Some perspective about older rookies, such as Derrick White

[Dejounte]

*this is all on the basis Derrick continues his current production*

Looking back at the 2017 draft, there are only two players I would take over Derrick: Bam Adebayo and Jayson Tatum. There are three players I would CONSIDER drafting over Derrick: Kyle Kuzma, DeAaron Fox (even though he wrecked us), and Donavon Mitchell.

This would effectively make Derrick the 6th pick if there was a re-do of that draft.

Regarding Mitchell, there is a 2 year and couple months age gap between he and Derrick. I am aware he was an all-star. Do I believe he will get that much better in two years? Not really. Mitchell is averaging about 24 ppg, 4 apg, 4 rbg. If Derrick continues his current production, he would average about 20 ppg, 4 ppg, 4 rbg.

Derrick is 26 and in his third year with the Spurs.

I think we all need to back off the idea that the younger a rookie is, the more potential they have. Looking back at that draft, I could see many fall for the "oozing potential" of Josh Jackson because he is so young and athletic. Or I even remember on here people wanting to trade Kawhi for a Markelle Fultz package because of "potential" and he is so "young". Then a few years later when said player has not improved much, all is forgotten...

[cjw]

John Collins would like to have a word with you. I’d take him over Kuzma (I’d also take White over Kuzma). Jarrett Allen has been very good too.

But generally agree, White likely would fall somewhere in the 8-10 range in a redraft.

[spurspl]

tatum, donovan, dearon, ball, josh jackson, lauri markannen , zach collins, john collins, jonathan isaac, bam, allen, og, kuz so yeah in a redraft white could be somewhere 12-15.

[John B]

I was glad Derek was older and didn’t fall on that teen sensation, or Spurs wouldn’t have gotten him. Two words, 5 charges. This is the unselfish, Manueque type of player Spurs was lucky to got a steal. Yup Donovan and Tatum would be nice, but I think Derek would end up top 3 on that batch after their careers are over. It depends on the position, Spurs needed the poise on the PG position that comes in maturity staying in college. TP had the benefit of Timmy/Drob and even European superstar Manu to bring leadership. Not with this new Spurs, with DJ still very much erratic sometimes. To be a PG should have that poise/maturity required than any other position. So depends on the position and personnel imo

[spurspl]

btw maybe another older rookie this year? obi toppin?

[cascaders]

derrick white has been playing great! he has so much more potential, i feel like he's still only in like gear 2-3. If the spurs call more plays for him, then man.. overnight superstar

[Dejounte]

tatum, donovan, dearon, ball, josh jackson, lauri markannen , zach collins, john collins, jonathan isaac, bam, allen, og, kuz so yeah in a redraft white could be somewhere 12-15.

Really? You'd have Ball or Isaac over White? OG is not looking like he is having a trajectory of being a great contributor to a team one day either.

[spurspl]

Really? You'd have Ball or Isaac over White? OG is not looking like he is having a trajectory of being a great contributor to a team one day either.

yup, they have had a better potential and skills. If they were in a spurs they would develop much more. But still imo they are slighlty better now and were definetely a better pick then.

[BillMc]

Being older and only having one, maybe two post-rookie contracts in his physical prime, I wonder if we'll have to pay Derrick more than say we did DJ to keep him? And, if so, how much more? White's gotta earn while he can.

[Collins21]

yup, they have had a better potential and skills. If they were in a spurs they would develop much more. But still imo they are slighlty better now and were definetely a better pick then.

You are foolish. On one hand all you do is bash Pop and the organization then on the other hand you say these players would be much better on the Spurs.

[Dejounte]

You are foolish. On one hand all you do is bash Pop and the organization then on the other hand you say these players would be much better on the Spurs.

LMAO yeah you cant have it both ways

[exstatic]

tatum, donovan, dearon, ball, josh jackson, lauri markannen , zach collins, john collins, jonathan isaac, bam, allen, og, kuz so yeah in a redraft white could be somewhere 12-15.

:lol Definitely a hater. Josh jackson is a mega bust, and an entitled baby who was arrested for fleeing an initial arrest (felony) after trying to bully his way into a music festival VIP section. When Phoenix traded him to MEM, he was sent directly to their g-league affiliate. He wasn't even invited to training camp last fall. That says one of two things: we don't think you can make the team, or we just flat out don't want your toxic ass on our roster.

[Collins21]

LMAO yeah you cant have it both ways

I hate reading his post they almost always make no sense.

