Should have taken Tyrese Haliburton tbh

[kht]

As much as I love our guy Devin Vassell, who looks to be a high IQ player and contributes to winning basketball, Tyrese Haliburton just seems to have the "IT" factor of confidence and poise that you don't see most rookies possess.

I know we have too many guards but you guys act like he's 6'2" or something... he's still got good size at 6'5" and in a league that's moving towards smallball and positionless basketball, he could easily slide into the 3 spot. If Tyrese is who we "really wanted" (best player available) but Vassell was the better fit, we should have gone with Tyrese. Size is basically a toss up on them.

Plus, Tyrese will probably be even better than Lonnie Walker at end of this season. LW is due for a big contract extension. I'd let LW walk and let Tyrese, who is on a rookie deal, take his spot for the next 3-4 years.

Again, I ask, any Popsuckers gonna do some damage control on this one?

[Mr. Body]

Eh.

[SpurPadre]

No, if anything, Klay Thompson shouldn't have injured himself, otherwise, we would've acquired Wiseman and unloaded LMA but them's the breaks.

[playblair]

its not popovich its brian wright he tanked the pistons & is doing the same to the spurs........he was a blm/liberal take the spurs had to hire him for astatic reasons

[Mr. Body]

its not popovich its brian wright he tanked the pistons & is doing the same to the spurs........he was a blm/liberal take the spurs had to hire him for astatic reasons

Huh. That was a shitty take.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

its not popovich its brian wright he tanked the pistons & is doing the same to the spurs........he was a blm/liberal take the spurs had to hire him for astatic reasons


stop eating paint chips.

[Degoat]

No way, Devin would be contributing just as much if not more if he was given the same amount of minutes as Halliburton is getting.

[Dejounte]

Do we need another thread about this?

This year's Brandon Clarke? (Rehashed topic over and over)

[Mr. Body]

No way, Devin would be contributing just as much if not more if he was given the same amount of minutes as Halliburton is getting.

You're already seeing it from Devin. Pop obviously is slow to throw rookies into the fire and he's getting time. The Kings don't work the same way.

[BillMc]

I haven't seen Tyrese play but I'm really excited by Devin. Dude may already be the best defender on our team.

[R. DeMurre]

I love Haliburton too, but Advanced Stats are absolutely lovin' Vassell so far: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/nba-player-ratings/


(https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/nba-player-ratings/)Edit: Sorry, that's just the generic page, I thought it was the rookie page. Click on Rookies under the Years of Experience category to see what I'm referring to.

[tonight...you]

As much as I love our guy Devin Vassell, who looks to be a high IQ player and contributes to winning basketball, Tyrese Haliburton just seems to have the "IT" factor of confidence and poise that you don't see most rookies possess.

I know we have too many guards but you guys act like he's 6'2" or something... he's still got good size at 6'5" and in a league that's moving towards smallball and positionless basketball, he could easily slide into the 3 spot. If Tyrese is who we "really wanted" (best player available) but Vassell was the better fit, we should have gone with Tyrese. Size is basically a toss up on them.

Plus, Tyrese will probably be even better than Lonnie Walker at end of this season. LW is due for a big contract extension. I'd let LW walk and let Tyrese, who is on a rookie deal, take his spot for the next 3-4 years.

Again, I ask, any Popsuckers gonna do some damage control on this one?
You can woulda coulda shoulda anything, but I choose to celebrate the player we have and the fact that's he's pretty damn good, for a rook and has a ceiling that makes for more excitement.

[Mr. Body]

I love Haliburton too, but Advanced Stats are absolutely lovin' Vassell so far: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/nba-player-ratings/

Once his threes start dropping, there's no looking back. They look really good so far, just haven't fallen. He's close to an instant rotation player already.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

I really like the Devin Vassell pick so far also. At worse the guy will be a solid rotation player and he is already that so far....

he has shown to be able to put the ball on the deck a little bit which is a plus. The sad thing though is when White comes back I have a feeling the young man isn’t gonna get many minutes. When he should obviously be taking Patty’s minutes if he doesn’t have his shot going.

[Sugus]

I'll go against the grain of the thread so far, and half-agree with OP: I also think we should've drafted Haliburton instead of Vassell, tbh. But I disagree with OP's evaluation of Haliburton as a player.

First of all, he doesn't have nearly enough length nor strength to be able to play the 3 like Vassell (or Lonnie) does. He's a combo guard at best. I'd have loved him on the Spurs due to his passing prowess (already on display for the Kings), his IQ on both sides of the ball (also on display given his impressive steals and plays, if y'all have watched the Kings this season, y'all know what I'm talking about), and his overall hustle and grit as a player. The only thing I wasn't - and am not - sold on, is his shooting, because I don't think his shooting motion is sustainable at the NBA level, and I don't trust prospects whose shooting form has to be reworked post-drafting. It can work out, I guess, but most times it fails miserably, and that's with small tweaks being made. Hali has an overall fugly form that should be worked from the ground up, tbh.

Having said that, he's playing excellently so far, and already one of the Kings' best players (not much of a high bar, I know). I just can't resist the high ceiling/low floor draftees, instead of the opposite spectrum which Vassell represents, in general, and especially for where the Spurs are right now; they should've been swinging for the fences instead of settling for the "safe" pick in Devin (and I know many posters here see more "potential" to Vassell than a 3-D prospect, I'm just not buying it yet).

As Dejounte says, though, definitely not something that should be beaten to death like the Luka/Clarke debacle, tbh. Vassell is playing good basketball right now and I'm grateful for it. Just hope that, should we end up in the lottery again this season, we don't go for the high floor-low ceiling prospect, tbh.

[rankingtear]

As much as I love our guy Devin Vassell, who looks to be a high IQ player and contributes to winning basketball, Tyrese Haliburton just seems to have the "IT" factor of confidence and poise that you don't see most rookies possess.

I know we have too many guards but you guys act like he's 6'2" or something... he's still got good size at 6'5" and in a league that's moving towards smallball and positionless basketball, he could easily slide into the 3 spot. If Tyrese is who we "really wanted" (best player available) but Vassell was the better fit, we should have gone with Tyrese. Size is basically a toss up on them.

Plus, Tyrese will probably be even better than Lonnie Walker at end of this season. LW is due for a big contract extension. I'd let LW walk and let Tyrese, who is on a rookie deal, take his spot for the next 3-4 years.

Again, I ask, any Popsuckers gonna do some damage control on this one?

He is 185lb and that looks to be his playing weight.

[kht]

Buy or sell - at the end of this year, Tyrese will be a better player than Lonnie Walker?

[Mr. Body]

Buy or sell - at the end of this year, Tyrese will be a better player than Lonnie Walker?

Why does that matter?

[kht]

Why does that matter?

Because the "too many guards" argument goes out the window. 1 guard out, 1 guard in.

Cheaper. We can sign a big. Lots of things.

[PrimeMinister]

Buy or sell - at the end of this year, Tyrese will be a better player than Lonnie Walker?

Different players in different situations where one will have more freedom to showcase their potential and the other will have to play more restrained compared to what their current skills might be.

Sell. Hard. Haliburton is lonzo with a bit more polish down the line best case.

[Sugus]

Buy or sell - at the end of this year, Tyrese will be a better player than Lonnie Walker?

This premise doesn't make any sense - the "buy or sell" is wrongly used here, to my understanding of the phrase. What am I supposed to "buy"? Lol. But anyways.

