Nine Answers After Marcus Morris Reneges And The Spurs Sign Trey Lyles

[timvp]

https://www.spurstalk.com/trey-lyles-signs-spurs-marcus-morris-reneges/

Unfortunate situation. There's a chance it works out long-term but the team's chances for next season took a hit with this news...

[slick'81]

Welcome to sa trey mamba​ lyles

[ginobilized]

Thanks, timvp!

Informative and sobering. Small markets are facing some incredible challenges.
This felt like a LeBron move from the get go. That really must be so deflating to
small market teams.
The next CBA should be intense. Hope the NBA doesn’t eat itself by then.

I bet Pop goes out swingin’ in his final years as far as fighting this stuff.
How many Klutch sports guys are on Team USA?

[Twisted_Dawg]

What I want to know is which party, Rich Paul or the Knicks, instigated the contract discussions AFTER Morris verbally accepted the Spurs offer?

After Bullock "failed" his physical, if the Knicks contacted Paul and said they can offer $15 million, then Paul had a fiduciary duty to convey the offer to his client.

But if after Bullock failed the physical, if Paul contacted NY seeking a better deal than the Spurs, then he is slimy POS.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Thanks Timvp.


I know why we did the Lyles deal, but I just don’t think he does anything for us. Of course, my thought on Morris was that he would do something destructive at some point. I didn’t know it would be before the season even starts.

I think the Morris move, and subsequently this one shows that the Spurs were desperate to fill that hole in the roster. I don’t think that hole got filled at all with this move. I hope Lyles proves me wrong.

[Russ]

The Spurs are in such solid shape going forward, this is likely just a blip.

Morris reminded me of every other sluggish front-court FA that passed on the Spurs, from Lamond Murray on. (Gosh, the Spurs never recovered from that one.)

Lyles has the profile of every player the Spurs rescued from the scrap heap -- a failed prospect ready to work.

[John B]

The Spurs are in such solid shape going forward, this is likely just a blip.

Morris reminded me of every other sluggish front-court FA that passed on the Spurs, from Lamond Murray on. (Gosh, the Spurs never recovered from that one.)

Lyles has the profile of every player the Spurs rescued from the scrap heap -- a failed prospect ready to work.
Thanks Timvp. Ready to work is the underlying word here. If he is, Spurs could unluck a lottery pick player with great size and youth. But I really hoped the Spurs tried harder acquiring Morris, maybe tried to shed salary offering 2nd pick plus Belli to a contender or something creative. Morris, while considered a hot head, is what the Spurs is lacking, someone who fitted the SJax mold. But enough crying over spilled milk. We got Lyles and I sure hope he’s turn a leaf.

PATFO still has moves to take, as mentioned trading Beli to clear minutes for budding Lonnie. I hope they can package Beli plus pick to get that hard-nosed defender, maybe Covington?

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

It sucks that a team like the Spurs, who have done everything right in order to build and maintain a winning roster, get totaled raped by Kawhi and Uncle Dennis. Essentially, the Spurs long-term future was set, post Duncan. Imagine our young talent maturing with Kawhi at the core. And then, while we're starting to get back on our feet a little bit, Morris and Rich Paul comes in and kick us in the shin and knock us back down a notch. Spurs can't win dealing with fvcktards like that. Some teams are poorly managed and deserve that sort of treatment...the Spurs, on the other hand, have just had their future torpedoed by assholes.

[Dex]

Thanks Timvp.


I know why we did the Lyles deal, but I just don’t think he does anything for us. Of course, my thought on Morris was that he would do something destructive at some point. I didn’t know it would be before the season even starts.

I think the Morris move, and subsequently this one shows that the Spurs were desperate to fill that hole in the roster. I don’t think that hole got filled at all with this move. I hope Lyles proves me wrong.

Well, going back to the Beli trade thread...the Spurs were apparently targeting a big who could shoot. Lyles kind of fits that mold...I guess? (Even with his atrocious .255 year last year, he averaged .381 just the year prior and is still a career .331 shooter from deep). Just have to hope he can have a bounce-back year, tbh.

The problem is now we still need to fill that defensive 3/4 void that Nephew (and now Morris) left wide-open, have less assets to do so, and the market has dried up.

[Dex]

It sucks that a team like the Spurs, who have done everything right in order to build and maintain a winning roster, get totaled raped by Kawhi and Uncle Dennis. Essentially, the Spurs long-term future was set, post Duncan. Imagine our young talent maturing with Kawhi at the core. And then, while we're starting to get back on our feet a little bit, Morris and Rich Paul comes in and kick us in the shin and knock us back down a notch. Spurs can't win dealing with fvcktards like that. Some teams are poorly managed and deserve that sort of treatment...the Spurs, on the other hand, have just had their future torpedoed by assholes.

Just a reminder that life ain't fair, tbh.

Meanwhile, the Lakers who have been astoundingly mismanaged and one of the worst organizations over the last 5 years end up with Lebron and Davis, and will have ring-chasers flocking to their door on shady, under-the-rug deals.

[Genovaswitness]

It sucks that a team like the Spurs, who have done everything right in order to build and maintain a winning roster, get totaled raped by Kawhi and Uncle Dennis. Essentially, the Spurs long-term future was set, post Duncan. Imagine our young talent maturing with Kawhi at the core. And then, while we're starting to get back on our feet a little bit, Morris and Rich Paul comes in and kick us in the shin and knock us back down a notch. Spurs can't win dealing with fvcktards like that. Some teams are poorly managed and deserve that sort of treatment...the Spurs, on the other hand, have just had their future torpedoed by assholes.

blame poop for not having that LOB mindset after 2014

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Just a reminder that life ain't fair, tbh.

