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Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 05:08 AM
www.sun-sentinel.com/spor...ports-heat (http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/basketball/heat/sfl-brandspec16jul16,0,6470000.story?coll=sfla-sports-heat)


Heat ready to offer Brand $82.2M

By Ira Winderman
and Harvey Fialkov
Sun-Sentinel Staff Writers
Posted July 16 2003

Less than a week after saying he might take a passive approach to the NBA's free-agent signing period, Heat coach Pat Riley is poised to make a splash similar to those he previously has made in South Florida with the high-stakes additions of Alonzo Mourning, Eddie Jones and Brian Grant.

Los Angeles Clippers power forward Elton Brand was in South Florida on Tuesday and today will be extended a contract offer from the Heat that could be as high as $82.2 million over six years -- the most an outside team can offer.

Riley spoke last week of avoiding the type of contracts he previously extended to Mourning, Jones and Grant, but hedged by adding, "There's only one player I would consider doing that for."

That player turned out to be Brand.

Unlike the Heat's previous megabucks bids, this one comes with strings attached -- plenty of strings, including what likely will be a tense waiting period.

Because Brand is a restricted free agent, the Clippers would have 15 days to match a Heat offer sheet. However, the Heat and agent David Falk are believed to have constructed the offer sheet in a way to make it particularly unpalatable to notoriously tightfisted Clippers owner Donald T. Sterling.

Foremost, the Heat can make Brand's expected $10.96 million 2003-04 salary payable immediately and can advance additional funds into that lump-sum payment through accelerated signing bonuses. In addition, a maximum trade kicker is expected to be written into the offer, automatically accelerating remaining payments by 15 percent should Brand be dealt.

For the Heat, it means if Brand accepts the offer, as expected, that until July 30, Riley's team will be out of the free-agent market. It also means if the offer to Brand is not matched by the Clippers, the Heat would have to fill out the balance of its roster with minimum-salary players.

With Brand, 24, the Heat could field a lineup of Grant at center, Caron Butler and Brand at forward, and Jones and rookie Dwyane Wade in the backcourt.

More likely in the scenario of Brand being added would be a trade of a veteran, perhaps Jones, in a bid to either bolster needed depth at center and point guard, or to lessen the Heat's overall salary burden, with an eye toward adding another prime free agent next summer.

The addition of Brand would more than offset the free-agent loss of Mourning, who today will join the New Jersey Nets. The expiration of Mourning's $105 million contract created the space for the potential addition of Brand.

While the built-in incentives in the offer sheet would allow Brand to realize a financial windfall by the end of the month, a decision to accept the Heat's offer sheet would display a faith in Riley's ability to rebuild a franchise that dropped to 25-57 last season and has not won a playoff game in three years.

Because NBA rules sharply favor incumbent teams when it comes to free agents, Brand is eligible for a far greater deal from the Clippers, one that could max out at $105.5 million over seven years. Under NBA rules, outside teams may only offer 10-percent annual raises in offer sheets, while incumbent teams may offer 12.5-percent raises. In addition, outside teams may only offer six-year contracts, while incumbent teams may offer a maximum of seven years.

Once Brand signs the offer sheet, it means Brand would be property of the Heat or Clippers by the end of the month. No other team is allowed to negotiate with the 6-foot-8 power forward once the offer sheet is executed.

While Brand is, by far, the Clippers' most productive player, he also has toiled for an owner reluctant to pay the going rate for productive talent. The largest deal previously approved by Sterling, a Los Angeles real estate magnate, was a five-year, $15 million package to guard Eric Piatkowski in 1998.

As much as anything, the Heat's gambit is based on timing. The Clippers are expected today to also receive offer sheets from the Utah Jazz and Denver Nuggets, respectively, for guards Corey Maggette and Andre Miller, worth about $100 million combined.

To further give Sterling pause is the reality that if the offer for Brand is matched, the Heat is expected to immediately extend an offer sheet to Clippers forward Lamar Odom, a player Riley has coveted since the 1999 NBA Draft, when he offered valued forward P.J. Brown in a trade.

The Heat likely has made its intentions with Odom already known. One agent said Tuesday that Odom may stand as the ultimate goal, with Sterling unable to quickly recover from the haymaker of the Brand offer sheet.

In Brand, the Heat is looking at an undersized forward who has displayed an uncanny ability to get the ball to the rim as a scorer and snag it off the boards as a rebounder.

Because most teams take the full 15 days to decide on offer sheets, the Heat will be forced to the sidelines at a time the free-agent market is being picked clean.


Ira Winderman can be reached at [email protected]. Harvey Fialkov can be reached at [email protected].

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 05:11 AM
F him.

On to Odom.

ImFromBeijing
07-16-2003, 05:17 AM
If Don Sterling elects not to match the offer, Pat Reiley needs to send Bill Duffy 1000 fruit baskets (for not picking up Carter's option).

