Dirty Mexicans

[Spurtacular]

Sucks that Dems blocked efforts to finish the wall. Their interference is literally costing many, many lives!

https://apnews.com/129cbe9e6320cd16ce3e845f29de0cac


In addition to Arizona, other states experiencing recent spikes of infections include California, Texas and North Carolina — particularly within the Hispanic community. As a result, the task force is looking at whether those spikes may be tied to legal travel between the U.S. and Mexico, which is experiencing an ongoing severe coronavirus outbreak.

[TimDunkem]

Legal travel.

[Winehole23]

Jump to conclusions before the investigation, like you do.

[boutons_deux]

the MX outbreak was seeded by Dirty Americans travelling to MX

[weebo]

hatercalled it. :tu

Mexico didn't heed his warning.

Mexico should have built that wall to keep shithole Americans out.

[Spurtacular]

Mexico should have built that wall to keep shithole Americans out.

So, you hate your fellow countrymen :tu

[DarrinS]

At least you didn't blame the increase on protests. That's some blasphemous shit.

[rascal]

So, you hate your fellow countrymen :tu

The virus entered the US before Mexico. The virus was here first.

[Spurtacular]

The virus entered the US before Mexico. The virus was here first.

The virus is everywhere. Podunk islands in the South Pacific weren't spared.

[hater]

The virus entered the US before Mexico. The virus was here first.

Yup dirty american bastards

[Ef-man]

“Could be” should be main take away from article.

Could be people who do not practice good hygiene; could be other than U. S. citizens; could be not so many lives; could be derps or derp-style?

Should not read too much in article.

[pgardn]

The virus is everywhere. Podunk islands in the South Pacific weren't spared.

but Chyna...

[Millennial_Messiah]

The virus is everywhere. Podunk islands in the South Pacific weren't spared.

Zero confirmed cases in Antarctica

[Spurtacular]

Zero confirmed cases in Antarctica

Penguins holding their breath.

[hater]

a penguin is cleaner than an average american

[ElNono]

Talking about det wall... your taxes at work, folks...

Trump said the new border wall was “impenetrable.” Smugglers are sawing through it.
Smugglers have found that all you need to cut through the wall is a $100 saw.

President Donald Trump promised that a wall on the border would radically change undocumented immigration and customs enforcement. But it turns out newly built sections of the president’s wall aren’t as sturdy as he promised: Smugglers have been using a commercial saw to cut through it, according to the Washington Post.

Smuggling people and goods into the US is a profitable industry for criminal organizations, which is why they are motivated to innovate when it comes to breaching barriers. Of late, smugglers have reportedly been cutting through the wall — which is made of steel bollards that are partially filled with concrete — to make gaps large enough for people and goods to pass through.

To do so, smugglers are reportedly using a reciprocating saw that can be bought for as little as $100. The tool can cut through the wall’s steel and concrete in minutes when fitted with the appropriate blades, Customs and Border Protection (CBP) agents have said.

After cutting the steel bollards, smugglers have taken to returning them to their original positions in hope of reusing the passage without being detected by border officials.

Agents now reportedly patrol the wall in search of defects, which are mended. However, those repaired sections of wall are prime targets for smugglers, as it is easier to cut through the welded metal than it is to make new cuts. And the repair policy has also been targeted by smugglers who attempt to fool agents into believing a severed bollard has been fixed by applying putty to the site of the cut.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/11/2/20945336/trump-border-wall-smugglers-saw-us-mexico

[weebo]

The wall is bullshit. Immigration reform is bullshit. So is the war on drugs crap. You put an end to these issues the money runs out. The government will pretend to care so the nathans and spurtaculars of the world are distracted with fear and anger while uncle sam and big business picks their pockets.

[TimDunkem]

The wall is bullshit. Immigration reform is bullshit. So is the war on drugs crap. You put an end to these issues the money runs out. The government will pretend to care so the nathans and spurtaculars of the world are distracted with fear and anger while uncle sam and big business picks their pockets.
Quoted for truth.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Talking about det wall... your taxes at work, folks...

$100 saw.

so:::: Mexico IS paying for it.

tee, hee.

[Spurtacular]

The wall is bullshit. Immigration reform is bullshit. So is the war on drugs crap. You put an end to these issues the money runs out. The government will pretend to care so the nathans and spurtaculars of the world are distracted with fear and anger while uncle sam and big business picks their pockets.

Yea, you're the one who has it all figured out, dick weed.
You can't even do your sweeping stand-alone declarations on your main account. :lol

[DMC]

Jump to conclusions before the investigation, like you do.
Jussie says hi.

[DMC]

Talking about det wall... your taxes at work, folks...

Trump said the new border wall was “impenetrable.” Smugglers are sawing through it.
Smugglers have found that all you need to cut through the wall is a $100 saw.

President Donald Trump promised that a wall on the border would radically change undocumented immigration and customs enforcement. But it turns out newly built sections of the president’s wall aren’t as sturdy as he promised: Smugglers have been using a commercial saw to cut through it, according to the Washington Post.

Smuggling people and goods into the US is a profitable industry for criminal organizations, which is why they are motivated to innovate when it comes to breaching barriers. Of late, smugglers have reportedly been cutting through the wall — which is made of steel bollards that are partially filled with concrete — to make gaps large enough for people and goods to pass through.

To do so, smugglers are reportedly using a reciprocating saw that can be bought for as little as $100. The tool can cut through the wall’s steel and concrete in minutes when fitted with the appropriate blades, Customs and Border Protection (CBP) agents have said.

After cutting the steel bollards, smugglers have taken to returning them to their original positions in hope of reusing the passage without being detected by border officials.

Agents now reportedly patrol the wall in search of defects, which are mended. However, those repaired sections of wall are prime targets for smugglers, as it is easier to cut through the welded metal than it is to make new cuts. And the repair policy has also been targeted by smugglers who attempt to fool agents into believing a severed bollard has been fixed by applying putty to the site of the cut.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/11/2/20945336/trump-border-wall-smugglers-saw-us-mexico

That should stop about 99% of the crossers.

[Spurtacular]

Trump said the new border wall was “impenetrable.” Smugglers are sawing through it.
Smugglers have found that all you need to cut through the wall is a $100 saw.


That should stop about 99% of the crossers.