Meanwhile, the Lakers who have been astoundingly mismanaged and one of the worst organizations over the last 5 years end up with Lebron and Davis, and will have ring-chasers flocking to their door on shady, under-the-rug deals.

It's funny, I used to be a huge college sports fan and booster/supporter, but saw the inequities first-hand of mid-major teams trying to compete with the bigger schools, and all of the preferential treatment the top conferences get from the NCAA. Basically that soured my taste for college sports over time, and now I really don't even follow college sports at all.

Now the NBA is reverting back to a league where only the major markets will compete for titles, similar to when I was a kid. The Spurs, somehow, broke that mold. It's been an amazing, amazing run, and the purity of how San Antonio built a championship culture without reverting to underhanded deals or preferential league treatment, and how guys like David, Tim, Manu and Tony put the team, and the city of San Antonio first, over and over again, was awesome to see. Really, the 3rd most likely NBA destination in the state of Texas, much less the NBA, became a dynasty as a result. I'm not sure we'll ever see anything like that again. It was incredible to witness.


And all of that is not to say that I'm not hoping for the Spurs to continue the tradition and return to the top of the mountain, but damn, you see how amazingly fortunate we were all those years. I have hopes for our young core to develop, but it's going to still take a superstar of the ilk of a Tim Duncan to make it all come together. This city has always been blessed with great players who loved the community, so we'll see. *fingers crossed*

[Mr. Body]

It's funny, I used to be a huge college sports fan and booster/supporter, but saw the inequities first-hand of mid-major teams trying to compete with the bigger schools, and all of the preferential treatment the top conferences get from the NCAA. Basically that soured my taste for college sports over time, and now I really don't even follow college sports at all.

Now the NBA is reverting back to a league where only the major markets will compete for titles, similar to when I was a kid. The Spurs, somehow, broke that mold. It's been an amazing, amazing run, and the purity of how San Antonio built a championship culture without reverting to underhanded deals or preferential league treatment, and how guys like David, Tim, Manu and Tony put the team, and the city of San Antonio first, over and over again, was awesome to see. Really, the 3rd most likely NBA destination in the state of Texas, much less the NBA, became a dynasty as a result. I'm not sure we'll ever see anything like that again. It was incredible to witness.


And all of that is not to say that I'm not hoping for the Spurs to continue the tradition and return to the top of the mountain, but damn, you see how amazingly fortunate we were all those years. I have hopes for our young core to develop, but it's going to still take a superstar of the ilk of a Tim Duncan to make it all come together. This city has always been blessed with great players who loved the community, so we'll see. *fingers crossed*

I'll mention that ESPN had a major role in spoiling college basketball. They favor teams and conferences enormously -- Kentucky, Duke, UNC, the ACC -- and essentially drive players onto those teams. They could give a shit about anybody else.

This same thing is infecting the NBA. Sure, ESPN has long been atrocious, but they've managed to play a role in busting small markets free from the narrative. They played an outsize role in steering Leonard to the Lakers, or very much trying to. It's amazing how many general fans still regurgitate the narratives they constructed.

[Marcus Bryant]

The Spurs are in such solid shape going forward, this is likely just a blip.

Morris reminded me of every other sluggish front-court FA that passed on the Spurs, from Lamond Murray on. (Gosh, the Spurs never recovered from that one.)

Lyles has the profile of every player the Spurs rescued from the scrap heap -- a failed prospect ready to work.

:tu

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

Good write up like usual.

Hopefully Lyles realizes that this might be his last step before being out of the NBA and comes into camp in shape and ready to learn. If he has that mindset he is going to be a good addition to this team. Hopefully he turns his career around for the better

[Marcus Bryant]

I'll mention that ESPN had a major role in spoiling college basketball. They favor teams and conferences enormously -- Kentucky, Duke, UNC, the ACC -- and essentially drive players onto those teams. They could give a shit about anybody else.

This same thing is infecting the NBA. Sure, ESPN has long been atrocious, but they've managed to play a role in busting small markets free from the narrative. They played an outsize role in steering Leonard to the Lakers, or very much trying to. It's amazing how many general fans still regurgitate the narratives they constructed.

ESPN paid eleventy trillion for the broadcast rights (which of course go into league revenues and then ultimately the players, it's why the cap has increased by 50% over the last few years) and needs its return. So, yes, no surprise they want large market teams to do well.

[Mr. Body]

ESPN paid eleventy trillion for the broadcast rights (which of course go into league revenues and then ultimately the players, it's why the cap has increased by 50% over the last few years) and needs its return. So, yes, no surprise they want large market teams to do well.

They're invested in the SEC football and ACC basketball and so drive those narratives. This last year all we heard was the Alabama Crimson Tide were possibly the greatest team ever, they could beat an NFL team. And Duke was possibly the greatest team ever and could go undefeated. Both teams' years ended in delightful misery.

This won't get any better, especially as the Mouse controls more and more of the sports/entertainment landscape.

[SpursDynasty85]

Well, going back to the Beli trade thread...the Spurs were apparently targeting a big who could shoot. Lyles kind of fits that mold...I guess? (Even with his atrocious .255 year last year, he averaged .381 just the year prior and is still a career .331 shooter from deep). Just have to hope he can have a bounce-back year, tbh.

The problem is now we still need to fill that defensive 3/4 void that Nephew (and now Morris) left wide-open, have less assets to do so, and the market has dried up.

I recall the thread just saying they were looking for a forward. Maybe that meant 4/5. If we kept Morris, that would've made sense, but seems Spurs legit knew Morris could bail so I imagine it was someone like him who could play some SF too.