I guess Spurs were never a serious conteder for Brand after all. :eyebrow

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 05:18 AM
I guess you really think we give a **** what you have to say. :eyebrow

bugramps
07-16-2003, 05:24 AM
I think a lot of guys are afraid to sign with the Spurs. It's a tough job to be a Spur, a Mav or a King...because you are fighting ALL year for the title and most importantly against the Lakers.
Guys would much rather run to the east where it's easier even if it means no title. Granted Brand would make more with the Heat and Miami is a more exciting town than S.A., but there has to be something to all this.
We are defending world champs with the 2-time MVP who is also the consumate teammate and a great leader AND we have millions under the cap and SO MANY players are turning us down.
I think the Malone and Payton decisions sent a lot of guys running for the east. Kidd went from on the fence to outright dedicated to the Nets as soon the Lakers revamped.
I think guys are terrified to be a Spur because the Lakers will be targeting us, and no one wants to be a part of that.
Maybe Pippen or Horry would, but only because they're vets who aren't afraid. But it's unlikely we'll get either.
I think the title just royally screwed us over with Free Agents.
Brand doesn't want to be any part of our repeat efforts.
I say **** all of them, and let's win it again, and show them what they passed up!
Brand and Kidd will have to learn to live with mediocrity through their careers ... commiting long term to eastern teams with no hope of getting a title. Kidd will be the thing he fears the most ... a great player who never won a title.

Whottt
07-16-2003, 05:34 AM
Something doesn't wash in this article..

Before I get to that...how in the **** can the Heat offer more than we can? Why are we sitting around dicking with this front loaded deal when all he wants is a max offer?

But what doesn't wash with me...Brand knows Sterling is going to match that offer..it's a grand total of 5 million more that what the Clips have already offered...

Brand wants to play for a winner, he has said he will take less to stay in LA is Sterling signs..#1 How in the **** are the Heat considered a winner?

#2. Why would he put himself at risk to get fucked and stay in LA while simultaneously helping Odom to escape?

He could be gambling to get Sterling to sign both he and Odom to long term deals but that is a stupid thing to do IMO.

I mean Brand wants Odom to stay in LA along with Magette, so why would he deliberately **** himself into long term deal in LA with no out..and blaze a path for his help to leave...

Pretty much guranteeing he will be stuck in LA with no sidekicks of any worth.

Why would he let himself be used?

And I call bullshit as well on Brand being afraid of playing in the West..the dude isn't that kind of player.

I do think guys like the East more because they can make the AS game easier over there..but what I have noticed is after a few years guys get sick of playing the AS game anyway.

Anyway something isn't right with this article, maybe I am missing something...but it sure doesn't make much sense.


Unless Brand just absolutely doesn't care about winning..and I don't think that's the case.

I want to know if the Spurs pulled out of this deal. We are hearing they did in certain corners of the press...

That's the only thing that makes sense to me..Brand wants out but the Spurs backed off..

The Spurs need to stop being so wishy washy and heavy handed on who they want..it makes them look bad, insincere, and it is a character trait this team has had for a few offseasons now. Pick your freaking guys and go after him but don't screw loyal guys in the process.

Maybe I am wrong, but I want to hear Brand wasn't interested...I don't want to hear this stuff about us concentrating our efforts elsewhere because we don't think we can get him. I mean we were willing to **** DROB for Webber..what have we got to lose on this one?

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 05:45 AM
Maybe Brand lied? Players give lip service to winning all the time. Out of Utah, San Antonio, and Miami where would you like to have an opportunity to live for the next 6 years?

Beyond that, there is a dearth of bigmen in the East. Brand can make an impact there and get notice. As well he has an opportunity to become the Heat's franchise player.

He will have a good crack at the All-Star team every year and what pressure is there exactly in Miami for the Heat to win?

The terms of the deal are similiar to the one that the Spurs were offering. Also, those terms make this deal more attractive to Brand by more than the nominal $5 mil difference. The Clippers' alleged offer wouldn't have the same payout as this one, as has been discussed ad naseum in this forum.

Finally, remaining with the Clippers was never a viable option for Brand. He never wanted to stay there.

Going to small market SA where he would be overshadowed by Duncan and also lose attention to a young and up and coming player like Parker wasn't apparently his top choice.

The only upshot is that Odom will now be available and he will be facing Denver, Utah, and SA who have any major cap flexibility though how much Denver has is a significant question mark. Also if things fall through with the Wizards and Arenas maybe they turn their attention to Odom?

I

Whottt
07-16-2003, 06:05 AM
No MB, you see...the reports we have been reading don't say Brand turned us down...they say we blew it off...

And Brand has been saying he wanted to stay in LA since he got there..if..

And at the beginning of this article it says Riley will only offer the max to one player Brand..

And then it turns around and says it's all a gambit to get Odom...

Surely Brand must realize he's being used?

If he wants to stay in LA all he has to do is tell the Clips to give him the max and they will do it I am pretty sure.


Anyway I am confused but I suppose more will come out as time goes by.

