What is Keldon Johnson's Floor/Ceiling in your opinion?

[raybies]

So far we've seen two complete extremes of Keldon here at Summer League. IMO we saw the floor and ceiling of him in consecutive days. Let me elaborate first though... Yesterday we seen strictly 3/D role while today we seen him involved in the offense a lot more with his number being called...

Today Thomas Robinson said in a interview after the game he calls him "Baby Russ" and sees a potential superstar. What players does he remind you of? What do you think his floor and ceiling is?

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1q6HRrxQEq8

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[Harry Callahan]

What KJ did tonight was no accident. Good for us.

[slick'81]

Floor should be danny green anything else is gravy

[raybies]

Floor should be danny green anything else is gravy
That's what I'm thinking too. That makes for a high floor. But he does penetrate a lot better. He could grab and go and also catch and shoot. Danny is much more limited than that.

[mo7888]

Floor is Danny Green with handles
Ceiling is a bigger CJ McCollum

[ironman2886]

I think Keldon would be offended by the green comparison.

[r0drig0lac]

Floor is Danny Green with handles
Ceiling is a bigger CJ McCollum

bradley beal?

[GAustex]

Geez y’all slow ur roll

[mo7888]

bradley beal?

I don't think he has Beals athleticism or twitch.

[Dennis the Menace]

Ceiling - Dwayne Wade or Bradley Beal
Floor - Alternate universe of Danny Green with no clubbing and pure gym rat mode with handles and more quickness

[Dejounte]

James Harden who plays off the ball and spots up and plays defense

[raybies]

After today my ceiling for him was an elite role player in a Iguodala-Warriors role with a Danny Green with better grab and go floor, but then I heard T Rob's interview and was blown away by what he seen. He see's superstar. I'm not trying to take that at face value but it caught me by surprise cause I just didn't see anything like that.

It's interesting seeing people's comparisons though.

[slick'81]

He does look like russ and wheres #3:spin

[raybies]

He does look like russ and wheres #3:spin
You know he wears the number three cause he looked up to Chris Paul growing up right?

[Dejounte]

After today my ceiling for him was an elite role player in a Iguodala-Warriors role with a Danny Green with better grab and go floor, but then I heard T Rob's interview and was blown away by what he seen. He see's superstar. I'm not trying to take that at face value but it caught me by surprise cause I just didn't see anything like that.

It's interesting seeing people's comparisons though.

Iguodala is a good comparison.

[slick'81]

You know he wears the number three cause he looked up to Chris Paul growing up right?


Who isnt a cp3 fan !?

[raybies]

Who isnt a cp3 fan !?
:|

[SpurPadre]

Lucky for him, if he does become the next LDN, he won't have TP complaining about him being left wide open, tbh.

[ironman2886]

I don’t want to overreact to 1 game in the Summer League, but I’m impressed. He was doing it all. It looked very easy for him. Great draft pick. He needs to put on a little weight like Luca, though.

[Wu36]

Floor Wes Johnson. Ceiling Chuck Norris.

[GAustex]

Floor Wes Johnson. Ceiling Chuck Norris.
😀

[SAGirl]

Too young to say tbh. Summer league can be misleading and I know from experience. lol
But he has talent and looks like a legit NBA player that may even play in his rook season and that is a great start.

[picnroll]

Haven't seen either game. Lot of talk about D Green. Is his defense at that level or have the potential to be. On ball? Off ball?

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

I once said Kawhi’s ceiling was a more athletic Bruce Bowen who could get you 15 a game, and I thought I was being complimentary.

Depends on KJ’s hunger level and how hard he’s willing to work. We seem to have a young core of guys willing to put the work in...maybe he’ll follow suit and turn into a starting level NBA player.

[Harry Callahan]

The rookies have a major learning curve ahead of them, so this will take a good bit of time. Tony Parker was the most successful of the late #1 hits of the Spurs in his first year. He had no one in front of him and Pop handed him the keys and he ran with it.

Our newbies need time, coaching, and development. I am encouraged by the first two games.

The Spurs have a number of young guys with potential.

[MR-Clutch]

Hard to say after two summer league games but maybe a better version of kris middelton?