By the end of the season, Lonnie will be (as he's always been) the player with the higher ceiling between the two. Though he's lacking in BBIQ for now, he's still the much, much more athletic prospect, has better length, speed that can consistently break down a defense, has the MUCH better shooting motion which is practically a must in today's NBA, and has the better defensive potential due to his physical prowess. Haliburton has (and probably will always have) the better IQ and passing ability, and maaaybe the better help defense, but that's about the extent of where he trumps Lonnie.

Overall, typical case of high floor/low ceiling prospect and vice versa. If all three were available in a single draft, though, I'd probably take Lonnie -> Hali -> Vassell, if that helps to answer your question somewhat.

[Atl Spur]

Lol.........I won’t even partake in this foolishness! Please bump this in a year and a half.

[DAF86]

I haven't seen Haliburton, but Vassell is an elite defensive player. Haliburton will have to be a very special player to be more impactful than Vassell.

[tim_duncan_fan]

No, if anything, Klay Thompson shouldn't have injured himself, otherwise, we would've acquired Wiseman and unloaded LMA but them's the breaks.

Astatic?

I don't think that word means what you think it means.

[poopbox]

Haliburton only looks so good because he is surrounded by the dysfunction of the kings tbh...somebody has to look normal out their for them...

[Biggems]

I am glad we have Vassell....I could give a rat's ass about Haliburton. The only ruing I will be doing this season is the failure to unload LMA on the Warriors for Wiseman and the failure to find a quality trade with Detroit for Wood, especially since we have Brian Wright now.

[exstatic]

Haliburton only looks so good because he is surrounded by the dysfunction of the kings tbh...somebody has to look normal out their for them...

Tyreke Evans. Started off as a rookie 20/5/5, and everyone said he’d be the next Jordan. He pretty much got worse every year, and is no longer in the NBA. He’s 31. When you play for a shit team, you put up numbers because no one cares about you.

[Dex]

People around here have been bitching for ages that the Spurs never draft any long wings, and once they do they suddenly want to draft the second coming of Patty Mills.

[timvp]

Haliburton would have been my choice if it were up to me, tbh ... and his offensive game has translated even better than I thought it would. Great IQ, great court vision and passer, deep range -- a lot to like about Haliburton on offense.

That said, advanced stats say Haliburton has been a disaster on defense. I haven't watched him enough to confirm he's been bad on D but given his skinny body and lack of strength, that was always a worry with him.

If Haliburton is legitimately a bad defender, then I think the Spurs made the right choice. I wouldn't enjoy a return to the Forbes/Belinelli years, even if Haliburton would have been a major asset on offense.

Vassell would have been my number two choice. So far, advanced stats say his defense has been great. Eye-test says his defense has been very good. He was really good offensively in the preseason and we've seen glimpses that he's more than a 3-and-D prospect.

Too early to tell which player will be better but I'm happy with Vassell. In a redraft situation, both of them probably jump over a number of players taken before them including Hayes, Jalen Smith, Okoro and maybe Avdija and Toppin.

[Mr. Body]

Yeah, Sacramento has a historically terrible defense, maybe the worst we've ever seen. Halliburton contributes to that.

I think in 30 games this isn't a question. Halliburton looks like a fantastic player in many ways, but Vassell should have grown into his role and more. You already see his offensive threat emerging and he's already impactful on defense after barely more than a handful of games.

[exstatic]

Haliburton would have been my choice if it were up to me, tbh ... and his offensive game has translated even better than I thought it would. Great IQ, great court vision and passer, deep range -- a lot to like about Haliburton on offense.

That said, advanced stats say Haliburton has been a disaster on defense. I haven't watched him enough to confirm he's been bad on D but given his skinny body and lack of strength, that was always a worry with him.

If Haliburton is legitimately a bad defender, then I think the Spurs made the right choice. I wouldn't enjoy a return to the Forbes/Belinelli years, even if Haliburton would have been a major asset on offense.

Vassell would have been my number two choice. So far, advanced stats say his defense has been great. Eye-test says his defense has been very good. He was really good offensively in the preseason and we've seen glimpses that he's more than a 3-and-D prospect.

Too early to tell which player will be better but I'm happy with Vassell. In a redraft situation, both of them probably jump over a number of players taken before them including Hayes, Jalen Smith, Okoro and maybe Avdija and Toppin.

In the second game of the pair with HOU, the offense was sputtering yet again, and he took a pass on the left perimeter, dribbled just inside the paint, rose up without hesitation, and stuck like a 12 foot jumper. It seemed like an isolated play, but that seemed to snap the team out of it’s funk.

[$pursDynasty]

Really shouldn't reply in this thread because I am unfamiliar with Haliburton and like Vasell, but the only relavent should have drafted threads should involve that waste of space Luka who is as worthless as a spitoon with a hole in it. If I was Keldon i would be dubious of a front office that drafted him before it drafted me.

[Dejounte]

Really shouldn't reply in this thread because I am unfamiliar with Haliburton and like Vasell, but the only relavent should have drafted threads should involve that waste of space Luka who is as worthless as a spitoon with a hole in it. If I was Keldon i would be dubious of a front office that drafted him before it drafted me.

Creating drama where it isn't needed. Glad Keldon is humble and loves his teammates. He's always happy to see Luka.

[$pursDynasty]

I have no problem with Keldon or Luka. I have yet to see anything in Luka than a G-Leaguer. In fact if the G-League had all-stars I doubt he could be one. Yet our FO drafted him in the first ahead of Keldon. I have seen more from Metu which wasn't much.

[JADG79]

Any rookie in Pop hands will not perform well.
SAS is not the best team for rookie players, Pop is not like Spoelstra or Brad.

Vassell or Haliburton in Pop hands will be the same results

[Mr. Body]

Really shouldn't reply in this thread because I am unfamiliar with Haliburton and like Vasell, but the only relavent should have drafted threads should involve that waste of space Luka who is as worthless as a spitoon with a hole in it. If I was Keldon i would be dubious of a front office that drafted him before it drafted me.

Lol, there's a thread for that, dummy.

[Ice009]

I have no problem with Keldon or Luka. I have yet to see anything in Luka than a G-Leaguer. In fact if the G-League had all-stars I doubt he could be one. Yet our FO drafted him in the first ahead of Keldon. I have seen more from Metu which wasn't much.

Detroit drafted Darko. What is your point? You're trying to create trouble over nothing. Why should Keldon be pissed off? It's stupid.

[Mugen]

I like DV tbh. He's been the best defender on the team so far. Shown flashes of improvement already, especially offensively (nice pull up moves the last few games).

No summer, no training camp, shortened training camp....the physical skills are there and has shown good BBIQ so far...I think he's gonna be an above average player in this league tbh.

[Ice009]

Yeah, I love Devin's defense and his BBIQ, so I am happy with the pick so far. I just want him to actually get more court time. I'm already that confident in having him out on the floor as much as possible. He's not phased by much of anything out there, and just plays like he's been here for a while already.

[exstatic]

I have no problem with Keldon or Luka. I have yet to see anything in Luka than a G-Leaguer. In fact if the G-League had all-stars I doubt he could be one. Yet our FO drafted him in the first ahead of Keldon. I have seen more from Metu which wasn't much.

Massively stupid statement. Metu was given many chances over two seasons. He always looked either lost, or completely a black hole. Luka played one real game, 31 minutes, scored 16, grabbed 6 boards, and hit 3 out of 5 three pointers. He was always going to be a two year project. Do you randomly pull things out of the oven when you think they should be done, and start eating them?