I want to hear Brand turned us down though..I need to hear that before I start assreaming our FO. Because all I have heard was that Brand's agent was working with us to find a poison pill contract...no doubt he wouldn't mind Miami...but I also don't think Brand is going to pull a Kidd and dick a team around that is willing to lay it on the line to get him out of there.

Fucking Rasho..I mean hey at least he wants to play here..but still

We aint winning a fucking title this year by replacing DROB with Rasho...keeping that draft pick looks like a pretty good idea about now..Hope Phoenix enjoys shoving Balderama or what ever his name is up our ass for the next 6 years before we collect on that pick.

Somethings fucked up if Minnesota can get guys..Portland can get guys...I mean SA isn't any worse than those places..Someone is dropping the ball somewhere this offseason..

Oh and Odom damn sure isn't coming here...get real..

Truthsayer
07-16-2003, 06:17 AM
Whott the hell?

Yeah, Minnesota can get guys. They couldn't even resign their own player. They got a reject NOBODY wanted.

Portland, what non-criminal did they get?

Who has Utah and Denver gotten so far? They both have MAJOR bucks to spend too.

What news stories did you read saying the Spurs blew off Brand? Not the same ones I have been reading.

What 28th draft pick had even a 50% chance of making the the rotation. Yet we would have been stuck with a guaranteed contract.

You are so brilliant. Take a Xanax and chill. Everything is going to work out all right.

Whottt
07-16-2003, 06:25 AM
Minnesota gets guys all the time..Joe Smith...

Portland? They get DA..they get Scottie Pippen, they get a lot of guys that aren't criminals..

Denver is about to get Miller and Utah is about to get Magette they have both signed sheets...

I am sorry you haven't seen the stories saying the Spurs pulled out, but if you look around they aren't hard to see..I know I have been debating it with guys in here hoping that they don't..

So maybe you should pull your head out of your ass and check your facts before jumping my shit.

And if you could read you would see what I wanted to hear before I jumped the FO's shit.

And if it is going to work out then why worry about me freaking out...just sit back and claim scoreboard when it happens. You take the xanax and stick it clean up your own ass.

Edit: and furthermore..with regards to the draft pick..while he may or may not have contributed..I can think of a lot better things to do with a pick then give it to a team we have problems with for a pick we might not get a return on for 6 years from now.

You are happy with Rasho, I am not if that is all we get...I think that sucks ass and I think we are in for a shitty season and an asskicking at the hands of the Lakers. Deal with it.

gunawanspurs
07-16-2003, 06:35 AM
.....As much as anything, the Heat's gambit is based on timing. The Clippers are expected today to also receive offer sheets from the Utah Jazz and Denver Nuggets, respectively, for guards Corey Maggette and Andre Miller, worth about $100 million combined.
......

So, it's not a MAX offer for CMagg afterall.

Closer to :

55 mil for CMagg

45-50 mil for Dre Miller

The Clips would pass on both these guys IMHO

IcemanCometh
07-16-2003, 06:37 AM
And another one bites the dust

Truthsayer
07-16-2003, 06:40 AM
Minnesota gets guys all the time..Joe Smith...

Yeah then got fined and lost five first round picks. And had their GM suspended. What a great example.


Portland? They get DA..they get Scottie Pippen, they get a lot of guys that aren't criminals..

Yeah, and they've been real winners ever since. So sucessful that they alienated their fans, have had to fire coaches and their GM, and are a lock to pay major luxury tax.


Denver is about to get Miller and Utah is about to get Magette they have both signed sheets...

Yeah, those are a couple of All Stars. And it remains to be seen whether Sterling matches Magette's offer sheet. Both those teams had as much or more cap space to work with than the Spurs.


I am sorry you haven't seen the stories saying the Spurs pulled out, but if you look around they aren't hard to see..I know I have been debating it with guys in here hoping that they don't..

I've been scouring the net about four hours a day for the last several days. As for your posts, I always take those with a BIG grain of salt. You like to be a hater and you always find a way.


So maybe you should pull your head out of your ass and check your facts before jumping my shit.

Okay GW, Jr. If your shit stinks and you think is smells great, someone has to tell you.

:flipoff

Whottt
07-16-2003, 06:47 AM
LMAO a hater? Lol I have been called a homer 50 times a day for the past year...Lol I have even had DizzG call me a homer. Ahem I have been called a homer by the starter of this thread..

Believing in your team and it's homegrown players makes you a homer even if they win a title it seems..criticizing what appears to be stupid manuevers by the FO equals hater...

Maybe I am just calling it like I see it..

If we pulled out on this deal I am gonna be pissed we didn't have the balls to see it through. Check this forum you will see articles saying the Spurs thought Sterling would match so they turned their efforts elsewhere. Bad freaking move if that is why Brand is sitting in Miami right now.

And like it or not if we are striking out on all these FA's someone needs to take a damn salesmanship class..Sure SA might require a bit more salesmenship than Miami, but I refuse to believe SA sucks so bad that no one will play there.

Whottt
07-16-2003, 07:17 AM
Ok truth you AHOLE!