And then you create tough criminal / civil penalties for the few who are so blatantly defying national security.
But ElNono is just looking to sperm shield.

[ElNono]

That should stop about 99% of the crossers.

:lol

But pun aside, there's millions of dollars in the balance here, so one would expect this to only escalate.

[Reck]

And then you create tough criminal / civil penalties for the few who are so blatantly defying national security.
But ElNono is just looking to sperm shield.

It will cost more to give them a trial. Then if they're guilty you still have to shelter and feed them for however many years.

Well I should say, will cost more for us the tax payers.

[Spurtacular]

:lol

But pun aside, there's millions of dollars in the balance here, so one would expect this to only escalate.

:cry We don't have the power :cry

[ElNono]

And then you create tough criminal / civil penalties for the few who are so blatantly defying national security.
But ElNono is just looking to sperm shield.

You need to catch them first, which apparently it's still a problem.

People like you that think fines or jail time of any sort is a deterrent don't understand the problem. Some of these people would gladly take a free ride in an American prison over going back to some of the shitholes.

[ElNono]

:cry We don't have the power :cry

I didn't say that, I was actually a proponent of better tech instead of the wall gimmick.

I'm pointing out that a wall isn't going to be an obstacle for cartels that make millions of dollars through smuggling.

[Spurtacular]

I didn't say that, I was actually a proponent of better tech instead of the wall gimmick.

I'm pointing out that a wall isn't going to be an obstacle for cartels that make millions of dollars through smuggling.

It's a huge obstacle. Walls work. They've been used all throughout history for a reason.

[Spurtacular]

You need to catch them first, which apparently it's still a problem.

People like you that think fines or jail time of any sort is a deterrent don't understand the problem. Some of these people would gladly take a free ride in an American prison over going back to some of the shitholes.

:lol The desperation.

[Spurtacular]

It will cost more to give them a trial. Then if they're guilty you still have to shelter and feed them for however many years.

Well I should say, will cost more for us the tax payers.

You're forgetting the other side of it. Cartels are businesses too. It takes a lot of resources to train coyotes. They keep losing men, they're screwed.
And when they use greener coyotes and get busted more, they're even more screwed and losing money hand over fist directly, too.

[Will Hunting]

It's a huge obstacle. Walls work. They've been used all throughout history for a reason.
:lol other than the Great Wall of China, what wall has been used “throughout history” to protect a 1,000+ mile border?

[Spurtacular]

:lol other than the Great Wall of China, what wall has been used “through history” to protect a 1,000+ mile border?

That worked, too. :tu

[ElNono]

It's a huge obstacle. Walls work. They've been used all throughout history for a reason.

So we should just get rid of the 2nd amendment and all guns for personal protection, because walls work, right? don't be an idiot.

List me a wall that historically hasn't been breached, especially by a well funded and motivated opponent. It doesn't exist. Not even the Berlin wall.


:lol The desperation.

Yes, it's pretty desperate for some of these people. This is apparently what you don't get.

[ElNono]

:lol other than the Great Wall of China, what wall has been used “throughout history” to protect a 1,000+ mile border?

Not to mention the epic fail on that wall...

Although a useful deterrent against raids, at several points throughout its history the Great Wall failed to stop enemies, including in 1644 when the Manchu Qing marched through the gates of Shanhai Pass and replaced the most ardent of the wall-building dynasties, the Ming, as rulers of China.

:lmao

[Spurtacular]

So we should just get rid of the 2nd amendment and all guns for personal protection, because walls work, right?

https://i.gifer.com/EE9O.gif

[ElNono]

https://i.gifer.com/EE9O.gif

It's what you argued... you said walls historically work.

So they work or not?

[Spurtacular]

It's what you argued... you said walls historically work.

So they work or not?

Definitely had nothing to do with abolishing the second amendment. That was your desperation talking. :lol

Yea, walls historically work. Read up.

[Will Hunting]

Seems like stricter background checks and criminal punishment for employers who knowingly hire illegals or willfully bury their head in the sand would be a lot more thorough than a wall that people can hack through with a saw.

Mar a Lago needs its cheap groundskeepers though :lol

[ElNono]

Definitely had nothing to do with abolishing the second amendment. That was your desperation talking. :lol

Yea, walls historically work. Read up.

We're talking security here... you're arguing walls work for that.

Walls are great at delimiting, and provide a small amount of protection against a casual invader, but that's clearly not what we're talking about here.

I did read, even posted a quote. Still waiting for you to list the walls that historically 'worked'.

[ElNono]

Seems like stricter background checks and criminal punishment for employers who knowingly hire illegals or willfully bury their head in the sand would be a lot more thorough than a wall that people can hack through with a saw.

Mar a Lago needs its cheap groundskeepers though :lol

Can't do that. Part of the donor class.

[Will Hunting]

Can't do that. Part of the donor class.
:lol the conservative message is basically “We need to stop illegal immigration no matter what it takes EXCEPT WE CANT PUNISH THE EMPLOYERS WHO HIRE ILLEGALS AND BENEFIT FROM THEYRE CHEAP LABOR, THATS A NON STARTER!!!”

[Millennial_Messiah]

:lol the conservative message is basically “We need to stop illegal immigration no matter what it takes EXCEPT WE CANT PUNISH THE EMPLOYERS WHO HIRE ILLEGALS AND BENEFIT FROM THEYRE CHEAP LABOR, THATS A NON STARTER!!!”

Yeah that's extremely hypocritical. Also need to punish employers who hire h1B's over US Citizens, especially for high paying jobs. I'm far less concerned with the $11/hour career dishwasher from Latin America who's funny and humble and a good overall individual than the $68/hour (US money) computer programmer from India with a shitty xenophobic personality and then takes that money back to India and perpetuates the caste system there. Lose-lose.

[Will Hunting]

Yeah that's extremely hypocritical.
Yet the hypocrisy doesn’t stop you from thinking Trump is some kind of populist who gives a shit about making sure American jobs don’t go to illegals :lol

[ElNono]

:lol the conservative message is basically “We need to stop illegal immigration no matter what it takes EXCEPT WE CANT PUNISH THE EMPLOYERS WHO HIRE ILLEGALS AND BENEFIT FROM THEYRE CHEAP LABOR, THATS A NON STARTER!!!”

I'm not against enforcing our immigration border, tbh... but like you said, there's readily much better ways to deal with this problem.

