. Avengers: Age Of Ultron
16. The Incredible Hulk
17. Ant-Man
18. Captain Marvel
19. Ant-Man and the Wasp
20. Spiderman
21. Iron Man 3
22. Thor: The Dark World

Man, I don't see any way CA: TWS isn't the greatest tbh. Spiderman and Cap Marvel are weirdly low, Thor is pretty bad, bottom five tbh.

Top 10

1. The Winter Soldier
2. Endgame
3. Civil War
4. Black Panther
5. Ragnarok
6. Avengers
7. GOTG
8. Infinity Wars
9. Iron Man
10. Spiderman

Bottom 5

18. Ultron
19. Iron Man 2
20.Thor
21. Hulk
22. Dark World

[cd021]

The ending definitely doesn't make sense the more I've read up on what happened.

Cap goes back to the 40's and stays; ages naturally, and appears at Starks funeral with an intact shield that he stole from the Cap from the timeline he went back to. He let horrible things happen, including the snap and inevitably and indirectly killing alt timeline Cap. Also wiped Peggy's kids out of existence. Old cap was just waiting for all those to come to the funeral to give Falcon the shield.

Prior to that; he had to put one stone back inside of Natalie Portman, return Thor's hammer, and give a stone back to Red Skull, among the other stones.

[lefty]

Lol that political only women teamup during the battle :lol

[lefty]

Professor Hulk kind of sucked. We didn't get a single Hulk rage fight scene where he goes HAM.because that’s how Professor Hulk is


I thought Thor was fucking hilarious but it also sucked to see him reduced to a total joke, with his belly all sticking out in his battle armor, smh

He lost his family, friends, half of Asgard and then failed to kill Thanos.
He created an emotional shield
We saw him breaking down a few times

[lefty]

:lol

Actually since pre-gauntlet Thanos dieded, wouldn't Vision still have the stone

Because he didn’t die in his timeline

[lefty]

The real question is : since it’s impossible to bring Widow back with the stone, can’t they bring her through time travel?

They did it with Gamora

[Texas_Ranger]

The real question is : since it’s impossible to bring Widow back with the stone, can’t they bring her through time travel?

They did it with Gamora

basically they can bring everyone back. MCU has pretty much become Dragon Ball.

[spurraider21]

The ending definitely doesn't make sense the more I've read up on what happened.

Cap goes back to the 40's and stays; ages naturally, and appears at Starks funeral with an intact shield that he stole from the Cap from the timeline he went back to. He let horrible things happen, including the snap and inevitably and indirectly killing alt timeline Cap. Also wiped Peggy's kids out of existence. Old cap was just waiting for all those to come to the funeral to give Falcon the shield.
you dont know that, though. for all we know, in that timeline, he took a bunch of steps to prevent those atrocities. we dont know how it played out when he got there. all we know is that at some point he got the shield.


Prior to that; he had to put one stone back inside of Natalie Portman, return Thor's hammer, and give a stone back to Red Skull, among the other stones.
once on vormir, the red skull isnt the same guy though, tbh. he's clearly different. returning thor's hammer wouldnt be too big a deal. just drop it off somewhere on asgard. thor summons it. maybe it takes an extra second or two... unlikely to have an impact. as for injecting the stone into jane foster... yeah that ones confusing :lol

[lefty]

The ending definitely doesn't make sense the more I've read up on what happened.

Cap goes back toAlso wiped Peggy's kids out of existence. Old cap was just waiting for all those to come to the funeral to give Falcon the shield.

.

Lol I was thinking about that

Dick move by Steve tbh, while he was frozen she met another man and had kids with him.

Steve just undid all that :lol

Also : if Steve goes back to the 40s and decides to live a normal life then he wouldn’t fight alongside the Avengers - he was their leader so kinda important- and wouldn’t have stopped Hydra from taking over.

It also means he wouldn’t have met Sam which means the latter shouldn’t be in a position to get the shield from old Cap

Fuck I hate time travel ex machinas

[spurraider21]

The real question is : since it’s impossible to bring Widow back with the stone, can’t they bring her through time travel?

They did it with Gamora
i addressed this earlier though... if they bring black widow back through time travel (say they go back to 2017 and bring her to the present), then as far as the people in THAT timeline are concerned, black widow has vanished and is presumed dead.

of course, they could just stop giving a shit about alternate timelines and not have to worry about that stuff.

[spurraider21]

basically they can bring everyone back. MCU has pretty much become Dragon Ball.
you say that but they made it clear that (bullshit reasoning and all) they COULDNT bring back just anybody. they couldnt bring back black widow. they didnt think they could bring back tony.

[lefty]

you say that but they made it clear that (bullshit reasoning and all) they COULDNT bring back just anybody. they couldnt bring back black widow. they didnt think they could bring back tony.

They couldn’t bring back Widow with the stones, since the owning of the soul stone is linked to her sacrifice

[lefty]

Btw it was cool to see Jarvis from the TV series Agent Carter

[leemajors]

basically they can bring everyone back. MCU has pretty much become Dragon Ball.

Heroes were dying and coming back in Marvel shit decades before Dragon Ball was thought of.

[Trainwreck2100]

because that’s how Professor Hulk is



He lost his family, friends, half of Asgard and then failed to kill Thanos.
He created an emotional shield
We saw him breaking down a few times
He actually lost 75% Asgardians half to thanos's first attack, half of the survivors to the snap

The real question is : since it’s impossible to bring Widow back with the stone, can’t they bring her through time travel?

They did it with Gamora
The black widow they bring back won't be the same black widow age will lack the experiences that made her her character. Like how Gamora doesn't give a shit about Quill anymore

[lefty]

He actually lost 75% Asgardians half to thanos's first attack, half of the survivors to the snap

The black widow they bring back won't be the same black widow age will lack the experiences that made her her character. Like how Gamora doesn't give a shit about Quill anymore
They wouldn’t have to go too far back , they can bring a recent version of her

[spurraider21]

anyway... movie with time travel has a lot of difficult questions

that shouldn't be the main takeaway :lol... can we talk about

- cap weilding mjonlir (thor saying "i knew it")
- cap and thor trading weapons
- cap finally saying "avengers assemble"
- SO MANY STAIRS
- ant man's peanut butter sandwich
- ant man's taco
- stark's build-a-bear line
- stark's lebowsky line
- asgardians calling rocket a rabbit
- korg playing fortnite
- thor trash talking
- quill dancing/singing
- cap fighting cap
- cap elevator scene
- spiderman's instant kill mode
- thanos bopping captain marvel with the power stone
- professor hulk, generally
- giant man
- thor stealing mjonlir from himself
- scarlet witch beating the shit out of thanos
- antman telling stark "flick me"
- stark and nebula playing paper football
- cap standing there by himself with mjolnir a broken shield before all of thanos' force just before everyone appears
- falcon actually doing something cool by impaling some dude with his wings
- professor hulk fake raging in the battle of new york
- "i am iron man"

missing a bunch. so much greatness imo.

