Kevin O'Connor: The Ringer:The San Antonio Spurs Paradox

[Drom John]

The San Antonio Spurs Paradox (https://www.theringer.com/nba/2019/11/13/20962320/san-antonio-spurs-demar-derozan-popovich-trade-style)

[SpursDynasty85]

interesting read. He really took a lot of time to write about the Spurs despite the Spurs looking so awful so far this year. But then again, compared to some of the Rockets' games, Spurs are much more entertaining.

[JuneJive]

DeRozan can become a free agent in 2020 by declining his $27.7 million player option; he was far apart from the team on extension talks before the season, according to The Athletic’s Sam Amick. The Spurs could always deal him sooner rather than let him walk for nothing. Multiple league sources say the Magic are scouring the trade market for scoring help and have already expressed interest in trading for DeRozan.



To Orlando, please.

[EasyMoney]

DeRozan can become a free agent in 2020 by declining his $27.7 million player option; he was far apart from the team on extension talks before the season, according to The Athletic’s Sam Amick. The Spurs could always deal him sooner rather than let him walk for nothing. Multiple league sources say the Magic are scouring the trade market for scoring help and have already expressed interest in trading for DeRozan.



To Orlando, please.



PLEASE DO IT ORLANDO. PLEASE

[Mugen]

Please god trade him to Orlando.

[Floyd Pacquiao]

You just pray he balls out against orlando on friday as a showcase game

[Fireball]

I liked trading deRozan and the Murray golden mushroom reference...

[MultiTroll]

Rest of the article is just copy n paste from SpursTalk.


"Multiple league sources say the Magic are scouring the trade market for scoring help and have already expressed interest in trading for DeRozan."

Do it!

[sananspursfan21]

I can’t believe I’m saying it, but do it Orlando. Salary brains, what could the Spurs score for him? Anything of value or would it just be a dump off?

[Dverde]

Hopefully someone will leak Orlando’s whiteboard again so we can see what they are planning.

[r0drig0lac]

fournier + aminu

[ZeusWillJudge]

Thanks for posting. There's good and bad in there:

"Of players to attempt at least 1,000 shots since last season, only Ben Simmons, Montrezl Harrell, and Andre Drummond have attempted fewer 3s than DeRozan and Aldridge."

That's telling. The two "stars" of the team, and only three (qualified) players have taken fewer 3's. And those three are all but worthless outside of about 6 feet. Having one of those guys as a mainstay on the team is bad enough. Having two in your starting lineup is a problem.


"San Antonio goes fast after misses and turnovers but slow after makes."

Pushing the ball after made shots all the time is D'Antoni Ball. Don't make the mistake of wishing for D'Antoni Ball. It hasn't worked for D'Antoni (except in the regular season), and he had teams built specifically for that purpose.

And here's the problem with the whole thing:

“We think defenses break down as the ball changes sides with X amount of passes. We hope that defenses let up and you find a great shot, rather than an early shot.”

Tim and Tony could bend a defense. Tim with his size, strength, and court vision. Tony with his acceleration. (And Manu, but the bench is a different discussion.) Defenders cheated off their man to try and help with those two. When the ball changed sides back then, it eventually found someone whose defender wasn't home. Aldridge and DeRozan don't command that kind of attention. Then throw in the fact that the other guys are lazy about moving without the ball. It's easy to clog passing lanes when you know that Aldridge and DeRozan are going to pass, and the other guys are stationary targets. It's just not that hard to figure out.

[Dex]

Good read. Another interesting tidbit:


They ranked seventh in offense last season and are seventh this season. And even though DeRozan and Aldridge live in the dreaded midrange, their passes frequently result in analytics-happy 3s or layups. And the rest of the team shoots a lot of 3s. Since last season, 35.9 percent of San Antonio’s shot attempts have come from 3-point range when neither of Aldridge or DeRozan are in the game, which would rank as the 10th-most frequent rate in the NBA. “We got a good mixture. Our second group has a lot of ball movement, and movement, period,” Forbes told me after a Spurs practice in Los Angeles. “Then we have two premier scorers and we let them do isolations. We have a lot of different sides to us.”

Basically, the Spurs anemic three-point rate stems from the fact that the players with the highest usage (Aldridge and DeRozan) live in the post or the mid-range.

Even for as iso-heavy as Kawhi was, he still put up 4 or 5 3PA a game in his last two seasons with the Spurs.

Get rid of DeRozan and replace him with another shooter (or just give more minutes to White, Walker, and Forbes and let them fire away), and the Spurs would be middle of the pack as far as shooting goes.

[ZeusWillJudge]

I can’t believe I’m saying it, but do it Orlando. Salary brains, what could the Spurs score for him? Anything of value or would it just be a dump off?

Markelle Fultz + Evan Fournier. WooHoo!

[lmbebo]

Markelle Fultz + Evan Fournier. WooHoo!

Would rather have Gordon. Fultz still a mystery and not really showing to be an outside threat with the zero insight I have into his game ...

[Kobe'sAchilles]

Would be hilarious if we ended up with Fultz after Philly refused to put him in any trade package for Kawhi :lol

[baseline bum]

Fournier + Fultz or Gordon + Fultz are the only deals that look like they could happen. Then you beg Chip to work another miracle on a broken jumper like he did with Leonard.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

"It would surprise none of the front-office executives I’ve spoken with if the Spurs did move DeRozan."


YESSS

[sananspursfan21]

Markelle Fultz + Evan Fournier. WooHoo!

:lol yay more back court guys!

[Dverde]

I thought that Aaron Gordon not getting a team USA invite was telling. I can’t see the Spurs trading for him.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

"With DeRozan and Aldridge leading the squad, they may not win quite as many games as they once did, but they’re anything but boring. The Spurs are a symbol of what the game once was and a contrast to what it’s becoming."