We're now in year 3 or 4 of this wall, at a cost of millions (billions?) of dollars, and it's clearly ineffective (lol @ smugglers having the time to put putty on the other side after they crossed).

Plus it's not like we couldn't tell if it was efficient. A true working solution would make a substantial dent in drug smuggling and distribution at least, and that would inevitably make the news (Fox would be first in line here).

[ElNono]

Yeah that's extremely hypocritical. Also need to punish employers who hire h1B's over US Citizens, especially for high paying jobs. I'm far less concerned with the $11/hour career dishwasher from Latin America who's funny and humble and a good overall individual than the $68/hour (US money) computer programmer from India with a shitty xenophobic personality and then takes that money back to India and perpetuates the caste system there. Lose-lose.

H1Bs are exactly for high paying jobs where there's not enough Americans to fulfill the position. The scam with H1Bs is consulting companies hiring H1Bs and not paying them top dollar, while subcontracting to companies that pay the consulting companies top dollar.

The vast majority of these consulting companies also provide outsourcing.

And yeah, this is another area where both conservative and liberals have been pretty silent about.

[Will Hunting]

I'm not against enforcing our immigration border, tbh... but like you said, there's readily much better ways to deal with this problem.

We're now in year 3 or 4 of this wall, at a cost of millions (billions?) of dollars, and it's clearly ineffective (lol @ smugglers having the time to put putty on the other side after they crossed).

Plus it's not like we couldn't tell if it was efficient. A true working solution would make a substantial dent in drug smuggling and distribution at least, and that would inevitably make the news (Fox would be first in line here).
Yeah I’m all for enforcing the border too, but a big expensive wall that has major enviroental implications but smugglers and illegals can easily get through is retarded.

In the end though, if there is no way for illegals to make a living here, they’ll stop coming. In 2009 the net change in our illegal population was negative because there weren’t any jobs here. The idea that you punish the illegal immigrant for being here and not the employer that made it possible for the illegal to be here makes absolutely no sense.

[ElNono]

Yeah I’m all for enforcing the border too, but a big expensive wall that has major enviroental implications but smugglers and illegals can easily get through is retarded.

In the end though, if there is no way for illegals to make a living here, they’ll stop coming. In 2009 the net change in our illegal population was negative because there weren’t any jobs here. The idea that you punish the illegal immigrant for being here and not the employer that made it possible for the illegal to be here makes absolutely no sense.

Isn't that what IronMexican was bitching about? That Obama substantially ramped up the deportations? IIRC, Barry still has the highest numbers of deportations, even after this gimmicky wall.

[Will Hunting]

Isn't that what IronMexican was bitching about? That Obama substantially ramped up the deportations? IIRC, Barry still has the highest numbers of deportations, even after this gimmicky wall.
Obama had plenty of deportations but there were also a lot of illegals who just up and left because they couldn’t get work anymore.

Illegal immigration was a big problem in the 1990s/early 2000s because we had a temporary shortage of labor in the US due a construction bubble while NAFTA completely fucked Mexican agriculture and sent Mexico into an economic crisis it never recovered from. Since 2007 the country’s illegal population has decreased, it shouldn’t even be an issue now. With a 15% unemployment rate it’s especially less an issue now than ever. No one is illegally immigrating to the US to try to get a job anytime soon.

[weebo]

Yea, you're the one who has it all figured out, dick weed.
You can't even do your sweeping stand-alone declarations on your main account. :lol

WTF. This is my main and only account. :lol

[Millennial_Messiah]

H1Bs are exactly for high paying jobs where there's not enough Americans to fulfill the position. The scam with H1Bs is consulting companies hiring H1Bs and not paying them top dollar, while subcontracting to companies that pay the consulting companies top dollar.

The vast majority of these consulting companies also provide outsourcing.

And yeah, this is another area where both conservative and liberals have been pretty silent about.

Bull-fucking-horse manure. There are PLENTY of Americans with college degrees, ready to fulfill the positions instead of graduating only to move back home (because not enough open jobs in their field) and tirelessly applying to such jobs but all to no avail because they just filled the position with someone H1B from India instead who has 15 years of "experience" (but in India, so they shouldn't count that). Why not hire them instead of bringing those disgusting stink pots from South Asia to half-ass their job for a pretty penny?

The Hispanic immigrants that a lot of people complain about, both conservatives and liberals, tend to be good individuals. They'll work for $11/hour, bust their ass on the job, feed their families, mow your front and back lawn for a mere $15, shake your hand, and make you free tacos on their own dime. You know? Because they're just good people like that.

The disgusting H1B Indians on the other hand? They won't work for a penny less than what they think is their (high) market value, they don't show up until 10:30 a.m., they half-ass their job, and instead of free tacos and a warm smile they'll charge you an arm and a leg for greasy, smelly Indian food and curtly stare at you until you're *safely* out of their *comfort zone*. Nothing with them ever comes for free. Why? Because they're greedy pigs like that. It's firmly embedded in their culture. They don't care about interpersonal relationships the way Hispanics or Americans do. They only care about their own families and their caste and saving face. Selfish, greedy, xenophobic assholes. They don't deserve to be in corporate American offices, no sir.

They should have been kicked out of the country (all of them) immediately in 2017, day 1 of Trump's presidency. You better believe that I'm pissed off at Trump over that. It doesn't mean I should vote for a worse solution in Biden (Schumer/Pelosi pulling the strings) because that would be cutting off my nose to spite my face.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Yet the hypocrisy doesn’t stop you from thinking Trump is some kind of populist who gives a shit about making sure American jobs don’t go to illegals :lol

Trump has screwed the pooch on a number of things and I've ranted on here about his shortcomings. He's made false promises in 2016 and since kow-towed to the establishment, the Mitch McConnell's of the country. That's not draining the swamp at all; that's feeding it.

The illegals are frankly less of a problem than the H1B's, as mentioned above multiple times. I've ranted and raved about it many times. No U.S. Citizen should graduate university and be a store-level or food worker while some disgusting smelling xenophobes get the premium C-level office jobs all because of their foreign "experience". It's sickening and some corporations need to be punished for it.

