Rank Lebron As A Player Now

[Spurtacular]

I'll have to give this some thought, but I don't even have him as the best player on his own team at this point.

[LkrFan]

"Now" as in "now that he is a Laker?" :lol

[Spurtacular]

"Now" as in "now that he is a Laker?" :lol

:cry It's a conspiracy :cry

[ambchang]

MVP

[Rummpd]

LaRoids is still best player on LAL only because DaQuiter is made of glass.

[ElNono]

He’s still #2 after dad killer, IMO. He’s just at a different stage in his career at this point.

[FrostKing]

He’s still #2 after dad killer, IMO. He’s just at a different stage in his career at this point.
At the current pace he'll never get from under Kobe's shadow

[DAF86]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qctiTlsriA

I'll admit I haven't been keeping up with the NBA as much as in previous years, but I'm surprised everyone has Lebron (and even Giannis and Harden) over Kawhi as the best player in the World. Who the fuck cares about that load management garbage during the regular season? When playoffs come around, who is the one guy you would rather have in your team? Kawhi, the guy that hasn't lost a playoffs series in 4 years, is the no brainer answer to me, tbh. And that makes you the best player in the World, imho.

[Larry Joe Bird]

He’s still #2 after dad killer, IMO. He’s just at a different stage in his career at this point.


No wing will ever pass Dad Killer at this point.

I swept that guy twice in a row. Ya'll take your fake news too seriously.

Even my teammates feared a guy ya'll don't ever talk about more than that over-hyped prima donna.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TwzTiNZyXwU&t=619s

[DAF86]

I swept that guy twice in a row. Ya'll take your fake news too seriously.

Even my teammates feared a guy ya'll don't ever talk about more than that over-hyped prima donna.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TwzTiNZyXwU&t=619s

You called the "over-hyped prima donna" God, tbh.

[Larry Joe Bird]

You called the "over-hyped prima donna" God, tbh.

You think som after-game hyperbole outranks two sweeps? GTFO :lmao

[Clipper Nation]

He’s still #2 after dad killer, IMO. He’s just at a different stage in his career at this point.
:lol DK at #1

LeBron, Duncan, Kareem are all better than him, and Kawhi probably will be too once it's all said and done.

[ElNono]

:lol DK at #1

LeBron, Duncan, Kareem are all better than him, and Kawhi probably will be too once it's all said and done.

Not a fan of DK, but not really debatable at this stage. Unfortunately Kawhi would have to win twice as many rings to outrank him, tbh, considering he has zero swag and marketability...

[FrostKing]

"Rise of Skywalker is the #1 Star Wars film"

[Spurtacular]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qctiTlsriA

I'll admit I haven't been keeping up with the NBA as much as in previous years, but I'm surprised everyone has Lebron (and even Giannis and Harden) over Kawhi as the best player in the World. Who the fuck cares about that load management garbage during the regular season? When playoffs come around, who is the one guy you would rather have in your team? Kawhi, the guy that hasn't lost a playoffs series in 4 years, is the no brainer answer to me, tbh. And that makes you the best player in the World, imho.

Marketing Decision(s). How it's always been; or do you really think Michael Jordan is the undisputed GOAT?

[FrostKing]

Marketing Decision(s). How it's always been; or do you really think Michael Jordan is the undisputed GOAT?
There is no definite when you are debating multiple seasons. I think Jordan has a stronger argument than Gretzky, Pele or Montana/Brady/Brown

[Clipper Nation]

DK has no argument over Gretzky at all. Gretzky had Wilt-level statistical dominance over his sport, won multiple championships, and single-handedly put hockey on the map in the furthest thing from a traditional hockey market (LA).

[DAF86]

Marketing Decision(s). How it's always been; or do you really think Michael Jordan is the undisputed GOAT?

I don't know if undisputed, but Jordan has a more than strong case as the GOAT. Not only narratives, raw numbers and accolades are on his side, but also advanced metrics support his case as the GOAT.

[Larry Joe Bird]

There is no definite when you are debating multiple seasons. I think Jordan has a stronger argument than Gretzky, Pele or Montana/Brady/Brown

GOATS don't lose to rivals 14x in a row, son. People like to excuse that the man was young and lacked surrounding talent; but the final game of the two sweeps, McHale, Walton, and others were out injured as I came back from 15 in the fourth to finish Jordan off on his home floor. Hell, Fred fucking Roberts was the starting 4 in that game. He was like the Lakers' version of Jeff Lamp (12th man).