[buttsR4rebounding]

Massively stupid statement. Metu was given many chances over two seasons. He always looked either lost, or completely a black hole. Luka played one real game, 31 minutes, scored 16, grabbed 6 boards, and hit 3 out of 5 three pointers. He was always going to be a two year project. Do you randomly pull things out of the oven when you think they should be done, and start eating them?

No. SD pulls them out of his ass and tries to feed them to us.

[TheChillFactor]

he has a weird jumpshot and there were tons of reports that his agent was telling teams he didn't want to be drafted by them.

for all we know, the Spurs were one of them. even if they weren't, that's not really a Spurs move.

[Seventyniner]

Massively stupid statement. Metu was given many chances over two seasons. He always looked either lost, or completely a black hole. Luka played one real game, 31 minutes, scored 16, grabbed 6 boards, and hit 3 out of 5 three pointers. He was always going to be a two year project. Do you randomly pull things out of the oven when you think they should be done, and start eating them?

I truly don't understand how anyone saw a future in the NBA for Metu. He never looked like an NBA player to me.

Forbes didn't either for a while, but I thought he had improved enough to be a 10th man while with the Spurs. Too bad they were starting him. His play with the Bucks has been underwhelming to say the least, though.

[XDT76]

If Spurs drafted Haliburton the Spurs FO will be trashed left right and centre in ST. The guy needs the ball in his hand to be effective and with the number of guys on the Spurs handling the ball he will be Forbes 2.0 w/o the 3 pt shooting. Even Lonnie does not gets to touch the ball with DDR back in the side. Anyway it was rumoured that he wanted to be on the Kings and refuse to give several teams his medical, we would not want a Kawhi 2.0 incident few years down the road.

[buttsR4rebounding]

Haliburton would have been my choice if it were up to me, tbh ... and his offensive game has translated even better than I thought it would. Great IQ, great court vision and passer, deep range -- a lot to like about Haliburton on offense.

That said, advanced stats say Haliburton has been a disaster on defense. I haven't watched him enough to confirm he's been bad on D but given his skinny body and lack of strength, that was always a worry with him.

If Haliburton is legitimately a bad defender, then I think the Spurs made the right choice. I wouldn't enjoy a return to the Forbes/Belinelli years, even if Haliburton would have been a major asset on offense.

Vassell would have been my number two choice. So far, advanced stats say his defense has been great. Eye-test says his defense has been very good. He was really good offensively in the preseason and we've seen glimpses that he's more than a 3-and-D prospect.

Too early to tell which player will be better but I'm happy with Vassell. In a redraft situation, both of them probably jump over a number of players taken before them including Hayes, Jalen Smith, Okoro and maybe Avdija and Toppin.

According to Hollinger’s ratings the Kings have the worst defense in the league by far yet their D is 4.5 points per 100 possessions worse with Halliburton. Of course, just being around that dumpster fire can’t be helpful.

[Darius Bieber]

he has a weird jumpshot and there were tons of reports that his agent was telling teams he didn't want to be drafted by them.

for all we know, the Spurs were one of them. even if they weren't, that's not really a Spurs move.

I believe the agent mentioned that he didn't want to go to any Team inside the Top 10... Even so, that's sacrificing a lot of money to go to a team like the Kings instead.... I would 100% rather go to the Warriors than Sacramento but... that's on him.

[timvp]

According to Hollinger’s ratings the Kings have the worst defense in the league by far yet their D is 4.5 points per 100 possessions worse with Halliburton. Of course, just being around that dumpster fire can’t be helpful.

Yeah, Sacramento's defense has been really terrible so far this season. Historically bad. It's too early to say how much of that is Haliburton's fault. Early returns aren't good but, then again, Cory Joseph's on/off defensive numbers are similar and he's actually a good defender so we have to wait for the sample size to increase.

[Sugus]

Having watched a couple of Kings games, including the one last night against the Pels, I can safely say that conclusions should not be drawn on Haliburton's defensive woes this season. The Kings are truly, disgustingly bad on defense, all kinds of defense, they can't stay with anyone man-to-man and have little understanding of zones, they miss rotations almost every play and have awful weakside help. Hali, beyond some blocks here and there (he had a pretty spectacular one at the rim last night that's bound to be overshadowed by the loss), hasn't exactly been stellar on D, but he's pretty swift on his feet and has potential as a help defender due to high-IQ reads that help him anticipate passes and play passing lanes. Of course, those gambles for steals coupled with his unimpressive wingspan are bound to be high risk plays, many times leaving his defender wide open with no chance for him to recover on time, so he'll have to learn in time how and when to make those gamble plays.

Overall, the Kings couldn't stop a G-League team if their lives depended on it. Luke Walton is a joke of a coach (or maybe he's just unlucky with the defense...? :lol). But Haliburton remains one of the only bright spots for the team, next to Fox who is a star in the making (though way overpaid at the max, he'll severely hinder the Kings' ability to build around him taking so much of the cap, and I can pretty easily see him demanding a trade after 2-3 years if things don't take a turn for the better), and Bagley, who had one of his better games last night.

It's always sobering to watch other teams in the league besides the Spurs, tbh. It brings a lot of perspective to watching our games, and the team's progress and struggles.

[Bogie]

its not popovich its brian wright he tanked the pistons & is doing the same to the spurs........he was a blm/liberal take the spurs had to hire him for astatic reasons


this is really stupid. Is this another derp alt?

[cjw]

Haliburton only looks so good because he is surrounded by the dysfunction of the kings tbh...somebody has to look normal out their for them...

This.

I hate drafting players for fit, but Vassell was the better fit of the two as well. Halliburton is a PG. Same height, but Vassell plays bigger as a wing.

His defense has a chance to be elite too.

[Sugus]

This.

I hate drafting players for fit, but Vassell was the better fit of the two as well. Halliburton is a PG. Same height, but Vassell plays bigger as a wing.

His defense has a chance to be elite too.

Incoming "but the Spurs don't ackshually have a PG on the team!!!" comments, tbh :lol

[TheGreatYacht]

Would probably be 11-5 right now tbh...

[TheChillFactor]

I believe the agent mentioned that he didn't want to go to any Team inside the Top 10... Even so, that's sacrificing a lot of money to go to a team like the Kings instead.... I would 100% rather go to the Warriors than Sacramento but... that's on him.

do you really think they had to call the Warriors and tell them not to pick him?

[LeBowen]

Haliburton would just either get DNPs or he'd sit in the corner while FIBA Patty chucks shots. :lol

I think he's a good player, but I also think Devin can be special. We just need not to lose our minds and wait for the vets to leave in the summer.

[paperboy77]

Haliburton would just either get DNPs or he'd sit in the corner while FIBA Patty chucks shots. :lol

I think he's a good player, but I also think Devin can be special. We just need not to lose our minds and wait for the vets to leave in the summer.

This right here. I hate this thread and the old Scola one. (Althouth Scola eventually had a pretty good, above average career. Plus an Olympic stud. Hliburton is just a rookie on a shitty team that grants him minutes.)

[TimDunkem]

Yes every good rookie that ever lived was only good if they weren't on bad teams first.

Vassell was a good pick. Tyrese would have been good too. Both things are true and it's okay to admit that, Slurpers.

[duncan2k5]

As much as I love our guy Devin Vassell, who looks to be a high IQ player and contributes to winning basketball, Tyrese Haliburton just seems to have the "IT" factor of confidence and poise that you don't see most rookies possess.