Check this from an article posted on page 2 of this forum:


The Spurs considered offering a front-loaded $74 million deal, with $22 million payable immediately. They may, instead, pull out of the bidding, even though Brand has become their No. 1 prospect.

Woudln't you consider that a minor screwup on our part?

Get the fucking smalltown chip off your shoulder..Brand may not be the bad guy here.


Link to the thread:
pub237.ezboard.com/ffullsportpressfrm7.showMessage?topicID=3980.topic (http://pub237.ezboard.com/ffullsportpressfrm7.showMessage?topicID=3980.topic )

Now who is the hater bitch?

And one other thing...this "no one wants to live in SA" excuse only goes so far...just because an athlete may not want to live in a city doesn't mean he won't play for it's team...

Bruce Bowen still has a house in Miami.. Bruce chose to play here even though he still lives in Miami...Manu I imagine has one in Argentina still, Tony in Paris...Karl Malone lives in damn Arkansas...Where is Rasho right now?

San Antonio is a kickass city..it's a party city..it's not the turn off you guys want to make it out to be and it's also not the immovable obstacle of getting players to play here...someone is dropping the ball on convincing these guys to play here. Can the FO judge talent? Definitely...are they doing a good job of selling players on the Spurs? Obviously not.

texbound
07-16-2003, 08:27 AM
The Heat likely has made its intentions with Odom already known. One agent said Tuesday that Odom may stand as the ultimate goal, with Sterling unable to quickly recover from the haymaker of the Brand offer sheet.

Ok, if Brand does sign an offer sheet from the Heat, the Spurs should sign Odom to an offer sheet at the same time. That way, if Sterling matches a deal for Brand, then Miami is left with nothing. Either Odom will signed by the Spurs or he'll signed by the Clips.

Tex

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 09:17 AM
It's very possible the Spurs have pulled out of the bidding for Brand out of fear that he will be matched.

If that is the case, and Brand signs with Miami and isn ot matched, I will be VERY disapointed in our Front Office, for not showing the balls when they had the chance to step up and knock one out.

Ludden has said they were getting scared as well as national sources. Now, if Brand does get matched, and we take another route, then well there's no problem there at all.

We Shall see.

Also, this makes the Odom offer much more likely now.

picnroll
07-16-2003, 09:56 AM
If the Spurs want Odom they better put the offer on the table now. They better make that offer rich to entice Odom and scare off Sterling. They better tell Odom "if you're interested sign it now, no waiting" so they don't get played by Odom, his agent and Miami waiting around to see what Sterling does with Brand. If Odom won't sign now asume he's interested in Miami and the only way we get him is if Sterling doesn't match Brand, so just walk away. He can go to Denver but they have Melo, Tskitishvili, and White so he's not a great fit. Utah. God I hope he doesn't want to go to Utah more than SA. Now if Odom did come just don't let him be in the same room with Jax without adult supervision.

If we're not interested in Odom or him in us then we're out of the market for impact players. Arenas has said he wants to play PG and he's the only one left.

How much is the Brandon exception? One rumor was that Miami would trade Joones to the T Wolves for Brandon's contract. Maybe Miami could sweeten it with draft picks. They do that and they might pull both Brand and Odom in.

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 10:13 AM
The problem with fans is that unless they read a news report or a newspaper article saying that your front office is pursuing yada yada yada, they assume its not happening.

Wrong.

I'm sure the Spurs know what they're next course of action is and are currently pursuing it.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 10:28 AM
Why are the Heat taking the approach with Brand and then Odom that the Spurs should be taking?

Now, at worst, Brand goes to the Heat and Sterling re-signs Odom.

At best, Sterling retains Brand and we get in a bidding war for Odom.

Buford better friggin' get on the ball here. Rasho ain't enough.


:cooldevil

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 10:33 AM
Ghost,

I honestly believe there is alot more to this onethat meets the avg fans eye. Join our chats sometime. :fro

Aggie Hoopsfan
07-16-2003, 10:36 AM
Man,

What the **** is our front office doing?

Besides looking like a bunch of pussies afraid of Donald Fucking Sterling.

AHF

Solid D
07-16-2003, 10:40 AM
Not good news for Spurs fans.

It's the same "check" and "checkmate" move mentioned yesterday regarding what the Spurs should do. I just didn't think it would be coming from the Miami Heat.

As mentioned yesterday, I doubt Odom (and his agent) will be inclined to move too quickly.

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 10:41 AM
People, the answer is rather obvious...Elton Brand prefers South Beach to Austin Highway.

Look, he can only choose to sign one offer sheet. He went with the Heat.

Next.

ducks
07-16-2003, 10:45 AM
I am not so sure he will sign. this is a florida paper reporting this. maybe the spurs will max their offer.

Aggie Hoopsfan
07-16-2003, 10:45 AM
Well RC and Pop have got some work to do, right now this off-season is a failure.

I don't doubt that South Beach is more attractive, but this is certainly a shock to what we were hearing yesterday. All that's happened since then that we've heard is the Spurs reportedly got scared off. Not exactly the model of off-season efficiency for our front office.