[spurraider21]

They wouldn’t have to go too far back , they can bring a recent version of her
would work as long as you dont give a shit about pissing people off in that timeline by kidnapping their black widow

[DPG21920]

Hit me in the soft spots...man, got teary eyed. Not gonna lie.

[Trainwreck2100]

They wouldn’t have to go too far back , they can bring a recent version of her

then the timeline they pull her from can't get the soul stone or they'd have to sacrifice someone else, also you'd be taking a separate Avenger's black widow

[lefty]

would work as long as you dont give a shit about pissing people off in that timeline by kidnapping their black widow
True true

[lefty]

then the timeline they pull her from can't get the soul stone or they'd have to sacrifice someone else, also you'd be taking a separate Avenger's black widow

Well I’m not sure anymore lol

[lefty]

Btw it was cool to see Jarvis from the TV series Agent Carter
Lol I guess I’m the only one here who watched that show

[cd021]

you dont know that, though. for all we know, in that timeline, he took a bunch of steps to prevent those atrocities. we dont know how it played out when he got there. all we know is that at some point he got the shield.


No, if he intervened then the avengers wouldn't form or be around to protect the earth. It seems clear that he made Peggy wifey and lived low-key with her up to and including when that timelines Cap comes out of the ice.

Where they messed up was having old Cap. Cap leaving and staying in the 40s means that there is no cap in the main timeline period. Old Cap would have been in another timeline completely, especially if he intervened like you said.

Also he essentially did what it took a like 8 Avengers to do in order to get the stones back, in order not to change the timeline but then goes back further with the intention of changing the timeline

The correct ending should have probably been that TWS tells Falcon that cap left for good and that he wants him to pick up the mantle of CA and that T'Challa is working on fixing or making a new shield.

[cd021]

Hit me in the soft spots...man, got teary eyed. Not gonna lie.
Man, those allergies. I came down with a case of them at the end of Logan. Damnist thing :lol

Best part for me was that Cap was willing to go at Thanos and his people's with a broken shield and then we hear "On your left, Cap."

[Trainwreck2100]

No, if he intervened then the avengers wouldn't form or be around to protect the earth. It seems clear that he made Peggy wifey and lived low-key with her up to and including when that timelines Cap comes out of the ice.

Where they messed up was having old Cap. Cap leaving and staying in the 40s means that there is no cap in the main timeline period. Old Cap would have been in another timeline completely, especially if he intervened like you said.

The correct ending should have probably been that TWS tells Falcon that cap left for good and that he wants him to pick up the mantle of CA and that T'Challa is working on fixing or making a new shield.

If he lived "low-key" that means he let bucky stay being a hydra agent and let hydra infiltrate SHIELD that doesn't fit his character at all

[cd021]

If he lived "low-key" that means he let bucky stay being a hydra agent and let hydra infiltrate SHIELD that doesn't fit his character at all

Also means that he let Thanos do the snap and kill 4 billion people in order to get with Peggy. That is hard to believe in regards to his character, especially since his logic in Civil War was that he couldn't agree to some thing that could keep him or the Avengers from intervening when needed.

He'd be able to intervene but choose not to plus he almost certainly stole the shield from another Steve Rodgers in order to give it to Falcon.

[Trainwreck2100]

I don't know if anyone else noticed, but the movie was written so that Evans could come back an play steve rogers again if he wanted to. I don't mean alternative rogers i mean old man Steve Rogers.

[TDMVPDPOY]

thanos clicks his fingers, the stones disappear as he had said at the start of end game

hulk click his fingers, yet the stones didnt disappear (whys that?)

ironman click his fingers, yet the stones didnt disappear like above... why the difference?

i assume after hulk clicks, they went back in time again?
then after ironman, they went back in time again to retrieve and restore correct timeline where those stones belong?

[Blake]

No, if he intervened then the avengers wouldn't form or be around to protect the earth. It seems clear that he made Peggy wifey and lived low-key with her up to and including when that timelines Cap comes out of the ice.

Where they messed up was having old Cap. Cap leaving and staying in the 40s means that there is no cap in the main timeline period. Old Cap would have been in another timeline completely, especially if he intervened like you said.

Also he essentially did what it took a like 8 Avengers to do in order to get the stones back, in order not to change the timeline but then goes back further with the intention of changing the timeline

The correct ending should have probably been that TWS tells Falcon that cap left for good and that he wants him to pick up the mantle of CA and that T'Challa is working on fixing or making a new shield.

That's the "Back to the future" logic. They told you it's b.s. lol

[Trainwreck2100]

thanos clicks his fingers, the stones disappear as he had said at the start of end game

hulk click his fingers, yet the stones didnt disappear (whys that?)

ironman click his fingers, yet the stones didnt disappear like above... why the difference?

i assume after hulk clicks, they went back in time again?
then after ironman, they went back in time again to retrieve and restore correct timeline where those stones belong?
The stone didn't disappear from Thanos's first snap he did a second snap on his farm planet and the second time his snap was to make the stones disappear so he wouldn't be tempted to use them again

[cd021]

I don't know if anyone else noticed, but the movie was written so that Evans could come back an play steve rogers again if he wanted to. I don't mean alternative rogers i mean old man Steve Rogers.

He is reportedly going to appear in the Falcon and Winter Soldier Disney + series

[Darth_Pelican]

Man, I don't see any way CA: TWS isn't the greatest tbh. Spiderman and Cap Marvel are weirdly low, Thor is pretty bad, bottom five tbh.

Top 10

1. The Winter Soldier
2. Endgame
3. Civil War
4. Black Panther
5. Ragnarok
6. Avengers
7. GOTG
8. Infinity Wars
9. Iron Man
10. Spiderman

Bottom 5

18. Ultron
19. Iron Man 2
20.Thor
21. Hulk
22. Dark World

Spiderman movies always seem a little too slapstick and lighthearted for my liking. I liked Captain Marvel's setting but the special effects and fight scenes were some of the lowest quality in MCU. Fury and Coulson were more entertaining than Cap Marvel. And how is Iron Man 3 not in your bottom 5 lol. That movie was vomit. And no love at all for Hulk?

[Blake]

Winter Soldier was easily my #1.

Black Panther middle of the pack.

Worst by far imo was Captain Marvel.

[lefty]

In a recent interview, the Russos clarified the whole time travel/reality thing :

https://www.reddit.com/r/marvelstudios/comments/bj0it4/joe_russos_qa_about_the_plot_of_avengers_endgame/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app

[redzero]

Infinity War is indisputably the best. The Guardians of the Galaxy movies, Winter Soldier, and Civil War are next. Endgame is top 5, I guess. The first Cap movie was straight up bad. Hulk and Captain Marvel were meh. Thor: The Dark World does take the bottom spot. It's so forgettable that I can remember next to nothing about it. There was a Chris Evans cameo, teleporting and Thor's mom dies (spoilers).