I know we have too many guards but you guys act like he's 6'2" or something... he's still got good size at 6'5" and in a league that's moving towards smallball and positionless basketball, he could easily slide into the 3 spot. If Tyrese is who we "really wanted" (best player available) but Vassell was the better fit, we should have gone with Tyrese. Size is basically a toss up on them.

Plus, Tyrese will probably be even better than Lonnie Walker at end of this season. LW is due for a big contract extension. I'd let LW walk and let Tyrese, who is on a rookie deal, take his spot for the next 3-4 years.

Again, I ask, any Popsuckers gonna do some damage control on this one?

We need to quit with this small ball narrative...the league isn't moving towards small ball...small ball has never worked...it's moving toward versatile ball...bit make no mistake,big teams win...even the warriors were on the bigger side...the one time they lost on their run is when their big man got injured... So us having a 6'4 PF isn't us catching up with the rest of the league... It's us being stupid... Big, versatile ball wins...

[rankingtear]

It seems him wanting to drop to the Kings was agent talk. He mentioned GS, CHI, NY and DET as his target destinations in the JJ Reddick podcast.

[kht]

Once again I ask, any pop suckers gonna do any damage control on this one? Wasted a lottery pick. Just like we wasted a pick on Luka lmfao.

[Degoat]

Once again I ask, any pop suckers gonna do any damage control on this one? Wasted a lottery pick. Just like we wasted a pick on Luka lmfao.

whatcha you talking about Devin Vassell has been great

[Mr. Body]

Watched him against the Knicks tonight. He looks really good, but I don't know where he'd play on this team. It would mean getting rid of someone we already had. Vassell is an instant fit with what we need, plus factors as an exceptional defender while Haliburton is not great in that area.

[Dejounte]

OP reaching hard on this one...

Has a brain of a cockroach.

[Ice009]

Once again I ask, any pop suckers gonna do any damage control on this one? Wasted a lottery pick. Just like we wasted a pick on Luka lmfao.

We need a defensive small forward and Vassell is fucking superior in that regard.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

Haliburton has been balling but I like Devin for our team. I think if he got more consistent minutes he would be putting up good numbers. For the amount of time he gets he always produces positively

[PrimeMinister]

5 years from now when Devin is making another all defensive team and we are looking back at Haliburton wondering why he peaked in his rookie season, I'll remember this thread fondly.

[John B]

5 years from now when Devin is making another all defensive team and we are looking back at Haliburton wondering why he peaked in his rookie season, I'll remember this thread fondly.
Agree.

[rjv]

hard to gauge players that get significant minutes on sub-par teams. especially when we just get highlights or box scores.

[look_at_g_shred]

He's playing meaningful minutes? What is the Kings' record?

[John B]

Haliburton, with all the hype, will be a Tyrese Evans.
Come on, we have a higher ceiling with Devin Vassell and he fills the defensive wing that Spurs always look for and key part of championship run, Ninja Elliott, Bruce Bowen, Kawhi and now Vassell.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

Haliburton, with all the hype, will be a Tyrese Evans.
Come on, we have a higher ceiling with Devin Vassell and he fills the defensive wing that Spurs always look for and key part of championship run, Ninja Elliott, Bruce Bowen, Kawhi and now Vassell.

i don’t think it’s fair to compare Haliburton to Tyreke Evans. Tyreke got his numbers due to really good athletic ability on a bad team. The Kings aren’t great this season but they aren’t bad also. Not to mention Haliburton is more of a high basketball IQ type of player.

I think Haliburton will be a solid to good player (baring injuries) in the NBA for a long time. Where as Evans kinda peaked his (besides the one season in Memphis) rookie season. I mean Evans had some other good years in the NBA but his numbers never got much better than his rookie year.

[DAF86]

In the long run it think Vassell will prove to be better than Haliburton.

[John B]

i don’t think it’s fair to compare Haliburton to Tyreke Evans. Tyreke got his numbers due to really good athletic ability on a bad team. The Kings aren’t great this season but they aren’t bad also. Not to mention Haliburton is more of a high basketball IQ type of player.

I think Haliburton will be a solid to good player (baring injuries) in the NBA for a long time. Where as Evans kinda peaked his (besides the one season in Memphis) rookie season. I mean Evans had some other good years in the NBA but his numbers never got much better than his rookie year.

Haliburton could very well be the ROY, like Evans, with the draft picks under performing, except for Melo. And that's a compliment. Evans carved a long NBA career. Nothing against Haliburton. He's a great kid.
But going to the other point, Devin addresses Spurs need. I don't know why people want another guard when Spurs are heavy on guards, and Tre in the 2nd round was a steal too! Tre, once he makes those outside shots, and his forms are great so I don't see why he wouldn't, would be a solid player. Nash/Stockton IQ on how he distributes and set offense. I think we got really solid drafts this year and wouldn't want anybody else than what we drafted.

[Sugus]

5 years from now when Devin is making another all defensive team and we are looking back at Haliburton wondering why he peaked in his rookie season, I'll remember this thread fondly.

Eh, I like Vassell as well, but no need to shit on Haliburton on this. There's no indicator that he's playing at his peak, nor that his game will age badly or is one-dimensional; his shooting has proven to translate to the NBA, even with that odd shooting motion, and he's a really high-IQ player, which always tend to have long careers in the league as opposed to athleticism-based prospects. His defense is one of the better in terms of overall Kangz defense, and I know because I've been watching a lot of their games. They are, bluntly put, a mess. I really can't understand thinking Luke MF Walton is the right choice to coach a young, developing team with playoffs aspiration... But it's looking like another lost season for Sactown.

I'm not saying your initial proposition can't come true, and Vassell definitely looks like a savant defensively, but there's just as much a chance of the opposite happening: Vassell's limited offensive game lowering his ceiling into a defensive roleplayer, whilst Hali's offensive arsenal, offensive IQ, shooting and offense-running turning him into a star or close to it, which isn't that much of a stretch given the modern, guard-heavy and shooting-heavy NBA. The only thing I'm certain of, is that scenario probably doesn't happen while he's on the Kings... :lol

[GB20]

We need to give these players at least five years and then we can judge them.

[Dejounte]

OP wasn't really looking for any intelligent discussion... he was looking for any mistakes that the Spurs have made and then point it out to rile people up. Unfortunately, this is a big miss for the guy. Let's wait another week before he makes another obnoxious topic talking about "The Spurs should have done this...!".

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

Haliburton could very well be the ROY, like Evans, with the draft picks under performing, except for Melo. And that's a compliment. Evans carved a long NBA career. Nothing against Haliburton. He's a great kid.
But going to the other point, Devin addresses Spurs need. I don't know why people want another guard when Spurs are heavy on guards, and Tre in the 2nd round was a steal too! Tre, once he makes those outside shots, and his forms are great so I don't see why he wouldn't, would be a solid player. Nash/Stockton IQ on how he distributes and set offense. I think we got really solid drafts this year and wouldn't want anybody else than what we drafted.



you’re preaching to the choir when it comes to Vassell. I like the pick and was one of the people early on who wanted us to draft him. It’s well documented on this very site that I liked Vassell for us before the draft. Lmao

i think the draft hasn’t been that bad though. It’s been some solid players getting a decent amount of run so far. Avdija, Patrick Williams, Pritchard, Maxey, have all been pretty decent and it’s a few more guys that have been solid also. I didn’t even name guys like Bane, Wiseman, Melo, and even Anthony Edwards has had a few flashes of brilliance.

