Preseason Grades: Spurs vs. Thunder - Dec. 12, 2020

[timvp]

https://www.spurstalk.com/grades-san-antonio-spurs-oklahoma-city-thunder-preseason-1/

Not the greatest of first steps. Thankfully, it didn't count.

[joeyjfive]

We are on the right track for Cade at least.

[BillMc]

https://www.spurstalk.com/grades-san-antonio-spurs-oklahoma-city-thunder-preseason-1/

Not the greatest of first steps. Thankfully, it didn't count.

Thanks for doing this.

[RC_Drunkford]

Like I said in multiple threads before, Vassell needs to start and Murray needs to be benched. Neither Lyles nor Gay can start at PF. And the defense has been terrible ever since Udoka and Messina left. Flopovich is getting exposed left and right

[Dejounte]

Championship teams have started 0-5 in pre-season before.

Pre-season is no indicator of how the season will go or how the players will play in the regular season.

Been watching the NBA far too long.

[Mr. Body]

How did Trey Lyles get a C-? :lmao

[onechance87]

Want to see tre jones take alll lonnies minutes.....Lonnie just cant get it....Trey looked more nba ready and more comfortable

[GAustex]

Just asking can Trey shoot?

[DAF86]

So, how tall did Vassell look out there?

[RC_Drunkford]

How did Trey Lyles get a C-? :lmao

I asked myself the same question. Should've been a clear F

[Mr. Body]

Just asking can Trey shoot?

He can't do anything.

[Dejounte]

So, how tall did Vassell look out there?

Looked about an 1" shorter than DeMar. Maybe the same height?

Honestly, doesn't matter anymore though

No clear SG on our roster who should be ahead of him anyway

[onechance87]

Just asking can Trey shoot?

Thats his weakness.....Hopefully he can improve...But hes a natural pg.....Kinda like corey joseph....But can play faster

[Dejounte]

Lyles was average until he became disastrous when Luka Samanic was subbed in. He wanted to show the sophomore who was boss. Dude clearly hates Luka. He wouldn't even look his way.

[Mr. Body]

Thats his weakness.....Hopefully he can improve...But hes a natural pg.....Kinda like corey joseph....But can play faster

I think he meant Trey Lyles.

[GAustex]

I think he meant Trey Lyles.
Sorry not Lyles the new kid
Sorry Body!

[poopbox]

Going to be sad when White and Keldon come back and force Vassel out of whatever rotation minutes he might have had cause he is clearly already a good defender and can knock down an open 3 :cry

Going to come down to him and Patty for back up guard minutes and you know who is going to win that battle :cry

[GAustex]

I thought I saw the second round draft choice your up some shots and missed pretty bad

[siraulo23]

Lonnie Walker - trash
Samanic - trash
Murray - meh

Vassell hell yea

[siraulo23]

Cant wait to see White Vassell Keldon Poetl lineup, defensive lineup :wow

[Dejounte]

As bad as Murray played, I couldn't help but notice that he looked quicker and more spry. His first step looked explosive.

[GAustex]

Eyetester

[RC_Drunkford]

As bad as Murray played, I couldn't help but notice that he looked quicker and more spry. His first step looked explosive.

he can easily blow by the defender. Problem is he can't finish or make good decisions with the ball

[SpurPadre]

As bad as Murray played, I couldn't help but notice that he looked quicker and more spry. His first step looked explosive.

THIS. I think people need to chill and not take one preseason game as the way to define a player for the rest of the year. That said, he needs to out up or shut up this season.

[GAustex]

He ain’t shown he can be trusted to be a winning PG

[GAustex]

Give btetter soon Derrick

[John B]

Thanks for the grades. Agreed. I don’t know what Pop was doing with his starting lineup. Demar, if he plays combo guard, should not pair with Murray who is NOT a SG. It would’ve been better to start Vassell at SG. Demar/Murray is like Bryn/Beli. They cannot be in the floor at the same time. Demar needs a shooter to open the lane for him and someone to dish the open shot to. It’s not Murray. I don’t know why ST is excited with Aldridge attempting 10 3pts. He needs to establish the paint first and punish small defenders, then he can hit the 3’s when they match him with a big. Patty is okay as a quick score, but I hate for him getting 20 minutes. I rather see Vassell/Lonnie/Keldon and even Q use those minutes for development. I can’t wait for Keldon and White to be back and boost morale with their defense. I like Cam and Diop. They came to play. Ball movement was terrible, no hard cuts to the basket, everybody standing by the 3 pt line watching a slasher. Hoping for better defense and plenty of fastbreaks in the next game.

[baseline bum]

Turned the game on, saw that starting lineup, and quickly noped out and fired up some RDR2 instead. I'm not watching this season if that's the lineup Pop's going to be running out there every night.

[Degoat]

Devin made some really solid passes as well, didn’t know he had that in his game tbh

[onechance87]

Devin made some really solid passes as well, didn’t know he had that in his game tbh

Yea...Seemed to handle the ball well

[playblair]

Turned the game on, saw that starting lineup, and quickly noped out and fired up some RDR2 instead. I'm not watching this season if that's the lineup Pop's going to be running out there every night.
agree if thats the lineup i wont even bother finding a stream

here is my grade
PopSo, all training camp we hear about the Spurs wanting to play faster and modernize their approach offensively. Then the first preseason game comes and Pop starts Murray, DeRozan, Gay, Aldridge and Poeltl, perhaps the slowest, most prehistoric lineup imaginable. Huh? That lineup would have been slow 20 years ago.
Grade: D

[PhantomDashCam]

Here’s my (over)reactions to tonight’s game:

- Theo Maledon and Tre Jones are better PGs than DJ and Mills
- The Starting 5 was our bizzaro world version of the Lakers team that won the championship, which unfortunately also included
4 players playing out of position
- Derrick White’s asking price went up another $5 mill. A yr
- Trey Lyles contract is untradeable
- Devin Vassell should be starting at the 2

[tim_duncan_fan]

Cant wait to see White Vassell Keldon Poetl lineup, defensive lineup :wow

lol that's the offensive lineup too.

[BackHome]

If people think this team is making the playoffs giving me some of what ever ya smoking. Like it or not this team is and has been in rebuilding mode and so just sit back and enjoy the TANK ride and there is a little bit of light Keldon, Vassell, will keep it interesting

[Dejounte]

Vassell on All Defense First Team in his future?

[Dejounte]

If people think this team is making the playoffs giving me some of what ever ya smoking. Like it or not this team is and has been in rebuilding mode and so just sit back and enjoy the TANK ride and there is a little bit of light Keldon, Vassell, will keep it interesting

The team is making the playoffs. People are overreacting over pre season games.

[Atl Spur]

If people think this team is making the playoffs giving me some of what ever ya smoking. Like it or not this team is and has been in rebuilding mode and so just sit back and enjoy the TANK ride and there is a little bit of light Keldon, Vassell, will keep it interesting

Relax big guy! We haven’t seen the actual rotations yet��

[phxspurfan]

didnt watch the game bc couldnt (not on tv anywhere but SA and none of the streams worked for me) but why did Mills get featured with 16 shots in a preseason game...

[ragas]

If Poeltl could only hit his free throws. Damn...
I can‘t understand how a pro can be bad at hitting this shot.

But he did well when wasn‘t at the line. Spurs are better with him on the floor.