AHF

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 10:50 AM
The Spurs extended him an offer as did Miami and Utah. He chose Miami. The Spurs didn't drop out they were in the middle of things.

Call up Brand and bitch him out.

Solid D
07-16-2003, 10:53 AM
If this is true, I wouldn't be surprised to see Eddie Jones and another player/pick end up with the Clippers to make something out of Sterling's investment.

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 10:55 AM
you're on crack, sterling wants nothing to do with EJ's contract

2Cleva
07-16-2003, 10:56 AM
Wow. This has to be devastating to you guys if its true.

But I can see why Brand would rather go to Miami and shine as one of the best big men in the East, become a perennial All-Star and dominate the paint with 2 potential star swingmen instead of coming to SA.

Not many players in general want to play second fiddle to a guy that plays their same position. They would never get the accolades that they would if they were by themselves.

But its not over yet, Spurs fans. Who knows what happens...

Aggie Hoopsfan
07-16-2003, 10:56 AM
No way Sterling takes that ugly contract.

And why isn't the league investigating the ACarter "clerical error"?


AHF

picnroll
07-16-2003, 10:57 AM
Wouldn't Sterling taking Eddie Jones just be slitting his own throat? That would be frreing up Miami's cap space to go after Odom. Unless he knew somebody else is going to make a run at Odom that he wouldn't match.

KoriEllis
07-16-2003, 10:58 AM
It will piss me off if the Spurs' management got pussified and just pulled out of the Brand running because they got scared of Sterling matching and then a loser organization like the Heat gets him. :cry

Another thing that is enraging me right now is that the frickin' Heat cheat their way into cap space by Anthony Carter "forgetting" to turn in his player option and end up with a shot at Brand. :gun

:flipoff

If it helps anyone, the Spurs were talking to Odom yesterday but I don't know the results.

I'll try to see if I can find out what's going on. But who knows if I can ... it's a busy day.

Aggie Hoopsfan
07-16-2003, 10:58 AM
If Sterling was going to take on Eddie's contract, he may as well match Brand.

AHF

scott
07-16-2003, 10:58 AM
this = bullshit.

Brand will be a Spur.

scott
07-16-2003, 11:00 AM
Anthony Carter's agent must die.

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 11:00 AM
One more time: Donald Sterling doesn't think like your average NBA owner. The only thing he cares about is keeping payroll low and long-term financial commitments to a minimum. There's no way he would ever take back Eddie Jones in a trade (because of his contract) whereas another owner might well be tempted to.

picnroll
07-16-2003, 11:02 AM
Investigation? Conspiracy theory, no investigation. League would rather see a powerhouse in Miami than SA. Stern probably suggested the plan.

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 11:07 AM
oh god, stfu with the ster conspiracy theories. some people have seen one too many episodes of the fucking x files.

picnroll
07-16-2003, 11:09 AM
Not serious Manny. What Duffy did is entirely legal. It's player option and Carter played ball with Miami.

Aggie Hoopsfan
07-16-2003, 11:10 AM
There's no conspiracy theory, just two guys in the Spurs front office with very small balls.

AHF

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 11:13 AM
Get real AHF. The Spurs extended him an offer. Probably the same damn one that Falk drafted with Miami. He went with Miami.

You seem to be forgetting that it's up to the player who he signs with.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 11:13 AM
Manny, I've been in the chats. Don't act like you know something you don't.

Perhaps the Spurs would've been better off moving the franchise near Bourbon Street.

If Sterling matches for Brand, the Heat will get Odom.

If Sterling doesn't match for Brand, the HEat will get him and Sterling will match us for Odom.

How do we not get screwed here?



Question.


We need to get Odom to sign an offer sheet from us now.

:cooldevil

Bounce580
07-16-2003, 11:14 AM
I wouldn't get so worked up about it yet. Supposedly Howard was going to Minny, Miller to Utah, etc etc

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 11:15 AM
Ghost, sign Odom to the offer sheet now. Provided, of course, that he wants to come to SA. Forget about waiting on his ass so he can see if he can go to Miami instead.

scott
07-16-2003, 11:18 AM
Greggy Pop, you've been PUNK'D

http://ak1.aka.eonline.com/7/1480/1218/0001/www.eonline.com/On/Special/Golden2001/Gallery/Images/kutcher.jpg

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 11:19 AM
That's what I am saying, Marcus.

Let Miami and LAC battle over Brand and make Odom the priority.

What will Sterling do when faced with a decision of matching big offers for both players?


Question.


:cooldevil

texbound
07-16-2003, 11:22 AM
For one thing, Brand hasn't signed the offer sheet yet.

Second, why would he and his agent work on this contract with the Spurs if he didn't want to be with SA. Thee is no other paper reporting this. Maybe the Spurs did back out, but it doesn't make any sense. Neither Falk ro Brand have said they were signing and offer sheet with either Miami or SA. Before you guys get pissed off, wait until another source has reported this information. Remember, the NY Post just reported that Kidd wanted Scott fired, which we found out was false. Just because one paper says something, doesn't make it so.