In contrast, however, Trump has done some good things for the country. Namely, getting the US and our taxpayer dollars out of the horrible, expensive, socialistic, globalistic Paris Climate accord crap, and the Iran deal which was feeding a sworn enemy funds for nuclear capability. Trump has done some things right. The 2017-18 tax bill is a mixed bag that I both like and dislike. The 2020 stimulus was a piece of shit and hypocritical after chastising the 2009 Obama stimulus, which was also a piece of shit.

I don't love Trump. He's a womanizer and the most tactless president in US history, and he's far underperformed his expectations. But, in short, a vote not for him is a vote not only for Biden, but for Schumer, Pelosi and the rest of the Dem establishment, so I'm going to hold my nose and vote Trump and hope my allergies don't flare up.

[ElNono]

Bull-fucking-horse manure. There are PLENTY of Americans with college degrees, ready to fulfill the positions instead of graduating only to move back home (because not enough open jobs in their field) and tirelessly applying to such jobs but all to no avail because they just filled the position with someone H1B from India instead who has 15 years of "experience" (but in India, so they shouldn't count that). Why not hire them instead of bringing those disgusting stink pots from South Asia to half-ass their job for a pretty penny?

The Hispanic immigrants that a lot of people complain about, both conservatives and liberals, tend to be good individuals. They'll work for $11/hour, bust their ass on the job, feed their families, mow your front and back lawn for a mere $15, shake your hand, and make you free tacos on their own dime. You know? Because they're just good people like that.

The disgusting H1B Indians on the other hand? They won't work for a penny less than what they think is their (high) market value, they don't show up until 10:30 a.m., they half-ass their job, and instead of free tacos and a warm smile they'll charge you an arm and a leg for greasy, smelly Indian food and curtly stare at you until you're *safely* out of their *comfort zone*. Nothing with them ever comes for free. Why? Because they're greedy pigs like that. It's their culuture. They don't care about interpersonal relationships the way Hispanics or Americans do. They only care about their own families and their caste and saving face. Selfish, greedy, xenophobic assholes. They don't deserve to be in corporate American offices, no sir.

They should have been kicked out of the country (all of them) immediately in 2017, day 1 of Trump's presidency. You better believe that I'm pissed off at Trump over that. It doesn't mean I should vote for a worse solution in Biden (Schumer/Pelosi pulling the strings) because that would be cutting off my nose to spite my face.

Sorry to wake you up to the news, but speaking from experience, there's a lack of Americans with expertise on a number of STEM fields. Even more so in areas where outsourcing was short-lived. College kids just don't cut it out of school, they need 5-10 years of experience on the job at the very least, and those people with experience are worth a lot of money.

I do agree that it should be a very tailored program though. Arguably, there's no need right now for such a program with a 15% unemployment rate.

And we definitely need to close loopholes that abuse this program to pay lower salaries.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Sorry to wake you up to the news, but speaking from experience, there's a lack of Americans with expertise on a number of STEM fields. Even more so in areas where outsourcing was short-lived. College kids just don't cut it out of school, they need 5-10 years of experience in the job, and those people with experience are worth a lot of money.

I do agree that it should be a very tailored program though. Arguably, there's no need right now for such a program with a 15% unemployment rate.

And we definitely need to close loopholes that abuse this program to pay lower salaries.
Damn straight, and if you want me to take a screenshot of my gmail on a random Tuesday, even during the coronavirus pandemic, you'd be lucky to find 1 out of 20 names that isn't some shitty Indian on a work visa.

They're taking our jobs that are remaining, even during the planned-demic. Experience? Foreign experience shouldn't count. Corporations should be punished for considering foreign experience as viable. Only U.S. experience should be factored in. If they have zero years of U.S. experience, they're on the same level as a U.S. Citizen fresh out of college in STEM, and the U.S. Citizen should get priority in this case because they are U.S. Citizens graduating from U.S. universities.

It's horse shit that there aren't enough US Citizens with STEM experience. There are tons, rotting away playing video games or forced into further academia when the money is for them to make high-paying wages immediately out of school. The kind of money that nets a solid down payment on a house after 6-9 months of salary, or buying the house with cash outright after 3-5 years of salary. But nope, instead corporations get the dothead xenophobes, which stink up our offices and completely wreck the social atmosphere for the few U.S. Citizens who do make it (like me).

I hate all of them and I'm going to retire the day before my 30th birthday. I'll be a millionaire by then, from W2 savings alone (!!), and tell them to fuck off while I start my apartment complex business. They can take their H1B's and shove them up their ass and go back to India and drown in a monsoon for all I care. Fucking assholes. And when I'm president, the H1B won't exist, and corporations caught circumventing will be administratively forced out of business, I don't care if it's Apple or Google. Any CEOs, CTOs etc caught cheating my system will do hard prison time under my watch.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Another thing that needs to be done is legal reform. If one side (or the other) is pissed off about too many minorities being disproportionately incarcerated for longer periods of time? Fix this by regulating the law industry. Any individual or corporation can only spend a max of $X per year (a medium range, middle-class amount) on legal counsel. This bans unfair low punishment for big corporations and yacht-toting corrupt investment bankers, and unfair high punishment for the black kid across the corner caught for selling a little weed or the Hispanic illegal immigrant caught working without a work permit.

[Will Hunting]

Another thing that needs to be done is legal reform. If one side (or the other) is pissed off about too many minorities being disproportionately incarcerated for longer periods of time? Fix this by regulating the law industry. Any individual or corporation can only spend a max of $X per year (a medium range, middle-class amount) on legal counsel. This bans unfair low punishment for big corporations and yacht-toting corrupt investment bankers, and unfair high punishment for the black kid across the corner caught for selling a little weed or the Hispanic illegal immigrant caught working without a work permit.
I don’t understand how restricting dollars spent on attorneys fees has anything to do with incarceration rate.

[Millennial_Messiah]

I don’t understand how restricting dollars spent on attorneys fees has anything to do with incarceration rate.

Simple. If everyone was entitled to the same quality of lawyers, wouldn't that solve the issue of $M's/$B's criminals getting off with probation and cease and desist vs. $K's and under criminals getting years in prison for selling a little coke?

[ElNono]

Damn straight, and if you want me to take a screenshot of my gmail on a random Tuesday, even during the coronavirus pandemic, you'd be lucky to find 1 out of 20 names that isn't some shitty Indian on a work visa.

