Biden, Harris Want To Force Schools To Let Biological Males into Girls' Sports

[ducks]

https://www.westernjournal.com/biden-harris-want-force-schools-let-biological-males-girls-sports/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=westernjournalism&utm_content=2020-08-12&utm_campaign=manualpost&fbclid=IwAR19-_sSvELe3rFIPI3H0NMG6wnJCir78_RntGgz5r05bH3iRLGd_3W pRRY

[rmt]

Wonder what Serena will have to say about this - by the time it hits a skill sport (as opposed to sheer speed and strength) like tennis, she'll be retired. And if she ever happens to match or break Margaret Smith Court's Grand Slam singles record - well, her record won't last very long.

[spurraider21]

yes the same hordes of non-genuine trans women who also stormed into girls bathrooms and raped them all

every amazing athlete i know decides to claim to be a woman just so they can dunk on girls

this same fear mongering crap is why Mack Beggs was forced to wrestle in the girls division

[Trainwreck2100]

this same fear mongering crap is why Mack Beggs was forced to wrestle in the girls division

If she went against men she would have gotten her ass kicked. Nobody on testosterone should be allowed to play in sports it's a fucking ped

[spurraider21]

If she went against men she would have gotten her ass kicked. Nobody on testosterone should be allowed to play in sports it's a fucking ped
So it’s an unfair PED and yet the other men would have kicked his ass.

[Trainwreck2100]

So it’s an unfair PED and yet the other men would have kicked his ass.

Nobody taking testosterone should be in sorry especially a female

[spurraider21]

Nobody taking testosterone should be in sorry especially a female
Because you say so?

im not convinced that the <1% or the population that is trans is going to take over and destroy sports

people talk as if prime lebron is just going to say “lol I’m a woman now” and instantly be allowed in the WNBA

[Nathan89]

Leftist lunatics throwing women under the bus for their new victim class.

[Nathan89]

Letting boys compete against girls will ruin the sporting experience for more people than it will benefit.

[spurraider21]

Leftist lunatics throwing women under the bus for their new victim class.
How are women being thrown under the bus

[spurraider21]

Letting boys compete against girls will ruin the sporting experience for more people than it will benefit.
How do you know who the boys are and who the girls are. Do you inspect the genitals of every child you come across? That’s pretty weird dude

[Nathan89]

"Less than a third of Americans believe biological males who identify as transgender should be allowed to compete in girls’ sports, a November 2019 poll showed."

[Nathan89]

How do you know who the boys are and who the girls are. Do you inspect the genitals of every child you come across? That’s pretty weird dude

No, but doctors do that when you get your physical.

[spurraider21]

"Less than a third of Americans believe biological males who identify as transgender should be allowed to compete in girls’ sports, a November 2019 poll showed."
63% of Americans support BLM

[spurraider21]

No, but doctors do that when you get your physical.
No doctor ever observed my penis when i played high school sports.

[ducks]

63% of Americans support BLM

Link

[Nathan89]

63% of Americans support BLM

Not based on the numbers I've seen. Also the media has been spewing propaganda about peaceful protesters to boost their numbers.

[Nathan89]

No doctor ever observed my penis when i played high school sports.

It was a part of my physical and the other people I knew that played sports.

[spurraider21]

Link
The most shocking thing to ducks in a thread about transgenders is that the American people support black people

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/63-support-black-lives-matter-recognition-discrimination-jumps/story?id=71779435

[spurraider21]

It was a part of my physical and the other people I knew that played sports.
Was he also a catholic priest?

why the fuck would a penis inspection be relevant for a physical to play sports?

[Nathan89]

Link

Based on what I've seen their support is at 49%, 37% dislike, the rest is unsure.

[elbamba1]

No doctor ever observed my penis when i played high school sports.
Then you had bad doctors. Male physicals always include a good testicle grab and cough.

[Nathan89]

Was he also a catholic priest?

why the fuck would a penis inspection be relevant for a physical to play sports?

"During the physical examination, the doctor will examine the genitals, including the penis and testicles. The doctor may ask the teenager to cough while examining the scrotum. Although this can be embarrassing for an adolescent male, it is necessary to help evaluate the presence of inguinal hernias or tumors."

[spurraider21]

"During the physical examination, the doctor will examine the genitals, including the penis and testicles. The doctor may ask the teenager to cough while examining the scrotum. Although this can be embarrassing for an adolescent male, it is necessary to help evaluate the presence of inguinal hernias or tumors."
a) A general physical is different from one necessarily for sports

b) this nuance has nothing to do with my original question

c) can you demonstrate that substantial harm will be done to the integrity of sports if trans students can participate?

[spurraider21]

Based on what I've seen their support is at 49%, 37% dislike, the rest is unsure.
How far down the search results are you going to find those :lol

pew has it at 67%

[DMC]

63% of Americans support BLM

BS.

Polls dont equate to popular votes

[DMC]

So why cant prime Lebron enter WNBA without claiming to be female?

[spurraider21]

So why cant prime Lebron enter WNBA without claiming to be female?
Because he’s not a woman

[spurraider21]

BS.

Polls dont equate to popular votes
Agreed. Never made that claim

[DMC]

Because he’s not a woman

So theres a stipulation that you must be female to play against other females ... because..?

[DMC]

Agreed. Never made that claim

you said 67% of Americans. You meant 67% of those polled.

[Nathan89]

Because he’s not a woman

And these people trying to compete against youth females are not females.

[spurraider21]

So theres a stipulation that you must be female to play against other females ... because..?
Must be a woman to play against other women

[DMC]

Must be a woman to play against other women

Why?

[spurraider21]

you said 67% of Americans. You meant 67% of those polled.
Polls are purposely designed to be extrapolated. That’s the whole point of polls.

You think my statement was claiming that all 320 million + Americans expressed their opinions? :lol

[spurraider21]

Why?
There’s good social utility in it

[Nathan89]

Imagine bringing up irrelevant black lives matter polls in response to me quoting the relevant polls that are against the policies that lunatics are implementing. And then later responding "this nuance has nothing to do with my original question" as if you care about being on topic.

[DMC]

Polls are purposely designed to be extrapolated. That’s the whole point of polls.

You think my statement was claiming that all 320 million + Americans expressed their opinions? :lol

this is how you were presenting it to show approval for BLM. You did not use the word "poll".

[spurraider21]

And these people trying to compete against youth females are not females.
Sports have typically been divided by gender not sex. You play boys basketball and girls basketball. Or men’s and women’s. Nobody calls it male soccer and female soccer

[DMC]

There’s good social utility in it

explain

[spurraider21]

this is how you were presenting it to show approval for BLM. You did not use the word "poll".
:lmao

[spurraider21]

Imagine bringing up irrelevant black lives matter polls in response to me quoting the relevant polls that are against the policies that lunatics are implementing. And then later responding "this nuance has nothing to do with my original question" as if you care about being on topic.
The point is that using polls to dictate policy is awfully convenient when you agree with it. I don’t think polling the American public is a good way to determine the policies of schools or private sports organizations

[Nathan89]

There is good in allowing youth females to compete in a fair competition against other youth females tbh.

[DMC]

Sports have typically been divided by gender not sex. You play boys basketball and girls basketball. Or men’s and women’s. Nobody calls it male soccer and female soccer

Thats because men and women historically were male and female. This alternate reality we live in now isnt retroactive.

[spurraider21]

explain
Particularly as it relates to team sports, there’s easier comradery when girls are among girls, etc. that’s a big element in sports.