[look_at_g_shred]

Remember how awesome White looked last summer? I’m getting the same feelz.

[raybies]

Haven't seen either game. Lot of talk about D Green. Is his defense at that level or have the potential to be. On ball? Off ball?
He's very advanced for his age on defense as far as fundamentals go. He's got a bull dog type defense about him with how he pressures. Not saying Bowen level cause Bowen was elite at moving his feet, but he positions himself very well and contests really well. He doesn't foul much either which gives some of us hope that he could take some minutes from Beli or Bertans next season. At his absolute basic self he could play some high energy minutes at a pinch with solid D. He doesn't need the basket to score cause of his high motor and attacking the boards. As for shooting, he can catch and shoot and grab and go. His mid range game needs some work though. He takes really long awkward floaters.

[raybies]

Remember how awesome White looked last summer? I’m getting the same feelz.
I really don't remember another Spurs rookie with as big of a game as KJ had today in summer league. Usually they need the second year to take off. I mean he obviously has to show this a little more consistently and the competition argument is valid, but still, it was an impressive outing.

[Ocotillo]

If he is on the active roster at the time, I can see one of those times where Pop gets pissed at the whole starting line up because of lack of energy or whatever and pulls them and puts in all bench players and Keldon shines.

[slick'81]

If he is on the active roster at the time, I can see one of those times where Pop gets pissed at the whole starting line up because of lack of energy or whatever and pulls them and puts in all bench players and Keldon shines.


I believe hes 1-13 right now yes

[peacemaker885]

Can PATFO hang on to him if pans out? Bigger question IMO.

[John B]

Quick feet and good bball iq with nose on the ball. Nah, he got handles so definitely not Green. He’ll put a lot of garbage points with 2nd efforts.

[Dennis the Menace]

Thomas Robinson seems like a really nice guy. Whether it’s development with the Spurs or a different organization I hope he finds a good home on a team

[HarlemHeat37]

So you guys think his FLOOR is a career starter on a contender every year?:lol damn, this man must be a monster..even Jonathon Simmons wasn't that and he was a Summer League star, as well..

[SAGirl]

I really don't remember another Spurs rookie with as big of a game as KJ had today in summer league. Usually they need the second year to take off. I mean he obviously has to show this a little more consistently and the competition argument is valid, but still, it was an impressive outing.
That was probably what impressed me the most. That he's a rook and he's very young.

White was older, Dejounte looked incredibly raw as a rook, just a really athletic guard with iffy handles but a great first step.
Walker looked like a star in the making but got injured as a rook. He is now a second season player (although still so very young).

Spurs don't generally have draftees this young to begin with until recently so it's tough to have much of a frame of reference.

This Grizzlies team was awful though. They saved all of their draft picks and even their better Gleague prospects didn't play (Watanabe and others). It was basically try outs for their Gleague team I am guessing. Keldon got many easy baskets. Still it's very encouraging.

[phxspurfan]

Floor: NBA dropout in 1 year

Ceiling: Mario Elie

[raybies]

So you guys think his FLOOR is a career starter on a contender every year?:lol damn, this man must be a monster..even Jonathon Simmons wasn't that and he was a Summer League star, as well..
Stop. Jonathon Simmons was like 25 or some ish. This is a 19 yr old kid and we are discussing floor/ceiling. And it's very generous of you to say that about Green in the manner that you are stating. He's been very fortunate. He found a perfect situation and has been making a living in a niche role that he occupied by having a simbient relationship with bigger stars. We are talking skill sets here. :nope

[HarlemHeat37]

Stop. Jonathon Simmons was like 25 or some ish. This is a 19 yr old kid and we are discussing floor/ceiling. And it's very generous of you to say that about Green in the manner that you are stating. He's been very fortunate. He found a perfect situation and has been making a living in a niche role that he occupied by having a simbient relationship with bigger stars. We are talking skill sets here. :nope

You think this guy's FLOOR is the equivalent impact of a career 40% 3-point shooter with all-NBA caliber defense and finishes in the top 5 every year at his position in RPM?

So wtf is his ceiling?:lol Kawhi? Jordan?

