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View Full Version : Trump’s not claiming executive power. He’s going for divine right.



Nbadan
05-14-2019, 11:58 PM
In 1787, the framers gave us a president, not a king. On Tuesday, lawyers for President Trump gave a dissenting opinion.

In the first of many courtroom showdowns between Trump’s executive branch and the legislative branch, Trump’s lawyer William Consovoy argued to U.S. District Court Judge Amit Mehta that Congress has no authority to pry into Trump’s finances. That was expected. Unexpected was Consovoy’s broader argument: that Congress has essentially no authority to investigate any president for anything. Sorry, Sam Ervin: Even the Watergate investigation would have been illegal under the theory offered by Trump’s team. --snip--

Consovoy, a beefy former law clerk to Justice Clarence Thomas, offered two related points:

(A) Congress can’t issue a subpoena or otherwise probe a president unless it is doing so for a “legitimate legislative purpose.”

(B) Any “legitimate legislative purpose” Congress could conceivably devise would be unconstitutional.

As a result, Consovoy argued, Congress can’t investigate to see if a law is being broken, can’t inform the public of wrongdoing by the executive and can’t look for presidential conflicts of interest or corruption, because that would be “law enforcement.”

Forget about the Unitary Executive Theory. This one is closer to the Divine Right of Kings.

Mehta, an Obama appointee, probed for the limits of this breathtaking theory but found none:

Trump’s finances are not subject to investigation?

“Correct,” Consovoy informed the judge.

Congress can’t verify the accuracy of the president’s financial statements?

“Correct.”

If “a president was involved in some corrupt enterprise, you mean to tell me because he is the president of the United States, Congress would not have power to investigate?”

No, Consovoy said, because that’s “not pursuant to its legislative agenda.” --snip--

But surely Congress could investigate a president’s compliance with the Constitution’s emoluments clause?

“I respectfully disagree in part,” Consovoy persisted, saying Congress can’t engage in “anything that looks like a law enforcement investigation.”

Even the Whitewater and Watergate investigations exceeded congressional authority?

Here, Consovoy demurred (“I’d have to look,” he said), rather than admit his theory would have indeed banned both.

The Supreme Court has said judges shouldn’t look at Congress’s motives (even if they appear to be political) for investigating the executive, deferring to the legislature on what is a legitimate legislative function. But Consovoy told Mehta that “I don’t think the court can ignore” the Democrats’ motives, as expressed in public statements, and he called their legislative reasons “retroactive rationalizations.” Consovoy’s own argument sounded more political than legal at times. His brief began: “The Democrat Party . . . has declared all-out political war against President Donald J. Trump. Subpoenas are their weapon of choice.”

Consovoy’s argument was so aggressive, it seemed Trump’s lawyers expected defeat in the lower court and were looking for a higher court to reinterpret the law in Trump’s favor or, more likely, for the appeals to stretch until after the 2020 election. Consovoy sought delays for discovery and more arguments, saying it would be a disservice if “I did not go into depth.” But Mehta brushed off these attempts, saying he would close the record this week. And the judge flatly rejected Consovoy’s exotic argument that Mehta should preemptively declare unconstitutional any hypothetical legislation Congress might come up with related to its probe of Trump’s finances.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/trumps-not-claiming-executive-power-hes-going-for-divine-right/2019/05/14/c439cff8-7687-11e9-b3f5-5673edf2d127_story.html?utm_term=.1ce766850461

https://twitter.com/chrislhayes/status/1128427592992927744

DMC
05-15-2019, 12:01 AM
Clutch the pearls... oh noes!

boutons_deux
05-15-2019, 07:37 AM
the OLC "opinion" by the self-serving, untouchable club of DoJ lawyers is not in the Constitution, has not been passed by Congress, has not been decided by the judiciary.

It's a fucking opinion, like OLC's famous "torture is ok".

Winehole23
05-15-2019, 11:07 AM
Clutch the pearls... oh noes!POTUS argues he's above the law?

nbd, says you.

Spurminator
05-15-2019, 11:18 AM
POTUS argues he's above the law?

nbd, says you.

He's more concerned with bigger issues, like the comma placements in CNN headlines.

boutons_deux
05-15-2019, 11:37 AM
He's more concerned with bigger issues, like the comma placements in CNN headlines.

but dominated by what Fox opinionators said last night, this morning

boutons_deux
05-15-2019, 02:24 PM
Repugs are implementing the Unitary Executive, so beloved by dickhead war criminal Cheney, which is to be beyond any interference from Congress or the judiciary

Trump Argument Comes Into View

We’ll have more on this shortly.