[Russ]

Meanwhile, the Lakers who have been astoundingly mismanaged and one of the worst organizations over the last 5 years end up with Lebron and Davis, and will have ring-chasers flocking to their door on shady, under-the-rug deals.

The Lakers are fucked. They distilled 6 years of lottery picks down to Kyle Kuzma, a horrificly slow front court scorer.

They have no draft picks for the next 50 years or so.

They think Danny Green is some kind of savior (I live in LA and hear this on sportstalk radio). Danny Green?

The Lakers have little present and no future. They are such an important (but mismanaged) brand, at some point the League may have to step in.

[rjv]

morris was a salty player that the spurs could have used since they lack that in their overall persona, but he also seems like a total ass and not sure a team devoid of the sort of leadership that tim, manu or time once brought, as well as such a young roster, really needed that kind of personality in the locker room. if lyles can at least stretch the floor then i'd be overall okay with it, especially since it can be reasonably argued that morris was essentially nothing more than a tier three talent.

[lmbebo]

The Lakers are fucked. They distilled 6 years of lottery picks down to Kyle Kuzma, a horrificly slow front court scorer.

They have no draft picks for the next 50 years or so.

They think Danny Green is some kind of savior (I live in LA and hear this on sportstalk radio). Danny Green?

The Lakers have little present and no future. They are such an important (but mismanaged) brand, at some point the League may have to step in.

Millenial attitude towards things. Take care of today, buy ourselves out tomorrow.

[John B]

Millenial attitude towards things. Take care of today, buy ourselves out tomorrow.
Sounds a whole lot like Reaganomics also tbh

[GusT15]

The Lakers are fucked. They distilled 6 years of lottery picks down to Kyle Kuzma, a horrificly slow front court scorer.

They have no draft picks for the next 50 years or so.

They think Danny Green is some kind of savior (I live in LA and hear this on sportstalk radio). Danny Green?

The Lakers have little present and no future. They are such an important (but mismanaged) brand, at some point the League may have to step in.

A 32 year old Danny Green coming off a Championship season?

Having secured the last big payday of his career?

Paired in LA with LeBron and all the clubs he wants to spend his money on?

What could possibly go wrong????

(I think that's why they also got KCP and Avery Bradley at the 2-Danny Green will make a wonderful trade asset at the trade deadline for Marcus Morris)

[sasaint]

Excellent analysis. Thanks, timvp.

[LaMarcus Bryant]

Fuck LeBron's fraud sporting agency. Should not reward this crap, promote depth from within.

Good writeup tho LJ

[Mr. Body]

The Lakers are fucked. They distilled 6 years of lottery picks down to Kyle Kuzma, a horrificly slow front court scorer.

They have no draft picks for the next 50 years or so.

They think Danny Green is some kind of savior (I live in LA and hear this on sportstalk radio). Danny Green?

The Lakers have little present and no future. They are such an important (but mismanaged) brand, at some point the League may have to step in.

Klutch will steer their clients there, though. Look at what that dipshit GM did in Phoenix sending Tyson Chandler to LeBron, too.

[Truth4sale$]

Dont like the trey lyles signing at all, seems lazy and soft. I would have rather seen the spurs leave the slot open for somebody emerging from the Gleague or a buyout. What's done is done, hopefully the guy comes in with a great attitude and works his butt off. If not, he is likely Europe bound next year.

[Dverde]

Good read, thanks. Much happier with him than another combo guard.

[Killakobe81]

It's funny, I used to be a huge college sports fan and booster/supporter, but saw the inequities first-hand of mid-major teams trying to compete with the bigger schools, and all of the preferential treatment the top conferences get from the NCAA. Basically that soured my taste for college sports over time, and now I really don't even follow college sports at all.

Now the NBA is reverting back to a league where only the major markets will compete for titles, similar to when I was a kid. The Spurs, somehow, broke that mold. It's been an amazing, amazing run, and the purity of how San Antonio built a championship culture without reverting to underhanded deals or preferential league treatment, and how guys like David, Tim, Manu and Tony put the team, and the city of San Antonio first, over and over again, was awesome to see. Really, the 3rd most likely NBA destination in the state of Texas, much less the NBA, became a dynasty as a result. I'm not sure we'll ever see anything like that again. It was incredible to witness.


And all of that is not to say that I'm not hoping for the Spurs to continue the tradition and return to the top of the mountain, but damn, you see how amazingly fortunate we were all those years. I have hopes for our young core to develop, but it's going to still take a superstar of the ilk of a Tim Duncan to make it all come together. This city has always been blessed with great players who loved the community, so we'll see. *fingers crossed*

As a Lakers fan...
Spurs have everything needed outside the superstar... Kawhi was that guy and they are not easy to find...
Spurs still have great culture, a strong front office, ownership and a smallish but rabid fanbase.

Eff the paranoid Lakerhatin prick section of your base... But most of yall deserve better.

[rjv]

found lyles' old drafta analysis for what it's worth. seems his shot has always lacked consistency but the potential has always been there. doesn't seem as if he'll be much better than bertans was on the defensive side of the ball, except that he has great length.

https://www.nbadraft.net/players/trey-lyles

[Mugen]

As a Lakers fan...
Spurs have everything needed outside the superstar... Kawhi was that guy and they are not easy to find...
Spurs still have great culture, a strong front office, ownership and a smallish but rabid fanbase.

Eff the paranoid Lakerhatin prick section of your base... But most of yall deserve better.

https://media.giphy.com/media/wViS9n0RqN2/giphy.gif

[SAGirl]

As a Lakers fan...
Spurs have everything needed outside the superstar... Kawhi was that guy and they are not easy to find...
Spurs still have great culture, a strong front office, ownership and a smallish but rabid fanbase.

