[OFFICIAL] Matrix 4

[djohn2oo8]

1163906114984894464

[FrostKing]

Excited but cautious

[Chris]

Don't hold your breath with trannies at the helm. It's going to be loaded with SJW bullshit :tu

[MultiTroll]

Don't hold your breath with trannies at the helm. It's going to be loaded with SJW bullshit :tu
Trailer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8f0ydqTUi0c

[Spurtacular]

Don't hold your breath with trannies at the helm. It's going to be loaded with SJW bullshit :tu

Yea, I don't think they'll be able to help themselves.

[Reck]

Interesting to see how Keanu will approach the role of Neo this time around.

He’s come a long ways on putting on a convincing act. Much more rounded as an actor now.

No high expectations from me but I’m gonna watch this for sure.

[Trainwreck2100]

Who wanted this after how much they completely fucked the last 2 movies

[TimmyBuckets]

Fuck ya.

[Texas_Ranger]

this shit will suck... Should have ended after 1.

[Reck]

Who wanted this after how much they completely fucked the last 2 movies

I'd take a franchise reboot over what Hollywood has been doing for the past 10 years. So much unoriginally and just copy/paste from books.

[Pavlov]

They lost me halfway through the second one. Seems unnecessary. I'd really rather watch another Speed Racer movie tbh.

Keanu is freaking ageless and Moss still looks good if not leather pants good. Everyone else looks a billion years old by comparison.

[leemajors]

I'd take a franchise reboot over what Hollywood has been doing for the past 10 years. So much unoriginally and just copy/paste from books.

there have been a lot of reboots/remakes over the last ten years, this makes zero sense.

[spurraider21]

I'd take a franchise reboot over what Hollywood has been doing for the past 10 years. So much unoriginally and just copy/paste from books.
so you are tired of unoriginality and therefore want a reboot? what?

[LaMarcus Bryant]

I'd take a franchise reboot over what Hollywood has been doing for the past 10 years. So much unoriginally and just copy/paste from books.

Originality? The entire matrix shtick is a huge rip off of Grant Morrisons "The Invisibles"

[lefty]

Matrix 1 was just right
Neo was the One , story had an ending , it was perfect

Matrix 2 was unnecessary, but you know, $$$$$$
However, it was interesting to see more of the Matrix world, and the action sequences were just AMAZING

[lefty]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ix7TUGVYIo

[NASpurs]

Neo John Wick


Already looks better than Matrix 2 and 3 which isn't saying much but I'm interested.

[FrostKing]

Trailer makes me think Prequel

[timtonymanu]

I'm probably the only one that thought the 1st Matrix was just ... alright lol. Didn't care for 2 and 3. Not necessarily excited about this one but it could be good.

[lefty]

I'm probably the only one that thought the 1st Matrix was just ... alright lol. Didn't care for 2 and 3. Not necessarily excited about this one but it could be good.

The 2nd one wasn't necessary because the 1st one had an end, Neo was the One, the prophecy is fulfilled etc


But at the same time I felt the 2nd one was interesting because we got to see more of the Matrix - the other programs, the Architect , etc
And the 2nd one also had the best action sequences of the trilogy, they were just f***ing amazing

The 3rd one, meh..... Smith turning into Mega Smith was a bit much lol

[DMX7]

CAN NOT WAIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[lefty]

By the way NPH's glasses are blue and the Oracle's (thats' her right? there is also a theory that she is an older Sati) are red
Obvious detail is obvious lol

[DMC]

The 1st one was a reveal that, if you didn't get a spoiler, pushed you back in your seat a little and you had to adjust your thinking. The rest were trying to live up to that and didn't. The 3rd was sappy and silly as fuck.

[Trainwreck2100]

The 2nd one wasn't necessary because the 1st one had an end, Neo was the One, the prophecy is fulfilled etc


But at the same time I felt the 2nd one was interesting because we got to see more of the Matrix - the other programs, the Architect , etc
And the 2nd one also had the best action sequences of the trilogy, they were just f***ing amazing

The 3rd one, meh..... Smith turning into Mega Smith was a bit much lol

the fact that the other two were so shit makes me believe the story that they stole the story from somebody.

[Reck]

Did Fishburne not want to come back for this one so they had to settle for a lite?