[C-Dub]

If Haliburton was selected by the Spurs in lieu of Vessel and Vessel was selected by Sacramento than I believe there's a good chance that most people that are saying this will be saying that the Spurs should of selected Vessel in lieu of Haliburton because Vessel would of been playing more minutes, therefore showing more of what he can do in the court and Haliburton would of bot been given the opportunity to show his game because Pop would of not giving him the consistent playing time that a player needs to progress. Look at Keldon last season. Herro and P.J. Washington came out of Kentucky just like Keldon and they both got consistent minutes to show what they could do and Keldon did not until the bubble at the end of the season. If Pop would've played Keldon earlier, he would be further along in his progression right now. Some players are able to spread their wings a little more and play more freely to release more of their talents once they move on from the Spurs. Ginobili would've most likely been a constant allstar if on another team during his career but probably wouldn't won as many titles. Spurs are more of a system team and I like it.

[R. DeMurre]

I like both guys, but I don't see where this silly "Haliburton will peak in his rookie year" stuff is coming from. He's not even 21 yet, and playing great.

[buttsR4rebounding]

I don’t have an issue with Vassel. The thing that I wonder is which teams were trying to trade up for Haliburton. Could they have traded back a few spots and still got Vassel and picked up an asset? Of course, if Vassel was so far above the next guy on their list that they felt they couldn’t risk it then I can live with that. It’s just so rare that the Spurs have leverage like they did for the 10 minutes they were on the clock I would have liked to see them use it.

[The Truth #6]

I like both. I’d love to have both on the team. But Vassel offers the chance to be part of an elite defensive team we are developing, so not as exciting but could be something special. And defense was definitely the focus of last draft, so let’s see how the team overall does.

[KobesAchilles]

I mean if we go forward with DJ, White, Vassell, KJ, and Poetl that is a hell of a defensive line up going forward.

[R. DeMurre]

You know who has a similar game to Haliburton, and is probably attainable? Tomas Satoransky. Haliburton is more of a scorer, but Satoransky's shooting percentages are a hair better, and he averages more assists per 36 than him, and that's Haliburton's one big statistical advantage over Vassell. A trade for either DeRozan or Aldridge before the deadline would give the Bulls an insane amount of cap space for next off season, and is something they might consider. Satoransky has one more year on his contract after this year.


https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&player_id1=satorto01&p1yrfrom=2021&player_id2=halibty01&p2yrfrom=2021

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

I don’t have an issue with Vassel. The thing that I wonder is which teams were trying to trade up for Haliburton. Could they have traded back a few spots and still got Vassel and picked up an asset? Of course, if Vassel was so far above the next guy on their list that they felt they couldn’t risk it then I can live with that. It’s just so rare that the Spurs have leverage like they did for the 10 minutes they were on the clock I would have liked to see them use it.

Apparently Boston and Dallas. There might have been a bit of a chance that Vassell could have dropped to Boston's spot with NO being fixated or Lewis, but Sacramento likely get him anyway.

[leo07251413]

Once again I ask, any pop suckers gonna do any damage control on this one? Wasted a lottery pick. Just like we wasted a pick on Luka lmfao.

Dude.....
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/e8/e9/90/e8e99004517fe80257cfce35f567f157.jpg

[Ocotillo]

If Devin becomes a good rotational player and does not bust but Haliburton ends up being a better player, I can live with that. Now down the road if Haliburton is lighting up the league and Devin is playing in China than yeah, come in and run smack. If they're close, be happy with what you got.

[cd98]

Devin is going to be a good player and have a long NBA career absent an injury. He has a ton of upside. He would have better numbers, but because he is a rookie, he gets limited minutes. In three years, the Spurs are going to look smart for drafting him.

[EricB]

Let’s just say the decision betwee Tyrese and Vassell was tough, and that they took all the time at the draft when it was their turn for a reason.

[rankingtear]

Let’s just say the decision betwee Tyrese and Vassell was tough, and that they took all the time at the draft when it was their turn for a reason.

Brian hinted the same thing post draft. Same tier players then tiebreaker is position of need. Tyrese may well be the better player but we have more upside and versatility with Vassell. White and Hali have also a lot of overlap in skillset and weakness. We have secondary ballhandlers in patty and white , we don't have a team defender wing like vassell. This allows us to mix and match depending on matchups between him Keldon , Lonnie and Luka.

[TheGreatYacht]

Not faulting PATFO at all for going with the bigger need over another guard, but damn this mf is good :depressed

[BatManu20]

Let the record show that I was one of the only people in the Draft Thread last summer that was upset that the Spurs took Vassel over Halliburton :lol


Damn. Can’t believe we passed on Halliburton, a true PG who’s 6’5, plays good Defense, shoots the 3 at a high clip, and is a good passer. Really wish we would’ve drafted him. He’s already better at every aspect of the game than DJ and he doesn’t seem to obsess over Instagram like Murray does. There’s a reason the analysts are saying the Kings got the steal of the night. Spurs blew it tbh.

[BatManu20]

Still have high hopes for Vassel though. Just think Halliburton is a more impactful player and he fell right into our laps. Could’ve been special tbh.

[GAustex]

Add this to poops screw up list

[Ice009]

Let the record show that I was one of the only people in the Draft Thread last summer that was upset that the Spurs took Vassel over Halliburton :lol

I didn't know much about him, but now that I've seen how it's played out so far, I would have taken him and traded one of the other guys later in the season (White for example).

[timvp]

Haliburton would have been my choice if it were up to me, tbh ... and his offensive game has translated even better than I thought it would. Great IQ, great court vision and passer, deep range -- a lot to like about Haliburton on offense.

That said, advanced stats say Haliburton has been a disaster on defense. I haven't watched him enough to confirm he's been bad on D but given his skinny body and lack of strength, that was always a worry with him.

If Haliburton is legitimately a bad defender, then I think the Spurs made the right choice. I wouldn't enjoy a return to the Forbes/Belinelli years, even if Haliburton would have been a major asset on offense.

Vassell would have been my number two choice. So far, advanced stats say his defense has been great. Eye-test says his defense has been very good. He was really good offensively in the preseason and we've seen glimpses that he's more than a 3-and-D prospect.

Too early to tell which player will be better but I'm happy with Vassell. In a redraft situation, both of them probably jump over a number of players taken before them including Hayes, Jalen Smith, Okoro and maybe Avdija and Toppin.

Tbh, Haliburton's defense didn't look bad. He's skinny but he fights.

[ace3g]

As with any Pop coached team, what would Haliburton's minutes be in comparison to Vassell's?

[daslicer]

As with any Pop coached team, what would Haliburton's minutes be in comparison to Vassell's?

Haliburton is a 6 point scorer on the Spurs due to minutes restrictions and also would have had his confidence broken by Pop.

[BWS-1994]

As with any Pop coached team, what would Haliburton's minutes be in comparison to Vassell's?

Will he get the same amount of playing time as Vassel now? Or worse due to the logjam?

[DAF86]

No, we should have taken the Marfan Demigod, tbh.

QqWbJJ5gkXs

[slick'81]

Tyrese is a far superior scorer and distributor to devin. Hopefully spurs arent kicking themselves in a year or two

[BillMc]

I'm a big Devin fan. He's going to be good.

No matter who we pick its getting really frustrating having to wait 3 years for them to get meaningful minutes. A slight exageration but not much.