Eff the paranoid Lakerhatin prick section of your base... But most of yall deserve better.
:bobo:cheer:clap:rollin

[SAGirl]

found lyles' old drafta analysis for what it's worth. seems his shot has always lacked consistency but the potential has always been there. doesn't seem as if he'll be much better than bertans was on the defensive side of the ball, except that he has great length.

https://www.nbadraft.net/players/trey-lyles
He rebounds much better from my recollection. Overall if he could shoot at his 38% rate he has the "potential" to be better. If he can't shoot though he'll be out of the league after this deal. He's very niche and is not good at his one niche. He can bounce back for sure. I am wondering what happened to his shot. The yips? Some injury? Being lazy? Depressed bc he didn't like Denver after all? Question marks.

[exstatic]

Sounds a whole lot like Reaganomics also tbh

:lol I was going to say Boomers, not Millenials.

[rjv]

He rebounds much better from my recollection. Overall if he could shoot at his 38% rate he has the "potential" to be better. If he can't shoot though he'll be out of the league after this deal. He's very niche and is not good at his one niche. He can bounce back for sure. I am wondering what happened to his shot. The yips? Some injury? Being lazy? Depressed bc he didn't like Denver after all? Question marks.

that's the million dollar question. hopefully, it's something that chip can fix, because if he can at least be a stretch, as you mentioned, then he could contribute.

[beirmeistr]

looked at some of his highlights on youtube---sorry but i can't embed them here---and he reminds me of kyle anderson on offense but with better mobility.

[JADG79]

The Spurs need to be in the CP3 to Miami conversation, they could acquire a Miami forward in exchange for Marco, Patty or Bryn

[Killakobe81]

The Lakers are fucked. They distilled 6 years of lottery picks down to Kyle Kuzma, a horrificly slow front court scorer.

They have no draft picks for the next 50 years or so.

They think Danny Green is some kind of savior (I live in LA and hear this on sportstalk radio). Danny Green?

The Lakers have little present and no future. They are such an important (but mismanaged) brand, at some point the League may have to step in.

They have their pick next year and every other year after...

[Russ]

They have their pick next year and every other year after...

Every other year they get the lower of their pick and OKC's. (But yeah I exaggerated.)

[Big P]

The Spurs need to be in the CP3 to Miami conversation, they could acquire a Miami forward in exchange for Marco, Patty or Bryn

Nobody is going to help us out by giving us a young prospect for mills contract...OKC and MIA would just cut us out and deal directly.

[spurs10]

The Spurs need to be in the CP3 to Miami conversation, they could acquire a Miami forward in exchange for Marco, Patty or Bryn Yeah sounds good. Chinook was just talking about maybe a Mills trade for James Johnson.

[tbdog]

I'm a fan of James Johnson game and would welcome him.

[offset formation]

https://www.spurstalk.com/trey-lyles-signs-spurs-marcus-morris-reneges/

Unfortunate situation. There's a chance it works out long-term but the team's chances for next season took a hit with this news...

:bobo

[Killakobe81]

Every other year they get the lower of their pick and OKC's. (But yeah I exaggerated.)

Nola.. But I get what u meant.

[mclovin20]

I'm sorry butt i am pretty stoned and cannot crack the acronym LOB can you tell me

[buujness]

LOB=Larry O'Brien

[spurs10]

"However, it makes sense to continue to try to improve the team. It’s possible the Spurs could find a trade that would help more closely replace what Morris would have brought to the table." LJ Ellis

It seems like it was natural for everyone to think of Lyles as a substitute for Morris when he probably was just someone there after the horrible "renege" as you politely call it. Like 'may as well, Bertans is gone.' Bertans had a rough season, so maybe Lyles as a shot blocker and defender in the paint can bring us something. Chip needs to put him to work.

Anyway I see it as more easy to understand that Morris' substitute is still out there. We might even get a better fit with a trade down the line. Thanks for all the info here nonetheless.

[spurs10]

I'm sorry butt i am pretty stoned and cannot crack the acronym LOB can you tell me


LOB=Larry O'Brien
:lobt2:

[heyheymymy]

Silver thinks small markets are bleeding and he is phasing them out. Look at SA,NOLA, CLE etc. He is stealing every star from small markets, sending them to huge markets and then when the small market teams fail he will dissolve them or send them to another bigger city.

I'm done with this shit. Just unsubscribed from r/ nba.

One thing I will say is thank you for 2014, silver. Stern would have never allowed that.

[gerald]

https://www.denverstiffs.com/2018/12/27/18156786/the-denver-nuggets-have-a-big-decision-looming-with-trey-lyles

"At the same time, it’s always tough to cut ties with a talented player who is still coming into his own. Lyles is just 23 years old. 6’10” prospects who can post up, rebound, and put the ball on the floor are hard to come by."

a hungry Lyles will prove better than a morris

https://www.denverstiffs.com/2018/12/27/18156786/the-denver-nuggets-have-a-big-decision-looming-with-trey-lyles

[gerald]

From https://milehighsports.com/season-in-review-trey-lyles-and-his-year-of-regression/:

ConsistencyWhen Millsap went down with a left wrist injury that sat him down for more than half of the 2017-18 season, Lyles was quickly catapulted into a scenario where he would have to play meaningful minutes.
Despite only starting in two games, Lyles finished third amongst bench players in minutes played behind only Will Barton (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bartowi01.html?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker-) and Mason Plumlee (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/plumlma01.html?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker-). Lyles made the most of his minutes.
With Millsap fully healthy this past season those minutes were not readily available and Lyles’ consistency disappeared.
Prior to the All-Star break, Lyles was having another productive season in a limited role. In 55 games, he was averaging 18.6 minutes per game which led to averages of 9.2 points, 4.1 rebounds and 1.4 assists per game. Still, while his raw per-game averages were strong, his issues with consistently knocking down shots remained as he shot 42.3% from the field.
After the All-Star break; however, is when things got shaky for the fourth-year forward. After playing in 55 games before the break Lyles was effectively removed from the rotation entirely and proceeded to only play in nine more games.
In those nine contests, Lyles only played 10.7 minutes and saw his numbers drop drastically. He put up a meager 4.3 points, 2.6 rebounds and 1.1 assists per game while shooting a brutal 35.9% from the field. A part of the drop off was the fact that Lyles was fighting through injuries, including a hamstring injury in February which ultimately led to his removal from the rotation.
Lyles still has not proven that he can be a floor spacer with size and a volume rebounder at the NBA level. He has the skill set to still become the multifaceted forward so many envisioned, but if Lyles is to reach that level, he will need to have a big bounce-back season in 2019-20/

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

I'm done with this shit. Just unsubscribed from r/ nba.

:wow :wow :lol :wow :wow

[gerald]

http://www.sportsforecaster.com/nba/player/3869:

"Smooth, quick, and skilled for a big man. Possesses a center's length yet has the overall game of a small forward. Shows good instincts & quickness to score over and around opponents. Has a nice shooting stroke. Runs the floor like a guard. Flashes solid defensive upside. Raw overall. Doesn't make nearly as much use of his great length and reach as he could, especially defensively. Lacks muscle mass and can be pushed around in the post, limiting him as a rebounder and shot-blocker. Could be more of a passer considering his hands."

[SAGirl]

From https://milehighsports.com/season-in-review-trey-lyles-and-his-year-of-regression/:

Consistency

When Millsap went down with a left wrist injury that sat him down for more than half of the 2017-18 season, Lyles was quickly catapulted into a scenario where he would have to play meaningful minutes.
Despite only starting in two games, Lyles finished third amongst bench players in minutes played behind only Will Barton (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bartowi01.html?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker-) and Mason Plumlee (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/plumlma01.html?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker-). Lyles made the most of his minutes.
With Millsap fully healthy this past season those minutes were not readily available and Lyles’ consistency disappeared.
Prior to the All-Star break, Lyles was having another productive season in a limited role. In 55 games, he was averaging 18.6 minutes per game which led to averages of 9.2 points, 4.1 rebounds and 1.4 assists per game. Still, while his raw per-game averages were strong, his issues with consistently knocking down shots remained as he shot 42.3% from the field.
After the All-Star break; however, is when things got shaky for the fourth-year forward. After playing in 55 games before the break Lyles was effectively removed from the rotation entirely and proceeded to only play in nine more games.
In those nine contests, Lyles only played 10.7 minutes and saw his numbers drop drastically. He put up a meager 4.3 points, 2.6 rebounds and 1.1 assists per game while shooting a brutal 35.9% from the field. A part of the drop off was the fact that Lyles was fighting through injuries, including a hamstring injury in February which ultimately led to his removal from the rotation.
Lyles still has not proven that he can be a floor spacer with size and a volume rebounder at the NBA level. He has the skill set to still become the multifaceted forward so many envisioned, but if Lyles is to reach that level, he will need to have a big bounce-back season in 2019-20/
Thanks for this. It at least explains his regression as a consequence of a hamstring injury. As the article says even when healthy he was not a fully “realized” talent but at least he should be expected to be better than last season when fully healthy.

[Fusternino]

So what's this talk of him being too skinny to play C? Also, his rebounding per 36 was lower than all of Jokic, Plumlee and Milsap last year by a wide margin.

[Blackhaus]

Wow, Joel Myers on NBA radio actual talked about the Morris situation and broke it all down and talked about how shady the knicks, Morris and Paul were. First time I’ve heard it talked about and how shitty they handled it. Was nice to here from an outside media person.

[Russ]

Wow, Joel Myers on NBA radio actual talked about the Morris situation and broke it all down and talked about how shady the knicks, Morris and Paul were. First time I’ve heard it talked about and how shitty they handled it. Was nice to here from an outside media person.

However, Joel was the Spurs TV announcer, including the 2003 championship year, for a few years (before the Lakers lured him away).

[Solid D]

This may become a blessing for the Spurs, as sad as it makes me to see Bertans so easily gifted away before contracts were signed. The Spurs now have an even deeper team with loads of options to put on the floor. They should be markedly better defensively. Non-trolls should NOT underestimate the Spurs’ ability to develop players. (BTW, the Austin Spurs should be really good.)
This is not like the Scola debacle.

[Russ]

This may become a blessing for the Spurs, as sad as it makes me to see Bertans so easily gifted away before contracts were signed.

I think the Spurs are fine with losing Bertans, the player (as opposed to Bertans the person).

The Spurs were in a dilemma -- they had given up on Bertans but liked the guy. If they trade him for nothing (just to get rid of him), it looks bad and it's insulting to a player they don't want to insult.

The Morris deal allows the Spurs to say "we had to do it to make the trade work."

The Spurs probably wanted Morris more than Lyles but I doubt they're really sorry about any of this.

They got rid of Bertans in a face-saving way (for both Bertans and the Spurs). That had independent value to them even if they didn't get Morris in the end.

[Blackhaus]

However, Joel was the Spurs TV announcer, including the 2003 championship year, for a few years (before the Lakers lured him away).