Then when I was injured and the Pistons got their chance, what did Jordan do when he had the Pistons 2-1 in the 89 ECF and Game 4 on his home court? He choked. He did nothing in the toughest era; we all were there, son. Then boys like you going through puberty in the 90's got a hard-on for the man. :lol

[Chris Fall]

I still rank LeBron a top 3 player in the league. Not a great game by him last night, but consider he started the game 0-for-7 and after that went 9-for-17 with a near triple double. And that was a not so great game by him. Expectations of his performance are set pretty ridiculously high, and yet his season numbers are essentially identical to his previous 7 seasons, many of which when he was still considered in his “prime.”

I have Giannis head of him for sure. Couple other players like Kawhi and Luka may be better, but it’s more of a coin flip imo. I don’t rank Anthony Davis ahead of LeBron because I just don’t believe a big man can impact the game the same way a wing who dominates the action and decision-making can.

Questions about his durability at his age and with his mileage are legitimate. But when he does play, his production still ranks him at or near the top of the league for me personally. Still one of the handful of guys to be considered the best in the league.

[Spurtacular]

I still rank LeBron a top 3 player in the league.

Based on playoffs with surrounding talent or overall? Because Lebron wasn't even good enough to make the playoffs last season.

[Spurtacular]

I don't know if undisputed, but Jordan has a more than strong case as the GOAT. Not only narratives, raw numbers and accolades are on his side, but also advanced metrics support his case as the GOAT.

Advance metrics are glorified measurements of ball hogging. If you go by those, it's Harden vs. Jordan for GOAT. :lmao
With Doncic the heir apparent. :lmao

[DAF86]

I still rank LeBron a top 3 player in the league. Not a great game by him last night, but consider he started the game 0-for-7 and after that went 9-for-17 with a near triple double. And that was a not so great game by him. Expectations of his performance are set pretty ridiculously high, and yet his season numbers are essentially identical to his previous 7 seasons, many of which when he was still considered in his “prime.”

I have Giannis head of him for sure. Couple other players like Kawhi and Luka may be better, but it’s more of a coin flip imo. I don’t rank Anthony Davis ahead of LeBron because I just don’t believe a big man can impact the game the same way a wing who dominates the action and decision-making can.

Questions about his durability at his age and with his mileage are legitimate. But when he does play, his production still ranks him at or near the top of the league for me personally. Still one of the handful of guys to be considered the best in the league.

You really rank Giannis over Kawhi despite last years' playoffs?

[DAF86]

Advance metrics are glorified measurements of ball hogging. If you go by those, it's Harden vs. Jordan for GOAT. :lmao
With Doncic the heir apparent. :lmao

It's actually the opposite, tbh. :lol

And Harden is a regular season GOAT. Go check his playoffs advanced stats to get the whole picture.

[Spurtacular]

It's actually the opposite, tbh. :lol

And Harden is a regular season GOAT. Go check his playoffs advanced stats to get the whole picture.

If he was it would've been the Thunder and not the Warriors breaking the Bulls regular season wins record.

[DAF86]

If he was it would've been the Thunder and not the Warriors breaking the Bulls regular season wins record.

Harden in OKC wasn't the player he is now. Let's not get into mind numbing arguments please.

[Spurtacular]

Harden in OKC wasn't the player he is now. Let's not get into mind numbing arguments please.

Actually, he is. He was just put as the central piece in a different system, and his numbers reflect that actuality.

[FrostKing]

DK has no argument over Gretzky at all. Gretzky had Wilt-level statistical dominance over his sport, won multiple championships, and single-handedly put hockey on the map in the furthest thing from a traditional hockey market (LA).
Statistically it is close as nearly every modern scoring record and accomplishment lists Jordan and multiple times. In terms of Titles, Wayne was done in the 1980s. Jordan could have brought basketball to any corner of the planet.

This Playoff blunder by Wayne is tough to forget

https://youtu.be/tRoNqiiY6Lg

[apalisoc_9]

fags.

Lebron turned a prennial 14th seeder into a 1st seeded team.

What more do you faggots need?

Maybe In a playoff vacuum Kawhi is the best...but there is no doubt hes still the most valuable player in the league in a night in and night out basis..Him and Giannis are 1 and 2

[Joseph Kony]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qctiTlsriA

I'll admit I haven't been keeping up with the NBA as much as in previous years, but I'm surprised everyone has Lebron (and even Giannis and Harden) over Kawhi as the best player in the World. Who the fuck cares about that load management garbage during the regular season? When playoffs come around, who is the one guy you would rather have in your team? Kawhi, the guy that hasn't lost a playoffs series in 4 years, is the no brainer answer to me, tbh. And that makes you the best player in the World, imho.

there is something to be said about a player who cannot even carry his team in the RS. yeah it's great he shows up in the playoffs but the thing that separates him from Giannias/Lebron/Harden is that they NEED to play 70+ games for their teams to be successful. Leonard is playing on stacked rosters so he can rest during the RS. he cannot carry a team on his own, and if he was on a lesser team, he would be gimped by the time the playoffs started.

cant be the best player in the league when you cant even actually lead your team to the post season.