They're taking our jobs that are remaining, even during the planned-demic. Experience? Foreign experience shouldn't count. Corporations should be punished for considering foreign experience as viable. Only U.S. experience should be factored in. If they have zero years of U.S. experience, they're on the same level as a U.S. Citizen fresh out of college in STEM, and the U.S. Citizen should get priority in this case because they are U.S. Citizens graduating from U.S. universities.

It's horse shit that there aren't enough US Citizens with STEM experience. There are tons, rotting away playing video games or forced into further academia when the money is for them to make high-paying wages immediately out of school. The kind of money that nets a solid down payment on a house after 6-9 months of salary, or buying the house with cash outright after 3-5 years of salary. But nope, instead corporations get the dothead xenophobes, which stink up our offices and completely wreck the social atmosphere for the few U.S. Citizens who do make it (like me).

I hate all of them and I'm going to retire the day before my 30th birthday. I'll be a millionaire by then, from W2 savings alone (!!), and tell them to fuck off while I start my apartment complex business. They can take their H1B's and shove them up their ass and go back to India and drown in a monsoon for all I care. Fucking assholes. And when I'm president, the H1B won't exist, and corporations caught circumventing will be administratively forced out of business, I don't care if it's Apple or Google. Any CEOs, CTOs etc caught cheating my system will do hard prison time under my watch.

It doesn't work like that. Look at cyberspace right now. Israel, Iran, North Korea, Russia, China, all hacking the shit out of the US left and right.

In the company I work for (F100) our top employees both are and come from all over the world... Netherlands, Germany, Japan, Brazil, France, the UK... heck, I came to the US on a H1B visa (citizen now).

And there's also the factor you mention, a lot of these people retire early and move on to do other things, start up their own companies, and then they need experienced people.

What you're talking about indians is the consulting firm stuff I was mentioning, which is a scam. That's literally a scam, it's well known and neither this or the previous administration have cracked down on it, and the sole purpose is to drag down salaries on the code monkey jobs. It's more prevalent outside of silicon valley, though.

It also completely breaks the purpose of H1B visas, which is to bring exceptional talent.

[Will Hunting]

Simple. If everyone was entitled to the same quality of lawyers, wouldn't that solve the issue of $M's/$B's criminals getting off with probation and cease and desist vs. $K's and under criminals getting years in prison for selling a little coke?
Are you saying you’d force private practice lawyers to do public defense work to? Even by your standards this is an incoherent idea that reflects a complete lack of understanding as to how the legal system works.

To answer your question, no, it wouldn’t, even setting aside how unrealistic and stupid the idea is that you could communize legal services such that the rich and the poor receive the same quality of representation.

[Millennial_Messiah]

It doesn't work like that. Look at cyberspace right now. Israel, Iran, North Korea, Russia, China, all hacking the shit out of the US left and right.

In the company I work for (F100) our top employees both are and come from all over the world... Netherlands, Germany, Japan, Brazil, France, the UK... heck, I came to the US on a H1B visa (citizen now).

And there's also the factor you mention, a lot of these people retire early and move on to do other things, start up their own companies, and then they need experienced people.

What you're talking about indians is the consulting firm stuff I was mentioning, which is a scam. That's literally a scam, it's well known and neither this or the previous administration have cracked down on it, and the sole purpose is to drag down salaries on the code monkey jobs. It's more prevalent outside of silicon valley, though.

It also completely breaks the purpose of H1B visas, which is to bring exceptional talent.

The main problem with the H1B visas is sheer volume, there should be a quota like 5% of them can be H1B if nothing else. The IT India consulting industry is a major scam, the TCS's, Cognizant's and Infosys's of the world can go to hell. I've been under the payroll of all three at various points (not anymore). The "code monkey" jobs shouldn't be paying $68 an hour, that's ridiculous, but it's "market rate" in, say, Dallas, Atlanta, or Philadelphia. In other places like CA/NY it's even more.

Don't try to tell me that a foreigner "code monkey" that shows up an hour late to office (or virtual office, now that we're in work from home times) spends half their time dicking around doing nothing and the other writing a few sql queries and editing a few lines of object oriented code and calling it a day... deserves 6-7 times more money than an immigrant from a less privileged background working his/her ass off at a restaurant or store just to live in a small apartment and feed their hungry kids.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Are you saying you’d force private practice lawyers to do public defense work to? Even by your standards this is an incoherent idea that reflects a complete lack of understanding as to how the legal system works.

Not force them to do public defense, but it'd sure put a cap on how many yachts and golf greens these private practices can afford.

[Will Hunting]

Not force them to do public defense, but it'd sure put a cap on how many yachts and golf greens these private practices can afford.
So you’d cap the earnings that private practice corporate lawyers who do mostly civil work earn, how the fuck would that translate to lower sentences for petty drug offenses in criminal court?

Setting aside the hundred other reasons why you’re not making any sense, do you not know the difference between civil and criminal court?

You have this idea that rich lawyers making a shit load of money doing corporate litigation is somehow related to poor blacks being incarcerated for petty drug offenses but haven’t articulated why.

[Millennial_Messiah]

So you’d cap the earnings that private practice corporate lawyers who do mostly civil work earn, how the fuck would that translate to lower sentences for petty drug offenses in criminal court?

Setting aside the hundred other reasons why you’re not making any sense, do you not know the difference between civil and criminal court?

Simple. Civil is torts, lawsuits, cease and desist etc. Criminal is sentencing for breaking of laws, which include revocation of business good standing (for companies), and for individuals fines, probation, jail time, etc.

Another thing that needs to be regulated is lobbyists. Why are lobbyists not regulated when individuals can get serious prison time for donating $X to a political campaign?

[Will Hunting]

Simple. Civil is torts, lawsuits, cease and desist etc. Criminal is sentencing for breaking of laws, which include revocation of business good standing (for companies), and for individuals fines, probation, jail time, etc.

Another thing that needs to be regulated is lobbyists. Why are lobbyists not regulated when individuals can get serious prison time for donating $X to a political campaign?
You say it’s simple yet can’t articulate how capping the earnings of civil corporate lawyers leads to lower sentencing for petty drug offenses.