[raybies]

You think this guy's FLOOR is the equivalent impact of a career 40% 3-point shooter with all-NBA caliber defense and finishes in the top 5 every year at his position in RPM?

So wtf is his ceiling?:lol Kawhi? Jordan?
did you not read the last part...? skill sets aka 3 and D. You are getting lost in the details. Anyone on this thread could've criticized the comparisons to Wade or anyone else if you go strictly into details. We are talking skill sets here. What can the kid do and not do.

[TrainOfThought5]

James Harden who plays off the ball and spots up and plays defense
Oxymoron

[Marcus Bryant]

Eh, 2 summer league games in and what you can say is all 3 picks have looked like NBA players, which is no small thing.

Lonnie balling a little down the stretch last night is what’s most exciting thus far.

[SpurPadre]

If he is on the active roster at the time, I can see one of those times where Pop gets pissed at the whole starting line up because of lack of energy or whatever and pulls them and puts in all bench players and Keldon shines.

In other words, in mid November, tbh?

[spurraider21]

less athletic, but better shooting marion?

[tbdog]

I haven't worked out his game yet. He harasses like Smart or Tony Allen. But doesn't have the dribbling like them, but has the standing shot that they don't.

[Seventyniner]

He's a #29 pick. Until he gets more games to prove otherwise, his floor has to be "washed out of the league in 2-3 years" like a bunch of other late first-rounders. Not that I think he's going to be nearly that bad.

[Degoat]

I’d say a rich mans Kawhi Leonard :smokin lol jk he’s still got a lot to prove but I kinda see a better defensive but less offensive Jayson Tatum

[TDMVPDPOY]

he better then that scrub danny green, yet his in the nba

dont see why this kelder clown cant be find a spot on some team...

[Spurtacular]

KJ could really help this team reach another level, tbh.

[spurraider21]

Eh, 2 summer league games in and what you can say is all 3 picks have looked like NBA players, which is no small thing.

Lonnie balling a little down the stretch last night is what’s most exciting thus far.
you think sammich looks like an NBA player right now?

[Marcus Bryant]

Yes.

[TDMVPDPOY]

his future determines on pos popabitch giving hiim any meaningful minutes

[mookie2001]

Bradley Beal would be physically he just looks like Bradley Beal. He also kinda looks like Donovan Mitchell. A good comp would be early Jalen Rose when he wasn’t a ball dominant point-forward

[daslicer]

If he can be a solid 3/D guy I will be happy.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Floor - Stanley Johnson
Ceiling - Marcus Smart who can hit wide open 3s

[superbigtime]

He looks like a natural.

[GreekSpursfan]

Lets hope he turns out to be a new Bruce Bowen. I don't expect much from him.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Lets hope he turns out to be a new Bruce Bowen. I don't expect much from him.

You don’t expect much, only that he’d have a career worthy of his jersey being retired?

[GreekSpursfan]

You don’t expect much, only that he’d have a career worthy of his jersey being retired?

Thats what i'm hoping he becomes but hope is different than what i expect which isn't much tbh.

[Chinook]

did you not read the last part...? skill sets aka 3 and D. You are getting lost in the details. Anyone on this thread could've criticized the comparisons to Wade or anyone else if you go strictly into details. We are talking skill sets here. What can the kid do and not do.

I agree with Harlem. Saying "Green with handles" implies at his floor he will be as good as Green at shooting and defense but with something extra. Danny is one of the best role-players ever in terms of his sheer impact. Johnson may reach that level, but it's far, far, far from a given. I think a lot of Spurs fans have it in their heads that Green was a generic three-and-D guy for the team that they could have just swapped out for another three-and-D guy with little loss. That's just not true. Danny isn't the paradigm of three-and-D wings. He's the paragon.

[Frenchfred]

I have not seen the game so hard to judge but looking at his highlights of the game, I feel that he doesn't have big hoops. He can shoot the three, his handles are not the best but they seem better than Green for sure. I'd say that he is probably a Danny Green with potential to score an extra 5 points/game

[kobyz]

Floor Wes Matthews, ceiling Rip Hamilton

[Big Empty]

Ceiling is Klay Thompson. Our 3 draft picks in this draft may all turn out to be studs. Kawhi didnt have great handles for 2-3 years. He worked on it

[Maddog]

Floor: NBA dropout in 1 year

Ceiling: Mario Elie


He's a #29 pick. Until he gets more games to prove otherwise, his floor has to be "washed out of the league in 2-3 years" like a bunch of other late first-rounders. Not that I think he's going to be nearly that bad.