Pretty long trailer, tbh. Hope they didn't give everything away.

[lefty]

Damn I didn’t recognize Jessica Henwick :lol

[redzero]

the fact that the other two were so shit makes me believe the story that they stole the story from somebody.

They stole the story from The Invisibles by Grant Morrison.

My question is whether the sequels sucked because the Wachowski Bros were sissy hyno'd or because they ran out of material to steal? Both?

[Texas_Ranger]

there is only one matrix movie.

[koriwhat]

there is only one matrix movie.

And we're living in it! :lol

[DMX7]

Did Fishburne not want to come back for this one so they had to settle for a lite?

Pretty long trailer, tbh. Hope they didn't give everything away.

It puts a small dent in the nostalgic vibe but not much. Neo is the star.

[Chucho]

If movies were descriptions for people, Matrix is right up there with Fast and Furious camp for males who wore Tap Out and Affliction shirts. The types that have hard times coping with middle age but get wet when 90s and 00s numetal bands reunite.

[koriwhat]

1st one was cool... Those trannies suck at sequels though.

[DMC]

the fact that the other two were so shit makes me believe the story that they stole the story from somebody.

A bit like the spot in Dusk to Dawn where Tarantino stopped and Rodriguez took over?

[DMC]

They stole the story from The Invisibles by Grant Morrison.

My question is whether the sequels sucked because the Wachowski Bros were sissy hyno'd or because they ran out of material to steal? Both?

The 1st one was a breakthrough in filming, editing, costume design, CGI and score. The acting was average at best. Elements of the film can be found in earlier films. The movie still serves as the benchmark for ground breaking cinematography. However once the cat was out of the bag and the shroud was removed, the story itself became tedious with a predictable ending for anyone who's familiar with the Christian belief system. You can only go back to that camera trick well so many times. You can only have the Dragonball Z fight so many times. Eventually we aren't impressed by agents flying across the room or taking over the bodies of people, especially in such a cardboard world they were in.

[Borosai]

Clear cash grab, but maybe it won't suck.

[Spurtacular]

Don't hold your breath with trannies at the helm. It's going to be loaded with SJW bullshit :tu

:lol Eyup.

[Adam Lambert]

Watched the original Matrix for the first time in a long time last night and it doesn't hold up.

It's style over substance, and the problem with that is that style gets dated. The story, dialogue, and acting are all pretty bad at best, laughably bad at worst.

[Adam Lambert]

Several times I laughed out loud during my rewatch last night:

- The industrial/goth rave with a bunch of super serious, dangerous looking people dancing to Rob Zombie's "Dragula"
- Whatever the fuck Keanu is doing before each of his martial arts fights
- "Tank, Dozer, Mouse, Switch, Cypher, Apoc"
- "Not like this"
- Trinity, a badass independent fighting chick and a leader within the group, falls in love with Neo after knowing him for like a week (maybe more, depending on how long he was in a coma) and this is the big reveal at the film's climax.
- Rage Against the Machine leads into the end credits. Could they be more on-the-nose?
- Thinking about the fact that there are still men in their 40's and 50's who think this is a great movie.

[Xevious]

Several times I laughed out loud during my rewatch last night:

- The industrial/goth rave with a bunch of super serious, dangerous looking people dancing to Rob Zombie's "Dragula"
- Whatever the fuck Keanu is doing before each of his martial arts fights
- "Tank, Dozer, Mouse, Switch, Cypher, Apoc"
- "Not like this"
- Trinity, a badass independent fighting chick and a leader within the group, falls in love with Neo after knowing him for like a week (maybe more, depending on how long he was in a coma) and this is the big reveal at the film's climax.
- Rage Against the Machine leads into the end credits. Could they be more on-the-nose?
- Thinking about the fact that there are still men in their 40's and 50's who think this is a great movie.
I think a lot of what DMC said is pretty accurate. The first movie was a big deal at the time of its release. The camera work, special effects, and story really set the bar. The fact that it doesn't really hold up is beside the point.

That said, I'll watch Matrix 4 on HBO, but wouldn't spend a dime otherwise to see it.

[Adam Lambert]

I think a lot of what DMC said is pretty accurate. The first movie was a big deal at the time of its release. The camera work, special effects, and story really set the bar. The fact that it doesn't really hold up is beside the point.