[timvp]

Yeah, for the record, I like what I'm seeing from Vassell. Obviously, he's on a much slower track than Haliburton in terms of his role and minutes. But a really good defender with three-point range and signs that he can create his own shot? That's gold in today's league.

[Spursfanfromafar]

Vassell is still the best fit and the best pick when the Spurs selected him. Tyrese would have barely played if he had been drafted with Murray, White, Walker, Mills and Derozan manning the guard position as well. Vassell needs a longer leash and a more effective lineup and it will come about sooner or later.

[The Truth #6]

In retrospect, though I really like the commitment to defense and moving away from Forbes/Beli, they may have over corrected slightly by choosing Vassel over Halliburton. I mean, let's hope they didn't see DDR in the longterm plans because of his appalling defense, and they knew they needed some playmaking to replace DDR, then Halliburton makes a lot of sense. Yes, it would have been an awkward situation with a resigning of White right as Halliburton would be joining the team. But his BBIQ and playmaking...man, they really, really need that on this team. Seeing him find players across the court reminded me of Bobo and Manu. Way too much 1-1 dribble drivel on the team now. I agree with all the valid points that we wouldn't be seeing this Halliburton on this team right now most likely. But again, with that BBIQ, I don't see how Pop could avoid playing him. He seems like a total team-firsts player. But until DDR is off the team, we probably don't really know what sort of team we have and where we are headed.

[KingKev]

Haliburton would have struggled to get minutes with our current roster makeup. Vassell was the right choice unless you planned to move one (maybe two) of Walker, White or DJ.

[The Truth #6]

Last night's game made our point guard play, or lack thereof, come into full relief for me after watching Halliburton orchestrate their offense. Basically, our team has no real point guard. We have 5 different shooting guards taking a stab at it in their own way: DJ, White, DDR, IV, and Patty. Trades will need to happen in the off season most likely.

[Ice009]

For today's NBA, now that I've seen him in action a couple of times, I probably take Haliburton if we could do the pick over again, but 10 or 15 years ago, Vassell would have easily been my first choice between the two.

[The Truth #6]

It will be interesting to not only see where we draft this Summer, but also who we prioritize. Someone to play the 4 makes sense, but I'm focusing on skills: shooting and playmaking.

[Dejounte]

I say there are at least five teams who drafted before us that should regret this even worse. Some of those teams badly needed a point guard.

[rankingtear]

We don't have a vertical lob threat , he won't be as effective with us even with the same minutes. He is much better than Vassell now though, but 3 years is usually the evaluation period on prospects and ceiling for this group is higher with Vassell due to position.

[Dejounte]

We don't have a vertical lob threat , he won't be as effective with us even with the same minutes. He is much better than Vassell now though, but 3 years is usually the evaluation period on prospects and ceiling for this group is higher with Vassell due to position.

Did anyone see that block by Vassell ON A PULL UP JUMPER last night? You hardly see those types of blocks. There aren't many non-bigs in the NBA who can do that. That, to me, will stand out all season long.

[Mugen]

If DV and Halliburton switched teams, we'd be saying how we should have taken Vassell instead since Tyrese would be getting sporadic spot minutes under the old man tbh :lol

[PrimeMinister]

I say there are at least five teams who drafted before us that should regret this even worse. Some of those teams badly needed a point guard.

knicks taking obi toppin comes to mind for me

vassell is gonna be fine. People bumping this thread after any single game this year don’t see the actual prize which is what they look like 3-4 years from now and how that player fits into each franchise.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Y'all talk like Haliburton wouldn't be up 35 in Austin if we had drafted him. Wouldn't have gotten run behind Wombat.

[Trill Clinton]

Halliburton looks like a vet out therehttps://www.thecoli.com/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/francis.png

[Rocalcio]

I’m sure Vassell would be as good as him if he had the same playing time.

[The Truth #6]

Really, we need both of them on the team.

[slick'81]

Tyrese would definetly be buried behind demar&mills

[rjv]

haliburton has the benefits of solid minutes and devon doesn't; it could be as simple as that. for all we know, samanic may be a better player than haliburton but he can't get on the floor. that being said, tyrese is going to be a solid rotational player for years to come.

[TD 21]

They definitely blew it and it has nothing to do with Vassell and everything to do with them foolishly thinking they're set in the back court with Murray and White. He's 4 and 6 years younger respectively, but already a superior 3-point shooter and more dynamic play maker than either, two things this team obviously desperately needs.

They should have picked him, traded one of them and tried to position themselves to come away with one of Vassell/Bey as well.

[DAF86]

If DV and Halliburton switched teams, we'd be saying how we should have taken Vassell instead since Tyrese would be getting sporadic spot minutes under the old man tbh :lol

This is too true, tbh.

[DAF86]

For the record, I think Vassell will be >> Haliburton when it's all said and done. Pop just needs to start playing Devin more.

Like I said though, the guy we should have drafted is Poku, imho.

[jbspurs]

Vassell just need more playing time. Vassell is already doing a lot for limited time. He's able to guard scorers and battles for rebound.

[GreekSpursfan]

Vassell will never get 10 assists in a game i don't care how much more he played. They are not in the same lvl. Haliburton has star potential, Vassell can become a good role player and that's about it.

[gospursgojas]

Vassell will never get 10 assists in a game i don't care how much more he played. They are not in the same lvl. Haliburton has star potential, Vassell can become a good role player and that's about it.

This

[duncan2k5]

Tbh Pop would have had him on the Luka treatment... Remember Devin only got a chance to prove himself because of injuries at the beginning of the year... Luka is now Pop's whipping boy because you can't even point to his defense being the reason he isn't playing... It's simply a schtick he is trying to maintain for whatever reason... I tried giving him the benefit of the doubt that he was keeping Luka on ice till after the trade deadline, but now we see that the only reason Luka was playing was because Rudy was out... Young players on other teams have certain freedoms they're allowed without fear of being benched for games on end... So our young players look like one dimensional stiffs for a couple years, while other players look more dynamic

For all we know if they were reversed, Vassel would have been a ROY contender and displaying to he ability to slash to the basket and shoot off the dribble consistently while we would be criticizing Tyrese for looking like a busy in the spot minutes he gets...

[EasyMoney]

Tyrese getting playing time over patty mills? Ha.

[exstatic]

I'm a big Devin fan. He's going to be good.

No matter who we pick its getting really frustrating having to wait 3 years for them to get meaningful minutes. A slight exageration but not much.

Dejounte started his second season. White started his second season. Keldon IS starting his second season.

[DAF86]

Vassell will never get 10 assists in a game i don't care how much more he played. They are not in the same lvl. Haliburton has star potential, Vassell can become a good role player and that's about it.

Sure. But would you rather have a flawed all-star ala John Wall or a high end role player like a Bruce Bowen? One of those is a championship piece, the other isn't.

[Seventyniner]

Dejounte started his second season. White started his second season. Keldon IS starting his second season.

And I can definitely see Vassell starting next season if DDR leaves, depending on how free agency shakes out.

[The Truth #6]

Halliburton or Vassell could start here in their second season. They’re both good. If we had better playmakers on the team, the Halliburton conversation wouldn’t be happening, at least for me. Vassell isn’t a bust, let’s keep perspective, also.

[TD 21]

Sure. But would you rather have a flawed all-star ala John Wall or a high end role player like a Bruce Bowen? One of those is a championship piece, the other isn't.