[onechance87]

didnt watch the game bc couldnt (not on tv anywhere but SA and none of the streams worked for me) but why did Mills get featured with 16 shots in a preseason game...

pretty much cause he was the only player making shots along with rudy gay

[NASpurs]

didnt watch the game bc couldnt (not on tv anywhere but SA and none of the streams worked for me) but why did Mills get featured with 16 shots in a preseason game...

Seems like you missed the news of FIBA Patty

[tbdog]

I just want to buy NBA 2k21 just so I can change the Spurs starting lineup.

[exstatic]

THIS. I think people need to chill and not take one preseason game as the way to define a player for the rest of the year. That said, he needs to out up or shut up this season.

I don’t think anyone is judging him on one preseason game. It’s been pretty much multiple seasons of boneheadery. I’d honestly rather have Vassel bringing the ball up and initiating the offense at this point.

[Rummpd]

Despite it being preseason the total fail of SAS FO x 3 years exposed losing to a franchise doing the right rebuild versus the no plan or action of SAS. Welcome to seasons of mediocrity unless big moves are made.

[dbestpro]

Tre Jones reminded me of Avery and how he would manage the pg

[RobinsontoDuncan]

I don’t think LJ and I were watching the same game. At least with regard to Luka, who I watched closely the entire game, I thought his rotations were very good and he was very active on the court. The entire team defense seemed to benefit from his length and aggressiveness. His on ball defense, which is normally his strength, was not great, especially in the paint, but it was the first preseason game so that’s to be expected.

I’m hoping Lonnie’s poor performance was related to his back injury and not a sign of things to come.

[sananspursfan21]

Championship teams have started 0-5 in pre-season before.

Pre-season is no indicator of how the season will go or how the players will play in the regular season.

Been watching the NBA far too long.

Yes! :lobt2:

[Dejounte]

Regarding Luka:

-my complaint during the bubble was that he would get lost on rotations-- he was better with that last night
-he is too slow to play small forward. Could it be due to lack of effort? Maybe.
-was forcing things on offense, but maybe as a result of poor ball movement with the line-up he was with
-was over helping on defense. Sagged off his man way too much

If they continue sticking Devin with him, there's still hope for Luka

[XDT76]

During the game it seems that some of the vets are taking it easy I remember one instance when the Thunder missed a shot, 3 Spurs were standing around the rim and did not box out. A thunder player just stroll in for and OR and scores. Another thing is probably this is a warm up game with some many players playing out of position. Let's see how the next 2 games play out but one thing is for sure DJM cannot be our primary playmaker.

[Dex]

We are on the right track for Cade at least.

Fade for Cade! :lol

[Dejounte]

During the game it seems that some of the vets are taking it easy I remember one instance when the Thunder missed a shot, 3 Spurs were standing around the rim and did not box out. A thunder player just stroll in for and OR and scores. Another thing is probably this is a warm up game with some many players playing out of position. Let's see how the next 2 games play out but one thing is for sure DJM cannot be our primary playmaker.

That was on Lonnie. I think he was subbed out right after that play. That play was an embarrassment

[Dex]

How did I know people were still going to complaining about Mills even though he was probably the best player for the Spurs last night?

Don't get me wrong, I think it's time to move away from him as well but at least give him credit when its due.

[Dejounte]

How did I know people were still going to complaining about Mills even though he was probably the best player for the Spurs last night?

Don't get me wrong, I think it's time to move away from him as well but at least give him credit when its due.

Are you just looking at the box score? Patty's points were empty. You can see the negative impact he had if you were watching.

[Dex]

Are you just looking at the box score? Patty's points were empty. You can see the negative impact he had if you were watching.

I was only able to catch about half the game, but he looked alright for the parts I watched. Patty will always be Patty on defense and that's a fair argument against him, but he was not only aggressive but also efficient on offense when nobody else on the Spurs seemed to be able to score a bucket.

If you want to nitpick, he needs to tally at least one assist if we want to pretend he is a point guard, but Mills was definitely further down the list of reasons why the Spurs lost.

[Dejounte]

I was only able to catch about half the game, but he looked alright for the parts I watched. Patty will always be Patty on defense and that's a fair argument against him, but he was not only aggressive but also efficient on offense when nobody else on the Spurs seemed to be able to score a bucket.

If you want to nitpick, he needs to tally at least one assist if we want to pretend he is a point guard, but Mills was definitely further down the list of reasons why the Spurs lost.

That's the thing though. On the surface, he had an "efficient" game, but when you dig deeper you'll see that there would only be two passes between Spurs players before he tried to score. No one was moving around on offense because he doesn't know how to run plays. Nobody could score a bucket because Patty was being a blackhole on offense. They weren't getting good looks OR touches. I don't care about assists or points or these counting stats. It's night and day when someone else runs the point aside from Patty. It was the same frustration I had when Kawhi was still here and Patty was taking Kawhi's shots.

If he does continue this bullshit, I hope it raises his trade value and he gets traded ASAP

[GAustex]

Patty gets the ball an its hide and seek around a high pick looking for his shot

[Prime BEEF]

Fade for Cade! :lol
haha ok that’s good

The current espn power rankings have spurs listed as 12th in the west

[Atl Spur]

Lonnie better get his head out of his butt ASAP; Vassell will take/keep his spot!
The more I think about it Murray , Vassell , Keldon , DeMar , LA lineup might work. Bench of white , Mills, Lonnie , gay, poodle. ( I want Bates in there somehow )

[Mugen]

Replacing Bryn/Marco with KJ/Vassell/Tre should likely result in +10 wins this season tbh.

But the wild card the last several seasons has always been that the Spurs have one of the worst coaches in sports currently, so you never know :lol

[Dex]

Lonnie better get his head out of his butt ASAP; Vassell will take/keep his spot!

Obviously it's only one preseason game, but Vassell already looks like he might be the better player. I loved that he came out aggressive and seems to be looking to steal a roster spot.

Lonnie has all the athleticism in the world, but just doesn't seem to have the drive. He just kinda...floats when he is out there. That's fine if he wants to be a career role player, but I think we all were hoping for more out of him.

[Atl Spur]

Obviously it's only one preseason game, but Vassell already looks like he might be the better player. I loved that he came out aggressive and seems to be looking to steal a roster spot.

Lonnie has all the athleticism in the world, but just doesn't seem to have the drive. He just kinda...floats when he is out there. That's fine if he wants to be a career role player, but I think we all were hoping for more out of him.
I totally agree; we need the Lonnie from the Houston game night in night out!!

[R. DeMurre]

If Patty's 24 pts in 20 minutes and a -2 playing with the bench guys were empty, then what would you call DeRozan's 12 pts in 24 minutes, and -10? Mills has his issues, but DeRozan's are worse, and he's paid double what Mills is. The team just doesn't flow with him in there, and there are a decade of advanced stats that back that up, along with two full seasons where the Spurs are significantly better with Mills on the floor than they are with DeRozan.