Men also tend to have physical advantages over women, so that separation tends to benefit both

[spurraider21]

Thats because men and women historically were male and female. This alternate reality we live in now isnt retroactive.
There have always been transgender people.

A vast majority of males still identify as men and vice versa. That hasn’t changed

[DMC]

Particularly as it relates to team sports, there’s easier comradery when girls are among girls, etc. that’s a big element in sports.

Men also tend to have physical advantages over women, so that separation tends to benefit both

So gender roles have advantages physically?

[spurraider21]

So gender roles have advantages physically?
Didn’t say that.

Most men tend to be male, most women tend to be female. The physical advantages of the male sex tends to manifest men

[Nathan89]

The point is that using polls to dictate policy is awfully convenient when you agree with it. I don’t think polling the American public is a good way to determine the policies of schools or private sports organizations

There is no policy being put forth to ruin BLM.

My quote was from the article and on topic and doesn't represent the entirety of my position. I never implied that we rule solely based on polls.

[DMC]

There have always been transgender people.

A vast majority of males still identify as men and vice versa. That hasn’t changed

Yet you seem to want to take the micro percentage of anomalies as the norm and say man and woman do not represent male and female.

Do you think doctors say congrats its a male?

[spurraider21]

There is no policy being put forth to ruin BLM.

My quote was from the article and on topic and doesn't represent the entirety of my position. I never implied that we rule solely based on polls.
To what extent should they be? I’d rather ask medical professionals

[DMC]

Didn’t say that.

Most men tend to be male, most women tend to be female. The physical advantages of the male sex tends to manifest men

Now you tie male to man. So you support cisgender policies?

When the man decides hes a woman do those advantages no longer matter?

[spurraider21]

Yet you seem to want to take the micro percentage of anomalies as the norm and say man and woman do not represent male and female.
im saying the micro percentage exists.

Ive read some interesting opinions on how you can actually accommodate, such as:

trans women must compete with men until they have undergone at least 12 consecutive months of hormone therapy, at which point they must compete with women

trans men have the option of competing with either until they have undergone at least 12 consecutive months... at which point they can only compete with men.

I don’t mind having similar standards on a sport by sport basis. We are just just talking about schools here.


Do you think doctors say congrats its a male?
They don’t. It’s technically incorrect but i don’t think it’s harmful enough to worry about, and given our understanding of the numbers it’s pretty damn reasonable to assume the kid is cis gendered until further notice

[DMC]

To what extent should they be? I’d rather ask medical professionals

Its not a medical issue. Its an ethics issue. Would you let a boy who claims to be a girl sleep with your daughter?

[spurraider21]

Now you tie male to man. So you support cisgender policies?

When the man decides hes a woman do those advantages no longer matter?
People don’t just up and decide. I also recognize that the biology doesn’t disappear. see my post above

[spurraider21]

Its not a medical issue. Its an ethics issue. Would you let a boy who claims to be a girl sleep with your daughter?
Do parents typically consent to their kids sex choices?

the degree to which somebody is psychologically harmed is a medical question. The degree to which hormone therapy can offset previous differences is inherently medical

[DMC]

im saying the micro percentage exists.

Ive read some interesting opinions on how you can actually accommodate, such as:

trans women must compete with men until they have undergone at least 12 consecutive months of hormone therapy, at which point they must compete with women

trans men have the option of competing with either until they have undergone at least 12 consecutive months... at which point they can only compete with men.

I don’t mind having similar standards on a sport by sport basis. We are just just talking about schools here.


They don’t. It’s technically incorrect but i don’t think it’s harmful enough to worry about, and given our understanding of the numbers it’s pretty damn reasonable to assume the kid is cis gendered until further notice

Whats reasonable changes when you get skin in the game. Assuming cisgender as normal is the new racism.

[DMC]

Do parents typically consent to their kids sex choices?

the degree to which somebody is psychologically harmed is a medical question. The degree to which hormone therapy can offset previous differences is inherently medical

I didnt mention sex. Daughter is 12. Boy/girl is 13.

[spurraider21]

The fearmongering scenario of dude suddenely deciding I’m a girl is absurd.

Certainly a school would be able to inquire about the child’s history. Have they seen psychologists? Have they been presenting themselves as being of the particular gender for any significant period of time? Are the undergoing hormone therapy or on puberty blockers, etc

[spurraider21]

I didnt mention sex. Daughter is 12. Boy/girl is 13.
You said sleep with, which is often a euphemism for sex.

If you are referring to a sleepover situation for kids, see my previous post

[FrostKing]

I self identify as African American and I support President Trump

[spurraider21]

I self identify as African American and I support President Trump
Don’t think there’s any significant psychologic or medical backing for a condition of trans-racial identification but sure, go along with your strawman

[FrostKing]

Don’t think there’s any significant psychologic or medical backing for a condition of trans-racial identification but sure, go along with your strawman
What if I told you I'm a transnigga

[spurraider21]

What if I told you I'm a transnigga
Id say the same exact thing as my previous post but also call you a probable racist

[rmt]

How are women being thrown under the bus

Are you really being serious? Even top women tennis players can be beaten by some high school/college male players. I suspect your tune might change if ever a daughter of yours competes/tries her very best and gets nowhere against males - especially where scholarship/prize money is concerned.

[Spurtacular]

63% of Americans support BLM

Source: Madeupmonkeyshit.com

[Millennial_Messiah]

plus, if you want to be a trans MTF and play basketball, your American salary in the WNBA is less than a corporate level programmer. Need to move to the USSR to make the big bucks.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Don’t think there’s any significant psychologic or medical backing for a condition of trans-racial identification but sure, go along with your strawman

Can you identify as trans racial (on a census or otherwise) if your wife/kids are a different race than you? Even if you don't take those melanin shots, lol.

[Spurtacular]

Lite's sperm shielding in this thread off the charts.

[boutons_deux]

Funny how people always tout youth sports as important because they build character and solid values, but the moment character and values are needed in youth sports, the adults are the ones acting the most childish.

total bullshit, same myth around military service.

Neither is guaranteed, or even probable, to "build (male) character" which usually means MachoMan "toxic masculinity" devoid of morals, ethics, fair play, respect for others.

[Will Hunting]

This kind of stuff is where Dems need to drop it (assuming the OP is actually true). Most Kids grow up without going to an all girls or all boys school, I don’t see why trannies having to do the same is such a big deal.

As for sports, sorry but it’s not fair to girls if they have to compete against a 6’3” 250 lbs. behemoth even if the person is legit trans. There are plenty of people with disabilities who can’t participate in sports at all, it’s not some grave injustice if trans people (a tiny portion of the population) are in the same boat.

[MultiTroll]

https://www.westernjournal.com/biden-harris-want-force-schools-let-biological-males-girls-sports/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=westernjournalism&utm_content=2020-08-12&utm_campaign=manualpost&fbclid=IwAR19-_sSvELe3rFIPI3H0NMG6wnJCir78_RntGgz5r05bH3iRLGd_3W pRRY
"University of Montana runner June Eastwood, a biologically male athlete who identifies as a transgender woman, was named the Big Sky Conference’s female athlete of the week in October 2019."

any relation?
https://i.pinimg.com/736x/bf/66/1a/bf661adad10eee623c8b987a6fa67a86--s-hairstyles-short-hairstyles-for-women.jpg

[rmt]

im saying the micro percentage exists.

Ive read some interesting opinions on how you can actually accommodate, such as:

trans women must compete with men until they have undergone at least 12 consecutive months of hormone therapy, at which point they must compete with women

trans men have the option of competing with either until they have undergone at least 12 consecutive months... at which point they can only compete with men.