[Joseph Kony]

Actually, he is. He was just put as the central piece in a different system, and his numbers reflect that actuality.

uh no they dont retard :lmao the fuck are you talking about? only real numbers that are similar are O and D rtg. his opm, w/s, vorp, etc are all clearly way better in Houston than in OKC. why are you just making shit up :lol

[Spurtacular]

uh no they dont retard :lmao the fuck are you talking about? only real numbers that are similar are O and D rtg. his opm, w/s, vorp, etc are all clearly way better in Houston than in OKC. why are you just making shit up :lol

Only a fucking retard is calling Harden 2nd best reg season GOAT. Not surprised to see you chiming in with your retardedness. Not surprised at all.

[DAF86]

Actually, he is. He was just put as the central piece in a different system, and his numbers reflect that actuality.

No, he isn't. Players improve you know. Also your argument is a poor one. Under your premise, the Warriors that broke the Bulls récord should have won 80 games next season with Durant.

[DAF86]

Only a fucking retard is calling Harden 2nd best reg season GOAT. Not surprised to see you chiming in with your retardedness. Not surprised at all.

Who is calling Harden that? And who the fuck do you think you, of all people, are calling retard? :lol

[DAF86]

there is something to be said about a player who cannot even carry his team in the RS. yeah it's great he shows up in the playoffs but the thing that separates him from Giannias/Lebron/Harden is that they NEED to play 70+ games for their teams to be successful. Leonard is playing on stacked rosters so he can rest during the RS. he cannot carry a team on his own, and if he was on a lesser team, he would be gimped by the time the playoffs started.

cant be the best player in the league when you cant even actually lead your team to the post season.

Every contender should be able to get by with its star player missing games here and there.

[daslicer]

Every contender should be able to get by with its star player missing games here and there.

Most teams would lose a bunch of games if their star player decides to sit out close to 20 or more per year. Take Lebron or AD off the Lakers for 20 games and they are falling the standings. Take Giannis off the Bucks 20 are more games and the same applies. You can say the same about the Sixer when it comes to Embiid or Simons.

Clippers are just stacked so #2 has the luxury of sitting out games.

[DAF86]

Most teams would lose a bunch of games if their star player decides to sit out close to 20 or more per year. Take Lebron or AD off the Lakers for 20 games and they are falling the standings. Take Giannis off the Bucks 20 are more games and the same applies. You can say the same about the Sixer when it comes to Embiid or Simons.

Clippers are just stacked so #2 has the luxury of sitting out games.

What happened when Duncan sit back on the mid '00's? Did that mean Duncan wasn't as good as advertised?

[DAF86]

Also, the Clippers are 4-5 when Kawhi doesn't play. Why are you acting as if the Clippers don't miss a beat when Kawhi sits? :lol

[Spurtacular]

No, he isn't. Players improve you know. Also your argument is a poor one. Under your premise, the Warriors that broke the Bulls récord should have won 80 games next season with Durant.

His improvement wasn't that pronounced. His utilization was though.

The reason that Durant didn't improve the Warriors reg season is that the rest of the league was catching up. He did make them better at playoff time.

There is no way you really believe a slouch like Harden is second best regular season player. Dude's a stat stuffer, not a difference maker.

[DAF86]

His improvement wasn't that pronounced. His utilization was though.

The reason that Durant didn't improve the Warriors reg season is that the rest of the league was catching up. He did make them better at playoff time.

There is no way you really believe a slouch like Harden is second best regular season player. Dude's a stat stuffer, not a difference maker.

When did I say that? :lol

[Joseph Kony]

Every contender should be able to get by with its star player missing games here and there.

but 25% of the season?

[daslicer]

Also, the Clippers are 4-5 when Kawhi doesn't play. Why are you acting as if the Clippers don't miss a beat when Kawhi sits? :lol

4-5 is a small sample size. I do believe their record will be better over a larger sample size. It still pretty good they are playing around .500 basketball without him. Very few teams are going to be able to hover around .500 without their star player being out for a long stretch unless it's a stacked team.

Also let's bring up last year where the Raptors had a ridiculously good record without him. It definitely helped him out tremendously. Very few stars have that luxury.

[DAF86]

4-5 is a small sample size. I do believe their record will be better over a larger sample size. It still pretty good they are playing around .500 basketball without him. Very few teams are going to be able to hover around .500 without their star player being out for a long stretch unless it's a stacked team.