I agree,
Floor is out of the league, or bouncing around team to team.

Let's not over react. He had good game in the SLC summer league. He got a fair # of points off of bad Memphis play.
I'm encouraged, but it's summer league and not even the main summer league.

[monty4329]

He got an OK game in Summer league against nobody. ONE game. Let's keep cool heads.

We need all the shooting we can find, so that's good.

To me though it is very worrisome his lack of verticality. Yes he has good long arms and seem to understrand the game, he is smart on where to be on the floor. But it is hard if he'll be overjumped on almost each possession.

Unless he finds verticality and at least 15 pounds of musles he'll have a hard time seeing the NBA floor soon.

[Em-City]

did you not read the last part...? skill sets aka 3 and D. You are getting lost in the details. Anyone on this thread could've criticized the comparisons to Wade or anyone else if you go strictly into details. We are talking skill sets here. What can the kid do and not do.

The Danny Green comparison is just lazy dude. He's probably never going to be as good on d or shooting 3s, but he'll be better at off the dribble, passing and a bunch of other stuff tbh. A better comparison would be a 3-d guy with a broader but more balanced overall skillset

[Dejounte]

He got an OK game in Summer league against nobody. ONE game. Let's keep cool heads.

We need all the shooting we can find, so that's good.

To me though it is very worrisome his lack of verticality. Yes he has good long arms and seem to understrand the game, he is smart on where to be on the floor. But it is hard if he'll be overjumped on almost each possession.

Unless he finds verticality and at least 15 pounds of musles he'll have a hard time seeing the NBA floor soon.

Sorry why does he need verticality when he has great anticipation of loose balls and knows how to work angles when laying it up?

[BacktoBasics]

Floor: NBA dropout in 1 year

Ceiling: Mario ElieThis is pretty close to reality in my eyes. Barring an injury, when it comes to his floor, I think the Spurs will work with him for at least this season and next. Then he'll catch on somewhere else and be out of the league after his third year. Mario Elie is good comp for his ceiling. KJ does seem to have some that intangible competitiveness that helps inferior players stick around and be impactful.

[Dennis the Menace]

This is pretty close to reality in my eyes. Barring an injury, when it comes to his floor, I think the Spurs will work with him for at least this season and next. Then he'll catch on somewhere else and be out of the league after his third year. Mario Elie is good comp for his ceiling. KJ does seem to have some that intangible competitiveness that helps inferior players stick around and be impactful.

are you high?

[TimDunkem]

Dejounte said James Harden with defense. :lmao

What the fuck, man.

[monty4329]

Sorry why does he need verticality when he has great anticipation of loose balls and knows how to work angles when laying it up?

Because the other NBA players have it. You can have great positioning against a college player or a G-league player and it will be fine. In the NBA you get blocked or rebounded on, all the time. It is physics, angles. Nowadays even 7 footers have a good verticality, or they wouldn't play in the NBA.

If he has some to develop, the staff will develop it. If he hasn't in him, he'll not be able to play MNA basketball. I trust they checked the relevant metrics before drafting him, anyway.

[Thunder1]

As a ceiling, possibly a modern day version of Alex English?...

[BacktoBasics]

are you high?
If anything that’s being generous. If he becomes more than that, great, but this guy is a small 3 and D at best and likely not athletic enough to hang with most quality 2’s.

[SpursGenius]

his future determines on pos popabitch giving hiim any meaningful minutes

This is the issue. He won’t get meaningful minutes and that will stunt his growth. Senile craterface needs to change his final three years and play young rookies.

[duncan2150]

He got an OK game in Summer league against nobody. ONE game. Let's keep cool heads.

We need all the shooting we can find, so that's good.

To me though it is very worrisome his lack of verticality. Yes he has good long arms and seem to understrand the game, he is smart on where to be on the floor. But it is hard if he'll be overjumped on almost each possession.