[Bojo]

I wouldn't overvalue the final score, it's preseason. I got some encouraging, some concerning impressions though.

good stuff:
+ LA played like a gunner, looking to shoot quickly instead of iso after iso. Won't fix everything, but he seems at least willing to change a little.
+ If he keeps playing like yesterday and in the bubble, Rudy is a great vet fit for this team. Might make Mills expandable.
+ Samanic looks more confident on the floor, like he knows where to be and what to do. I think his off-ball movement was way better, problem is he got frozen out yesterday. Increases the pressure to force things when he does get the ball a little. This was still encouraging though!
+ All the newcomers and rooks. Especially Devin. This guy needs 20 mpg asap, no discussion.

bad stuff:
- Murray can't run an offense significantly better than Mills. Concerning.
- Lonnie is lost without the ball, gets roasted on defense and worst of all gave up two offensive rebounds by just watching and letting his man go by and grab the board without any resistance. I know the common sense is that Pop ruined him, but maybe Lonnie is not (yet) as good as everyone thinks he is...rightful benching tbh.
- Lyles looks very selfish. Freezing out Luka (anyone seen that already secure rebound he kind of wrestled away from him?), insisting on putting the ball on the ground too much instead of doing what I think is expected from him (giving it up quickly)...needs to focus on his strengths and play with the team and not force horrible spin move isos.

[BacktoBasics]

Everyone wants to trade LA, DDR, Patty and Gay. Then can’t figure why it’s important to give them early minutes in a meaningless game to showcase these guys.

How do you expect this team to get any reasonable value if they don’t play them?

Trading one of these guys for Al Far Aminu is fucking stupid. The shit you guys think constitutes an upgrade or even a reasonable return is laughable. They got to show value to get value otherwise it makes more sense to keep these guys and take the salary cap freedom for nothing.

At least with salary cap freedom you can absorb some send offs in a 3 way deal if you can’t land any quality FA’s.

[Dejounte]

If Patty's 24 pts in 20 minutes and a -2 playing with the bench guys were empty, then what would you call DeRozan's 12 pts in 24 minutes, and -10? Mills has his issues, but DeRozan's are worse, and he's paid double what Mills is. The team just doesn't flow with him in there, and there are a decade of advanced stats that back that up, along with two full seasons where the Spurs are significantly better with Mills on the floor than they are with DeRozan.

The difference is I've seen DeMar switch to a facilitator role (he wasn't one last night) and do it effectively, whereas Mills can only do one thing and one thing only - score.

No one is defending DeMar. He was bad.

[KobesAchilles]

That's the thing though. On the surface, he had an "efficient" game, but when you dig deeper you'll see that there would only be two passes between Spurs players before he tried to score. No one was moving around on offense because he doesn't know how to run plays. Nobody could score a bucket because Patty was being a blackhole on offense. They weren't getting good looks OR touches. I don't care about assists or points or these counting stats. It's night and day when someone else runs the point aside from Patty. It was the same frustration I had when Kawhi was still here and Patty was taking Kawhi's shots.

If he does continue this bullshit, I hope it raises his trade value and he gets traded ASAP
That was always my fear when I heard about the new ball movement (movement) we were gonna implement. We have a team full of chuckers and only really 2 people that know how to create for others and neither are elite at it

[Dejounte]

That was always my fear when I heard about the new ball movement (movement) we were gonna implement. We have a team full of chuckers and only really 2 people that know how to create for others and neither are elite at it

I think things will change once White comes back to takeover those PG duties.

I'm reserving judgment on the team until 10 games into the regular season. Others should too. Preseason always makes people go nuts.

[Spursfanfromafar]

It is just one pre-season game, but it still points out how redundant the duo of DDR/ LMA is to the team when played together. At best, they are forcing one of them to play unnaturally (to his ability) at age 35 and at worst, they are hampering the development of one of the Spurs' PG prospects in Dejounte Murray who should be thriving in a fast paced offense. I was hoping so much for LMA to be traded this offseason mostly because he was the better trade-able commodity among the two mid-rangers. Sadly, the Spurs FO has failed in doing so. Now I hope they dont overplay these two in the game as the season begins. And I hope fervently that White's and Johnson's injuries are minor or else this season would be hell to watch.

[r0drig0lac]

Jakob is shit

[onechance87]

It is just one pre-season game, but it still points out how redundant the duo of DDR/ LMA is to the team when played together. At best, they are forcing one of them to play unnaturally (to his ability) at age 35 and at worst, they are hampering the development of one of the Spurs' PG prospects in Dejounte Murray who should be thriving in a fast paced offense. I was hoping so much for LMA to be traded this offseason mostly because he was the better trade-able commodity among the two mid-rangers. Sadly, the Spurs FO has failed in doing so. Now I hope they dont overplay these two in the game as the season begins. And I hope fervently that White's and Johnson's injuries are minor or else this season would be hell to watch.

Only way murray was gonna thrive if he got a solid 3 point shot...It has yet to come...His court vision is not of a pg as well

[BackHome]

It is just one pre-season game, but it still points out how redundant the duo of DDR/ LMA is to the team when played together. At best, they are forcing one of them to play unnaturally (to his ability) at age 35 and at worst, they are hampering the development of one of the Spurs' PG prospects in Dejounte Murray who should be thriving in a fast paced offense. I was hoping so much for LMA to be traded this offseason mostly because he was the better trade-able commodity among the two mid-rangers. Sadly, the Spurs FO has failed in doing so. Now I hope they dont overplay these two in the game as the season begins. And I hope fervently that White's and Johnson's injuries are minor or else this season would be hell to watch.

Why do people think DM is a PG he has not show the ability to play point since day 1 it’s plain to see that White is easily our best starting PG. Also, don’t be surprised when Tre will soon beat him out of backup PG spot for Murray it’s either SG or bust the sooner he figures that out the better it will be for his career.

[Mr. Body]

I wouldn't overvalue the final score, it's preseason. I got some encouraging, some concerning impressions though.

good stuff:
+ LA played like a gunner, looking to shoot quickly instead of iso after iso. Won't fix everything, but he seems at least willing to change a little.
+ If he keeps playing like yesterday and in the bubble, Rudy is a great vet fit for this team. Might make Mills expandable.
+ Samanic looks more confident on the floor, like he knows where to be and what to do. I think his off-ball movement was way better, problem is he got frozen out yesterday. Increases the pressure to force things when he does get the ball a little. This was still encouraging though!
+ All the newcomers and rooks. Especially Devin. This guy needs 20 mpg asap, no discussion.

bad stuff:
- Murray can't run an offense significantly better than Mills. Concerning.
- Lonnie is lost without the ball, gets roasted on defense and worst of all gave up two offensive rebounds by just watching and letting his man go by and grab the board without any resistance. I know the common sense is that Pop ruined him, but maybe Lonnie is not (yet) as good as everyone thinks he is...rightful benching tbh.
- Lyles looks very selfish. Freezing out Luka (anyone seen that already secure rebound he kind of wrestled away from him?), insisting on putting the ball on the ground too much instead of doing what I think is expected from him (giving it up quickly)...needs to focus on his strengths and play with the team and not force horrible spin move isos.

If Lyles is freezing a player out -- and by many accounts he was -- he cannot see the floor. This is a very limited player who is not far from moving out of the league. Not to say that behavior is excusable for anyone, but for a player with his limited gifts, he needs to go.

[Mr. Body]

Why do people think DM is a PG he has not show the ability to play point since day 1 it’s plain to see that White is easily our best starting PG. Also, don’t be surprised when Tre will soon beat him out of backup PG spot for Murray it’s either SG or bust the sooner he figures that out the better it will be for his career.

I've not considered Murray a point guard for some time, if ever. He's a shooting guard or wing who cannot shoot.