Understood, wasn’t questioning that. It’s just the first time I’ve actually heard someone talk about it and show it for what actually happened instead of espn slurping on the knicks balls. He had a cohost with him (not sure who but former upper office person on a team) and said it was very unethical and bad on everyone involved on the other side of the spurs. It was just nice to hear someone other than ST realizing how bad a situation it was.

[Truth4sale$]

Watched some YouTube highlights of trey lydes in some good games against the Clippers and Detroit last year, there is some offensive talent. Showed good movement without the ball, running the floor, and confidence in his shot, even from beyond the arch. Never seemed to hesitate and passed the ball around. Nothing defensively stands out. Might just need a chance and commit to defense. I can see him in a lineup with either Poeltl or Aldridge at center, Lyles as a power forward, Caroll, Walker, and Derrick White. Might be a good signing, but he cant be on the floor with non defenders such as DeRozan or Belineli and Forbes, because he brings nothing defensively himself or the ability to clean up others mistakes despite his size from what I see.

[Fusternino]

Can he play center? That would be redeeming if he could.

[picnroll]

Since Lyles played with two coaches with good reputations for developing defense without great success this will be an interesting test of Pops defensive teaching chops. He did a solid job with Kyle Anderson.

[Mr. Body]

Since Lyles played with two coaches with good reputations for developing defense without great success this will be an interesting test of Pops defensive teaching chops. He did a solid job with Kyle Anderson.

Yeah, but KA actually worked hard and wanted to be a good defender.

[picnroll]

Yeah, but KA actually worked hard and wanted to be a good defender.
Hence it’s a test for Pop.

[RC_Drunkford]

Wow, Joel Myers on NBA radio actual talked about the Morris situation and broke it all down and talked about how shady the knicks, Morris and Paul were. First time I’ve heard it talked about and how shitty they handled it. Was nice to here from an outside media person.

what exactly did he say`?

[cutewizard]

:fro

[buujness]

Can he play center? That would be redeeming if he could.
In watching one of the highlight clips, he was playing small-ball 5. That being said, he's probably the third option at both the 4 and the 5, so it's not like he's all that helpful in the playoffs, just that he's useful depth at the two positions.

[Marcus Bryant]

I think the Spurs are fine with losing Bertans, the player (as opposed to Bertans the person).

The Spurs were in a dilemma -- they had given up on Bertans but liked the guy. If they trade him for nothing (just to get rid of him), it looks bad and it's insulting to a player they don't want to insult.

The Morris deal allows the Spurs to say "we had to do it to make the trade work."

The Spurs probably wanted Morris more than Lyles but I doubt they're really sorry about any of this.

They got rid of Bertans in a face-saving way (for both Bertans and the Spurs). That had independent value to them even if they didn't get Morris in the end.

Agreed. Otherwise that's another $7 to 10 million which is earmarked.

[Biggems]

As a Lakers fan...
Spurs have everything needed outside the superstar... Kawhi was that guy and they are not easy to find...
Spurs still have great culture, a strong front office, ownership and a smallish but rabid fanbase.

Eff the paranoid Lakerhatin prick section of your base... But most of yall deserve better.

The entire fanbase hates the Lakers, and for good reason. We are the Celtics of the West as far as rivalry with the Lakers goes. I am not sure, but I am willing to surmise that Laker fans hate the Spurs more than any other West franchise......and it comes down to respect. You guys respect or existence and our ability to bring it to you like no other team in the West has. Sure, you may hate other fanbases far more, but not actual teams. I know I hate the Lakers the most. I respect the history, but damn I hate the arrogance, though earned by great success. I hate Boston too, but they are not 2nd....that goes to the POS Rockets, who I have no respect for at all. When the Jazz had Malone, I hated them more than any other team, the Bulls up there in the 90s.

[SAGirl]

Watched some YouTube highlights of trey lydes in some good games against the Clippers and Detroit last year, there is some offensive talent. Showed good movement without the ball, running the floor, and confidence in his shot, even from beyond the arch. Never seemed to hesitate and passed the ball around. Nothing defensively stands out. Might just need a chance and commit to defense. I can see him in a lineup with either Poeltl or Aldridge at center, Lyles as a power forward, Caroll, Walker, and Derrick White. Might be a good signing, but he cant be on the floor with non defenders such as DeRozan or Belineli and Forbes, because he brings nothing defensively himself or the ability to clean up others mistakes despite his size from what I see.
This is a good evaluation. :tu If he regains the shooting touch I agree. In the playoffs lack of toughness is exposed though so his minutes might be cut.

[SAGirl]

I think the Spurs are fine with losing Bertans, the player (as opposed to Bertans the person).

The Spurs were in a dilemma -- they had given up on Bertans but liked the guy. If they trade him for nothing (just to get rid of him), it looks bad and it's insulting to a player they don't want to insult.

The Morris deal allows the Spurs to say "we had to do it to make the trade work."

The Spurs probably wanted Morris more than Lyles but I doubt they're really sorry about any of this.

They got rid of Bertans in a face-saving way (for both Bertans and the Spurs). That had independent value to them even if they didn't get Morris in the end.
this is a good hypothesis. It would explain them not being so upset as to blacklist Rich Paul (It wouldn't be wise either as has been discussed) but it's easier to swallow nd they had already explored trades for Davis and didn't find any they liked, but they were looking to move him.

Davis has a few hard core fans here, but the Spurs were ready to move on from him bottom line and Davis also expressed some dissatisfaction with his playing time and role so he's probably looking forward to the move to a team where he will get more opportunities presumably. He didn't seem surprised at this move or upset, was very gracious about his opportunity with the Spurs...