[ElNono]

The main problem with the H1B visas is sheer volume, there should be a quota like 5% of them can be H1B if nothing else. The IT India consulting industry is a major scam, the TCS's, Cognizant's and Infosys's of the world can go to hell. I've been under the payroll of all three at various points (not anymore). The "code monkey" jobs shouldn't be paying $68 an hour, that's ridiculous, but it's "market rate" in, say, Dallas, Atlanta, or Philadelphia. In other places like CA/NY it's even more.

Don't try to tell me that a foreigner "code monkey" that shows up an hour late to office (or virtual office, now that we're in work from home times) spends half their time dicking around doing nothing and the other writing a few sql queries and editing a few lines of object oriented code and calling it a day... deserves 6-7 times more money than an immigrant from a less privileged background working his/her ass off at a restaurant or store just to live in a small apartment and feed their hungry kids.

The bolded above is the real issue here, and what really damages both American workers who generally lack experience, college grads, and is completely against what the H1B program is supposed to be.

None of the people on H1Bs should be code monkeys, but the $68 an hour reflects the lack of availability of talent. If you had a lot of people for those jobs, then it wouldn't be hard to find a cheaper deal. That's just basics economics.

Then again, you wouldn't give those guys a $10m-$100m dollar project. You hire those people to build your website or your app.

[Millennial_Messiah]

You say it’s simple yet can’t articulate how capping the earnings of civil corporate lawyers leads to lower sentencing for petty drug offenses.

I'm not looking to cap their earnings per se. If they work more cases, in spite of tort reform (damages should be in the $xK's not $M's and $xM's) and work harder, then yes, they deserve more money. But what I'm trying to eliminate on a criminal context is criminal white-collar defendants, both corporations and individuals, should be barred from spending over, say, $xK per year on attorneys and legal counsel. Thus, they have a higher probability to get a stiffer and more accurate sentence; and the left will have far less ammunition to complain about "white privilege" Win-win.

[ElNono]

Another thing that needs to be regulated is lobbyists. Why are lobbyists not regulated when individuals can get serious prison time for donating $X to a political campaign?

This one is easy. Citizen's United.

[Will Hunting]

I'm not looking to cap their earnings per se. If they work more cases, in spite of tort reform (damages should be in the $xK's not $M's and $xM's) and work harder, then yes, they deserve more money. But what I'm trying to eliminate on a criminal context is criminal white-collar defendants, both corporations and individuals, should be barred from spending over, say, $xK per year on attorneys and legal counsel. Thus, they have a higher probability to get a stiffer and more accurate sentence; and the left will have far less ammunition to complain about "white privilege" Win-win.
Still has nothing to do with lowering sentences for petty drug offenses but you’re clearly just rambling at this point. That’ idea is also unconstitutional for myriad reasons.

[Will Hunting]

This one is easy. Citizen's United.
:lol it’s amazing how often conservatives complain about the realities their side is responsible for

[Millennial_Messiah]

The bolded above is the real issue here, and what really damages both American workers who generally lack experience, college grads, and is completely against what the H1B program is supposed to be.

None of the people on H1Bs should be code monkeys, but the $68 an hour reflects the lack of availability of talent. If you had a lot of people for those jobs, then it wouldn't be hard to find a cheaper deal. That's just basics economics.

Then again, you wouldn't give those guys a $10m-$100m dollar project. You hire those people to build your website or your app.

Bingo, and it's India's fault. Trump should have cracked down on India before tackling China. China could easily be handled by dispersing more factories across Southeast Asian countries, not just China, to provide more competition and less dependence on a communist second world superpower.

There isn't a lack of availability of talent. There are tens of thousands of US Citizen STEM grads each year who graduate without job offers in hand and are forced to go home and work menial jobs or take out expensive loans to get a master's degree that is essentially useless beyond its title. The IT consulting industry has fucked up the numbers and it's gotten far too easy to get away with lying about experience if it's foreign experience because it's so expensive and time consuming for corporations to validate foreign industry experience (and education, for that matter) so they just go with the flow and take their word for it.

American workers who "generally lack experience" such as college grads should be PRIORITY candidates to fill these jobs. No US college grad left behind!! There needs to be a big fat regulation on this. If they don't have industry experience? Fine, train them!!! It's far less expensive to pay, say, a team of 25 less-experiences US Citizen grads $35 an hour starting pay, those who will generally show up from 9-5 and be much better socially, than a team of 15 $68 an hour (PLUS H1B sponsorship and relocation!!) dank foreign xenophobes with questionable accountability and verifiable experience, bad social skills, a thick accent and no regard for US culture.

[Millennial_Messiah]

:lol it’s amazing how often conservatives complain about the realities their side is responsible for

Yeah, Citizens United was terrible. Corporations are not people. Wtf were they thinking?

[Will Hunting]

Yeah, Citizens United was terrible. Corporations are not people. Wtf were they thinking?
Don’t ask me, you clearly don’t seem to mind it.

I don’t understand how even though Citizens United offends you you’d still rather take it over Pelosi/Schumer for completely amorphous reasons. Corporations being able to take over America is pretty much a worst case scenario.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Don’t ask me, you clearly don’t seem to mind it.

I don’t understand how even though Citizens United offends you you’d still rather take it over Pelosi/Schumer for completely amorphous reasons. Corporations being able to take over America is pretty much a worst case scenario.

No, the worst case scenario is absolute government control; communism; red China/North Korea, et al. and you know it. Why do you think the protestors of Hong Kong are fighting for freedom? The right to protest isn't a right in many places; the USSR would make a bloodbath out of "Chaz, Seattle" and look at the Tienanmen Square incident.

A free market economy is generally good; oligarchy from big corporations, particularly big tech and their limitless pocketbooks, is generally bad; but government seizure of the economy is the absolute worst.

[Will Hunting]

No, the worst case scenario is absolute government control; communism; red China/North Korea, et al. and you know it. Why do you think the protestors of Hong Kong are fighting for freedom? The right to protest isn't a right in many places; the USSR would make a bloodbath out of "Chaz, Seattle" and look at the Tienanmen Square incident.