[leemajors]

The first half was a little tedious, but I liked the first Captain America movie. I also like the Norton Hulk movie but Hulk and Cap are two of my favorite characters.

[spurraider21]

In a recent interview, the Russos clarified the whole time travel/reality thing :

https://www.reddit.com/r/marvelstudios/comments/bj0it4/joe_russos_qa_about_the_plot_of_avengers_endgame/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app
their explanation for why they couldnt bring back stark the same way thanos brought back vision doesnt make sense at all tbh :lol...

but glad they addressed that Cap had to jump back to this timeline at the end... its not like old cap just sat on the bench and waited for this moment. he jumped back through time to be at the bench

[lefty]

CA : The Winter Soldier and Avengers :Infinity War are both #1 in my book.

It’s a toss up for me

[TheSpurglar]

The ending definitely doesn't make sense the more I've read up on what happened.


Cap goes back to the 40's and stays; ages naturally, and appears at Starks funeral with an intact shield that he stole from the Cap from the timeline he went back to. He let horrible things happen, including the snap and inevitably and indirectly killing alt timeline Cap. Also wiped Peggy's kids out of existence. Old cap was just waiting for all those to come to the funeral to give Falcon the shield.


Prior to that; he had to put one stone back inside of Natalie Portman, return Thor's hammer, and give a stone back to Red Skull, among the other stones.

The prime timeline can't be changed. Everything that happened, happened. If anything is changed in the past, it simply makes a new timeline.

Cap left the prime timeline, returned the stones and Thor's hammer to the points in the past from which they were initially taken at the exact moment (or right after) they were taken, so that what the Avengers did wouldn't have any significant impact (causing new timelines where things might go bad for the people).

Then Cap decided to stay in the past with Peggy, and this did indeed cause a new timeline to be created where he and Peggy were together (so in THAT timeline, Peggy didn't get married, kids weren't born, etc). Now, he would probably have to lay low, since there'd likely be another(that timeline's) Captain America thawed out in that timeline's future at some point, the creation of that timeline's Avengers, maybe even that timeline's "snap" etc., but ultimately all he'd have to do it wait until some point beyond the date of Endgame, travel to the past again (arriving in the prime timeline), sit on a bench, and... there you go. He's back and hands Sam his shield, which obviously wasn't ever destroyed in the alternate timeline he created.

[TheSpurglar]

The real question is : since it’s impossible to bring Widow back with the stone, can’t they bring her through time travel?

They did it with Gamora

They didn't do it. Thanos did it. They(Avengers) were actively trying NOT to do things like that.

But the answer is, yes, they could definitely swipe a Nat from the past and bring her to the prime timeline. It'd cause an alternate timeline to be created though.

[spurraider21]

The prime timeline can't be changed. Everything that happened, happened. If anything is changed in the past, it simply makes a new timeline.

Cap left the prime timeline, returned the stones and Thor's hammer to the points in the past from which they were initially taken at the exact moment (or right after) they were taken, so that what the Avengers did wouldn't have any significant impact (causing new timelines where things might go bad for the people).

Then Cap decided to stay in the past with Peggy, and this did indeed cause a new timeline to be created where he and Peggy were together (so in THAT timeline, Peggy didn't get married, kids weren't born, etc). Now, he would probably have to lay low, since there'd likely be another(that timeline's) Captain America thawed out in that timeline's future at some point, the creation of that timeline's Avengers, maybe even that timeline's "snap" etc., but ultimately all he'd have to do it wait until some point beyond the date of Endgame, travel to the past again (arriving in the prime timeline), sit on a bench, and... there you go. He's back and hands Sam his shield, which obviously wasn't ever destroyed in the alternate timeline he created.
its not entirely clear how Cap approached that stuff. maybe he stopped shield/hydra ahead of time. maybe he protected the tesseract (which was on earth at the time) and prevented many of the events from happening in the first place. he also has knowledge of where all the stones are, so maybe he prevented the infinity saga altogether in that timeline. we dont know. but based on the fact that he grew old and was happy, we can assume it worked out


They didn't do it. Thanos did it. They(Avengers) were actively trying NOT to do things like that.
eh, not really. banner specifically said that he tried to bring Natasha back too. the good guys used two different snaps in the movie... i dont see why they'd be so against using a single stone like the time stone. Dr. Strange used the time stone to defeat dormammu. after the battle, why not let him use the stone thanos style to bring back stark before returning the stones?

ultimately we just have the accept that they're retiring RDJ/Tony Stark... they did an ok enough job. the damage caused to the user by the stones is probably irreparable, which is why thanos was still half dead when they first encountered him in endgame. he wasnt able to heal himself


But the answer is, yes, they could definitely swipe a Nat from the past and bring her to the prime timeline. It'd cause an alternate timeline to be created though.
yeah an alternate timeline where from that perspective, Nat has gone missing and is presumed dead. based on the events of the film though, and their commitment to return the stones, they clearly care about not fucking over alternate timelines.

[TheSpurglar]

If he lived "low-key" that means he let bucky stay being a hydra agent and let hydra infiltrate SHIELD that doesn't fit his character at all


Also means that he let Thanos do the snap and kill 4 billion people in order to get with Peggy. That is hard to believe in regards to his character, especially since his logic in Civil War was that he couldn't agree to some thing that could keep him or the Avengers from intervening when needed.

He'd be able to intervene but choose not to plus he almost certainly stole the shield from another Steve Rodgers in order to give it to Falcon.

All that's really clear is that he decided to stay with Peggy in the past, creating an alternate timeline. Anything could have happened from the point he made that decision to when he returned to the prime timeline as an old man. He could have taken on an entirely new superheroic identity in that timeline and helped prevent all the things you guys are talking about up above. There was no way for him to change the prime timeline, but he could make the world a better place in an alternate timeline, along with scratching his Peggy itch.

Then at some point, when he's an old man, after that timeline's Cap has died, he was given the shield. Or maybe the Stark or Panther of that timeline made a new one. Pretty much anything could have happened.

[lefty]

Guys,


We’ve lost sight of what is really important here :





No





More





Black Widow








Woohoooooooo

[spurraider21]

Guys,


We’ve lost sight of what is really important here :





No





More





Black Widow








Woohoooooooo
the only eye candly left is wanda's cleavage which is always emphasized

[gambit1990]

Guys,


We’ve lost sight of what is really important here :





No





More





Black Widow








Woohoooooooo
:tu

she’s coming back somehow though, right? isn’t she getting her own movie?