Also let's bring up last year where the Raptors had a ridiculously good record without him. It definitely helped him out tremendously. Very few stars have that luxury.

Bucks played around .500 ball last season without Giannis. And, yeah, contenders are usually stacked teams. That's why the Spurs won a lot more than they lost when Duncan used to sit. That's why the Bulls won 50+ games when Jordan retired for the first time.

[daslicer]

Bucks played around .500 ball last season without Giannis. And, yeah, contenders are usually stacked teams. That's why the Spurs won a lot more than they lost when Duncan used to sit. That's why the Bulls won 50+ games when Jordan retired for the first time.

But was Giannis and Jordan sitting out 20 plus game per year? #2 is great if you have team where you can afford to sit him out 20 plus games a year. I doubt the bucks could afford to do that with Giannis.

[ElNono]

Kawhi is probably the better player right now, but I was talking career wise and what people end up remembering, which is what ultimately matters. Nobody will remember TD outside of San Antonio even if he was a top 10 player of all time. He simply wasn’t a marketable star, and that was his own choice. Kawhi has the same issue, tbh, plus a speech disfunction of some sort. DK was an asshole but marketed well, same with LeBron, Shaq, AI, etc. Even second tier sidekicks like SwaggyP, Kobe, etc had a solid off court media game.

[daslicer]

Kawhi is probably the better player right now, but I was talking career wise and what people end up remembering, which is what ultimately matters. Nobody will remember TD outside of San Antonio even if he was a top 10 player of all time. He simply wasn’t a marketable star, and that was his own choice. Kawhi has the same issue, tbh, plus a speech disfunction of some sort. DK was an asshole but marketed well, same with LeBron, Shaq, AI, etc. Even second tier sidekicks like SwaggyP, Kobe, etc had a solid off court media game.

It's interesting with #2 I see huge push by the media trying to make him look cool. I never saw that with Duncan. With Duncan it was he's boring and dull. But with #2 they are trying to hype him up to be a terminator type of figure. They also try to make him out to be a funny guy based on every simple thing that comes out his mouth ala "fun guy". #2 has it great with the media considering he gets to be a retarded version of Duncan but gets better treatment along with getting more hype.

[ElNono]

It's interesting with #2 I see huge push by the media trying to make him look cool. I never saw that with Duncan. With Duncan it was he's boring and dull. But with #2 they are trying to hype him up to be a terminator type of figure. They also try to make him out to be a funny guy based on every simple thing that comes out his mouth ala "fun guy". #2 has it great with the media considering he gets to be a retarded version of Duncan but gets better treatment along with getting more hype.

Coz LeBron is retiring sooner rather than later and it’s either Giannis or Kawhi for the hype. And Giannis is in the wrong market. But even then, did you see that DeRozan-Kevin Hart interview upstairs, where Hart mocks the fuck out of Kawhi and the way he talks? I’m living in LA right now, and there’s really no hype. Maybe it’ll change if they ring, or have a solid series against the Lakeshow, but right now I’ve seen a grand total of one commercial (Terminator, where he’s played awkwardly as a robot), and all the Clippers billboards are about ‘team first’ and nothing about Kawhi...

[daslicer]

Coz LeBron is retiring sooner rather than later and it’s either Giannis or Kawhi for the hype. And Giannis is in the wrong market. But even then, did you see that DeRozan-Kevin Hart interview upstairs, where Hart mocks the fuck out of Kawhi and the way he talks? I’m living in LA right now, and there’s really no hype. Maybe it’ll change if they ring, or have a solid series against the Lakeshow, but right now I’ve seen a grand total of one commercial (Terminator, where he’s played awkwardly as a robot), and all the Clippers billboards are about ‘team first’ and nothing about Kawhi...

Wow that's pretty interesting. I never believed #2 was ever marketable due to not having charisma and social presence that guys like Kobe,MJ,Lebron,Shaq had. Giannis has the charisma but I think what hurts him moreso than the market he is in is that he's a foreigner. It's just hard to market a foreigner in America. Lebron proved when he played in Cleveland that market size doesn't really matter.

NBA has an interesting problem the next few years which is the top young talent below 25 Embiid,Doncic,Giannis are all foreigners.

[FrostKing]

If Lebron hadn't ran off to Miami he'd probaby still be sitting today on a big fat 0. Suffocating from the pressure.

[ElNono]

If Lebron hadn't ran off to Miami he'd probaby still be sitting today on a big fat 0. Suffocating from the pressure.

He won with Cleveland. He broke the curse. He’s basically historically immortal after that.

