Draft Strategy: A promise for Okeke or Porter?

[pad300]

Should the Spurs consider making a deal with either Chuma Okeke or Jontay Porter's camps? Both players have long term injuries that are expected to drop them to the second round, but are first round talents.

Proposal : offer one of them a promise of pick #29, in return for them agreeing to go back to school for one year.

The Spurs free a roster spot for next year (and associated cap space), get a talented player (perhaps better than could otherwise pick at 29), and don't spend a year of the rookie contract on rehab.

The player (who because of injury won't be playing next year either in the NBA or college), would transfer to one of the universities in town (USTA SA campus, Texas A&M SA Campus, etc.). They get to rehab with NBA professionals (obviously, SAS would open their facilities) and get a first round guaranteed contract.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

I wouldn't mind using the 29th pick on Okeke even if he's signed right away.

Porter not so much.

[exstatic]

Should the Spurs consider making a deal with either Chuma Okeke or Jontay Porter's camps? Both players have long term injuries that are expected to drop them to the second round, but are first round talents.

Proposal : offer one of them a promise of pick #29, in return for them agreeing to go back to school for one year.

The Spurs free a roster spot for next year (and associated cap space), get a talented player (perhaps better than could otherwise pick at 29), and don't spend a year of the rookie contract on rehab.

The player (who because of injury won't be playing next year either in the NBA or college), would transfer to one of the universities in town (USTA SA campus, Texas A&M SA Campus, etc.). They get to rehab with NBA professionals (obviously, SAS would open their facilities) and get a first round guaranteed contract.

I’m not even sure where to start with this. Kids ONLY go to school to hoop. There’s no way they agree to be drafted and go to some local school instead of getting paid. No player or agent would agree to that. If you draft either of them, it’s ironclad that you will be paying them to sit for a year.

[cjw]

Seems a bit unprecedented, and the player would be taking risk of that contract when a team in round 2 would certainly give them guaranteed money. Not sure it’s even allowed (typically it’s guys who are under contract in Europe).

Also, without a contract how would they have access to team doctors?

Agree that wasting a year of rookie contract is less than ideal. Maybe what they can do instead is reduce the rookie scale contract to account for it.

The cheap Thunder did it with Huestis and guaranteed him a contract instead of picking a better player in Fathead.

[RC_Drunkford]

I'd say rather sign them with a 2nd rounder. You can buy 2nd rounders fairly cheap. Then let them rehab and when they ready bring them along in the G-League. Kinda like they did with Lonnie. I think they should definitely take a chance on one of them

[RD2191]

What?

[lmbebo]

Don't think thats legal with current CBA. Opens a big debate though ... Drafting kids out of high school, but then sending them to colleges for development, team has there rights through age 22?

[BD24]

This is pretty fucking stupid tbh

[pad300]

Don't think thats legal with current CBA. Opens a big debate though ... Drafting kids out of high school, but then sending them to colleges for development, team has there rights through age 22?

I suspect it's CBA legal. It's not like the CBA could force a kid to come and play basketball for you, and instead, he wanted to join the marines... If the kid chooses not to come to the Spurs that year and demand his guaranteed contract, that's presumably his business.

[pad300]

Seems a bit unprecedented, and the player would be taking risk of that contract when a team in round 2 would certainly give them guaranteed money. Not sure it’s even allowed (typically it’s guys who are under contract in Europe).

The player would almost certainly be ahead in this scenario - how much guaranteed money would teams put in front of a second round player who's injured. I'd guess the vet min.



Also, without a contract how would they have access to team doctors?

By the team chosing to let them in. Same way we had a big part in the treatment of Javtokas after his motorcycle accident.




Agree that wasting a year of rookie contract is less than ideal. Maybe what they can do instead is reduce the rookie scale contract to account for it.


Might be another approach, but you can only go down to 80% of the rookie scale, IIRC.

[John B]

I don’t think that’s legal. You’d have to pay him sitting. Why would a player agree to that?

[exstatic]

I suspect it's CBA legal. It's not like the CBA could force a kid to come and play basketball for you, and instead, he wanted to join the marines... If the kid chooses not to come to the Spurs that year and demand his guaranteed contract, that's presumably his business.

It’s not allowed anymore by the CBA, and the NCAA would deem them ineligible.

[timvp]

Yeah, that at the very least would be frowned upon and even if a player agreed to it, the players union wouldn't be happy for the precedent that would set. It'd be pretty dumb to risk a Joe Smith 2.0 situation for a borderline second round pick.

I wouldn't mind making a promise to an injured player. But, as mentioned, the only reasonable condition the Spurs can put on their promise would be the rookie agreeing to a lower salary.

[phxspurfan]

I would be ok if they drafted either one

[phxspurfan]

Yeah, that at the very least would be frowned upon and even if a player agreed to it, the players union wouldn't be happy for the precedent that would set. It'd be pretty dumb to risk a Joe Smith 2.0 situation for a borderline second round pick.

I wouldn't mind making a promise to an injured player. But, as mentioned, the only reasonable condition the Spurs can put on their promise would be the rookie agreeing to a lower salary.

What happened to Joe Smith? I remember he was on the Warriors but wasn't that good

[BackHome]

Okeke yes but no way in Hell would I sign Porter way to injury prone. But yeah I would love to move up high second to grab Okeke

[Pavlov]

Seems like the player could just force his way onto the roster regardless of some secret agreement. Would pretty much be a no-brainer from the player's standpoint were he drafted in the first round.