[GAustex]

and that drunk assed senile poop over paid DJM

[Mr. Body]

That was always my fear when I heard about the new ball movement (movement) we were gonna implement. We have a team full of chuckers and only really 2 people that know how to create for others and neither are elite at it

I don't think you need elite facilitators, necessarily, so much as players who can slash and kick if they need to. This creates a churn that opens up the perimeter. You do need attentive guys who can see collapsing defenses, but this isn't impossible for players who are good in other categories. Of course it's not Manu and Diaw, but Parker wasn't an exceptional floor general and he learned to see and know where everyone was.

[Sugus]

If Lyles is freezing a player out -- and by many accounts he was -- he cannot see the floor. This is a very limited player who is not far from moving out of the league. Not to say that behavior is excusable for anyone, but for a player with his limited gifts, he needs to go.

Agreed, tbh. Lyles' behavior was very clear, and completely unacceptable. I think all that stuff about being on the new jersey promos might've given him a false sense of security within the roster, which his last interviews reflected. He thinks he's "found his place" in SanAn, and of course the young, potential-filled Luka is his direct adversary in staying on the rotation. Coaches better be showing him yesterday's tape and screaming in his face that that shit can't fly during the season, nor ever.

On a funny note, looks like Dejounte was right when he said he had the feeling Lyles and Luka didn't like each other... Now I'm hoping it's not some unhealthy level of disdain.

[Sugus]

The difference is I've seen DeMar switch to a facilitator role (he wasn't one last night) and do it effectively, whereas Mills can only do one thing and one thing only - score.

No one is defending DeMar. He was bad.

DeMar was awful last night. Back to Hero Mode playstyle, completely forgot about his distributor role he had in the bubble. He was constantly looking for his own shot, like Mills, then being a turnstyle on the other end. He even had some floaters-running shots that were worse looks than he usually settles for, looked kind of forced. Out of the vets, only LMA and maybe Rudy played acceptably well.

You have to wonder what the locker room mood was, after all that talk before pre-season, then coming in and getting beat by the G-League Thunder :lol

[The Truth #6]

I think things will change once White comes back to takeover those PG duties.

I'm reserving judgment on the team until 10 games into the regular season. Others should too. Preseason always makes people go nuts.

Probably wise. But I do think the team is going in two distinct directions and Pop has to guide them to their better version through his rotations if nothing else.

[Dejounte]

Agreed, tbh. Lyles' behavior was very clear, and completely unacceptable. I think all that stuff about being on the new jersey promos might've given him a false sense of security within the roster, which his last interviews reflected. He thinks he's "found his place" in SanAn, and of course the young, potential-filled Luka is his direct adversary in staying on the rotation. Coaches better be showing him yesterday's tape and screaming in his face that that shit can't fly during the season, nor ever.

On a funny note, looks like Dejounte was right when he said he had the feeling Lyles and Luka didn't like each other... Now I'm hoping it's not some unhealthy level of disdain.

We don't even need to count on Luka to humble him. KBD looks like he has potential to do that.

[TD 21]

I said it then, people read way too much into the "bubble". They were never going to go into the season starting DeRozan at the four. I wouldn't read too much into the 90s starting lineups either, as we've seen this in the past for the first preseason game.

- DeRozan, Murray and Poeltl, should never play together.

- Haven't given up, but Walker has the whiff of a one dimensional, empty calories type and seems headed for whipping boy/fringe rotation status.

- At least it'll be easy to relegate him to that, unlike Murray, who they foolishly prematurely anointed and sunk starting money into.

- Suspected it and it's already clear Vassell should start on the wing opposite DeRozan. Put Gay at the four, then have a combination of Lyles/DeRozan/Johnson eat the backup minutes.

- Poeltl, White, Johnson, Vassell, appear to be the keepers among the youth.

[Dejounte]

DeMar was awful last night. Back to Hero Mode playstyle, completely forgot about his distributor role he had in the bubble. He was constantly looking for his own shot, like Mills, then being a turnstyle on the other end. He even had some floaters-running shots that were worse looks than he usually settles for, looked kind of forced. Out of the vets, only LMA and maybe Rudy played acceptably well.

You have to wonder what the locker room mood was, after all that talk before pre-season, then coming in and getting beat by the G-League Thunder :lol

I think the ESPN rating was still on his mind. I think he'll revert back to a facilitator soon enough (especially if the losses start stacking up). Hopefully it doesn't need to get to that point.

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/TreStones3/status/1338148620395278339?s=09

If we're down point guards,

STOP
PLAYING
PATTY
AT
THE
POINT

use this guy.

[Sugus]

We don't even need to count on Luka to humble him. KBD looks like he has potential to do that.

Any word on his ankle? I don't think I saw him get back on the court after he twisted it. But you're right, he definitely has potential - though I think having to "count on" a better player to show another one of our players who's boss, is already a bad strategy. Lyles is far too inconsequential on the court to be potentially creating drama in the lockerroom. If his antics go on a few more games, I'll officially add him to my Trade-ASAP list, tbh.


I think the ESPN rating was still on his mind. I think he'll revert back to a facilitator soon enough (especially if the losses start stacking up). Hopefully it doesn't need to get to that point.

You'd think that seeing his team lose every time he "goes back" to his regular game would eventually make him realize it's not winning ball. After like 12 seasons in the league though, I'm not expecting anything... And tbh, I can see the more selfish play as a directive from coaching, to up his (and maybe Mills') trade value. I'm not going to make too many assumptions over one preseason game, but it does make sense. Now, if he continues to play selfish, and he's still on the team by trade deadline...

[Dejounte]

Any word on his ankle? I don't think I saw him get back on the court after he twisted it. But you're right, he definitely has potential - though I think having to "count on" a better player to show another one of our players who's boss, is already a bad strategy. Lyles is far too inconsequential on the court to be potentially creating drama in the lockerroom. If his antics go on a few more games, I'll officially add him to my Trade-ASAP list, tbh.



You'd think that seeing his team lose every time he "goes back" to his regular game would eventually make him realize it's not winning ball. After like 12 seasons in the league though, I'm not expecting anything... And tbh, I can see the more selfish play as a directive from coaching, to up his (and maybe Mills') trade value. I'm not going to make too many assumptions over one preseason game, but it does make sense. Now, if he continues to play selfish, and he's still on the team by trade deadline...

To be fair to Lyles, he's not a negative impact player when he's the worst player on the court (with the starters, for example). He's just okay.

However, when he's the "best" player on the court (with the deep bench) AND he starts acting like he is, he's one of the worst players in the NBA.

I think he'll start playing like an afterthought again once the rotations are back to normal.

[Sugus]

To be fair to Lyles, he's not a negative impact player when he's the worst player on the court (with the starters, for example). He's just okay.

However, when he's the "best" player on the court (with the deep bench) AND he starts acting like he is, he's one of the worst players in the NBA.

I think he'll start playing like an afterthought again once the rotations are back to normal.

That's not exactly a hopeful evaluation then :lol

A bad player who's basically forced to acknowledge his role when on the court with superior talents, but readily forces the spotlight on him when the chance arises, AND without the talent or play to make up for that "me-ness"? And on top of that, he's conflicting with and actively shunning a young player who could grow into replacing him? Yeah, no thanks...

[Dejounte]

That's not exactly a hopeful evaluation then :lol

A bad player who's basically forced to acknowledge his role when on the court with superior talents, but readily forces the spotlight on him when the chance arises, AND without the talent or play to make up for that "me-ness"? And on top of that, he's conflicting with and actively shunning a young player who could grow into replacing him? Yeah, no thanks...