But I want to point out the common argument the President’s personal lawyers (yesterday) and the White House Counsel’s office (in today’s letter) are now making.

They argue that the Congress has no legitimate oversight role with respect to the executive branch at all,

a stunning argument that would clip the wings of Congress permanently.

They are arguing first

that the only legitimate document requests or subpoenas are those tied specifically and narrowly to shaping upcoming legislation.

That’s an aspect of oversight but only a smallish part of it.

Secondly,

anything that is tied to wrongdoing or malfeasance or possibly crimes is “law enforcement”,

which is the exclusive purview of the executive branch.

In other words, from both sides of the equation,

they argue that Congress has no oversight role at all.

Now the argument is out in the open.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/trump-argument-comes-into-view?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+tpm-news+%28TPMNews%29 (https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/trump-argument-comes-into-view?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+tpm-news+%28TPMNews%29)

koriwhat
05-15-2019, 05:29 PM
POTUS argues he's above the law?

nbd, says you.

Funny you're concerned about that but not yrs of illegal spying and a hoax of a conspiracy in russiagate that you and many pushed along as reality. Fuck out of here!

Spurminator
05-15-2019, 06:02 PM
Illegal spying AND a hoax of a conspiracy!

Winehole23
05-15-2019, 06:18 PM
Funny you're concerned about that but not yrs of illegal spying and a hoax of a conspiracy in russiagate that you and many pushed along as reality. Fuck out of here!You must have me confused with someone else. I got a mile of shit from Bonnerific and Spurs Homer for questioning Russiagate -- they still think I'm a DJT stan.

Look, have the investigation. It's not going to be any easier to prove than than the conspiracy alleged against Trump and is likely to produce a similar result: a legally inconclusive report that people bicker over endlessly.

Winehole23
05-15-2019, 06:20 PM
It's not cool for POTUS to sic the DOJ on his political opponents, period.

boutons_deux
05-15-2019, 06:47 PM
It's not cool for POTUS to sic the DOJ on his political opponents, period.

I notice the Repug pols are outraged

koriwhat
05-15-2019, 06:48 PM
You must have me confused with someone else. I got a mile of shit from Bonnerific and Spurs Homer for questioning Russiagate -- they still think I'm a DJT stan.

Look, have the investigation. It's not going to be any easier to prove than than the conspiracy alleged against Trump and is likely to produce a similar result: a legally inconclusive report that people bicker over endlessly.

i probably do have you confused tbh... my bad! i think an investigation into the coup d'etat actors is going to open a bunch of closed minds nation/world wide but that's just me.

koriwhat
05-15-2019, 06:49 PM
It's not cool for POTUS to sic the DOJ on his political opponents, period.

was it ok for those same losers to sick the fbi on trump as well as numerous other 3 letter agencies? it's time for justice whether the dems want to see their snake headed heroes fall or not.

koriwhat
05-15-2019, 06:50 PM
I notice the Repug pols are outraged

no one cares what you noticed motherjones! go back to your padded room already.

Winehole23
05-15-2019, 06:54 PM
was it ok for those same losers to sick the fbi on trump as well as numerous other 3 letter agencies? it's time for justice whether the dems want to see their snake headed heroes fall or not.I've not seen any evidence Obama sicced the FBI on Trump, have you?

Winehole23
05-15-2019, 06:57 PM
That'll be as hard or harder to prove than the narrative that DJT cooperated directly with the GRU during his campaign.

Reck
05-15-2019, 07:11 PM
i think an investigation into the coup d'etat actors is going to open a bunch of closed minds nation/world wide but that's just me.

Going full retard is your specialty, calf tats.

Pavlov
05-15-2019, 07:14 PM
i probably do have you confused tbh... my bad! i think an investigation into the coup d'etat actors is going to open a bunch of closed minds nation/world wide but that's just me.How was this coup d'etat supposed to work again?

You guys never answered.

Chris
05-15-2019, 08:03 PM
I've not seen any evidence Obama sicced the FBI on Trump, have you?

Clapper ran his yapper. Try to keep up please.

Pavlov
05-15-2019, 08:37 PM
Clapper ran his yapper. Try to keep up please.Link?

pgardn
05-15-2019, 09:23 PM
Link?

OH good luck with that.