That said, I'll watch Matrix 4 on HBO, but wouldn't spend a dime otherwise to see it.

Sure and it's fine to appreciate it on a purely technical level, but that goes back to my point that style and special effects don't tend to hold up over time. It was certainly innovative, though it probably lead to more bad stylistic choices in future films than good ones.

[DMC]

Sure and it's fine to appreciate it on a purely technical level, but that goes back to my point that style and special effects don't tend to hold up over time. It was certainly innovative, though it probably lead to more bad stylistic choices in future films than good ones.

I agree with this. This is why you can watch a movie like Meet Joe Black and it still holds up in any era. No special effects just fantastic acting and a great script.

I don't feel like movies like The Matrix are meant to hold up long-term. Like the original Star Wars and other Sci-Fi movies, they are breaking new ground and it's difficult to go back and watch them and expect to feel the same way when the majority of that feeling is caused by the new ground not by the storyline or the acting.

[Xevious]

Sure and it's fine to appreciate it on a purely technical level, but that goes back to my point that style and special effects don't tend to hold up over time. It was certainly innovative, though it probably lead to more bad stylistic choices in future films than good ones.
Oh absolutely... especially all of the gratuitous slow-mo shots and wire work other movies would try to emulate.

[Adam Lambert]

Watched 2 and 3 last night and I'm ready to say Reloaded holds up better than the original. The acting is better, the dialogue is an improvement, the side characters are better established and more interesting, the concept is dense enough to invite and reward rewatches. The car chase is the best action scene in the whole series. Still some dumb parts but I appreciate that it evolved into more of a sci-fi thing than an allegory for white male 20-something angst and paranoia.

Revolutions has too much filler and relies too much on CGI battle scenes. Still my interest is a little more piqued for 4 now.

[Chumpette]

Watched 2 and 3 last night and I'm ready to say Reloaded holds up better than the original. The acting is better, the dialogue is an improvement, the side characters are better established and more interesting, the concept is dense enough to invite and reward rewatches. The car chase is the best action scene in the whole series. Still some dumb parts but I appreciate that it evolved into more of a sci-fi thing than an allegory for white male 20-something angst and paranoia.

Revolutions has too much filler and relies too much on CGI battle scenes. Still my interest is a little more piqued for 4 now.

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/001/886/104/912.png

[Reck]

- Thinking about the fact that there are still men in their 40's and 50's who think this is a great movie.

Why couldn't this be a great movie? People hold Star Wars on a pedestal despite exactly what DMC said. Acting is wonky, story is mediocre and special effects are shit.

The important takeaway from these type of movies is that they are transcendent and laid the ground for new movies and concept to be use in the current time.

[Adam Lambert]

Why couldn't this be a great movie? People hold Star Wars on a pedestal despite exactly what DMC said. Acting is wonky, story is mediocre and special effects are shit.

The important takeaway from these type of movies is that they are transcendent and laid the ground for new movies and concept to be use in the current time.

I don't know that I have a good answer for that. For one thing, I also think 40/50 year olds who obsess over Star Wars are kind of sad, but I also see the first movie as a launching point to a more interesting universe and story.

I don't know that even among Star Wars fans there's a lot of people who would call it a "great movie" but I can see how its story holds up for people over time. It's a simple space odyssey with an underdog and good-vs-evil themes. The bad CGI still serves the story and doesn't seem arbitrarily inserted to make you go "Wow, cool effects!" You might outgrow the acting and the writing and the FX, but you might not outgrow the story and caring about the characters.

The Matrix touches on some interesting themes like AI and existence itself, but it's overwhelmed by this constant "people are sheeple" theme driving its entire story which is hard to relate to when you're no longer in your early 20's. The CGI and martial arts scenes serve themselves and not really the story, so the more dated they get, the more they feel like a waste of time. (For the record I think the CGI still holds up for the most part, it's more the slow-mo / cinematography choices that I find dated). And character-wise, they're just so poorly written, it's hard to relate or care.

I also wouldn't underestimate something as simple as having a timeless John Williams score vs. dated Chemical Brothers electronica.