[Trainwreck2100]

the only eye candly left is wanda's cleavage which is always emphasized

Only eye candy I need is ant man punching a leviathan

[gambit1990]

idc about comic book movies. this was better than i thought it would be.

when thanos had the gauntlet he should’ve just rewound time to when no one was near enough to take the gauntlet off... simple...

[rjv]

The ending definitely doesn't make sense the more I've read up on what happened.

Cap goes back to the 40's and stays; ages naturally, and appears at Starks funeral with an intact shield that he stole from the Cap from the timeline he went back to. He let horrible things happen, including the snap and inevitably and indirectly killing alt timeline Cap. Also wiped Peggy's kids out of existence. Old cap was just waiting for all those to come to the funeral to give Falcon the shield.


so, the Avengers movie uses the many worlds approach to avoid the grandfather paradox. but the way that the "many worlds approach" is that there should be another version of you in a parallel universe that is completely unaware of the other you. and this seems to be the case with rogers when he fights himself in the new york battle scene but not at all the case when rogers goes back to live the life he would have had otherwise. so, there are several problems here:


1) do both versions of rogers somehow have a seperate consciousness?


2) was carter supposed to have had another husband that steve wipes away or is he the somehow very clandestine husband?


2) clearly, rogers retains his memories so that entails that he just sat by and let bucky get tortured by hydra- so much for "i'm with you to the end of the line".

[spurraider21]

2) clearly, rogers retains his memories so that entails that he just sat by and let bucky get tortured by hydra- so much for "i'm with you to the end of the line".
how do you know he didnt alter that timeline and change all sorts of things? he already altered it by marrying peggy. who's to say he didnt stop hydra early, didnt warn people about tesseract/loki/thanos/ultron, etc?

[lefty]

:tu

she’s coming back somehow though, right? isn’t she getting her own movie?
She is

It's going to be a pre-IW movie given what's happened in EndGame

We didn't see Nat's funeral, It would be cool if they opened the BW movie with that

[lefty]

Q: Peggy Carter was probably already married and in her mid 40s in 1970, in that case what year was it that Captain America went back to dance with her?
A: We can't answer it for now, this is a story that happened in an alternate reality. Maybe it will be revealed in the future.


Q: Did Captain America's action at the end affect the timeline? Does that mean there was a time where two CA existed in a same universe?
A: To me, CA's action in the end wasn't the fact he wanted to change anything, it's more like me has made a choice. He chose to go back to past and lived with the one he loved for the rest of his life. The time travel in this movie created an alternate reality. He lived a completely different life in that world. We don't know how exactly his life turned out, but I'd like to believe he still helped many others when they were needed in that world. Yes, there were two CA in that reality, it's just like what Hulk said, what happened in the past has already happened. If you go back to past, you simply created a new reality. The characters in this movie created new timeline when they went back to the past, but it had no effect to the prime universe. What happened in the past 22 movies was still canon.

[redzero]

Q: Peggy Carter was probably already married and in her mid 40s in 1970, in that case what year was it that Captain America went back to dance with her?
A: We can't answer it for now, this is a story that happened in an alternate reality. Maybe it will be revealed in the future.


Q: Did Captain America's action at the end affect the timeline? Does that mean there was a time where two CA existed in a same universe?
A: To me, CA's action in the end wasn't the fact he wanted to change anything, it's more like me has made a choice. He chose to go back to past and lived with the one he loved for the rest of his life. The time travel in this movie created an alternate reality. He lived a completely different life in that world. We don't know how exactly his life turned out, but I'd like to believe he still helped many others when they were needed in that world. Yes, there were two CA in that reality, it's just like what Hulk said, what happened in the past has already happened. If you go back to past, you simply created a new reality. The characters in this movie created new timeline when they went back to the past, but it had no effect to the prime universe. What happened in the past 22 movies was still canon.

That just supports my belief that all the dead heroes should have been brought back even more.

[spurraider21]

That just supports my belief that all the dead heroes should have been brought back even more.
it all makes sense as long as you dont care about pissing off others in the alternate timelines.

i mean they had to get rid of characters, cant have everyone get old and retire like cap

[Trainwreck2100]

That just supports my belief that all the dead heroes should have been brought back even more.

How could they do that without creating another timeline where the dead heroes are missing? It worked for 2014 Gamora because that timeline has no GotG now so literally noone from 2014 is missing her. And she wasn't even the same Gamora that got killed in IW

[rjv]

how do you know he didnt alter that timeline and change all sorts of things? he already altered it by marrying peggy. who's to say he didnt stop hydra early, didnt warn people about tesseract/loki/thanos/ultron, etc?

well, he clearly didn't alter bucky's timeline as bucky goes on to become the winter soldier. he also didn't stop ultron or anything else because he's clearly in the same timeline as the captain america rogers (again, but they have seperate consciousness?). if he wasn't there was no way he could have met up with sam and bucky at the end because he did not get there through the portal. but he may have altered peggy's (and therefore countless others) timeline. in fact, the only way he didn't is if he is the one she marries but then that assumes she stayed single up until they meet again, he is kept a secret and she also has to agree to not get involved in all of the events that rogers has knowledge of. all so that they can fulfill roger's wish to get to dance with a woman she had a crush on. but yes, the grandfather paradox that is supposedly removed really isn't in the case of rogers. and then there's the whole gamora and loki scenarios that created their own set of problems.

[Trainwreck2100]

well, he clearly didn't alter bucky's timeline as bucky goes on to become the winter soldier. but he may have altered peggy's (and therefore countless others) timeline. in fact, the only way he didn't is if he is the one she marries but then that assumes she stayed single up until they meet again, he is kept a secret and she also has to agree to not get involved in all of the events that rogers has knowledge of. all so that they can fulfill roger's wish to get to dance with a woman she had a crush on. but yes, the grandfather paradox that is supposedly removed really isn't in the case of rogers. and then there's the whole gamora and loki scenarios that created their own set of problems.

That's not how it works, the timeline he settled down in was separate from the prime timeline. We don't know what he did in his marriage timeline, because it was completely disconnected

[rjv]

That's not how it works, the timeline he settled down in was separate from the prime timeline. We don't know what he did in his marriage timeline, because it was completely disconnected


then how did he arrive in the same timeline at the end of the film?

[Trainwreck2100]

then how did he arrive in the same timeline at the end of the film?

the time gps on his wrist, the same way they all got back after the initial heist

[rjv]

there are also other time problems not related to travel such as how it is that ned (parker's friend) is still in the same grade.