I don’t mind having similar standards on a sport by sport basis. We are just just talking about schools here.


They don’t. It’s technically incorrect but i don’t think it’s harmful enough to worry about, and given our understanding of the numbers it’s pretty damn reasonable to assume the kid is cis gendered until further notice

So, are they gonna shrink x (average difference between men and women) inches and weigh x pounds less after 12 consecutive months of this hormone therapy?

[rmt]

"University of Montana runner June Eastwood, a biologically male athlete who identifies as a transgender woman, was named the Big Sky Conference’s female athlete of the week in October 2019."

any relation?
https://i.pinimg.com/736x/bf/66/1a/bf661adad10eee623c8b987a6fa67a86--s-hairstyles-short-hairstyles-for-women.jpg

OMGosh - all my good thoughts of Dirty Harry just became like thoughts of Bruce Jenner winning the decathalon.

[spurraider21]

This kind of stuff is where Dems need to drop it (assuming the OP is actually true). Most Kids grow up without going to an all girls or all boys school, I don’t see why trannies having to do the same is such a big deal.

As for sports, sorry but it’s not fair to girls if they have to compete against a 6’3” 250 lbs. behemoth even if the person is legit trans. There are plenty of people with disabilities who can’t participate in sports at all, it’s not some grave injustice if trans people (a tiny portion of the population) are in the same boat.
How many 6’3 250 pound trans college athletes are there?

This isn’t remotely the most important issue to me (I’ve already told you what i think priority issues for the election should be, and the two biggest issues for me personally besides those are climate change and healthcare)... but the fearmongering over Lebron just up and deciding he’s a girl so he can dominate girls basketball in junior high is made up shit

[spurraider21]

Can you identify as trans racial (on a census or otherwise) if your wife/kids are a different race than you? Even if you don't take those melanin shots, lol.
Show me any medical or psychological data/research supporting that and I’ll listen

[Will Hunting]

Quite frankly, even as to the ones who are genuine about being a trans woman, any biological male who wins a female athlete award without any shame or recognition of the physical advantages is a fucking loser.

“June Eastwood” isn’t any more of a woman after he/she/whatever dominated a sports competition against physically inferior biological women. He’s just an asshole.

[spurraider21]

Quite frankly, even as to the ones who are genuine about being a trans woman, any biological male who wins a female athlete award without any shame or recognition of the physical advantages is a fucking loser.

“June Eastwood” isn’t any more of a woman after he/she/whatever dominated a sports competition against physically inferior biological women. He’s just an asshole.
She won that award after a second place finish.

This isnt really you saying dems should drop the issue because of any strategic reason, this is just because you disagree with it because trans people are weird and icky

[Will Hunting]

How many 6’3 250 pound trans college athletes are there?

This isn’t remotely the most important issue to me (I’ve already told you what i think priority issues for the election should be, and the two biggest issues for me personally besides those are climate change and healthcare)... but the fearmongering over Lebron just up and deciding he’s a girl so he can dominate girls basketball in junior high is made up shit
I’m not sure what “June Eastwood’s” height and weight are, but I’m willing to bet (insert appropriate pronoun here) has clear and significant physical advantages over whoever the female athlete (insert appropriate pronoun here) beat out for the Sky Conference Female Athlete of the Week award.

I agree the Lebron James scenario fear mongering is ridiculous, but this is just an issue of fairness to me. The scenario where a very small number of biological men/trans women either have to compete against biological men or can’t compete at all presents less unfairness than the scenario where allowing that same very small group to compete against biological women ruins the competitive experience for a much larger group of biological women (let’s not pretend that it wouldn’t be discouraging for a female track and field athlete who busted her ass training for an event to show up to the event only to discover one of the other runners is a biological male who’s going to smoke her no matter how hard she trained).

[Will Hunting]

She won that award after a second place finish.

This isnt really you saying dems should drop the issue because of any strategic reason, this is just because you disagree with it because trans people are weird and icky
Not really. I make fun of trans shit because the amount of airtime liberals give it (as something that affects only a tiny number of people) is absurd. During the first primary debate Cory Booker at one point said “We need to be concerned about the rights of black homosexual transgender people!”...yeah buddy, we’ll get on that when we tackle human rights issues Asian-Latino Hermaphrodites with irritable bowl syndrome and every other oddly specific demographic might face.

[spurraider21]

I’m not sure what “June Eastwood’s” height and weight are, but I’m willing to bet (insert appropriate pronoun here) has clear and significant physical advantages over whoever the female athlete (insert appropriate pronoun here) beat out for the Sky Conference Female Athlete of the Week award.

I agree the Lebron James scenario fear mongering is ridiculous, but this is just an issue of fairness to me. The scenario where a very small number of biological men/trans women either have to compete against biological men or can’t compete at all presents less unfairness than the scenario where allowing that same very small group to compete against biological women ruins the competitive experience for a much larger group of biological women (let’s not pretend that it wouldn’t be discouraging for a female track and field athlete who busted her ass training for an event to show up to the event only to discover one of the other runners is a biological male who’s going to smoke her no matter how hard she trained).
You don’t have to speculate on what the pronoun should be. Pronouns are a shorthand of using somebody’s name. Somebody with a feminine name would be called she, etc.

There are something like 150-200 trans ncaa athletes but naturally attention goes to the small handful that are excelling.

at some point a lot of this stuff becomes arbitrary. Should they have made a separate black nba because they were too good for whites? Should Lebron have been banned from high school ball because he was born with athletic advantages? The advantage lebron had over other boys far outweighed whatever advantage this June Eastwood person does.

If it can be demonstrated that trans athletes are ruining sports with any meaningful data we can discuss it. In the meantime this is a population with an astronomically high suicide rate where the single best way found to reduce that is strong support from family, showing that this is a a result of social stigma and their not being able to enjoy everyday experiences because they were unfortunate enough to be born with Genital that don’t comport with our socially invented set of expectations of personality and character for people with those genitals

[spurraider21]

Not really. I make fun of trans shit because the amount of airtime liberals give it (as something that affects only a tiny number of people) is absurd. During the first primary debate Cory Booker at one point said “We need to be concerned about the rights of black homosexual transgender people!”...yeah buddy, we’ll get on that when we tackle human rights issues Asian-Latino Hermaphrodites with irritable bowl syndrome and every other oddly specific demographic might face.
i agree that booker bringing that up was cringe inducing... just like kamala harping on and on about getting trump banned from twitter when everybody else in the room was talking about adult issues :lol

Is a trans woman a woman?

[Millennial_Messiah]

Show me any medical or psychological data/research supporting that and I’ll listen

Medically, obviously not. Living 40 years and even exchanging DNA through french kissing, sexual intercourse and the like does not change one's race because, even though you are what you consume to an extent, the individual's original genome controls mitosis, which is cell/DNA replication and division. So we can rule out the idea of having large amounts of physical/very intimate contact and exchanging of temporary DNA with someone of a different race can actually medically change the race of the individual.

Meiosis on the other hand is a complicated process, because the zygote formed by, say, a white man's sperm and a black woman's egg, does in fact create an individual that is a race of his/her own, sharing characteristics of both his/her parents. While the generic result is "mixed", the fact is that most of us are already mixed to some degree in some way. What are the odds otherwise?