There's nothing flawed about Haliburton. He'll probably fall just short of stardom and top out in the nebulous in between zone (a la Brogdon, Van Vleet, peak White, etc.), but unlike Wall he's already a very good 3-point shooter.

He won't be the caliber of defender Vassell is, but he should be about neutral and unlike him, he can actually create for himself and others.

[3&D_TBH]

Sure. But would you rather have a flawed all-star ala John Wall or a high end role player like a Bruce Bowen? One of those is a championship piece, the other isn't. What would Bowen had been if he had not been surrounded by hall of famers though? Not much tbh.

[GAustex]

Bowen struggled to carve a niche before hooking up with Duncan.

[Ice009]

Darn man, I don't want to come into this thread anymore. He's a really darn good player and I like his game :(. Kings got a steal that would go much higher in a redraft.

The Spurs also need to play Vassell more.

[cd98]

In year 3, I predict Vassell is a better player than all the people currently on the roster, assuming no major injury.

[DAF86]

What would Bowen had been if he had not been surrounded by hall of famers though? Not much tbh.

Yeah well, that's the point. I don't see Haliburton as a franchise type player, and since he's a ball dominant one, I would rather have an impactful off ball player (like Vassell), than a "not good enough" playmaker.

[exstatic]

What would Bowen had been if he had not been surrounded by hall of famers though? Not much tbh.

Bowen was a 20+ scorer in the French league, probably the second best national league in Europe.

[look_at_g_shred]

Bowen was a 20+ scorer in the French league, probably the second best national league in Europe.
Is that really true? Damn I never knew that.

[rjv]

dude has an ugly jump shot, tbh. it goes in but devon has much better looking form. the difference is that tyrese is far more aggressive at this point,

[SpursDynasty85]

dude has an ugly jump shot, tbh. it goes in but devon has much better looking form. the difference is that tyrese is far more aggressive at this point,


Devin and Halliburton are such different players. One is a pure PG the other is a pure SG. Would love to have both on the team tbh. Not sure what the options were other than Devin just fits our team better at this point so it was the right pick but a tough pill to swallow.

[TD 21]

Devin and Halliburton are such different players. One is a pure PG the other is a pure SG. Would love to have both on the team tbh. Not sure what the options were other than Devin just fits our team better at this point so it was the right pick but a tough pill to swallow.

More like a combo guard and a wing and fit should be irrelevant when talent is your primary need. Fit comes later, when you've established a player(s) to build around.

They might have extended Murray and White, but it'd be foolish to pass up superior talent because of their presence or an organizational refusal to break character.

[SpursDynasty85]

More like a combo guard and a wing and fit should be irrelevant when talent is your primary need. Fit comes later, when you've established a player(s) to build around.

They might have extended Murray and White, but it'd be foolish to pass up superior talent because of their presence or an organizational refusal to break character.

I'll agree Halliburton is more impactful now but Vassell has the highest ceiling out of our young guys. His jumpshot is so good (great form and high release) and his ceiling is not much lower than Halliburton's imo.

[duncan2150]

More like a combo guard and a wing and fit should be irrelevant when talent is your primary need. Fit comes later, when you've established a player(s) to build around.

They might have extended Murray and White, but it'd be foolish to pass up superior talent because of their presence or an organizational refusal to break character.

You're right but i'm not sure haliburton is a superior talent and i'm not sur he'll have a better carreer.

[RC_Drunkford]

I'll agree Halliburton is more impactful now but Vassell has the highest ceiling out of our young guys. His jumpshot is so good (great form and high release) and his ceiling is not much lower than Halliburton's imo.

Luka and Lonnie have the highest ceiling tbh. Vassell has a lot of time to improve his offensive game though, I‘m curious how far he can develop

[TD 21]

I'll agree Halliburton is more impactful now but Vassell has the highest ceiling out of our young guys. His jumpshot is so good (great form and high release) and his ceiling is not much lower than Halliburton's imo.

As I alluded to, this isn't to diminish Vassell and I agree it'll end up close. They blew this because they thought and think they're set with Murray and White.


You're right but i'm not sure haliburton is a superior talent and i'm not sur he'll have a better carreer.

He's 4 and 6 years younger than them respectively, doesn't have a significant injury in his rearview or persistent durability issues and is already making a greater offensive impact.

Other than center, offense has greater value than defense because in the latter, it's more important to be a non liability (which he has the physical tools to avoid being) than it is a standout.

[duncan2150]

He's 4 and 6 years younger than them respectively, doesn't have a significant injury in his rearview or persistent durability issues and is already making a greater offensive impact.

Other than center, offense has greater value than defense because in the latter, it's more important to be a non liability (which he has the physical tools to avoid being) than it is a standout.

Ah, i was talking about him and Vassell, not White or Murray.

[3&D_TBH]

Bowen was a 20+ scorer in the French league, probably the second best national league in Europe. I did not know that. I was a huge fan of Bowen, not trying to throw shade at his game. He was a defensive monster. Was just making the obvious point that he was surrounded by top tier talent unlike what we have now.

[Joseph Kony]

Vassell is going to be a highly coveted player in a few years and Haliburton will be seen as another dime a dozen scoring combo guard. Vassell's game is more suited to plug and play on any team in the current NBA. Haliburton may have a higher ceiling but Vassell imo has a much higher floor

[Mr. Body]

It is frustrating, since Haliburton seems ready to score in ways our other young guards don't. They need to be in rhythm and get the yips. He seems to have no filter or regard, a cockiness we need -- actually, that I'd love Lonnie to have. Still, no rookie gets a lot of PT and freedom under Pop.

[TD 21]

Vassell is going to be a highly coveted player in a few years and Haliburton will be seen as another dime a dozen scoring combo guard. Vassell's game is more suited to plug and play on any team in the current NBA. Haliburton may have a higher ceiling but Vassell imo has a much higher floor

He's more than a scorer, but I get the gist. The thing is, this team is loaded with high floor types. They lack high ceiling types, which is what ultimately gets you out from being mired in mediocrity or worse.



Ah, i was talking about him and Vassell, not White or Murray.

Right, but my point is they could have potentially had Haliburton and one of Vassell/Bey had they been willing to trade one of Murray/White.

[ginobilized]

I'd argue that the Spurs system would've slowed Halliburton's development if he were our pick.
He would get the yips and not have the rhythmic flow he's granted with the Kings.

Defensively, Vassell is a savant. Unreal instincts. He's still adjusting to the complexities of Pop's schemes, yet, is often telling the older guys what schemes they are running and where to be.

Haliburton is great, no doubt. I believe the Spurs picked the right player for them.

[R. DeMurre]

Yeah well, that's the point. I don't see Haliburton as a franchise type player, and since he's a ball dominant one, I would rather have an impactful off ball player (like Vassell), than a "not good enough" playmaker.

So far this year, Haliburton's Usage Rate is actually pretty low, at 17.7%. That's a bit higher than Vassell's (13.2%), but still lower than DeRozan, Murray, White, Gay, Walker, and KJ. I see Haliburton more as a glue guy than a ball dominant guy, but at this point I think the Kings probably get better as he increases his usage rate.


https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/SAS/2021.html
https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/SAC/2021.html

[FkLA]

Yall acting like Vassell is a limited offensive player. He's not Danny Green on offense. I dont see his usage "skyrocketing" next year, but theres no reason prime Vassell (5-7 years from now) wont be a huge part of the teams offense, imho.