[Trainwreck2100]

there are also other time problems not related to travel such as how it is that ned (parker's friend) is still in the same grade.

c'mon that's easy, he got snapped too

[spurraider21]

well, he clearly didn't alter bucky's timeline as bucky goes on to become the winter soldier. he also didn't stop ultron or anything else because he's clearly in the same timeline as the captain america rogers (again, but they have seperate consciousness?).
how could you possibly know that he didnt alter bucky/ultron. we dont see what happened in that timeline after he dances with peggy. for all we know its radically different


if he wasn't there was no way he could have met up with sam and bucky at the end because he did not get there through the portal. but he may have altered peggy's (and therefore countless others) timeline. in fact, the only way he didn't is if he is the one she marries but then that assumes she stayed single up until they meet again, he is kept a secret and she also has to agree to not get involved in all of the events that rogers has knowledge of. all so that they can fulfill roger's wish to get to dance with a woman she had a crush on. but yes, the grandfather paradox that is supposedly removed really isn't in the case of rogers. and then there's the whole gamora and loki scenarios that created their own set of problems.
its pretty clear he time-jumped into that spot. russo brothers confirmed that in the Q&A too. the movie was explicitly clear that you cant change your present by changing the past. they didnt suddenly retcon that mechanic in that scene.

[rjv]

c'mon that's easy, he got snapped too then why does he seem so happy to see parker? the scene certainly suggests that ned was surprised to see that parker was still alive after all.

[spurraider21]

Q: Did Captain America's action at the end affect the timeline? Does that mean there was a time where two CA existed in a same universe?

A: To me, CA's action in the end wasn't the fact he wanted to change anything, it's more like me has made a choice. He chose to go back to past and lived with the one he loved for the rest of his life. The time travel in this movie created an alternate reality. He lived a completely different life in that world. We don't know how exactly his life turned out, but I'd like to believe he still helped many others when they were needed in that world. Yes, there were two CA in that reality, it's just like what Hulk said, what happened in the past has already happened. If you go back to past, you simply created a new reality. The characters in this movie created new timeline when they went back to the past, but it had no effect to the prime universe. What happened in the past 22 movies was still canon.

[Trainwreck2100]

then why does he seem so happy to see parker? the scene certainly suggests that ned was surprised to see that parker was still alive after all.

because waking up after a 5 year coma is probably a mindfuck. He had no way of knowing if Peter was the same or a colleged age Peter Parker.

[spurraider21]

then why does he seem so happy to see parker? the scene certainly suggests that ned was surprised to see that parker was still alive after all.
you know, if i went to bed tonight, and then when i woke up, realized its actually the year 2024, read about the fact that i, as well as much of my family/friends had actually died, and only recently came back, and it's been 5 years... i'd be happy to see my best friend too.

especially considering spiderman was part of the final battle against thanos and easily could have died during said battle

[redzero]

How could they do that without creating another timeline where the dead heroes are missing? It worked for 2014 Gamora because that timeline has no GotG now so literally noone from 2014 is missing her. And she wasn't even the same Gamora that got killed in IW

Again, get them right before they are killed. What is the downside?

[rjv]

because waking up after a 5 year coma is probably a mindfuck. He had no way of knowing if Peter was the same or a colleged age Peter Parker.

we'll certainly see more in the upcoming spider man film, which if it is set after endgame, will have to be the year 2023 or after. it will be interesting to see if there is any reference to that time frame from any of the characters of if the writers will just skip over it.

[spurraider21]

Again, get them right before they are killed. What is the downside?
feel like you keep missing the point. you are fucking over that timeline by basically kidnapping one of their heroes.

having a new stark in the prime timeline at the expense of some alternate one.

of course, you might think "fuck the other timelines, they're on their own" but the movie really showed the characters NOT taking that approach, hence returning the stones

[Trainwreck2100]

Again, get them right before they are killed. What is the downside?

If she gets pulled before she dies that that timelines hawkeye doesn't get the soul stone

[spurraider21]

we'll certainly see more in the upcoming spider man film, which if it is set after endgame, will have to be the year 2023 or after. it will be interesting to see if there is any reference to that time frame from any of the characters of if the writers will just skip over it.
think we're just gonna assume all the main characters (peter, ned, mj, flash) all got dusted, so they remain the same age.

[Blake]

feel like you keep missing the point. you are fucking over that timeline by basically kidnapping one of their heroes.

having a new stark in the prime timeline at the expense of some alternate one.

of course, you might think "fuck the other timelines, they're on their own" but the movie really showed the characters NOT taking that approach, hence returning the stones

Eh, except for Cap taking that approach.

But how did he show up as old man Cap in this time line if he started a new one...

[TheSpurglar]

Eh, except for Cap taking that approach.

But how did he show up as old man Cap in this time line if he started a new one...

Cap didn't take the approach of taking somebody away from one of the timelines he visited. He added himself to one of the timelines, lived there until he was an old man, presumably (though we don't know for sure) doing awesome Captain America-like things in that alternate timeline. Then, once he'd gotten old as hell, and the date for Endgame in the alternate timeline had past, he went back in time to the prime timeline, sat on a bench, had his talk with Sam and gave him the shield.

[spurraider21]

Eh, except for Cap taking that approach.

But how did he show up as old man Cap in this time line if he started a new one...
the russo brothers in the Q&A made it pretty clear imo that he time jumped again to wind up on that bench. but yeah they executed that poorly for dramatic effect

[rjv]

That's not how it works, the timeline he settled down in was separate from the prime timeline. We don't know what he did in his marriage timeline, because it was completely disconnected

i read the russo brother's explanation that rogers jumps back to this realm at the end. so, unlike the "time travel" that takes place in most of the film, the time travel that rogers engages in the end is quite different. in this one, he does create an alternate timeline, with a version of peggy carter but not the actual peggy carter because the real peggy carter remains in the MCU timeline, unmarried to rogers.

[redzero]

feel like you keep missing the point. you are fucking over that timeline by basically kidnapping one of their heroes.

having a new stark in the prime timeline at the expense of some alternate one.

of course, you might think "fuck the other timelines, they're on their own" but the movie really showed the characters NOT taking that approach, hence returning the stones

But they didn't care about fucking over the other timelines. Cap inserted himself in to Peggy's life, Thor stole another Thor's hammer, they let Loki steal the tesseract back, Nebula shot her 2014 self and Iron Man snapped 2014 Thanos and almost his entire army out of existence.

[spurraider21]

But they didn't care about fucking over the other timelines. Cap inserted himself in to Peggy's life,
that doesnt fuck over anybody except peggy's other husband. but we're on team cap anyway so fuck that guy


Thor stole another Thor's hammer,
cap took the hammer with him on his final time travel trip, presumably returning it to asgard along with the reality stone (still unclear how he injects that into jane, but different story)


they let Loki steal the tesseract back,
oh, they definitely fucked that up. but that's not from them not caring about fucking over other timelines. and thats likely going to be the basis of the Loki spinoff series, considering he's otherwise dead in the prime timeline


Nebula shot her 2014 self and Iron Man snapped 2014 Thanos and almost his entire army out of existence.
yeah i dont think they mind murdering thanos in every possible timeline. besides, 2014 thanos and 2014 thanos' army weren't exactly invited.