[Adam Lambert]

If we're honest with ourselves, we love Star Wars because we grew up with it. We saw it at an age where we weren't concerned with the bad acting and clunky dialogue. We were awed by the vastness of space and the aliens and the big ass Death Star and the Force. We pass it on to our kids when they're a similar age with similar expectations for movies. Did people who saw Star Wars for the first time when they were 20 have the same nostalgia for it? Not in my experience.

Meanwhile we saw The Matrix in our teens and twenties and it appealed to us then based on that stage of our lives and what other movies looked like at the time.

The Matrix is Tron.

[koriwhat]

If we're honest with ourselves, we love Star Wars because we grew up with it. We saw it at an age where we weren't concerned with the bad acting and clunky dialogue. We were awed by the vastness of space and the aliens and the big ass Death Star and the Force. We pass it on to our kids when they're a similar age with similar expectations for movies. Did people who saw Star Wars for the first time when they were 20 have the same nostalgia for it? Not in my experience.

SW sucks and always has...

[DMC]

Never cared for Star Wars. I get the fandom aspect but it seems forced. And may that forced be with you.

[benefactor]

Watched 2 and 3 last night and I'm ready to say Reloaded holds up better than the original. The acting is better, the dialogue is an improvement, the side characters are better established and more interesting, the concept is dense enough to invite and reward rewatches. The car chase is the best action scene in the whole series. Still some dumb parts but I appreciate that it evolved into more of a sci-fi thing than an allegory for white male 20-something angst and paranoia.

Revolutions has too much filler and relies too much on CGI battle scenes. Still my interest is a little more piqued for 4 now.
I agree with all this. As a side note, Raid 2 still has the best car chase seen I have ever seen.

[FrostKing]

Not to hijack but what's with this gang up on 'New Hope'. For the record 'Empire Strikes Back' has always been my jam but the original is more than able to be a stand alone classic and probably would be even more idolized if this were the case.

I would need to rewatch Matrix but I tend to remember this also being the case here. It's just that the sequel had greater action/picture and the 3rd film exploded the scope of the story. But imagine if these future films were never released. Just because certain aspects were improved upon doesn't take away from the overall greatness of the originals which still remain the all around best, in their genre.

Lasty: both films were also transcendent because of the timing of their subject matter - Star Wars a decade after the first launch into Space and Matrix on the heels of the world wide web/A.I.

[Reck]

Did not expect this to be on HBO Max. I will watch tonight and report back

[Trill Clinton]

Trash can water.

[Reck]

The movie is...yikes.

The first 20 minutes were very painful and full body cringe must be activated to survive. If you make it past the awful opening sequence then the movie kinds of settles down and nostalgia carries it a liitle bit. Matrix 4 makes Matrix 3 very appealing in constrast.

I wouldn't reccomend this to anyone. Looks like they are planning a 5th installment too. :lol

[Borosai]

I haven't watched this yet, but I will, even if it sucks (not surprising). No money will be lost.

[Trainwreck2100]

The wachowsky brothers ability to con Hollywood at least one more time makes me question what good stories we're not getting, especially now that it's obvious they stole the matrix in the first place

[koriwhat]

LMAO I watched this fucking shitty ass Matrix last night and it was pure garbage. Those trannies suck at making movies now. The gfx alone were weak af! The story line with the "nice" machines is so fucking dumb. What a shitty ass movie and a waste of time.

[koriwhat]

The wachowsky brothers ability to con Hollywood at least one more time makes me question what good stories we're not getting, especially now that it's obvious they stole the matrix in the first place

They also stole their mother's clothes and makeup.

[Reck]

LMAO I watched this fucking shitty ass Matrix last night and it was pure garbage. Those trannies suck at making movies now. The gfx alone were weak af! The story line with the "nice" machines is so fucking dumb. What a shitty ass movie and a waste of time.

Why are you so angry about a shitty movie? :lol

To warrant 2 posts back to back. Go see a therapist.

[koriwhat]

Why are you so angry about a shitty movie? :lol

To warrant 2 posts back to back. Go see a therapist.

Just because you and the other weak fucks here continuously claim that I am "angry" doesn't make it true. The movie sucked ass so is everyone else here with the same opinion "angry" too? It's a fucking review you dumb tranny retard. You're just upset because you wear your mother's clothes and makeup too.

Do me a favor and fuck off bro. Seriously, I don't care to hear from the likes of you and the other weak males here.