Oh yeah, no I'm not defending his case of being a long term starter or anything like that. Just evaluating him as far as priorities go relative to other players-- he's not a major issue at this moment (though he is when there are rare opportune times when other young players like Luka are getting playing time and he's taking away the spotlight from them)

[Mr. Body]

Trey Lyles still thinks he's one of John Calipari's top recruits instead of one of his cast asides. This is Danny Green before he got cut the third time or whatever it was. Just most players don't become Danny Green.

[onechance87]

https://twitter.com/TreStones3/status/1338148620395278339?s=09

If we're down point guards,

STOP
PLAYING
PATTY
AT
THE
POINT

use this guy.


Hope to see more of him next game

[The Truth #6]

Was Lyles really that selfish last night? Locker room cancer seems like a fast reaction, not that I don’t engage in fast reactions myself frequently. To me, Luka looked completely passive and Lyles was calling his shot too much. Obviously, one affects the other, but my initial take was more about Luka.

[GAustex]

It appeared to me that Lyles on more than one occasion went away from the best option at the time which was Luka and instead went with himself or tried to make a play that had a bad outcome

[SAGirl]

Thanks for the grades. I am not local so I can’t watch these games. (No illegal streams for me either TY). Glad to hear to read that Vassell looked good hopefully he integrates with the team for his rook season.

[timtonymanu]

Lyles only has a career because of that stupid Morris brother doing his nephew act on us. If that scrub is really trying to pull that shit,, Pop better not hesitate to drop his ass.

Made me so annoyed last year when people would make the comparisons to Boris Diaw.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

As others have stated, if Pop rolls this pile of horsesh!t lineup out there every night I’ll just watch something else. The bubble group was fun to watch. This group will play just well enough for a mid to late lottery pick, and will be painful to watch all year.

Boo.


2/10 enjoyment factor on this game.

[KobesAchilles]

I don't think you need elite facilitators, necessarily, so much as players who can slash and kick if they need to. This creates a churn that opens up the perimeter. You do need attentive guys who can see collapsing defenses, but this isn't impossible for players who are good in other categories. Of course it's not Manu and Diaw, but Parker wasn't an exceptional floor general and he learned to see and know where everyone was.

Yes but you are trading one elite player/skill for another so it’s a moot point. Like nobody on this team is event close to peak Parker at driving and kicking and collapsing a defense. Just like nobody on the team is close to the vision/iq of Manu and Diaw. It’s the reason why I wanted Lewis bc he can get by his man with his dribble while nobody on our team consistently can. Maybe White, but he needs to up his aggression by a lot.

I was just saying we have no elite players at anything so this motion offense stuff isn’t gonna work and the majority of our players are gonna go back to what they know- chucking

[KobesAchilles]

Also I was REALLY hoping we didn’t pick up Lyles contract this year. The guy needs to go. He does nothing positive. He’s like an amoeba, he’s just kinda there

[GAustex]

He’s like an amoeba
lol

[poopbox]

all this hand ringing over the starting lineup...Derrick is out...pretty sure he is going to replace Gay when he gets back...

Now the real problem is LMA and Poeltl starting...defense falls apart when Poeltl is out and aint no way ma touches is ever going to come off the bench...if pop asked he might lock himself in his shoe house...

Biggest impact to winning in the bubble was demar at the 4 and it looks like that isn't going to happen so...not going to replicate the success of the bubble...

[The Truth #6]

Hmm. It’s hard for me to understand the hate for Lyles. No one is saying he’s actually good. But he hit almost 50% of his 3s at the last few months of last season. That’s something I hope to see more of. But I’m not into sacrificing this year so contract-year players can pad their stats. Hence the disappointment of the offseason and the larger challenge for Pop to make sense of the mess he helped create.

[Sugus]

all this hand ringing over the starting lineup...Derrick is out...pretty sure he is going to replace Gay when he gets back...

Now the real problem is LMA and Poeltl starting...defense falls apart when Poeltl is out and aint no way ma touches is ever going to come off the bench...if pop asked he might lock himself in his shoe house...

Biggest impact to winning in the bubble was demar at the 4 and it looks like that isn't going to happen so...not going to replicate the success of the bubble...

In what world does White replace Gay when he comes back? They play entirely different positions. If you meant in a "positional shuffle" kind of sense, there's a bigger problem there, which is Dejounte's fixation on the SL per Pop's wishes. White is more likely to come off the bench once he's healed, than take the starting PG job, sadly; especially if Pop wants to start LMA/Jakob or doesn't want to start DeMar at the 4, where he'd make the most sense especially given our lack of true starting caliber options there.

Agreed on the rest. Hilarious that a 35yo can't reasonably come off the bench, but this is what we've come to, I guess. LMA could get all the touches he wants abusing opposing benches, while the starting lineup benefits from Poeltl's defense (as long as he can stay on the court, at least) and bubble-simil playstyle. But nope.

[spurs10]

The difference is I've seen DeMar switch to a facilitator role (he wasn't one last night) and do it effectively, whereas Mills can only do one thing and one thing only - score.

No one is defending DeMar. He was bad. Scoring seemed to be a big issue for our team last night though. On another note, is 74 points in the first half some kind of record? Must be one the worst in recent history.

[Dejounte]

Scoring seemed to be a big issue for our team last night though. On another note, is 74 points in the first half some kind of record? Must be one the worst in recent history.


Yes, so what's the root of that issue?

>>>> Lack of ball movement because the "head of the snake" Mills won't run plays

It wouldn't be so hard to score if our players got open looks.

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

lonnie and djm — put them on the texas eagle to austin. one way ticket

[EasyMoney]

lonnie and djm — put them on the texas eagle to austin. one way ticket


You're a damn fool.










Forgetting about Trey Lyles.

[BackHome]

Yes, so what's the root of that issue?

>>>> Lack of ball movement because the "head of the snake" Mills won't run plays

It wouldn't be so hard to score if our players got open looks.

Mills and Murray are Terrible PG but since White is out that is what will probably see and the end result will be a big fat L.

[Dejounte]

Mills and Murray are Terrible PG but since White is out that is what will probably see and the end result will be a big fat L.

Honestly, the momentum was swinging our way in the middle of the third quarter. We were only down 5 after being down 20. Then Pop subbed all the youth in. The game was winnable, but there was no need to win it.

I'm not as down on Murray as others. Yeah, he shot terrible but it wasn't "pull my hair out" terrible like several times during the bubble. Like I said earlier, he looked explosive. Maybe he wouldn't look as bad if the players around him didn't play bad too. Finishing around the rim still leaves much to be desired, but being quicker? That should open things up for him.

[GAustex]

Eyetester

[BillMc]

Scoring seemed to be a big issue for our team last night though. On another note, is 74 points in the first half some kind of record? Must be one the worst in recent history.

74. And it is not like OKC is prime Warriors. ugh

[Truth4sale$]

I see alot of criticism of Lonnie but do people remember he has back spasms, and was a late add. He was likely trying to toughen it out.
On the other hand, I think the reality is Dejounte might have peaked as far as natural basketball point guard skills. He will likely not improve much further. He cant play alongside Derrick White. I think either Devin Vassell or even Keldon Johnson would be a better option to start.
Dejounte is not running the offense playing alongside White or DeRozan anyway, and his growth is being stunted. If he moves to the bench, he would be surrounded by primary scorers in Patty Mills and Lonnie, Gay. It's time for Popovich to move off the Dejounte idea of the next great Spur and except him as a bench/role player. Beside he would strength/balance the bench defense & offense

[Sugus]

Honestly, the momentum was swinging our way in the middle of the third quarter. We were only down 5 after being down 20. Then Pop subbed all the youth in. The game was winnable, but there was no need to win it.