Tex

Morphgizmo
07-16-2003, 11:22 AM
Greggy Pop, you've been PUNK'D

Again! :(

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 11:23 AM
Well, Odom would have to want to come here.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 11:29 AM
This is pathetic.

What is it about the Spurs that keeps star free agents at bay?


If we can't attract a star free agent this summer, we never will.


:cooldevil

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 11:32 AM
texbound,

That's true but Miami was interested in Brand and talking to him. Brand had offers from SA, Miami, and Utah. If this article is accurate he chose the Miami offer.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 11:34 AM
Miami has Odom pegged as their backup plan. If we were smart, we'd make Odom our new primary plan.

Rasho's not the answer.


:cooldevil

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 11:35 AM
Maybe Miami is Odom's primary plan and San Antonio he thinks is a great taco dish.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 11:45 AM
So either way we're screwed, basically.

Two players. Three teams.

Spurs look like the odd man out.








"We're the Spurs.":shootme





:cooldevil

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 11:47 AM
Ok Ghost what are the Spurs doing wrong? If they are doing nothing wrong then is there a reason to complain?

Damn, you go off on the Spurs like they're run like the Knicks or something.

Jimcs50
07-16-2003, 11:55 AM
Brand wants to come to SA. That is what he said to Maggette. I believe that. Keep the faith.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 11:55 AM
What are they doing wrong?

Nothing so far as I can see.

What is there to complain about?

Not getting any superstar free agents despite having everything going for us.



:cooldevil

Jimcs50
07-16-2003, 11:57 AM
Of course, if you had millions of dollars, where would you rather hang out, South Beach or The Riverwalk? That is a no brainer, I'm affraid.

Jimcs50
07-16-2003, 11:58 AM
But I believe what he told Maggette and I think he is working with RC and Pop as we speak.

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 12:00 PM
Manny, I've been in the chats. Don't act like you know something you don't.

Look Asshole,

I hadn't seen you there. Even if I did know something you didn't, which I don't, I wouldn't care. Unlike you Ghost, I don't get a hardon based on my self proclaimed INCREDIBLE POSTER status on this or any other board.

Get over yourself.

****, can't even talk about the Spurs for one fucking morning without you pulling out the "I'm a punk ass" card.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 12:04 PM
Watch your mouth, b1tch.

Don't bring up the chatroom as a source of secret information if you don't know anything more than the rest of do, Emmy.

Until Brand and Odom are signed, it's anyone's guess what will happen.


I don't appreciate that tone either, young lady. If you're pissed off, send Kidd, O'Neal and Brand an angry email.

:cooldevil

spurster
07-16-2003, 12:06 PM
Brand was always a long shot. Brand in the East makes the East a little better at least.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 12:07 PM
All the stars were a longshot, spurster. Why do you think I was so critical of the Holt-ing Pattern?





Question.


:cooldevil

gospurs21
07-16-2003, 12:09 PM
Maybe FA don't want to play 2nd fiddle to Tim Duncan or be blaimed if we don't repeat.

I still don't understand the contract being offered to Brand.

Miami has ~11M cap room.

If the full (base + bonus) contract is 82M for 6 years.

What is the starting base and what is the bonus?

Go Spurs...

scott
07-16-2003, 12:13 PM
We were offering a much larger lump sum up front it seems like... so either Brand doesn't like Puffy Tacos, or we pulled out like MFD on Prom Night.

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 12:16 PM
Ghost,

The thing that pisses me off about you is that your so fucking wrapped up in your ego and spurs fan elitism to realize just how incredibly stupid all your takes are.

I brought up the chatroom because I never see you in there, and I thought you might actually want the info that is shared in there. But who the hell am I to actually try to help out the great GHOST WRITER. I mean hell, he comes up with the most witty of phrases like Emmy and Holting Pattern, not to mention displays an incredible amount of NBA GM prowess.

Whatever dude, If it makes you feel more complete to think of yourself as the some sort of GURU on this board, by all means go ahead. I know in the future to remember that you won't actually directly admit to ignorance in any way at all, you'll simply display it in your posts.

Solid D
07-16-2003, 12:24 PM
Manny - you might want to request a change in your title and your name you post under if you want your disdain for other people's egos to have merit.

Just a thought.

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 12:33 PM
My screenname is a long running joke from my early days at WOAI having to do with Sister Beth's name.

As far as what was put under it, I had no say or request in that, but i figured it was a joke having to do with praise god.

Ghost isn't going to look at my post and rethink his posting, he's just going to call me emmy and say something along the lines of "eat shit and die, you're an idiot" so who cares? ;)

Thanks for your concern on trivial things though.

ducks
07-16-2003, 12:35 PM
I wonder if the spurs talked to odom to force brand to make up his mind

and I thought odom was the one that riley really wanted

RBodenburg2150
07-16-2003, 12:41 PM
Call me a hopeless optimist, but I won't believe anything until I actually read that Brand SIGNED the offer sheet with the Heat. Right now, there's really only one source reporting this -- a Miami newspaper. 24 hours ago we were sure he'd sign with us. Lots of things can happen.