[FrostKing]

He won with Cleveland. He broke the curse. He’s basically historically immortal after that.
Not like there is a long list of stars whom have failed in Cleveland. He basically pulled a Leonard in Toronto

Winning in Lakers backyard after all the talent Clippers have wasted, would be the most impressive feat.

[ElNono]

:lol Toronto. Canada is hockey and nothing else, tbh.

[FrostKing]

:lol Toronto. Canada is hockey and nothing else, tbh.
Cleveland is a football town. Maybe baseball.

[ElNono]

Cleveland is a football town. Maybe baseball.

Has teams in all 3 major American sports, LeBron the only guy that could deliver in the past what, 20+ years?

Plus he had his redemption story to boot. Played masterfully, tbh

[FrostKing]

Has teams in all 3 major American sports, LeBron the only guy that could deliver in the past what, 20+ years?

Plus he had his redemption story to boot. Played masterfully, tbh
Well yah he was able to accomplish what the great Mark Price could not. No one ever brought an NBA title to Cleveland cause no one significant ever tried. Move Irving and Durant to the Cavaliers and I am confident they can win at-least one.

[DAF86]

But was Giannis and Jordan sitting out 20 plus game per year? #2 is great if you have team where you can afford to sit him out 20 plus games a year. I doubt the bucks could afford to do that with Giannis.

Jordan sit for an entire season and the Bulls still won 50+ games. :lol

[Clipper Nation]

Jordan sit for an entire season and the Bulls still won 50+ games. :lol
:lol What kind of "GOAT" gets replaced by Pete Myers and the team still wins 55 games and a playoff series?

[Chris Fall]

The kind when he returns, the team sets a regular season record 72 wins and goes off for a second championship threepeat? That kind of Goat?

[ElNono]

The kind when he returns, the team sets a regular season record 72 wins and goes off for a second championship threepeat? That kind of Goat?

Yep. From 3 peat champs to first round fodder. Sounds about right.

[FrostKing]

6 rings in 6.5 seasons

[HarlemHeat37]

He clearly isn't as good as Giannis or Kawhi, I'd have him behind Davis(despite being overrated) and Harden, as well. Lebron is only going to get worse as the season progresses considering his age and mileage, he should already be retired. Assuming deterioration by the end of the season, he's a back-end top 10 player, similar to Embiid/Jokic/George

[Clipper Nation]

Cleveland is a football town. Maybe baseball.

And yet it was LeGOAT, not the Browns or Indians, who brought them their only ring in the last 50+ years.

The LeGOAT Effect

[Clipper Nation]

6 rings in 6.5 seasons

11 rings in 13 seasons

https://i.imgur.com/21cG2Le.jpg

[LkrFan]

:lol DK at #1

LeBron, Duncan, Kareem are all better than him, and Kawhi probably will be too once it's all said and done.

You're a Spur fan at heart, so I'll let your Jim love slide. But Kawhi has been in the right place at the right timePERIOD.

He was drafted to the Spurs, who were already good. Jim was the man on those teams. They still had Manu. Still had TP. Still had Pop on the sidelines and good role players. All he had to do is mature as a player and fit into Pop's system. Then they fell out. Somebody had to go so he was...

...Deported to a ready made contender, who went 18-4 (81.8%) while he load managed in route to a ring*. Even without him this year, the Raps are winning at a 67.7% clip - good for 6th in the East (so far).

Fast forward to this year. He (secretly) met with Paul George - while he was simultaneously "negotiating in good faith" with Jeannie Buss. All in an effort to join another stacked team. Go get Moe Harkless. Go trade for Paul George. Etc, and I'll sign.

When has he ever had to shoulder the load of dragging a lotto team to the playoffs? Answer: none.

Career averages of 18.1ppg, 6.4rpg, and 2.5apg is hardly worthy of being thought of amongst the all-time greats. He "won" because he was on great teams. That's it and that's all.

* yes his 2019 ring deserves a big fat * next to it. We all know if KD and Klay played he'd be shining shoes.

[Joseph Kony]

Only a fucking retard is calling Harden 2nd best reg season GOAT. Not surprised to see you chiming in with your retardedness. Not surprised at all.

when did i or anyone claim he was the 2nd best RS GOAT? :lol you're such a fucktarded idiot :lmao stick to having autist arguments for 12 straight hours with Chump and Blake, because you sure as shit dont know fuck all about basketball. :lmao

dumbfuck, you literally said he was the same player in OKC as he is now, and that " his numbers reflect that actuality." and they clearly do not, one click trip to basketballreference.com shows youre completely full of shit and just making stuff up to seem like you know what youre talking about. like i said, go back jerking your butt buddies off in the club / political forum, stay out of the basketball forums and let the actual men here discuss ball. kthx

[Spurtacular]

He won with Cleveland. He broke the curse. He’s basically historically immortal after that.