[spurraider21]

i read the russo brother's explanation that rogers jumps back to this realm at the end. so, unlike the "time travel" that takes place in most of the film, the time travel that rogers engages in the end is quite different. in this one, he does create an alternate timeline, with a version of peggy carter but not the actual peggy carter because the real peggy carter remains in the MCU timeline, unmarried to rogers.
they're all "real"

easier method is just to label the MCU timeline/universe that we are familiar with and call that one "prime"

so Prime peggy died of old age. but Prime steve went back and married alternate peggy. then at some point he decided to bounce back to Prime to give falcon the shield. he probably just adjusted his coordinates the way steve and cap jumped back further into the 70's without needing the landing pad

[spurraider21]

saw this on reddit

https://i.imgur.com/Wft7ofk.jpg

[rjv]

they're all "real"

easier method is just to label the MCU timeline/universe that we are familiar with and call that one "prime"

so Prime peggy died of old age. but Prime steve went back and married alternate peggy. then at some point he decided to bounce back to Prime to give falcon the shield. he probably just adjusted his coordinates the way steve and cap jumped back further into the 70's without needing the landing pad

yes, they're all real but just different versions, with the exception of rogers, who marries the non-prime version of carter. it's up to each audience member to decide whether or not it's really "his peggy".

[spurraider21]

so there are basically 4 timelines we're concerned with

1) prime we know quite well...

2) the post GOTG1 timeline is the one where now thanos has abandoned (and subsequently dies). so that timeline continues with no thanos, so no fear of infinity gauntlet saga.

3) the post Avengers 1 timeline is likely going to be where the Loki series takes place. loki loses battle of new york but escapes with tesseract anyway. still, he lost the scepter/mind stone. unclear how this all affects the future

4) 1940's cap timeline. we have no clue what happens by and large, but cap looks like he's happy. probably solved hydra ahead of time, warned people about infinity stones, etc

[rjv]

i also don't think the russo brothers will ever really explain away how rogers got back. it's just what it is, i guess.

[rjv]

so there are basically 4 timelines we're concerned with

1) prime we know quite well...

2) the post GOTG1 timeline is the one where now thanos has abandoned (and subsequently dies). so that timeline continues with no thanos, so no fear of infinity gauntlet saga.

3) the post Avengers 1 timeline is likely going to be where the Loki series takes place. loki loses battle of new york but escapes with tesseract anyway. still, he lost the scepter/mind stone. unclear how this all affects the future

4) 1940's cap timeline. we have no clue what happens by and large, but cap looks like he's happy. probably solved hydra ahead of time, warned people about infinity stones, etc in that timeline, all we know is that he marries another peggy. for all we know, in that timeline, starks parents don't die either. the issues of determinism here get quite grey. to the point where rogers becomes quite different from the rogers that we knew because he has to make more complicated ethical choices.

[spurraider21]

i also don't think the russo brothers will ever really explain away how rogers got back. it's just what it is, i guess.
well based on how heavy handed the movie was on this point, we can rule out the possibility that old man cap was living in the prime timeline all along and just made sure to visit the bench that day

that violates the rule they were pretty clear on

[redzero]

that doesnt fuck over anybody except peggy's other husband. but we're on team cap anyway so fuck that guy


cap took the hammer with him on his final time travel trip, presumably returning it to asgard along with the reality stone (still unclear how he injects that into jane, but different story)


oh, they definitely fucked that up. but that's not from them not caring about fucking over other timelines. and thats likely going to be the basis of the Loki spinoff series, considering he's otherwise dead in the prime timeline


yeah i dont think they mind murdering thanos in every possible timeline. besides, 2014 thanos and 2014 thanos' army weren't exactly invited.

Then I will repeat myself again: how is taking the heroes from other timelines right before they die, in anyway a bad thing? Save Gamora and Thanos doesn't get The Soul Stone. Save Vision and Thanos doesn't get The Mind Stone. Saving Loki doesn't harm anybody. Saving Quicksilver doesn't harm anybody. Saving Iron Man and Black Widow doesn't harm anybody. There is one timeline where the snap is reversed. That was mentioned multiple times in Infinity War and multiple times in Endgame. The argument that saving those heroes will fuck up other timelines holds no water.

[spurraider21]

in that timeline, all we know is that he marries another peggy. for all we know, in that timeline, starks parents don't die either. the issues of determinism here get quite grey. to the point where rogers becomes quite different from the rogers that we knew because he has to make more complicated ethical choices.
indeed. that timeline could be all fucked up or all roses.

but old man cap is still our prime cap and he seemed to be happy and at peace

[rjv]

indeed. that timeline could be all fucked up or all roses.

but old man cap is still our prime cap and he seemed to be happy and at peace

what is weird for me, is that i was team cap all the way but the ending, although i can't begrudge him his right to be happy, tainted it just a tad. i actually became quite the stark fan in this film. what makes it harder is that peggy was just a crush, they hadn't even dated yet. if she had been his wife already, that would have been different for me. it's not as if he couldn't have been happy with someone else in this timeline. but i think the story was altered by evans decision to leave the franchise. they had to create a way for him to be out of the picture without killing him.

[spurraider21]

Then I will repeat myself again: how is taking the heroes from other timelines right before they die, in anyway a bad thing? Save Gamora and Thanos doesn't get The Soul Stone. Save Vision and Thanos doesn't get The Mind Stone. Saving Loki doesn't harm anybody. Saving Quicksilver doesn't harm anybody. Saving Iron Man and Black Widow doesn't harm anybody. There is one timeline where the snap is reversed. That was mentioned multiple times in Infinity War and multiple times in Endgame. The argument that saving those heroes will fuck up other timelines holds no water.
true for some of them. they did, for instance, "save" gamora by taking her out of a timeline where thanos would eventually sacrifice her for the soul stone. and i agree you could generally do that for vision as well.

saving ironman means you prevent him from doing the snap, which is no bueno. saving black widow means the good guys never wind up with the soul stone so they cant do the unsnap.

people are still debating mechanics of back to the future. we can do this for a while. time travel has paradoxes, inconsistencies, and ultimately the story has to make sense.