A free market economy is generally good; oligarchy from big corporations, particularly big tech and their limitless pocketbooks, is generally bad; but government seizure of the economy is the absolute worst.
Yeah except that’s never going to happen here. America is in a lot more danger of becoming a corporation controlled oligarchy than it is a communist state, the fear of communism is irrational. Your paranoia over one extreme that’s never going to happen has basically convinced you to support the other extreme that very much already has happened.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Yeah except that’s never going to happen here. America is in a lot more danger of becoming a corporation controlled oligarchy than it is a communist state, the fear of communism is irrational. Your paranoia over one extreme that’s never going to happen has basically convinced you to support the other extreme that very much already has happened.
It only takes a short period of time for everything to change. Very slippery slope. Look at Russia with the Bolsheviks, Mao Zedong in China in the late 50s, and Iran in 1979. Even ISIS's 2014 conquering of major territory in Iraq and Syria. Shit happened virtually overnight.

[Will Hunting]

It only takes a short period of time for everything to change. Very slippery slope. Look at Russia with the Bolsheviks, Mao Zedong in China in the late 50s, and Iran in 1979. Even ISIS's 2014 conquering of major territory in Iraq and Syria. Shit happened virtually overnight.
Yeah again all of those examples are irrational comparisons. You’ve fallen hook line sinker for the Fox News playbook of scaring people into turning America into a corporate oligarchy out of the irrational fear that it’s either a corporate oligarchy or becoming another USSR.

[ElNono]

Bingo, and it's India's fault. Trump should have cracked down on India before tackling China. China could easily be handled by dispersing more factories across Southeast Asian countries, not just China, to provide more competition and less dependence on a communist second world superpower.

There isn't a lack of availability of talent. There are tens of thousands of US Citizen STEM grads each year who graduate without job offers in hand and are forced to go home and work menial jobs or take out expensive loans to get a master's degree that is essentially useless beyond its title. The IT consulting industry has fucked up the numbers and it's gotten far too easy to get away with lying about experience if it's foreign experience because it's so expensive and time consuming for corporations to validate foreign industry experience (and education, for that matter) so they just go with the flow and take their word for it.

American workers who "generally lack experience" such as college grads should be PRIORITY candidates to fill these jobs. No US college grad left behind!! There needs to be a big fat regulation on this. If they don't have industry experience? Fine, train them!!! It's far less expensive to pay, say, a team of 25 less-experiences US Citizen grads $35 an hour starting pay, those who will generally show up from 9-5 and be much better socially, than a team of 15 $68 an hour (PLUS H1B sponsorship and relocation!!) dank foreign xenophobes with questionable accountability and verifiable experience, bad social skills, a thick accent and no regard for US culture.

Come on man.. these companies are outsourcing so they can pay $20/hour, with no benefits, but they don't know there's this giant pool of college grads that would gladly work for $40/hour and instead decide to pay a more expensive $68/hour? Companies are not stupid, not that stupid anyways.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Come on man.. these companies are outsourcing so they can pay $20/hour, with no benefits, but they don't know there's this giant pool of college grads that would gladly work for $40/hour and instead decide to pay a more expensive $68/hour? Companies are not stupid, not that stupid anyways.

they're treating foreign "corporate industry experience" as canon, which is a problem. Only U.S. industry experience should be considered. That puts a 40 year old dothead with a shitty Indian college degree and whatever Indian IT experience on the same level as a 23 year old US Citizen entry level STEM graduate candidate. Which is only fair and correct, since we're talking about US-based US office jobs here.

The $20 an hour with no benefits is perfectly fine for offshore resources that can work remotely from offshore, since $20 an hour is filthy rich in India when you consider the conversion rate to rupees and the fact that $3 a night buys you a four-star hotel over there and 80 cents buys you a hooker or a nice dinner.

It just perpetuates the aristocratic caste system over there which wrecks both US and Indian society at once.

[ElNono]

they're treating foreign "corporate industry experience" as canon, which is a problem. Only U.S. industry experience should be considered. That puts a 40 year old dothead with a shitty Indian college degree and whatever Indian IT experience on the same level as a 23 year old US Citizen entry level STEM graduate candidate. Which is only fair and correct, since we're talking about US-based US office jobs here.

It doesn't work like that Andy... experience is a premium. Like I said, the US is not at the forefront here. It's unfortunate the kids here in the US come out from college with 200k in debt, only to have to work harder to learn that experience. That's just something broken in the private education system.

Most of these companies compete globally, not just in the US. Your notion of how economies work is just outdated.

[Millennial_Messiah]

It doesn't work like that Andy... experience is a premium. Like I said, the US is not at the forefront here. It's unfortunate the kids here in the US come out from college with 200k in debt, only to have to work harder to learn that experience. That's just something broken in the private education system.

Most of these companies compete globally, not just in the US. Your notion of how economies work is just outdated.
Offshore resources should be left offshore, not shipped into the US to stink up our offices and ruin our once-lively social atmosphere. It makes all of us non-Indians (minorities in the IT field) just want to exclusively work from home, even before COVID.

I don't mind the $20/hr resources paid offshore, since that's small money; though it's arguable and likely that they should get paid less than that, considering the conversion rate over there and the fact they don't have to travel or immigrate. But leave them offshore. Only hire U.S. Citizens for U.S. office jobs. Save American culture. The Indians just don't seem to give a fuck about the "when in Rome, do as the Romans do" maxim... and that's a huge problem. Americans shouldn't have to assimilate to their shitty caste culture ON U.S. SOIL.

[ElNono]

Offshore resources should be left offshore, not shipped into the US to stink up our offices and ruin our once-lively social atmosphere. It makes all of us non-Indians (minorities in the IT field) just want to exclusively work from home, even before COVID.

I don't mind the $20/hr resources paid offshore, since that's small money; though it's arguable and likely that they should get paid less than that, considering the conversion rate over there and the fact they don't have to travel or immigrate. But leave them offshore. Only hire U.S. Citizens for U.S. office jobs. Save American culture. The Indians just don't seem to give a fuck about the "when in Rome, do as the Romans do" maxim... and that's a huge problem. Americans shouldn't have to assimilate to their shitty caste culture ON U.S. SOIL.

A company that pays a guy $1m but he makes $20m for the company are much more important than your feelings, Andy. We live in a world where there's a measurable competitive advantage between an experienced and inexperienced employee. c'est la vie.

[Millennial_Messiah]

A company that pays a guy $1m but he makes $20m for the company are much more important than your feelings, Andy. We live in a world where there's a measurable competitive advantage between an experienced and inexperienced employee. c'est la vie.