[duncan2k5]

The Spurs are in such solid shape going forward, this is likely just a blip.

Morris reminded me of every other sluggish front-court FA that passed on the Spurs, from Lamond Murray on. (Gosh, the Spurs never recovered from that one.)

Lyles has the profile of every player the Spurs rescued from the scrap heap -- a failed prospect ready to work.

Is he tho? I heard his work ethic is trash

[buujness]

Upon further reflection, I do find it interesting that the Spurs signed Lyles to the same amount of money per year that they were reportedly willing to give to Kyle Anderson. If I may put on my rose-tinted and tastefully-perfumed glasses, perhaps the coaching staff feels that they can turn Lyles into a facsimile of what Anderson was/is defensively, as their body types/skillsets are quite similar (with Lyles being more athletic).

In the highly unlikely scenario where the coaches and Lyles himself are able to turn Lyles into a more athletic Anderson on defense, then he becomes a more interesting pickup.

[Rockdoc]

It sucks that a team like the Spurs, who have done everything right in order to build and maintain a winning roster, get totaled raped by Kawhi and Uncle Dennis. Essentially, the Spurs long-term future was set, post Duncan. Imagine our young talent maturing with Kawhi at the core. And then, while we're starting to get back on our feet a little bit, Morris and Rich Paul comes in and kick us in the shin and knock us back down a notch. Spurs can't win dealing with fvcktards like that. Some teams are poorly managed and deserve that sort of treatment...the Spurs, on the other hand, have just had their future torpedoed by assholes.

agree. its frustrating and the spurs and their fans dont deserve it

[Mr. Body]

Upon further reflection, I do find it interesting that the Spurs signed Lyles to the same amount of money per year that they were reportedly willing to give to Kyle Anderson. If I may put on my rose-tinted and tastefully-perfumed glasses, perhaps the coaching staff feels that they can turn Lyles into a facsimile of what Anderson was/is defensively, as their body types/skillsets are quite similar (with Lyles being more athletic).

In the highly unlikely scenario where the coaches and Lyles himself are able to turn Lyles into a more athletic Anderson on defense, then he becomes a more interesting pickup.

Wonder if they'd rather have Anderson. Scoring isn't nearly the problem it was back then, especially from the perimeter and now they're facing Kawhi Leonard four times a year. Could use a long perimeter defender.

[slick'81]

Wonder if they'd rather have Anderson. Scoring isn't nearly the problem it was back then, especially from the perimeter and now they're facing Kawhi Leonard four times a year. Could use a long perimeter defender.


5.5 isnt near 9.2

[Mr. Body]

5.5 isnt near 9.2

What are you talking about and what do you think you're talking about?

[buujness]

Wonder if they'd rather have Anderson. Scoring isn't nearly the problem it was back then, especially from the perimeter and now they're facing Kawhi Leonard four times a year. Could use a long perimeter defender.
I think that they'd love to have Anderson...at Lyles's price point. I don't think that they really miss him at 9 million a year.

[K...]

I think that they'd love to have Anderson...at Lyles's price point. I don't think that they really miss him at 9 million a year.

I do think kyle is proven skill and Lyle is speculative. So you pay 5 for maybe light defense and maybe good shooting or 9 for guaranteed defense and guaranteed poor shooting.

[Mr. Body]

I think that they'd love to have Anderson...at Lyles's price point. I don't think that they really miss him at 9 million a year.

Considering Lyles projects to be Ayres 2.0, I'd bump that salary to get an actually useful player.

[buujness]

I do think kyle is proven skill and Lyle is speculative. So you pay 5 for maybe light defense and maybe good shooting or 9 for guaranteed defense and guaranteed poor shooting.
You just said it: guaranteed poor shooting. I'm a fan of Kyle, but it's hard to survive in today's NBA if you're a forward who doesn't shoot. Hence the desire for him at 5 million decreasing rapidly at 9 million.

It's a gamble, most definitely.

[buujness]

Considering Lyles projects to be Ayres 2.0, I'd bump that salary to get an actually useful player.

Eh, the fact that Lyles knows how to use opposable thumbs makes him better than Ayres, IMO.

[spurs10]

Lyles won't be in the top 10. He'll hopefully get a shot at playing some minute, but he won' be a replacement for Morris which is good for others.

[vavvi]

Lyles won't be in the top 10. He'll hopefully get a shot at playing some minute, but he won' be a replacement for Morris which is good for others.

Yeah Morris-Lyles events basically mean DDR is back as a full-time SF.
If Morris were here we would probably see a lot of DDR-Morris-Gay(Carroll) lineups meaning DDR at 2.
Now it's gone, Lyles is a 3rd PF behind Gay and Carroll.

[venitian navigator]

For what I red, Lyles problems are his injuries and his head (will to sacrifice and improve)...not his talent (that is a lottery talent) or his feel for the game (the kid can obviously play). He can play the three front court roles, to the point he played sf also before being draft-picked...and has the body to play also small ball c. He can pass the ball and has a good shoot movement, also is not afraid to shoot...and talking about defense he has quite the same body of Kyle but a lot more athletic...so looks like improving on defense can be possible.
That said, the contract is clearly a sort of last chance for him to revitalize his career and clean his image buying in our system after a very bad season and a market quite totally dry for him...and a chance to be a long term part of our organization. If he'll have the humility to understand that and act of consequence he has everything for becoming good to very good for us...otherwise his entire career will be put in grave danger (and for an ex top 12 draft pick that would mean a big failure).