Unless he finds verticality and at least 15 pounds of musles he'll have a hard time seeing the NBA floor soon.


I think you're right about the verticality but imo he has an above average verticality, not very good but ok imo.

[BatManu20]

Floor: Vinny Del Negro

Ceiling: Michael Jordan

[313]

He looks like an NBA player, at (19?) which is promising. Reminds me of a Gary Harris, type. Not crazy athletic like Westbrook, or super long like Giannis, but he looks like a solid NBA player. His ceiling after 2 SL games I say, is a playoff rotational player. Which is a pretty high ceiling for a late 1st rounder*, imo.

[exstatic]

He looks like an NBA player, at (19?) which is promising. Reminds me of a Gary Harris, type. Not crazy athletic like Westbrook, or super long like Giannis, but he looks like a solid NBA player. His ceiling after 2 SL games I say, is a playoff rotational player. Which is a pretty high ceiling for a second round pick, imo.

He's not a second round pick.

[313]

He's not a second round pick.
Remembered right after posting lol

[313]

I think his floor is higher than Murray's floor. If he can have the same motor and work ethic as murray, he seems like a natural hooper.

[Keepin' it real]

Malik Hairston 2.0 -- spurstalk

[ceperez]

He's got length and athleticism. He also can shoot. This isn't the first time he's chucked a ball from mid court. Yes, it has to be a lucky shot, but to do it more than once tells you that he's got a great feel for shooting it from anywhere.

He also scores while taking contact.

He's only 19.

His floor is Danny Green... everything else is gravy.

[ceperez]

Right now I'm thinking his floor is Dejounte and his ceiling is D.White

Derrick White > Keldon Johnson > Dejounte Murray > Lonnie Walker

[acoelho1]

Whatever his ceiling is, he's has a high probability of reaching it given his tenacity and work ethic. Also, you can't discount the Spurs development program and they don't skip steps so rest assured they will maximize KJ's strengths and improve on his weaknesses. Lastly, kudos to the RC again for getting another player with solid tools at the 29th pick. Still too early but love his intensity and defense.

[JeffDuncan]

He got an OK game in Summer league against nobody. ONE game. Let's keep cool heads.

We need all the shooting we can find, so that's good.

To me though it is very worrisome his lack of verticality. Yes he has good long arms and seem to understrand the game, he is smart on where to be on the floor. But it is hard if he'll be overjumped on almost each possession.

Unless he finds verticality and at least 15 pounds of musles he'll have a hard time seeing the NBA floor soon.

You're quite sure of all that, are you?

Perhaps you wish to explain why NBA Draftnet says the following:

"Strengths: Athletic wing who plays with a lot of heart and determination ... Has an explosive first step that he uses to get by defenders to the rim ... He’s great at finishing around the basket ... He’s a good three-point shooter ... He shot 38% from behind the arc this season on just over three attempts per game ... He’s a great athlete with strong arms which will make a coveted player at the next level ... He has great leaping ability which will make him fun to watch in transition ... "

https://www.nbadraft.net/players/keldon-johnson

Tell us why we should believe you and not them.

You're not just lying in order to slander a Spurs player, are you?

[JeffDuncan]

Right now I'm thinking his floor is Dejounte and his ceiling is D.White

Derrick White > Keldon Johnson > Dejounte Murray > Lonnie Walker

ROFL!

Thanks for the laugh.

[SpursDynasty85]

Dont know much about the guy. This is a hard question but I'm going to guess he will be like a chuck person for us we are going to exploit that nice and quick shooting stroke he has.

[phxspurfan]

If anything that’s being generous. If he becomes more than that, great, but this guy is a small 3 and D at best and likely not athletic enough to hang with most quality 2’s.

Exactly. His middle ground is Keith Bogans Centerpiece (hustle defensive wing with medium length arms and medium physical tools/speed/athleticism). His high ground is Mario Elie, who was a key defensive contributor for several championship caliber teams like the Rockettes and 99 Spurs. Hung around the league for 10 years I think. Clutch and hard nosed dude, important piece to have on a roster but not an all star.