I'm not as down on Murray as others. Yeah, he shot terrible but it wasn't "pull my hair out" terrible like several times during the bubble. Like I said earlier, he looked explosive. Maybe he wouldn't look as bad if the players around him didn't play bad too. Finishing around the rim still leaves much to be desired, but being quicker? That should open things up for him.

Honestly, the big letdown about Murray's shooting isn't the numbers per se (I'm not going to worry about a bad shooting night on the first preseason game), but the mechanics behind it. I'd have to go over yesterday's tape to confirm it, but I definitely saw his weird motion that he had pre-COVID, and which hasn't been fixed:

He's still pulling his knees together before he takes a jumper. He's still hesitating when catching the ball on the perimeter whilst open. His shot still doesn't look fluid - he has a middle motion after catching the ball, where he brings it down before shooting whilst setting his feet, but it's way longer than a normal "dip" and definitely something opposing wings can and will block; and in his single made 3, his feet weren't pointing at the rim, it was more of a sideway shot, even after having a lot of time to set himself.

I'll try to get a screencap of the shot so you can see what I'm talking about. But overall, the point is, he can have better or worse shooting splits on a given night, but the structural issues preventing him from being an NBA-caliber shooter (and therefore NBA-caliber SG) are still there. That's what worries me, at least, can't speak for others.

[Dejounte]

Honestly, the big letdown about Murray's shooting isn't the numbers per se (I'm not going to worry about a bad shooting night on the first preseason game), but the mechanics behind it. I'd have to go over yesterday's tape to confirm it, but I definitely saw his weird motion that he had pre-COVID, and which hasn't been fixed:

He's still pulling his knees together before he takes a jumper. He's still hesitating when catching the ball on the perimeter whilst open. His shot still doesn't look fluid - he has a middle motion after catching the ball, where he brings it down before shooting whilst setting his feet, but it's way longer than a normal "dip" and definitely something opposing wings can and will block; and in his single made 3, his feet weren't pointing at the rim, it was more of a sideway shot, even after having a lot of time to set himself.

I'll try to get a screencap of the shot so you can see what I'm talking about. But overall, the point is, he can have better or worse shooting splits on a given night, but the structural issues preventing him from being an NBA-caliber shooter (and therefore NBA-caliber SG) are still there. That's what worries me, at least, can't speak for others.

Fair points. I didn't pay attention to his shot as much as I paid attention to his movement on the court.

Honestly, if his shot doesn't improve and if the improved quickness is for real, he could pursue to be a Giannis type role player - pushing the ball in transition (like he found Patty in that one fast break last night) should be his focus. Aside from outstanding D, that's all Giannis really is.

Other than that, his other hope is to be a 3 and D but like you said, his shot stinks.

To be a natural PG who has vision and can reliably shoot the 3? That's out of the question for him.

[Sugus]

https://i.imgur.com/2624OWF.jpg

Hmm, will this image post correctly? I think I've got it down now... Anyways, Dejounte, here's the stuff I was talking about. Keep in mind this awful shooting pose was after being granted several seconds to set his form by a defensive mismatch/bad closeout from OKC, and included the way-too-deep dip that I mentioned. Shooting sideways just isn't gonna cut it at the NBA level, sadly, even if it leads to occasional hot spurts.

[Dejounte]

Here's food for thought:

Would Giannis be as effective if he played with DeMar and LMA?

The ball would stop so much (if we're thinking pre-bubble, and assuming it doesn't continue this season)

So... I don't think he would be as effective.

This is how I view DJ. Just a bad fit for him to be effective at all.

I'm not saying DJ is NOT a scrub. He very well could be. But I think his potential would be unlocked with a different type team. And maybe that's why he complains so much about LMA being on the team.

[Sugus]

Fair points. I didn't pay attention to his shot as much as I paid attention to his movement on the court.

Honestly, if his shot doesn't improve and if the improved quickness is for real, he could pursue to be a Giannis type role player - pushing the ball in transition (like he found Patty in that one fast break last night) should be his focus. Aside from outstanding D, that's all Giannis really is.

Other than that, his other hope is to be a 3 and D but like you said, his shot stinks.

To be a natural PG who has vision and can reliably shoot the 3? That's out of the question for him.

Haha, you're selling Giannis way short there. He's an unnaturally fluid ball-handler for his size and length, a walking mismatch for opposing PFs who have been trending the opposite direction since the early 2000's, and also a scoring machine (in the regular season at least), on top of DPOY-level defense. It's important to mention this, because it explains why Giannis hogging the ball and bringing it up actually has value; on that same note, I cannot say that Dejounte particularly doing the same, while lacking court vision and shooting threat, is worth nearly as much as Giannis, who can also explode towards the rim in a way that Dejounte never will (not to mention actually score when he gets to the rim, another area DJ lacks in). Why would I rather have DJ take the ball up instead of White, every single time? No reason at all.

Quickness in a vacuum isn't too valuable, at least combined with the rest of DJ's game. At least for the time being (and it's been a few years now), he can't convert too well once he gets to the rim, he's not good in the PnR 'cause he's got no pull-up or shooting game, he's not a good distributor due to lacking vision, and to top it off, he's unequivocally convinced that he's actually good enough at all these areas to warrant that ball-hogging. That might actually be what irks me the most about him :lol.

The more I write about Dj's game, the less encouraged I feel, tbh. I might have to stop altogether, at least until the season begins...

[Sugus]

Here's food for thought:

Would Giannis be as effective if he played with DeMar and LMA?

The ball would stop so much (if we're thinking pre-bubble, and assuming it doesn't continue this season)

So... I don't think he would be as effective.

This is how I view DJ. Just a bad fit for him to be effective at all.

I'm not saying DJ is NOT a scrub. He very well could be. But I think his potential would be unlocked with a different type team. And maybe that's why he complains so much about LMA being on the team.

Can't disagree there, even though I don't like the rethorical question and feel compelled to answer that yes, Giannis would still be effective paired with DD+LMA. Dejounte is just a bad fit on the Spurs, first and foremost, and can't be ruled out as a Certified Scrub until he's given a chance in another team. The question being - how much do the Spurs have to suck for Pop to realize this?

[Dejounte]

Haha, you're selling Giannis way short there. He's an unnaturally fluid ball-handler for his size and length, a walking mismatch for opposing PFs who have been trending the opposite direction since the early 2000's, and also a scoring machine (in the regular season at least), on top of DPOY-level defense. It's important to mention this, because it explains why Giannis hogging the ball and bringing it up actually has value; on that same note, I cannot say that Dejounte particularly doing the same, while lacking court vision and shooting threat, is worth nearly as much as Giannis, who can also explode towards the rim in a way that Dejounte never will (not to mention actually score when he gets to the rim, another area DJ lacks in). Why would I rather have DJ take the ball up instead of White, every single time? No reason at all.

Quickness in a vacuum isn't too valuable, at least combined with the rest of DJ's game. At least for the time being (and it's been a few years now), he can't convert too well once he gets to the rim, he's not good in the PnR 'cause he's got no pull-up or shooting game, he's not a good distributor due to lacking vision, and to top it off, he's unequivocally convinced that he's actually good enough at all these areas to warrant that ball-hogging. That might actually be what irks me the most about him :lol.