[spurspl]

You are foolish. On one hand all you do is bash Pop and the organization then on the other hand you say these players would be much better on the Spurs.

i said that multiply times that spurs have one of the best trainers in the league and almost every player here develops but i dont like the way this organization works (the way pop runs team, bad trades, lack of tanking when its needed bc pop must add another PO to his streak etc etc) Thats the difference, my foolish friendS ;)


LMAO yeah you cant have it both ways
up

[Collins21]

i said that multiply times that spurs have one of the best trainers in the league and almost every player here develops but i dont like the way this organization works (the way pop runs team, bad trades, lack of tanking when its needed bc pop must add another PO to his streak etc etc) Thats the difference, my foolish friend ;)

Nah if Pop runs the team so bad players wouldn't get better here they would get worse. You don't like that Pop doesn't allow clown shit in the organization.

[spurspl]

Nah if Pop runs the team so bad players wouldn't get better here they would get worse. You don't like that Pop doesn't allow clown shit in the organization.

ok so u r a fan of playing forbes and belli instead of young players? XD

pop is just a coach and he makes a strategy for the game but for an improvement of guys are responsible trainers.

[spurspl]

:lol Definitely a hater. Josh jackson is a mega bust, and an entitled baby who was arrested for fleeing an initial arrest (felony) after trying to bully his way into a music festival VIP section. When Phoenix traded him to MEM, he was sent directly to their g-league affiliate. He wasn't even invited to training camp last fall. That says one of two things: we don't think you can make the team, or we just flat out don't want your toxic ass on our roster.

maybe hes not the smartest guy in nba, dennis rodman was a badboy too but if u look at the skills and potential (basketball) josh jackson i better in this area than white.

[Dejounte]

maybe hes not the smartest guy in nba, dennis rodman was a badboy too but if u look at the skills and potential (basketball) josh jackson i better in this area than white.

Josh Jackson will be out of the league in two years.

Your double standard amazes me.

Your whole theory that any rookie would be better with the Spurs because of their development team working wonders is lazy analysis.

If we use this logic, there's no possible way to assess players accurately. We live in the here and now, and players with "potential" don't magically become great players if they're with the right organization. They hold a major stake in accountability for their development, too. If your logic was true, all players the Spurs draft should turn out decent... But they don't.

It's pointless to live in a fantasy land where the Spurs development team are like the tooth fairies.

It's funny you bring up Dennis Rodman because he was a Spur and didnt excel here but he did elsewhere. It's actually the perfect example why the Spurs can't simply make ANY player into a great one. The Spurs dont accommodate bad character players. The proof is Dennis Rodman. Given this, Josh Jackson would probably had been out of the league sooner if he was a Spur. Why don't you use this line of thinking? Oh yeah, because it doesn't fit your "any rookie with potential would do better with the Spurs" narrative...

[r0drig0lac]

Really? You'd have Ball or Isaac over White? OG is not looking like he is having a trajectory of being a great contributor to a team one day either.

Isaac? yep

[phxspurfan]

He was a solid pick at that draft position. He had taken the time to develop into a better player in his schools. A true overachiever given his lack of natural talents (not overly fast, strong or athletic, not a great shooter, very average court vision for a PG, but fairly smart esp on D). High character guy, supportive teammate, flourishes in a defensive minded scheme, a true Spurs type of pick (seems like Keldon is the same type of pick, albeit Keldon has higher pedigree). But don’t overvalue him, he’s wildly inconsistent and has persistent confidence problems (like we saw toward the end and after the national team days). Would much rather have higher ceiling guys like Jarrett Allen, Isaac, even OG. OG in this system would be amazing.


Kuz, Fox, Adebayo, Tatum, Ball, Markannen and John Collins are all in a different class. They’re top 10 quality picks. White is a solid backup PG who plays good D.

[Dejounte]

He was a solid pick at that draft position. He had taken the time to develop into a better player in his schools. A true overachiever given his lack of natural talents (not overly fast, strong or athletic, not a great shooter, very average court vision for a PG, but fairly smart esp on D). High character guy/a Spur. But don’t overvalue him, he’s wildly inconsistent. Would much rather have guys like Jarrett Allen, Isaac, even OG. OG in this system would be amazing.


Kuz, Fox, Adebayo, Tatum, Ball, Markannen and John Collins are all in a different class. They’re top 10 quality picks. White is a solid backup PG who plays good D.

Everything you listed are mostly athletic attributes. I think people forget about evaluating players based on their feel, fundamentals, and basketball intelligence. And by the way, White is one of the fastest and quickest players in the league. As far as comparing his skills of that a PG, he isnt a PG... He is a guard / perimeter player with PG skills. This is a classic case of the TP3 vs other guards. I'd wager in the end, White will be the most successful from those players you mentioned and will contribute to winning more. White blows away these other players by sheer fundamentals and winning plays.