By comparison, higher end defensive prospects (to start at least) are guys like Sefolosha, Roberson, arguably Bowen, and of course bitch made Apple Lover.

[monty4329]

You're quite sure of all that, are you?

Perhaps you wish to explain why NBA Draftnet says the following:

"Strengths: Athletic wing who plays with a lot of heart and determination ... Has an explosive first step that he uses to get by defenders to the rim ... He’s great at finishing around the basket ... He’s a good three-point shooter ... He shot 38% from behind the arc this season on just over three attempts per game ... He’s a great athlete with strong arms which will make a coveted player at the next level ... He has great leaping ability which will make him fun to watch in transition ... "

https://www.nbadraft.net/players/keldon-johnson

Tell us why we should believe you and not them.

You're not just lying in order to slander a Spurs player, are you?

First of all, fuck you. Slander what? Suck me.

Second. ''leaping ability'' is NOT verticality. You understand shit about basketball, clearly. The people at drafnet understand the difference between '' fun to watch in transition'' where you ''leap'' and playing a half court game where you jump for layups and rebounds.

Third. You don't need to believe anybody. You may want to understand basketball and make your opinion. Or don't. Whatever.

[monty4329]

You're quite sure of all that, are you?

Perhaps you wish to explain why NBA Draftnet says the following:

"Strengths: Athletic wing who plays with a lot of heart and determination ... Has an explosive first step that he uses to get by defenders to the rim ... He’s great at finishing around the basket ... He’s a good three-point shooter ... He shot 38% from behind the arc this season on just over three attempts per game ... He’s a great athlete with strong arms which will make a coveted player at the next level ... He has great leaping ability which will make him fun to watch in transition ... "

https://www.nbadraft.net/players/keldon-johnson

Tell us why we should believe you and not them.

You're not just lying in order to slander a Spurs player, are you?

First of all, fuck you. Slander what? Suck me.

Second. ''leaping ability'' is NOT verticality. You understand shit about basketball, clearly. The people at drafnet understand the difference between '' fun to watch in transition'' where you ''leap'' and playing a half court game where you jump for layups and rebounds.

Third. You don't need to believe anybody. You may want to understand basketball and make your opinion. Or don't. Whatever.

[kobyz]

Mitch Richmond if he develop like crazy in reach his absolute ceiling...

[Slippy]

Definitely see the baby Russ comparison from watching those highlights. The spurs in transition and simply attacking the rim are going to be much better at it next season with this guy, Luca and Lonny progressing.

[Roscoe P. Coltrane]

This guy might make up for the Walker bust.

[Gordy58]

This guy might make up for the Walker bust.
calling Walker a bust before he even gets consistent nba minutes lol

[leo07251413]

I feel like the ceiling of KJ would be Iggy.

[kobyz]

This guy might make up for the Walker bust.

True bomb

[rjv]

He's a #29 pick. Until he gets more games to prove otherwise, his floor has to be "washed out of the league in 2-3 years" like a bunch of other late first-rounders. Not that I think he's going to be nearly that bad.

"....other late first rounders," or other Spurs late first rounders?

[TheCerebral1]

Floor: Better than DeRozan

Ceiling: Better than DeRozan

[MultiTroll]

What would he garner in a trade?

Contract runs thru 2027
19 mil a year basically.

[Obstructed_View]

Well he isn't a better point guard than Jeremy Sochan :lol

[Dex]

Well he isn't a better point guard than Jeremy Sochan :lol

How did we draft like 100 guards over the past few years....and suddenly our best PG is Tre Jones?

[timtonymanu]

Over this guy. I think the Olympics gave him some false hope that he could be a star player but he’s so average and easily replaceable. Tired of him and his black hole tendencies.

[tbdog]

I like Johnson motor. But I recall that pelicans game in the playin where he had a dud first half. It was that point I knew he couldn't be relied upon to be a playoff player, even taking into account of improving.

The reason being:

1. His three point shot is slow.
2. His in between game is limited.
3. His man to man defense is avg.
4. His help defense is bad.
5. He isn't big, long or athletic.

It means, it's really easy to scout him. You can sag off his shot and still contest it. Let him meet you in the paint when you have size. Don't worry about his help defense.