The more I write about Dj's game, the less encouraged I feel, tbh. I might have to stop altogether, at least until the season begins...

True, I did sell Giannis short. But I did say a 'role player' version of Giannis, whatever that means.

Giannis is ridiculously strong and bullies his way into the rim, with length to maneuver around players for easy lay-ups and/or dunks.

Dejounte is really lacking in strength. If he amped up his strength, to the point of where he can give inside bigs a little push back, he could score much easier. But the fact is, he's the one being pushed down which in effect makes him lose the ball instead of an easy 2.

[Biggems]

https://twitter.com/TreStones3/status/1338148620395278339?s=09

If we're down point guards,

STOP
PLAYING
PATTY
AT
THE
POINT

use this guy.
Some quality passes, too bad his teammates couldn't cash those checks.

[GAustex]

Tre needs to make the open shot

[Mr. Body]

Tre Jones and Derrick White are the only two natural point guards on the roster.

[Shakril]

Jakob is shit

Based on the fact, that as soon as he was off the court, the entire Spurs defense colapsed. Rethink your statement.

[phxspurfan]

sad to have to get Spurs bball from YT highlights, but Vassell looks good

Csm63O5AMes

[phxspurfan]

Samanic better be the white Robert Horry (clutch af) because he looks slow and useless

[phxspurfan]

jJyuQe1M7xE

Looks like everyone but Mills and Vassell were just going through the motions out there. Meanwhile OKC guys were trying to win jobs.

[BackHome]

I will give Luka another year as he was a project pick and bigs usually take longer to figure things out in the NBA but I still want to see some improvement or just plain hustle

[tonight...you]

jJyuQe1M7xE

Looks like everyone but Mills and Vassell were just going through the motions out there. Meanwhile OKC guys were trying to win jobs.
Real effort and want-to is a hell of a thing.

[phxspurfan]

Lineup should be

LMA
Gay
Vassell
DeRozan
Jones (while White is out)

tbh


with Mills/Purrtl as a good bench PnR duo, and Walker/Lyles and whoever. I guess Murray. But Murray sucks ass. His decision making is poor, his defensive effort seems poor (1st preseason game I know). He hit a 3 which is good, but other than that bright spot I don't see the same impact on the game he had when he was year 1/2.

prediction for this year, the vets will hurt the youth's development. Needing to find minutes for guys like Gay, Mills, even LMA and DeRozan, is making guys like Walker, Murray, and later, Keldon, White and Vassell struggle to get meaningful PT. And useless players like Lyles don't help either. Team really needs to commit to developing their youth. They're not making the playoffs, and they shouldn't, because making 7 or 8 seed and getting blown out by a contender in the first round isn't worth wasting another year of the team's young players.

[phxspurfan]

I will give Luka another year as he was a project pick and bigs usually take longer to figure things out in the NBA but I still want to see some improvement or just plain hustle

He's so damn slow. I don't have a problem with slow if the player can be smart like Bobo and be in the right places/make plays, like a Jokic style player. But dude seems like he's lost out there. Not reading whats going on at all, much less making things happen. Just spectating. Shitty since there are only 5 players, everyone needs to contribute with their floor time. I mean, Bonner was slow and played no D, but at least he spaced the floor and was a weapon at 3.

skip to 7:56 and watch for about a minute. Dude literally gets used over and over again. By G leaguers playing street ball.

jJyuQe1M7xE

[spurs10]

Yes, so what's the root of that issue?

>>>> Lack of ball movement because the "head of the snake" Mills won't run plays

It wouldn't be so hard to score if our players got open looks. Yes I agree that having 0 assists is not going to cut it. Mills is a shooter and not a playmaker. I'm hoping Jones can start playing some minutes with the bench.

[spurs10]

Fair points. I didn't pay attention to his shot as much as I paid attention to his movement on the court.

Honestly, if his shot doesn't improve and if the improved quickness is for real, he could pursue to be a Giannis type role player - pushing the ball in transition (like he found Patty in that one fast break last night) should be his focus. Aside from outstanding D, that's all Giannis really is.

Other than that, his other hope is to be a 3 and D but like you said, his shot stinks.

To be a natural PG who has vision and can reliably shoot the 3? That's out of the question for him. Do you see Pop starting White at the 1?

[Dejounte]

Yes I agree that having 0 assists is not going to cut it. Mills is a shooter and not a playmaker. I'm hoping Jones can start playing some minutes with the bench.

Yeah. He doesn't even need to garner the assist stat. Just move the ball around. Run a play. He does neither. The assist stat is more tailored towards point guards who have special vision anyway. A guard could have three assists and still have decent vision. But that same guard who has three assists, moves the ball around? That's a great role player. White is an example of that.

[Dejounte]

Do you see Pop starting White at the 1?

I don't, unfortunately. But he doesn't need to start in my eyes, for us to be a decent team. Our offense is a hybrid attack from having multiple primary/ secondary ball handlers on the floor at the same time. DJ could be the starter but it's not like he's having PG duties for all of 48 minutes in a game. AT LEAST three players share those PG duties on the Spurs. On other teams, it is three players at most who handle PG duties.

[Dejounte]

Hell, even Vassell was bringing the ball up a couple times last night. Our system isn't designed to rely on a single primary ballhandling point guard to run its offense.

[Mr. Body]

White should start and shiould be the primary ball-handler, or share duties with DDR if he's playing. Anything else is lunatic.

[SAGirl]

Here's food for thought:

Would Giannis be as effective if he played with DeMar and LMA?

The ball would stop so much (if we're thinking pre-bubble, and assuming it doesn't continue this season)

So... I don't think he would be as effective.

This is how I view DJ. Just a bad fit for him to be effective at all.

I'm not saying DJ is NOT a scrub. He very well could be. But I think his potential would be unlocked with a different type team. And maybe that's why he complains so much about LMA being on the team.

it doesn’t work that you are comparing Dejounte with Giannis. Just not a useful comparison.

[Rummpd]

Lineup should be

LMA
Gay
Vassell
DeRozan
Jones (while White is out)

tbh


with Mills/Purrtl as a good bench PnR duo, and Walker/Lyles and whoever. I guess Murray. But Murray sucks ass. His decision making is poor, his defensive effort seems poor (1st preseason game I know). He hit a 3 which is good, but other than that bright spot I don't see the same impact on the game he had when he was year 1/2.

prediction for this year, the vets will hurt the youth's development. Needing to find minutes for guys like Gay, Mills, even LMA and DeRozan, is making guys like Walker, Murray, and later, Keldon, White and Vassell struggle to get meaningful PT. And useless players like Lyles don't help either. Team really needs to commit to developing their youth. They're not making the playoffs, and they shouldn't, because making 7 or 8 seed and getting blown out by a contender in the first round isn't worth wasting another year of the team's young players.

Good post - major trades that should have happened already needs to occur during year but so far FO has been a farce and a HOF coach is now stubborn.

[SAGirl]

sad to have to get Spurs bball from YT highlights, but Vassell looks good

Csm63O5AMes
Thanks for sharing. I liked what I saw. I’d just forget about the Gleague and gave him in the team this season.

[Dejounte]

it doesn’t work that you are comparing Dejounte with Giannis. Just not a useful comparison.