[cjw]

Okeke yes but no way in Hell would I sign Porter way to injury prone. But yeah I would love to move up high second to grab Okeke

Exactly, can just go buy a pick if they want either from a team like Chicago whose owner doesn’t care or Philly who has several second rounders. The issues I see are (1) Spurs don’t seem to be willing to send out money in trades for picks (and might be limited because of money sent out with Kawhi) and (2) roster is already going to be pretty full:

11 guys under contract plus Gay likely coming back, and two first rounders already put them at 14 without using the MLE on anybody. It’s unlikely everyone is back (no trades), but only way I see them finding a way back into the second round is if they package both picks to move up.

[Chinook]

With two-way deals now a thing, I don't thinking carrying an injured player for the whole year is really a big deal. If you believe in one of those guys, you get them to come out when you can get them rather than wait until they show some more potential and price themselves out of your market.

[talkspurs]

I wonder if we could use a 2way contract on a first rd pick. The player would not be able to return to school and play basketball. He could go overseas but not to college. I do think we can pick a player in the first and then if he agrees to sign he could go to the D league but I dont know if we could put him on 2 way. Would be a draft in D league.

[objective]

The only point of a promise to an underclassman is to induce him to stay in the draft and/or shutdown workouts

Neither of these guys is a risk for going back to school to miss a season and neither one can do a lot of workouts as it is.

[ZeusWillJudge]

I'm not sure what OP is trying to accomplish.

A first round contract is guaranteed for two years (plus options for years 3 & 4), with the salary pre-determined by the draft position. If a player enters the draft (and stays there past the deadline), he is ineligible for any college play. If the Spurs were going to use the actual 29 pick on one of those guys, they have their own rehab program - they don't need one of the local colleges to do it for them.

If you're proposing some sort of back-door deal, that's a recipe for disaster. I don't even know what that would look like, but back-door deals aren't allowed, and the Joe Smith debacle shows just how ugly the penalties can be for trying.

The Spurs can't get him to back out of the draft and then sign him. Nobody gets a free shot at a player. If he opted out of the draft, he'd just have to enter it next year.

The

[cjw]

I wonder if we could use a 2way contract on a first rd pick. The player would not be able to return to school and play basketball. He could go overseas but not to college. I do think we can pick a player in the first and then if he agrees to sign he could go to the D league but I dont know if we could put him on 2 way. Would be a draft in D league.

No, you can’t do that

Anyone can play in the G League though. Although players with a certain amount of years have to agree to go down.

[Drom John]

Old rules.

If a player enters the draft (and stays there past the deadline), he is ineligible for any college play.

New rules: (https://www.ncaa.org/about/flexibility-going-pro-and-getting-degree)

"College basketball players who request an Undergraduate Advisory Committee evaluation, participate in the NBA combine and aren’t drafted can return to school as long as they notify their athletics director of their intent by 5 p.m. the Monday after the draft."

[ZeusWillJudge]

Old rules.
New rules: (https://www.ncaa.org/about/flexibility-going-pro-and-getting-degree)


First of all, I said: "and stays there past the deadline".

Regardless of what you may have read, this is the latest document from the NCAA: https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/enforcement/2019ENF_NBAMemo.pdf

Skip down and you'll read this: "A student-athlete who wishes to remove his name from the NBA Draft AND maintain NCAA eligibility must submit a written statement to the NBA by 11:59 p.m. Eastern time, May 29, 2019." The draft is on June 20.

They were talking about changing the rule to allow players to go through the draft and still come back to college, if undrafted. But that rule is pending. As of right now, they have to withdraw from the draft by May 29, or they can't come back to college.

[Bolded and underlined some things to highlight the main points and save people some time.]

[Degoat]

If Okeke is there at 29, the spurs should grab him no question

[sasaint]

If Okeke is there at 29, the spurs should grab him no question

Absolutely. I am praying this happens.

[look_at_g_shred]

If Okeke is there at 29, the spurs should grab him no question
I think other than GSW, there’s no other team I think would risk their first rounder who will likely miss the whole year. GSW can take that risk well because they are going to be great for a few more years. The spurs will have the luxury to be able to gamble because we have two 1sts.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

If Okeke is there at 29, the spurs should grab him no question

I was going to post the same thing. If he comes back well from injury I feel he could be a steal at the 29th or lower. Like look_at_g_shred stated I can see a team like Golden State or even Boston due to having multiple picks grabbing the guy before us at 29.

If the one kid Samanic is there at 29 and we haven't traded out or he hasn't been drafted I can see our guys getting him to save a roster spot and money

[DJR210]

I'm not sure what OP is trying to accomplish.

A first round contract is guaranteed for two years (plus options for years 3 & 4), with the salary pre-determined by the draft position. If a player enters the draft (and stays there past the deadline), he is ineligible for any college play. If the Spurs were going to use the actual 29 pick on one of those guys, they have their own rehab program - they don't need one of the local colleges to do it for them.

If you're proposing some sort of back-door deal, that's a recipe for disaster. I don't even know what that would look like, but back-door deals aren't allowed, and the Joe Smith debacle shows just how ugly the penalties can be for trying.

The Spurs can't get him to back out of the draft and then sign him. Nobody gets a free shot at a player. If he opted out of the draft, he'd just have to enter it next year.

The

Bend over, I'll show you a back-door deal

[exstatic]

I was going to post the same thing. If he comes back well from injury I feel he could be a steal at the 29th or lower. Like look_at_g_shred stated I can see a team like Golden State or even Boston due to having multiple picks grabbing the guy before us at 29.

If the one kid Samanic is there at 29 and we haven't traded out or he hasn't been drafted I can see our guys getting him to save a roster spot and money

One roster spot out of 15 for a long term project isn't going to make or break things, especially with two way contracts now a thing, and the money isn't much, just a bit over $1M.