I guess you're assuming someones like D-Wade and Chris Bosh would have came to Cleveland; because the Cavs got lottery picks like Kyrie Irving and Tristan Thompson because Lebron left.

[Larry Joe Bird]

6 rings in 6.5 seasons

14 straight losses / 2 playoff sweeps

Nobody cares about your watered down nineties gunk, fanboy.

[Chris Fall]

when did i or anyone claim he was the 2nd best RS GOAT? :lol

Don't know if it’s what he’s referring to, but ambchang started a thread a while back making such a claim. Said his advanced metrics proved Harden was the second best SG in history.

[Chris Fall]

when did i or anyone claim he was the 2nd best RS GOAT? :lol

Don't know if it’s what he’s referring to, but ambchang started a thread a while back making such a claim. Said his advanced metrics proved Harden was the second best SG in history.

[ElNono]

I guess you're assuming someones like D-Wade and Chris Bosh would have came to Cleveland; because the Cavs got lottery picks like Kyrie Irving and Tristan Thompson because Lebron left.

Not assuming anything. It’s a fact he went back to Cleveland after his stint in Miami and beat a historical Warriors team.

[ElNono]

Plus he just gifted beats headphones to the Ohio State squad... such class

[Joseph Kony]

Don't know if it’s what he’s referring to, but ambchang started a thread a while back making such a claim. Said his advanced metrics proved Harden was the second best SG in history.

i never made that claim so its retarded to quote me in and respond with that when he couldnt back up his claim that "in actuality" the numbers show Harden is the same player now as he was in OKC. this is so incorrect is laughable tbh

[Spurtacular]

Not assuming anything. It’s a fact he went back to Cleveland after his stint in Miami and beat a historical Warriors team.

It's a fact that the supporting cast was at a much higher level.

[ElNono]

It's a fact that the supporting cast was at a much higher level.

Sure. Not Bosh, Wade, Allen talented, but pretty good. That said, none of those guys have done anything of note since.

[FrostKing]

Upon further review. Tiny dick james. Tbh.

[Spurtacular]

Sure. Not Bosh, Wade, Allen talented, but pretty good. That said, none of those guys have done anything of note since.

A double-double guy and a top ten level player when he needed it. No getting past GS without them.

[ElNono]

A double-double guy and a top ten level player when he needed it. No getting past GS without them.

You’re putting the cart before the horse. Double-double guys are dime a dozen in this league. And ‘top 10 guy’ only when LeBron picked up all the attention. That’s why LeBron is a franchise guy, the rest tried and failed.

[Spurtacular]

You’re putting the cart before the horse. Double-double guys are dime a dozen in this league. And ‘top 10 guy’ only when LeBron picked up all the attention. That’s why LeBron is a franchise guy, the rest tried and failed.

They were top draft choices, dude. Those type of players weren't very likely to fall in Cleveland's lap if Lebron had stayed.

[ElNono]

They were top draft choices, dude. Those type of players weren't very likely to fall in Cleveland's lap if Lebron had stayed.

I’m not saying they didn’t turn out to be good, what I’m saying is that the guy that elevated everything there was LeBron.
Kyrie thought he was hot shit after that ring and his teams have done better without him.

[Spurtacular]

I’m not saying they didn’t turn out to be good, what I’m saying is that the guy that elevated everything there was LeBron.
Kyrie thought he was hot shit after that ring and his teams have done better without him.

Kyrie may have needed Lebron to peak right, but his talent was undeniable. Sure, he went to Boston and fizzled out; maybe he could've won another ring if he had stayed with Lebron. But Lebron wasn't winning that ring without Kyrie. That said, I don't care how much Kyrie gets called out on his shit play going forward; it's largely true.

[ElNono]

Never said they’re not talented. TD and Manu had Parker, Shaq and Pau had Kobe, Curry and KD had Klay... you always need a solid second/third banana around.

[lefty]

Never said they’re not talented. TD and Manu had Parker, Shaq and Pau had Kobe, Curry and KD had Klay... you always need a solid second/third banana around.
Agreed
MJ was a great 2nd banana to MVPippen and Rodman tbh

[Spurtacular]

Never said they’re not talented. TD and Manu had Parker, Shaq and Pau had Kobe, Curry and KD had Klay... you always need a solid second/third banana around.

And my point is I doubt Lebron gets those types of players if he had stayed in Cleveland and not went to Miami.