[spurraider21]

what is weird for me, is that i was team cap all the way but the ending, although i can't begrudge him his right to be happy, tainted it just a tad. i actually became quite the stark fan in this film. what makes it harder is that peggy was just a crush, they hadn't even dated yet. if she had been his wife already, that would have been different for me. it's not as if he couldn't have been happy with someone else in this timeline. but i think the story was altered by evans decision to leave the franchise. they had to create a way for him to be out of the picture without killing him.
or they could have just killed him. but the peggy thing had been called back on so many times... if it was just a crush, he wouldnt have kept her picture with him at all times, years later, and she wouldnt have his picture on her desk in the 70's

[Blake]

the russo brothers in the Q&A made it pretty clear imo that he time jumped again to wind up on that bench. but yeah they executed that poorly for dramatic effect

Ah, I didn't read it. That makes sense

[redzero]

true for some of them. they did, for instance, "save" gamora by taking her out of a timeline where thanos would eventually sacrifice her for the soul stone. and i agree you could generally do that for vision as well.

saving ironman means you prevent him from doing the snap, which is no bueno. saving black widow means the good guys never wind up with the soul stone so they cant do the unsnap.

people are still debating mechanics of back to the future. we can do this for a while. time travel has paradoxes, inconsistencies, and ultimately the story has to make sense.

Did you even read my post? Why does it matter that other timelines will be fucked up when Thanos is successfully defeated in one timeline? Who cares that other heroes will fail in other timelines when they are destined to fail anyway?

I am criticizing the time travel mechanics because they deserve to be criticized. Don't introduce time travel into the story, tell the audience that people can't be brought back from the dead, and then give no in-story justification why that is true.

[lefty]

It was weird to see CM not have a lot of screentime after all the build up to her appearance in EG

But it makes sense, it wouldn’t have felt earned in comparison to other characters

[Thanos]

The movie makes zero sense and completely falls apart logically under the smallest bit of scrutiny. But it doesn’t matter, it’s a movie about talking raccoons and thunder gods, it’s not meant to be examined that deeply. The fan service is tons of fun. Better than Infinity War. Still the same boilerplate Marvel formula, for better or worse.

Even as a non fanboy, you have to respect their ability to go 11 years and 22 movies, keeping things consistently fun and reasonably coherent, and absolutely sticking the landing. It’s never been done before. Endgame should get the same congratulatory “you’re not even close to the best movie this year, or even in your own film series, but props for accomplishing the impossible” type Oscar sweep they gave to Return Of The King.

Will be interesting to see if they even try to top this in the next phase of films.

[spurraider21]

Did you even read my post? Why does it matter that other timelines will be fucked up when Thanos is successfully defeated in one timeline? Who cares that other heroes will fail in other timelines when they are destined to fail anyway?
thanos isn't only defeated in one timeline. dr strange said he looked at 14 million possible futures, and in only one of them did the good guys win. every timeline still has that 1 in 14 million chance. its not like there are exactly 14 million timelines and only prime is the winner.

and good luck convincing those past versions. imagine captain america got a visitor from the future saying "oh my the way your timeline is fucked anyway, so we're gonna go ahead and snatch up ironman and black widow, k thanks bye" and then cap just stands there having lost people close to him.


I am criticizing the time travel mechanics because they deserve to be criticized. Don't introduce time travel into the story, tell the audience that people can't be brought back from the dead, and then give no in-story justification why that is true.
yeah and why didnt dr strange just tell thanos that he has come to bargain? you can always nitpick decisions

we haven't seen the good guys actually have the ability to bring somebody else from the past to the current timeline. its a round trip. you send someone back, and then return that same person to prime. we dont even know if what you're suggesting is even possible/allowed given their rules. they send somebody back with pym particles and therefore are able to track them and re-summon them to prime

[spurraider21]

The movie makes zero sense and completely falls apart logically under the smallest bit of scrutiny. But it doesn’t matter, it’s a movie about talking raccoons and thunder gods, it’s not meant to be examined that deeply. The fan service is tons of fun. Better than Infinity War. Still the same boilerplate Marvel formula, for better or worse.

Even as a non fanboy, you have to respect their ability to go 11 years and 22 movies, keeping things consistently fun and reasonably coherent, and absolutely sticking the landing. It’s never been done before. Endgame should get the same congratulatory “you’re not even close to the best movie this year, or even in your own film series, but props for accomplishing the impossible” type Oscar sweep they gave to Return Of The King.

Will be interesting to see if they even try to top this in the next phase of films.
suspension of disbelief only goes so far though. like we can accept people have super powers and there are aliens, but if bruce banner gave birth to a peanut butter sandwich that wouldnt make sense at all and i wouldnt rationalize it as "oh well its a movie with super heroes"

[Thanos]

suspension of disbelief only goes so far though. like we can accept people have super powers and there are aliens, but if bruce banner gave birth to a peanut butter sandwich that wouldnt make sense at all and i wouldnt rationalize it as "oh well its a movie with super heroes"
Okay Philo

[lefty]

Stark was obviously to weak to withstand a snap, but he could have used 1 stone to neutralize Thanos and someone else would have cut Thanos’ arm or removed the gauntlet

[Chinook]

Stark was obviously to weak to withstand a snap, but he could have used 1 stone to neutralize Thanos and someone else would have cut Thanos’ arm or removed the gauntlet

You mean like how they could have just gone back to that part in IW where they were subduing Thanos and just cut his arm off with SB and gotten almost all the stones in one go?

[spurraider21]

You mean like how they could have just gone back to that part in IW where they were subduing Thanos and just cut his arm off with SB and gotten almost all the stones in one go?
well then...

[Trainwreck2100]

I am criticizing the time travel mechanics because they deserve to be criticized. Don't introduce time travel into the story, tell the audience that people can't be brought back from the dead, and then give no in-story justification why that is true.
How could they bring black widow back without fucking over the timberline they took her from. She had to die for the soul stone

[cd021]

the time gps on his wrist, the same way they all got back after the initial heist

I missed that part. I thought he had just waited all those years until Stark's funeral to appear. He basically lived his life with Peggy then returned to the prime timeline moments after he had initially left.

That makes more sense than what I had thought. He still did royally fuck up one timeline though and I still wanna know how he got that shield

[cd021]

How could they bring black widow back without fucking over the timberline they took her from. She had to die for the soul stone

They couldn't, as far as I understand it.

[cd021]

the russo brothers in the Q&A made it pretty clear imo that he time jumped again to wind up on that bench. but yeah they executed that poorly for dramatic effect

Yeah, that confused me until I read the Q&A. They could've shown him wearing the time jump watch thingy to illustrate that he had jumped all the way back to the forties, lived with Peggy up until her death in 2016 then jumped back to the moment after he left the main timeline. That makes more sense than what I had thought.

[TDMVPDPOY]

captain cuck, the cuck game

[cd021]

what is weird for me, is that i was team cap all the way but the ending, although i can't begrudge him his right to be happy, tainted it just a tad. i actually became quite the stark fan in this film. what makes it harder is that peggy was just a crush, they hadn't even dated yet. if she had been his wife already, that would have been different for me. it's not as if he couldn't have been happy with someone else in this timeline. but i think the story was altered by evans decision to leave the franchise. they had to create a way for him to be out of the picture without killing him.