And the Indians do a half-assed job. They show up at 10:30, take calls, respond to emails in funky English, work as slowly as possible, constantly push back deadlines, edit a few lines of code based on a new project requirement and they're done for their day. That's it. There isn't a single computer programmer who is solely responsible for $1M/year, let alone $20M of revenue/profit for any company. They're overpaid and deep down, everyone knows it.

Forget college STEM candidates. An ambitious, eager high school graduate with STEM ambitions even without a college degree can do a better job than those foreign dothead fuckers.

[DarrinS]

Half my friends are dirty Mexicans, and they would laugh their ass off, if I called them that. They'd have some choice insults for me, too. But, we're in our 50's-60's and don't GAF, tbh. :lol

[DarrinS]

Half my friends are dirty Mexicans, and they would laugh their ass off, if I called them that. They'd have some choice insults for me, too. But, we're in our 50's-60's and don't GAF, tbh. :lol

Older Hispanic dudes hate "woke" PC culture, in my experience.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Half my friends are dirty Mexicans, and they would laugh their ass off, if I called them that. They'd have some choice insults for me, too. But, we're in our 50's-60's and don't GAF, tbh. :lol
:tu

Not too long ago I dated a "dirty Mexican" in north Dallas named Monica who was fine, thin & fit even after having delivered 2 children... she didn't speak a word of English but she wouldn't stop screaming "ayyy guerito" with me inside of her. :lol

Protip: The ultimate form of world dominance for a man is to conquer the world with your penis.

[ElNono]

And the Indians do a half-assed job. They show up at 10:30, take calls, respond to emails in funky English, work as slowly as possible, constantly push back deadlines, edit a few lines of code based on a new project requirement and they're done for their day. That's it. There isn't a single computer programmer who is solely responsible for $1M/year, let alone $20M of revenue/profit for any company. They're overpaid and deep down, everyone knows it.

Forget college STEM candidates. An ambitious, eager high school graduate with STEM ambitions even without a college degree can do a better job than those foreign dothead fuckers.

Well, market self-corrects, right? I mean, outsourcing has been more or less a disaster in the IT area for a while now. That fad eventually went away. We'll see what happens with this stuff.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Older Hispanic dudes hate "woke" PC culture, in my experience.

yes sir. Quite conservative. Will Hurd's base. Was Quico Canseco's for a time. Bonilla's in the past. Not enough of them left, sadly

[Millennial_Messiah]

Well, market self-corrects, right? I mean, outsourcing has been more or less a disaster in the IT area for a while now. That fad eventually went away. We'll see what happens with this stuff.

you hope so, but the problem is that too many of their *kind* have become entrenched in the HR systems responsible for the hiring and firing of such positions, and due to their large-scale systematic ethnocentricity, they're not likely to move away from fighting and budgeting to bring aboard as many of their own *people* as possible. Sadly.

[ElNono]

you hope so, but the problem is that too many of their *kind* have become entrenched in the HR systems responsible for the hiring and firing of such positions, and due to their large-scale systematic ethnocentricity, they're not likely to move away from fighting and budgeting to bring aboard as many of their own *people* as possible. Sadly.

You don't have to worry about it, Andy... it's probably one of the most competitive marketplaces, alongside finance. There's little room for mistakes.

[DarrinS]

One of my Hispanic buddies is over 80 years old and strong AF. I haven't visited him in a long time, since he's at risk group and his wife has cancer. Miss that dude. :depressed

[Millennial_Messiah]

One of my Hispanic buddies is over 80 years old and strong AF. I haven't visited him in a long time, since he's at risk group and his wife has cancer. Miss that dude. :depressed
Damn, god bless them... fuck cancer tbh. :(

[Millennial_Messiah]

You don't have to worry about it, Andy... it's probably one of the most competitive marketplaces, alongside finance. There's little room for mistakes.

That totally runs contrary to your earlier story of "literally they can't hire enough programmers so they have to get H1B's"... ahahahaha.

[DarrinS]

Damn, god bless them... fuck cancer tbh. :(

Yeah, he's good, but wife has lung cancer. Sucks.

[ElNono]

That totally runs contrary to your earlier story of "literally they can't hire enough programmers so they have to get H1B's"... ahahahaha.

Because I don't see the story you're telling here in America, and I've been working in this field, in the US, for well over 25 years. So I rather not argue, you really have no idea what you're talking about.

[DMC]

It doesn't work like that Andy... experience is a premium. Like I said, the US is not at the forefront here. It's unfortunate the kids here in the US come out from college with 200k in debt, only to have to work harder to learn that experience. That's just something broken in the private education system.

Most of these companies compete globally, not just in the US. Your notion of how economies work is just outdated.

Yeah but they got that liberal arts degree in queer studies and radio/TV. They are set.

[ElNono]

Yeah but they got that liberal arts degree in queer studies and radio/TV. They are set.

hey, I was talking about CS degrees....

Plus, what he wants is straight up communism, tbh... if you're American and you studied in America, you're suddenly entitled to a high paying job?

Sounds like Andy got a shitty job out of school coz he sucks, and is envious of Apu Nahasapeemapetilon making more money than him... what happened with bootstraps, etc?...

[Millennial_Messiah]

hey, I was talking about CS degrees....

Plus, what he wants is straight up communism, tbh... if you're American and you studied in America, you're suddenly entitled to a high paying job?

Sounds like Andy got a shitty job out of school coz he sucks, and is envious of Apu Nahasapeemapetilon making more money than him... what happened with bootstraps, etc?...
STEM degrees in general.

[Spurtacular]

1273688806508675073

[boutons_deux]

"ICE is cruel even in “normal” times.

But during a pandemic?

The agency’s contempt for the human beings they detain really shines through.

ICE is spraying the people they’re taking into custody with

toxic disinfectant chemicals,

leading to rashes, bloody mucus, and chemical inhalation.

They’re basically taking Trump’s suggestion for people to inject bleach literally.

--Mike Phelan, Progress America

================

Immigrants, advocates, members of Congress decry chemical use at ICE facility in Adelanto

https://www.desertsun.com/story/news/politics/immigration/2020/06/27/immigrants-members-congress-decry-chemical-use-ice-facility-adelanto/3273095001/

[RandomGuy]

Because I don't see the story you're telling here in America, and I've been working in this field, in the US, for well over 25 years. So I rather not argue, you really have no idea what you're talking about.

You are just now figuring that out? :lol