The key is psychological. Also, external factors like, financials, what kind of neighborhood (downtown vs. dogtown vs. suburban/poshtown vs. rural) do you live in, whose extended family is more involved in their and/or their kids' lives, etc. What kind of culture(s) they are exposed to, music scenes, school quality and racial/ethic/socioeconomic makeup, etc. All of that can factor in to determining the psychological aspect of racial / ethnic identity.

[Will Hunting]

You don’t have to speculate on what the pronoun should be. Pronouns are a shorthand of using somebody’s name. Somebody with a feminine name would be called she, etc.
Sorry but a lot of trans people want to be referred to as "they" and "them".


There are something like 150-200 trans ncaa athletes but naturally attention goes to the small handful that are excelling.
How many are competing against other women? I have no issue with trans athletes competing in the men's league.


at some point a lot of this stuff becomes arbitrary. Should they have made a separate black nba because they were too good for whites? Should Lebron have been banned from high school ball because he was born with athletic advantages? The advantage lebron had over other boys far outweighed whatever advantage this June Eastwood person does.
This is a ridiculous slippery slope. A sports league dedicated to women who compete against other biological women isn't something new.


If it can be demonstrated that trans athletes are ruining sports with any meaningful data we can discuss it.
Lets start with whoever would have won the award June (transgender people always pick the stupidest first names) won over a hardworking female athlete who didn't have the advantage of higher testosterone levels.


In the meantime this is a population with an astronomically high suicide rate where the single best way found to reduce that is strong support from family, showing that this is a a result of social stigma and their not being able to enjoy everyday experiences because they were unfortunate enough to be born with Genital that don’t comport with our socially invented set of expectations of personality and character for people with those genitals
It's not just genitals, it's size/build/etc. Hate to break it to you, but life is always going to be difficult for a woman with the physical appearance of a man and visa versa.

[Millennial_Messiah]

i agree that booker bringing that up was cringe inducing... just like kamala harping on and on about getting trump banned from twitter when everybody else in the room was talking about adult issues :lol

Is a trans woman a woman?

No. A trans woman is the third category; non-binary.

If anything, have sports be 3 categories... men's, women's, and other/non binary's.

[Will Hunting]

i agree that booker bringing that up was cringe inducing... just like kamala harping on and on about getting trump banned from twitter when everybody else in the room was talking about adult issues :lol

Is a trans woman a woman?
I don't give enough of a shit to care. Take the bathroom shit for instance, when I'm in a public restroom it has never dawned on me to check the gender of everyone else there. I take a piss, wash my hands and leave. If trans people want to use the same public restroom as me, go for it. Not even sure why it needed a law.

Quite honestly I think trans shit has filled the void left by gay marriage that establishment Dems focus on so they can avoid talking about things like single payer healthcare and out of control defense spending. Americans view the Republican party as the party more equipped to handle the economy even though the last two Republican presidential terms have ended/will end with double digit unemployment, and spending disproportionate time harping on shit like this feeds those misconceptions.

[Chucho]

Was he also a catholic priest?


The Catholic Priest is being usurped by politicians and celebrities as the pedophile monsters of the times. Get as much juice out of this while you can.

[spurraider21]

Sorry but a lot of trans people want to be referred to as "they" and "them".
gotcha... though every article i pulled after after june eastwood was brought up ITT referred to her as a she



How many are competing against other women? I have no issue with trans athletes competing in the men's league.
might be good information to have before being so worried about it, tbh



This is a ridiculous slippery slope. A sports league dedicated to women who compete against other biological women isn't something new.
and if the concern over trans women competing is inherent athletic advantages, it's not that slippery



Lets start with whoever would have won the award June (transgender people always pick the stupidest first names) won over a hardworking female athlete who didn't have the advantage of higher testosterone levels.
the implication being that June wasn't hard working? from what ive read, june was a champion track runner in high school among boys and on that merit became a college track runner. had to stop competing for 15 months while undergoing hormone treatment. i havent kept up with june eastwoods track career (first heard that name today) to know what's been happening since


It's not just genitals, it's size/build/etc.
but you dont determine somebody's sex by looking at their shoulder breadth and height. for a child in their early teens, the differences are largely negligible, for instance.


Hate to break it to you, but life is always going to be difficult for a woman with the physical appearance of a man and visa versa.
i have no doubt about that

it will be... because they are still stigmatized. it was a lot harder to be a gay person 40 years ago than it is now, because people warmed up to them. their suicide rates have seen a drastic drop as well.

[Will Hunting]

i have no doubt about that

it will be... because they are still stigmatized. it was a lot harder to be a gay person 40 years ago than it is now, because people warmed up to them. their suicide rates have seen a drastic drop as well.
The fact I wouldn't be physically attracted to a woman with broad shoulders and a gigantic Adam's Apple bulge has fuck all to do with stigma. You can't actually be serious.

[Will Hunting]

No, but doctors do that when you get your physical.
:lmao

Were you on the gymnastics team at Michigan State? That would explain you being so angry at the world.

[spurraider21]

No. A trans woman is the third category; non-binary.

If anything, have sports be 3 categories... men's, women's, and other/non binary's.
somebody who identifies as a woman is by definition binary

[spurraider21]

The fact I wouldn't be physically attracted to a woman with broad shoulders and a gigantic Adam's Apple bulge has fuck all to do with stigma. You can't actually be serious.
i'm not talking about sexual attraction, i'm talking about everyday life. the high rates of suicidality among that population isn't because they aren't getting laid

whats funny about this is that without your knowing, you've probably been attracted to a woman who was actually trans. they're not all like the black hooker from 40 year old virgin

[Millennial_Messiah]

I don't give enough of a shit to care. Take the bathroom shit for instance, when I'm in a public restroom it has never dawned on me to check the gender of everyone else there. I take a piss, wash my hands and leave. If trans people want to use the same public restroom as me, go for it. Not even sure why it needed a law.

Quite honestly I think trans shit has filled the void left by gay marriage that establishment Dems focus on so they can avoid talking about things like single payer healthcare and out of control defense spending. Americans view the Republican party as the party more equipped to handle the economy even though the last two Republican presidential terms have ended/will end with double digit unemployment, and spending disproportionate time harping on shit like this feeds those misconceptions.
Yeah, MIT a few years back incorporated gender-neutral community bathrooms (with showers, sort of like a locker room) in their dorm halls. Still I believe they only pair the same gender for roommates in double rooms, but the halls and even suites are completely co-ed there. Not sure what other colleges have followed them, I may recall reading that Oberlin might have at some point. Honestly, who cares about bathrooms and locker rooms and showers? Just because you have co-ed public bathrooms and showers doesn't mean that the girls are going to be raped or sex-related crimes in general would increase. So having completely gender-neutral bathrooms is a much easier way to fix the "trans" issue than having to have 3 separate bathrooms/shower rooms. I agree that people should stop being so puritanical and prudish. The idea of incidentally or accidentally seeing someone partially or fully naked does not mean someone is going to get molested or assaulted! Jeez.


The fact I wouldn't be physically attracted to a woman with broad shoulders and a gigantic Adam's Apple bulge has fuck all to do with stigma. You can't actually be serious.
Not to mention, the one in their pants

[Millennial_Messiah]

somebody who identifies as a woman is by definition binary

What is the sex on their birth certificate, when they were born in the hospital? That is their binary sex, and only possible binary sex for life.

They have but one other option: a sex change (self-funded, not by taxpayer dollars btw), and thus a change to identifying as the opposite sex; however, they are now part of the 3rd category, which includes anyone who is not both currently AND born (M) or (F).