He has the tools.

https://twitter.com/jollyrogerwilco/status/1377635617736159236?s=19

[south side spur]

Great discussion I’m impressed with most of the analysis even from 2k5. Minimal b*tch @ssness. This is only a discussion because Pop is done. I don’t even blame Mills anymore it’s not his fault he’s a midget. Pop not playing Vassell has to rank up there with biggest Pop blunders. Best shooter on the team and one of the best defenders. Hopefully Pop is gone once he breaks that all time wins record.

[slick'81]

Haliburton with 29 minutes-16 points,3 boards,6 dimes and 4 triples.....meanwhile vassell is a garbage man

[rankingtear]

Haliburton with 29 minutes-16 points,3 boards,6 dimes and 4 triples.....meanwhile vassell is a garbage man

Patience, Keldon barely played his rookie year and now looks like the 5th best player in his class. Pelton has Keldon at 4th best and Shcmitz at 5th best.

https://tv5.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/31303501/ranking-zion-williamson-ja-morant-other-nba-sophomores-future-star-potential

Vassell already mentioned at 6 on Peltons board.

https://tv5.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/31295796/ranking-lamelo-ball-anthony-edwards-other-nba-rookies-future-star-potential

[cd98]

Patience, Keldon barely played his rookie year and now looks like the 5th best player in his class. Pelton has Keldon at 4th best and Shcmitz at 5th best.

https://tv5.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/31303501/ranking-zion-williamson-ja-morant-other-nba-sophomores-future-star-potential

Vassell already mentioned at 6 on Peltons board.

https://tv5.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/31295796/ranking-lamelo-ball-anthony-edwards-other-nba-rookies-future-star-potential

Agreed. Vassell didn't get stuck in the D-League like most of the Spurs rookies, so that in and of itself is an accomplishment. Plus, he had no summer league and his role in the offense has been to stand in the corner. That will change with time, but they are basically running no plays for him when he is in the game, he doesn't handle the ball much, and he is forced to sit in the corner 3.

[rjv]

i really think that one would have to do some sort of comparison to gauge which system works best before declaring the spurs method a total bust. don't get me wrong, it's frustrating as hell to watch rudy and patty stink it up on so many nights while devon and luka sit on the bench, but i'd like to see how players that get immediate playing time fare 3 o4 years down the road in terms of development versus how players who spend time in the g-league or on the bench do 2 or 4 years down the road. take a guy like eubanks, for instance. he was just a towel waving guy for the past couple of years and i'd say his game is significantly better than what we did get to see of it in spot time.

[rankingtear]

Agreed. Vassell didn't get stuck in the D-League like most of the Spurs rookies, so that in and of itself is an accomplishment. Plus, he had no summer league and his role in the offense has been to stand in the corner. That will change with time, but they are basically running no plays for him when he is in the game, he doesn't handle the ball much, and he is forced to sit in the corner 3.

"With young wings, I always think it's important to become really good at the role-player skills before being unleashed as any type of shot creator. That's the path that we've seen players like Brown, Kawhi Leonard (https://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/6450/kawhi-leonard) and even OG Anunoby (https://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/3934719/og-anunoby) to some degree take with great success. " -from the article

- good teams put their wings through that process so I don't mind the corner 3 and D route, Keldon did graduate from it. And Mikal Bridges which is Vassell closest comp went through it just fine.

[KobesAchilles]

"With young wings, I always think it's important to become really good at the role-player skills before being unleashed as any type of shot creator. That's the path that we've seen players like Brown, Kawhi Leonard (https://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/6450/kawhi-leonard) and even OG Anunoby (https://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/3934719/og-anunoby) to some degree take with great success. " -from the article

- good teams put their wings through that process so I don't mind the corner 3 and D route, Keldon did graduate from it. And Mikal Bridges which is Vassell closest comp went through it just fine.
I don't think anybody is really saying they want Vassell to be anything but a role player as a rookie. But Pop won't even play him. Dude had a really nice game without the vets and then doesn't see any playing time immediately afterwards. That's where the real frustration is with him. Not that he isn't as good as Hal

[ace3g]

damn

https://twitter.com/NBCSKings/status/1389033840845463554

[lebomb]

Hyper extended knee? That injury sucks. I got it playing basketball as well, and my knee swole up like a grapefruit. I was basically out of commission for 6 weeks. I was in a hell of alot of pain and needed pain killers for this one.

[exstatic]

Hyper extended knee? That injury sucks. I got it playing basketball as well, and my knee swole up like a grapefruit. I was basically out of commission for 6 weeks. I was in a hell of alot of pain and needed pain killers for this one.

Looks exactly like Jamal Murray’s ACL. No contact at all, just collapses.

[Dejounte]

Fractured his wrist in college.

Let's see what the diagnosis is for this one.

Maybe similar to White or worse, and he's made of glass.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

Hopefully for him and the Kings it isn’t that serious. He has played really well as a rookie

[playbonner15]

Spurs need Vasselline's defense more than Haliburton's offence tbh

[slick'81]

Dude has been a monster thisnyear. Glad hes knee is going to be ok

[DAF86]

I think Vassell will prove to be the better championship piece in the long run. The elite 3 and D wing that every championship team needs. A future Bruce Bowen, Danny Green type. While I see Haliburton as a future flawed borderline all-star that doesn't quite have what it takes to be a primary piece on a contender. What player would you rather have comes down to personal taste and/or circumstances. If the Spurs gets their franchise player in the upcoming years, we will be more than happy with Vassell. If not, then we might be kicking ourselves for not picking Haliburton.

[Uriel]

Why didn't we? He was the highest available player on timvp's big board at the time of our selection, so it's not like this was a draft selection that was only obvious in hindsight (like Jokic).


7. Tyrese Haliburton

I don’t think there’s much of a chance that Tyrese Haliburton falls to 11 but if he does, that’d be another easy selection. (Speaking of which, the four players who could hypothetically fall to 11 who would be no-brainer picks are Toppin, Okongwu, Williams and Haliburton. Ball, Edwards and Wiseman won’t fall to 11.) As a skinny combo guard, Haliburton isn’t the greatest fit on San Antonio’s roster but he’s too multi-talented to ignore. He can pass, shoot and make plays on defense, which are all things the Spurs desperately require.
https://www.spurstalk.com/san-antonio-spurs-final-big-board-2020-nba-draft/

[CGD]

Why didn't we? He was the highest available player on timvp's big board at the time of our selection, so it's not like this was a draft selection that was only obvious in hindsight (like Jokic).


https://www.spurstalk.com/san-antonio-spurs-final-big-board-2020-nba-draft/

Apparently his agents were withholding medical information to get him specifically to… Sacramento.

Givony: ...Haliburton, they (the Mavericks) were 100% trying to get him, starting at 8, they offered a, like you said, a boatload of stuff and future picks even to try and go get him. People are like, how did Haliburton fall so far?!… a lot of this was by design. The consistent theme that I kept hearing in the pre-draft process from agents was, “I hate the teams that are drafting in the top 10. I don’t want my guys with any of those franchises.” And so, they were very selective with who got medicals and they were openly telling teams, “don’t take my guy, please.” So I think, that is a big reason why Haliburton ended up going 12. He… he could have gone 6, I think, had he wanted to, but he was open to, you know, “let me sacrifice $7, 8 million because I think it’s going to end up working out in the long term with Sacramento”... and Zach, how many times can you say a player wants to go to Sacramento?! It’s incredible!!”