[Ef-man]

Why are you so angry about a shitty movie? :lol

To warrant 2 posts back to back. Go see a therapist.

:lol

It does not take much to set him off and get him to post that he dgaf about people say. :lmao

[daslicer]

I saw the movie and felt the storyline was terrible. The part about the machines resurrecting Neo and Trinity from the dead didn't make any sense to me. It doesn't seem like it would be in the machines best interest to bring back Neo after he nearly brought down the previous Matrix. Neo creating a new AI Morpheus through coding in the Matrix was pretty cheesy. The new Morpheus doesn't have the same aura as the original Morpheus. Neo no longer being able to successfully fly and jump from buildings even though he knows the Matrix isn't real was pretty dumb since in the previous movies he was able to do it easily. The ending in which Trinity becomes the one and Neo is no longer the one was a play towards modern day feminism.

[Reck]

The ending in which Trinity becomes the one and Neo is no longer the one was a play towards modern day feminism.

I think they're both the one? Suddenly Neo could fly as well? lol

I think what they are wanting to do is pass the torch to Carrie Ann Moss so she can cheese out more movies because Keanu is not doing any more of these.

[Xevious]

I watched the trilogy in anticipation of this, and they were just as bad as I remember. Reloaded tried to make the franchise a little more cerebral than the first, but it made zero sense. The whole conversation with the Architect played out like it was super important, but turned into a nothing burger. The Oracle basically shrugged off what he said in the next movie and we proceeded with CGI action fatigue. And not a single character in Zion do we care about. The machines could've won and it wouldn't have altered the emotional impact in the slightest.

I'm not expecting anything from Matrix 4. I'm sure it sucks also.

[Thanos]

The entire movie was just a meta commentary on how unnecessary and stupid making a fourth Matrix movie is. It wasn’t even a little bit subtle about it. I mean, it was still a terrible film, but it’s pretty much on purpose. It’s an anti-Matrix movie. Lana Wachowski knew Warner Bros was going to make a fourth film without their involvement, so she secured a big bag of money from Warner Bros and delivered a giant middle finger of a movie to them. Again, the movie sucks big time, but I do love that one aspect of it.

[FrostKing]

https://i.ibb.co/kGztJDz/RDT-20211228-1014384711629593733707802.jpg

[BD24]

I couldn’t even finish this shit. Shame that Keanu’s name is gonna be attached to this garbage

[Chucho]

I couldn’t even finish this shit. Shame that Keanu’s name is gonna be attached to this garbage

Wait...you think Keanu is a good actor????

Dude is a fuckin bump on a log who benefitted from great scripts in his latter career. There is almost no difference between Keanu Reeves and Val Kilmer except that Reeves had better luck with health that gave him the longevity to get the scripts that saved his career. Can't name 1 movie where Keanu is actually a "good" actor.

[BD24]

Wait...you think Keanu is a good actor????

Dude is a fuckin bump on a log who benefitted from great scripts in his latter career. There is almost no difference between Keanu Reeves and Val Kilmer except that Reeves had better luck with health that gave him the longevity to get the scripts that saved his career. Can't name 1 movie where Keanu is actually a "good" actor.
Obviously he isn’t a good actor in the traditional sense. But, in the right roles he is pretty perfect. And I do just like Keanu overall as a person and have enjoyed that’s her been able to have a late career revitalization.

the reality is that there are only a few truly good actors/actresses at any given time. So I try to enjoy actors for what they can bring to the table and roles they can excel in

[Chucho]

Obviously he isn’t a good actor in the traditional sense. But, in the right roles he is pretty perfect. And I do just like Keanu overall as a person and have enjoyed that’s her been able to have a late career revitalization.

the reality is that there are only a few truly good actors/actresses at any given time. So I try to enjoy actors for what they can bring to the table and roles they can excel in

Correct. He saw the script and accepted the gig. His name is 100% attached to this movie and he wanted it to be. Fairly obvious that the Matrix saved his career and put him on the path to an action star on par with the Rock so far as drawing power goes. He basically owed this movie to the IP.

Don't feel bad for Keanu. He doesn't feel bad about it. Just an off-hand stinker he was bound to have eventually.

[Reck]

Action movies dont require you to be a good actor. Just look at the Avengers movie. Half the cast is shit.