[spurraider21]

Yeah, MIT a few years back incorporated gender-neutral community bathrooms (with showers, sort of like a locker room) in their dorm halls. Still I believe they only pair the same gender for roommates in double rooms, but the halls and even suites are completely co-ed there. Not sure what other colleges have followed them, I may recall reading that Oberlin might have at some point. Honestly, who cares about bathrooms and locker rooms and showers? Just because you have co-ed public bathrooms and showers doesn't mean that the girls are going to be raped or sex-related crimes in general would increase. So having completely gender-neutral bathrooms is a much easier way to fix the "trans" issue than having to have 3 separate bathrooms/shower rooms. I agree that people should stop being so puritanical and prudish. The idea of incidentally or accidentally seeing someone partially or fully naked does not mean someone is going to get molested or assaulted! Jeez.
or you could just continue having 2 bathrooms and people will choose the one they prefer or identify with as they always had, even before laws were put into place.

rape is still illegal. the meme of grown man walking up to the bathroom saying "HUR DUR IM A GIRL NOW" and then raping the girls in the bathroom isnt born out by any statistic

[Will Hunting]

the meme of grown man walking up to the bathroom saying "HUR DUR IM A GIRL NOW" and then raping the girls in the bathroom isnt born out by any statistic
Yeah that one was ridiculous. Pretty sure if a rapist wants to go after a girl who's in the restroom, the sign that says "girls only" isn't going to be much of a deterrent :lol

[spurraider21]

What is the sex on their birth certificate, when they were born in the hospital? That is their binary sex, and only possible binary sex for life.

They have but one other option: a sex change (self-funded, not by taxpayer dollars btw), and thus a change to identifying as the opposite sex; however, they are now part of the 3rd category, which includes anyone who is not both currently AND born (M) or (F).
now you're changing from sex to gender. nobody "identifies as the opposite sex"

the gender binary is identifying as a man or woman.

sex isn't even really a binary (though it is bimodal), and that refers generally to what genitals you have and/or your chromosomes. there are fringe cases there too, people born with XXY, XYY, X. there are people with XX who develop male parts, and people with XY who develop female parts.

[Millennial_Messiah]

or you could just continue having 2 bathrooms and people will choose the one they prefer or identify with as they always had, even before laws were put into place.

rape is still illegal. the meme of grown man walking up to the bathroom saying "HUR DUR IM A GIRL NOW" and then raping the girls in the bathroom isnt born out by any statistic
Just make all bathrooms gender independent, problem solved.

Rape will always be illegal, and the idea that women should have to fear that just because there are men in the restroom eliminating waste/doing their business at the same time as the females, is absurd. And the idea of men freaking out over seeing a tampon or pad in the waste basket? Get over it, grow up, this isn't the 16th century.

[spurraider21]

Just make all bathrooms gender independent, problem solved.

Rape will always be illegal, and the idea that women should have to fear that just because there are men in the restroom eliminating waste/doing their business at the same time as the females, is absurd. And the idea of men freaking out over seeing a tampon or pad in the waste basket? Get over it, grow up, this isn't the 16th century.
people also go to certain bathrooms because there's a level of comfort. i dont go to the men's bathroom because i'm afraid of getting raped by women. if somebody is trans, early on during that they'll probably still go to the same bathroom they always had, until they start feeling more and more affirmed in their identity, and will eventually start using the other one.

its really not a big deal. nobody does a genital check at the bathroom door. it hasn't been a problem to date. no problem with having the 2 restrooms. some places like starbucks have space for a single unisex bathroom, thats obviously fine too.

but no it doesnt make sense to have a single large unisex restroom... women dont want to walk in and see dudes on urinals

[Millennial_Messiah]

now you're changing from sex to gender. nobody "identifies as the opposite sex"

the gender binary is identifying as a man or woman.

sex isn't even really a binary (though it is bimodal), and that refers generally to what genitals you have and/or your chromosomes. there are fringe cases there too, people born with XXY, XYY, X. there are people with XX who develop male parts, and people with XY who develop female parts.
the XXY, XYY, XXXY etc hermaphrodite cases would of course be listed as "other", say "X" at birth. In which case they are already born into the third category I've been talking about all along, and are therefore set for life in the third category of non-binary.

Three categories
(M) for life
(F) for life
(X) - Non binary, either at birth or changed sex/gender identity at any point in life.

[spurraider21]

the XXY, XYY, XXXY etc hermaphrodite cases would of course be listed as "other", say "X" at birth. In which case they are already born into the third category I've been talking about all along, and are therefore set for life in the third category of non-binary.

Three categories
(M) for life
(F) for life
(X) - Non binary, either at birth or changed sex/gender identity at any point in life.
you are failing to recognize the distinction between sex and gender

the gender binary, as we have it in our society (there are places, such as in parts of asia, where they actually recognize 3 genders), refers to people who identify as a man or woman. that is their gender. that is separate and distinct from their sex (genitals/chromosomes).

lockdowns notwithstanding, you probably see hundreds of people per day and can make educated guesses about whether those people are men or women without ever seeing their genitals or running a DNA test. gender is your identity and how you express yourself to the world. if you identify as a man or woman, you by definition fall under the gender binary

[Millennial_Messiah]

people also go to certain bathrooms because there's a level of comfort. i dont go to the men's bathroom because i'm afraid of getting raped by women.

And because, well, there's a sign, and, illegal or not, it would just be socially awkward to go into the one labeled for females.

The bottom line is that, bathrooms should be gender independent, because-

-Men should not necessarily be uncomfortable by the presence of women or non-binaries in the bathroom,
-Women should not necessarily be uncomfortable by the presence of men or non-binaries in the bathroom, and;
-Non-binaries should not necessarily be uncomfortable by the presence of cis-men, cis-women, or other types of non-binaries in the bathroom.

At the end of the day, human waste is human waste, and it's all headed for the sewer no matter the sex/gender of the human bodies that eliminated such waste; it breaks down and decomposes, and eventually its atoms and molecules are re-instated, little by little, back into nature in its due time.

[spurraider21]

And because, well, there's a sign, and, illegal or not, it would just be socially awkward to go into the one labeled for females.

The bottom line is that, bathrooms should be gender independent, because-

-Men should not necessarily be uncomfortable by the presence of women or non-binaries in the bathroom,
-Women should not necessarily be uncomfortable by the presence of men or non-binaries in the bathroom, and;
-Non-binaries should not necessarily be uncomfortable by the presence of cis-men, cis-women, or other types of non-binaries in the bathroom.

At the end of the day, human waste is human waste, and it's all headed for the sewer no matter the sex/gender of the human bodies that eliminated such waste; it breaks down and decomposes, and eventually its atoms and molecules are re-instated, little by little, back into nature in its due time.
you have a fundamental misunderstanding about the relationship between sex and gender.

transgender =/= non-binary

transgender = when your gender identity does not correspond with the one which was assigned to you at birth due to your sex

non-binary = when your gender does not fit under the man/woman paradigm

[Millennial_Messiah]

women dont want to walk in and see dudes on urinals

You obviously would engineer it to where the urinals were away, maybe by having a separate stall door or partition for the urinals away from the front entrance, lol.

[spurraider21]

You obviously would engineer it to where the urinals were away, maybe by having a separate stall door or partition for the urinals away from the front entrance, lol.
why are you so opposed to the dual bathroom system? has it been problematic?