Chris
05-15-2019, 10:05 PM
“If it weren’t for President Obama, we might not have done the intelligence community assessment that we did that set off a whole sequence of events which are still unfolding today, notably, special counsel Mueller’s investigation”
-Clapper's yapper

Chris
05-15-2019, 10:08 PM
https://proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fthetyee.ca%2FOpinion%2F2016%2F03% 2F30%2FIdiot-610px.jpg&f=1


https://proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fthetyee.ca%2FOpinion%2F2016%2F03% 2F30%2FIdiot-610px.jpg&f=1

Pavlov
05-15-2019, 10:10 PM
“If it weren’t for President Obama, we might not have done the intelligence community assessment that we did that set off a whole sequence of events which are still unfolding today, notably, special counsel Mueller’s investigation”
-Clapper's yapperLink?

Context?

Anything?

Chris
05-15-2019, 10:13 PM
Direct quote from Clapper. Are you upset?

Pavlov
05-15-2019, 10:14 PM
Direct quote from Clapper. Are you upset?Link?

Context?

Anything?

Th'Pusher
05-16-2019, 06:42 AM
Link?

Context?

Anything?

https://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2018/aug/06/americanjournalreviewcom/article-wrong-clapper-said-obama-behind-trump-russ/

boutons_deux
05-16-2019, 07:00 AM
https://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2018/aug/06/americanjournalreviewcom/article-wrong-clapper-said-obama-behind-trump-russ/ (https://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2018/aug/06/americanjournalreviewcom/article-wrong-clapper-said-obama-behind-trump-russ/)

"Part of our reporting process is to reach out to the author of claims we’re checking.

The author of this story, Adriana, has no last name in her byline or contact information on the website.

The article also has no published date."

:lol

DMC
05-16-2019, 07:37 AM
POTUS argues he's above the law?

nbd, says you.


He's more concerned with bigger issues, like the comma placements in CNN headlines.

What politician/billionaire doesn't think they are above the law?

B I G
F U C K I N G
D E A L

DMC
05-16-2019, 07:38 AM
You must have me confused with someone else. I got a mile of shit from Bonnerific and Spurs Homer for questioning Russiagate -- they still think I'm a DJT stan.

Look, have the investigation. It's not going to be any easier to prove than than the conspiracy alleged against Trump and is likely to produce a similar result: a legally inconclusive report that people bicker over endlessly.

You pretty much bitch about everything in some weird, up your own ass sort of way.

Winehole23
05-16-2019, 08:48 AM
You pretty much bitch about everything in some weird, up your own ass sort of way.You pretty much just bite other posters ankles. It's remarkable a person as educated as you has so little to say about the topics.

Pavlov
05-16-2019, 10:01 AM
Direct quote from Clapper. Are you upset?:lol Qhris nailed posting fake news once again. Are you upset?

koriwhat
05-16-2019, 01:59 PM
Going full retard is your specialty, calf tats.

you're literally a retard and you went full retard a long time ago you dickless tranny.

koriwhat
05-16-2019, 02:01 PM
How was this coup d'etat supposed to work again?

You guys never answered.

did i ask for your opinion? nah, last thing i asked of you was for you to fuck off and leave me be already. idgaf about your bitchass pav! learn to be a man and stop acting like a bitch by being such a pest.

boutons_deux
05-16-2019, 06:24 PM
this is too long, historical, and intellectual for all you low-ed, ignorant Trash fellators

Trump Attacks Western Civilization Itself

Trump’s imperious usurpations of that system do not simply affront political sensibilities or conventional norms.

They desecrate the western constitutional order that has been 800 years in the making.

https://www.commondreams.org/views/2019/05/16/trump-attacks-western-civilization-itself?cd-origin=rss (https://www.commondreams.org/views/2019/05/16/trump-attacks-western-civilization-itself?cd-origin=rss)

Chris
05-17-2019, 02:36 PM
:lol Qhris nailed posting fake news once again. Are you upset?

Direct quote from Clapper - you're definitely upset :lol

Chris
05-17-2019, 02:36 PM
https://twitter.com/RepRatcliffe/status/1129463499011371008

Chris
05-17-2019, 02:37 PM
https://twitter.com/GeorgePapa19/status/1129463098161582080

koriwhat
05-17-2019, 03:10 PM
https://twitter.com/GeorgePapa19/status/1129463098161582080

2 muslim scumbags... go figure.

Pavlov
05-17-2019, 06:27 PM
did i ask for your opinion? nah, last thing i asked of you was for you to fuck off and leave me be already. idgaf about your bitchass pav! learn to be a man and stop acting like a bitch by being such a pest.
:lol you little sissy

Pavlov
05-17-2019, 06:28 PM
Direct quote from Clapper - you're definitely upset :lol
:lol Qhris lying about his fake news post.

Why do you lie?

Nbadan
05-17-2019, 11:45 PM
https://twitter.com/BeschlossDC/status/1129570363040522240