[monty4329]

For what I red, Lyles problems are his injuries and his head (will to sacrifice and improve)...not his talent (that is a lottery talent) or his feel for the game (the kid can obviously play). He can play the three front court roles, to the point he played sf also before being draft-picked...and has the body to play also small ball c. He can pass the ball and has a good shoot movement, also is not afraid to shoot...and talking about defense he has quite the same body of Kyle but a lot more athletic...so looks like improving on defense can be possible.
That said, the contract is clearly a sort of last chance for him to revitalize his career and clean his image buying in our system after a very bad season and a market quite totally dry for him...and a chance to be a long term part of our organization. If he'll have the humility to understand that and act of consequence he has everything for becoming good to very good for us...otherwise his entire career will be put in grave danger (and for an ex top 12 draft pick that would mean a big failure).

I think spending that kind of money on a reclamation project, wich probably will have zero impact on his first year is quite incomprehensible. I'd rather keep the money for an eventual buyout in case we have a great season and need a veteran for a deep run in the PO. If we have a poor season, then play Walker (although I don't see what apparently everybody is seeing in him).

PATFO doesn't panick, but this to me smells like a rushed, panick driven move. I'd almost rather sign Melo....

[RC_Drunkford]

I think spending that kind of money on a reclamation project, wich probably will have zero impact on his first year is quite incomprehensible. I'd rather keep the money for an eventual buyout in case we have a great season and need a veteran for a deep run in the PO. If we have a poor season, then play Walker (although I don't see what apparently everybody is seeing in him).

PATFO doesn't panick, but this to me smells like a rushed, panick driven move. I'd almost rather sign Melo....

doesn't really make a difference tbh. Most teams can only offer the Minimum, Spurs can still offer 4.2 Million. That's more than enough to sign a buyout

[BackHome]

If he comes in thinking he is going to get major minutes and then cash in on free agency it will end very badly for him. If he comes in thinking he wants to be a better player and a better teammate then he could have a nice career.

[DPG21920]

Confirmed: flat 2/11 (so 5.5M per year) and 1M partial year 2. Stupid contract but whatever

[MultiTroll]

front page articles
timvp on the front page articles, for example Final Spurs Summer League Stats And Grades.

Are the faces at the bottom asking us to react to what you as the writer wrote? Or the subject matter, what we ourselves think about the subject?

Example we think you wrote a great article so give it a smiley face 100%
Or we think the Spurs had an average summer league regardless of what you wrote therefore give it the 50/50 rated face?

[timvp]

timvp on the front page articles, for example Final Spurs Summer League Stats And Grades.

Are the faces at the bottom asking us to react to what you as the writer wrote? Or the subject matter, what we ourselves think about the subject?

Example we think you wrote a great article so give it a smiley face 100%
Or we think the Spurs had an average summer league regardless of what you wrote therefore give it the 50/50 rated face?


Hmm. Good q. We'll leave that open to interpretation, tbh.

[timvp]

Confirmed: flat 2/11 (so 5.5M per year) and 1M partial year 2. Stupid contract but whatever

That's a fine contract, IMO. Based on comparable players (Kaminsky, J. Green, Kanter, etc), I had Lyles pegged at being worth between $6 million and $9 million over two years. Getting him for $6.5 million is on the low end of that and $1 million (at worst) dead money is tiny. The chances that comes back to bite the Spurs are pretty microscopic, tbh.

[DPG21920]

That's a fine contract, IMO. Based on comparable players (Kaminsky, J. Green, Kanter, etc), I had Lyles pegged at being worth between $6 million and $9 million over two years. Getting him for $6.5 million is on the low end of that and $1 million (at worst) dead money is tiny. The chances that comes back to bite the Spurs are pretty microscopic, tbh.

Be that as it may, there is zero reason for a player of Lyles abilities, that there should be any chance it comes back to hurt SA.

What reason would there be not to give him all the money in Year 1 where you know it won’t hurt you for sure? There is none. Has nothing to do with the amount of money he’s being paid total; its the contract structure (and honestly he should not be more than 4M per year)

[Spursfanfromafar]

Folks are going to be surprised by Lyles. I think he had a bad situation last year with the Nuggets with injuries, backing up Jokic and not getting to play much and so on. I suspect he will improve for sure this season and will contribute to the Spurs squad. His game translates well to the Spurs system. And he will fit well with Poeltl/ Aldridge.

[Mr. Body]

I'm prepared to not be surprised by Lyles. He is who he is, a lazy dude who shat the bed at two pretty good franchises in Utah and Denver and is a lot closer to being out of this league than he thinks.

[ginobilized]

Who has the scoop on Reggie Bullock's new contract?
Wondering how they healed his plantar fasciitis and how much they charged him.

[Tailboar]

Reggie Bullock has officially signed his two-year deal with the Knicks.


Bullock initially agreed to a two-year, $21 million deal with the Knicks, but after an unanticipated health issue was discovered during his physical, the Knicks and Bullock re-worked the deal on a more team-friendly salary. He reportedly signed for less than the $4.7 million exception and his contract has a player option on Year-2, but we still don't know exactly what ailment he's dealing with.

Free agent forward Reggie Bullock (https://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/2528779/reggie-bullock) has signed a two-year, $8.2 million deal with the New York Knicks (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/ny/new-york-knicks), his agent David Bauman told ESPN's Adrian Wojnarowski on Tuesday.

[kobyz]

...

[Spursfanfromafar]

Folks are going to be surprised by Lyles. I think he had a bad situation last year with the Nuggets with injuries, backing up Jokic and not getting to play much and so on. I suspect he will improve for sure this season and will contribute to the Spurs squad. His game translates well to the Spurs system. And he will fit well with Poeltl/ Aldridge.

Too early? yes. But still, I told you so.