Kori, any new news?

F7
07-16-2003, 12:54 PM
The article said Brand was in South Florida but never really indicated whether or not he was going to sign.. basically just said that the Heat are going to put an offer sheet on the table.

Bodenburg is right, looks like the writer was just pimping up a possibility that Brand would sign.. does not seem like a sure thing. If it were, it would already be on ESPN.

With that being said.. Brand was never a guarantee, that's why the Spurs signed Rasho.

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 12:54 PM
The problem is that the Spurs are asking these free agents to come play in the shadow of Tim Duncan and the rising young Tony Parker....in San Antonio, Texas. That's not as appealing as we would like to believe.

These guys have egos. They are used to being "The Man". Spurs should use their cap flexibility wisely now to bolster the supporting cast with experienced vets and some younger less noticed players.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 12:58 PM
Nice try.

But none of that stopped perennial All-Stars like Payton and Malone from "playing in the shadows" of Shaq and Kobe.

Parker and Duncan should be a draw, not a detriment.

:cooldevil

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 12:59 PM
I honestly think TP had alot to do with Kidd not coming here, with his public comments and what not.

Well, I've said all along thats fine.

If he and Manu can turn into Stars, which is easily possible, then all we need are roll players.

I know that immediatly, this summer will be declared a bust without another big signing, but what if later on down the road it turns out the the seemingly mediocre acquisitions were just what they needed?

Its a definete possibility.

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 01:01 PM
Nice try.

But none of that stopped perennial All-Stars like Payton and Malone from "playing in the shadows" of Shaq and Kobe.



It's the damn truth. As if Payton and Malone are not going to be noticed in LA. Why should Brand come here and spend his career in the shadows when he can be the man in freaking Miami?

If I'm not right then what's the real answer?

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 01:04 PM
Ghost used his direct connection to the powers that be to make sure they didn't come here to prove his holting pattern genius.

That is the real truth.

2Cleva
07-16-2003, 01:05 PM
There is a difference in GP and Malone than say Kidd and O'Neal/Brand.

LA needs a PG and a PF. Those two know they will get plenty of minutes and no one to look over their shoulder at their position.

The two thing SA don't need is a PG and PF. Those players know they will have to compromise their games to fit next to Parker and Duncan.

Also, LA went after older players who care more about winning and have already had the money and fame. SA went after young players who care more about the latter. They'd rather rule a city and try to make them winners than go to a city who is already a winner and realize they never will be the best player on the team, or the focal point.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 01:10 PM
I think it has more to do with being "The Man."

I think for some reason star free agents are generally turned off by the San Antonio Spurs.

There's a stigma attached to this team.

It's like the Spurs are too boring or conservative or something.

Charles Barkely also echoed the general feeling that there's nothing to do in SA repeatedly during the playoffs.

It's frustrating to live down these stereotypes.


:cooldevil

picnroll
07-16-2003, 01:12 PM
Payton and Malone have a great setup in LA. They ride into troubled Lakertown like the Magnificent Two. They rescue the poor troubled townfolk. Then they ride out and Lakertown continues its collapse into oblivion, thus showing how critical the Magnificent Two were and adding to the greatness and the glory that are Malone and Payton.

Can't do that in SA even if they wanted too.

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 01:13 PM
Spoken just like someone who doesn't live here.

Well, we convinced Tim to stay twice. Thats gotta count for alot of something. We routinely attract role players torwards the end of their careers for less money than they can make other places.

It seems that this is the first time we've been turned down by FA's, and they've all been young (exception of Kidd).

So to say we routinely miss out is false isn't it?

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 01:13 PM
Ghost that's the lamest take I've ever seen you post. None of these guys want to play second fiddle to Tim Duncan in a small market town. That's it. Accept reality and move on.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 01:16 PM
Okay, if you say so, homer.

Let's see...

South Beach or the Riverwalk?

:cooldevil

MannyIsGod
07-16-2003, 01:25 PM
What did bowen pick for less?

baseline bum
07-16-2003, 01:27 PM
Hahahahaha... the Spurs are totally screwed. When's the last time a team had this much money and didn't get shit?

What a bust of an offseason. Rasho's Vinny Del Negro soft and it looks like the best we can pull is Robert Horry.

4-seed here we come!

GrandeDavid
07-16-2003, 01:33 PM
4 seed? :rollin :rollin :rollin

Baseline, go easy man! You can't get every free agent you want with or without the cash every year, and the Spurs have done a decent job on the rebound. Rasho is not an all star, by any means, but he should fill the Spurs' immediate needs. If not, there are always potential trades!

Each player the Spurs courted, or thought about courting, was always doubtful to leave their respective team (Jason Kidd, J OŽNeal). The biggest surprise was P.J. Brown deciding to stay in New Orleans...until I discovered that Louisiana is Brown's home state.