If I'm gonna throw you a bone, maybe Lebron gets one quality FA to join him and catches lightning in a bottle one of those Miami years, and he rings.

[TDfan2007]

You're a Spur fan at heart, so I'll let your Jim love slide. But Kawhi has been in the right place at the right timePERIOD.

He was drafted to the Spurs, who were already good. Jim was the man on those teams. They still had Manu. Still had TP. Still had Pop on the sidelines and good role players. All he had to do is mature as a player and fit into Pop's system. Then they fell out. Somebody had to go so he was...

...Deported to a ready made contender, who went 18-4 (81.8%) while he load managed in route to a ring*. Even without him this year, the Raps are winning at a 67.7% clip - good for 6th in the East (so far).

Fast forward to this year. He (secretly) met with Paul George - while he was simultaneously "negotiating in good faith" with Jeannie Buss. All in an effort to join another stacked team. Go get Moe Harkless. Go trade for Paul George. Etc, and I'll sign.

When has he ever had to shoulder the load of dragging a lotto team to the playoffs? Answer: none.

Career averages of 18.1ppg, 6.4rpg, and 2.5apg is hardly worthy of being thought of amongst the all-time greats. He "won" because he was on great teams. That's it and that's all.

* yes his 2019 ring deserves a big fat * next to it. We all know if KD and Klay played he'd be shining shoes.

:wow what a takedown. I agree with everything you've said, but when the guy plays, he's an assassin and easily a top 3 player because you can take nothing away from him. His passing is even improving.

It's a tough call between him and LeBron at this point, with Anthony Davis and Harden having a case for that number 4 spot. Giannis is clearly number one right now

[ElNono]

And my point is I doubt Lebron gets those types of players if he had stayed in Cleveland and not went to Miami.

If I'm gonna throw you a bone, maybe Lebron gets one quality FA to join him and catches lightning in a bottle one of those Miami years, and he rings.

I mean, it’s hard to tell and we can play the what if game all day long. He did get some players to join him like Kevin love, friendkilla, RJ, Mozgov, Perkins, Shawn Marion, Shumpert. They had Mo Williams too, IIRC. There’s a lot of talent there that was recruited by LeGM, tbh

[ambchang]

You're a Spur fan at heart, so I'll let your Jim love slide. But Kawhi has been in the right place at the right timePERIOD.

He was drafted to the Spurs, who were already good. Jim was the man on those teams. They still had Manu. Still had TP. Still had Pop on the sidelines and good role players. All he had to do is mature as a player and fit into Pop's system. Then they fell out. Somebody had to go so he was...

...Deported to a ready made contender, who went 18-4 (81.8%) while he load managed in route to a ring*. Even without him this year, the Raps are winning at a 67.7% clip - good for 6th in the East (so far).

Fast forward to this year. He (secretly) met with Paul George - while he was simultaneously "negotiating in good faith" with Jeannie Buss. All in an effort to join another stacked team. Go get Moe Harkless. Go trade for Paul George. Etc, and I'll sign.

When has he ever had to shoulder the load of dragging a lotto team to the playoffs? Answer: none.

Career averages of 18.1ppg, 6.4rpg, and 2.5apg is hardly worthy of being thought of amongst the all-time greats. He "won" because he was on great teams. That's it and that's all.

* yes his 2019 ring deserves a big fat * next to it. We all know if KD and Klay played he'd be shining shoes.

So the 99 spurs deserve an asterisk because they played less games and thus didn’t let the injury game play out, but the raptors deserve an asterisk because the other team was injured?

But there’s no asterisk for the 12 heat (shorter season), 88 lakers (Isiah Thomas injury), 00 lakers (duncan injury), 10 lakers (Celtics frontline).

Pick a lane buddy.

[LkrFan]

So the 99 spurs deserve an asterisk because they played less games and thus didn’t let the injury game play out, but the raptors deserve an asterisk because the other team was injured?

Yes and yes.

50/82=61% of the season. Every other true champ had to grind all the way thru all 82. 1999 deserves an *PERIOD

You really think the Raps beat a healthy Dub team? :lol Drinking Saki early huh? :lol They deserve an *PERIOD.


But there’s no asterisk for the 12 heat (shorter season), 88 lakers (Isiah Thomas injury), 00 lakers (duncan injury), 10 lakers (Celtics frontline).

12 Heat - no *

88 Lakers - nope; they just beat them in 87. Matter of fact, you missed the Pistons 89 *. Magic and B Scott didn't play.

00 Lakers - nope; then went on to annihilate the Spurs in 2001, proving 2000 wasn't a fluke :lol


Pick a lane buddy.