As long as Keanu does movies where he's breaking faces and putting bullets in people, he's great. Dont need much more than that.

[Thanos]

This really isn’t an action movie, because the action is purposefully bad, and it’s meant to mock all the fanboys screaming for “Gun. Lots of guns.”

But you still could have found a way to make it visually interesting and not look like a cheap episode of Agents Of Shield :lol

[Xevious]

The entire movie was just a meta commentary on how unnecessary and stupid making a fourth Matrix movie is. It wasn’t even a little bit subtle about it. I mean, it was still a terrible film, but it’s pretty much on purpose. It’s an anti-Matrix movie. Lana Wachowski knew Warner Bros was going to make a fourth film without their involvement, so she secured a big bag of money from Warner Bros and delivered a giant middle finger of a movie to them. Again, the movie sucks big time, but I do love that one aspect of it.
Yeah that whole conversation with the Smith character at the beginning... "Warner Brothers is going to make another Matrix game with or without us, so we might as well cash in." :lol They didn't even bother trying to change names or hide anything. At the same time though it's hard to believe that Lana Wachowski intentionally made this as bad as it was, considering the other movies are pretty damn shitty also.

But yeah, Matrix 4 is like a modern day Plan 9. It's just ridiculously bad.

[Thanos]

Yeah that whole conversation with the Smith character at the beginning... "Warner Brothers is going to make another Matrix game with or without us, so we might as well cash in." :lol They didn't even bother trying to change names or hide anything. At the same time though it's hard to believe that Lana Wachowski intentionally made this as bad as it was, considering the other movies are pretty damn shitty also.

But yeah, Matrix 4 is like a modern day Plan 9. It's just ridiculously bad.
On the one hand, I applaud Lana Wachowski for taking back The Matrix from all the idiotic manbabies who co-opted it and misinterpreted it for 20 years now, but at the end of the day she still made a crappy movie here, so it kind of ruins the point :lol

I feel pretty certain that the lifeless action sequences were purposeful, it feels like a “yada yada here’s some kung fu, neckbeards” because she wants to tell everyone the Matrix was never an action franchise, but rather a love story about Neo and Trinity. It doesn’t help that the love story also sucks, and that Keanu & Carrie-Anne Moss have zero chemistry or spark on screen together.

[gambit1990]

The wachowsky brothers ability to con Hollywood at least one more time makes me question what good stories we're not getting, especially now that it's obvious they stole the matrix in the first place
one only worked on the film. it wasn't both.

[DMC]

I think they're both the one? Suddenly Neo could fly as well? lol

I think what they are wanting to do is pass the torch to Carrie Ann Moss so she can cheese out more movies because Keanu is not doing any more of these.

I agree with this. Like other "super hero" movies, they are trying to save a buck while appearing to be doing the gender swap for fair play. In reality the stars of these flicks command too much money. Hawkeye's now a girl, a no name girl at that. You'd think that, if Trinity was spared, they'd have done something to make her less of a bull dyke. Keanu couldn't even be arsed to lose the John Wick look for this flick :lol

[DMC]

one only worked on the film. it wasn't both.
Nah, they both flew in to see Smith.

[Thanos]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHCsz78GfYg

[DC23]

Watched this tonight. Undoubtedly one of the worst movies I have ever seen. Words cannot describe how disappointing this movie was. Major waste of time.

[Leetonidas]

finally got around to watching this last week and yeah it was fucking trash. really disappointing. who the fucks idea was this piece of shit? :lol it was pointless

[koriwhat]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHCsz78GfYg

That was just as bad as the Matrix 4. That dude blundered it by not taking the opportunity to don a dress and cake on some makeup like those two pigs the Wachowski brothers.

[lebomb]

I was disappointed as well. I give it a solid 4/10.

[lefty]

Just watched it

That movie sucked ass

And I liked the Merovingian in the original trilogy, they turned him into a goofball

I liked Jessica Henwick tho

[Reck]

I liked Jessica Henwick tho

Probably the worst aspect of the movie.

[lefty]

Probably the worst aspect of the movie.

Nah that honor goes to shitty version of morpheus and Smith
They can’t act for shit

[Reck]

Nah that honor goes to shitty version of morpheus and Smith
They can’t act for shit

The Smith guy is the detective from Mindhunters. He's just fat now.