Let's let this all play out and at the very least we should be slightly better than next season.

picnroll
07-16-2003, 01:34 PM
When's the last time a team had this much money and didn't get shit?
Chicago.

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 01:41 PM
Riley didn't want Bowen back as a starter, Emmy.


:cooldevil

baseline bum
07-16-2003, 01:42 PM
No fucking way this team is better than last year's when they lose Dave and replace him with that soft-ass bitch Rasho without adding another quality starter. Adding a couple of bench scrubs while losing Claxton won't do shit for us. If the offseason turns out as projected I expect to see Dallas take the division.

scott
07-16-2003, 01:42 PM
What did Anthony Carter choose?

Oh... wait...

Aggie Hoopsfan
07-16-2003, 02:00 PM
WGAF what there is to do in SA.

During the season you are dog tired all the time anyway. Have a summer home in whatever hotspot you like, and come play for SA.

This is pathetic, there's got to be going on than we know about.

AHF

scott
07-16-2003, 02:07 PM
Brand is going to sign with Lakers for the vet minimum. Sterling says he won't match.

SCOOP (http://www.theskyisfalling.com)

SpursRock50
07-16-2003, 02:32 PM
No offense to DROB last year...but it seems some think he was just amazing. He wasnt...Rasho is decent and his numbers against LA were about the same as DROB

Last year

http://sportsmed.starwave.com/media/sportscenter/2003/0716/photo/nesterovicvrobinson_i.jpg

Spurs with a 4 seed? :lol

Admiral
07-16-2003, 02:40 PM
I'm tired of this "well, at least we tried" attitude. That's a pathetic attempt at justifying an extremely disappointing summer. It's about results, and so far we haven't gotten any. That is a FACT.

I don't blame the front office, I'm sure they are trying their best. I have total confidence in their abilities, but the bottom line is that it hasn't happened yet. No big deal at this point. It might happen five seconds after I submit this post, or in a week, but it hasn't happened yet. So why are some people trying to gloss it all over? Let's look this problem in the eye for what it is - then modify and adjust. That's how you turn things around, not saying "oh well, at least we tried!"

By the way, the article stated nothing about Brand accepting the offer. There is still hope for Brand, and I won't believe otherwise until he's signed an offer sheet with another team.

bugramps
07-16-2003, 02:47 PM
Not sure if this was already mentioned. I know there is a thread for the ESPN Insider article that just quoted the Florida paper...this one is a second source. For what it's worth:

espn.go.com/nba/news/2003...81398.html (http://espn.go.com/nba/news/2003/0716/1581398.html)

RBodenburg2150
07-16-2003, 02:54 PM
That ESPN article isn't a second source. It just references the same Sun Sentinel article.

spurster
07-16-2003, 03:00 PM
The front office thought they had Kidd, but they didn't.

What it all shows is that the cap space strategy is terrible for signing stars. It is a good way of keeping your costs down and have more flexibility to sign decent players, but that's about it.

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2003, 03:00 PM
Okay, if you say so, homer.

Let's see...

South Beach or the Riverwalk?


No shit motherfucker I've said that is why Brand went to Miami. According to you, however, this is not significant. Maybe you need to understand the difference.

bugramps
07-16-2003, 03:01 PM
not so much on brand, but on odom it does. When I worked for a newspaper, it was a fireable offense to site something without giving credit to the source.
If the Brand part about accepting the offer came from the Sun article, the reporter is obligated to mention it IMMEDIATELY following the sentence -- i.e. "brand is expected to sign the offer, according to the Sun Time article." If you don't, it is rightfully assumed to be independent information.
The only part sited from the Sun article was about Odom being Plan B. If this reporter just regurgitated the reporting done by another paper, then he or she is in HOT ASS WATER!

gospurs21
07-16-2003, 04:49 PM
the funny thing is all the bitching but no one seems to have a solution to why FA don't want to play in SA.

Pop and RC throw MAX dollars at Kidd, Kidd says no. NOT SAs FAULT

O'Neil does not return Pop's calls NOT SAs FAULT

Brown wishes to stay in home state NOT SAs FAULT

It can't be because of market size. Look at Chicago. AGAIN NOT SAs FAULT

Malone and Payton wanted to ride the coat tails of snaq/krybe. ONCE AGAIN HOW IS THIS SAs FAULT?

No amount of bitching will change that fact. SA is not attractive for what ever reason. GET OVER IT.

STOP LOOKING FOR SOMEONE TO BLAIM

Biggest bunch of babies I have ever encountered. It is as if GW has infected everyone.

Go Spurs...

Ghost Writer
07-16-2003, 04:58 PM
Marcus, you are the dope who doesn't think there is a stigma of boringness attached to SPURS BASKETBALL.



:cooldevil

T Park Num 9
07-16-2003, 05:02 PM
go spurs

your gonna get ripped up for ripping someone up.

Dont you know that people here have to bitch cause well..
thats all they can do.

Your also gonna ripped up for being a blind homer who has to rip the Spurs to be a TRUE fan,