Giannis was used because he is big and long for his position - as is Dejounte.

Giannis was not a natural point - as is Dejounte.

Giannis uses length to harass defenders - as does Dejounte.

Giannis is not a natural shooter - as is Dejounte.

Sure, the talent difference probably makes it a bad comparison, but I thought saying a role player version of him would make sense.

Maybe someone like Emmanuel Mudiay is more apt. Or Ricky Rubio with way less vision.

[Dejounte]

White should start and shiould be the primary ball-handler, or share duties with DDR if he's playing. Anything else is lunatic.

DJ starting with White worked. It worked because the ball movement was ramped up and didn't rely on DJ to create something.

[The Truth #6]

I said it then, people read way too much into the "bubble". They were never going to go into the season starting DeRozan at the four. I wouldn't read too much into the 90s starting lineups either, as we've seen this in the past for the first preseason game.

- DeRozan, Murray and Poeltl, should never play together.

- Haven't given up, but Walker has the whiff of a one dimensional, empty calories type and seems headed for whipping boy/fringe rotation status.

- At least it'll be easy to relegate him to that, unlike Murray, who they foolishly prematurely anointed and sunk starting money into.

- Suspected it and it's already clear Vassell should start on the wing opposite DeRozan. Put Gay at the four, then have a combination of Lyles/DeRozan/Johnson eat the backup minutes.

- Poeltl, White, Johnson, Vassell, appear to be the keepers among the youth.

I agree with this.

[SAGirl]

Giannis was used because he is big and long for his position - as is Dejounte.

Giannis was not a natural point - as is Dejounte.

Giannis uses length to harass defenders - as does Dejounte.

Giannis is not a natural shooter - as is Dejounte.

Sure, the talent difference probably makes it a bad comparison, but I thought saying a role player version of him would make sense.

Maybe someone like Emmanuel Mudiay is more apt. Or Ricky Rubio with way less vision.
A good comparison is Mudiay yeah. It’s not very useful to compare role players with all stars bc it would be like saying if Walker could play like Lebron for example. I suppose there’s some useful points there but one is so much better at what they are than the other that it doesn’t help me understand the point. Really discouraged about Murray frankly. But I am excited about Vassell and seeing Keldon and White back.

I think it only worries me that pop might not play his best guys bc they haven’t earned their chance or “gotten over themselves.” I hope to be wrong in that.

[Dejounte]

A good comparison is Mudiay yeah. It’s not very useful to compare role players with all stars bc it would be like saying if Walker could play like Lebron for example. I suppose there’s some useful points there but one is so much better at what they are than the other that it doesn’t help me understand the point. Really discouraged about Murray frankly. But I am excited about Vassell and seeing Keldon and White back.

O think it only worries me that pop might not play his best guys bc they haven’t earned their chance or “gotten over themselves.” I hope to be wrong in that.

I think Pop will continue to play Vassell. I understand the cynicism when it comes to Pop not playing the best players because of past trauma, but I believe last night's outing was no accident. Pop sees something in practice in Vassell that he did not see in Luka or even Keldon starting off. Maybe it even serves a lesson to Luka to get his shit together and for him to understand he's not playing because he has a lot of work to do.

[EasyMoney]

White
Murray
Vassell
Derozan
Aldridge

They need to embrace the small ball and if they need to go big they got lyles and poeltl

[The Truth #6]

I think Pop will continue to play Vassell. I understand the cynicism when it comes to Pop not playing the best players because of past trauma, but I believe last night's outing was no accident. Pop sees something in practice in Vassell that he did not see in Luka or even Keldon starting off. Maybe it even serves a lesson to Luka to get his shit together and for him to understand he's not playing because he has a lot of work to do.

I wonder if Luka actually likes playing basketball. A lot of tall people get sort of get pushed into it, you know, because they’re tall.

As for Pop and young players, he has something that he looks for in their demeanor, at least I think. With DJ there was a play early on in his career where he waved Pop off so he himself could talk a frustrated player down. It seems like he loved him after that and continues to double down each year. I’m being a little sarcastic. But not completely.

https://airalamo.com/2019/11/18/dejounte-murray-leadership-san-antonio-spurs/

[Dejounte]

I wonder if Luka actually likes playing basketball. A lot of tall people get sort of get pushed into it, you know, because they’re tall.

As for Pop and young players, he has something that he looks for in their demeanor, at least I think. With DJ there was a play early on in his career where he waved Pop off so he himself could talk a frustrated player down. It seems like he loved him after that and continues to double down each year. I’m being a little sarcastic. But not completely.

The ROI for players who overcome their confidence issues turn out to be great though. See: Derrick White

[Prime BEEF]

Tre Jones and Derrick White are the only two natural point guards on the roster.
Agreed

[The Truth #6]

Agreed

Yet they are 2nd and 3rd team. At least I hope not.

[spurs10]

I don't, unfortunately. But he doesn't need to start in my eyes, for us to be a decent team. Our offense is a hybrid attack from having multiple primary/ secondary ball handlers on the floor at the same time. DJ could be the starter but it's not like he's having PG duties for all of 48 minutes in a game. AT LEAST three players share those PG duties on the Spurs. On other teams, it is three players at most who handle PG duties. Well like you say if DM and White play together it's going to help keep the ball moving. Keldon and Vassell should both look good out there with them...and DDR and LMA ain't going anywhere.

[Dejounte]

The #leader has spoken.

https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone/status/1338567586611605508?s=19

[Sugus]

The #leader has spoken.

https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone/status/1338567586611605508?s=19

:bang

[Dejounte]

https://news4sanantonio.com/sports/watch-spurs-derozan-on-rookie-devin-vassell-team-chemistry-and-more

Much praise from DeMar for Devin

Devin + Keldon ... Kinda rhymes

They're the next Jordan + Pippen

Book it!

[Ocotillo]

The #leader has spoken.

https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone/status/1338567586611605508?s=19

Drozz covering himself in a contract year. Murray makes him look better in comparison. :bobo

[Dejounte]

CIyyTcXDEkv

Prove us wrong, Luka...

[John B]

CIyyTcXDEkv

Prove us wrong, Luka...
He's getting buffed. There's a big upside on this guy, so much talent but needs the game slow down on him.

[BackHome]

Remember he was picked as a project and also big almost always take longer to develop so just looking for little improvements and then big improvements the following year.

[Mugen]

Luka actually looked a bit improved in the first preseason game compared to his limited minutes in the bubble last season tbh, which is saying something because he was still pretty terrible in Game 1 :lol

I think he's a guy that need to get his touches offensively to settle in which wasn't happening with Lyles deciding to airball every touch he got. Regardless, I don't see him being anything other than garbage time fodder this season.

[BackHome]

I am not asking for him to get major minutes but Pop needs to have him play every game I don't care if it is for two minutes or thirty minutes he needs to get court time. You gotta keep these young kids engaged and having them sit and watch old vets and read stupid books is not going to get the job done. That includes Vassell and Walker etc....all the young guys should be touching the floor every game.

[Atl Spur]

I am not asking for him to get major minutes but Pop needs to have him play every game I don't care if it is for two minutes or thirty minutes he needs to get court time. You gotta keep these young kids engaged and having them sit and watch old vets and read stupid books is not going to get the job done. That includes Vassell and Walker etc....all the young guys should be touching the floor every game.

Especially in their second year.........these kids are cut from a different cloth!