[Collins21]

ok so u r a fan of playing forbes and belli instead of young players? XD

pop is just a coach and he makes a strategy for the game but for an improvement of guys are responsible trainers.

Nah buddy you're wrong because with Kawhi Pop laid out a plan for the things he wanted Kawhi to work on to get better as a player and then he and the trainers worked on these points. However the player that Kawhi became in San Antonio was laid out by Pop but the work was put in by Kawhi and the training staff. It's amazing how clueless you are on these things.

[Dejounte]

tatum, donovan, dearon, ball, josh jackson, lauri markannen , zach collins, john collins, jonathan isaac, bam, allen, og, kuz so yeah in a redraft white could be somewhere 12-15.

https://twitter.com/BleacherReport/status/1292578719115042816?s=19

This guy wanting Lonzo fucking Ball over Derrick White just shows you how a lot of Spurs fans here evaluate players

You have your cliff jumpers who dont see things out of perpective ever, and they will only admit theyre wrong until the Spurs achieve an ultra rare feat (winning a championship)

[DAF86]

He was a solid pick at that draft position. He had taken the time to develop into a better player in his schools. A true overachiever given his lack of natural talents (not overly fast, strong or athletic, not a great shooter, very average court vision for a PG, but fairly smart esp on D). High character guy, supportive teammate, flourishes in a defensive minded scheme, a true Spurs type of pick (seems like Keldon is the same type of pick, albeit Keldon has higher pedigree). But don’t overvalue him, he’s wildly inconsistent and has persistent confidence problems (like we saw toward the end and after the national team days). Would much rather have higher ceiling guys like Jarrett Allen, Isaac, even OG. OG in this system would be amazing.


Kuz, Fox, Adebayo, Tatum, Ball, Markannen and John Collins are all in a different class. They’re top 10 quality picks. White is a solid backup PG who plays good D.

He may not be "overly" fast, strong or athletic. But he's more than decent at all of those things, tbh.


Colorado Guard Derrick White posted the second best three-quarter sprint time at 3.08 (97th percentile historically) and tied for the third best standing vertical leap at 35.5 (99th percentile historically) - Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Derrick-White-95407/ ©DraftExpress

White's "untapped Athletic potential" is one of the reasons Buford drafted him. Also:


White shows impressive vision -Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Derrick-White-95407/ ©DraftExpress

What's with all these Spurs fans underselling the only current draft pick who has proven to be worth a shit so far? Is it because he wasn't a "sexy" pick? I don't get it. When I heard we drafted a 23 year old 6'4" guy I was also unimpressed, but after just a couple of games of seeing him play I realized he was the real deal. People need to let their bias go and hop on the D-White train, tbh.

#whitelivematters

[DAF86]

Kuz, Fox, Adebayo, Tatum, Ball, Markannen and John Collins are all in a different class. They’re top 10 quality picks. White is a solid backup PG who plays good D.

lol son, I had skimmed through this part. :lol White is better than half the guys you mention there. White is exactly the player the Pelicans wished Lonzo was.

As my friend Groucho Marx points out:


https://twitter.com/BleacherReport/status/1292578719115042816?s=19

This guy wanting Lonzo fucking Ball over Derrick White just shows you how a lot of Spurs fans here evaluate players

You have your cliff jumpers who dont see things out of perpective ever, and they will only admit theyre wrong until the Spurs achieve an ultra rare feat (winning a championship)

Yall brothas need to start warming up to White, tbh. He will be a top 3/2 Spur, maybe even best Spur, for years to come.

[spurspl]

https://twitter.com/BleacherReport/status/1292578719115042816?s=19

This guy wanting Lonzo fucking Ball over Derrick White just shows you how a lot of Spurs fans here evaluate players

You have your cliff jumpers who dont see things out of perpective ever, and they will only admit theyre wrong until the Spurs achieve an ultra rare feat (winning a championship)


thats just a couple of games in the bubble, look at the wider perspective. Lonzos stats this season: 12ppg/6rpg/7apg. Plus he has still a huge potential and this potential can be unleashed due to right training and hes younger than white. In the bubble white showed how great he can be and yea white in the bubble>>>lonzo in the bubble, theres no doubt. But if u add all above into consideration lonzo in 2-3yrs can be a better player than white now.

However, white seems to be more humble and less money chasing. That could make him more value/money player.