Disagree, the offense is very ugly but maybe when young guns get more minutes they'll be more fun.

I'll take watching 2007 Spurs over this bunch any day

[ZeusWillJudge]

Fournier + Fultz or Gordon + Fultz are the only deals that look like they could happen. Then you beg Chip to work another miracle on a broken jumper like he did with Leonard.

Or like he has with DeRozan?

[J_Paco]

Markelle Fultz + Evan Fournier. WooHoo!

Yes, a team with 7/8 guards on the roster should trade for another guard (who might not be better than Murray or White).......

Any combination of Ross, Fournier (can play some SF), Gordon (yes, please), Frazier or Aminu could work.

Preferably Gordon and whomever else (giving up DeRozan, Belinelli and a future lottery - protected pick in return).....

[Kobe'sAchilles]

Can Gordon shoot? I feel like we would still have major spacing problems if we traded for him. Fournier can atleast shoot the ball and would provide spacing for LMA to go to work down low. Plus we could have White as the 3 and close with LMA, Gay, White, Fournier, and DJ. I like that group tbh.

I don't want Fultz at all. He's a useless player. But I would like Aminu

[DJR210]

I'm going to Orlando in a month, I'd absolutely love to stop by and cheer DeRozan fucking up in a Magic jersey

[ZeusWillJudge]

Yes, a team with 7/8 guards on the roster should trade for another guard (who might not be better than Murray or White).......

Any combination of Ross, Fournier (can play some SF), Gordon (yes, please), Frazier or Aminu could work.

Preferably Gordon and whomever else (giving up DeRozan, Belinelli and a future lottery - protected pick in return).....


I didn't say that's what I wanted, you fucking troglodyte. The guy asked what the Spurs could get from Orlando for DDR, and I told him the most likely pair.

Let me get this straight. You want them to take DeRozan, AND Beli? So that's like $35.5M worth of salaries the Spurs would have to take back off of their shitty roster? (And just for laughs throwing in a first round pick?) I mean, kudos for casting off DDR and Beli in your scenario. But the idea is to get better than Orlando is right now.

You guys who act like Aaron Gordon would be a prize crack me up. Start with the fact that he's under contract through 21-22, and add in the fact that people here would cry about him more than DeRozan, and you have the perfect base for a big trade. :lol

At least DeRozan can be gone after this season. Gordon would be the gift that keeps on giving for two more seasons.

[NASpurs]

This is going to be a 20 page thread of people getting blue balls only for Pop to say:

:pop: We like what we have.

F that, I’ve learned my lesson. :lol

[Dex]

This is going to be a 20 page thread of people getting blue balls only for Pop to say:

:pop: We like what we have.

F that, I’ve learned my lesson. :lol

It's the same drill as it was with Pau...he's still a Spur until he's no longer a Spur.

[exstatic]

Fultz is markedly better this year than before. He's at least an NBA player now. His eFG%, FG%, FT%, and ppg are all up. He shouldn't be the pivot of any trade, but as a throw in, he wouldn't be bad.

I doubt they'd give up Fournier. ORL has the same problem that we do: lack of 3 point shooting. He's their best at 40% on 5 attempts per game. The next best is JIsaac at 38% on about thee and a half attempts. It drops off a cliff after that.

[ZeusWillJudge]

This is going to be a 20 page thread of people getting blue balls only for Pop to say:

:pop: We like what we have.

F that, I’ve learned my lesson. :lol


:lol

[jermaine]

Derozan an Marco would be great for them if they want shooting.

[TDomination]

Thank you for posting very interesting read.

I feel like change is coming soon. We'll look at that loss to memphis as a good thing in the long run...i hope.

Now what kind of change i'm not sure. Maybe starting lineup change? Rotation changes. Or even trades. We can make fun of PATFO all we want but I can guarantee you that they do not like losing. Going 1-2 on that home stand is embarrassing and losing to a 2-6 grizzlies team on TP night is even worse.

We'll see what happens.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Fournier + Fultz or Gordon + Fultz are the only deals that look like they could happen. Then you beg Chip to work another miracle on a broken jumper like he did with Leonard.

Fultz is dogsh!t. Spurs fans will be missing DeRozan fast if he rolls into town. Orlando will absolutely have to include a decent asset or two to make that move palatable. I like Fournier and Gordon though.

[Maddog]

I'm looking at Orlando's Roster and it's hard to get real excited. Gordon has had potential, but not quite clear he is ever getting there.still owed 34 mil after this season.
Fultz? Has only played 43 games in a little over 2 seasons.

Since 2013 draft picks
2
3 and 12
5
11
6
6

All that and they are still bad....

[baseline bum]

Fultz is dogsh!t. Spurs fans will be missing DeRozan fast if he rolls into town. Orlando will absolutely have to include a decent asset or two to make that move palatable. I like Fournier and Gordon though.

Yeah Fultz is just to match salaries. Part of me would expect the Spurs to cut him, but with $22 million due over this year and next I figure they'd probably see if there is any way they could salvage his career.

[SpurPadre]

This is going to be a 20 page thread of people getting blue balls only for Pop to say:

:pop: We like what we have.

F that, I’ve learned my lesson. :lol

Or he'll make jokes to the reporters about not making trades like he's done in the past.

[DJR210]

Derozan an Marco would be great for them if they want shooting.

Guess you haven't seen many games this season..

[playblair]

Or like he has with DeRozan?

its not chips fault derozan chooses to hang out in compton with the grape street crips/rolling 60s all summer instead of practicing his shot in east san antonio like kawhi