[pgardn]

https://www.westernjournal.com/biden-harris-want-force-schools-let-biological-males-girls-sports/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=westernjournalism&utm_content=2020-08-12&utm_campaign=manualpost&fbclid=IwAR19-_sSvELe3rFIPI3H0NMG6wnJCir78_RntGgz5r05bH3iRLGd_3W pRRY


Yes they will make this a major part of their platform.
This goes nowhere. Not during an election.
Just like Trump did not want to talk about a more fundamental candidate characteristic, honesty.
He has never said that word.

[MultiTroll]

OMGosh - all my good thoughts of Dirty Harry just became like thoughts of Bruce Jenner winning the decathalon.
:rollin

I already believe in God, so will not need to check out of the human race if Clint were to pull that shit. You neither please.
Brucette Kardashian, while I didn't see full on tranny coming, you can more or less expect super weird shit to any bio males who choose to engage with those demonic kunts.

[Millennial_Messiah]

why are you so opposed to the dual bathroom system? has it been problematic?

Well, I work in IT..... and those curry-smelling Indians straight off the plane from India, they have not a clue regarding Proper U.S. urinal etiquette, but it's whatever I guess, just a pet peeve of mine.

[pgardn]

the XXY, XYY, XXXY etc hermaphrodite cases would of course be listed as "other", say "X" at birth. In which case they are already born into the third category I've been talking about all along, and are therefore set for life in the third category of non-binary.

Three categories
(M) for life
(F) for life
(X) - Non binary, either at birth or changed sex/gender identity at any point in life.

If you really understand this:

Genotype does not necessarily lead to a certain phenotype (which can be more than just a physical characteristic, it can be a behavior).
Because you also understood genotype, not producing the expected phenotype is due to environmental influences.
Mendelian genetics was a very valuable first step, but it has been expanded upon because it was way too simplistic as given above.

And yes I think Mendel was one of the greatest thinkers because he was one of the first to put math and statistics to explain a biological phenomena that was extremely vexing. (Thus my name peagardn in his honor) In fact if Darwin had read him (Mendel had already published but was rediscovered in the early 1900s) it would have explained Darwin's frustration on where genetic biological diversity can arise from. Darwin always pointed the origin of diversity out as a weakness to his ideas on natural selection. He thought genetic diversity arose strictly from the environment. Mendel finding "genes" was huge.

I know you like this stuff so Im giving it to you.

[Millennial_Messiah]

If you really understand this:

Genotype does not necessarily lead to a certain phenotype (which can be more than just a physical characteristic, it can be a behavior).
Because you also understood genotype, not producing the expected phenotype is due to environmental influences.
Mendelian genetics was a very valuable first step, but it has been expanded upon because it was way too simplistic as given above.

And yes I think Mendel was one of the greatest thinkers because he was one of the first to put math and statistics to explain a biological phenomena that was extremely vexing. (Thus my name peagardn in his honor) In fact if Darwin had read him (Mendel had already published but was rediscovered in the early 1900s) it would have explained Darwin's frustration on where genetic biological diversity can arise from. Darwin always pointed the origin of diversity out as a weakness to his ideas on natural selection. He thought genetic diversity arose strictly from the environment. Mendel finding "genes" was huge.

I know you like this stuff so Im giving it to you.
correct, genotype is the cause/gene/brains/x variable, phenotype is the effect/dependent/y variable, like a physical characteristic or a behavior.

High school Mendelian four-square genetics work great for a lot of things, especially binary things (are you or are you not wide-footed, or have a widow's peak, or be an achondroplasic dwarf or get Huntington's disease)? But it gets more complicated when you add more than two discrete outcomes to a given solution (eye color, hair color, etc) or a continuous outcome (hand/foot/brain/head/penis size; skin color) which are more polygenic than anything, meaning too many genes to count are added to a given solution of phenotype. Furthermore, there are other factors like sex-linked conditions such as colorblindness and mid-life balding, and even more that are spontaneously mutation-based and not explainable by Mendel (such as microcenphaly [tiny-head syndrome] linked to the Zika virus).

[Spurminator]

Conservatives love being afraid of things so much they make up things to be afraid of.

It's the political equivalent of having a blow-up doll.

[ChumpHumper]

Some of us are reckx. Conservatives are really fighting this in 2020?

[Chinook]

People are always going to be offended by shit. Why is it a woman's right to not see guys at urinals? I'm all for having individual bathrooms, because I'm not trying to stand or sit next to someone else taking a shit. I get so tired of this anti-male that gets paraded around as anti-trans bigotry. A man isn't going to start raping a woman just because he can hear her shitting.

"Oh my daughter tried her hardest but got second to a tranny". Shut the fuck up. Let me know when she loses out on scholarships because a bunch of Lebrons in dresses stormed the competition. Until then, teach your daughter not to value herself based on a trophy. Stop telling your kids that the only way they can be validated in sports is if they win. Youth sports are already grossly unfair for so many reasons. I don't see why a person undergoing hormone therapy (which makes a big difference -- hence why juicing is a thing in the first place) shouldn't be able to compete wherever. I'm okay with the idea of having women's sports and then just sports and men and transwomen who haven't done the therapy can do the general category and cis-women and trans-women who've done the therapy can do the other one. I know that runs into the category of saying the men's group is the default, but fuck 'em. If they want their own separate category, it's okay for it to be defined that way.

[Spurtacular]

People are always going to be offended by shit. Why is it a woman's right to not see guys at urinals? I'm all for having individual bathrooms, because I'm not trying to stand or sit next to someone else taking a shit. I get so tired of this anti-male that gets paraded around as anti-trans bigotry. A man isn't going to start raping a woman just because he can hear her shitting.

"Oh my daughter tried her hardest but got second to a tranny". Shut the fuck up. Let me know when she loses out on scholarships because a bunch of Lebrons in dresses stormed the competition. Until then, teach your daughter not to value herself based on a trophy. Stop telling your kids that the only way they can be validated in sports is if they win. Youth sports are already grossly unfair for so many reasons. I don't see why a person undergoing hormone therapy (which makes a big difference -- hence why juicing is a thing in the first place) shouldn't be able to compete wherever. I'm okay with the idea of having women's sports and then just sports and men and transwomen who haven't done the therapy can do the general category and cis-women and trans-women who've done the therapy can do the other one. I know that runs into the category of saying the men's group is the default, but fuck 'em. If they want their own separate category, it's okay for it to be defined that way.

So it's a civil rights issue that men and women be allowed to shit side by side?

[rmt]

:rollin

I already believe in God, so will not need to check out of the human race if Clint were to pull that shit. You neither please.
Brucette Kardashian, while I didn't see full on tranny coming, you can more or less expect super weird shit to any bio males who choose to engage with those demonic kunts.

I have fond thoughts of growing up thinking what fine specimen of males Clint Eastwood and Bruce Jenner were - although my mother was shattered when she found out that Rock Hudson was gay. Now, I have no idea what girls think or re-think or ... and we won't even talk about these K-drama guys with their perfect hair/skin who look like I don't even know what you call them. It's like where are the REAL men?

[DMC]

People don’t just up and decide. I also recognize that the biology doesn’t disappear. see my post above

They do decide to do something about it. Person X was living as a female for 20 years, but decides to transition. That's a decision. The psychological timelines aren't important to the discussion, the fact is this person was unable to compete against the opposite sex, suddenly they can. Where in your world view does this gender role change create a less problematic matchup for the sides?

[DMC]

You don’t have to speculate on what the pronoun should be. Pronouns are a shorthand of using somebody’s name. Somebody with a feminine name would be called she, etc.