Chris Evans isn't done with the MCU, that's been confirmed. It's been rumored that he may appear in the Falcon and Winter Soldier series as a mentor for Falcon as the new CA.

Russo's also mulled the idea of a forth Cap movie set in the alternative timeline. Maybe that turns into a Disney+ series that follows Rodgers and Peggy and how he/they changed that timeline.

It seems evident that that will be the primary-alternative timeline, maybe the timeline where the mutants and the X-Men appear.

[rjv]

Chris Evans isn't done with the MCU, that's been confirmed. It's been rumored that he may appear in the Falcon and Winter Soldier series as a mentor for Falcon as the new CA.

Russo's also mulled the idea of a forth Cap movie set in the alternative timeline. Maybe that turns into a Disney+ series that follows Rodgers and Peggy and how he/they changed that timeline.

It seems evident that that will be the primary-alternative timeline, maybe the timeline where the mutants and the X-Men appear.


this is where a lot of critics go after the russos and marvel studio in that they will often point out that it seems as if much of the writing is done so that it can just generate more movies and more profit for the studio. my thinking is that most of these critics aren't familiar with the comic book genre because that's exactly what happens in the comic book world. heroes die, they have alternate versions of themselves, they come back from the dead, they go bad, they disappear and so on and so on. so if the door was left open for evans to come back, then that's just par for the course.

[Trainwreck2100]

Chris Evans isn't done with the MCU, that's been confirmed. It's been rumored that he may appear in the Falcon and Winter Soldier series as a mentor for Falcon as the new CA.

Russo's also mulled the idea of a forth Cap movie set in the alternative timeline. Maybe that turns into a Disney+ series that follows Rodgers and Peggy and how he/they changed that timeline.

It seems evident that that will be the primary-alternative timeline, maybe the timeline where the mutants and the X-Men appear.

They don't even have to do that they can deage him. Like what happened to ant man

[cd021]

this is where a lot of critics go after the russos and marvel studio in that they will often point out that it seems as if much of the writing is done so that it can just generate more movies and more profit for the studio. my thinking is that most of these critics aren't familiar with the comic book genre because that's exactly what happens in the comic book world. heroes die, they have alternate versions of themselves, they come back from the dead, they go bad, they disappear and so on and so on. so if the door was left open for evans to come back, then that's just par for the course.

Cap just got old in Endgame so he didn't die, people or critics shouldn't be surprised if he return. It would be sort of weird if he didn't now, Old cap is a thing in the comic, as is Falcon-CA, Viking looking Thor and Cap wielding Thor's hammer and saying "Avengers, Assemble".

[Blake]

this is where a lot of critics go after the russos and marvel studio in that they will often point out that it seems as if much of the writing is done so that it can just generate more movies and more profit for the studio. my thinking is that most of these critics aren't familiar with the comic book genre because that's exactly what happens in the comic book world. heroes die, they have alternate versions of themselves, they come back from the dead, they go bad, they disappear and so on and so on. so if the door was left open for evans to come back, then that's just par for the course.

I don't care how much money they make as long they produce a quality product. And they do.

They could plunk money into these movies and bust just the same a la DC.

[lefty]

1123620664152395776

1123446946776125441

[Trill Clinton]

Movie was fire but now its time to give us the GOAT villain, Dr. Doom

[lefty]

Movie was fire but now its time to give us the GOAT villain, Dr. Doom
MCU Dr Doom should be awesome

[tlongII]

https://www.google.com/search?q=galactus&client=safari&prmd=inv&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjd0dLmpP7hAhU3IjQIHTh7CPUQ_AUIEigB&biw=1024&bih=666#imgrc=9xc6_Tt9FrbhIM

[Blake]

MCU Dr Doom should be awesome

I'd love if they gave him his own movie tbh

[lefty]

I'd love if they gave him his own movie tbh
I’ve been thinking the same

A solo origin movie to introduce him, where he wouldn’t be a villain, then in later movies he would become one

[FrostKing]

Isn't Black Panther already the villain?

[Spurminator]

I usually get hung up on logical inconsistencies and plot holes in films involving time travel, but I found it very easy to just go with the flow on this one.

[LaMarcus Bryant]

I usually get hung up on logical inconsistencies and plot holes in films involving time travel, but I found it very easy to just go with the flow on this one.

:tu

[cd021]

I’ve been thinking the same

A solo origin movie to introduce him, where he wouldn’t be a villain, then in later movies he would become one

There were plans for a Doom film but it got cancelled after the Fox merger. He could still appear in a Black Panther movie (probably not 2 because it seems like it might be the Submariner) , as an introduction before the Fantastic 4 enters the MCU.

[leemajors]

There were plans for a Doom film but it got cancelled after the Fox merger. He could still appear in a Black Panther movie (probably not 2 because it seems like it might be the Submariner) , as an introduction before the Fantastic 4 enters the MCU.

Spider Man has a long history with Doom too.

[lefty]

There were plans for a Doom film but it got cancelled after the Fox merger. He could still appear in a Black Panther movie (probably not 2 because it seems like it might be the Submariner) , as an introduction before the Fantastic 4 enters the MCU.
Sucks that Stark dieded though, we won’t see the full Illuminati lineup

[spurraider21]

engame already surpassed titanic and now sits #2 all all time highest grossing films

[cd021]

Sucks that Stark dieded though, we won’t see the full Illuminati lineup

Probably weren't going to, anyway, with Blackbolt not really introduced, and with Mr. Fantastic, Professor X, and Namor yet to be introduced.

Hope they do a proper Inhumans series with Disney + and make the Submariner the villain in BP 2- at least introduce those characters sooner rather later.

[cd021]

Spider Man has a long history with Doom too.

Think Sony wants a slow build to the Sinister 6; they already have Vulture, Shocker & Misterio. Spiderman 3 would probably have 2 villains. Maybe two of the four ; Dr. Octopus, Scorpion, Rhino, or Green Goblin.

Black Panther 3 probably makes more since given that the MCU tends to adapt more recent comics- with Doom invading Wakanda iirc.

[Xevious]

I know I'm ridiculously late, but I was able to avoid spoilers and only just now saw this. :lol

After reading through this thread I was kind of surprised at how many people were confused about the time travel mechanics. Everything seemed very consistent to me, with the only confusion being how Old Cap was at the end. But as others said, he had to have traveled back to the prime universe to be there.

The problem I'm having is that with time travel and the multiverse introduced to the MCU, I'm afraid that it's going to become a convoluted mess like the Xmen movies. Are casual viewers really going to understand that the Loki in the TV show is from a different timeline than the one from the movies? Is he going to travel to the prime universe? Or are they just going to ignore what's happening in the movies?