Just be lucky Phil Jackson didn't coach the 1998 Lakers:

Eddie Jones
Eldon Campbell
Nick Van Exel
Rick Fox
Robert Horry
Shaq (only 315lbs)
Kobe
Corie Blount

I guarantee you guys don't win in 1999 :toast

[LkrFan]

^ forgot about that 0.4 dude, who backed up NVE. They were stacked, young, and way more athletic before they traded EJ and Elden Campbell for Glenn Rice.

[Ghazi]

:lol DK at #1

LeBron, Duncan, Kareem are all better than him, and Kawhi probably will be too once it's all said and done.

Shit ass take

[lefty]

:lol DK at #1

LeBron, Duncan, Kareem are all better than him, and Kawhi probably will be too once it's all said and done.

Agreed

[lefty]

GOATS don't lose to rivals 14x in a row, son. People like to excuse that the man was young and lacked surrounding talent; but the final game of the two sweeps, McHale, Walton, and others were out injured as I came back from 15 in the fourth to finish Jordan off on his home floor. Hell, Fred fucking Roberts was the starting 4 in that game. He was like the Lakers' version of Jeff Lamp (12th man).

Then when I was injured and the Pistons got their chance, what did Jordan do when he had the Pistons 2-1 in the 89 ECF and Game 4 on his home court? He choked. He did nothing in the toughest era; we all were there, son. Then boys like you going through puberty in the 90's got a hard-on for the man. :lol

[ambchang]

Yes and yes.

50/82=61% of the season. Every other true champ had to grind all the way thru all 82. 1999 deserves an *PERIOD

You really think the Raps beat a healthy Dub team? :lol Drinking Saki early huh? :lol They deserve an *PERIOD.



12 Heat - no *

88 Lakers - nope; they just beat them in 87. Matter of fact, you missed the Pistons 89 *. Magic and B Scott didn't play.

00 Lakers - nope; then went on to annihilate the Spurs in 2001, proving 2000 wasn't a fluke :lol



Just be lucky Phil Jackson didn't coach the 1998 Lakers:

Eddie Jones
Eldon Campbell
Nick Van Exel
Rick Fox
Robert Horry
Shaq (only 315lbs)
Kobe
Corie Blount

I guarantee you guys don't win in 1999 :toast

Thanks for confirming your self contradiction.

[daslicer]

Yes and yes.

50/82=61% of the season. Every other true champ had to grind all the way thru all 82. 1999 deserves an *PERIOD

You really think the Raps beat a healthy Dub team? :lol Drinking Saki early huh? :lol They deserve an *PERIOD.



12 Heat - no *

88 Lakers - nope; they just beat them in 87. Matter of fact, you missed the Pistons 89 *. Magic and B Scott didn't play.

00 Lakers - nope; then went on to annihilate the Spurs in 2001, proving 2000 wasn't a fluke :lol



Just be lucky Phil Jackson didn't coach the 1998 Lakers:

Eddie Jones
Eldon Campbell
Nick Van Exel
Rick Fox
Robert Horry
Shaq (only 315lbs)
Kobe
Corie Blount

I guarantee you guys don't win in 1999 :toast

Trading Eddie Jones and Elden Campbell for Glen Rice was a big mistake by Jerry West. Those guys caused problems for the Spurs matchup wise.

[LkrFan]

Trading Eddie Jones and Elden Campbell for Glen Rice was a big mistake by Jerry West. Those guys caused problems for the Spurs matchup wise.

Agreed. Next to not seeing Eddie and Kobe for a decade, I also regret not keeping NVE. He was soooooo fun to watch:
SrI7AjIG1-o

As a 6th man extraordinaire, he could've been Sweet Lou on steroids.

[Rummpd]

I don't know if undisputed, but Jordan has a more than strong case as the GOAT. Not only narratives, raw numbers and accolades are on his side, but also advanced metrics support his case as the GOAT.

Jabbar is the true GOAT

[spurraider21]

11 rings in 13 seasons

https://i.imgur.com/21cG2Le.jpg
:lmao a league where there were 8 total teams

[Clipper Nation]

:lmao a league where there were 8 total teams
Good point, the league didn't water itself down with expansion for Russell like they did for DK.

[FrostKing]

1. Jordan
2. Kareem
3. Russell

[lefty]

Good point, the league didn't water itself down with expansion for Russell like they did for DK.

[Larry Joe Bird]

This dude knows.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYGLWCjhF04

[FrostKing]

1. Duncan
2. Shaq
3. Kobe
4. James
5. Curry

[Spurtacular]

1. Duncan
2. Shaq
3. Kobe
4. James
5. Curry

Get rid of the three point line and play with old school rules and Curry is probably not even an NBA player. :lol