There are something like 150-200 trans ncaa athletes but naturally attention goes to the small handful that are excelling.

at some point a lot of this stuff becomes arbitrary. Should they have made a separate black nba because they were too good for whites?

They didn't?

Should Lebron have been banned from high school ball because he was born with athletic advantages? The advantage lebron had over other boys far outweighed whatever advantage this June Eastwood person does.
You said he cannot play in the WNBA because it would present problems. Why are you so squishy on this?


If it can be demonstrated that trans athletes are ruining sports with any meaningful data we can discuss it. In the meantime this is a population with an astronomically high suicide rate where the single best way found to reduce that is strong support from family, showing that this is a a result of social stigma and their not being able to enjoy everyday experiences because they were unfortunate enough to be born with Genital that don’t comport with our socially invented set of expectations of personality and character for people with those genitals

I think it's obvious by your stance that you have no skin in the game, meaning you don't have a daughter competing at the scholastic level and matching up against a she-man. You're looking at it through the lens of an attorney who would need to bullshit his way through court about it. The truth is you already illustrated you understand why someone like Lebron cannot play in the WNBA, but if he had a sex change suddenly he can. So you're saying that the sex change actually makes the person female when we know that's simply not true. It's bad science. Seems you don't have an issue with calling out bad science when it's about global warming, immunizations and other scientifically falsifiable claims. But because of hurt feelings, you think people should pretend a man who has surgery and hormone therapy is a woman. There's plenty who might sign off on it, but still never believe it.

If you weren't married, would you date a tranny? If you say no, then you don't either.

[spurraider21]

They do decide to do something about it. Person X was living as a female for 20 years, but decides to transition. That's a decision. The psychological timelines aren't important to the discussion, the fact is this person was unable to compete against the opposite sex, suddenly they can. Where in your world view does this gender role change create a less problematic matchup for the sides?
:rolleyes

obviously they make a decision to transition. when i said they dont "up and decide" i meant its not some change they make on a whim overnight.

i've already stated that i support timelines with hormone treatment before allowing them to compete

[DMC]

:rolleyes

obviously they make a decision to transition. when i said they dont "up and decide" i meant its not some change they make on a whim overnight.

i've already stated that i support timelines with hormone treatment before allowing them to compete

You're the one who went all pedant on the topic with the "they don't decide" shit.

Timelines are arbitrary. You're on a slippery slope by saying a male needs to have less male features and attributes to compete with females. You cannot offer any objective reasoning as to why that is, only the "fair play" concept which eventually ends up wrecking your argument.

[rmt]

you have a fundamental misunderstanding about the relationship between sex and gender.

transgender =/= non-binary

transgender = when your gender identity does not correspond with the one which was assigned to you at birth due to your sex

non-binary = when your gender does not fit under the man/woman paradigm

I have no idea what all that means. When my kids were small, I sent my daughter in the women's bathroom alone and never worried. When my boys got old enough that they didn't want to go to the women's bathroom, I stood outside the men's bathroom and talked to them the entire time they were in there - of course, the men must have thought I was crazy but I didn't care. Oh, how times have changed...now, I guess I'd go with her every time.

[spurraider21]

They didn't?
i asked "should they" not "did they"


You said he cannot play in the WNBA because it would present problems. Why are you so squishy on this?
what am i being squishy about? im making the point that its ultimately arbitrary as to what constitutes such an inherent physical advantage that is so great that we need to separate leagues. currently we've set it at men and women (we also do by age... high schoolers dont play against college athletes, etc). i think that the divisions we've drawn have ultimately held up fine. i think we can accommodate trans people within that framework without the system falling apart


I think it's obvious by your stance that you have no skin in the game, meaning you don't have a daughter competing at the scholastic level and matching up against a she-man. You're looking at it through the lens of an attorney who would need to bullshit his way through court about it. The truth is you already illustrated you understand why someone like Lebron cannot play in the WNBA, but if he had a sex change suddenly he can. So you're saying that the sex change actually makes the person female when we know that's simply not true. It's bad science. Seems you don't have an issue with calling out bad science when it's about global warming, immunizations and other scientifically falsifiable claims. But because of hurt feelings, you think people should pretend a man who has surgery and hormone therapy is a woman. There's plenty who might sign off on it, but still never believe it.
my having or not having a daughter athlete is irrelevant, and you're just appealing to emotion with that. thats like saying men shouldnt discuss abortion rights, white people shouldnt talk about black issues, etc.

i havent said anything about a sex change this entire conversation. i didnt say anything about a male becoming female, so your random anti-science rant has no weight. the science behind gender is there.


If you weren't married, would you date a tranny? If you say no, then you don't either.
no, i dont think i'd date a trans woman. im interested in having kids, so that would be a big issue. i'm also generally sexually attracted to females, so that would be problematic. so you can add them to the list of women i wouldnt be interested in when it comes to a romantic or sexual relationship. with that said, its possible, if not very probable, that i've seen women at bars or coffee shops, or on a school campus who i thought was good looking, and was in fact trans. i have no way of actually knowing.

and people have used that "surprise" as a defense for assault claims... ie guy talks to girl at bar, they make out, turns out she has a dick, guy is confused/frustrated and beats her up, using the surprise element as a defense.

this isn't about "pretending a man who has surgery and hormone therapy is a woman." a woman is somebody who identifies and presents themselves as a woman. that doesnt make them of the female sex.

[spurraider21]

I have no idea what all that means. When my kids were small, I sent my daughter in the women's bathroom alone and never worried. When my boys got old enough that they didn't want to go to the women's bathroom, I stood outside the men's bathroom and talked to them the entire time they were in there - of course, the men must have thought I was crazy but I didn't care. Oh, how times have changed...now, I guess I'd go with her every time.
i noticed. thankfully your kids werent trans... having supportive parents is the #1 way to lower their suicidality rates. not sure they would have gotten that tbh

[CosmicCowboy]

I couldnt care less about multigender bathrooms, but if a male athlete decides to identify as a female and compete against women that's fucking wrong and 80% of the US agrees with me.

[spurraider21]

You're the one who went all pedant on the topic with the "they don't decide" shit.

Timelines are arbitrary. You're on a slippery slope by saying a male needs to have less male features and attributes to compete with females. You cannot offer any objective reasoning as to why that is, only the "fair play" concept which eventually ends up wrecking your argument.
i didnt say that people dont decide to transition. when i said "they dont up and decide im a woman now" i was pretty clear what i was referring to

[spurraider21]

I couldnt care less about multigender bathrooms, but if a male athlete decides to identify as a female and compete against women that's fucking wrong and 80% of the US agrees with me.
public support for moral validation hasnt always been the best indicator

[CosmicCowboy]

Hairy chested guys knocking real women out of the opportunity for title 9 college scholarships sucks.

[ducks]

Because he’s not a woman

You sucked his balls?

[spurraider21]

You sucked his balls?
no

[spurraider21]

Hairy chested guys knocking real women out of the opportunity for title 9 college scholarships sucks.
texas forced the hairy chested dude to wrestle girls because his birth certificate said female.

[Will Hunting]

texas forced the hairy chested dude to wrestle girls because his birth certificate said female.
Yeah that was idiotic. The athlete flat out said he wanted to compete against men but the law forced him to compete against women and then the outrage was directed at him for winning.

[spurraider21]

Yeah that was idiotic. The athlete flat out said he wanted to compete against men but the law forced him to compete against women and then the outrage was directed at him for winning.
https://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdv8yt4YAb1ra1l63.gif

[DMC]

i didnt say that people dont decide to transition. when i said "they dont up and decide im a woman now" i was pretty clear what i was referring to

They aren't a woman per the rules until they do. Ergo they decide they are women.

You always think you're clear because it sounds right to you. It's not clarity that's lacking, it's meaning. What's the point in your objection? You said Lebron cannot and should not be able to just walk on to a WNBA team and compete. if Lebron had a sex change, would that be less of an advantage? I mean, the WNBA players are masculine enough without a bearded giant dunking from the FT line.

[spurraider21]

They aren't a woman per the rules until they do. Ergo they decide they are women.

You always think you're clear because it sounds right to you. It's not clarity that's lacking, it's meaning. What's the point in your objection? You said Lebron cannot and should not be able to just walk on to a WNBA team and compete. if Lebron had a sex change, would that be less of an advantage? I mean, the WNBA players are masculine enough without a bearded giant dunking from the FT line.
no shit they decide. but this doesnt happen overnight. people are imagining scenarios where a male athlete (often times lacking genuineness) is going to decide on a whim "hey im going to be a girl now, better sign up for sports!"

and per the guidelines the NCAA has adopted, they wouldnt be able to immediately compete. if we start coming across an epidemic of trans women being grossly overrepresented in sports and just crushing the competition, we can revisit. but until then its a boogeyman like bathroom rapes

[DMC]

Now you tie male to man. So you support cisgender policies?

When the man decides hes a woman do those advantages no longer matter?


People don’t just up and decide. I also recognize that the biology doesn’t disappear. see my post above


no shit they decide. but this doesnt happen overnight. people are imagining scenarios where a male athlete (often times lacking genuineness) is going to decide on a whim "hey im going to be a girl now, better sign up for sports!"

and per the guidelines the NCAA has adopted, they wouldnt be able to immediately compete. if we start coming across an epidemic of trans women being grossly overrepresented in sports and just crushing the competition, we can revisit. but until then its a boogeyman like bathroom rapes

1st... :lol

2nd, so you're on the envelope of what authorities have decided, and that's where your moral compass is pointed? You live on a slippery slope, and somehow you try to insist it's the pragmatic outlook.

Maybe they need a special category for sports. I mean, you cannot put a regular HS athlete in the Special Olympics even if they make bad grades, but it's not their fault they weren't born retarded so why not?

[Spurtacular]

i noticed. thankfully your kids werent trans... having supportive parents is the #1 way to lower their suicidality rates. not sure they would have gotten that tbh

What's the rate lower to with supportive parents?

[spurraider21]

1st...
:lol
already addressed but you can keep laughing about it if you wish


:rolleyes

obviously they make a decision to transition. when i said they dont "up and decide" i meant its not some change they make on a whim overnight.

i've already stated that i support timelines with hormone treatment before allowing them to compete



2nd, so you're on the envelope of what authorities have decided, and that's where your moral compass is pointed? You live on a slippery slope, and somehow you try to insist it's the pragmatic outlook.


Maybe they need a special category for sports.
my moral compass is not dependent on what the authorities have decided. i do agree that they've found what appears to be a practical way to accommodate trans student athletes without having to overhaul the whole system of gendered sports. if we start seeing data suggesting that it's not working and we need another category to preserve the integrity of sports, we can figure out solutions when that time comes.


I mean, you cannot put a regular HS athlete in the Special Olympics even if they make bad grades, but it's not their fault they weren't born retarded so why not?
not dignifying that with a response


edit: dont know why the formatting got all wonky, not going to bother fixing

[spurraider21]

What's the rate lower to with supportive parents?


To attain a recent measure of suicide risk, we asked participants if they had considered suicide in the past year, and whether they had attempted it. Consideration of suicide was common, and was reported by 35% of youth whose parents were strongly supportive and 60% of those whose parents were not strongly supportive. Particularly alarming is that among this latter 60%, nearly all (57%) had actually attempted suicide in the past year. In contrast, only 4% of those with strongly supportive parents attempted suicide. While 4% is still far too high, the impact of strong parental support can be clearly seen in the 93% reduction in reported suicide attempts for youth who indicated their parents were strongly supportive of their gender identity and expression.

http://transpulseproject.ca/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Impacts-of-Strong-Parental-Support-for-Trans-Youth-vFINAL.pdf

suicidal thoughts are nearly cut in half. when it comes to actual attempts, 93%

[Blake]

Hairy chested guys knocking real women out of the opportunity for title 9 college scholarships sucks.

When has that happened

[ChumpDumper]

DMC's really passionate about girls sports.

Creeping authoritarianism? Well, he's not passionately against it....

[Spurtacular]

http://transpulseproject.ca/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Impacts-of-Strong-Parental-Support-for-Trans-Youth-vFINAL.pdf

suicidal thoughts are nearly cut in half. when it comes to actual attempts, 93%

So, you're saying that if parents prop up mentally unhealthy choices, then there's some damage control. I can buy that.

[spurraider21]

So, you're saying that if parents prop up mentally unhealthy choices, then there's some damage control. I can buy that.
that's not what i'm saying, but im glad you recognize that parental support is a huge factor in suicidality of trans people, which is the point i was making

[Spurtacular]

that's not what i'm saying, but im glad you recognize that parental support is a huge factor in suicidality of trans people, which is the point i was making

I recognize that any type of positive support lessens suicide.
If these trans went to church, their suicide rates would go down.
Something tells me you wouldn't argue trans should go to church though.

[spurraider21]

I recognize that any type of positive support lessens suicide.
If these trans went to church, their suicide rates would go down.
Something tells me you wouldn't argue trans should go to church though.
if familial and broader societal support and helpful to their mental health, i dont think they're going to get a lot of that support in church tbh

but if you have data suggesting that church attendance decreases suicidality of trans people, i'll take a look

[ChumpDumper]

I recognize that any type of positive support lessens suicide.
If these trans went to church, their suicide rates would go down.
Something tells me you wouldn't argue trans should go to church though.How many trans boys and girls in your church?

[Blake]

I recognize that any type of positive support lessens suicide.
If these trans went to church, their suicide rates would go down.
Something tells me you wouldn't argue trans should go to church though.

Lol derp pushing church

[Spurtacular]

Lol derp pushing church

Are you saying your fellow parishioners wouldn't offer support, board cuckold?

[Blake]

Are you saying your fellow parishioners wouldn't offer support, board cuckold?

When confronted with an lol, we see the frustrated derp make things up in an effort to confuse his many predators.

He'll most likely repeat this action. Let's watch.

[Spurtacular]

When confronted with an lol, we see the frustrated derp make things up in an effort to confuse his many predators.

He'll most likely repeat this action. Let's watch.

Cuckerish.

Are you saying your fellow parishioners would not be supportive of trans people?

[spurraider21]

Are you saying your fellow parishioners wouldn't offer support, board cuckold?
The only time churches have been supportive of LGBT issues is when they protect their priests tbh

[Spurtacular]

The only time churches have been supportive of LGBT issues is when they protect their priests tbh

I'd say the Catholics have had a hand in producing many trans, tbh.

[Blake]

When confronted with an lol, we see the frustrated derp make things up in an effort to confuse his many predators.

He'll most likely repeat this action. Let's watch.


Cuckerish.

Are you saying your fellow parishioners would not be supportive of trans people?

[Spurtacular]

^^

:lol Doubling down on cuckerish.

[ElNono]

The only time churches have been supportive of LGBT issues is when they protect their priests tbh

https://vevmo.com/sites/default/files/black-kid-oh-snap_0.gif